BTC price has fluctuated wildly I thought I would update this in USD: 75k USD (Negotiable) Anyone who needs details just email me: Support@bitsumo.comPablo. |
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Pablo,
I wish the devs could do something about the bot's tendency to sell low & buy back in higher than it sold. I'm losing $60 here & $100 there & it adds up such thaat the monthly deposits I make to try to increase the amount of money the bot has to work with are doing nothing more than making up for these small bad trades.
I understand it's necessary to let the bot do its thing. But it really gets me down.
I'd love to see it reduced somehow.
Thanks,
NginUS
Hi Ngin  , Yes, agreed. We should be adding some mitigation for this when we release the revamped trading engine next year; it's a long process but it should have good end results. Please let me know how I can continue to help. Pablo. |
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Anyone else having issues with the graphs not being drawn? I get 'Invalid Symbol" when ever i load the plugin.
I see "invalid symbol" only on btc-e; the others are fine Hi , This is an issue with our provider BitcoinCharts, we expected it to resolve itself over the last few days but it looks like BTC-E is still working on it. It in no way affects trading and we are looking (in a preliminary phase) at designing our own graphing solution to avlid these sorts of issues in the future. Please accept my apologies for the inconvenience. Please do not hesitate to check in on me in the meantime, I am here to help. Pablo. |
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I don't like the buy and sell thresholds. I guess because they don't make any sense. Why do you need a threshold and what is that really helping you do? If I just want to trade EMA lines crossing why can't I do that? I tried inputting those negative numbers and tried it on the back testing and I can't really see it performing like it should. My bot sold at $603 today at 1Hr intervals default settings. But if it would of sold as soon as it went negative it would of sold at $629. I guess I'm just dissapointed in this bot. It seems to make a lot of bad trades. Does anyone have good setting for this bot that give any better results? I wish I knew programming. It seems like you know what the bot should do but it just does whatever it wants and makes pretty bad moves. I thought I would give it another shot but its killing me.
I could be wrong here, but this is what I think is the problem. Even though the bot requires it be always connected, it doesn't take advantage of that itself. It doesn't monitor the market moves, it only checks them on the schedule you set. So if you have it set for a 1 Hour EMA, it is only checking in once an hour, even though the 1 Hour EMA actually crossed over 45 mins ago, the bot is only now checking and making the needed trade. That is correct. It only checks on the interval that you specify; that is what it is designed to do. You don't want it checking all the time, or it would be trading all the time. It costs a fee each time you make a trade. And often, the ema's will cross over several times in a short period of "sideways" movement. If you trade on all of them, you end up just giving all your money to the exchanges. What this bot works well at, is longer intervals. You want to trade less often, but make a bigger profit when you do trade. It is a long-term trading bot, not a day trading bot. EMA detects trends. Upwards trends and downward trends. And it only knows the trend is over AFTER the trend is over. It will never identify the highest or lowest values while it is at that value. It will only do it after that value has passed. Obviously, there is no way to tell if you are at the highest or lowest point. Will the price keep going up? Will the price start dropping? No one can tell you. So, you set your bot for EMA's 10 and 21 (or whatever you want), set your interval for 1 hour (or higher), and watch it make a few trades per month. You want to grab the few BIG trends. Not the hundreds of smaller ups and down that just eat away at your profit. Please, everyone, go read Goomboo's thread. It is difficult at first if you are not used to market terms and theories (I was not), but it is definitely worth it if you want to try to use this bot. I understand what your saying, but I'm not sure you understand what I'm saying. Let me give two examples, and please, anyone jump in an tell me where I got it wrong. Example #1 Using Butter-Bot on BitStamp, 1Hour, 10/21, with no time offset (so it is checking at the top of the hour). This example checks at the top of the hour, and does the calculations, if there has been a crossover, then it makes the needed trades. Example #2 Watching BitWisdom on Bitstamp, 1Hour, 10/21, with live feed (so it is checking constantly). This example uses the same settings as Example #1, but it just checks a whole lot more often, so it is much more accurate at spotting the actual crossover, when it happens. So you aren't missing it by 1-59 mins late. Why does the frequency of data point updates have to be the same as the (2h, 1h, 30m, 15m) EMA time setting? This is a valid point and a basic feature to have. Hi , Yes, it also strikes me as an interesting feature, I have forwarded this to the developer for his input. Pablo. |
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Hi Fablo,
Is there terms of use for Butter Bot? Or any written agreement which calrify the duties of service provider?
Thank you!
Hi Cool , Yes there are, when you sign up for the demo, or purchase Butter, they will be the first thing you see during setup. I hope that helps, please let me know if you need anything at all . Pablo. |
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**********************************************
Making Your Butter-Bot React More Quickly to the Market:
**********************************************
There has been a lot of email traffic on this is issue lately so let me give you guys a pro tip.
