30 days? WTF are you smoking? Seriously. They are already 37 days behind on some of the orders give them another 30? Fuck me. How about you just let then ship whenever they want? The deal was 9 - 10 weeks. If they failed to do that they are in breach of contract. We need refunds. Full stop. If we don't get refunds we boycott them as hard and vigorously as we can so that we will seriously disrupt the GEN2 chip sales and hurt them on the bottom line and we do that until we are all adequately compensated. Anything less and you are being suicidal. http://support.avalon-asic.com/ <--- START A REFUND TICKET here. Such refund ticket, is for B2B clients such as SebastianJu, SteamBoat & Zefir. So far only SebastianJu seems to speak up. I know the others are not sitting happily in their boats, but they should be the ones asking for our refund.. Our group put in a refund ticket 6 days ago. No reply. wow.. i hope all groupbuys does it. SebastianJu? |
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I don't disagree, but whose going to do anything, if the community wants to send him a message then perhaps someone should post a poll with a set of options for action. He would no doubt see the results and may react before any action is necessary.
ive made such a poll, so far 50% wants a refund.. see my footer. |
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Sell into Euro, and in BTC
Make me offers.
located is Germany.
Send the Blade only to Europe.
Buyer pay DHL shipping.
You only have one? |
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price were adjusted to 104BTC
On wednesday i will give you an offer.  |
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The anker hub is a bit pricier though.. Since its the only hub that actually can power 10. 9 for sure (some ppl succeeded with 10).. |
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They are saying chips are stuck in customs, but we don't know how many.. Is even any of the group buys part of that?
I doubt they will start shipping soon. They are also coming up with personal excuses which is horrid, since they don't want B2C clients, why would we listen to their personal issues? Be a business, act like a business. Leave personal matters aside.
If they cant deliver on time, refund. Start over, sell when they have stock, whats difficult in that? (problem with that, is that they would actually have to make some losses and live up to some promises, which doesn't seem to be high priority..)
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30 days? WTF are you smoking? Seriously. They are already 37 days behind on some of the orders give them another 30? Fuck me. How about you just let then ship whenever they want? The deal was 9 - 10 weeks. If they failed to do that they are in breach of contract. We need refunds. Full stop. If we don't get refunds we boycott them as hard and vigorously as we can so that we will seriously disrupt the GEN2 chip sales and hurt them on the bottom line and we do that until we are all adequately compensated. Anything less and you are being suicidal. http://support.avalon-asic.com/ <--- START A REFUND TICKET here. Such refund ticket, is for B2B clients such as SebastianJu, SteamBoat & Zefir. So far only SebastianJu seems to speak up. I know the others are not sitting happily in their boats, but they should be the ones asking for our refund.. |
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Hi,
when did you place order 1 and 2? when are you expecting delivery of those? How many weeks are BFL saying it would take to deliver the chips?
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Ship the chips within 2 weeks (real time, not BFL time).
Refund 50% to make up for lost ROI.
This way miners get their chips and might still make ROI, the assemblers didn't risk their livelihood for nothing AND Avalon can save their face and still make a shitload of money (because I honestly don't want to think about the margin on those chips).
Agreed, but then better add 100% of the chips you ordered to the delivery? that way you will make back your money, and Avalon will only "make less margin" and not have to refund anyone.. For the board mounting services, it would be the same, if Gen2 chips come out in October, the boards will be the same from what i read? I mean only the chips will be faster, but using the same connection specs. |
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Might be true if bitinstant is collecting the payments from one customer, in this case bitsyncom, in one address. Then it wouldnt be yifus address and he got paid out from another address.
Does it really matter? If Avalon wants to stay in the business, to save face, i think they have to refund the orders past due 4 weeks? What does your groupbuy clients say? Send them to the poll? With that, we will know what the B2C people thinks at least? It seems like not many other group buy arrangers really speak up.. Which is sad, they represent a big amount of orders and "say".. |
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Refund is the only way to go, sorry Yifu but probably we should start to name you Josh 2.0.
Anyway, I hope you all understand that we'll never ever see a refund? He'll just ship the chips in a few months when they will be worth nothing more than a bunch of plastic and silicon in a nice QFN package...
Yes, if we B2C clients does not speak up, we will allow him to do whatever he feels like. He should take part of these losses, return the group buys to save his reputation in the forums and start selling when he has stock. I'm sure new groupbuys will pop up immediately if he has stock.. I might even buy again.. |
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Yes of course it would be better than nothing. My vote would be to explain the chip boxes (i added the link in my post above now) and where those chips went to, ship the chips fast or refund in full since in some weeks its too late to get the investment back with mining. (And who the heck wants to invests 100€, puts much work into it only to get 100€ out of it at the end?) The difficulty is rising from 62% to 75% per month already. Its possible next time it is 100% a month. See: http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/I think yifu had plenty of time and experience to know how long it takes to get the chips. When i see the boxes my guess is that the chips already were created but someone bought them away. Yifu thought he could order new ones fast and now they are overdue... Ok, a refund would then be the best option. I'm curious, the address you sent the payments too? have they still not touched those coins at all? That would make their lives very easy suddenly, just return the coins into our wallets, and they can go on with their lives just as this did not happened. Announce a product in stock ,and sell out the stock (like production and selling should be).. |
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This is the account where the coins from chip orders have gone: https://blockchain.info/address/1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU?offset=0&filter=0Judging from the balance, that's about 3.036 pcs of full Avalons worth of chip orders. What's interesting here is that I don't see any outgoing payments from this account. Meaning, the chip orders to TSMC must have been paid from other sources. So, basically Bitsyncom -could- refund all chip orders if they had to, as they are still holding all the funds. Maybe I'm wrong, this is just my view of the situation. My point exactly. Refund the groupbuys or whoever made an order with them.. But what do you mean 3.036? there's hundreds of thousands of chips ordered.. |
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The difficulty is rising 75% each month at the moment. 30% more chips wont help in more than one way. 30% more chips does not cover the less mining income next month and these 30% are only the price for the chips. Those are not complete miners. That means you have to pay the assembly too on top. Without rebate.
