Apparently its just a failsafe response Polo have for if there's a glitch.

Mod says it'll be back up shortly.

Dude, will you please stop making these posts, you're just coming across as being desperate now.

Nobody is questioning Rivaa's situation. They are doing their FIAT-based UREA deals with Indian Potash as normal, that doesn't affect the URO situation one bit. It is about trying to get confirmation that GES has actually supplied or is supplying Rivaa with UREA for URO in payment.

That Rivaa has said they will pay for UREA with URO doesn't mean much either, who'd turn down the chance to say yes to buying a commodity at a fraction of the price?

It's all about whether ANY of the Uro Foundation NIERs has or can show that they will be delivering UREA to a customer who has paid in URO.



It also doesn't help when the URO Foundation facebook page does dumb things like referencing a Science20.com article that cites GES, when the truth is that they only mentions GES because they cut and paste a stock picture from the GES website. The article was nothing to do with GES.

That is why there needs to be independent references being made other than GES, because both GES and URO Foundation have far too many questionable aspects to them.

So I raise concerns about how there has been no mention of URO outside of GES and you link me to a GES web announcement which, let's be honest, only actually shows a document relating to a contract in January between IPL and Rivaa which, while it might confirm Rivaa's, FIAT, role in a trade with IPL, doesn't serve to prove anything more than that.

Again, where is there a mention of URO outside of GES, other than crypto news? UREA trade journals would be all over this.

You see, your posts are starting to really unsettle me, you appear to have simply moved into the "just buy coins now before it's too late", mode of response without actually being willing to have a discussion related to some pretty important facets of what was asserted clashing with what is now being asserted.

Nobody other than GES has released information about URO. There have not been any other mentions of it in trade journals or news outside of the crypto world.

So all the reports we are getting that are claiming to be confirmation are, in fact, simply GES web-based announcements.

Indian Potash did a deal with Rivaa for FIAT and, while Rivaa have apparently been willing to send an email to say that they will do a trade in URO, this would actually be them buying UREA with URO, meaning they get to agree to receive tons of UREA at a fraction of the equivalent FIAT price at this time, so there's little reason to question why they'd agree to it.

Either way, there would be an immense amount of interest at trade-level for what is happening, yet there are not independent mentions of it anywhere.

Don't talk to me like I am an idiot, I'm being more than reasonable with you.

But seeing as you want to play that card, sure, this is what Bohan actually said about the Hong Kong company

All I am wanting to establish is why Bohan criticised those who questioned the legitimacy of the Australian office by telling them they should have been checking Hong Kong when, three days ago he writes that the HK office is nothing to do with it either.

I gotta say, that's a pretty meaningless response to my valid concerns. This isn't about faith, it is about objective proof of what is actually taking place.

I'm willing to be open-minded about this project but there are aspects to it that run contrary to the claims being made. It is unreasonable for you to just demand that people simply 'believe'.

Green Earth Systems are directly part of this coin's launch yet Bohan says he is leaving them because they are pissed at him for spending too much time on this project? Surely they should be applauding him for the work being put in considering the amount of money at stake here?

It doesn't make sense, also, that he first said that GES Australia were not the office to be examining as the critics should be looking at the Hong Kong office, yet the pastebin IRC chat I have has him saying that GES Hong Kong is nothing to do with it either.

Except is hasn't been confirmed by anyone other than GES and the contract documents so far relate to Rivaa's FIAT deal with IPL.


Not outside the crypto industry, which is surprising, I would have thought this would be reported by now in the associated industry journals.

Erm, I'm not sure if I should post the link here. I'm genuinely torn over whether a bit of sloppy work with paste-bin being used to save a private conversation should result in complete public exposure.

Suffice to say that, at this point, I know that Bohan is stepping down from GES because he says the accounts department, apparently, are pissed at him for not doing any other work for GES while he's been working on URO. You can ask him if you like, he'd be a fool to deny it because he'd have to know that I have come across the paste-bin IRC transcript.

