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Author Topic: [ANN] Sia - Decentralized Storage  (Read 1345543 times)
DanTheHam
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November 26, 2017, 11:48:03 PM
 #6621

I gave up mining SIA a while back (and switched to a non storage based coin) simply because, I don't see a future for it. I can't see any large company wanting to go through the hassle (and risks) of exchanging cash for SIA then using it to buy storage. Currency fluctuations can have big effects on profitability (Lots of UK businesses after Brexit have seen profits squeezed, or even wiped out after GBP took a dive) Why would a large company already at risk of currency fluctuations increase that risk by also getting involved with crypto markets, and with something as important / essential as storage?

With high speed networks, falling SSD prices (and increasing capacities) along with super reliable HDD's does SIA really have a large scale customer out there? Perhaps content creators could find a use for SIA as an alternative back up space - but the likes of a large multinational with huge storage requirements would probably already have their own facilities in place. Honestly, I don't see enough small scale users to make up the difference.

So, that's why I got out - I don't think the demand will ever match the supply. I think it's important to have faith in any project you're investing in (whether it's buying coins or using resources to mine them, it all counts as an investment!) - I have a great deal of respect for all those who do believe that there's a future for SIA - perhaps you can see something I can't... (or maybe you are just smarter than me!) - however, for me - I think there are better options out there.
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MR,bon
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November 27, 2017, 12:57:04 AM
 #6622

it looks like the siacoin is moving like a statue using batteries. we will not feel the pleasure of life.
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November 27, 2017, 01:02:58 AM
 #6623

I gave up mining SIA a while back (and switched to a non storage based coin) simply because, I don't see a future for it. I can't see any large company wanting to go through the hassle (and risks) of exchanging cash for SIA then using it to buy storage. Currency fluctuations can have big effects on profitability (Lots of UK businesses after Brexit have seen profits squeezed, or even wiped out after GBP took a dive) Why would a large company already at risk of currency fluctuations increase that risk by also getting involved with crypto markets, and with something as important / essential as storage?

With high speed networks, falling SSD prices (and increasing capacities) along with super reliable HDD's does SIA really have a large scale customer out there? Perhaps content creators could find a use for SIA as an alternative back up space - but the likes of a large multinational with huge storage requirements would probably already have their own facilities in place. Honestly, I don't see enough small scale users to make up the difference.

So, that's why I got out - I don't think the demand will ever match the supply. I think it's important to have faith in any project you're investing in (whether it's buying coins or using resources to mine them, it all counts as an investment!) - I have a great deal of respect for all those who do believe that there's a future for SIA - perhaps you can see something I can't... (or maybe you are just smarter than me!) - however, for me - I think there are better options out there.

Price volatility can easily be controlled by matching crypto to fiat at the time of sale. The main problem is the initial acquisition, and holding the crypto in a wallet. If there was an option to just pay with a credit card, that the billing system automatically converts to crypto for the sake of the platform it would be pretty viable. I'm not sure how Sia addresses these concerns, but they're certainly not insurmountable. Also, if Sia has time stamping, the potential goes far beyond storage and into proof of ownership and time certification. Hoping the Sia admins can fill in the gaps.

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mycotoxin
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November 27, 2017, 01:41:26 AM
Last edit: November 27, 2017, 02:56:02 AM by mycotoxin
 #6624

I gave up mining SIA a while back (and switched to a non storage based coin) simply because, I don't see a future for it. I can't see any large company wanting to go through the hassle (and risks) of exchanging cash for SIA then using it to buy storage. Currency fluctuations can have big effects on profitability (Lots of UK businesses after Brexit have seen profits squeezed, or even wiped out after GBP took a dive) Why would a large company already at risk of currency fluctuations increase that risk by also getting involved with crypto markets, and with something as important / essential as storage?

With high speed networks, falling SSD prices (and increasing capacities) along with super reliable HDD's does SIA really have a large scale customer out there? Perhaps content creators could find a use for SIA as an alternative back up space - but the likes of a large multinational with huge storage requirements would probably already have their own facilities in place. Honestly, I don't see enough small scale users to make up the difference.

