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I don't understand how Europeans decided it was a good idea to accept muslim immigrants and asylum seekers, refugees etc etc

can someone explain to me the thought process of how local Europeans and their governments decided being over run by muslims was a good strategy for the future of Europe?

I truly believe Islam is not compatible with democracy and the western world, but that is another debate.

So you read about an attack and now 100% of the muslims are to blame? Are you really that stupid?

Europe gives about humanity not about religion. They have seen how religion can corrupt people in the crusades.

I hope they will implement a better screening procedure, try more to 'Help' refufees in their neighbour countries so when the problem is over they can return.

You wouldn't understand because you are obviously quite an idiot and racist, so I won't try.

I'll bet you anything that muslims are to blame,

and ill bet you anything of those 2 million muslims marching into europe now, at least 10 000 are hard core Jihadis

This was a warm up event for europe

want a bitcoin bet? that this was muslims? lets do it.

When someone says...

I don't understand how Europeans decided it was a good idea to accept muslim immigrants and asylum seekers, refugees etc etc

can someone explain to me the thought process of how local Europeans and their governments decided being over run by muslims was a good strategy for the future of Europe?

I truly believe Islam is not compatible with democracy and the western world, but that is another debate.

And you respond ....

So you read about an attack and now 100% of the muslims are to blame? Are you really that stupid?

You make the following logical errors.

Ad hominem
Broad brush based on your own mis framing of the argument
Mis framing of the argument

One question.  Did you think it would work?

Duh it were radicals. Most of these guys are fleeing from the same attackers we saw in action in Paris...

So yes let's be civil and help people whom are in need for help.

This does not mean immigration, as stated. Help them in neigbour countries and add a few extra layers of security.

Offer shelter and a safe return...

Ad hominem
Yes, that is a common mistake made ignorant human being. The there is no misframing, just a lack of intelligence you are promiting with your question, since it is cleary suggstive and harmful.

Even for a Non-Moslim like my me. Western values and traditions are well-known throughout the world for patience, bliss and generosity.

My comment didn't have to work. Your question is both ignorant and naive, and apart from some bogus people, there are plenty of people who saw your topic and chose not to react.

Question. or no.. just a statement: Abusus non tollit usum

I'm not addressing the issue.  I'm addressing your hijacking of it only.  Thanks for getting back on track.

Now you suggest a course of action.  Let me bring back the essential question, which I do think is a very good question -


can someone explain to me the thought process of how local Europeans and their governments decided being over run by muslims was a good strategy for the future of Europe?

This question does not have any relation to "a course of action."  It asks about mental attitudes, political views and world views.

Paraphrased it asks "How the fuck could these leaders be so damn stupid?"

I been wondering that too....

Can you provide clarity? 

Nah it's a serious question.


I truly don't understand it, not even a tiny bit.

exactly my point.

it is beyond my comprehension.

I want to understand the thought process of how letting millions of muslims into Europe is a good idea. I bet I will never agree with it, but at least I can try understand the rationale.

I did not tend to hijack, my comment was cleary against your insinuating someting and I responded to that, in the proper topic too.

On topic
If your read the comment againt, values, lessoned learned etc. I should explain all of it. Yes i am serious, all of it..

To explain a little bit more there is a pecking order or things that are happening and most bigs events are controlled by
The elite
Multinationals
Countries
Politicians

The politicians are the last and yes even being idealistic or getting the maximum benifit for their career they are the ones we see rule a country, while not ruling it..

Lol, we're likely mostly in agreement, I just didn't see anything stupid at all about the actual questions of the OP.  And leaving aside the pragmatic realities of diffusing responsibility as you do by noting "pecking order, benefit, idealism" I do believe a question of this sort....

"How can these leaders be so FUCKING STUPID..."

is a damn good question.

But this question, also, does not answer the question of the OP and misdirects it.  I still like it, though.

Lol, but don't forget your question was misleading and progressive in the wrong way and with that your made a thinking error by adding and I quote:
"I truly believe Islam is not compatible with democracy and the western world, but that is another debate."

Islam, Christianity and Jewism share a lot.. perhaps too much to call it a seperate religion.

Honestly I am not a fan of both muslim and the US and that is my wrongfull mistake. Because every person is equal bla die bla. However in this era most innocent people are killed by the parties stated above.

No country, no organization and no men has to right to kill innocent people or even criminals, (Criminals should be in jail with water and bread for repentance).

The short answer:
Merkel, Hollande and Obama will retire and the line of sheeps to follow is big, so yes they will find a new stupid victim, and the line of stupidty of leaders will never end.

P.S. I think Obama is a sheep to, but a damn good sheep, the same for Merkel and Cameron, today's politicians are either well instructed or try to have their idealistic ideas come alive..

P.P.S. I'm out. This topic is now about we have to blame a lot of muslims (99%), revolt, then kill our leaders and go back to the 14th century.

Because %99 of the population is Muslim already. We feed 2.2 million Syrians in our country.

You're confusing me with someone else.  And the bolded section, no, I don't think that's what this thread will degenerate into.  No thread on muslims on bitcointalk has ever gone in that direction.

I didn't say make war on muslims, or that existing muslim citizens be thrown out of Europe.

I asked simply why europeans think its a good idea to let millions *more* muslims into their countries.

As of yet, no one has even attempted to answer the question, everything has been done to avoid answering the question in fact.

But I think that is the answer in of itself. Europeans don't want to have to answer such a "ugly racist" question themselves. Instead they pretty much turn a blind eye to it and pretend it doesn't matter?

Except when it does matter , like tonight in Paris.

The elephant in the room is that fundamentalist Islamic beliefs are totally incompatible with western civilization. So again, i ask again and again, why invite people into your country who will not be compatible with almost anything your country is built on.

Well, you talk like you think that all those muslims are on the move for no particular reason other than they think that it´d be really really cool to go somewhere else.

I never said life was fair for the refugees, I am sure most of them have horrible stories.

Maybe 95% of those refugees are decent people - but even those 95% will on average make zero attempt to integrate into the local society they end up in.
then you have 4% who are probably truly hateful of western civilization and will do anything they can do to screw their host country short of violence.

and then 1% who are potentially batshit crazy like the Paris group.

And exactly how is Europe in its infinite wisdom going to figure out who that batshit crazy 1% is?

maybe 20 people I am guessing were involved in the attacks on Paris. Now Europe is letting potentially 1 000s or 10 000s of battle hardened soldiers from Afghanistan and Syria and Iraq come wander around Europe.

Maybe muslims in America can start wearing black hats if you are the bad guys, and white hats if you are the good guy :)

Most people don´t give it much of a thought but much of those refugees from Syria started their refugee career from next door Iraq earlier in the new century.

Friend I am Muslim only. Please don't all Muslims with same point of view. In every country in every culture people are there in good views and bad views So please don't tell all Islamic friends not fit for European culture and all. just we are humans only

because jews have brainwashed us into suicidal self hatred

ISIS terrorists had French passport. They aren't from regular refugees. So, what's the point here? You want Middle Age religion wars again?

You HAVE a Middle Age religion war, that is exactly what radical Muslims have.  And it's pointed at you and me.

Hi guys, first as a French living in Paris i appreciate your concerns and ind words.

But please don't confuse everything, of what i read you're all suggesting two things: let the people carry weapons and get immigrants out.

On the first one i'll say that i'm pretty sure armed population would even be more dangerous on a terorist attack. Lot's of people didn't really understand what happened, some citizens fought others thinking they were part of the attack. It was a very unclear situation, i'm sure that if people were allowed to have guns, people would have killed more innocents than terrorists. Everyone was afraid and confused, you do reaaaaaaally stupid things when you're afraid.
And most of the damages were done by bombs and the first shots at Bataclan (the place where half victims were). Armed people wouldn't have done shit because they openned the gates of the room where the concert took place, screamed and shot in the public. They killed nearly 50 persons in just a few seconds, nobody would have reacted fast enough to stop them.

So no, we don't have guns and we don't want some thanks.

And for the immigrants... I'm not saying it has no importance, but people saying we should close the borders are stupid. France is huge, and so is Europe, terrorists are maybe hiding in the refugees groups but it doesn't matter, we just can't control our borders. Dozens of thousands of Mexican goes trough the USA borders and it's the fucing biggest and most secured border in the world! How do you want to control European borders??? You just can't. In France only it's 4 000 km of ground borders, and i'm not talking about the seas or the ocean...

It's terrible but sadly enough you can't really defend yourself. Which doesn't mean you can't attack though...

According to the latest reports from France, at least one Syrian passport has been recovered from the bodies of the slain terrorists. That means that at least some of them were recent immigrants to the European Union from the Middle East (either Syrian citizens, or other nationals using stolen Syrian passports to reach the EU).

That makes my point even more strongly. I am saying that Muslims are not compatible with Western civilization, as a whole they will never integrate, and even letting 1 into any western country is a mistake. But Europe reckons inviting millions is a great idea.

Also I don't believe every single one was a French passport holder.

Not only are the refugees a threat, their children's children will be a threat. No integration and a point of view when taken to fundamentalist Islam levels that all non Muslims need to either become Muslim or die is a setup for disaster.

I would have zero questions or concerns  about Europe helping those refugees if the were atheists, Jews, Buddhists etc, and of any skin color.

I'm not European, but I have spoken to some who are sympathetic to settling millions of refugees. They say things like, "They're just like us -- doctors, lawyers." When jihadist attacks are brought up they say things like, "That's just a one-off, very rare, nothing to worry about."

I suspect there are some Europeans who think importing millions of new Muslims is maybe sort of a bad idea, based on, you know, centuries of Muslim attacks against the West, including occupations of Eastern European countries. (The kind of people who recognize the phrase "Gates of Vienna" and know what it refers to.) But most of them remain silent because there may be serious social and possibly legal side effects from talking about these things. It's possible a dangerous party like the Front National could win elections in France as a consequence of the multiple jihadi attacks on France the past few years, combined with the "refugee" crisis invasion. It's probably too late to save France, but I suppose the Front National could kick out millions of Muslims into the welcoming arms of Germany -- a country that wants to commit suicide and frankly deserves to get what it wants.

Edit: Above I refered to the Front National as a "dangerous party". While I do believe they are potentially dangerous, I don't want to give the impression they're anywhere near as dangerous as the homocidal jihadi minority in France. Without a Churchhill to save France, Marine Le Penn might be the safest bet.

Yes. Except this time only one side has the will to fight, and that's the side that will win. So "war" probably isn't the right term.

If European countries wanted to help real refugees who live in danger in the Islamic World, they should accept ex-Muslims (those who've left the Muslim faith). As a bonus, it would be importing people who aren't total morons who blindly follow a 7th century delusional illiterate pedophile warrior.

Your problem is that almost all of what you believe is based on superstition and wrong facts.
There is no need to discuss anything if the person you are talking with is not interested in a factual discussion.

This is like the scientific proof for god thread.

But nevertheless one of the main reasons we need immigrants is because we have a huge negative birthrate. It the end it is just a pure economical question.

Also i can promise you that we have more inland psycopaths then terrorist refugees for sure - taking every bet here.

Just so you know,the results came out and they turned out to be Muslims .You have anything to say ? Why is it that anywhere a bomb blast,terror attack takes place only muslims are seemed to be involved? Why there is a training provided for all these muslim suicide bombers in Pakistan ? Why the people who blew 911 were muslims? Why the people who attacked Mumbai were Muslims? All those involved in attacks came in as form of refugees or sneaked in through coasts.The fact is everyone of them is a Muslim.Now please take your time out to answer me.

Ok so you can't stop all of them coming in, but with some effort you could stop 90 percent, and the other 10 percent you sure as hell can send back home.

Get rid of your dumb asylum laws and get serious about deportation.

And Btw I have never heard of a Mexican person blow up anything or attack random people in the USA for religious purposes as far as I know. So it's a very different set of circumstances.

