This is the truth, and when people actually stop playing selective listening and actually take the time to read Pankkake's post or MPOE-PR's post at face value they will gain some valuable insight. Of course everyone has their own agenda but that doesn't defeat what they have to say.

I've said it before but I've read all of Pankkake's post, Crumb's post, VE's Post, MPOE-PR's post, NotLambChops and all his other Alt's post when they posted on a thread that concerned my money. Of course they're memes and images and cursive font got quite annoying but other than that they have more knowledge then a lot of us in this community.

If I would have known of Pankkake and MPOE-PR before I found ActiveMining I probably would have sold when I had the chance, though I have not invested nearly enough for it to destroy me (I do feel sorry for DTS and many others) as I looked at more of a bet than an investment, but if I could of done it again I would have picked black instead of red if you know what I mean.

It doesn't matter who the advice is coming from, if it is sound advice. Shit I was one who kept saying VolcanicEruptor had good points back when everyone else was calling him a troll. He was just a bit aggressive.  

"There are shareholders that still think this will turn-around. Therefore, I have to agree with pankkake: 'people have not learned their lesson'. I disagree, besides Zum and Vince and maybe one other. (They really need to stop playing with DTS's emotions.)

I don't think any new people are getting into AcTM (Thankfully, I would and have advised against it). I personally don't think we have any chance of turning an actual profit, but I think we can get closer to clearing our debt and getting more of our money back than we can at this point. And if not, I have so small shares that selling it wouldn't be worthwhile compared to the immense amount of joy I get out of Ken's shitty puzzles.

But have an actual conversation with anyone one of them and you'll see that they won't just try to insult you and belittle you if you don't try to do the same to them. Shit I had a decent conversation with NotLambChop a week or so ago before it got deleted and I'm pretty sure I've butted heads with him on one of his Alts before.

The only silver lining to this is that if BTC goes up, our hardware will be worth more and we might have more liquid cash to ride this very unstable train we've called Active mining.

So a short while ago (not even an hour) you were up to connecting the dots and clarifying the situation for everyone here who does not have this knack for insight like you do.


But now you don't. Apparently we are too lazy to connect these dots?

Is it because I forgot to let you pick a color? I like green. (The color of the money Ken is losing every day, and by association, us too). But feel free to pick a color yourself.

I would love for this thread to read like an AsicMiner thread. They ask questions, they shut up and wait for an answer. They accept the answer because it elaborates enough to satisfy the question asked and then they ask more questions, shut up and wait again. - It's the reason I don't post there. I have no need to, I have all the information I need for my confidence in FC and AC. AcTM, I do not.  

I believe I have asked you twice already. Can you please clarify for us. I am kindly asking to take you up on your offer. I mean no disrespect but this is money, no emotions.

From reading your post, I can only assume that you are talking out of your ass to either.

A. Buy time for Ken.

B. Take blame off of Ken.

C. Cover up Ken's incompetence.

After reaching this point I can only assume that you (and maybe even Vince, but I refuse to point fingers without actually talking to him directly like I am with you now) are working for Ken under some guise of payment or other valuable reason.

Now I have held my tongue and bided my time while we did not have shares, I have accepted that we failed with the eAsic 28nm chip, I have accepted that Ken bought hashrate to confuse us. I have accepted that Ken has blatantly lied three times about a Financial Report. I have accepted all of this, so I say this with the most appreciation possible for the situation we are in and with the appreciation that you know I am not one to come on here and just whine and cry and throw my finger in Ken's face anytime I hear something I do not want to.

But I can not possibly see why we are not converting the hardware we are not using, into the money that we can use to clear up our debt. Now if you know why this is. Then you should come out and say it. Or we can only assume that you are outright lying to me now and have no idea. What does this mean?

This means that no shareholder currently has a clue what the CEO of the company we have a stake in is doing, and by this we can only assume from previous experience that it is NOT GOOD

A precedent has been set by Ken, when he doesn't let us in on the secret, it's bad.

He is currently not letting us in on the secret.

Help Ken help us. Let us in on the secret.

Yes please, join the dots. Be very specific. I grow tired of Ken's guessing games and making assumptions out of 1 sentence responses from Ken. I would very much like for you to assist me with this.