So, that's why I got out - I don't think the demand will ever match the supply. I think it's important to have faith in any project you're investing in (whether it's buying coins or using resources to mine them, it all counts as an investment!) - I have a great deal of respect for all those who do believe that there's a future for SIA - perhaps you can see something I can't... (or maybe you are just smarter than me!) - however, for me - I think there are better options out there.


Soooooo wrong . Ive worked for two of the biggest storage manufacturers of storage in Silicon Valley and in the world. I'm not talking Terrabytes  of data  we are talking arrays which hold multi Exabytes of data, hosted in data centers the size of football fields. Every major company, business, hospital, stock market exchange  in the world is on these arrays. When an array goes down its in the news as it impacts something huge and the downtime can  affect the  stock price of a company.

Now think about this,  for every petabyte of data there has to be a backup of this petabyte of data , (government regulations dictate backups go back 7 years) , and to avoid a single point of failure this data has to be replicated to multiple branch locations throughout the world. Where do you think the XRAYS hospitals use are stored ? Do you really think the movie studios are storing  movie  data  on a bunch of hard drives ? Nope, they are on multi-million dollar intelligent arrays the size of fridges  which  manage the data and its spread across  several global locations.

One of the biggest challenges is how do you preserve this data,  how do you provide cooling , the cost of electricity, security, product failures, data redundancy, real time replication, data deduplication, ete etc . These are issues which  the major storage companies and  enterprises  struggle with .
SIACOIN solves a majority of  these problems and is going to huge.

I have  675 TB  of data I manage at home,  which means I need to keep another 675TB of space  for backups and another 675TB in case the main backup fails.
You can imagine my electricity bill,  its  up there and I try to offset it with solar panels and 20 x  12volt (256 Amp Hrs) solar batteries which run these NAS devices when the Sun goes down and  the panels no longer supply energy.

In summer time these NAS boxes require  a lot of cooling and im also mindful  of what happens to the data if there's one of these California  earthquakes . This is where SIACOIN comes in as I will  archive the data to the SIACOIN network, and now  I  only need to keep 675TB of live data and my cooling and  power requirement issues are now resolved - As a plus  I also get to pocket a lot in savings. Another added benefit is its decentralized so I no longer need to worry about security ( As you need the wallet key and seed to get to the data ). Plus its decentralized so there's no need to worry about  a single point of failure - And Even if SIACOIN  team folds and gives up the project  the network still  lives on .
 
Think again @DanTheHam  in the future I see SIACOIN on phones, in cars, watches etc ... this revolutionary and is going to be huge !



Hakkane
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November 27, 2017, 01:49:13 AM
 #6625

I gave up mining SIA a while back (and switched to a non storage based coin) simply because, I don't see a future for it. I can't see any large company wanting to go through the hassle (and risks) of exchanging cash for SIA then using it to buy storage. Currency fluctuations can have big effects on profitability (Lots of UK businesses after Brexit have seen profits squeezed, or even wiped out after GBP took a dive) Why would a large company already at risk of currency fluctuations increase that risk by also getting involved with crypto markets, and with something as important / essential as storage?

With high speed networks, falling SSD prices (and increasing capacities) along with super reliable HDD's does SIA really have a large scale customer out there? Perhaps content creators could find a use for SIA as an alternative back up space - but the likes of a large multinational with huge storage requirements would probably already have their own facilities in place. Honestly, I don't see enough small scale users to make up the difference.

So, that's why I got out - I don't think the demand will ever match the supply. I think it's important to have faith in any project you're investing in (whether it's buying coins or using resources to mine them, it all counts as an investment!) - I have a great deal of respect for all those who do believe that there's a future for SIA - perhaps you can see something I can't... (or maybe you are just smarter than me!) - however, for me - I think there are better options out there.

I think you are missing some points here.