The scary thing is one of these terror groups is going to get a wmd eventually and they will use it without hesitation.

US-Mexican drugwar maybe?

U guys usually have a phd in googling what happened?

Well, I can try to give you an answer - my answer - but I believe it will not be a short one.

First of all: Europe had in the past decades again and again "waves" of people coming here, looking for a better live.

In the 60s, it was the Italians. And we all were warned that they will eat our cats, rape our girls and make extensive use of their knives. Nothing of all of this was true. Instead, they brought spaghetti, tortelloni, pizza - and prosperity, because they worked their asses off.

Then came Turks. We were warned how they will use pistols and change our culture, they would rape our girls and deal drugs. Nothing of all this was true - instead they brought kebab and other goodies, - and prosperity, because they worked their asses off.

Then came people from Sri Lanka. We were warned they would rape our girls, deal with drugs and change our whole culture. Nothing of this was true - instead they brought a lot of new food, and hundred of restaurants wouldn't have survived if these guys wouldn't have worked their asses off. You guess it: They brought properity.

In the 90s came people from the Balkan. Oh, how we were warned: They would - of course - rape our girls, steal everything, bring a new culture with a muslim background, this destroying our culture. Nothing of this was true - instead they brought new food, new drinks, new clubs  - and prosperity.

It IS true, though, that with every group of these cultures came people who were not good. Who raped. Who stole. Who murdered. Just as it was before. Only that all the sudden, people started to ask "where do they come from".

Now let's look at the people from the Balkans. As a matter of facts, I was a lot in Kosovo, Kroatia and Serbia during the war. You can believe me: This war was different than everything you thought you'd see. It was the most brutal of all wars I had ever seen.

I was a volunteer to evac people from Bihac. I went there with my truck, just before Christmas 94, and loaded this truck with every"thing" I could: Kids, women, men, dead, alive, dying. In such a situation, religion never is an issue. The people need help, and that's the only thing you can offer at the moment.

Many of the people from the Balkan returned once they had the impression their home is safe. Others just became ordinary people. You wouldn't know that they orignially come from the east if you wouldn't know. They look like you, they talk like you, they are just like all of us. Most of them drink beer and other alcoholic beverages, but don't eat pig. That is, in most cases, the only way how you can tell they believe in something else than the majority here.

They are just like you and me - maybe a bit more patriotic than I am - but they are patriotic for MY country, the country they are living in.

Now there's the war in Syria. Have you ever had kids? Have you ever been in a war? Would you stay there with your kids? I understand that a lot of people come to Europe. And yes, this may be risky because some of the refugees are convinced that they have to install a state of war in our countries, too.

So what. I believe in me, in the people living here, in the people who come here, to fight those guys. Just this morning, my son's friend from Macedonia came by. He is muslim. We all were watching the latest news from Paris, he was crying, asking why these people are doing this.

Since I can remember, I fought neonazis.

If you talk to them and then talk to radical islamists, you'll see that there is basically no difference between them all. They have a wicked mindset, and they all are all but normal. We, our society, will be able to deal with it.

Terror means that they want to spread fear. They may, from time to time, be successfull with this. But I also remember how I, as a kid, was afraid to go to the shopping mall because of the Baader-Meinhof-Gang. But from a certain point on, I just decided that it is me who has to say where I go and where I don't - and not terrorists.

The same is true for today. I will fight every terrorist with all possible means - but hell, if someone is in need of a shelter, of a place which is safe, I'll do everything I can that this person gets it. Never looking at the color of the skin, the age, the sex, the religion. That is what makes us human.

Not a bad answer.

I can definitely see your point of view. Belief in the premise that humans are essentially nice people and we are all the same in the end. 

I still think you will be proven wrong over time, but at least the answer you provided is a real answer.

It is true that non-Muslims face more risks when compared to the Muslims in the Middle East. But how will you find out whether a person is ex-Muslim or not? People will lie that they are ex-Muslim, just to gain an EU residence permit. I have heard of incidents from Germany, where Muslim immigrants nominally convert to Christianity before submitting their asylum claims. In the claim, they will argue that they have left Islam, and therefore they face death if they are sent back to their home country. But once the claim is processed, these people will rejoin the Islamic faith.

How do you decide who is a muslim btw?

Do you assume based on their birthplace?
Take my case. I am an atheist born in Istanbul. My turkish identity card has "muslim" written on it. I work as a researcher in a prestigious french university, and I contribute rather positively to the french society (I had many students, postdocs etc.). So you want france to kick me out, or not let me and my family into france based on what is written on my identity card? Very smart. I hate islam more than you do, believe me...

Or do you just ask? Do you think people who have no problem killing innocent people indiscriminately will have any problem lying to you about their religion? Muslims even have a word for it, it's called takiyye (in turkish spelling anyway). You are allowed to lie to further your religious goals.

So the rational thing is to not approach with a broad brush. And to try to identify who is dangerous and who is not, instead of trying to identify who is muslim and who is not, which doesn't immediately translate to violence or lack thereof anyway.

I guess this is the principle. But I agree that in practice the french are a bit too idealistic. They should probably come up with a better way of identifying the risks. Not everyone that can provide a translated cassier de judissiare from their home country is innocent in real life.

Interesting view.


But I would simply note that war is full of purposefully devised double bind situations.

For example note the case of Coventry in WWII.  If the British vacated the city, the enemy would then know that the British had broken their encryption. 

An enemy seeks refuge within a greater population, where he cannot be thrown out without impacting that greater population.  This is why the USA put Japanese citizens in internment camps during WWII.  The threat of a small fraction of that population.

Since then this has been often cited as a racial abuse, but at the time it was done for the greater safety of the US population. 

Summary?  Political correctness has just died.  It's over, folks.

In my country Muslims live over 500 years, so such question is meaningless.
We live in peace with them but had conflict with other Christian group.
Of course, Muslims which now coming to Europe are completely different issue.

Good to see you in forum again. :)

In Turkey %50 of population support ISIS and other %50 hate them to death.
%99 of the people have written Muslim in their ID card, even they don't. That's stupid country policy. If you want to change it you'll face big problems in your social life.
So, I believe in God but am not a Muslim. I feed 2.5 million Syrians with my tax money, I cover your EU and you say to me I face double standards when I go to Europe. You can GTFOH and die alone with your racist thoughts.

This is not yet confirmed that the passport was from one of the terrorist ... so far , only Greece confirmed that the passport found on ground was validated for entrance in Greece ... that's all ...

At no point did I or I think anyone in this thread say it would be a choice to kick existing Muslim citizens out of a country, as that is wrong. The countries that gave them citizenship cannot and should not go back on that.

My question was why accept more Muslims.

First there is on EU law ... that force the "Family assembly" so if you give nationality of 1 member of the family , then he has the right to bring his complete 1 level family ... bad or good one ... no matter :D

And secondly ... to be politically correct ... hoo yes ... and for Germany ...to get worker more cheap , good slave with low salary !

So 50 percent of your country supports people who think all non Muslims should die, and you don't think that is going to cause issues when you go to non Muslim countries?

Well one of best suggestions ever. I just think to not be just about muslims, to every religion have that kind of dressing code.


This is interesting, I thought about it. Why muslims come to Europe, when they religious views are much different then here in Europe. Why they dont go to Abu Dabi, Dubai, Egipt, Maroko etc... there is a lot of muslim countries out there, why they choose Europe, far and cold Sweeden probably they didnt saw so much snow even on tv.


And on the end I live in Serbia, we are not in EU. But we are here on intersection, refugees crossin my country to come to Europe. What will be if after this attack Europe decide to close the borders? And can u tell me why most of EU countries voted for Kosovo and made a muslim country on place where was christianity?

The answer is that it is not the doing of the European people and governments... that they accept Muslims. The answer is that God is working it.

Islam says that you are saved for eternal life by your works. Christianity (in which Europe is steeped) say that you are saved by the grace of God through faith In Jesus Christ - the truth.

God is causing severe unrest in the lands of Islam, so that the Muslims flee to, where else? the lands of the Christians. He is doing this because part of His ancient, Old Testament writings say that He will show favor to the descendants of Ishmael.

The time for the return of Jesus is imminent. The Muslims must be given their chance. God is driving the Muslims to the Christians, because Muslims (as a whole) would not accept the Christian missionaries He tried to send them over the hundreds of years since the inception of Islam.

:)

Yeah, sounds legit

1095 - After consultations with god, Pope Urban II calls upon the Franks to invade the more civilized Muslim world. Begins five centuries of warfare.


"Let those who have hitherto been robbers now become soldiers."
– Urban II addresses his gangster horde.

Christian 7th century medieval bullshit.

Bah.

I am not a french citizen. I am a turkish citizen, I work in france and plan to apply for citizenship.

It is besides the point too. There will be more people like me in the future. Who are highly qualified, some of them atheists or agnostics. And your idea of not letting new muslims into europe, will block these people also.

also a working definition of racism is discrimination (legal or otherwise) of a person based on her race, ethinicity or religion. You can discriminate against someone because he/she has done bad things, or has violent tendencies, or simply because he/she is stupid etc. (the latter being called mentalism for example), those are not as problematic. But if you discriminate based only on race, ethnicity or religion that causes a lot of problems.

Racism actually is not necessarily a problem in itself. But europe has had experience with it, and has decided to never practice it again. Because it doesn't work, and it causes massive social issues. I think the institutional policy against racism is part of the effort to not go down that road again.

But crime is an individual concept. I may come from a family of criminals. Unless I commit a crime, I can not be discriminated against. The government can watch me more carefully, but they have to treat me like everyone else. This is a universal principle of human rights.

Even if 99% of Turks were homicidal maniacs, you can't argue that I am also one, unless you have reasonable evidence that I, "as an individual" may be one.

There are actually many details. For instance ISIS guys are sunnis. Some people that flee from them are alevites or shiites. These are different sects of islam. But from the point of ISIS people (or those that support ISIS point of view) alevites and shiites are not muslims. So again, who decides, who is to be classified as muslim? There are also christians in Syria. There are agnostics. There are people who call themselves muslims, but drink alcohol. There are people who don't call themselves muslims but don't eat pork etc. There is a whole spectrum...

So why waste all this effort to figure out who is a muslim and who is not instead of trying to figure out who poses a threat to France?

You have a naivity about the reality of war.  As an example look at the Spanish Civil War.  A man walked into a village and was asked "Are you a Catholic, or a Communist?"  If you answered the wrong way, you got shot.  If you answered the right way, you were enlisted in that side's army.

That's the way it is.  All you'll get for your nuanced intellectual talk is a boot in the face.

"Europe is smarter, wiser and more tolerant now."

No, it does seem they are totally stupid fucks.

Actually no, the evidence is of continual and rising anti-Semitism in Europe.  Who are you to say there is "an effort to not go down that road again?"

You know, we should let all the criminals out of jail.  Not many of them were rapists.  We could spend our time and money better figuring out which of them were rapists than simply discriminating against all criminals and locking them up.  Just because they were branded as criminals doesn't mean they are all bad, that's discrimination.  There are all types.  Some rape, some rob  banks, some are completely innocent.

Why are you so prejudiced?

:)

They may be totally stupid fucks but at least they´ve not been stupid enough, so far at least, to go on a totally out of control emotional porn binge when they´ve been attacked, rushing into one unplanned war after the other leaving nothing but endless chaos and more war.

Spendulus, the answer to your OP question is: no one really asks us if we want to. Just like no one asks Americans if they want to be at war with Iraq, Afghanistan, Lybia, Syria, etc...
Even when you think you vote for a PM/party that may be more restrictive with immigration, once they get to power, they do a 180.

If there are 100 men at a gate, and one has an AK47 and intends to empty his clip into innocent people, I certainly would not let those 100 people through that gate.

End of Subject.