But that seems kinda weird for GES 'accounts department' (where are they located BTW?) to be complaining to him about a project that, if it became successful, would net the company a fortune from being primary adopters.

No, the information I came across has him intending to leave Green Earth Systems.

As they are part and parcel of the roll-out of this project, it could look to some like he's getting ready to bail.

Well that's not really true, though, is it? Evidence of coins being put into batches is not evidence of legitimacy and not having dumped at .05 isn't either. I don't think the .05 market price would have been able to provide much of a cash-out as the time period was so small for the initial spike.

What is needed is independent clarification from boots-on-the-ground (journalist) in India who can confirm these things.

By the way, if Bohan is the man behind this project, why would he be stepping down, that doesn't make sense to me, especially at such a critical time.

Let me clarify, I mean him leaving GES.

Then, by that measure, 'everyone' is a misinformed idiot. The Bitcoin blockchain has been rolled back in its early history, too, but people didn't start screaming about teh injustice of it all and that it couldn't be trusted and, as has been pointed out numerous times, VRC is still a decentralised currency, if the majority of wallet holders didn't agree to the rollback then Pat and Mintpal would have found themselves sitting alone on their own little fork.

How does this issue relate to a PoS weakness?

BTW, VRC has value-added services which, at this time, are centralised, it doesn't mean to say that people don't value them or find them extremely useful. This rabid hysteria against VeriBit or VeriSend is absurd considering the naysayers are more than happy to use centralised point-of-sale webs services for transactions involving bitcoin.

Right well I'm going to reserve judgement either way at this point. I don't think that evidence of crappy websites and business changes is evidence of scam, but there is not quite enough proof of the big UREA trades actually occurring through URO payments either.

The URO foundation might be on to something staggeringly innovative, but most people here have been burnt plenty of times by outlandish business propositions, so while I am more open to the idea that things are done differently for Indian UREA trades, it'll probably take some sort of confirmation from an independent industry source outside of GES.

I'm sure they could get an Indian journalist or industry association rep from the region to verify with the companies who are actually moving the physical goods around whether it is legit or not.

Still, if it turns out to be a poorly executed, but genuine trade concept, I think there is plenty more room for others to consider attempting same but with a better approach that could establish market confidence a lot earlier.

I certainly had lots of concerns about the various business setups behind the scenes but there is still the fact that people change and adapt their businesses, move on to new ones, invest in different sectors and leave behind a web presence that doesn't match our first-world expectations. But this isn't evidence of scam in itself, just a changing business environment that took place over many years.

Instead of focusing on the past business activities of those involves, we should be looking to establish a way to find evidence of the trading environment that is being created now.

I asked earlier, has anyone been in touch with Nilesh Nair himself, as he's likely to be more able to provide reasonable explanations as to how this new trading environment has been setup.

Well this is the remarkable nature of employing crypto for commodities. As long as you can have a group of traders who are willing to commit to buying and selling physical product at 1URO per metric tonne of UREA, the price of UREA in FIAT only matters when they need to cash out some URO for funds. If they can convince the market that the deals are bone fide, the value of the coin should reach FIAT equivalent fairly quickly, thereby ensuring that their business ends up receiving the right price for the deals done now because they will still hold the coin to that value.

Sure, if this whole project fails then there is a risk that traders will lose out, the sellers anyway. It's commodities trading for future returns, not using the coin as a currency for cashing out today. Deals of this size regularly run into the millions and take months and months for commercial banking processes to complete, so they do have some leeway regarding time.

It will require the, rather infantile, crypto market traders of today to change how they perceive what commodities trading actually means and how it works. Long term its a solid process that would benefit multiple stakeholders.

But there is a short term risk that they obviously want to mitigate by way of getting the market to accept that these deals are being done at the quoted rates today so that the price floor rapidly grows to equal that of the FIAT trading levels.

