Well, we are not expecting you to go through all of the posts on the forum, but perhaps a sensible analysis of just the posts on the thread that you are choosing to comment on would be optimal.  It seems unlikely that a time constraint would consistently lead to your sole selection of our posts only that need to be criticized especially where there are higher frequency and higher density of other users on those thread using ONLY ad hominem attacks that are not even mixed among/based upon valid and irrefutable points.  It is not impossible that a time constraint could result in such selective or randomly allocated criticism ending on our doorstep alone, but each time that it does pass over everyone else and does land on our door step alone it becomes increasingly improbable that could be the sole explanation.

Also I don't believe that our comment meets the threshold for not as bad fallacy in this instance. As I explained that particular post and many of the terms and statements made are not strictly ad hominem when you take the full context of the thread including the points raised in the initial post and other subsequent revelations. Therefore there are certainly posts contained within this thread and the other thread that your point would have been clearly more relevant and clearly stronger in terms of no opposition could have been forthcoming that would stand up to scrutiny. That is keeping in mind that our understanding is that ad hominem are personal attacks (even if factually based) that have no direct influence on the central points being made or that the central points being made are certainly not dependent on those personal attacks/statements of fact. I'm not even sure that one can say that calling a skunk a skunk is an attack anyway, no more than calling an undeniable scammer and undeniable scammer, especially when discussing skunks being present in places they have no business being and scammers being in places they have no business being.

That's not to say your points are disputed in full, but only that your points seems to lack the accuracy and indisputable relevance and strength they may have had if directed as any of other numerous members on this thread relying on PURE and undeniable clear ad hominem. Therefore the impact can be seen to be reduced or even nulled in full.

So that is what we meant by not as bad, perhaps not as applicable, not as relevant, not as clear cut, not as indefensible  etc.

We appreciate ad hominem is ad hominem, we simply dispute that post is clear cut as adhominem in the full context. Certainly you would have less problem presenting your point as clearly and undeniably valid with many other posts here by other members. Or even just for a change to mix things up a bit with a view to being neutral and all of that kind of thing.

I have no idea why you do not just join with the debate. I suspect it is because you have enough sense to realize they are trying to defend pretty much indefensible positions that they have put themselves in due to the observable instances in their post histories. Or again it could be a time constraint or lack of interest. Those are certainly possibilities.

As we say we have no direct issue with you actmyname, and are always willing to be cordial and fair. We ask the same.

So rather than keep to a definition that is objectively enforceable and sensible  to ensure only information that is presented as true is true. You want a definition that means the mods would need complete knowledge of every members life to enforce that is therefore meaningless and valueless. Anything could be inflammatory if you have personal knowledge of a persons life that may not even seem inflammatory to other readers at all. Trolling  from a forums perspective is only objectively enforceable using the forums definition in the rules as they are now.

I mean it is clear that you are afraid of needing to demonstrate any of our central points have been debunked, aka you know you can not debunk them because they are observable instances and are true.

You can't debunk them ( because they are true) so you want  definition where they can be true and have value but be called trolling because it is inflammatory to call scammers and scammer supporters... filthy skanky scammers or disgusting shit stain ass kissing scammer supporters. haha

Clearly trying to weasel out of the requirement of demonstrating they can debunk or demonstrate our central points are incorrect.

Can't debunk an observable instance or demonstrate it is incorrect =  THEN IT IS NOT TROLLING - got it scammer supporter.

Claiming independently verifiable observable instances are TROLLING when you know you can not debunk them is TROLLING TROLLING and should be punished to prevent this method of hiding, obscuring, derailing and generally trying to cast doubt upon the truth that you know you can not debunk because it is TRUE.

Take these scammers supporters sigs away and watch them squeal like the weasels they are.

So here we have it, there is no credible and valid objection from them to being called scammers or scammer supporters, it seems like just don't like being called filthy dirty skanky scammers or degenerate asskissing servile scummy scam supporters.

Tough shit scum bags.

I am not sure why it was locked. I mean the points there I think would have been conclusively debunked and it would have ended up valuable to the discerning reader that wanted to see how each of those points would have been tackled.

In general though I think points should be debunked in public rather than just locked, it does open the board to some criticism.