There is a fine line. Migration on an individual level, when people come from other cultures because they found a job or love, and when such people are prepared to assimilate or at least live in harmony, is perfectly fine in my book. But what is being done to Europe now, is a controlled and directed invasion (I can't find another word for what I see) by people who for the most part expect preferential treatment, don't intend to work and expect the countries they move to to change to suit their lifestyle.

These two articles from a few months back illustrate well the scope of the problem:
http://stanislavs.org/we-have-nothing-to-losethe-refugees-who-arrived-in-the-european-union-are-ready-to-revolt/
http://stanislavs.org/apocalypse-of-europespecial-report-from-the-flooded-by-refugees-austria/

Tell me why European are accepting Jewish Mosad danger ,Black,Buddhist,Hinduist,USA asylum seekers moreand more of them here,Russians KGB danger,

Do you know many terroristics attacs has been done in past by whithe.Bader Mainhof,Brigadi Rosso,ETA,IRA ,eleven november and many others

Do you know than 120000 people hasied in Syria in still ongoing terroristic attacks,3 mln Vietnamise in done ny USA
 terroristics,Afghanisthan,Iran,Nicaragua many,many others,Palestine,Gaza,There is terroristicattack in Gaza every week.Everyweek Apachappearand thay are shooting

And who is behind ISIS,Brigadi Rosso,Bader Mainhof,Syria war,AlKida etc

And who is behind ISIS,Brigadi Rosso,Bader Mainhof,Syria war,AlKida etc

Indeed. This whole terror mess is very murky and that´s nothing new.

Google "Operation Gladio".

Terrorists and freedom fighters and moderate opposition and other ingredients of this soup...there´s always labels that fit changing publicizing needs and interests. Is war lucrative business? Do businessmen try to create business opportunities? Do armaments manufacturers fund politicians? Do they expect to get something in return? Do bears defecate in the woods?

Because they don't have balls. That's why they are continuously electing these laughable puppets (Hollande, Merkel etc.) into office.

Simple comparison of laughable puppet with real president:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0_FyjmYlrU

Or another example of well educated politician:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6-gJ1zI3D4

I'm not saying that muslim brotherhood is fine but it's not their fault that there is no competent people in the EU governments. If you're giving yourself into hands of puppet regime, then no wonder that you're getting what you deserve.

Sorry I thought I was having a conversation. Instead I have been trolled. I should have known better.

No you have not been trolled.  Your argument has been satired.

Your argument is basically, "It's all hopeless."  If you want, I will show why that is a false allegation.

there is some truth to this.

but on the other side, I am pretty sure very few europeans have made it their mission in the last 24 months to inform every politician in their area that they object.

so its a probably a silent objection if any of the locals object.

Eat shit, who sponsor to kill Saddam Husseyn and Muammar Gheddafi.
Pay Your Bills NOW.

RE: compatible with democracy and the western world

I don´t think it´s bloody compatible with democracy and the western world to have drones flying around the world wiping out weddings, funerals and this and that to maybe get some alleged terrorists. The nutsos in charge of this freely admit that maybe they killed this guy or that or they may never really know. Yeah, they killed 50 people at that wedding tough shit, that´s collateral damage. Or maybe they use another term for it nowadays, I guess they need to provide some variety to idiots that are brainwashed by their 30-second analyses of very complex issues.
I mean, unless you´re a freakin psychopath like these people or borderline retarded you can´t deny that this is nothing but terrorism. And yes, I live in the western world.

some truth to that as well.

Those wars in the Arab countries have done nothing but destabilize the region and create the conditions for ISIS.

But no rewind now, in fact the most likely outcome now is an escalation from all sides.

I think you guys are getting me wrong.  I don't think drone strikes on non combatants  is right and I don't want to invade the middle east.

I just don't think Muslims and the western world can truly ever get along,  so why try force it by moving into each other's countries.

I don't want to live in a Muslim country and I'm sure they wouldn't want me there either. Everyone keep to themselves type deal.

There seems to be serious lack of understanding about the connection between cause and effect, action and consequence on these threads. I wonder why.

Learn Shariah Law to be as sclave in Worldwide Khalifate.
Learn Your next Civil Rights http://www1.umn.edu/humanrts/instree/cairodeclaration.html (Non ISIS Edition)

LOL
Go here: https://www.google.com/maps/place/12%C2%B030'03.4%22N+92%C2%B047'38.8%22E/@12.5011168,92.7921679,16.75z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x0:0x0

To accept muslims is not the problem. It's to accept africans (niggers, algerians...). They do it because since Mitterrand, a lot of social-laws passed, and now eveyone is antiracist. Racism is the base of the mankind, it's the preservation of ourselves, but these guys don't understand this.

Show them a drawing of Mohammed. If they get angry, drop them back in ISIS-land to get what they deserve.

For extra security, ask them to eat a slice of delicious bacon.

We can only hope. I'm skeptical. PC is like the undead. Always comes back as soon as people forget the obvious. And the forgetting happens faster each time.


I'd be happy if the Front National got elected and kicked out Muslim French citizens. I doubt they'd go that far though. I've had it with this Jihadi bullshit. Muslims have had centuries to modernize and deal with the Jihadi elements of their religion. At this point, fuck them. Westerners have no obligations to Muslims.

Islam is almost like christianity in these terms, God may forgive you for virtually anything. They will pass these verificarions without any issues. Then they will confess these sins a bit later, while returning to their original faith.

For starters, the question is not "how do we deal with these masses of refugees from Syria?"

The question is how many people to add to the rosters reviewing immigration requests, and how many to add to border control.  Volunteers could help.  Then the next question is whether to bend any rules to "help" in this (made up) "refugee crisis."

Get the picture?

Well, it´ll be interesting to see how European authorities will react after ignoring all warnings about the likely consequences of this massive influx of refugees. Which they have called immigrants in order to help themselves and others in the ignoring of the dangers. They´ve made efforts to make it all seem harmless. It´s organized. Carefully chosen words et cetera. Now that the consequences are starting to materialize, will they resign? be fired? If not this is very clearly what they wanted, just policy.

Well, questioning the wonderful diversity that comes from masses of refugees would obviously be a xenophobic no-no question. Not permitted.


It's not hard to predict. They'll publicly talk about how they stand in "solidarity" with the victims of "random" acts of "terrorism." And they'll privately contact Facebook to help them police Europeans who voice concerns. It's the Merkel dance.

Yeah, and the military on every street corner in Paris, London and Berlin and armed police sniffing every other butt is probably bad for business. Still, it´s a conundrum. If there are more attacks and they have the same song even the thickest out there might start to get a little bit suspicious. At least until next morning.

No, it won't be good. Marine kicks her father and Philippot is a faggot. Some years ago, it was a real far-right party, but nowadays it's just everyone's party. To achieve this they had to be less extremist. I don't want a preference between real French and fake muslims one. I want that niggers, jews and maghrebins and the mixed childrens of each to get out of my country. Such an idea will never apply with the Front National. Also, I don't want a women to the head of the state. That would be really akward. Would Louis Alliot be the Première Dame de France ? Having a female president creates a lot of problems.

PS : Je suis français. Si tu veux on peut discuter plus en profondeur.

The problem is not muslims but radical islam muslims. You need to understand that not all muslims are radicals and that terrorist acts are made by radical fundamentalists that don't necessarily need to be muslims.

I know. I´ve known many Muslims, most of them Arabs. Formal, correct people as far as I´m concerned. Never noticed any fundamentalism or much religion for that matter.

Pffft!  Do cattle get to choose what fields to graze in and what herds to group up with?  Cattle would not make the correct decisions to maximize the benefit to the ranch or the rancher.

So how to cattle migrate from one field to another?  Carrots, sticks, and training.  The peeps in pretty much every nation are much closer to the state of cattle than they are to free individuals.  Ironically this is probable most true in the 'democratic' Western world.  That's how I see it anyway.

I think it´s in principle a good idea to mix people or whatever they want to call it. But it has to be a long and gradual process, probably over a century or centuries. It can´t be good to move millions of people in few years or even months between radically different environments and cultures.

This is wrong.
"Radical fundamentalism" exist only in heads of Jew owned Mass Media for selling to You or brainwashing as News.

You need study what is salafi and why is in direct contrary with Quran.

The benefits of hybridization have been noted by 'technocrats' for a long time.  There are ethical and less than ethical ways to do it.  But modern Technocrats concern themselves mostly with  efficiency (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1239675.0).

If you wan´t to deal with fundamentalism go for the source. Here´s a clue: it costs money to fund all those fundamentalist schools and training centers in Britain and France and elsewhere. Follow the money.

Well, can´t say I´ve pondered this issue for any special ideological reasons. But if I were a farmer I´d certainly make sure that my stock didn´t get inbred. Anyway, I think it´s inevitable that races will mix in fact they have always been doing so to some degree.

Europe is in a demographic trap, its leaders know it and young people in other parts of the world know it as well. Maybe the real reason for all those war scams is to drive people from the middle east and those muslim regions to Europe. And the U.S. too I guess. Who knows. I do know that I get the party line from the Ministry of Truth. If I´m automatically always 180 degrees from that I´ll probably be at least 80% right over time without much effort.

Just look at Americans. Now; that´s a mix for you. Yeah I know they´re the stupidest fucks on the face of the earth but they´re best in everything. Well, they´re also worst in everything there are always some side-effects.


...relax, it´s tongue in cheek,,,  ;D

Can you restate that without the Jew Hate shit and try to make it understandable?

Because I don't have any idea how you can claim that radical fundamentalism does not exist.

Thanks.

RE: Clues. If terrorists like chopping the heads off people check if any government in the general viciny of the terrorist heartland is hot on that same practice. If a particularly unsavory version of islam has been emanating from that government for a long time you´re probably on to something. If your leaders are crawling over each other selling weapons to this government and generally fawning at its feet, well there you are.

LOL

   Israel News
Nine Arrested in Crackdown on Suspected Jewish Terrorists
read more: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-1.670266
Chaim Levinson Aug 09, 2015 5:01 PM

I notice to You, about owners of "News" fonts.
Some of them like to rappresent all arabs as "suspected terrorists".


You hate Terrorists? I hate too, specially i hate Jew Terrorists.

Find me, please this branch here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_schools_and_branches

Yes, we are familiar with this August case of some Jewish terrorists.

So what?  What does that have to do with anything?

I am not making sense of your posts, sorry.   You don't need to notice to me, I don't know of any news sites that repressent all arabs as suspected terrorists.  Not even thereligionofpeace.com does that.

I am not saying there are not any.  This is a big world.

Because muslims are perfectly compatible with democracy. You know, I used to live in a tiny french island, called Réunion. We have so many religions there that I knew from a very young age that some people won't eat beef, pork etc. No one fucking mind because even if there are some kind of communitarianism, we all live on the same island and we try to be good to each others. Even muslims hang out each others, not giving a shit if their friend are Sunnites or Shiites. We accept everyone, we don't give judgements, we don't discriminate. Sometimes people are telling that it's probably because the weather is good ;).
The only problem is with people from near Comoros Islands because they are very poor and sometimes won't speak french or creole. So it's very difficult for them to be integrated.
Don't end up hating muslims or stuff like that, it's putting oil on fire really :-\ .
I usually don't accept any kind of proselytism though. And in Japan, Christians are really annoying (we don't have such things in Réunion).

LOL
Who put and use this fake termin "radical fundamentalism"?
In this mode any "muslim" is on the risk to be so dangerous person and at risk to be "suspected terrorist".

But if goes to talk about Jew related terrorism and Jew owned Media on "news" manipulating - someone start to tell "What does that have to do with anything?"

http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/11/11/watch-anti-migrant-video-going-viral-across-europe/

Europe heading to a trainwreck!

Europe=Muslim sharia hellhole=4th world

The first victims of salafi are muslim people.
The number of muslim victims is big.
Who send instructors and weapons to salafi and to Usama Bin Laden in person from 1979? - United States Of America and NATO.

