nodes!=boss
Thanks for understanding that too. Bitcoin not being a "proof of node" coin, nodes aren't the boss, like you say. if there is a real disagreement about what is the valid chain the nodes will do NOTHING to solve the disagreement. coinbase will run 2 F'ing nodes, we will take the disagreement to the markets where everyone can participate. hashrate, node count, dev approval none of this really matters, none of these actors are truly "the boss" consider this.. minority fork, minimal node count, and disapproving devs. thats how ETC was born. why? because "the boss" put his foot down  I learned a lot too during the ETH/ETC split about the dynamics of consensus. It was a fascinating experience. Maybe bitcoin people didn't follow this drama very closely and didn't learn as much about how proof of work consensus networks really work. hashing power is only a signpost, a best guess, as to what the consensus really is. ETC failed to gain majority hash rate, because it failed to gain majority market share, not the other way around.... |
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seems dinofelis is on a scripted mission
objective try to brainwash sheep into thinking nodes are not important.
i think he is new to the community and doesnt yet grasp the deeper details of consensus or bitcoin,, and has only been taught the highschool level concept.
if coinbase (non-mining node) stopped getting blocks from pool X.
pool X cant spend its reward with coinbase and thus hashing for nothing.
the nodes work together to get a single agreed chain of blocks.
the nodes agree on what should go next ontop.
pools blocks do get orphaned off where by a different pool gets chosen as the better block creator.
this happens many times a week
pools are NOT the boss.
nodes are the boss
pools are just the secretary. collating data, but having to collate it in the way the boss is happy to sign off and file. if the boss disagree's he will bin their work and get another secretary.
nodes=boss
pools=secretary
devs=janitors
nodes!=boss if there is a real disagreement about what is the valid chain the nodes will do NOTHING to solve the disagreement. coinbase will run 2 F'ing nodes, we will take the disagreement to the markets where everyone can participate. hashrate, node count, dev approval none of this really matters, none of these actors are truly "the boss" consider this.. minority fork, minimal node count, and disapproving devs. thats how ETC was born. why? because "the boss" put his foot down |
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its not gr8 at long term storage...
but if we are looking to preserve some value for a short time.
cash is king.
Not always...  right highly sought out rare unique items might be and excellent store of value. a bitcoin more like these stamps then it is gold. these stamps have a strictly limited supply. not so with gold. These stamps were from Germany in 1924. LOL. The are not rare or valuable at all. The point is they were going for 5000 to 500,000 marks, and then they had to cross that out and they were going for 2 million marks. I was refuting your claim that cash is king for the short term. That has not always been the case. i assumed you were point to some super rare stamps or somthing ...idk... ahhh the Gr8 Germany " wall-paper money experiment "  |
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its not gr8 at long term storage...
but if we are looking to preserve some value for a short time.
cash is king.
Not always... right highly sought out rare unique items might be and excellent store of value. a bitcoin more like these stamps then it is gold. these stamps have a strictly limited supply. not so with gold. |
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consider fiat's cost of production and the rate at which the FED prints it and INJECTS it into the economy... yet fiat is still a relatively stable store of value.