Aside from the obvious "lower your thresholds" you can effectively annul threshold 1 by entering a low negative value (like -50) meaning that that threshold will alway be met by the inverse trend so when the trend switches you only have to cross one threshold instead of two to trigger a trade.
This is not the same as having your threshold set to 0 because with 0 butter will still wait for a positive signal to trigger threshold one, albeit it a very low movement.
There are two thresholds to avoid having Butter trade on market noise, but the one threshold model is also valid and what Gomboo uses so feel free to experiment :=).
I am here if anyone needs anything.
Pablo.
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How close to Version 3 releasing? I'm holding off purchasing in case it requires a whole new bot purchase instead of a free upgrade.
Hi Spiffy , V3 will be a free upgrade as are all bot upgrades for current subscribers . We don't have a set date, but early next year is what we are aiming for, hopefully between January and February. Please let me know if you need anything at all. Pablo. |
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Butter Bot is designed for long term trading.
Any recommended bot for short term trading to capitalise on the price volatility?
Pablo: Any plan for a HFT bot?
This is something we will definitely be looking at for V4 when we develop alternative strategy modules for Butter; like someone already pointed out however, it requires a completely new trading engine and it is not a simple task to design the algorithm either. All in all however, it is quite a requested feature and something we will definitely delve into in the future. Pablo. |
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I read through the manual and did some "back testing", but it seemed to come up negative or below the value of buying and holding each time. Am I missing something? I use BTC-E
Hi Invisible , With the EMA strategy, you need to back test for six months or more, short term back testing results can be pretty random for reasons previously discussed. Please let me know if you need anything at all . Pablo. |
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I think ButterBot should have a 'Lifetime Subscription' offer available for $1,499.99, with free upgrades forever.
I certainly like that idea . I would be worried about "forever" though given server costs as we plan to keep developing for the next couple of decades . I will look into this though, it may be worth it for long term clients. Pablo. |
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Does anybody know if one butter bot license allows it to run simultaneously on multiple machines?
I'd like to have it running 24/7 on my desktop at home, while being able to check / test / change settings while traveling.
Hey , You can actually run a couple of instances as long as it's within reason and for your own personal use. A lot of people do this to trade with multiple strategies on the same account and this is not a problem if you are using different API keys and settings. As someone else already pointed out though, it is a problem if you are using two bots on the same account simultaneously which are running the same settings as they will really trample on each other. I hope that helps, please let me know if you need anything at all . Pablo. |
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Pablo,
Do you think you could get the developers to make the graph on the engine tab change to coorespond with the main exchange chosen in the drop down menu?
Ngin, Yep, this is already on the board for V3 . Pablo. |
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Dear Pablo: Want to know do you have plan includ LTC exchange @BTCE ? Hi Paul , The next version of Butter-Bot (V3) should include altcoin support on BTC-E: we aim to have this available early next year. I hope that answers your questions, please let me know if you need anything at all. Pablo. |
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The license key start when we got them on email ? Why not make it start count when we activate it ? I activate it today and it said will expired 3 more days
Hi BlueMonkey , The demo starts when you download the file, but please feel free to download another copy, you are not limited to one . Pablo. |
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Currently using following settings on MtGox:
Short EMA: 10
Long EMA: 21
Frequency: 30 minutes
Buy Thresholds: 0/0.25
Sell Thresholds: 0/0.25
Tick Offset: Anything
I always seem to make a small loss here... any idea what I might be doing wrong?
Hi Tnkflx . As previously discussed on the thread, EMA will actually make about 70% small loss trades and 30% profit trades (which should cover any losses plus a healthy profit over the long term). So this is expected behavior, please keep in mind that we are talking of this as expected behavior over the long term, whatever you see in the very short term is likely the result of mraket randomness; you need to look at long term results to identify trends. Please let me know if you need anything at all . Pablo. |
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After buying the 1 year license, putting it in and restarting chrome now it says next to the little triangle
API: connected
MTGOX: disconnected
BTC-E:disconnected
BITSTAMP: disconnected
My API's for gox and btc-e are correct... am I good or is there a network problem right now?
The fact that the bot knows what my balances on both sites are I am gonna guess good but it doesn't look right.
Naelr
Hey Naelr , 99.5% of the time this is caused by one of two things: 1. Your key and/or secret were copied incorrectly. 2. Your API keys were not given both "trade" and "get info" privileges on BTC-E (Bitstamp in contrast requires 6 permissions). Please drop me an email if that doesn't help, I will be happy to help you from there . Pablo. Pablo@Butter-Bot.com |
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Pablo,
I am a big fan of the simplicity of the bot. I strongly believe in simple, emotionally detached trading systems, which is exactly what this bot allows for.
