[...]
And if you want to go conspiracy
bitmain is halong
bitmain did all of this to get us to believe Halong is real and they needed to do a fire sale to compete with them.
And bitmain is now doing insane amount of sales of gear.
the Scrypt diff went from 160 to 210 that is 80,000 L3+s In a month.
Even at the discount price of 500 to 600 usd with coupon they still make money on it.
Notice the L3+ is the only alt that Halong did not go against.
[...]
That doesnt make sense to me. Why would bitmain create their own competitor and compete with themselve? Driving up mining difficulty hurts themselves too as they are the biggest miner, among other things. They can just keep selling at higher prices, lesser units but more profit if not for competition. Making an xmr machine for bitmain and one for halong is also waste of money. It is the same to do 2 for SIA. This miner is supportive of.slushpool, which is bitmain antpool competitor. It is default on slush right? Furthermore, if bitmain created halong just to use an excuse to lower miners, they have gotten what they wanted and they would have no issue to send u a demo. Inno being Dragonmint makes more sense. Notice how all of dragon miners have no algo similar to inno machines. It is not just the control board. Just my 2 cents speculation
Moderator's note: This post was edited by frodocooper to trim the quote from philipma1957. |
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How come they didnt send to philip? But they send to u first? No offense but all your post in 2018 has been at halong thread only and before that, it was a 2015 post.
Did they send it so you can make a thorough review here at the forum ?
I offered to take one to review and analyze it independently, they accepted. I look forward to checking out the unit, and plan on posting here about my experiences. Sandal, if you are keeping up with my posts, one of the primary Halong representatives here lives under half an hour from me and I had visited in early January to investigate the authenticity of these claims and was pretty delighted with what I found. Had he lived anywhere else, I would probably still be lurking. I think if the situation was the same, any of you would do likewise. It's a good opportunity to give back intelligence to the community with so much general angst and distrust of newcomers. As for Philip, I'm going to guess we're going to get the units at a similar time. It's a good thing they agreed to ship these out to more than one person. As mentioned before, I've got no skin in the game with Halong directly. I'm not being compensated, and I'm happy to send the unit back if they desire. I appreciate the trust I've built with the company. I'm just an oldschool miner that likes new toys  I'm all ears for any ideas on the reviewing the unit if anyone wanted to test something unique. I had a few things in mind! I dont buy that at all. This is freaking 2018. What is so difficult about shipping a machine over. It can be done in ONE DAY. There are only a few tweets about the machine's existence and no detailed reviews. We have a foruner whose review claims that the machine is actually NOT as good as advertized. Some of the machine are abit better than S9 and some are worse. No one wants a cherry picked review that shows good numbers. The fellow can probably drive to u and help u with the review. It is also suspicious that all your 2018 posts are in halong thread and your post before that was in 2015. No offense intended. They should send a few machines to a few of the forum legendaries here for review. This way there will be a few different nunbers and reviews to look at. After all, these machines seem to perform with pretty huge variation. Be transparent and fair. If the machine is as good as they say, the reviews will speak for itself. |
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Are they going to send you a free unit, like they are sending to Philip?
That's correct. I had a confirmation email already, it should come this week sometime. How come they didnt send to philip? But they send to u first? No offense but all your post in 2018 has been at halong thread only and before that, it was a 2015 post. |
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<snip> ..as long as they are affordable, perform close to spec and are reliable.
Yeah I agree 100% that in the end it is those things that matter. But have they? because right now, they're just glorified toasters......energy efficient toasters.......but toasters. When their competitor can sell asics as low as 315 USD due to having high volume, they will always be toasters compared to the competitors price unless the competitor can make something much more efficient and sell at huge enough volumes so that it can be priced cheaply enough. Then, perhaps they can win market share. It seems impossible though. I think bitmain took this threat too seriously and flooded the market with cheap sha256 miners. Think about it. If new competitor sells a product that is slightly more efficient, bitmain straights away sells theirs far cheaper on a PER TH BASIS. This increases mining difficulty greatly. Competitor has to lower price of their asic OR those asics become "expensive slightly-more-efficient toasters" as u put it. Competitors cant lower price much because they sell at lower volumes. Bitmain maintains their dominant position. Bitmain wins some as they sell more machines than usual, and make money, though at lower margins. More importantly,they PREVENT competitor from selling high volumes of product. Bitmain's own mining business takes a hit in profitability due to higher mining difficulty but this sacrifice is needed to keep market share. The new competitor is priced out of the market as they cannot sell asics at a low enough price to compete. All other miners lose alot of profit due to higher mining difficulty. I dont get why some of u want competition here. If halong lowers price aggressively, bitmain will lower price and flood coupons again. It will devalue all previous miners u just bought and it will mean higher difficulty and lower mining profitability for everyone and if they keep doing this enough, your S9 will be a D3, a machine that didnt break even for anyone, even if u mine with free electricity. U can now get an S9 for abit above a 1000 USD if u use a cheap -350 or -420 coupon bought at marketplace. The power doesnt lie in just having a slightly better asic. It lies in the amount of volume and price that a good asic can be sold at and having a good asic. So, right now bitmain's new pricing has made halong asics bought at higher 2k-ish prices toasters. They have also made S9s previously sold at 2k-ish toasters (thank god I bought mine at 1.5kish last year). And if halong pushes the price down to fight bitmain, I bet bitmain will make new S9s cheaper in order to make the new batch of halong T1 into toasters..and in the process make their previous S9 batch toasters too haha. So, how many of u are fond of toasters? |
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The wattage and Hashrate numbers you quoted are accurate but how it was paired up may have been wrong.
