EUR might drop below USD

[deisik]

Well that's not a good move, Eurozone economy and US economy are strictly bonded together, just look what happened in 2008.

If they are really bonded together, why the Eurozone start to QE and the US just quit QE and start to raise interest rates.
It seems there on the totally opposite direction.

If they do opposite things, this doesn't mean they are not dependent on each other. It is enough to look at the list of the largest trading partners of the European Union to understand this at once. As you may guess, the US is the largest trading partner of the EU. The EU exports to the US are twice as much as to China, for example...

[manselr]

US and UK will step in before Russia does. Greece and Russia may be eyeing each other but both know a switch of allegiance by Athens away from Washington is opening a Pandora's box.

[Gronthaing]

I see a lot of chaos there, for example those who think that Switzerland and UK are part of the Eurozone... Really?

By the way probably EUR won't drop below USD and the Eurozone won't collapse after a hypothetical Grexit, just because Greece is too small.

Actually the only downside of a Grexit and the consequent bankruptcy is the public exposure of Germany (65bln€), France (49bln€) and Italy (43bln€).

As you can see here: Eurozone countries exposures to Greece - 2011 vs 2014.

But that's not a really big deal actually.

if greece leaves the eurozone will collapse, italy, spain, and why would germany still want to stay in? ...

That's not the case, as an italian guy i am 100% sure that we will stay in the eurozone with or without Greece.
If you ask me, France is the biggest problem for the Eurozone, not economically (at least not right now), but politically, but that's another story.
By the way I already said that a Grexit is not a big deal, greek economy is just too small, not a big player and however we can't even tell if a Grexit is likely to happen or not, so right now the Eurozone is safe.

Isn't Italy going to have a referendum about leaving the eurozone? Don't know if it will pass. Or if the government will follow through with an exit if it does. But are you 100% sure it won't pass? Even without considering Greece. http://rt.com/news/248769-italy-eurozone-referendum-petition

[Sithara007]

If Greece leaves the Euro zone, that would make the Euro stronger, and that may happen.

Greece's exit from the Euro—if it happens—can bring a host of troubles upon Greece and Europe, but scenarios for a rosy outcome are much less likely.

The euro model have not been created to last forever. First they create that, then they overuse the benefit of the system and then they look for a new system. The whole Europe except a few countries will be on Greece's footpath.

[Amph]

I see a lot of chaos there, for example those who think that Switzerland and UK are part of the Eurozone... Really?

By the way probably EUR won't drop below USD and the Eurozone won't collapse after a hypothetical Grexit, just because Greece is too small.

Actually the only downside of a Grexit and the consequent bankruptcy is the public exposure of Germany (65bln€), France (49bln€) and Italy (43bln€).

As you can see here: Eurozone countries exposures to Greece - 2011 vs 2014.

But that's not a really big deal actually.

if greece leaves the eurozone will collapse, italy, spain, and why would germany still want to stay in? ...

That's not the case, as an italian guy i am 100% sure that we will stay in the eurozone with or without Greece.
If you ask me, France is the biggest problem for the Eurozone, not economically (at least not right now), but politically, but that's another story.
By the way I already said that a Grexit is not a big deal, greek economy is just too small, not a big player and however we can't even tell if a Grexit is likely to happen or not, so right now the Eurozone is safe.

Isn't Italy going to have a referendum about leaving the eurozone? Don't know if it will pass. Or if the government will follow through with an exit if it does. But are you 100% sure it won't pass? Even without considering Greece. http://rt.com/news/248769-italy-eurozone-referendum-petition

it was like so, but they are not still there yet, was just a rumor at the end, i think ital will stay in the euro for now, and greece getting out will not change that

[GreenStox]

I see a lot of chaos there, for example those who think that Switzerland and UK are part of the Eurozone... Really?

By the way probably EUR won't drop below USD and the Eurozone won't collapse after a hypothetical Grexit, just because Greece is too small.

Actually the only downside of a Grexit and the consequent bankruptcy is the public exposure of Germany (65bln€), France (49bln€) and Italy (43bln€).

As you can see here: Eurozone countries exposures to Greece - 2011 vs 2014.

But that's not a really big deal actually.

if greece leaves the eurozone will collapse, italy, spain, and why would germany still want to stay in? ...

That's not the case, as an italian guy i am 100% sure that we will stay in the eurozone with or without Greece.
If you ask me, France is the biggest problem for the Eurozone, not economically (at least not right now), but politically, but that's another story.
By the way I already said that a Grexit is not a big deal, greek economy is just too small, not a big player and however we can't even tell if a Grexit is likely to happen or not, so right now the Eurozone is safe.

Isn't Italy going to have a referendum about leaving the eurozone? Don't know if it will pass. Or if the government will follow through with an exit if it does. But are you 100% sure it won't pass? Even without considering Greece. http://rt.com/news/248769-italy-eurozone-referendum-petition

it was like so, but they are not still there yet, was just a rumor at the end, i think ital will stay in the euro for now, and greece getting out will not change that

Haha what a joke, a referandum really?

