I may underestimate things -I doubt it but it is possible- but not Blackcoin's glorious logo. I have stated it many, many times and will state it many more still. And yes, I believe it is THAT important and in a very big way responsible of the initial success of the coin. You will not find a more deeply enthusiast of it than me (and, like I said before, I extend that to the wallet's splash, which is simply amazing).

I also agree with "market positioning" being of enormous importance. But, unfortunately, we are still light years away from widespread (mainstream) adoption so, for now, it all comes down to market valuation. And on that, no one can battle the bloodsuckers when they are firmly installed inside like La Mano Nera is. Nothing hypotetical, by the way: Bragged about, in fact, publicly, by Morituri13... yep, the guy properly dressed and slightly embarrassed next to the beach clad town's fool at the pR offices. Contracts drawn -nothing very formal- but papers signed.

By all means keeps promoting it or doing whatever you deem's best for your interests.

You have your vision, I have mine. Too many (great) coins already out and many more to come -including possibly from IE- that will not necessarily have the same "problem". Mind you, I am for the dev team to be handsomely compensate if the manage to bring up a successful coin. That's would be one thing. Quite another is stealing.

The Black Hand will never lose, never. That's part of the deal, to eliminate risks to the max. Before losing, they will have exited and move on to "greener pastures", but as long as there's blood to be sucked here, they'll be around.

Which, obviously, is not going to be for too long.

You stupidity is of another level altogether. Fully knowing I have been the most ferocious critic, by far, of IE. But you are what you are and that's that.

As for the dumping of (much more) than 15 million BC, it has occurred since day one. All along. The most that was being dumped, actually occurred on the rise to 95k, and obviously at the top of those 95k. But it has continued since the get go. And yes there has been plenty mode than the average price of that dump which is around 30-40k. But you wouldn't want to see that even if it was shown to you by the people doing the dumping, tthat's how idiotic you are, so no more waste.

Relatively off-topic

I have been researching NEXTcoin. While I have found their "distribution problem" an unacceptable -for me- inconvenient (I bluntly call it scam, but it is a different scam, very different, from the clumsy manipulators of BC). Over there, just a few people -not necessarily scammers- own 90% of the coins and therefore reap almost 99% of the proof of Stake benefits. It is, I repeat, a problem serious enough for me to bail out.

That said, their platform is, by far, the best I have found so far in cryptoland, in terms of innovation and possibilities. The potential is simply mindboggling. I'd advise IE to check it out because it is simply impressive and his new coin could be launched on top of that platform, quite easily.

Quite frankly, compared to BC, it is like a Lamborghini compared to a burro in terms of vision, technology and possibilities.

For the rest, once again, I am not advocating investing in NEXT. As a matter of fact, I bailed with a bit of a profit when I discovered the "distribution problem" and it's potential for disaster. But check the complex platform, their Exchange -unlimited possibilities there, again- and the potentiality of building any number of applications, including new coins, on top of their architecture.

Those are my estimations of what The Doge, StGNU and Rat4 still have after they have dumped more than 15 million. I may be off by quite a few million on the upside, mind you.

I understand your position and, questionable as it may have been, the "distribution", so to speak would have been "common behavior". Very questionable but standard in the industry, so to speak?

The problem here are the business on the side  --i.e: the multipool than, as you know, is a personal, independent business, for the ONLY purpose of profit -of course- of TheDOGE and StGNU. That being the case, the business of BC should be up for grabs, not given by decree to this guys, without any warranties and collecting a % which is above the goiing rates in the industry, let alone taking into consideration the "exclusivity".

If that wasn't enough, here comes the BIG problem: La Mano Nera, The Black Hand. Mind you, contracts drawn and papers signed by Morituri13's own recognaisance, public one. The manipulate from the inside. They donate to the Multipool -and the Foundation- and they have so much access to inside info that, actually, they are the ones that approve or disapprove whatever is to be done in BC. Get it now? They don't just own and control tens of millions of coins, they have this as a going business. When the two Joe Sixpacks and Rat4 finish their dumping, the Black Hand will still be buying and selling at points of their choosing and with 100% manipulation, not just of the price through their usual P&Ds but through ALL THE OTHER ACTIVITIES of the coin and it's foundation. Corrupt to the core, alright? No way for the investors, traders or enthusiasts to win. The Black Hand will win. Always And kill the coin, while doing so.

To be perfectly clear, if they would sell -the devs- all their coins and leave, BC had a chance. As it is, none whatsoever.