I mean that is a post that is crying out for a serious debunking and could have ended up a net positive read by the end.

Some people really may think there were valid points in the initial post letting them be dismantled and debunked is fine isn't it?

If some or all of those exact statements have been conclusively debunked already, a simple link posted in large text would have been enough.

People will generally though not know what has and has not been stated, proven or debunked in the entire history here so we can allow multiple instances if people still choose contribute to the debate unless it was super recent.

Locking should be ONLY done for super extreme instances of abuse of the forum else yes you do open yourselves to undeniable claims of crushing free speech and implementing bias.

Generally the mods do a very good job here and free speech is way better than most places on the net. But there is nothing wrong at all with calling out any instances where they are getting slack or bias is clearly evident. Don't let creep set in. If you are wrong when you point it out, then you'll soon get the memo.

Well, taking the full context of this thread, I think that there is far greater value to that post to the discerning reader. That may have not read ALL pages thus far. Many of what you may consider ad hominem attacks are not meeting the definition of ad hominem at all in our opinion in the context of this thread. (of course you could present an arguement we would openly consider and evaluate)

When one has clearly and undeniably been demonstrated to support scammers then calling them out as scammer supporters in a thread focusing on scammers and scammer supporters that are infesting DT then there is certainly value. The reader can always ask for clarification and validation.

However, ignoring that for the time being.

Are you seriously going to continue to selectively apply your counsel in our direction whilst saying nothing at all to the myriad of others that engage in far more clear cut adhominem attacks (that are also going to fall apart under even mild scrutiny not highly credible statements such as our own) that occur instantly on our threads that seek to derail and destroy any real chance of a debate on the central and core points being raised?

I would only ask that you appear early on in our threads and give the same counsel to ANY member that starts with ad hominem attacks or going off topic and relevant at all.

If you refuse to do so then we ask respectfully that you refrain from selectively injecting your criticism in our specific direction.

In the notes we have it says to treat you with respect and it goes on to say that your posts should be carefully appraised before tackling your central points fairly and clearly with no form of undo aggression and certainly no ad hominem attacks regardless of whom or what you are giving support to at that current moment.

I mean if you are to objectively remove all valueless content and that of negative value then meta would likely be a very sparse place.

I think you will find that if you are really taking ad hominem then we are far less guilty than most ( that do not receive your counsel)

A discerning reader will almost always cut away ad hominem anyway , however unless they are privy to the truth and history in all cases it is impossible to cut away trolling and scammer supporting.

You missed out (or more likely can't comprehend numbers above 4)

5. Turd world desperate scum bags that will support scammers and feltch anyone in public who will drop them a merit or 2.

6. Morons that promote and work for exit scamming exchanges.

7. Divs that have achieved NOTHING of note that try to lecture those that have accomplished a great deal.

you would quality for 3-7 of course.



Can you please keep on topic and relevant, or even failing that keep to making claims that stand up to mild scrutiny.

Now please can you and xtraelv continue your brilliant guide to ensuring peoples exchange accounts are never compromised ... were these the same tips that cryptopia were following by any chance??

Imagine following anything this couple of observably low functioning plebs say haha...



@actymyname..

Please see our response to a similar point that you have made on our other thread.

Are you concerned actmyname?

I mean specifically with independently verifiable instances of auction scamming being cast off as trolling when presented?

Just to be clear on your own position ?

Lot of fortune jack alts and pals all joined around the same time didn't they.

Things that may seem incoherent to idiots and non achieving scammer supporters or worse like yourselves are perfectly comprehensible to those that are way smarter. Just so you know. Although even that concept may be out of your league.

What a filthy gambling sig spamming scammer supporting fucking loser we have here.  Can you imagine being so low and worthless on the scammer league table you are a public tman ass feltcher and scammer defender... hahaha

Well, what a lovely weekend we've had.

Anyway, I have to say this is all very disappointing. I had expected better even from this bunch of low functioning fools.

The reader should note that xtraelv seems to have been adding some edits now LOL kind of diminishing and debunking his original weak and meaningless point.

Let's start with xtraelv (who else haha)

So let's start with his latest bungle.

Claiming that Tman is an auction scammer = TROLLING according to xtraelv the scammer supporter.

Let's analyze his claim.