I still have yet to see a dot for instance. I really can not see where ActM could fit in with the expansion of the mining industry if it isn't.

A. Selling mining hardware (Which he is neglecting at this point by not cleaning up the website and doing some decent Marketing/PR of the product).

B. Mining with mining hardware (Which he is also neglecting at this point by not getting another DC up and running or even PMing Bargraphics).

I think you think that there is going to be some spectacular chip coming out from ActM. I wholeheartedly (With every fiber of my existence on this planet) disagree. There is no evidence of this, not a single drop. Not a dot. I have looked, but I can not find one except for more 21 Question avoidances from Ken.

Spoon & Asic alone are about to completely destroy the difficulty of mining in the next Month or Two. And I mean that what we are mining with will be worthless very very very very very soon. Very soon. So what exactly is Ken doing to fight this? So far I see nothing. He has products On hand. He needs to get these out of the door before they are worthless. He has gotten to the finish line, yet he refuses to cross it.

Let me make this absolutely clear. Ken does not need us to succeed. He needs us to succeed the way you picture him to succeed.

But there are many other ways to succeed. How about disappearing. I must say the scammer of Labcoin definitely succeeded, he made more money on this forum than pretty much any one else in the such a short amount of time. I must say his work to profit ratio was probably higher than Warren Buffets.

I look forward to you connecting the dots.

Exactly, Ken has an obligation. A legal duty to act in the best interest of the company. Clearly he is not doing that from the actions we have seen.

If Ken had some sort of plan in the pipeline. He needs to come on here and say "I have a plan in the Pipeline that deals with x, y and z."

(And here is the tricky part). He needs to come on here and say this BEFORE (yes before) he dedicates company time and resources to it. You don't just throw money at a wall for months and then come and tell your shareholders "I've thrown money at a wall for months."

No, you come on here and say "I plan to throw money at a wall for months." before you actually go throw money at a wall for months. Otherwise no one has a clue what the CEO is doing and for all intents and purposes it looks as though the CEO is feigning incompetence for some illegal and immoral reason.

Ken I have repeatedly informed you on the bare minimum you had to do to gain shareholder confidence. I will do it once more.

1. Simply come on here and tell us why you have no (or little) desire to update the website and improve marketing of our only product.

2. Simply come on here and tell us what your plan is that is more important than the website and the only profitable product.

It's like we got out of the quicksand only for you to decide to stick your foot back in it. I can not even comprehend why and the fact that Vince and Zum believe they can worries me even more.

Unfortunately I have not gained mastery of this skill like you and Vince have. How about you enlighten us since our supreme overlord Ken refuses too. I feel like I'm reading shitty scriptures from a Chinese bible knockoff.

Is your argument that we won't make any profit by mining?

(Surprise were not in the black - This has been stated, at least by me, repeatedly.)

If we're not going to make any money mining then it's a good thing Ken seems to be switching to selling don't you think?

You don't prove anything by beating other shareholders in arguments as they have no insider information about the company or even any say in the company.

I believe ( I could be wrong ) that you have stated that you were going to sell out once shares went live (of course you don't need to follow suit, it wasn't some sort of verbal/written contract that you must). What has changed since then that has allowed you to come back into the fold of wanting this business to succeed compared to not really caring about it?

You have a few choices, Legal, Sell Now, Keep Bitching (Where Ken will obviously just ignore you unless you are Zumzero or Crumbs) or Stop Bitching. One of those will allow you to get out of this immediately which I thought was your previous plan.

The another one of those 3 (your current pursuit) just happens to annoy the shit out of the rest of us.

Let me make this perfectly clear, this is not some legitimate business in some legitimate industry where precedent has already been perfectly set. Your shares don't have any voting ownership over this company, you and I and everyone else here merely gave money to Ken on a bet. You can not cry and scream when the bet happens to land on red when you picked black.

And then me and him can talk about buying my small small small, paltry set of shares last so he can wrap up this endeavor. Of course I won't be selling for under .0025

=)

I have stated that we only have around 200~400 BTC left in wallet's that Ken has shown us. Who knows how much money we actually have, but I believe Ken never raised 25K BTC as shares started being sold at .0005, not .0025, that means at minimum we started with 5K btc, what Ken did with this 5,000~25,000BTC, who knows.