Fiat is not a relatively stable sore of value. Each and every year that passes by, a dollar buys less and less. I must admit, the inflation in the US has been ralatively low for quite a while. However, in the late 70s, this was not the case. As a child, it seemed every time that I went to the store, candy, pop and comic books cost 5 cents more. its not gr8 at long term storage... but if we are looking to preserve some value for a short time. cash is king. |
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cost of production only has an impact on the market if that commodity is consumed and very depended on continually replenishing the supply. for things like gold, bitcoin, and fiat cost of production is meaningless, only thing that really matter for these types is total supply + the rate at which the supply grows. for gold and fiat, the higher their value the higher the rate at which the supply grows, but not bitcoin! and this is one reason why bitcoin is a better store of value than gold. no one can simply change the supply. sure its hard to "change the supply-side of gold" but its not impossible, asteroid minning is a real possible future for gold. and it wont be the fact that 1 oz of gold only cost 100$ to produce that will bring down its price, the price will change because the total supply and the rate at which that supply grows, has changed. imagine we mine an asteroid FULL of gold, so much gold we don't know what to do with it, the cost of producing that gold was 100$ an oz, but flooding the market with ALL THAT GOLD would crash gold's price to 5$ an ounce... at that point the supply of gold stops gorwing completely and its more or less forever worthless! in contrast, if 500 Billion barrels of oil MAGICALLY appeared, the price might go down for a while... but once consumed, the cost of oil goes right back to the cost of production. lets consider silver. its cost of production is near 0 because it is a byproduct of copper mines. but silver still has a bloody high market price. case and point, production cost has very little impact on "highly durable commodities"  ... maybe thats why they "dont make them how they use to anymore" O_O |
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Here's an economics problem about bitcoin as a store of value I want to see Marcus and Adam even attempt to address. The post is a reply to a Nick Szabo quote I don't think is correct: Any commodity that can be stored and so traded can be used as store of value that will render the owner immune from the perceived or actual risks of holding a floating currency. First of all, just about every currency is a "floating currency" unless the entire supply has been entirely mined from the closed ecosystem and you no longer have to worry about cost of production affecting value. But even then, you're still governed by people's sentiment for how much they value that object to trade their goods and services for vs bartering with something else. Everything about the currency is going to be floating in one way or another. Secondly, bitcoin having a potentially wildly floating cost of production is one of it's greatest weaknesses and one reason it's not a store of value. A wildly volatile to the downside cost of production is a black swan event in itself and would render confidence in that asset to nothingness. If we lived in an open ecosystem, which anyone who claims we will be mining asteroids for metals does, then the cost of production and it's ability to not plummet is the main factor that makes gold a store of value at all. If you live in a closed ecosystem it's not that big of a factor since you're bound by supply. As for bitcoin, the fact that mining NEVER ENDS is exactly the equivalent of using gold as money while being in an open ecosystem. If cost of production craters, you're screwed. This can happen in bitcoin easily. The act of previous holders just hoarding their money and refusing to sell low doesn't help because the network is officially dead in the first place if there's no mining fees to siphon off at this new lower cost of production, so the fresh lower cost of production coins drag everything else down with it. cost of production has very little effect on price even if ( for no good reason ) the cost of mining the remaining 9million coins was 0, price would not be affected. so what if the miner dumps 12.5BTC every 10mins and makes a profit. its NOTHING compared to the global trading volume, and the market itself dosnt really care about how much or how little the miner is profiting consider fiat's cost of production and the rate at which the FED prints it and INJECTS it into the economy... yet fiat is still a relatively stable store of value. |
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i always underestimate the magical unicorn effect  So are these people who didn't get in on bitcoin during the etf hype that it was, only think BTC is just unicorn money because they are on the outside looking in?  no one thinks bitcoin is a magical unicorn, but some poeple seem to think money will keep pouring in and rise the price when there is no more reason to buy the price UP anymore. for years now, the upcoming ETF has been a good reason to pour money into bitcoin ( or maybe more improtently a reason to hold off selling) now that this has come on gone, poeple still believe price will move on higher " oh th ETF never made sense anyway " , " ETF decline was already priced in " , " THIS IS BITCOIN, UP!! " this is the magical unicorn effect. OK i'm exaggerating, its not that there is no more reason, but certainly there is 1 less reason to buy, and 1 less reason to keep holding. |
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i always underestimate the magical unicorn effect |
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Feels like a big disconnect between trader's "sentiment" and the external market here to me.
I think traders got overly focused (obsessed even) with the wtf ETF because it was 'their thing', Wall St., big bucks, yada yada yada, etc BS. So price has been dominated by trader's sentiment towards ETF thinking since at least mid December .... meanwhile the physical market on the street in India, Japan, China, Asia, Brazil, S. America, UK Europe, USA, etc has been picking up some serious exponential growth steam, look at wallet adoption numbers, s/ware downloads, localbitcoins.com.