I strongly support the growt number of non salafi muslims in NATO states to stop military help to salafi terrorist groups and ISIS "state".

Europeans: can you please try explain to me why your countries accept Muslims?

Please, why are you mark and group people? We are all humans and we all belongs to the human race! We shouldn't act like this, by banning people from another religion, instead we should teach them what is right and what is wrong and how should they start to think and live.

No it isn't.

In the western world we have a well known phenomena, Christian fundamentalism.  We also have "radical Christian fudmanentalism."  This is not complicated.

The same words and concepts certainly apply to other religions such as Islam.

There may have been some slight violence attached to Christian fundamentalism. People are people. When they have a difference of opinion, sometimes they duke it out with fists... or guns.

The difference for Islam is, violence is virtually required at times, by their religious writings.

Islamic fundamentalism is way more violent that Christian fundamentalism. Christian writings dictate peace... virtually all the time.

:)

This termin is a fake termin of Jew brainwashing terminology, here is the example of it: http://biblicalstudies.org.uk/pdf/eq/2006-3_221.pdf

"Islam fundamentalism" exist not.

How do You will call "Liberal export of Democracy" to ISIS territory? A Rainbow beam of 500 KG Bombs?
National-Socialist Fighters of Syria allies.
Holy Liberalism in best colours of itself.

This isn't racist.

It has to do with religion.

Well, I wouldn´t really classify the end of the world as "slight" violence. Christian fundamentals, at least the craziest of them, believe that Armageddon is a great thing because they and their followers will somehow end up as winners up in the clouds somewhere. When you have people like that in power or advising people in power who knows maybe they´re working on making that great idea happen. There was plenty of them around Bush, don´t know if Obama got rid of them. In any events there´s millions of them in the U.S. Which is a concern since it´s a nuclear power so their dream can come true.

Not sure what you mean, but...

The exporting of real democracy to Islamic countries would bring about an abundance of freedom for Muslims, freedom that they do not presently have.

:)

Refugees are accepted, not based on your race nor religion

It's called being human trying to help a fellow human being.

You can easily compare this to as your neigbour having a fire in their house and they become homeless, wouldn't you help them out and have them over until they get back on their feet?

While there are a bunch of Christians that think like this, the ones that seem to be pushing war in the Middle East, are doing so for two reasons:

1. To keep Islam from starting Armageddon;
2. Oil profits.

The Christians who like the idea of Armageddon are simpletons that unwittingly support the real war makers through taxes that they don't have any idea about how to stop paying.

:)

Like I said, there was a bunch of those "simpletons" around Bush. And it´s a matter of historical record that he claimed that god had ordered him to attack Iraq and did so numerous times. Of course he didn´t mention that until after it was a done deal and they had invaded Iraq. Before the fact it was weapons of mass destruction, the new hitler and terriers and all that stuff. Anyway, it´s easy to confuse simpletons with certifiable nutcases or explain their nuttiness away that way.

Oh, so much teories "How to made better the life of muslims".
Such "export" is the consequence of today situation in Lybia, Iraq, Syria and Afghanistan.

Just let me know when our friendly Christian fundamentalists start beheading people, will you please?

Otherwise drop the lame attempt at moral equivalence, and write something that's wroth reading.

Not all muslim are bad. all people in the world created by God of course Muslim or not can go where ever they want there is no law that Muslim can go in some country. Why you need to think that Muslim can't. Are you God that can hold Muslim to go some where or put them only to there country.

"The person who is sinless should be the first to throw a stone at her" and now talk if why our country accept Muslims.

I guess truth hurts.

You voted for this guy, right?

"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/stories/2005/10_october/06/bush.shtml

People is created by vagina and dick, all of them. 100% information, the smallest % is artificially created using non supported by Quran and Torah metods.

Too bad that Bush didn´t mention those orders from god BEFORE the invasion. He should have made this important announcement at the United Nations. Then everybody would have realized IN TIME that he was batshit crazy and the whole thing and what has followed could have been prevented.

The final story will be Kirsan Ilyumzhinov as president of Russian Federation.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-_rt6FHroXto/Uw_-NWGJ7nI/AAAAAAAAAfo/ByZqgMf540I/s1600/Ilyumzhinov-and-Assad-540x300.jpg

http://en.chessbase.com/portals/4/files/news/2012/ilyumzhinov14.jpg

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-VhpiVLlJEB8/Uw_83BDM8qI/AAAAAAAAAfI/jv_R5MrjmoU/s1600/moammar-gadhafi-kirsan-ilyumzhinov-2011-6-14-7-30-38.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CT3xkPuWEAAlL5K.jpg:large

This poor guy needs your help. He ran away from home to save his life from Assad's bombs. Remember that he comes from the different culture. Though you can't understand some of his traditions, please be polite with him. Political correctness is your friend.

No, mixing populations is not a good thing. I suppose your white. Would you like that your descendants become semitic, like Algerian ? I hope not. I would like this for mine. I'm proud to be the descendant of Germanic europeans, light haired and light eyed (like me). I'm proud of my race, like you should be ! My credo is : for the Nation, for the Race, for God ! Every proud white man should have the same.

He's a poor refugee anyway, you should understand him. Give him your clothes, money and wife, this will be democratic enough.

Frankly, I´ve seen too many excellent outcomes of interracial procreation to worry much about whether my descendants turn out this color or that.  And yes, I´m pure paleface. I come from a long line of farmers, although not a farmer myself. They understand these things. The stock must not be allowed to become inbred.

What is dhe difference from this one and personages from Northern Caucasus in France, Belgium, Norway and Federal Republic of Germany?
This guy is a "rebel" against "tyrany" of Asad. NATO countries love him.

Since God created the man (who was originally White, to show you how we're his creation while others are Satans' one), our only objective was to protect ourself against invader. Since Jews created communism, egalitarianism and all this dumb ideas, mens became stupid animals that even cannot defend their territory.

Perfect whiteness

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/daigoro1715/pic20485.jpg

Sorry about that. You can´t unwatch it and it will haunt you forever, that is actually my spell ;D

I can, since I've just received a notification from the Interior Ministry and have no idea what do they want from me. Will see tomorrow.

Thank you, my beloved state, you've made it possible to unsee these pictures. ;D

It's a conspiracy

Believe me, colour is not the problem here at all. It is religion and whole outlook of these people what is problematic. Western culture is not compatible with mindset of Muslims.
They don't respect our laws and want to introduce their own.  And dialog is not an option here.

simply accept immigrants, religion isn't a feature. All underdeveloped countries that are geographically close to Europe are Muslim countries.

And why these people are electing to go to Europe instead of very rich Muslim countries like Saudi Arabia, Qatar, United Arab Emirates or Oman?
Emigrants will be fine among people of similar historical and cultural background and religion. But instead they chose to go further just to reach Germany or UK?

Much of those refugees fled Iraq from the war there and went to Syria. That didn´t work well. I don´t know, maybe they figure that neighboring countries may be next in line to be destroyed. Just because we´re dumb as doornails doesn´t necessarily have to mean that they are as well.

Come To Kazan or Grozny city. You will see, what is culture.
If You go to Mahachkala, You will have a lot of fun.

It's all about the Power Elite of the world trying to form the world into one big nation that they control. These PE run the governments that are allowing the immigrants in. The average public of the European nations don't want it. But what can they do? Their governments have the guns to stop them from keeping the immigrants out.

:)

There would of course be an organized push behind this movement.  Not if, but who and why is a question of merit. 

Yeah, it seems kind of likely. Happens too quickly and too much mass to be spontaneous. Also, it costs money.It isn´t like they take some dirt cheap flights and land a little later in Frankfurt.

To americans: can you please try explain to me why your country invaded middle east for no reason?

Something tells me you could fill an ocean with what you don't truly understand.

So what do you propose if people lie and all say they're Christian?   Or secular?  Make them write a test?

Ignorance.

good point, but is Americans to be blamed for the invasion why not go kill the people who you think responsible for the invasion instead of attacking the innocent, this does not effect Bush and his family, he still goes play golf.

This goes for Muslims, all Muslims cant be blamed for ISIS.  Just because terroist blame the one who taught and twisted their religion.  also people should stop mocking Muslims, christians and other religions.  I see hate is just causing more hate.

Except rares cases, colour of the skin is related to religion. Islam has not evaluated since the VIIIth century, and that's it the problem.

So your saying your agains by GOD. of course we all came from our parents vagina and dick so in that case we are created by vagina and dick ? LOL praise your mom and dad vagina and dick I'm sure 100% will answer your prayers !

Accept because government is crazy:(

No, they're sane enough to serve Obomba, their Master.

The U.S., as a 'nation of immigrants' are and interesting study.  I've seen it hypothesized that individuals who have been able to generate the motivation to immigrate tend toward possessing other traits which can contribute to success in various endeavors.  And, when a population starts out rich in such traits, the effects can be observed statistically over some generations as 'regression to the mean' takes it's course.

I find this hypothesis to be at least interesting.  In looking around I sometimes feel that 'regression to the mean' has fully run it's course here.  Then I see things representing the mentality of my peers in other countries and change my mind back again :)

One thing that is notable is that Americans are being treated with fluoride, vaccinations, GMO foods, etc more than almost any population.  A suspicious mind (like mine) wonders if some of TPTB would like to assist the 'regression to the mean' principle (and milk the cow in the process since we've individually accumulated significant wealth during our time as a super-power and not everyone has blown their net worth on trinkets yet.)  I'd say that there is a danger of an 'overshoot', and in looking around must wonder if might be the case that the seeds of such an overshoot have already be sown.

So we should make sure nobody draws cartoons of some raggedy old bearded guy, because someone else might take offense and start shooting.

You just endorsed a climate of fear.

My guess is that they are not as fearful and ignorant as you are.

Basically not all of them are bad.
Basically if they would have the means to navigate way to Murica, I'm sure your gov't will also give them asylum.
And, since the "western" population goes older and older, getting some fresh blood in may ensure a good retirement to some.

Another thing is that, in contact with real unrestricted information, some of those muslims have a good chance to wake up from their slumber. I find it a good (though risky) way to reduce the number of terrorists actually.

The problem, as always, stays in the numbers. If the number of immigrants is too big, then they will stay a community and not get "absorbed" by the western civilization. And that's a failure of all the good plans.
And now the numbers are too big.  :-\

In the UK in the 50's and 60's immigrants were brought in from the (then) colonies to fulfill a labour shortage during halcyon years of full employment. Look at the mills of West Yorkshire. It is no coincidence that several of the 7/7 bombers were from this neck of the woods.

Whilst there is no labour shortage today, the effect of immigration is to reduce the price of labour > higher profit margin.

But TPTB can't have it all ways I'm afraid - they can only have it 99% of "all ways".

The other 1%, that eludes them, is Paris last Friday night.

    
"to Europeans: can you please try explain to me why your countries accept Muslims"

My brother used to go to a boxing club - he told me once that there was a guy that trained there that was reading, amongst other things, Marcel Proust. We thought it odd at the time, what with it being a boxing club. My brother was worried that before long he'd have the other lads reading Genet, James Baldwin and maybe even, God forbid, Oscar Wilde.

We were worried about where it all might end.

Yes, they want to drive down wages, but unfortunately, they don´t import millions of bankers, doctors and lawyers, businessmen and civil servants and politicians etc. If they did that they could cut taxes massively and that won´t do. The system is most of all interested in the system and its own self-preservation and growth.

And, as usual, you're probably wrong.

to Europeans: can you please try explain to me why your countries accept Muslims

this is not question to somebody called "Europeans". this is question for Angela Merkel and few stupids from Brusel - those are forming Europe and setting rules here.

United Nations: Human Rights! People are free to be religious and have their own opinions. There is nothing wrong with Islamic People/Muslims. There Is, however, a problem with Islamic Extremism (A MINORITY OF THE POPULATION)

(also: more than 1 million people have been trafficed from Siria and other neighbouring countries. So, some haven't been accepted... They have just arrived and then travel to the richest part of Europe, western Europe: France, Germany, Spain, England...)