I don't know how Ken could have lost this much money, (even a month or so ago we were at 1.5K BTC left in wallets he's personally showed us IIRC)

People will bitch until the day they die.

I think I'll just hold onto my shares and just enjoy the ride at this point.

Oh ok thanks, that was kind of unclear in your last post.

Is this what they are investigating him for or they are not? (I am confused - They are not investigating him for Securities fraud but are investigating him for selling unregistered securities, or is it neither and they are after something else?).

I got a question for Ken.

What did you mean when you said the MSD are not investigating you. Can you elaborate on this entire situation? Did they start and then stop? Or were they never investigating you in the first place? What is the newest reason we don't have shares then?

If you @ them on twitter, they look rather responsive. You could just ask directly for pictures.

I hear you - and I am also not looking for an argument.

If you want to define dividends as Profit made by the company then even if shares came out, you do agree that there has been no profit from this company so far yes? So either way there will be no dividends even from the mining sales as they have definitely not made up all the money that has been spent & lost. (They probably haven't even covered the money lost to Mt. Gox or the money lost to eAsic). So if dividends are the profit of the company then it is effectively zero. At this point I don't even think a financial report is necessary to see that this is the case but (@ Ken) a financial report is still necessary for company clarity.

On the other hand, if you don't want to define dividends as Profit and instead want to define it as mining income, then we have an address where we can see all of the mining income. Which has yet to go untouched. So this is a no issue, Ken could have a plan for this money that doesn't involve shareholders but I do not think that it is the reason we have gone 5 months without having shares - Now it could be a reason as you save for us to lack access to our shares, but I see no evidence to alludes to this.

As you can see, at this point. There really is no way for a shareholder to expect to receive a dividend that includes money made from selling hardware. The company is in a deficit, worst case the company is sitting on less than 350BTC to continue operations and make a turn around. I don't see how one would expect to receive any dividend, let alone a dividend from newly sold hardware. I could be ignorant (and probably am) of a few other failures and/or success from the company that can have that 350BTC be way off (140BTC~ from the Mining address + last I heard 200BTC from the AMC/VMC address + w/e we sold so far), but from the information I've seen this is accurate.

Who knows why Ken hasn't done shares yet. For all intents and purposes it could be that hes just lazy. I can not recall ever arguing as to why we don't have shares ( but yes, I have stated my opinion on the matter ), I've only wanted people to be clear of where our mining income has gone to and made sure that they understand that Ken hasn't been stealing it. It's still there after all these months, it's been in limbo as long as our shares.

Thank you.

SebastianJu is confused. I guess he thinks I am defending Ken (even though I said it in the both(?) post addressed towards him and pretty much every other post I make on this thread that I am not defending Ken, only clarifying the situation for people).

SebastianJu seems to think that Ken is using our dividends. I've proved that that is not the case. Anything else Ken is doing has nothing to do with whether or not Ken has used our dividends and I am not defending any of his other actions besides the fact, repeat this a fact by definition of fact, that Ken has not used any of our dividends including the 50% split that goes towards furthering the company goals that was decided on back in November. What does this mean? I don't know.

I can only speculate that it means that the company does not actively need the 70~ BTC to keep afloat at the moment.

TL;DR this entire page = If you have an issue with Ken that is fine, don't come on here and scream about him using our dividends or accusing him of using our dividends when the ONLY thing we really really have proof of is that he hasn't touched our mining income in over 5 months and the last time they were touched were to pay out dividends. If you want to pick up spears and arrows and chuck them at Ken, at least aim for the right target.

Actually I am now referring to the 139BTC and counting as our mining income. There should be no dividends in a company until they turn a profit. Which this company has not.

I expect that some of you guys (if you would have owned shares of blockbuster) would have went to a Blockbuster shareholder meeting and would have screamed for dividends while they were announcing the company's bankruptcy.

@SebastianJu

I am not defending Ken or saying hes on the right track. I am in no way blind and think this company is currently headed to success. If you think I am one of the cheerleaders then you are wrong.

I am only stating that you have spewed in factual information and before you do that and base assumptions off of misinformation, make sure it is the right information.

"Ken is dishonest because hes withholding shares so he doesn't have to pay out dividends that he is using to do x,y, and z with."