Trolling = the deliberate proliferation of conclusively debunked information as being true, aka claiming things are true  that are proven to be false or claiming things are false that are proven to be true.

Scammer = using deception or lies for financial gain.

Hmmm so he must be claiming Tman is undeniably proven to NOT have been attempting to deceive people for financial gain??

This is quite hilarious because although anyone can say " tman was not being deceptive for financial gain"  I mean you can say ANYTHING you want.  We have given them multiple challenges to provide an ALTERNATIVE of tmans actions by becoming tman and describing in DETAIL how he was not attempting to be deceptive for financial gain.

EACH TIME THEY HAVE RUN AWAY FROM DOING SO.

So therefore not only have they NOT proven that the tman is an auction scammer is CONCLUSIVELY and undeniably debunked and untrue (required for it to be trolling) they have not even managed to provide ONE alternative to our claim that would stand up to scrutiny. I mean they have not even DARED to present one alternative because they know we will rip it to pieces.

SO now what does this mean??

It clearly means that they are TROLLING TROLLING and attempting to cast the undeniable and independently verifiable observable instances of tmans auction scamming  as TROLLING

Thank you xtraelv for clearly demonstrating a NEED to punish those attempting to support scammers and endanger honest members of this forum.

Now present your ALTERNATIVE explanation for tmans actions OTHER THAN CLEAR DECEPTION FOR FINANCIAL GAIN or accept I will use this as a KEY example of trolling trolling and present this precise example to theymos in public and ask for comment on this kind of disgusting and untrustworthy scammer supporting here.

So again... You are tman , you have asked your pal to auction this coin for you ( for some reason) and you come to the auction ....how does it go down that is NOT deception for financial gain.

Hurry up you dumb shits. It is boring to crush your scammer supporting little minds in public repeatedly.#


@ the other turd word scanks that are blurting out garbled nonsense like lafu ( the promoter and employee of exit scamming exchanges) and  legendster https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5176043.0 , please bring some substance with your massacre of the English language.  Thenoobnobody2143123 is an alt of one of the other fortunejack shit pumpers like lauda, tman, or one of those dregs.

HMM you may be on to something. I think OG nasty was trying to reveal JUST THAT kind of thing to people before tman started threatening him and telling him to STFU. Well done xtraelv.... you don't give these scammers  an inch do you, although that is not as important as you may think really.

So you are now claiming tman was lying about the record low price? or it was a record low price when he said it? or was it?I mean we were just quoting what he said himself... Of course we did not look at it because it does not matter.. Although if you have caught him lying also that is a good effort.

However, the latest of your funny excuses means nothing (well only to a useful idiot such as yourself). Unless you are trying to dispute people (even honest ones not auction scammers like tman) certainly like to get more rather than less for their items they are auctioning.

This is further supported by him telling OG to shut up and GTFO when OG gave a his fair appraisal that the coin was already perhaps over priced.  Please stop humiliating yourself over and over. It is giving the game away.

The undeniable evidence is there. Only a moron and scammer protector such as yourself would leap from one failed excuse to the next. The reader should start reading here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5170789.msg52994658#msg52994658 or back track a few pages for the XLdiv collection of moronic excuses and desperate scammer protecting. Even when challenged multiple times TMAN would not deny it was scamming. However now he has agent fox poop he is starting to form some funny story we will milk for all it is worth at a later stage.


I mean it is very simple XLDIV all you have to do is.... walk us through it step by step as if you were tman ...don't let tman down here.

Please stop refusing to describe in detail how you (taking the place of tman in his auction scam) were reasoning when you came to the auction of your own coin ( that you got your pal to auction for some reason)  when you spot it is at an apparently "RECORD LOW PRICE" and then what you did next ...

Why are you refusing?? we want the funny story of how it is not a deception for financial gain. Hurry up and stop refusing to provide some agent fox poop classic entertainment.

Looks just like you are very scared to present the " then tman..." version of events because it will be just too ludicrous even for a agent foxpoop explanation...haha no no that is not even possible after that phone thing.

Come on foxy... so you are tman, you're there at your coins auction you have asked your pal to auction for you and the price looks a bit on the low side " record low"........take us through it step by step...