I've never been particularly critical of Merkel. As far as German politics goes, she seemed fairly reasonable.

Until this insanity.

Now I think she'll go down in history as the German chancellor who did more damage to Europe than any other in history. Including Hitler.

This is quite funny what she did. If this is what you are referring to.
1. She allowed 800,000 migrants to seek refugee status in Germany.
2. She said that they would just accept the first 800,000 that arrived to Germand and seeked aslyum there.
3. She offered no way for the migrants to travel there meaning, people were using expensive ways to travel there instead.
4. She also then forced the aslyum to not be granted after only 70,000 people had entered the country,  they realised that they couldn't cope with this increase even though they agreed to allow 10x the ammount of people to enter and stopped them at a very low amount, compred with what they were willing to take!

controversy is not just about recent events like accepting migrants. she defended NSA or holds Greece in EU..

Well, Germany is an occupied country and has been for 70 years. I doubt that it has much of an independent policy, at least in key issues. It´s just how it is with occupied countries and vassal states. The Russians left long ago so don´t blame them.

Strange to think that Germany didn't have room for 800,000 migrants when 10% of Europes population is living in the UK which has the least amount of land in the entirety of Europe!

Saudi Arabia has much more available space than Germany. (14 people per sq km for Saudi Arabia vs. 232 people per sq km for Germany.) Of course, millions of Muslims migrating en masse to Saudi Arabia would defeat the obvious purpose of the migration.

http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/EN.POP.DNST (http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/EN.POP.DNST)

Those medieval princes in charge of the Saudi dictatorship have absolutely no interest in anything that could destabilize or threaten their hold on power. So, hundreds of thousands of refugees is definitely not on the list.

BTW, the U.S. seems to be giving up on those Saudi fruitcakes at least weapons sales have been decreasing. Guess who has been busy taking up the slack lately , that´s right the French. Makes sense, if you´re busy shoveling weapons into warzones that´s likely to bolster happiness and good will toward you and absolutely decrease the risk of terrorist attacks on your territory.

turkish fans boo and shout allah etc during the 1 minute silence for victims of Paris killings.

really nice people these muslims, invite them into Europe

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3322708/Turkey-supporters-boo-minute-s-silence-victims-Paris-attacks-prior-team-s-friendly-against-Greece-Istanbul.html (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3322708/Turkey-supporters-boo-minute-s-silence-victims-Paris-attacks-prior-team-s-friendly-against-Greece-Istanbul.html)

My guess is that they are far more fearful, existing in a culture which uses fear commonly for control of the people, and certainly they are far more ignorant - statistically, this would be true for all the middle eastern nations maybe with an exception for Kuwait.

Maybe Europeans should start using soccer matches against turkey as an opportunity to inform people about the genocide the turks committed against the Armenians.

Na. The turkish animals are probably proud of that.

I'm going to sponsor a Syrian family to stay with me. Anybody know an agency/NGO helping the refugees? My home is open.  ;)

Never mind, I found a contact.

EDIT: Ok, I have put aside 2K $USD to help with expenses and basic needs while the family settles in. I hope to be of some help in navigating the systems here in America. I'll also see what I can do to help them find work.

To us, lives in the western world are simply worth infinitely more than the lives of people somewhere in Farawayistan. It´s obvious; we take special care to vote into power people with exactly the same mentality.

A good start would be to get them into some work with electrical. After that job have them work in a mining operation so they can get familiar with explosives.

Failing that just get them working in a gun store or gun range.

All winning jobs for new refugees, should greatly reduce their jihadi incubation stages.

Dunno if you are joking or not, but I vaguely considered doing something similar.  I'm kind of allergic to responsibly to the extent that I don't even have any pets so it makes little practical sense in my case, but I have a lot of respect for people who would do such a thing.  An immigration policy which was based on non-coercive sponsorship is one that I could get behind.  It looks to me an awfully lot like these one-worlders (such as Obama or whoever controls him) are interested primarily in developing groups of antagonists who will be helpful in a divide-n-conquer strategy.

To say the honest truth, I sort of consider my countrymen to be 'damaged goods'.  Certainly the ones born after about 2000 AD.  The best hope for the country in the form which the founders seem to have been envisioning is probably people who are drawn to this country by some of these 'old school' principles and I believe that there are many people around the world who fit that description.  In the case of people from many parts of the Middle East, having your country ripped apart by American imperialism and NWO/UN machinations must be a powerful lesson in why it is worth the struggle to resist these forces is worthwhile.

There are homeless American kids sleeping on the streets or stuck in foster homes, whose futures are most likely screwed, but you gotta help your fellow Americans by importing refugees from a foreign country. Maybe look at yourself too.

This is a 20 minute video worth watching. There are some aspects of the video I could argue with, but at this point maybe it's time to make some questionable alliances. Stalin against Hitler kinds of alliances.

If anyone's interested, I used some clips of the video (along with other images) to create a 3 minute version set to Leonard Cohen's version of The Partisan (a song about the French Resistance in WW2). I posted the file on mega:

https://mega.nz/#!4A4FDJBJ!-mqEvLUKUpJMLMgGoMqGjcatIUmV4J0g-xy0WiRJcPs (https://mega.nz/#!4A4FDJBJ!-mqEvLUKUpJMLMgGoMqGjcatIUmV4J0g-xy0WiRJcPs)

I had planned to post it on a video site like dailymotion or youtube. Dailymotion refused to publish it for whatever reason and google/youtube makes it impossible to make an account through Tor. If anyone else wants to publish it in an easier way to watch, I'd be happy about it.

Incidentally, I also made a copy of the original 20 minute video in case it disappears. It's probably the sort of thing you should share with people on usb sticks. It's the kind of thing Merkel and Zuckerberg don't want shared on Facebook. Sharing it on the internet at all is probably unwise.


You're wasting your time with RodeoX. He hates the West. He knows what he's doing and why.

Haters are always quick to project their hate on others. I guess it has to do with the main weakness of idiots, well apart from the obvious one, they always underestimate the intelligence of other people. It goes without saying.

Hi Jason,

The history of Muslims in Europe goes back centuries, simply looking at a few headlines current events won't really give you a full picture. Millions of Muslims live peacefully in Europe and integrate well and add value to society at similar rates to any other population group

The indigenous (white) Muslim populations of Bosnia were largely displaced as refugees in the early 90's and settled in other parts of Europe. In particular France has so many Muslims because of its colonisation of Syria, Algeria, Tunisia in the early 20th century and long-standing interests in those regions. Britain has had strong ties with Pakistan going back hundreds of years and has large Muslim population as a result. Spain, due to it's geographical proximity to Northern Africa, also has a well established Spanish Muslim population.

At the end of the day, (IS or whatever pseudonym you wish to attach to this bizarre paramilitary force) is initially funded, trained and equipped by same western forces that have been trying to gain control of the same region they have been trying to secure since the 1950's using pretty much the same tactics.

Most Europeans understand this and welcome refugees of all race and creeds, but yes the current situation is a major security concern and for sure there will be all sorts of undesirables coming into the 'open borders' Europe. So its a tough cookie to chew for EU's security forces, they literally cant check everyone coming in.

Its funny you should express this point of view - I have read your sig only 1 week after having talked to a "lady" local to me that expressed a very similar viewpoint to yours. Same legitimation also - the holocaust. She even asserted that Israel needn't conform to International Law - because, well, the Holocaust. I was shocked.

How are you any different from the desperate souls that have just blown themselves up - and taken 129 innocents with them - in Paris ?

Some people are calling for any ISIS sympathisers to be banned on these forums. I don't believe they should - and neither do I believe you should be banned - but what, in your opinion, differentiates you from them ?

First of all, I'm not killing anyone or even threatening to kill anyone. It's easy enough to exterminate the human species by simply attacking the ability to reproduce.

The followers of Mohammed are attempting to bring the world under the Muslim rule. I'm of the opinion that human extinction is a preferable alternative. You're free to believe otherwise, of course. And if Allah is so Ackbar, then I'm sure he can stop me from creating nanobots that attack the human reproductive system.

In any case, the nature of my promise is to let people know that Israel's destruction is their destruction. It's much easier for people to dismiss the widespread advocacy of the extermination of the Jewish state if they think it doesn't affect them.

Regarding "International Law" -- there is no such thing. And by any reasonable standard, Israel is more civilized to her enemies than her enemies are to -- well, anyone. Israels enemies are barbarians that chop off heads and throw people off buildings. I'm not sure if any of that's against "International Law" though.

Gates of Vienna

Sure you are.  The only question is whether you are a blow-hard jackoff which I find likely in this instance.


I've heard such a threat here and there myself over the last few years.  As in this case (if the quotes are correct) it is probably a parroting of something that some wanker heard somewhere.  It's hard to think of a better way to legitimize various warnings from the anti-semitic crowd...for what it's worth. 

Beyond that, it's a potential risk that is not completely outside the realm of possibility from a technical perspective.  I've long felt that such a thing is more likely than, say, global thermo-nuclear war as devastating high mortality events go, though not necessarily as a retaliatory action of 'the joos.'

Well, that's crazy talk.

RE: Chopping off heads. That´s definitely not against international law, otherwise the people we vote into power wouldn´t be crawling over each other selling weapons to the medieval head-chopping fruitcakes in charge of Saudi-Arabia and fawning at their feet. I guess some of those weapons end up with other head-chopping enthusiasts such as ISIS. The Middle-East is BTW France´s most important weapons market and their sales to Saudi-Arabia are ballooning now that Uncle Sam seems to be giving up on those head chop nuts. But of course this doesn´t have to do with anything, effect doesn´t usually follow cause except maybe when it´s convenient for the right purposes.

Chopping off heads - bombing schools.

You say potarto - I say potaeto.

Lets call the whole thing off.

Why would anyone care about what was "against some bullshit supposed international law," unless it was some kind of international law that actually existed and was well established, like international maritime law recognizing salvage rights and territorial rights?

Well, I guess there´s an international law against attacking other countries without any truthful justification and on totally false pretenses, at least if the attacker eventually ends up being the losing side.

Well if I only had one choice I'd rather hang out with a bunch of Arabs than these clowns in Europe's far-right.

Did anybody see them get kicked out of Liverpool on the weekend? by a bunch of socialist/anarchist types and the trade union folks. Lol they are meant to be hardcore football hooligans but they get sent home by a bunch of tea-smoking hippies and trust-fund Marxists.

In the UK we have one anti-Muslim party but they are a local joke, they call themselves UKIP, their leader looks like a frog and he couldn't even win a seat in parliament. Ironically there are probably more Muslims on the electoral register than UKIP supporters.

The truth of the matter is this:

MOST Europeans welcome refugees from anywhere on Earth.
MOST Europeans judge a foreigner on his or her individual actions and willingness to integrate and contribute to society, not their race/religion or culture.
MOST Europeans hang our heads in shame when we see people like Marine Le Pen, Golden Dawn or PAGIDA using fear and distrust to propel their political careers.

I think, instead of asking why europeans countires accept muslims, we should ask our self: When we plan to teach this people that Islam is not the answer?

What I mean by that? People who belong to this religion think that the Islam is the right way of believing in God! Do you think that this is normal thing? If that text is sacred as they says, then why it teach them to look in one direction?

I don't have against muslims, but I can not accept the fact that those people believe so blindly in that texts!

I don´t know: if adults are into this imaginary friends in the sky thing, doesn´t it make more sense to try to standardize it? So called christians have literally thousands of sects and cults everyone of which believes that theirs is the only right god and the way to believe. So they don´t even agree on the number of those imaginary friends. Which is understandable since what those heavenly creatures are mostly interested in is money for their deputies in charge of all those cults. It´s competing rackets, that´s all.