If I could make a couple of quick suggestions:
1. It would be an excellent feature to set volume parameters, as the EMA system is not very effective in sideways markets. I believe this could help identify stronger incoming trends and leave out weak sideways choppiness.
2. The backtesting feature is nice, however, it would be awesome to be able to customize time frames. Instead of backtesting the past x months, it would be great to be able to back test a specified period such as 4.10.2013 - 8.09.2013. This would make testing different settings in different market conditions significantly simpler.
I apologize if any of these suggestions have already been made as I did not take the time to read through all 83 pages of this thread!
Hi Bitcopia :=), 1. Yes, this is one way to improve the strategy in a sideways market, we are looking at this and other possibilities for our overhaul of the trading engine; we should have something to show on this early next year . 2. Definitely agreed, I hope we can add this to the next upgrade. Please let me know if you have any other suggestions . Pablo. |
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I am pushing for profiles in the next version, should not be a problem . Pablo. Have the new hired staff been completed? Can we expect an accelerated release schedule of new or planned features? Hi PuertoLibre , We are trial testing some new developers, if that works out over the next couple of weeks, then yes; you can definitely expect a faster release schedule . It all depends on the new candidates working out however. I'll keep you guys posted. Pablo. |
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Hi OleOle & Naeir.
I'm relatively new to the bot- I've been using it since I think October. I used to use the 'suggested' settings for BTC-e, until one day the bot sold low & bought high because of them, and then I went looking for new settings, and someome on the forums here suggested that I dial down my EMA numbers. Doing so was the best thing I've ever done, because now in backtesting, depending on the day, I can sometimes get over 16,000% profit from my new settings.
So I'll share them with you, and will suggest that you slowly tweak the buy/sell threshold numbers, testing them with backtesting every day or so to see how different numbers affect the settings. Go slow with the adjustments. And try tiny negative numbers in place of the zeros on them.
Short EMA: 7
Long EMA: 15
Frequency: 2 Hours
Buy Thresholds: 0/0.25
Sell Thresholds: 0/0.1
Tick Offset: Anything
I also use bitcoinwisdom.com and enter these EMA numbers into it and set it to display EMA lines so I can watch & see what the bot sees, I find it helps to visualize what's happening. It also helps to visualize new strategies before I test them in the bot by punching the numbers into bitcoinwisdom first, too & seeing where the EMA lines would cross.
So good luck, hopefully these settings will either help or inspire you.
Thanks very much NginUS, while it's one thing for people to comment on what they think the bot does or what they think the market will do over time, it's quite another to share your settings and your ideas for tweaking them, thank you I really appreciate that as it helps my understanding of the changing of settings in the context of the current choppy market and the quite wide range of flexibility that the settings allow. Really appreciate all your comments, guidance and observations. There's no doubt that it's going to be tricky to get the balance right between taking a longer term view to work with the design parameters of the bot over the longer term and honing the settings to take account of the shorter term volatility in the market. You mention that you are constantly backtesting your settings, this does make sense when you get your settings into a 'sweet spot' where you feel that they are adapted nicely to the current market and are making a certain level of profit. I'm nowhere near that 'sweet spot' yet, so I'll review your remarks and the comments that other folks have kindly made and I'm sure that with some time and application I'll be able to make greater sense of it all and fine tune the settings. I also like the idea of being able to visualise things, so I'll take your advice and use bitcoinwisdom to 'paint the EMA pictures'. Thanks very much once again, it's greatly appreciated. If you search you can find lots of settings. I gave NginUS a bunch of my settings to try out, this one looks like a modified one of mine. Glad to see it is helpful. Bitcoinwisdom.com and some math can be very helpful when figuring this out. Actually, Vesperwillow, I came up with these myself, by tweaking EMA values in bitcoinwisdom first to see where the crosses landed on the curves. Your settings scared me away because they were all 15 minutes ffrequency. I thank you nevertheless for sharing your settings with me, as yyour assistance came at a time for me when I was too noob to have the confidence to try new settings on my own. It just so happens that around the same time that you sent me youer settings, I discovered U could visualize the EMA lines on bitcoinwisdom. That set me free since I could see what the numbers were doing to the crosses. That combined with trial & error & backtesting helped me formulate these here settings. I stand humbly corrected, and am glad you have benefited! Yeah I have some short frequency trade settings, and I also have 2-8 hour ones as well. I told Pablo month or 2 ago, there should be a 'settings storage' capability, along with some notes on it. Heck, with enough settings, the bot could have some simple AI to dynamically choose the right settings ... I am pushing for profiles in the next version, should not be a problem . Pablo. |
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Please do not hesitate to let me know if you guys need anything at all . A site which offers hot latinas for BTC?  (just had to disrupt the topic) Hmmm, not a bad plan: *starts googling*  Pablo. |
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