They control votes and commit voting fraud.

C`mon people, most of you must realize by now what a joke this "democracy" thing really is....

[Gronthaing]

@Amph Where did you see it was a rumor? Did a quick search and found nothing.

@GreenStox I know of cases like Ireland where the result not to enter the union wasn't accepted. And they repeated the referendum until they got the result they wanted. And I know of cases like Greece and the fear mongering against Syriza. But didn't hear of voting fraud. Do you have sources for that? Not that this referendum is binding anyway. But still significant if it isn't only a rumor.

[GreenStox]

@Amph Where did you see it was a rumor? Did a quick search and found nothing.

@GreenStox I know of cases like Ireland where the result not to enter the union wasn't accepted. And they repeated the referendum until they got the result they wanted. And I know of cases like Greece and the fear mongering against Syriza. But didn't hear of voting fraud. Do you have sources for that? Not that this referendum is binding anyway. But still significant if it isn't only a rumor.

Even Stalin said that its not who votes that counts its who counts the votes.

Democracy is a joke really. The only power you (think) you have is voting, but even that is covered with frauds and deception.

So really c`mon people you must realize that democracy is just another form of mirage and scam the tyrants use to keep their slaves in-line.

[Sithara007]

@Amph Where did you see it was a rumor? Did a quick search and found nothing.

@GreenStox I know of cases like Ireland where the result not to enter the union wasn't accepted. And they repeated the referendum until they got the result they wanted. And I know of cases like Greece and the fear mongering against Syriza. But didn't hear of voting fraud. Do you have sources for that? Not that this referendum is binding anyway. But still significant if it isn't only a rumor.

Even Stalin said that its not who votes that counts its who counts the votes.

Democracy is a joke really. The only power you (think) you have is voting, but even that is covered with frauds and deception.

So really c`mon people you must realize that democracy is just another form of mirage and scam the tyrants use to keep their slaves in-line.

If not democracy then what will be the best model? Tell us dear. May be Dictatorship?

[Gronthaing]

@Amph Where did you see it was a rumor? Did a quick search and found nothing.

@GreenStox I know of cases like Ireland where the result not to enter the union wasn't accepted. And they repeated the referendum until they got the result they wanted. And I know of cases like Greece and the fear mongering against Syriza. But didn't hear of voting fraud. Do you have sources for that? Not that this referendum is binding anyway. But still significant if it isn't only a rumor.

Even Stalin said that its not who votes that counts its who counts the votes.

Democracy is a joke really. The only power you (think) you have is voting, but even that is covered with frauds and deception.

So really c`mon people you must realize that democracy is just another form of mirage and scam the tyrants use to keep their slaves in-line.

So no sources, just speculation? I'm not saying there aren't problems. But you have to work with what you have. At the moment that's a form of democracy. Referendums help bring issues to public attention. And to start debates. Far from perfect, but what are you proposing instead? And I mean realistic proposals with what we have now.

[Sithara007]

@Amph Where did you see it was a rumor? Did a quick search and found nothing.

@GreenStox I know of cases like Ireland where the result not to enter the union wasn't accepted. And they repeated the referendum until they got the result they wanted. And I know of cases like Greece and the fear mongering against Syriza. But didn't hear of voting fraud. Do you have sources for that? Not that this referendum is binding anyway. But still significant if it isn't only a rumor.

Even Stalin said that its not who votes that counts its who counts the votes.

Democracy is a joke really. The only power you (think) you have is voting, but even that is covered with frauds and deception.

So really c`mon people you must realize that democracy is just another form of mirage and scam the tyrants use to keep their slaves in-line.

So no sources, just speculation? I'm not saying there aren't problems. But you have to work with what you have. At the moment that's a form of democracy. Referendums help bring issues to public attention. And to start debates. Far from perfect, but what are you proposing instead? And I mean realistic proposals with what we have now.

see, every system has it's own problem. You see  China is struggling with it's system. No human right, so much frustration.
County like India is struggling with it's democracy as well.
Middle east countries are also struggling with their kingdom structure.
Everyone is fed up.
We need a rest button.

[GreenStox]

see, every system has it's own problem. You see  China is struggling with it's system. No human right, so much frustration.
County like India is struggling with it's democracy as well.
Middle east countries are also struggling with their kingdom structure.
Everyone is fed up.
We need a rest button.

So no sources, just speculation? I'm not saying there aren't problems. But you have to work with what you have. At the moment that's a form of democracy. Referendums help bring issues to public attention. And to start debates. Far from perfect, but what are you proposing instead? And I mean realistic proposals with what we have now.

We don't need a system. It's the craziest idea to have a system which extorts people and robs their bank accounts or counterfeits money to feed the political parasites.

Or in other more technical words: taxation, bank freeze, quantitative easing, fractional reserve. I like to call these out what they really are.