My country accept them cause Europe says so and Europe most possibly because that way we can have some more terrorism. I bet all that is because they want to spy on us bit more, just like USA does to their citizens. I really cant imagine other reason.

How about money? That thing that seems uppermost in the minds of most people? Imagine that.  War, weapons sales? It seems kind of likely that weapons manufacturers are interested in the weapons being used. It´s a business. Usually businessmen are interested in repeat sales at least they´re more interested in that than going out of business because the market has dried up. And I think we can safely assume that management and shareholders are very interested in the share prices.

Good ideas. Unlike Americans, people in the rest of the world know how to do things besides deliver pizzas to each other. I'll have to look into the trades.

" to Europeans: can you please try explain to me why your countries accept Muslims"


There were 4 people that perpetrated the attacks on London on 7th July, 2005.

2 were born in Leeds, West Yorkshire.
1 was born in Bradford, West Yorkshire.
And one was raised from the age of 5 in West Yorkshire, having come across from Jamaica.

They were British.

The problem is not one of Europe accepting Muslims - neither is it one of complex encryption algorithms.
It is a problem which to the people of the West is hidden, and for which there is no pertinent dialogue. The only narrative is that supplied by the state controlled media.
The problem, it seems to me, is in large part, the West attempting to guarantee its own energy security by occupying, either directly or indirectly, oil rich states in the middle East - or ones that strategically are important to the supply of oil (and/or the security of Israel within the region).

If we want to prevent another atrocity such as the one that occurred in Paris last Friday night, then I reckon we need to start having a grown up discussion about these issues.

Well said. Obviously you have not been scared by the terrorist operation in Paris. You sir are the jihaddi's great fear, someone with a backbone.

You are spot on bro, follow the money every time:

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/oireachtas/mick-wallace-says-arms-industry-shares-up-4-in-three-days-1.2433873

And if you follow the money trail far enough it usually lead you back to Saudi Arabia, a country literally run by religious extremists and armed by NATO. Oh but they are our buddies so we never talk about that.

Yeah, as usual when lots of hot air is being spewed by politicians and presstitutes it´s best to focus on what they avoid mentioning. Especially if it´s an elementary-my-dear-watson thing like money and financial  interests. And of course always watch what whey do more closely than what they say.

Well being a muslim i believe on humanity and respect for other religions existing in the world. The refugees are also suffered due to this stupid terrorism on the name of Islam. But unfortunately some people who seems that they are right and Extremisms is the right way. But they totally wrong there is no justification of stupid attacks. Yes it is the good human behavior of western countries to gave poor muslims a safe shelter. 99% of muslims are peaceful.

Where are you from?

Why do you believe Islam is not compatible with democracy?

Are you not for helping people in need?

I'm calling you out on this.  It's an easy, glib thing to say.  But is it true?

I have reason to think it is not true, that Saudi funds the money trail of ISIS.

So if you want to assert it, can you prove it?

Thanks.

Whats your analysis of the situation ?

how many of those 4 people you mention were muslim? let me guess? all 4?

which makes it even worse. Shows my points even more strongly, the fact that they are born in those countries and have not assimilated in any way, muslim above british, pro islam vs pro democracy - but this fact seems to be lost on you.

yes there is an oil issue at play, but explain how the 4 muslims in growing up in Britain were in any way impacted by oil wars in the middle east? They were not. They obviously felt more Muslim than British. I am not saying the oil wars are right, they are not, but in this case those 4 guys were not displaced families from US bombs in iraq or similar.

And the real kicker is instead of attacking government offices, or military bases, what do they do? attack defenseless civilians, of course!

Which is my point, Muslims and the west are not compatible. It is a waste of time discussing anything. There is a core sect of muslims that hate democracy and hate the west, and they will always find an excuse to be upset and to attack. If its not oil, it will be Israel. If its not Israel it will be infidels. If it is not infidels it will be someone drawing Mohammed. if its not drawing Mohammed it will be you are denying them sharia law, if its not that it will be someone in their neighborhood is selling pork etc etc etc

All this while the silent majority of muslims say, hey, most of us are peaceful, but inside are doing nothing to stop the crazies, and cheering them on, sometimes not so silently, please see the video of the crowd at the recent greece turkey soccer game.

I wasn't asking how are we going to get along, that is a waste of time.

I was asking why do Europeans let people in who they are not going to get along with, its just plain stupid.

and I never thought I would see the day where I cheer on Russian forces instead of US armed forces, but the day has arrived.

Russians blowing the hell out of 500 ISIS fuel trucks, the ISIS money machine.

for some perverse reason I think Obama / CIA is going to be very unhappy with this video. Oh wait, Obama couldn't find them, they were too camouflaged.

the world is so messed up. Obama creates the ISIS syria crisis, creates the refugee crisis, and then pretends he cannot find Isis when it all backfires on him.

what a terrible president, and a terrible man.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgYbiCGYy2c&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgYbiCGYy2c&feature=youtu.be)

I view it as the end product of political correctness gone amuk.

For example, we have immigration policies and procedures.  People with certain contageous diseases are not allowed to immigrate.  Prostitutes are not allowed.  Felony level convictions are a disallowance.  On and on, including people with ties to known terrorist organisations.

Make no mistake about it, the current ABUSE of the "refugee status" is a clear attempt to make an end run around the rules.

I don't care whether the reason is disease, criminal record, or terrorist history.  Such people should be not allowed in, but when the "refugee card" is played, it trumps these factors and trumps common sense.

You make some valid points - but let me make one thing clear - I am in no way an apologist for their actions. Far from it - they have forfeited their rights to life as far as I'm concerned. No, its just that I am more concerned with getting at the root cause of the problem - I actually don't want to see a repitition of what occurred last Friday.

And to my mind, the root cause is not Islam. For years they told us that the root cause of the troubles in Ireland was religion also - in that case it was supposed to be Catholicism vs. Protestantism.
 Of course, this was just a red herring, the legitimation that was expediant to maintain an exploitative domination - the root of the problem was British emperialism. But if you say that out loud in the current climate you are supposed to be some kind of lilly livered nancy boy.


     I mean, I know there are those among us that have a much stronger stomach than me, and a more sterling backbone - they are most likely calling for co-ordinated airstrikes and boots on the ground etc etc. as we speak.
    Whereas I personally have been calling for a more honest debate on the issues on foreign policy re. the middle east for a long time, certainly way before 9/11. I have had, and do have, relatives serving out there - so I have a personal vested interest you could say.

   Off to bed for me now. I'll just say this before I go - history repeats itself, first as tragedy, and then as farce.

  All you have to work out is, are you tragic - or are you a joke ?

Catholics in New Zealand are not, for some reason, blowing up Protestant churches in some weird kind of association with issues in Ireland.  I think that is a comparable scenario....

Because of many easily thought out examples like this, I am strongly included to assert some causation to a phenomena of violence associated strictly with Islam, to some aspects of Islam itself.

I do not think we should have ever put one western boot in the middle east, ever. Air strikes are a waste of time too. The only legitimate targets are attacking WMD facilities (not imaginary ones, real ones). And by that I mean attacking the actual WMD facility itself, not the entire country. but that is just my opinion.

In the context of war, air strikes are certainly not a waste of time, but an essential aspect of any winning strategy.  Your talk about "legitimate targets" is not framed correctly in any particular context.  War, rooting out insurgents, spy and covert activity looking for singular targets, blah blah blah.

Air strikes in the absence of a boots on the ground general war are a completely different matter.  Here "air strikes" must be segregated into styles, such as fighter/bomber vs. drone strike, versus B52 converntional munitions, vs cruise missile precision targeting.  These must then be viewed in line with the nature of supporting ground forces, and their level of competence and strength against an enemy.

There is nothing nice about this stuff. 

Putin tanks in New Hitler survey as Whatshisname soars.

Current standings:  
Whatshisname, the head of that ISIS thing 92%
Vladimir Putin, evil dictator of Russia 8%

Standings from Weekly Survey: Who is the New Hitler, by Webcrawlers United, Routed, Hitler Franchise [TM]

Well, I suppose you are right to some extent. Islam is definitely in the mix - but for me its just not the "prime mover". You certainly can't imagine turn the other cheek Christians acting in a similar fashion, I'll grant you.

I suppose what I'm driving at is best summed up by William James when he said  - "Religion makes felicitous and easy, what in any case is necessary".

Its working out what is necessary for certain groups that should be the focus of our attention. Take away someones home, their countries wealth, their right to self determination - murder those that protest against it - and things become necessary that weren't necessary before.




The Irish (and I am of Irish descent) came to mainland UK to find work. They were living in poverty in Ireland, often starving - though there was no famine (https://www.facebook.com/notes/irish-holocaust-push-to-educate-the-facts/an-open-letter-to-the-irish-national-famine-memorial-day/10150171679388022) - and so had no choice but to make the trip over the water, leaving their homeland behind. It was necessary.
  On arrival they were greeted often by racist xenophobes - but, if they were lucky, they got to find work doing the hardest, most dangerous and least well paid jobs that the natives didn't want to do. They formed their own communities, as all immigrant populations do, but slowly over the years became more integrated and assimilated into the wider population. I myself, my very existence, is a testament to this.

Anyhow, I digress. What I'm driving at is that the Islam bogeyman provides an easy to grasp handle on the situation for the masses - but really, to my mind, the main driver is economic necessity and/or economic exploitation. 
 
   

Mate, sorry to say this, but you don't know anything about religion and spirituality...

Because, if you do, you will know the difference between religion and the Bible. You will know that what the preachers teach us and what is written in the Bible is so so wrong. You will also know that the people who are leading the temples are do that to earn money, just like it was written in the New Testament.

People having a problem when they try to think of God and his power, but they actually don't see that God was create us in His image (so we are like Him) and if we want to unlock those powers, the first thing that we must do is to start to believe in our self.

Tell me, how you would be able to believe in others if you actually don't believe in yourself? Or tell me, do you prepare to believe in some thing bigger that you, if you first don't believe in yourself? :)

This closeness to the other, to the point of feeling that he is someone who belongs to me, overcomes every barrier of nationality, social extraction and religion … as the good Samaritan of the Gospel parable teaches us. It also overcomes that culture in a negative sense in which, both in rich and poor countries, human beings are accepted or refused according to utilitarian criteria, especially in terms of social or economic utility. This mentality is the parent of the so-called 'medicine of desires': an increasingly widespread custom in rich countries, characterised by the search for physical perfection at all costs, in the illusion of eternal youth; a custom that leads indeed to the rejection and marginalisation of all that is not 'efficient', that is seen as a burden or a hindrance, or is simply ugly.

Cute, huh? Stolen from the pope.

because some of us in the UK are not hateful. some of us truly believe that the majority of asylum seekers and such are not terrorists.
It just makes me sad when bad stuff happens and the only thing i hear are cries of "Bloody Immigrants"

They're not terrorists indeed. Just social parasites, who desperately want to receive monthly subsidy from your pocket. State will help them gladly with that, through inventing new taxes or increasing the profit tax, for example... Just like it happened in France.

That must be why England, Sweden, and other countries find their problems with rape are almost completely caused by muslims.

There's nothing wrong with making a generic statement, that if you move a certain number of Muslims into a Western country, that various sorts of crime and assault will increase, that there will be a small fraction of radical and violent terrorists included, and other negatives. 

Turning a blind eye to this is ignoring reality.  Better to ask "Is the increase in rape significant?"  And other questions which explore the reality of the social change.

Almost completely caused by muslims? Do you have a source for this? Not saying it can't be true but seems odd. That should be true in other european countries with higher muslims populations then. Percentage wise and actual numbers.


Muslims from Indonesia, Malaysia, Turkey, Iran, etc are all the same to you? What about that study that talks about crime rates in muslim countries or countries with large muslim populations to be less than non-muslim countries for example? Generalizations don't always make sense.

So what is their current tax rate? This doesn't seem fair at all but then again their really isn't much fair about Socialism anyway.