And next gen? How will the GH priced compared to those chips now? Lets pretend the old chips come mid august. When the 2. gen chips are the half price per GH, but come 2 months later you will have an even worse trade than with the old chips. Because when your miner is ready the difficulty probably is 300-400% higher. Your half price means nothing then anymore. Plus, the price of the chips might half, but the assembly cost not.
So i think its either ship the chips fast or refund in full. I doesnt care when the chips cant be sold anymore, there were plenty of time to order, which obviously happened, there were many chips created already... they only didnt found the way to us. So i dont care if the chips cant be sold anymore.
I see your point. However, 30% more chips delivered, within 30 days, is 30% more than 0%.. It is at least some kind of help, to see that they do take some responsibility and try and fix the problem, and not play the blame game. (i changed it to 100% more chips) And i am curious SebastianJu, you as a groupbuyer (and an active forum member), what would be your vote? |
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Bitsyncom, Thanks for the update. It is appreciated, but around 20 weeks to late (proper project management will know if development will take twice the time, or remain on time, at least half the time in development) I have made a poll, where the forum members can decide what you should do to regain the trust for future products: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=270897.0 |
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I wouldn't give Avalon 1cent after all this.
Simple, companies like that shouldn't be rewarded.
I vote with my wallet.
Guys, i made a small poll with a few choices.. hopefully Avalon will see it and the forum will decide what they need to do to regain trust: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=270897.0 |
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Update: Avalon has decided to give groupbuyers and direct purchases a refund. Most of us asked for this to happend. If this poll was a success or not , I will let you decide. I am happy with the outcome of receiving a refund of the GroupBuys I participated in. I have locked the voting and the topic. Thanks for participating and good luck in future BTC ventures. Dear Avalon, Most of the group buys arranged on this forum very early are now past due delivery with more than 5 weeks. You said yourself, many times that you really dislike and do not want to do B2C distribution ever again (Avalon Miners Batch 1-3) mainly because of disrespectful and screaming clients. You then decided to work only with B2B, while taking this route, you made promises and agreements with clients. Many of them where groupbuyers, these groupbuyers in turn, has direct clients like us: B2C. While you are not living up to your agreement with your B2B clients of 9-10 weeks delivery, this in turn puts you in an extreme bad light over all your potential future clients, US the B2C clients, trusting board developers and suppliers such as burnin and BKKcoins to do a better board mounting service than you did (and do not want to ever do again). I read your post on the main page of your site, telling heartbreaking stories of personal life being infriged upon and that chips are held in customs. This might all be true, but then all we need to look at is your agreements with your B2B clients. You made a promise to deliver prepaid orders, which you did not do. Where in the world does your personal life, or the employees of your company make us risk takers in the sense of you not abiding by your agreements? You as a company need to take some risk in this, your clients shall not bear all the cost in this.. I only see a few options for you to recoup your trust in the market, the vote above will show you which one will be most appreciated by the forum, your B2C clients, who you never want to do business with again.. To anyone else on the forum, shall i change any of the votes? or am i missing something cruicial in my writing that i should change? Edit1: I changed from 30% to 100% more chips on delivery. Edit2: This is presumably the address which received all the orders: https://blockchain.info/address/1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU?offset=0&filter=0Contains more than 70.000 coins. Should be simple to refund.
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And the worst part is, after he fucked us, he said "Don't worry, I'll do it again harder in October!"
No. The worst part is that there will be people willing to give him money in October after he pulled this stunt. I'm writing on a vote-poll, where i am suggesting Avalon to return all payments from the groupbuys to the managers of these purchases, and then we will all get our investments back should we want to. And those who want to remain, can gladly do so on the new "in stock order" process. This is madness, and should never have been gone this far. Ok guys, my VOTE/Poll is done. give me your votes! https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=270897.0 |
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Thinking back to Zefir's batch which arrived a couple weeks ago, he mentioned this:
Update: 1st batch shipped
I got a a status update from Avalon - the first batch of chips has been shipped, including DHL tracking number. It should get delivered this week.
So they did send it through DHL with a tracking number, though it does seem it was shipped directly from Avalon rather than TMSC. Factory's can send on behalf of brands/clients no problem.. Worldwide. They just call DHL, and use the clients details for payments and attach clients invoice for customs. |
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The minimum that is due now:
- what is stuck in customs from where to where
- proof that chips are stuck in customs: paperwork, tracking #, etc...
- daily updates for paying customers of bitsyncom
I do believe chips being stuck in customs to be rumors? Where have you seen such statement? i have not heard this from the group buy im participating in at all.. (with 10-15 completed group buys, I find it far fetched..) |
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