You are very welcome.

Now, you can try to fool yourself as much as you want and, by all means, do with your investment whatever you deem is more convenient for you and your purposes, but the fortunate fact that you bought cheap in no way lessens the blow you are suffering -along with the rest of holders of the coin. If anything it makes it even more painful. Because you could -and should- have cashed in long before this descend into hell. And since you didn't, that is very, very real money you have lost.

even though you recovered your costs, it isn't, wasn't and never will be "the house's money". That diminishing amount in value? all yours and only yours.

Calling Ximp, calling Ximp...

I know IE censors you because he doesn't want or can't accept your challenge, but maybe if you address the following instead, he won't have any problems with it.

First of all, kudos and chapeau to you for that gloriously beautiful logo. I'm going to assume that the even more beautiful splash on the wallet is also your doing. Amazing work man, way more deserving than the cancerous coin it represents.

No the questions... how many BC wallets do you have? Don't tell me, please, that you have only one with a current balance of 269 BC... Tell me, for instance, that you have that only for donations, but the you hold, at the very least, half a million coins or more. Please, please pretty please with a cherry on top, don't disappoint me.

Final question: Are you in The Black Hand? (you know, the "group of investors"...)

Thanks in advance for your answers.

Well, IE just offered it, so lets...

It comes with conditions, of course.

No crooks -nor incompetents- on board.

It should be easy enough...

Well, not exactly. The "whales" if you want to call them that, are not "whales", are The Black Hand. Do you understand what is "being in cahoots"? Since apparently you do not, it means they act in agreement (formal, in this case, with papers signed) with the developers of the coin... in this case Rat4, StGNU and The DOGE, and they pay some crums to the towns idiot, Soepkip. It is Insider trading and manipulation, playing with marked cards, ok?
Of course other coins are manipulated by whales, of course. And it is legitimate market activity. Because they are no acting on inside information nor orchestrated, from the inside, moves to manipulate the price.

Contrary to what you think, the DOGE and his group -not necessarily The Black Hand, I have no evidence of that, so probably just the DOGE, StGNU and Rat4-, mined more than 35 million coins during the first few days. Distributed in several wallets. We know many of those wallets are at zero already. And, by my estimation, there are still over 10 million coins, perhaps more, to be dumped just by these three. Now The Black Hand came upon the coin later. I don't know how many coins they have but I assure you it is in the millions and they are increased in anticipated upside moves -not all working, obviously-. But there's no way to know the exact specifics. What's evident is that the group have an "investment" big enough to justify sending pointman Moriturui13 to Miami to try to contain the stupidity innate to the towns' fool.

And that, regardless of what you may choose to think, not only is not acceptable, it is the cancer of the coin, the beginning of the end.

Oh Rat4, like I have stated, is just another crook who codes who happens to be quite an stupid individual to boot. He's not "developing" anything. He never did. He just hard-forked Peercoin, that's all. There are no innovations of any kind in BC. None. There are several coins that are faster. There are several coins that are more innovative (not a stretch for this is not at all) and there are coins that are greener -if you insist on a name, I'll direct you to another con but very interesting coin, NXT, much greener, much more innovative, much faster...

The video, funny as it is, is not Soepkip, it is a mocking of his "brilliant" activities in Miami, by the way. But I understand your confusion.

Amazingly, no one seems to even care about the question posed 2 days ago already:

Moritury13/dognip, what where you doing attending the meeting with the PR firm in Miami?

You yourself admitted to be Black Hand (the "investment" group that is in cahoots with the Blackcoin development team -The Doge, DSt.GNU and rat4-, manipulating the coin and dumping TENS OF MILLIONS of coins and thus hurting individual investors, traders and BC enthusiasts).

Once again, censoring is not the way to go. Nothing gives anyone more credibility than publicly recognizing mistakes. Nothing.

Censoring challenges is absurd because they surface in other venues so the damage is compounded.

More importantly, stupidity is fully exposed and remains so permanently... kind of like the pants of Soepkip and his stoned look.

But hey, it's your backyard...

Ximp will come back. Wouldn't you in his place?

Again, too stupid... amazingly.

No, it doesn't really matter what any person will do or say. If the majority agreed -which is NOT happening, there are no charitable individuals in crypto, didn't you know that?- he could do it with no trouble at all. He could refund personally the very few that would disagree -faced with the fact-, or ignore them altogether while they would be exposed in the forum. No legal action would come because none corresponds at all and courts don't entertain idiocies, as a norm.