 This is a slightly different point to the argument that I was addressing.What exactly are we talking about here ? The Syrian crisis ? Refugees in general ? Multi cultural societies ? Islam/religion ? Sex/hate crimes ?  I've already tried to answer the OP's question - but the goalposts are getting shifted.

There have been numerous cases over the last few years of gangs of men (of ethnic descent) that have been grooming and sexually exploiting young girls in inner city shitholes, predominantly in the north of England. I have no idea what religion these men were, if any.  These men are without doubt worthless parasitic scum.

Is there a real problem here ? Yes there is.

But putting it down to Islam is a bit too easy - and quite probably counter productive.



    It has to be said, that if you want sexual exploitation of the basest kind, the really hateful stuff, then you need to have a look at what our Prime Minister, General Chief of Staff and numerous other pillars of the Establishment/members of the Great and Good were engaging in during the 1970's in orphanages throughout the land. Do a search on Haut de la Garenne for example.
   I don't think it involved the Koran.



  Your question is a question re. the feasibility of a multi cultural society, the melting pot. The Far Right, I know, tells us its an unobtainable and undesirable myth. Their idea is that a community that isn't "infiltrated" by foreign elements is a happy community. This itself is mythical. What happens in reality is that immigrant populations give the host population an easy vent for its frustrations - that it would otherwise have to turn in on itself.

   FWIW I'd say the notion of a "melting pot" is a misnomer. That being said diverse communities can peacefully coexist for the betterment of all concerned. A thriving economy helps. As does a bit of tolerance of difference.



  

that is a very lame question you have there. Everybody has a right to religion and depends on their heart. Remember those terrorist attacking innocent people in the name of Islam they are non but lost souls. they have been radicalized for the benefit of few evil people no Islam. Instead of such a post we should be trying to preach peace among st ourselves not hating. Peace peace

Wow, stop please! If you are talking about how the system if functioned, then you have the same thing in the Bible...

It's very clearly written in the Old Testament how should one government works like. The government is chosen by the people, to serve to the people. Here, I will give some practical example:

If you are chosen to be leader of group then what are you responsibilities? To serve the group by leading then and teaching them. It is the same with the government, the people are choose so they can lead them in right direction not in wrong like we have now in 21 century. That is the Matrix! That's why we have so many poor people! That's why the world is unbalanced!

No they do not always make sense.  I am simply arguing in favor of looking at the facts instead of covering them up.  Where ever they lead.

http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5195/sweden-rape

Well, I stole that wisdom from the Pope or his script writers like I said up there. As for politicians, it isn´t like they jump up on a soapbox and the masses flock to their banner and their brilliance. No, it costs money to advertise them and promote them like pretty much everything else I guess. That´s democracy for you. Who´s their master, the people or their corporate sonsors? That isn´t always clear.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uigRJkE7GMI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ohh-eZ6isgM

Very interesting video, recommended to everyone.

I guess they poop and piss in plastic bags in those trailer trucks.  ;D

https://www.rt.com/news/322963-isis-dolls-attack-foiled/

IS uses dolls, the US uses drones . What's the difference when the end result is the same, innocent children are killed.

This is also going to happen in Europe. If they won't be stopped of course.

Yes, and the crux of the matter is that they won´t be stopped and eradicated unless you have allies on the ground there doing the groundwork. First bomb, then mop up. The U.S. and NATO have only enemies (well apart from some mercenary garbage and moderate terrorists and some medieval dictators in charge of their vassal states in the area) after systematically destroying and destabilizing country after country. So, nobody in their right mind is very interested in more of the same from those screwballs.

This begs the question, really.  The question is which set of screwballs they get as Overlords, and which set of mercenary garbage and moderate terrorists and medieval dictators wind up in charge of their vassal states.

Insult and malign the actions of war of those with honorable intentions all you want, then just shut up when you get the remainder.

Well, way worse than useless screwballs have been conducting this so called war on terrorists since 2001. Most clueless morons have given up on excusing the train wrecks and the boom in terrorism that this has left.

Hahaha, talk about projecting one´s dumbness on others. This yokel calls other people airmchair generals. Right.

I guess truth hurts.

If you like, consider my comments critical of our mutual dumbness.  If not, then consider the plain and simple words of my comments.  Makes no difference to me.

It isn´t just in the Middle-East that the U.S./NATO has been busy bolstering terrorism by wagering war against it and creating it directly. The U.S. set up a special African Command in the last years of the Bush administration and have since then been at war with terrorism all over Africa, at least where there´s something worth stealing. The very predictable and familiar result: A boom in terrorism.

No, if you can show some cause and effect relation between American actions in Africa, and any alleged "boom in terrorism," go ahead and try.  Africa has its own unique dynamics, sub Saharan and northern.  And it's unusual outcome where "fighting terrorism" creates a vacuum of power, so my comments remain.

Sure does look like armchair general you excel, in but when questioned, revert to ad hominem.  Hey just blame the US, nobody will question it.  Right?

Coleman is knowledgeable about African, wonder what he's got to say about this.

Think I´ll put this guy on ice for a few months at least. It´s utterly devoid of any useful content.

 The Untold Story of Mali and Oil  (http://www.oil-price.net/en/articles/mali-and-oil-untold-story.php)

Same story in Nigeria, Libya (obviously), Angola  (http://globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn.com/2013/05/17/angola-matters-to-u-s-so-whats-the-problem/) ....

Figures.  You don't like your bullshit being questioned.

Can't have that.

you missing the point. Air strikes are great at blowing shit up and even great at killing people you are targeting.

what it doesn't explain, is that for every 10 jihadis you kill, you probably create another 50 through the collateral damage plus bad public relations.

so its pointless. Almost every single one of these Isis recruits that I have seen interviewed has one common thread in their logic : they become enraged at seeing infidels in the holy land and enraged at the videos of infidels killing muslims.

save the strikes for major threats, like WMD facilities. Rather spend all that money on strengthening borders and intelligence. Lacking something to fight and lacking an immediate target to vent their frustrations on, these guys ALWAYS end up killing each other, they hate each other a lot too, they just hate the west more.

ISIS is trying to get US to commit to battle, as well as Europe. It's a jihadi recruiting machine x 1000 for them.

Obviously never happen as the weapons companies will go out of business.

yes lets all hold hands and sing camp songs

I don't think Europeans can see it, but from the outside it looks like the EU is in the early stages of falling apart.

And you believe the conclusion to take from that article is that rape in sweden is almost completely caused by muslims? Maybe a lot of it is. I don't know. Didn't read the linked articles, and they aren't in english. But that isn't the conclusion I would take. The article has problems:

comparing data with 30 years difference and ignoring society changed in the meantime. They say higher rates of report and different laws are strange explanations for that. But both are true. Reports are more encouraged than 30 years ago and laws have changed a lot. Not only the new things that are now reported as rape as they say. But also the way it is reported is now different: each assault is counted separately. Even for the same people involved. That is why it's problematic to compare different countries with different laws. The article also lies directly: it compares denmark and sweden saying laws are similar. They are more similar now that denmark changed the criminal code. But weren't in the data they compare for 2008 and 2011. Denmark is one of the worst countries in europe in terms of violence against women. And with a lot of under reporting of rapes. And laws against it were very weak until 2013 when changes were made. For example rape of someone in a helpless state didn't count as rape.

they admit there isn't a lot of studies on background of rapists. Between links not being in english and they lying as I said above I don't know if data they show is true. But take the 1996 study that talks about countries of origin. And how more likely immigrants from those countries were to commit rape than swedish men. "The figures for men from Iraq, Bulgaria and Romania were, respectively, 20, 18 and 18. Men from the rest of Africa were 16 times more prone to commit rape; and men from Iran, Peru, Ecuador and Bolivia, 10 times as prone as Swedish men." If this was all a muslim thing I would expect to see Iran higher too. And christian nations like bulgaria and romenia down, not with almost double the rate of a muslim nation. So either there was not sufficient information to take broad conclusions. Or the society where immigrants come from has great impact. It's not only religion. Like I said do you want to compare people in indonesia, malaysia, saudi arabia, somalia, etc just because they share the same religion? Doesn't make sense.

uhmmm maybe it does make sense, because in a lot of the arab countries you mentioned, if you report getting raped, it gets you a public whipping for being a slut?

What?  I posted an article that clearly states the limits of it's methodology and conclusion.  That's being about as fair to all sides as one can get, isn't it?

It's a lost cause. I have realized Europeans live in a make believe world. They seem to be logically illiterate.

For example, they are going to spend 100s of billions of dollars on these new refugees who will offer them nothing but headaches, yet they could have offered a lot of their troubled member states complete debt relief and restructuring with that same money (Portugal Italy Spain Greece).

Instead they chose to humiliate Greece as a warning to others, and welcome millions of hostile strangers.

So, they would rather help anonymous strangers and not their own eu citizens.

The place is done for, I am absolutely convinced we are seeing the beginning of the breaking apart of the eu.

The borders fences are going up, they are taking on a massive social and financial burden with refugees and their debt crisis is not solved it's been put on hold temporarily, plus throw in massive youth unemployment, and now a legitimate terror threat that will haunt them for the next decade at minimum. 

Lying to make a point isn't fair. Did you read what I wrote?


Arab and muslim isn't the same thing. And he was talking about muslims. But if you believe it makes sense and since he avoided the question maybe you want to answer? If society where people come from doesn't matter why are people from christian countries like ecuador, romenia or bolivia with the same or higher likelihood to rape than people from a muslim nation according to the study? Are all christians rapists too? And are people from countries so different as saudi arabia, qatar, turkey, malaysia, etc the same because they maybe share the same religion?

I agree with you I don't know how reliable these studies are. The data is difficult to verify and can be skewed easily.

What is more difficult to dispute is it's definitely a fact that almost all the countries the refugees come from have very low levels of women's rights.

So I don't understand if women are 50 percent of eu vote, how can they possibly think this ends well for them?

And maybe you're right. But if there aren't reliable studies to back it up all you are doing is speculating. You are speculating the refugees will behave that way in the new countries. That they are hostile as you posted above. That they will not integrate in the new society. Nor their descendents. And that they will only be a burden and a danger to society. Maybe someone else can speculate that for example a good amount of syrian refugees are normal people with skills who were productive in their society. And if given the chance will be in the new country too. Maybe someone else can make the case that most countries where refugees come from are dictatorships or failed states. Countries where moderate and progressive forces are killed or persecuted. So taking broad conclusions from all refugees is problematic. Without evidence, I don't know what the reality is. But I know that many are running for their lives. I don't believe what is being done is all that is necessary to solve the problem. But I have nothing against helping them as much as possible for now. Then a long term solution will need to stabilize the middle east. Not bombing it without pause. And destroying countries everywhere.

Muslim rape in England, this subject has been being discussed for years.

http://www.clarionproject.org/analysis/muslim-child-rape-gangs-britain#

That is no speculation. Go visit France. The Muslims there have made pretty much zero effort at integration, and probably most if not all the attackers are 2nd generation.

You might be helping the refugees, but you are doing it at the expense of your fellow eu citizens.

Plus what happens when half of Africa shows up at your door? You gonna absorb 250 million more refugees? What you are seeing is the tip of the iceberg.

And when you slam the door on those 250 million, the left and the rest of the world are going to call you racists.

So you may as well as raise your middle finger now, get called a racist, and tell them all to get the f out.

Horrible cases. Too short sentences for what they did. And political correctness gone too far. But looks more like a problem with people of the pakistani community to me. This article goes more in-depth about it: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/child-sex-grooming-the-asian-question-7729068.html


You're saying most of the 5 or 6 million muslims in france have not integrated in the society? Ok. Integration is a difficult process. Assimilation worse. France being a very racist country too doesn't help. But that is still not believable. Of course there are problems. But saying all muslims or all immigrants are to blame isn't true and doesn't help.