Here are TH/s & wattage for 4 rigs I am looking at right now:
#1: 15.15TH/s @ 1647w (Myrig PSU). 108.71w per TH
#2: 15.42TH/s @ 1586w (Myrig PSU). 102.85w per TH
#3: 15.51TH/s @ 1477w (Myrig PSU). 95.23w per TH
#4: 15.24Th/s @1680w (EVGA 1600 G2). 110.24 TH
Hashrate is fairly stable when raising room temps from 70 degrees F to 80 degrees F
Wattage is taken from APC AP8641 PDU display on #1, 2, & 3. Wall outlet meter being used on #4
board temps range from 66-75 degrees, not sure why so much variance from one rig to the next but hopefully new firmware will improve power consumption and hashrate.
I just swapped out rig #1 Myrig PSU with Bitmain 1600watt PSU and saw no improvement in numbers. Wish I had some larger PSU's and try what Phil suggested.
Rig #5 is at home and I ran it in a much cooler room temp over night to see what would happen and the hash rate dropped from 15.40 TH/s to below 13.0TH/s. EDIT: I warmed up the room and happy to report it is hashing 16.3 TH/s on slush
EDIT 2: Hashrate back down to 14.50TH/s
Room temps at 21-27 degrees celcius is good. U should not need to adjust them and 21 should be better. I see. The T1 can work better or worse than the S9 depending on luck. It is making me wonder how they made that demo vid with 16th and 1460watts.
Moderator's note: This post was edited by frodocooper to remove multiple nested quotes. |
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My five units are running at various speeds and power draw: 1489 watts, 1521watts, 1656 watts on 220V single phase and one at 1688 watts 110v using an EVGA 1600 G2. (5th unit I have not checked wattage but pulling 7 amps on 220V). room temperature is 70 degrees
Hashrates showing on Dragonmint miner status page: 15.13TH/s, 15.86TH/s, 15.38TH/s, 15.42TH/s, & 15.40TH/s (slushpool)
Are u sure?? If so, how did they pull off their demo video off https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRCsQUyR7_IIt showed 16.26 TH at 1470 watts? Recheck your readings perhaps. That video was using the standard PSU. This video was in nov 2017, about 4-5 months back. Your room temperature is 21 degrees celcius, converted from farenheit. At wat temps are your miners running? S9 is around 13.8TH for 1420w in hagsfin review - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2676763 This S9 is on 220-240v wall socket, same as the T1 numbers here. S9 - 1420w/13.8th = 102.9 watts per TH T1 - 1489w/15.13th = 98.41 watts per TH T1 - 1521w/15.86th = 95.90 watts per TH T1 - 1656w/15.38th = 107.67 watts per TH T1 - 1688w/15.42th = 109.46 watts per TH It is at around 5-7% more efficient as S9 with those numbers u mention. If the 1600+ watt range were used, it can be less efficient than an S9. Can u double check because it makes no sense how it is that far apart. 1688w and 1489 watts is a 199 watts difference. It does not seem right. |
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Already sold 2 to jesseco via philip as escrow. Deal was smooth.
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All you need is my 15$ daily coin ;-)
U create that coin. We will help u mine it |
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Buck converter design looks to be much like in the S9.
The hash board cooling design is almost copied from the Antminer S9.
Invidual heat sinks, the v-shape area without heat sinks.
thanks, and innosilicon-wise, though the plot was halong is inno, not bitmain Hmmm speculative theory. Halong is Innosilicon? Reasons: -Control board is similar -All halongs 4 algorithm asic are different from all innosilicon asic algo. Halong could release more smaller algo asics like SIA and Decred but no litecoin or dash? (not that i want them to do so and compete more) -The T1 has similar hashboard design to S9. So, if a lawsuit occurs, it goes to halong and not innosilicon. Thus, safer to use another entity. Bitmain is aggressive and is sue-ing whatsminer after all. -They were able to release new Algo miners for sale quickly, as if the miners were developed and in use before hand. They release those miners around the same time bitmain did. Hmmmm Just my 2 cents speculation |
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Buck converter design looks to be much like in the S9.
The hash board cooling design is almost copied from the Antminer S9.
Invidual heat sinks, the v-shape area without heat sinks.
I am not familiar as I have never open the S9 before. U think they will get a lawsuit from bitmain? |
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ain’t nobody wants to discuss pcb photos i posted on page 82?