[Sithara007]

The biggest upcoming problem will be the uk referendum in 2017 about leaving the eu.
additionaly grexit + marine le pen as french president...

Gonna be stormy times for europe

europe will face tough years. something that was supposed to bring us wealth is now making us poorer than ever. we citizens can only hope for the best.

Hope is not enough. I recently opened a bank account outside the euro zone that allows me to hold USD balance.

I convert a certain amount of Euro's into USD just in case something bad happens with the Euro. I am prepared.

That's very smart of you. Just wish , even my bank could have allowed me to do so.
Not possible in m country.

[GreenStox]

@Amph Where did you see it was a rumor? Did a quick search and found nothing.

@GreenStox I know of cases like Ireland where the result not to enter the union wasn't accepted. And they repeated the referendum until they got the result they wanted. And I know of cases like Greece and the fear mongering against Syriza. But didn't hear of voting fraud. Do you have sources for that? Not that this referendum is binding anyway. But still significant if it isn't only a rumor.

Even Stalin said that its not who votes that counts its who counts the votes.

Democracy is a joke really. The only power you (think) you have is voting, but even that is covered with frauds and deception.

So really c`mon people you must realize that democracy is just another form of mirage and scam the tyrants use to keep their slaves in-line.

If not democracy then what will be the best model? Tell us dear. May be Dictatorship?

No the best model is: Freedom. Democracy is just another form of "subtle" slavery.

[Gronthaing]

see, every system has it's own problem. You see  China is struggling with it's system. No human right, so much frustration.
County like India is struggling with it's democracy as well.
Middle east countries are also struggling with their kingdom structure.
Everyone is fed up.
We need a rest button.

So no sources, just speculation? I'm not saying there aren't problems. But you have to work with what you have. At the moment that's a form of democracy. Referendums help bring issues to public attention. And to start debates. Far from perfect, but what are you proposing instead? And I mean realistic proposals with what we have now.

We don't need a system. It's the craziest idea to have a system which extorts people and robs their bank accounts or counterfeits money to feed the political parasites.

Or in other more technical words: taxation, bank freeze, quantitative easing, fractional reserve. I like to call these out what they really are.

Great. But that still doesn't say how we get from where we are to there. Try explaining that to the people on the street. Chances are they know little of what you're talking about. Or actually support the system or part of it. That's why I say starting public dialogue like this is important. You can't just tear down what exists now and expect things to suddenly change for the better. You have to take it one step at the time.

[Sithara007]

@Amph Where did you see it was a rumor? Did a quick search and found nothing.

@GreenStox I know of cases like Ireland where the result not to enter the union wasn't accepted. And they repeated the referendum until they got the result they wanted. And I know of cases like Greece and the fear mongering against Syriza. But didn't hear of voting fraud. Do you have sources for that? Not that this referendum is binding anyway. But still significant if it isn't only a rumor.

Even Stalin said that its not who votes that counts its who counts the votes.

Democracy is a joke really. The only power you (think) you have is voting, but even that is covered with frauds and deception.

So really c`mon people you must realize that democracy is just another form of mirage and scam the tyrants use to keep their slaves in-line.

If not democracy then what will be the best model? Tell us dear. May be Dictatorship?

No the best model is: Freedom. Democracy is just another form of "subtle" slavery.

What do you mean by Freedom? There has to be a system to handle 7 billion people. You can not let all the people free on planet. It will be a chaos. Don't you think?

[Valta Crypto]

When democracy was born in ancient Greece it was used to govern
city states with population less than 200 000 citizens.
In the current situation I don't think we (USA, EU)
even have democracy anymore. It's more like plutocracy
with democratic structures.

[Valta Crypto]

What do you mean by Freedom? There has to be a system to handle 7 billion people. You can not let all the people free on planet. It will be a chaos. Don't you think?

I suppose he means negative liberty
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negative_liberty

[bryant.coleman]

That's very smart of you. Just wish , even my bank could have allowed me to do so.
Not possible in m country.

Why it is not possible? If it is not possible through banks, then try some other way around. There are currency exchanges in every nook and corner of India. Many of them won't even ask for any identification as well.

[qiwoman2]

When democracy was born in ancient Greece it was used to govern
city states with population less than 200 000 citizens.
In the current situation I don't think we (USA, EU)
even have democracy anymore. It's more like plutocracy
with democratic structures.

I agree, it's an oligarchy of the northern EU states that are creating slavery from the peripheral EU countries. It's another autocratic system of colonialism. Now because they can't get anything left out of Africa and Asia they wanna milk the southern European countries. China has now its big foot in Africa and at least is giving some infrastructure and jobs to the Locals..EU autocrats are taking away jobs, economies and sovereignty.. They will be pleased to see Greece selling off its national assets to feed Shoimble and his cronies.. I hope EURO drops more because I live in the Eurozone but Hubby gets paid in usd lol