As for the tax, he can just claim what he gives and end of the "problem" -problem only in your troubled empty head, nowhere else-.

You are obviously a fan boy so I will not go one by one...

This coin has NOTHING and is NOTHING other than a gloriously beautiful logo and a community of supporters. In all the other aspects, this is just a hard fork or PeerCoin with a bunch of crooks manipulating every single aspect of it and DUMPING tens of millions of coins at the expense of unsuspecting investors, traders and all around choir-boys.

There's nothing "faster" (other coins are much faster), there's nothing "green" (other coins are much greener) and there's nothing innovative or original about this coin (except for that gloriously beautiful logo). The bunch of manipulating crooks? unfortunately, not even that is original or unique.

IE would be crazy to go on with the WS Event. And crazy egomaniac as I think he is, I believe he's way smarter than to throw himself into such running train. It simply won't happen. This coin will be left to day on it's own (lack of) momentum, because there's nothing, not a single idea, behind this coin, other than the ones -crazy and clever, both- that IE brought. None. Oh they have wasted 1/3 of the $32,550 on the absurd PR firm. And they'll probably spend at least another 1/3 -the third and last one, that's up in the air), but no buying of ideas will save this coin.

Do you know the current project? Oh it has such amazing ramifications, it will probably bring the price back up to 50K sat... the Android wallet. I mean , you can't possibly top that, can you? Perhaps a price-ticker for IPhone? How about a rehash of The Doge of Wall Street called, you guessed it, the BlackCoin of Wall Street?

Ah the genial ideas are so many that you can hardly keep them in check. This coin is indeed going to be unstoppable...

He has not misappropriate one red cent. And you know it even in your inferior waste of skull space. You are just an abject liar. In any world or realm.

As a matter of fact he has offered the only generous option, truly generous option -but not the only one- anyone has EVER offered here, actually giving money away from his own pocket. To charity, none less. What a concept ah?

But you are an idiot and no sane person would pay attention to an idiot... as reality has proven it once again.

Converting to fiat the donations was, and remains, the wisest move logistics notwithstanding. As a matter of fact, those donations would buy today double -roughly- the amount of coins, so it was THAT brilliant to convert them.

But only a new level of idiocy would even pretend that the opposite was the right way to act.

Some levels of idiocy are quite difficult to even fathom.

First of all the coder of a coin is NOT (always) the developer. Rat4 does code. Nothing else. (Oh he does play with the ra-rah kids on IRC showing he is just another asshole who can code, but that's not what you are asking for).

There was a thread that you still can access that rat4 closed at the behest of the crooks who are running things in BC now. They are Eugene Rukhlin (the Doge of Wall Street) and Morituri13/dognip (they lead an "investors group" (The Black Hand) manipulating the price from the inside and dumping tens of millions of coins). And let me reiterate it clearly to you: THEY ARE CROOKS.

Then there's a bunch of choir-boys and interested guys that blatantly lie, either because they are just ra-rah guys or because they are paid to do so, for instance Soepkip, but you can add Mickey -Vizique-, Josh -the guy from Cambodia and yes, nice/boy Dutch Treat, Maarten.

Promotion of blackcoin should be the only goal if there wasn't a cancer in the coin. As it is, you would be promoting for them to take your cash. And that's why we are where we are.

Now you have the lowdown. in not too many words.

Don't waste your time, please. Everyone and his aunt knows very well you maybe a bunch of things but not a crook -at least not here-. You wasting of time with these losers makes you sound like Nixon, and you don't want to sound like Nixon.

Like I told you, you cant win this one because you can please most of the people most of the time but you can NEVER please all of the people all of the time.

Ignore the idiocies and go on ahead.

And, actually, if you want to do something great for BC -it will have to be thought by you, which in itself would be a waste of energy and talent, since who else is have ANY ideas around here?- here's my proposal: Give it to whatever Generous ColinFX deems is a good, worthy project. He will be so enthralled by his own project that he will not only match your WS money but any donations from the community to that effect. We are talking some serious shit here, so let your imagination and talent go Colin, you may well be the savior of BC... because, let me tell you right now, if you don't take me up on this and come up with something really spectacular, in a week not only all of "this" will have not been forgotten but much worse than "this" will be happening with the price leaving the teens --on the south side.

How about it? Less talk and more action, that's what the "community" really wants.