Wat does it show?? significance wise. |
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It is almost exactly the same. Safe to say innosilicon is halong mining. Even the words G19 and G29,etc. Real similar Back then, there was a big miner that said innosilicon claims they have nothing to do with halong. Hmmm |
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My guess is that the 1 is just a batch number. Nice to see that machine live, I asked him if he could take a photo of the full control board without breaking any seals. EDIT:Cool, after I asked and mentioned few tips Brian took out carefully the control board and took a photo of it. https://twitter.com/brianchoffman/status/979506673021784064Here’s the control board in all its glory @HalongMining T1 PictureHere is a quick comparison I made. Comparison screenshot: https://i.imgur.com/7av9xSu.jpgOn left you can see the Dragonmint T1 control board and on right you can see the Innosilicon A4+ control board. Can you people now believe that I was not crazy talking, when I said that the control board design is exactly same?  Innosilicon is involved in this project in some way, but I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing. I've been running some A4+ and A5 machines with no issues so far. It looks the same indeed. Pretty much exactly. They definitely have something to do with it. I dont see how it can be so precise otherwise. |
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So Halong are people going to have to wait for their miners? Ba dum tsckkk...
I guess is best to wait for people in the thread to receive and put reviews with pics and videos first. It is probably a few days more only. |
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I have not been given a tracking number for the demo even though I gave my shipping info to 2 different sources .
I will post if I get any new info.
I suggest u call DHL instead. Their service is really good, can probably fix it in a quick call. I had my few issues in the past fixed very quickly.
Moderator's note: This post was edited by frodocooper to remove a response to a now-deleted redundant discussion. |
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With a $420 coupon an L3+ is $530 including shipping. Crazy.
Yeah and I hope u anticipate the high network increase that comes with cheap miners too. |
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I've enjoyed reading all of your feedback about the L3+ price drop. Still, I'd like to get another one or two. I have one now set up on solar power so, low electricity cost, but would like to expand a little. Even with the price drop, I'm still a little short with shipping, power supply, and customs. So, upon advice from mining whale friend of mine, I came to ask, hat in hand, if any of you big dogs have a Bitmain coupon that you can't/won't use and would be willing to part with?
If, like BenRickert I could get it down to $650ish, I'd be thrilled! Fingers crossed XX.
Thank you!
. I think u have better luck trying to get a 350 or 420 dollar coupon at higher prices. Check the marketplace. Notice ALL coupons expire no later than June 30 2018. I suspect a 10 or 12 NM announcement shortly after. NO WAY Bitmain is taking coupons for the new units.
I dont think they would do that so fast. That would be very bad for previous L3+ customers. L3+ is only on 28nm, thus a 14/16nm is more than enough. A 14/16nm should be 3 times stronger I believe. |
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Selling 2 pieces of 350 USD coupon for 70 USD each in coins.
Take both for 140 USD.
PM me.
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Wow, super bargain price. Any rumor on next generation of scrypt miner from Bitmain ?
Also have similar concerns...L3+ price keep dumping. Or maybe it just because of competition agains Innosilicon A4, A6 miners. L3+ is only 28nm and Inno A4 is on 14/16nm. The A4 is only 20% more efficient. The S9 (14/16nm) is 3 times more efficient than the S7 (28nm). Hence, if an L4+ appears, it could be 3 times more efficient. That being said, I dont think an L4+ will appear anytime soon as there is no real need for it. Bitmain can win on pricing by far I believe, especially since they are producing a 28nm against a competitor 14/16nm. Just my 2 cents Bitmain is sending a definite signal that they are clearing their inventory in preparation for release of new technology. The legacy units are now only useful to those with huge scale and minimum electricity costs. To say the l3+ will be "useless" is just plain stupid. Although it will be, to all the stunned morons that piled into mining in the last 4 months at record ASIC and Crypto highs. Time to cull the herd. If it gets to that point, I hope u realize that L3 miners will run the miner even if it makes 10 bucks a month and some will run it even if it makes a small loss. At that point, the lower cost miners will only be making say 20-30 bucks a month, not much either. The cost gap between running at 5 cents and 10 cents electricity rate is only 30 USD per month per miner. There is no winner really. This is the case with the D3 now. Lets not forget the lower cost miners also do have rental and staff cost unlike home miners. Hmmm I now see someone posting that they even run S9 at a loss in the S9 thread. Seems some dont mind running it at a small loss since they like it or something. Just my 2 cents If they sell 100,000 units that only makes network jump from 160,000gh to 210,000gh DATE................DIFFICULTY.......CHANGE.....HASH RATE Mar 21 2018___5,721,231_____-0.86%____163,817 GH/s Mar 17 2018___5,771,050_____ 1.75%____165,243 GH/s Mar 14 2018___5,671,972_____ 2.79%____162,406 GH/s Mar 10 2018___5,517,835_____ 1.32%____157,993 GH/s https://bitcoinwisdom.com/litecoin/difficultyThis is nothing like the D3 the scales were far different. I purchase a 7th today. I just don't see the network growing that much. I don't think there are 100,000 L3+s to sell. I do not know how much they will sell or if your calculations are correct but litecoin difficulty is 4 million on 1st Feb 2018 and it is 6.12 million now, less than 2 months later. It has increased by 50% in less than 2 months and this is without cheaper mining equipment prices. It will get worse with cheaper miner prices. |
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