I understand what you're saying but when you have a guy in India who has a job working with UREA traders in the region, and who has been shown as having done this job from well before URO ever appeared on the scene, there's little reason to believe he would tolerate calls from abroad from people asking him detailed questions about how this new method of trading works if it wasn't real. As I said, he didn't know anything about cryptocurrency, but was well informed as to how the use of URO as payment for this commodity was going to work for this group of traders who have signed up to it.

It's not like they are claiming all UREA trades in India are being done this way, just initially those between the signing parties to the protocol and, once the market allows the coin price to equal FIAT market price, the first trades will not have lost on the deals already processed because they will still hold the coins they accepted for the tonnage traded at the time.

It does take some getting used to understanding that URO is not meant to be a currency but, rather, a commodity. It is really quite impressive as a concept.

Well you should give Mr Singh a call, he's been working for GES for a few years and came across as being a reasonable guy to talk to about this. His role has been negotiating these UREA deals and, while he's probably not entirely up to speed on cryptocurrencies, seemed to know enough about the role that URO was playing in the arrangement regarding the URO Foundation members and UREA traders he works with.

Because GES is not a 'big company' in the classic sense, it is primarily some well connected people, such as Nilesh Nair, who can shake hands and do the deals to get a bunch of traders and suppliers in India to agree to commit to using URO as a payment method for the next ten years. It is experimental but, as I said, the risk is actually a lot smaller once the market accepts that there is a proven agreement whereby 1URO will equate to 1 metric tonne of UREA.

This is not currency, this is commodity. Completely different rules apply.

Many raw material manufacturers, suppliers and customers would benefit hugely from utilising p2p crptocurrencies to trade with due to the, often, third-world nature of the banking systems they are usually constrained by.

You will need to take your head-space out of the First-world mentality of expecting glossy web-presence and marketing and understanding that the developing world does deals face-to-face with people who are connected to other people. It is the banks that leech of them and add so much more in real cost to the deal.

Nothing really to 'come at you' with, other than to remind you that IPL confirms a deal with Rivaa, for the usual payment terms, but that GES supplied Rivaa under the terms of the URO agreement.

That is the significance of the time delay between the January-dated contracted only now being able to be process because of the archaic banking process, whereas the GES deal with Rivaa was able to be transacted in days because of URO.

Well, I have to say I stand corrected on my concerns about this project and I am pleased to say so.

I spent the last 48 hours doing some pretty solid research into URO and, while I might still have some issues with the structure of the companies behind it, I do understand the way in which people like Nilesh work as well as the limitations of the associated online footprint related to the kind of deals done in these situations. I also telephoned Mr Singh in India, the man who brokers the IPL trades and politely asked him to confirm a few things, which he was professional enough to do.

It is important that people remember, in this instance, URO is not a currency, it is a commodity.

We need to accept that it requires a different perspective to understand how a commodity-backed coin works, especially the initial stages of establishing an accepted market price in the trading environment. Once a reasonable market price for the 'coin' is reached, the 'difficult' birth of the project has been achieved and any trade whereby one party accepted 1URO for payment of 1 tonne of UREA and held on to the coins they received, would ensure that they did, indeed, receive the usual market-price for the transaction, even if the the purchaser got themselves a bargain at the time by paying significantly less for their URO coins.

It is a steep hill to climb initially but once the trading parties can see that 1URO is priced at an equivalent market rate for 1 tonne of UREA, then many more participants in the industry will come on board simply to benefit from the fluidity of transacting in URO.

The early adopters benefit by getting some raw materials at a bargain price and the suppliers, as long as the coin price floor is set high enough, soon enough, do not lose out on the deal and, more importantly, are not subjected to the inequities of the third-world banking system that would otherwise massively handicap the completion of these trade deals.

You really shouldn't project, it exposes more about you than you realise.

Please point out where I am out of order simply for asking pertinent questions that MitchellMint doesn't want to answer?

None of my assertions are baseless, most of the bizarre claims made by your esteemed leader, however, are. So how does that make me the bad guy?

It is far healthier to pursue the truth than to live a lie. I don't need, nor do I seek, your approval in order to do so.