Hey, depending on your idea -let me assure you no matter how preposterous it cannot be worse than the non-ideas currently NOT happening-, I may even buy some BC...

Amazingly, I have to side with Colin on this one:

Iconic, it is very unfortunate and to some extent unfair but you put yourself in a no-win situation with the WS event. Not only you will have to take aggravation and countless hours of work returning the donations, you will STILL be vilified because you made yourself a millonaire in the exchange for fiat since the prices have dropped so much. Of course your profit would be a total of maybe $100 bucks, but for every asshole in this community -and the abound- you will have pocketed hundreds of thousands if not thousands of thousands. But there's no way around it. The Red Cross idea, very good but you have already seen the reflection: People here, in case you had any doubts, are in for the quick buck, charity be dammed. Colin himself, you know, he gave "generously" to the PR shit, do you think he cares even one little bit about how many children's lives would that money have saved? Not in the least... Anyway, that's the bulk of the community here -and I am willing to bet across the board in crypto-. Of course everyone has already a pre-furnished (Black?) shield of excuses on the matter, so don't bother and expect them to be volunteered -as they have already- in throes.

So, since you cannot win, that puts you, paradoxically, in a very convenient situation: Do with it whatever you want. Community decision? it will please the most vocal only, depending on results even the most vocal will turn it against you. And you will have hundreds shouting that they were in favor of the WS Event but NOT, specifically, in whatever other is decided. Hundreds. Remember, no possible win on this one.

And no, the "community" will not dump the crooks, not until everyone has lost most of their money and by then they would have already move on from here.
This is done. For good.

On another matter, obviously the guy is an idiot but to each his own, the logo is gloriously beautiful and kudos should be given to his creator, no matter how stupid, as an individual, he can be. I don't know if he copied it -everyone copies, by the way EVERYONE- of how he came up with the idea and the creation, but the thing is simply gorgeous and, by far, the best thing about this con-coin.

I will be quite interested in filtering your initiatives in a new coin. As long as there are no crooks in it, I will be there supporting.

Maarten, please stop lying or you will lose any shred of respect very, very soon.

Blackcoin is, and it has always been, totally controlled by Eugene, StgGNU and Morituri13 as the visible representation of the "investors group" (contracts drawn and papers signed) that is and has manipulated the coin from the start. That's the cancer of this coin. You know it and now everyone knows it. BC cannot be saved. It's tainted. It's done. Eugene will not leave, ever. Not even having taken all the money he already has. Not enough. Rat4 is and idiot and greedy like the other two (I don't care how good a coder he is, he's a crook and an idiot and fully into the scam and being handsomely paid for it).

Everyone in crypto now knows what's behind this coin, therefore no one will touch it with a 10 feet pole. And you (still very happy about your buy at just under 27?), with your lies -for you perfectly well know all of this- are simply contributing to the quick demise.

You still have not made a total ass of yourself publicly so, be careful with the lies and the faked attempts to "rally the troops", ok? The real community is diverse, not just ra-rah guys and total, embarrassing assholes like Ashdrake. The real community will judge you quite harshly if/when they see you are not on the up and up. You do know Josh is done, right? so is Morituri13, so is Mickey. And Eugene and StGNU -how are those miners coming along to V2?-... well, the gig's pretty much up... except that they were nothing, had nothing -quite literally- and BC, even at 5k satoshis, is good to dump the millions still to be dumped, so they'll hang in and they'll concentrate on a multipool -a normal, not a BC only as a hoped for business in the future.

The community is way wiser than you give it credit for. Many have already diversified; many have already left except for a few coins just _to see what happens- and many are on the verge of running for the exits as the price keeps on falling and the dumping continues (yes, the two Jose Sixpacks and Morituri and The Back Hand continue dumping-. One again, the gig's up. The accusations, the evidence of the manipulation, the attacks... all of that is coming as the price falls. You can choose, right now, to be a hero and save face for a long future ahead of you, or a villain that people will never forget in this or any other community.

You are not just maarx anymore, remember?

Still quite confused: Isn't the purpose of Facebook -and all media  outlets- to precisely be "unprotected"? I mean why would you put anything on Facebook if you don't want people to see it? If you want top say something to somebody and only to that somebody, you use a text message, right? Or, for more "protection" a phone call...

Of course FB isn't a wallet but if you put a text on a wallet, there's no "social" aspect to it, is there?

I guess what I mean is that if it is "social" cannot be "protected", by definition.