You never shy from a funny story usually.... come on let us have it, spray us all down baby....hahah


Tourettes poet still here hey....haha applying merits to fox poops running away...

Our loyal fans and supporters always ready to ensure our threads get lots of nice attention haha nom nom nom

What you mention is just another instance of campaign managers being garbage for the most part.

They are too lazy (or corrupt) to do their own investigations or research. You may as well have bots running them ( that would be fairer)

1. they just simply defer responsibility for selection/rejection to the gamed and abused metrics of merit / trust
2. they refuse to produce any transparent clear rules that they enforce equally to all members leaving them wide open to corruption.

They should be able to produce a reasonable and rational reason for refusing people or accepting them that stands up to scrutiny... not just oh well they earned x merits or have x trust.  Those scores when investigated are VERY MISLEADING resulting in a lot of untrustworthy and low quality shit posters getting the best sig spots.

3. Of course as you say, their lazy or corrupt ways often leads to them making ZERO effort to ensure that the people are posting in the correct places or that their posts are not just trolling, net negative shit posts made by undeniable scammers.

Campaign manager should be placed under a lot more scrutiny.

You seem to be refusing to give your reasoning on how it went down that demonstrates no deception therefore not scamming.

Please present your reasoning, failure to do so means you refuse to drill down and explain your reasoning clearly. Hence you seem to be foxpooping again.

So again, you are Tman coming to your own coins auction (that he has got his pals to auction for him for some reason) and spot the coin is at apparently at a " record low price"...

Now you're off foxpoop.... you are going to present the reasoning that clearly demonstrates there was deception for financial gain.

Please stop refusing to explain your reasoning it sounds like you are afraid to drill down on this ...

We were expecting a funny story you can not disappoint us like this.

Don't leave it to Tman to defend himself the poor scamming wretch. Don't do him like that agent F.

I mean leaving with another " my opinions are not based on reasoning"  uppercut  in TMANs dumb scamming  face is very cruel after the build up.

Please just present you story of what happened in full so we can stop beating around the bush. Just come out with the full explanation of how it went down in your opinion. You always have the " my opinions are not based upon reasoning" to fall back on. So nothing to worry about.

So again

You are tman, you come to your coins auctions auction thread ( that you have asked your pal to auction for you for some reason) and boom you are off agent foxpoop .. explain how it went down that is not a simple case of a under cover deception and manipulation to talk the price up whilst also threatening and telling people to fuck off who voice their honest appraisal of that market.

The entire story please... off you go.

@tman...is that you again? haha what about finding you on one of our threads you ignore. Please save your hilarious explanation until foxpoop has finished. We will have our fun with you later tourettes poet. Please do yourself a favor though do not try to copy the good agents version of events that would be a terrible move...haha


anyway foxpoop is tman now turning up to his own coins auction that he has got his pal to auction for him (for some reason)... here we go... foxpoop you are up take it from here ..

So you notice the price of your own coin (in an undercover auction by your pal miner jones) is a bit low for your liking...." a record low" in fact... what do you do next??

Haha please drill down.

So you think Tman really would have bought the coin FROM HIMSELF because it would be such a GREAT DEAL FOR HIM at that low of a price. The only small matter was tman already had to many so he would NOT buy it from himself at that record low price and had to miss out on that brilliant deal...haha

Explain please your reasoning on this.

Can you tell me MORE about the requirements to be DECEPTIVE?  

So tell it like you are tman coming to HIS OWN COINS auction that he has asked his friend to auction for him (for some reason).

So you are TMAN and you come to the under cover tman auction thread.... start there so I can get the full agent foxpoop story line.

Just so we are clear... agent F. You accept deception for financial gain = scamming you just don't believe tman was trying to deceive people? is that where we are???  

@tman

If your ears are burning and you can't keep away from our threads and you want to keep pretending that we are on ignore (although you are compelled to come to our threads) and you want to play the guessing game. Then just guess " scammer" and you will win everytime.

The prize is you look like a terrified little scamming bitch trying to derail.


@xtraDIV

you see there a net positive and sensible correct indication that you xtraelv are an imbecile and useful idiot. Net positive nod to the reader to treat all that you splurge out here as if it is moronic spew.