  • The storage pricing does not correlate with the value of the coin: hosts select their own pricing and they adjust it to fixed dollar values. For example, during the price rally of May-June, even if the coin went up 50x, the storage pricing remained under $2/TB/month. Currently the price is $1/TB/month (https://siastats.info/storage_pricing.html). If a company buys Sia on the go instead of provisioning a large amount for the following years, they will be paying the same amount in fiat all the time
  • Final users are not the target of Sia. The goal is that storage providers (new ones or current ones that embrace Sia) use Sia as their storage layer. That way, they can offer storage plans paid by fixed fiat rates, while they do all the Sia conversion behind the scenes. Siacdn.com for instance uses this model
  • The pricing is the biggest reason to adopt Sia. Currently Sia storage is $1/TB/month. AmazonS3 is $23/Tb/month. Bandwidth costs are 100x cheaper in Sia. No traditional storage provider can compete with that, because they want to make huge profits with the overhead costs (small wonder AWS ahs those figures of benefits), while in a storage marketplace like Sia, hosts compete for cheaper rates, having very small margins (while still profitable). Big companies paying thousands of dollars per month in storage can greatly reduce their bills with Sia once is ready for the prime time.
  • Traditional storage solutions do not include native encryption and decentralization. No government can shut-down your data in Sia. No storage company can spy your data in Sia because it is decentralized and no individual host has access to enough data to reconstruct the files
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November 27, 2017, 03:17:05 AM
 #6626

I gave up mining SIA a while back (and switched to a non storage based coin) simply because, I don't see a future for it. I can't see any large company wanting to go through the hassle (and risks) of exchanging cash for SIA then using it to buy storage. Currency fluctuations can have big effects on profitability (Lots of UK businesses after Brexit have seen profits squeezed, or even wiped out after GBP took a dive) Why would a large company already at risk of currency fluctuations increase that risk by also getting involved with crypto markets, and with something as important / essential as storage?

With high speed networks, falling SSD prices (and increasing capacities) along with super reliable HDD's does SIA really have a large scale customer out there? Perhaps content creators could find a use for SIA as an alternative back up space - but the likes of a large multinational with huge storage requirements would probably already have their own facilities in place. Honestly, I don't see enough small scale users to make up the difference.

So, that's why I got out - I don't think the demand will ever match the supply. I think it's important to have faith in any project you're investing in (whether it's buying coins or using resources to mine them, it all counts as an investment!) - I have a great deal of respect for all those who do believe that there's a future for SIA - perhaps you can see something I can't... (or maybe you are just smarter than me!) - however, for me - I think there are better options out there.


Soooooo wrong . Ive worked for two of the biggest storage manufacturers of storage in Silicon Valley and in the world. I'm not talking Terrabytes  of data  we are talking arrays which hold multi Exabytes of data, hosted in data centers the size of football fields. Every major company, business, hospital, stock market exchange  in the world is on these arrays. When an array goes down its in the news as it impacts something huge and the downtime can  affect the  stock price of a company.

Now think about this,  for every petabyte of data there has to be a backup of this petabyte of data , (government regulations dictate backups go back 7 years) , and to avoid a single point of failure this data has to be replicated to multiple branch locations throughout the world. Where do you think the XRAYS hospitals use are stored ? Do you really think the movie studios are storing  movie  data  on a bunch of hard drives ? Nope, they are on multi-million dollar intelligent arrays the size of fridges  which  manage the data and its spread across  several global locations.

One of the biggest challenges is how do you preserve this data,  how do you provide cooling , the cost of electricity, security, product failures, data redundancy, real time replication, data deduplication, ete etc . These are issues which  the major storage companies and  enterprises  struggle with .
SIACOIN solves a majority of  these problems and is going to huge.

I have  675 TB  of data I manage at home,  which means I need to keep another 675TB of space  for backups and another 675TB in case the main backup fails.
You can imagine my electricity bill,  its  up there and I try to offset it with solar panels and 20 x  12volt (256 Amp Hrs) solar batteries which run these NAS devices when the Sun goes down and  the panels no longer supply energy.

In summer time these NAS boxes require  a lot of cooling and im also mindful  of what happens to the data if there's one of these California  earthquakes . This is where SIACOIN comes in as I will  archive the data to the SIACOIN network, and now  I  only need to keep 675TB of live data and my cooling and  power requirement issues are now resolved - As a plus  I also get to pocket a lot in savings. Another added benefit is its decentralized so I no longer need to worry about security ( As you need the wallet key and seed to get to the data ). Plus its decentralized so there's no need to worry about  a single point of failure - And Even if SIACOIN  team folds and gives up the project  the network still  lives on .
 
