I wasnt fooled. Surprised, yes, not fooled because I never claimed or thought I could predict the future of every company or everything in the universe. You see, I dont play on the lottery or try to predict the numbers. I do predict my neighbour will lose on his lottery investments, and I tend to get that right pretty much all the time. And yet, you could say I get surprised by every lottery drawing, but its ridiculous to say I get fooled by them just because I didnt predict them.

And anyone who "followed my recommendation/opinion" would still have all his coins in his wallet. If you bought AMhash or anything else listed in the OP, then you did not follow my recommendation. If that turns out badly, thats on you, not on me.

Where do I say its a scam? I have no idea what is going on at AM. And I sure as hell couldnt have predicted it anyhow.

But if you expect me to predict which established legitimate companies will turn in to scams in the future, Id sure love to hear what criteria you would apply.  Post them in your own thread, lets see how you do. Lets see if you correctly predict the next KnC, Avalon or possibly, AM.  I dont have that pretense, Il stick to predicting the next pbmining.

Whats the difference between scam rating and ponzi rating?

What you dont seem to understand is that Im quite sure about the sites labeled scam being scams , and that is the reason for this thread. What I cant know, nor pretend to know is what investments in companies that arent obvious scams will pan out or fail for whatever reasons. Thats where your own due diligence and risk assessment comes in, and blaming me for your failure at that is quite unfair.

Im also tired of hearing I promoted AM, when it got the same rating as Hashnest (am I promoting that too now?) and the same rating even as Cryptx which I had been arguing for months was a monumentally stupid investment. But all these companies did prove not being obvious ponzi's without hashrate, and were scored as such.

But the ONLY thing I ever promoted is keeping your coins in a cold wallet. I never promoted anything else. Had you actually listened to me, you wouldnt have lost a satoshi.

How would that not apply to AM? In fact, AM had been around and 'shipping miners all over the world' for quite a bit  longer than Bitmain.


Rockminers problem where well known, but its not rockminer that caused this. Its AM's vanishing act.
Who saw that coming? Did you ? There was no more reason to think this would happen to AM than there is reason now to think the same will happen to Bitmain, Bitfury, SPtech or anyone else. Thats what the disclaimer is for, I dont pretend to be able to predict stuff like that,  but if you expect me to predict meteorite crashes, lottery numbers or entire warehouses being stolen or CEO's vanishing/ being kidnapped / whatever, my crystal ball isnt that good.


BTW,

Your own posting history shows that while you had doubts and asked the right questions, you were far from certain if PBmining, Hashie and many of the other oh so obvious scams where at all scams.

So you knew hashie, pbmining etc where ponzi's all along? Good on you, but let me tell you precious few people believed me at the time. And its those people I tried reaching with this 101.

As for nobody doubting hashnest, tell me, how is it more legit than amhash was?

As for this:


I hereby give permission to the mods to publish any and all PMs between me and amhash. The only thing I ever discussed with them was prior to hashie's collapse, how they could guarantee the hashrate purchased through hashie, since I knew hashie was a scam and would run off. Thats it.

My list is no substitute for your own due diligence and risk analysis, nor did I ever claim it was. You should have tried reading the disclaimer:


Amhash did provide the reasonable evidence and the score I gave was fully warranted based on the criteria as I defined them. If you interpreted that somehow as meaning zero risk, you have yourself to blame for that. I couldnt have foreseen what happened any more than I could have foreseen a meteorite striking their building.

But I will say this: I offered to take bets on each of the 6-7 point scams that they would scam their customers, and each of the 0-1 points that they would not. Had anyone taken me up on those bets, I would so far have won 20 out of 21 bets.  Who's got a better average?

What could I be wrong about exactly? 
If you fed me false information, then its not likely Im the one who has to apologize for that.
If amhash resurfaces, then you and your customers will get lucky, but I wouldnt have been wrong in warning them and its up to them to gauge those odds.  Panic selling could have been avoided if you had disclosed the information and suspended trading for a while to allow investors to catch up. You flatly refused to do either, so thats not on me.


You dont feel they deserve to know that you no longer control what you sold to them ? Do you think AMhash should not have told their customers what was going on either?


On the contrary. Ive kept this private for long enough now. The moment AMhash collapsed I told you you should inform your customers of the impact on your business. When you refused I felt obligated to come forward, and Id feel disgusted not telling and allowing you to run a fractional reserve/ponzi scheme.

This is what you wrote to me:

So basically we are buying GH/s for 0.0012 and offering them at kryptologika making profits on the price difference and maintenance difference.
At the moment we have 4180.00 GH/s on hashie.co 
to verify that you have to enter my e-mail address here:
http://amhash.com/hashie/index.php
my address is *****
[..]
The remaining 382GH/s is still on hashnest as I was not able to sell all the GH/s there.