Now to address your point and use it to prove OUR OWN POINT (thanks again our fav fool)

We have challenged ANY and ALL that voted to present the central points of ours concering their scamming, scammer supporting or the flaws in the systems of control that they can conclusively debunk as INCORRECT.

They have failed to do so. Therefore their voting as "troll" someone they can not bring even ONE central point they have debunked does indeed confirm the need to punish those trying to mislead the honest members here whilst placing them in danger with their scamming pals that they support.

Take your time to digest before assisting again.

@agent foxpoop

So to be clear you have read the entire auction debacle where tman is UNDENIABLY trying to deceive others for financial gain and claim you see no attempt at deception there??

Can you explain this comment.. knowing and accepting ( as it is undeniable)  that this is tmans coins he is auctioning via his friend minerjones

"TMAN used minerjones to anonymously auction a KIALARA and then attempted to manipulate the auction by stating, "wow this has to be a record low for a sub #100 serial. if I didn't have so many I would be snapping this up"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1931778.msg19286369#msg19286369

Just for fun foxpoop, let me here your explanation of how making that statement ( and the other statements to OG to shut up when he gave his fair appraisal of the market for these items)is not deception for clear financial gain.

Is this going to be another agent foxpoop classic. Is this " trolling" opinion also NOT BASED on reasoning??

Can't wait to hear how he would buy his own coin from himself if he did not have so many...well snapping it up since it is a record low hahha hahahah

Go on hit us with the explanation for this one.... can hardly wait....haha

What is more fun, rubbing scammers faces in their own scamming dirt over and over with the help of their scammer supporting pals

or

Watching the scammer supporters make up more and more ludicrous excuses and explanations whilst helping drag their scamming pals through their own scamming dirt over and over.

haha got to be option 2 ... especially when xldiv and agent foxpoop are around lol

via Imgflip Meme Generator

Since anything AFTER the sale would be impossible to prove. Pass changes, btc addresses , posts saying " didn't sell it really" etc etc .... the only sure thing you have is the account sales pitch.

If we are tagging account sellers. The sales pitch would be the most important piece of evidence there is. 
When you also realize nutildah was screaming account sales = scam facilitating before deciding  to sell their own this is an especially damning insight into their character. Certainly looks to be a case for flagging and tagging more than any other account seller who may not be sure they are facilitating scams.

It seems you have dug too deeply timelord, you will now start to see the scammers and abusers/gamers of these current systems of control will come after you. Lauda first then if you keep digging more red and flags will follow. Consider carefully because theymos is not going to come to your aid for uncovering their scamming/gaming/abusing and getting punished by them using his systems of control.

I say keep digging, but of course it is up to you.

The armed criminals in raccoon suits with swag bags caught outside the bank, all claiming it was a security test to protect other investors money....haha

Then all blaming it on each other, when the game is up.

Shut up scum bag. I see you are backing up laudas trust abuse too you're all part of the same dirty little scumbag club with tman and these other fortune jack dirt bags.

Glad lauda pulled it all off then got you all embroiled into it too. That will be a lesson to stay away from scammers like him in future.

Let's hope (if that is true) that you learned your lesson. Same for everyone else distance yourself from scammers or you are going down with them. Once the ship starts sinking the rats will all try to jump to another. NOT GOING TO HAPPEN unless you jump soon.

Only so many excuses and supporting of scammers can be plausibly written off as " we didn't know".

The fortunejack gang are obviously a unit but the rest of their useful idiots could still make it out. Get on with it.

@twitchy which part of theymos requested lauda removed and requesting to know which members did NOT take note of that were you objecting to exactly?  still not sure we get what you are trying to say here?

That list is good, but which of those got the PM but obviously didn't "get" the memo?

Pharmacist for 1  ... I'm guessing qrk 2,  I mean in a pile of nobodies and non achieving dregs how would one start to guess which of those were given consideration.

Surprisingly except the obvious lauda ass feltchers and dregs like the pharmacist ( who already said he does not know if lauda done a shady escrow or not but would support him ANYWAY out of loyalty ) not that many meta scumbags are including the CONniving cat these days.

Let's get him off dt and then his "loyal" supporters. Time to put out the trash.

thankfully xtraelv has turned up to assist us

Clearly providing examples of how assisting people to find the truth is completely different to deliberately trying to mislead people and protect scammers.