So you are basing your reason for him holding shares off of in-factual information and then accusing him of something because of it. There's 100 reasons someone could and probably should be mad at him but him stealing dividends is definitely not the case. I have just proved it to you. Do I need to prove it to you again? Shit you proved it to yourself by quoting me.

"Im pretty sure im a way bigger shareholder than you." - SebastianJu

That means your more right than me huh? Almost everyone here is a bigger shareholder than me, I'm not stupid enough to throw all my BTC in one investment.

"Im pretty sure im a way bigger shareholder than you. So dont try to say that i come in and randomly accuse ken." - SebastianJu

(I didn't try to say it. I did say it, you came in here, again with in-factual information and accused Ken of something he hasn't done) Just because you own a lot of shares that doesn't prove you've done your due diligence, kept update with the company, or even spent 5 minutes out of the day to use Google. It just means you have a lot of money to throw around or you make very poor financial decisions.

"And why are you seeing the untouched divs as proof when you post the notice that ken will use half of them for investment?" - SebastianJu

So.. the accusation is that he is stealing and using our Divs.. and I show you that they are untouched and that isn't proof?

By definition of untouched.

Untouched: Not handled or used.

By definition of untouched Ken can't have possibly used them.

"And what are 139 BTC for 10,000,000 shares? 0.0000139BTC per shares. Nothing near 0.0025BTC. So whatever. It doesnt care what small amount of divs he already mined. The miner sales are probably more anyway. The important thing is that we cant trade. People that dont believe in Ken anymore could sell and the guys that believe can buy. But we arent allowed to do this because ken claims the MSD prevents this. While in fact he allows trading of the same shares on a smaller base. So anytime a missouri citizen could buy shares. If that would be the big problem like he claims he would have to stop trading. But he didnt. So no, i cant believe his explaination." - SebastianJu

None of this has anything to do with what I stated above (I'm again I'm not defending Ken so go rant to someone else) so I'm going to pretty much ignore it, but I feel obligated to post this last bit here so you are 100% certain that I am going to ignore it and won't bring it up again in this debate.

I keep seeing this as one of the points. Obviously Ken could not be honest but to use divs as an excuse doesn't work. Why? Because we can actively see at any time of the day 24/7 for the last 5+ Months that our Divs have not been touched. There is a wallet with 120 139 Coins in it from our mining for the last 5months that Have not been touched Ken has not touched our Divs at all.

I repeat because this "Ken is stealing our divs" appears so much that clearly people come on here, do no research, and then make up bullshit. Ken has no touched our Divs at all for the last 5 + Months. Our Divs are easily Trackable &&&&&&& visible on the blockchain. The next time someone says Ken is stealing our Divs, please show evidence. Because I can easily produce evidence that Ken is not.


Here is our Div Address https://blockchain.info/address/1DJpsvnM7xTnQbWEhLYyCyfxQyxwupEzCa

And here is our mining where you can easily see (Even in the URL) that it is pointing towards our Div Address. http://eligius.st/~wizkid057/newstats/userstats.php/1DJpsvnM7xTnQbWEhLYyCyfxQyxwupEzCa


****** Also notice Ken has claim to half of these to further to company in buying hardware, upgrading staff, w/e but hasn't touched one BTC, maybe the company is financially afloat for now? ******
 

+1

@DTS you're right and I thought everyone here knew that it was Ken who was not giving us back our shares or giving out dividends. That said he has never said that "MSD has told us to not give back shares or pay out dividends." but he has hinted at "To not fuck ourselves over and give MSD more evidence/cause, we will be holding shares and dividends until the situation is over with."

MSD isn't blocking our shares, Ken is picking between a Catch 22 (Give us our shares and pay divs so we stop going after him with Lawyers or Hold our shares and don't pay Divs so MSD has less to go on.) looking for the path of least harm. Does that mean I agree with his decision? No. But I understand why he is doing it, I don't need Ken to explain to me why he is holding our shares and I understand why he won't verify them. The less he talks about shares and address concerns about share holders, the less information the MSD can pull from the horse mouth himself and the more information they have to find for themselves. But again, this does not mean I agree with him. 

On the share front, I don't think Ken has lied about that. He has no reason to lie, he has nothing to gain. He knows and has stated and acknowledges our shares, it won't cost him money to list him and will get a lot of pressure off of his back.