Given that AMhash is currently gone, Ill let your customers decide if losing >90% of your hashrate required any communication or how they think you can make profit from such a loss and at who's expense that would be.

No, I refused to base my assessment on non-public information that I was asked to keep secret. You should have let everyone check your hashrates, not just me,  then Id gladly have checked it and anyone could have double checked it. Not disclosing this information publicly would mean my assessment would require people to trust me, which is not much help, thats why I told you: make it public or I will ignore it.


'has used" is past tense. You told me a few months ago your hashrate came from AMhash. Are you denying this? If you have other sources, I strongly suggest you make the evidence public. Otherwise people would be wise to assume you dont have any atm.


Right. Nothing happened to AM, your hashrate provider...

Since l3sny doesnt deem it necessary to inform its customers (if any), I feel I should.

kryptologika is/was basically a AMhash passthrough operation that took a margin on top off AMhash prices and added some (IMO quite pointless) token amount of silver in the mix.

The issue of course, is that AMhash is in limbo, with their hardware allegedly stolen and friedcat missing in action. That means kryptologika doesnt have any hashrate backing its contracts either, whatever its paying in dividends doesnt come from mining right now and kryptologika is essentially running as a fractional reserve/ponzi scheme.

Id have much preferred if l3sny had chosen to inform you of this, along with presenting his recovery plans  (if any) and temporarily suspending trade to allow Q&A, but since he refused, you'll have to hear it from me.

Have you done the math? 1oz of silver is like $15.
Whether its bullshit or not, that never made any sense. Its like saying my house is "backed by gold", its got a gold plated chandelier somewhere.


Hashie at one point resold AMhash hashrate. I also considered AMhash "legit", even though I had always said hashie was a scam operation, and their previous 'gen 1' and later 'firecrackers' or whatever imagined mining products, where clearly non existent. They just used reselling of amhash to confuse customers and gain appearance of legitimacy. Worked well too.

When hashie collapsed, amhash did back their hashrate sold through hashie,  at least until this whole friedcat disappearing act hit and no on knows what to think.

FWIWI dont think AMhash set out to scam; I do think they made a huge mistake by not disclosing this earlier,  but I still believe they had honest intentions, but they were completely dependent on AM. Whatever happened at AM, I also do not believe it was a run of the mill heist, it makes no sense if you think about it, AM has already paid out many times more in dividends to investors then it ever collected, it has delivered on all its hardware sales afaik, and it could have stolen so much more if they had wanted to, by selling the widely anticipated BE300 chips and hashrate. I can only guess, but something like an escalated internal conflict between FC and the general manager resulted in the company breaking apart, perhaps with both people taking a crucial element (bitcoin wallet, asic design) and creating some sort of Mexican standoff.  Whatever the truth, its probably better than most fiction.

Whatever happened, AM wasnt a ponzi. They already paid out ~6x more to investors than they collected from them. Thats by definition completely impossible for a ponzi and a very rare, if not unique occurrence in the whole of bitcoin history. Try naming two other companies that even paid out 100% of their IPO in divs, let alone ~600%.

Now its possible its a legit operation that turned in to a scam, but many things dont make much sense to me if that were the case. To name just one, AM could have collected a shitload more money by pretending to have finished BE3000 which everyone was expecting, and collecting sales and cloudmining sales based on that.

Downgraded Kryptologika to ponzi. Its a 'secret' passthrough of AMhash but the owner deems it unnecessary to tell this to his investors, even now that Amhash is pretty much gone.

Kryptologika may continue to pay out, but currently there is nothing backing the hashrate and the owner IMO is acting in bad faith, so I have to rate it a ponzi.

Yeah, but you dont necessarily get to keep it. Google clawback laws, then reread the SEC subpoena.

Havelock isnt a regulated exchange, they do not comply with security laws that exist in almost every country. Laws designed to prevent these kinds of things from happening, but laws which also make it all but impossible for small crypto startups to be listed on an exchange and for anonymous unsophisticated investors like yourself, to invest in them.

If you are not happy with that, you shouldnt have used havelock. I dont think they claim to perform a thorough due diligence thats even remotely comparable to a, say, NYSE IPO. And whatever due diligence they may do or you might reasonably expect them to do, would have cleared asicminer

Ive never recommended anyone to use HL for the above and countless other reasons, but I also dont think they are to be blamed for this fiasco.

Bwahahaha. 1/10 for understanding how bitcoin works. Next fantasy story: to guarantee the privacy of their customers, CMW isnt even publishing their mined blocks on the blockchain!

Man its taking a long time for the price to crash to where it belongs.


Like a slow motion trainwreck

LOL, they expect anyone to believe they have the money to acquire mines, acquire, fix and resurrect a bankrupt exchange, but not to pay out their customers?

In the not so distant past it had a mine, offices, employees and a CEO.