Think again @DanTheHam  in the future I see SIACOIN on phones, in cars, watches etc ... this revolutionary and is going to be huge !





Another wonderful thing is no matter how much Dropbox, Amzon, Microsoft, Box etc  try they can never complete with SIACOIN in the storage space. This is because there's no storage,  cooling, security, power  etc.. etc requirements for SIACOIN its all taken care of in their distribution model.  There's never overhead as its decentralized. If  Drobox, Microsoft, Box etc attempt to compete with SIACOIN they can never ever win as they have various  financial overhead they can never  avoid - you gotta love it .   These are some smart Devs over at SIA -  So SIACOIN will always undercut them in prices and will always be more secure .
Where do you think these enterprises are going to turn to cut costs and  up their stock valuation ? .. SIACOIN network gives them this option
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November 27, 2017, 03:45:01 AM
 #6627

price just went up 20% in just few hour.. lets go 100 sat and we are back in the top 50 coinmarket cap



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diogoo
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November 27, 2017, 03:53:40 AM
 #6628

I see more than 100 satoshi soon Smiley
inspiredinvestor
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November 27, 2017, 04:01:56 AM
 #6629

I gave up mining SIA a while back (and switched to a non storage based coin) simply because, I don't see a future for it. I can't see any large company wanting to go through the hassle (and risks) of exchanging cash for SIA then using it to buy storage. Currency fluctuations can have big effects on profitability (Lots of UK businesses after Brexit have seen profits squeezed, or even wiped out after GBP took a dive) Why would a large company already at risk of currency fluctuations increase that risk by also getting involved with crypto markets, and with something as important / essential as storage?

With high speed networks, falling SSD prices (and increasing capacities) along with super reliable HDD's does SIA really have a large scale customer out there? Perhaps content creators could find a use for SIA as an alternative back up space - but the likes of a large multinational with huge storage requirements would probably already have their own facilities in place. Honestly, I don't see enough small scale users to make up the difference.

So, that's why I got out - I don't think the demand will ever match the supply. I think it's important to have faith in any project you're investing in (whether it's buying coins or using resources to mine them, it all counts as an investment!) - I have a great deal of respect for all those who do believe that there's a future for SIA - perhaps you can see something I can't... (or maybe you are just smarter than me!) - however, for me - I think there are better options out there.


Soooooo wrong . Ive worked for two of the biggest storage manufacturers of storage in Silicon Valley and in the world. I'm not talking Terrabytes  of data  we are talking arrays which hold multi Exabytes of data, hosted in data centers the size of football fields. Every major company, business, hospital, stock market exchange  in the world is on these arrays. When an array goes down its in the news as it impacts something huge and the downtime can  affect the  stock price of a company.

Now think about this,  for every petabyte of data there has to be a backup of this petabyte of data , (government regulations dictate backups go back 7 years) , and to avoid a single point of failure this data has to be replicated to multiple branch locations throughout the world. Where do you think the XRAYS hospitals use are stored ? Do you really think the movie studios are storing  movie  data  on a bunch of hard drives ? Nope, they are on multi-million dollar intelligent arrays the size of fridges  which  manage the data and its spread across  several global locations.

One of the biggest challenges is how do you preserve this data,  how do you provide cooling , the cost of electricity, security, product failures, data redundancy, real time replication, data deduplication, ete etc . These are issues which  the major storage companies and  enterprises  struggle with .
SIACOIN solves a majority of  these problems and is going to huge.

I have  675 TB  of data I manage at home,  which means I need to keep another 675TB of space  for backups and another 675TB in case the main backup fails.
You can imagine my electricity bill,  its  up there and I try to offset it with solar panels and 20 x  12volt (256 Amp Hrs) solar batteries which run these NAS devices when the Sun goes down and  the panels no longer supply energy.