Just saying you guys might be missing the woods for the trees. Try not to get run over by the bitcoin moon train when scalping your trading card pennies up off the track ...
the question now is, can the market support these prices without this "ETF coming Soon TM" bullishness. i'm betting that it can't, and we in for a sizeable drop, probably Below 1000$.. i'm looking forward to a more reasonable 950 maybe you're asking the wrong question and therefore betting not only on the wrong pony but the wrong race at the wrong track? what if the question actually is, how much has the ETF deadline anticipation held bitcoin price growth below the adoption/halving trend it had been on for the previous 12 months? you're suggesting that the upcoming ETF was a weight on the market that has now been lifted!?! thats just nutty... i can't accept this line of reasoning as sensible or valid. |
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Feels like a big disconnect between trader's "sentiment" and the external market here to me.
I think traders got overly focused (obsessed even) with the wtf ETF because it was 'their thing', Wall St., big bucks, yada yada yada, etc BS. So price has been dominated by trader's sentiment towards ETF thinking since at least mid December .... meanwhile the physical market on the street in India, Japan, China, Asia, Brazil, S. America, UK Europe, USA, etc has been picking up some serious exponential growth steam, look at wallet adoption numbers, s/ware downloads, localbitcoins.com.
Just saying you guys might be missing the woods for the trees. Try not to get run over by the bitcoin moon train when scalping your trading card pennies up off the track ...
the question now is, can the market support these prices without this "ETF coming Soon TM" bullishness. i'm betting that it can't, and we in for a sizeable drop, probably Below 1000$.. i'm looking forward to a more reasonable 950 Well the worst is likely over, the big selloff was the bulk of it but there might be smaller dips later here and there. I'm betting we'll drop right back down again to 1000 once we poke around 1250 if we even get there or even lower. the sell off was the bets being placed. now we wait and see if the bets are winners. |
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Feels like a big disconnect between trader's "sentiment" and the external market here to me.
I think traders got overly focused (obsessed even) with the wtf ETF because it was 'their thing', Wall St., big bucks, yada yada yada, etc BS. So price has been dominated by trader's sentiment towards ETF thinking since at least mid December .... meanwhile the physical market on the street in India, Japan, China, Asia, Brazil, S. America, UK Europe, USA, etc has been picking up some serious exponential growth steam, look at wallet adoption numbers, s/ware downloads, localbitcoins.com.
Just saying you guys might be missing the woods for the trees. Try not to get run over by the bitcoin moon train when scalping your trading card pennies up off the track ...
the question now is, can the market support these prices without this "ETF coming Soon TM" bullishness. i'm betting that it can't, and we in for a sizeable drop, probably Below 1000$.. i'm looking forward to a more reasonable 950 |
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remarkable market is holding this price like a champ.
Price has absolutely no short term upside at all, so it feels like some whales who got stuck on the wrong side of the ETF trade are propping it up in order to then come in with the flash $4-5 million dump on finex and bitstamp while nobody is looking. I try to steer clear of " the manipulator is manipulating" speculation altho there is no doubt some of that going on... A lot of money was waiting on the sidelines looking to buy on the ETF approval. now that its not approved this money is content with "buying the dip" But I'm thinking the amount of BTC held back from selling because "the ETF is coming SOON TM" is a massive amount. there's a huge amount of profit taking to take place, can market really absorb that while pushing new highs, with "absolutely no short term upside at all". dip buyers: this dip buying is Cute, but dont expect a magical unicorn to buy it back up over 1350 once your done. |
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remarkable market is holding this price like a champ.
15jYgRVym33hQyHBXiq1sjFdQLgLaU4udZ lol i'll deal with you when the time comes. |
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remarkable market is holding this price like a champ.
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