No one expects europe to take in hundreds of millions people more. Only that it does what it can to help people who need it. Within its possibilities.

You're asking the wrong people.

History is written at least 30 years before it happens. All this was calculated to the slightest detail.

Some countries are getting forced to accept them, so they get accepted to European Union.
Some other countries need cheap labor.
Some other countries don't have/had an option.

Hungary did a great job doing its part in this media manipulation fasco.

It's all about geopolitics.

PS: Not sure if your question is serious, because I could ask the same thing about "USA", and you'd have an answer to give.

I think we should be united in this horrible time. We should not play into the hands of Evils who want us to divide and rule.

Its simple. Because the European countries are controlled by Zionist Jews and Freemasons. Thats why.

Europe, or any other place, has always relied on imported labourers. First that labour was cheap because you only had to buy the labourer, later it became somewhat more expensive when we left the idea and started paying wages, and stopped using whips.

It really has nothing to do with 'accepting muslims' or not, we accepted labourers and at the time, we got the best deals with muslimcountries I guess. Recently we got good deals with Polish labourers for example and we bitch about them drinking too much beer and being too loud.

Acceptance of muslims under the European people is another thing, we don't easilly mix but we do in some cases and if those people are happy Europeaners who are able to overcome their need to kill homos and rape kids then there is still some outlook.

???

This is nonsense.  If you add 5M people to a country with 100M, and they are equally productive, you should see 5% growth....

Mate, do you think that the popes write the Bible?

The Bible is written by Prophets and Apostles. The others that you call popes are preachers who was chosen to lead the temples. Those are the people that make things go wrong! Believe me, if you try to read the Bible I am sure that you will find all the mistakes in the modern era.

Everything that was written, especially in the New Testament is so true. If you try to think what the Apostles want to teach us, I am sure that you will realize many more things. I know why you are reject the Bible and I completely understand you. People don't believe because of the preachers and I hope that one day they will be a revolution where the normal people will say NO to the preachers and YES to the Bible. ;)

Suuuurrrrreeee.

The Evil Jews are working to bring millions of Muslims into Europe.

That's a good one.

Lol...

to Americans: can you please try explain to me why you completely fucked up Middle East and left Europe and Russia to deal with consequences?

to Rest of World:  Because it was your turn?  Because Russia likes her pipeline?  Because it was time for you to see how stupid your own leaders were, instead of just bitching about ours?  Because you've already forgotten about how much you liked Obama, so you helped put him in place?

Hell I don't know.  Got any more questions?

Well, it could be effective in furthering a Zionist objective.  Europe seems to be less inclined to support the type of ethnic cleansing required to achieve a 'greater Israel' than we here in the U.S. for some reason.  Pumping Europe full of criminals and associating their crimes with Islam probably would create an equivalence between what the masses want/need to do in Europe and what the Zionist wish to do in the Middle East.  An equivalence in the 'herd mind' at least, that that is all-important.

I'm certainly not saying that this is happening.  All I am doing is mulling over some of the 'motive' parts of a 'means, motive, opportunity' equation.  It is up to those who are more interested to uncover positive or negative information about the other components.  I'll look at any evidence brought to the table with an open mind.

It's all part of the beginning of Armageddon foretold by the Bible.

:)

If you wish to be specific, I would consider what you have to say about it.  I personally am not 'spiritual' and am not a bible scholar, but I can think of several reasons why religious texts are valuable to understand.

1)  Some of the writings describe events that shake out of basic human nature and systems devised by humans.  Some of these structures, strategies, etc are so universal that they have been repeated through our history.

2) A good strategy which would give a jump-start to a project would be to ride the shirt-tails of something which a sizable percentage of people already believe by virtue of it being 'sacred' in the texts of a popular religion.  Sort of a 'predictive programming' on steroids one might say.

Muslims are welcome, muslims are not terrorist, only few of them and I dont like to call them muslims, just crazy people.

The Bible is a book written by Zionists. So, if you read the Bible, you read the plans of Zionists.

If you want to learn more about the connection between the Bible and the Zionists you can read the book Bible Not for Adults of Argyris Tsakalias.

http://www.gbip.gr/book/1096/Tsakal%C3%ADas,_Arg%C3%BDris_D./Bible_Not_for_Adults

Wouldn't it be more likely that the movement of huge numbers of Muslims to Europe would be caused by people who say over and over they want to take over Europe....like Muslims?

It doesn't seem more likely to me.  'Muslims' have no power to even begin to do what is happening with the immigration stuff as far as I can tell.  They are dust blowing in a wind they have no real influence over.  I'm pretty convince that this is planned and implemented by those who have a broader vision.  Indeed, I've long felt that Zionists are probably but a cog in the same class as Christians, Muslims, Scientism-ists, etc.

I've also not really seen 'Muslims say over and over again' that they wish to take over Europe.  Maybe a few crazies who are very probably Western intel plants make some noise about this but my sense is that the average Muslim in Indonesia, Iran, etc, etc doesn't really give two fucks about Europe and certainly has no interest in 'taking it over'.  They've got the same set of problems of putting food on the table as everyone else by-n-large.  If it were not for Western drones exploding their wedding parties and such they probably would hardly think about the West any more than I think about Tajikistan.

My answer for USA is easy. Legislation was just passed denying any more Syrians entry. Even though the USA is probably the most responsible for the entire refugee crisis.

Do you have another question?

This is crazy talk.  You are reversing cause and effect, and rationalizing placing cause in the most unlikely places, instead of the most likely.  It doesn't even make sense as a conspiracy theory.

Do you really think that ISIS are the beginning of the Armageddon?

I am sure and there are a lots of evidence who telling us about what was happen in the Bible in the distant past. Every word from the prophets was come true. Every word! And what is written in the book of Revelation and what is happening right now is different. Because, the story is about the war between the angels and demons, not mankind. Mankind in that time will be deleted from the planet and only those who will chose to follow the path to the enlightenment will be saved.

You always have a choice. God never actually tells you that you should must believe in Him. He only shows you the path and the two direction and it is you who will decide to believe and walk the path. I am sure that those who are don't know in what they believe or they reject God as a Light and walk by their own, that they will reborn and will have to learn the same lesson again...

The only people I see making such statements about taking over large territories are the likes of 'ISIS' and it's well beyond 'conspiracy theory' that this group and other's like them are fully a creation of Western intelligence organizations.

The main adjustment I would make to my statement is to clarify that those involved in the psy-op may not be 'crazies' in real life, but act that way as part of the show.

I don't doubt that outfits such as ISIS have roped in some genuine wack-a-doodle Muslims (and the percentage of said among the population are roughly the same as in Christians, Hindu, Buddhist, etc religions) but that contingent of them in these manufactured and loud-mouth groups are nearly completely powerless to do anything on their own and pose zero threat to me or to any semi-functional nation state.  The problem comes when a 'semi-functional nation state', (or someone with influence over them (e.g., the United Nations)) sees the presence foreign radicals/criminals dispersed through a population as a way to achieve an objective which would otherwise be unpopular.  Bio-metric identification, increased individualized surveillance, and clamping down on internet freedoms would be some examples.

Bah.

You can prove anything anywhere with that kind of logic.

For example.  "It's well documented that the US fought with Russia in WWII Therefore Communism is the Product of US and British Intel."

Want more examples?  Just take the logical grammer and substitute true facts with different nouns.

I've watched with signification interest the evolution of 'ISIS/ISIL' since before most people had heard of the term.  It has been abundantly clear exactly what they are and what the goals of the operation (Western+ Wahhabist funding/training if ISIL/ISIS) since that time.  This is an even more blatant scam than the global warming hoax as I rate things.

TeamWakeEmUP (https://www.youtube.com/user/TeamWakeEmUP) (aka, Redsilverj) has done quite a thorough job of analysis in his 'Breaking Bullcrap' series recently covering the laughable 'beheading' hoaxes and a raft of other related stuff including a remarkable number of amusing 'mis-statements' by the likes of Obama, McCain, Clinton, Graham, etc.  Worth the time to watch this content IMHO.

The UN technically forced us too, along with the EU. It is not the religion that is corrupt, it is a small minority of extremist "Muslims". There is extremist groups of all faiths Islamism, Hindu, Catholocism/Christianity... ETC...

Neither the UN nor the EU can "force" on this issue. Europeans are largely accepting it, even celebrating it. But, eh, fuck them. Europeans will get what they deserve.

Regarding Islam, you sound like you've never studied it. The Jihadists are not a sign that Islam is "corrupt." The Jihadists are following the pure vision of Islam, as set out by their warrior prophet Mohammed. I'd challenge you to write a few paragraphs for yourself about when Mohammed lived and what he did. Then look up some sources and compare it to what you wrote. No offense, but most people (including most Muslims) know almost nothing about Islam and its founding.

Same with other religions. No one follows their religion to the letter. And they aren't unchangeable. Everyone ignores one part or another and has their interpretations. So you're basically agreeing with him. Most christians, muslims, etc moved on and are peaceful. Then there are extremists that haven't moved on. Or that follow only what they want of their religion.

Yes flat earth, NWO plan, chemtrails...

My country accepts people, if they decide living with the rules and norms of the country. We do not discriminate or reject people on behalf of their religion. Why should a Christian, budhist or an atheist be more welcome than a muslim?

flat earth:  Laughable psy-op undertaken partially to facilitate posts like yours.

NWO plan:  The (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1TgzCdn_wA) null hypothesis (no plan) is kind of absurd.

chemtrails:  'Owning the weather by 2025'...it's now 2016 FYI.  There are a fair number of patents involving releasing material from aircraft to achieve environmental effects.  That it does not yet ever happen is a stretch.

BTW, NOAA recently reported that commercial aircraft are 'accidentally' doing weather modification.  Funny how it took them so long to figure that one out.  They should have asked one of the rapidly growing pool of wacho's like me who would have pointed upward into the sky and suggested opening their eyes.

Confusing fantasy "chemtrails" with moisture vapor stratospheric trails is a big mistake.  Making something out of nothing one might say...

What is the basis for your apparently rock solid belief that you know with certainty the chemical composition of the persistent and spreading trails which are common these days?  If I might ask.

By the way, I poo-poo'd this 'conspiracy theory' myself, and with some forcefulness, until a few years ago.  Mostly what got me looking around a bit was various oddities that I observed with my own eyes over my head.  I got so interested by some of the stuff I saw that I actually started researched the right kind of camera to to the kinds of monitoring I would need to meet the level of rigor I thought I would wish to make meaningful observations.  Before I finished figuring this out almost all of the oddities stopped and I have seen almost none since.  This would have been in probably June of 2015.  We now have the same kinds of cloud cover I remember as a kid, and the typical shitty winters that I remembered (2012/13 and 2013/14 being amazingly nice and dry.)  It's actually a bit more wet than 'normal', but that is fairly easily explained by an el-nino this year.  I'm in the Southern Pacific NW by the way.

Oh, once you've convinced me that you perform your own spectral analysis to verify that water vapor is now acting in new and interesting ways, you can start to convince me that, ya, the Air Force was interested in 'owning the weather by 2025' (http://csat.au.af.mil/2025/volume3/vol3ch15.pdf) and a lot of people obtained patents (http://climateviewer.com/2014/03/24/geoengineering-weather-modification-patents/), but that project was dropped as uninteresting, not useful, unethical, non-profitable, etc.

Or you could try to convince me that the .mil site was defaced.  Or that it is a funny joke by air force folks with a sense of humor.  I would not rule out either of these, but they also do strike me as unlikely.

Knowledge of aircraft structures, and reference books.  Few planes have the ability to disperse chemicals from tanks, particularly at wingtips.  Water vapor trails created by wing and tail tips are very well understood.

I guess you could look at spectrographic analysis of them if you wanted.

I am not saying that there cannot be slight weather mods from water vapor clouds at jet cruise altitudes, but water vapor and clouds are not "chem trails."