So his examples like


smarmacist a sneaky snake like fool who lectures others on shitposting whilst sneakily and greedily using a sockpuppet to plaster his racist garbage everywhere for extra btc dust.

This is helping people to see the truth and therefore net positive

vs

screaming trolling at undeniable and independently verifiable observable instances of scamming is deceiving people and trying to hide the truth and is net negative.

Hiding the truth and presenting the truth are very different. Well done xtraelv. Thanks for assisting us.

@ foxy

Of course we would love to. The nutildah excuse we will pull apart next but let us stick with TMAN first.

I mean it is in the initial post of the dirty turds poll

Seems Tman also is not above a bit of scamming directly when it suits him (we quote OG below who discovered this)

"TMAN used minerjones to anonymously auction a KIALARA and then attempted to manipulate the auction by stating, "wow this has to be a record low for a sub #100 serial. if I didn't have so many I would be snapping this up"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1931778.msg19286369#msg19286369

Admission it was his auction:
"Dude I haven't crossed paths with OG in over 6 months, it wasn't until he derailed my auction hosted by MJ that this kicked off."
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1946142.msg19349060#msg19349060 "

That does not even mention the observable instances of trying to threaten and silence people giving their honest appraisal during the auction of his own coin.


Tman is an auction scammer.  TROLLING Or TRUE.

If trolling then detail here how deliberate deception for direct financial gain is not scamming?

We see lots of screaming that is trolling. We can certainly go to nutildah next but one scamming piece of shit at a time. We have plenty of time.

Apologies tman for dredging up the fact you are an undeniable scammer over again, but your pals insist it becomes personal.

Nutildah it seems you are next willful and deliberate scam facilitator for pay. Or is that trolling?? we shall find out now that agent foxpoop is on the case.


@xtraelv (read above also) but please no more help from you until agent foxpoop is done ...unfair of us to gang up on him. Just wait until he is finished then you can assist further.

Haha can you get any dumber?? that is the challenge I have been setting all along. Just present the central points of ours regarding you and your scamming pals or the systems of control that you can conclusively debunk and BOOM if we continue to proliferate those same central points as being true you have some TROLLING to report.

Get on with it scabby little exit scamming exchange pusher.

Make your good start.

No point BEGGING us to stop presenting observable instances of scamming AKA "stop crying and complaing about always the same thing ."

Beg more scumbag.

Now back on topic please. FALSE accusations of trolling should be punished. If you scream trolling then clearly point out the central points that you have conclusively debunked and inform the person they should not repeat that information as true.

If you scream trolling at undeniable and independently verifiable observable instances of scamming. You should be punished and given red trust for trying to cover up undeniable scamming. You are placing in danger other honest members here.

Is that what you are trying to do lafu??

Got to love the defense here by these scumbags claiming. " we should be able to claim undeniable observable instances of scamming  are trolling, hereby claiming they are untrue" therefore deceiving other members and covering up these scams... and there should be no punishment for doing so??  Oh really??

Look how

1. they fail to present EVEN one central point regarding their scamming, or scammer supporting or even the short falls of the systems of control  NOT ONE have they debunked conclusively or even made a credible attempt to debunk (because it is impossible)

2. trying to derail and detract with any tactics they can

3. when I pull them to specifics they run away.

scum bags. Get their sigs taken away at a minimum. Let's see what kind of REAL enthusiasts they are here. Surely they will continue to contribute without sigs for just a few months right?? 

More words with zero substance behind them. Mr ar15 tough guy haha

I think it's more of a sustained and continuous attack on undeniable scammers and their supporters. One of which is your very low functioning self.  

The only thing clear here is that you are too much of a pussy to come and debate with us, so have to pretend we are on ignore.

Come. why don't you take your turn at  being humiliated in public whilst trying to debate with us the observable instances listed in the initial post?  Perhaps you will provide more entertainment by explaining how deliberate deception for direct financial gain is not scamming and should not be punished but rather rewarded with default trust positions?

Oh wait you won't. You can see (just from reading the replies) the most silly excuses have been presented and ripped to pieces.

Come here jared and let's get down to specifics. You scammer supporting dreg.

Ready to entertain us further Jesterkaragon?? yes or no.??