In summer time these NAS boxes require  a lot of cooling and im also mindful  of what happens to the data if there's one of these California  earthquakes . This is where SIACOIN comes in as I will  archive the data to the SIACOIN network, and now  I  only need to keep 675TB of live data and my cooling and  power requirement issues are now resolved - As a plus  I also get to pocket a lot in savings. Another added benefit is its decentralized so I no longer need to worry about security ( As you need the wallet key and seed to get to the data ). Plus its decentralized so there's no need to worry about  a single point of failure - And Even if SIACOIN  team folds and gives up the project  the network still  lives on .
 
Think again @DanTheHam  in the future I see SIACOIN on phones, in cars, watches etc ... this revolutionary and is going to be huge !





Another wonderful thing is no matter how much Dropbox, Amzon, Microsoft, Box etc  try they can never complete with SIACOIN in the storage space. This is because there's no storage,  cooling, security, power  etc.. etc requirements for SIACOIN its all taken care of in their distribution model.  There's never overhead as its decentralized. If  Drobox, Microsoft, Box etc attempt to compete with SIACOIN they can never ever win as they have various  financial overhead they can never  avoid - you gotta love it .   These are some smart Devs over at SIA -  So SIACOIN will always undercut them in prices and will always be more secure .
Where do you think these enterprises are going to turn to cut costs and  up their stock valuation ? .. SIACOIN network gives them this option


I do not agree with your analysis in the previous post. Please take a neutral analysis for both Sia (de-centralised) and others (centralised, including Dropbox, Amazon, etc.). You can see that all of them need hardwares, by which I mean real high-perfomanced devices for their storage services. Those services all need power, cooling systems, etc. which put the Earth under extremely high pressure about environmental pollution, generally. The only thing Sia project is better than those others is it use de-centralized devices, and you can restore your data easier. That's it.

regarding storage and siacoin. how is the data storage security is it uniformly encrypted on each devices? where can I learn more about this as I would be keen to use it for additional phone storage. Smiley


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November 27, 2017, 04:39:04 AM
Last edit: November 27, 2017, 05:36:21 AM by mycotoxin
 #6630

I gave up mining SIA a while back (and switched to a non storage based coin) simply because, I don't see a future for it. I can't see any large company wanting to go through the hassle (and risks) of exchanging cash for SIA then using it to buy storage. Currency fluctuations can have big effects on profitability (Lots of UK businesses after Brexit have seen profits squeezed, or even wiped out after GBP took a dive) Why would a large company already at risk of currency fluctuations increase that risk by also getting involved with crypto markets, and with something as important / essential as storage?

With high speed networks, falling SSD prices (and increasing capacities) along with super reliable HDD's does SIA really have a large scale customer out there? Perhaps content creators could find a use for SIA as an alternative back up space - but the likes of a large multinational with huge storage requirements would probably already have their own facilities in place. Honestly, I don't see enough small scale users to make up the difference.

So, that's why I got out - I don't think the demand will ever match the supply. I think it's important to have faith in any project you're investing in (whether it's buying coins or using resources to mine them, it all counts as an investment!) - I have a great deal of respect for all those who do believe that there's a future for SIA - perhaps you can see something I can't... (or maybe you are just smarter than me!) - however, for me - I think there are better options out there.


Soooooo wrong . Ive worked for two of the biggest storage manufacturers of storage in Silicon Valley and in the world. I'm not talking Terrabytes  of data  we are talking arrays which hold multi Exabytes of data, hosted in data centers the size of football fields. Every major company, business, hospital, stock market exchange  in the world is on these arrays. When an array goes down its in the news as it impacts something huge and the downtime can  affect the  stock price of a company.

Now think about this,  for every petabyte of data there has to be a backup of this petabyte of data , (government regulations dictate backups go back 7 years) , and to avoid a single point of failure this data has to be replicated to multiple branch locations throughout the world. Where do you think the XRAYS hospitals use are stored ? Do you really think the movie studios are storing  movie  data  on a bunch of hard drives ? Nope, they are on multi-million dollar intelligent arrays the size of fridges  which  manage the data and its spread across  several global locations.

One of the biggest challenges is how do you preserve this data,  how do you provide cooling , the cost of electricity, security, product failures, data redundancy, real time replication, data deduplication, ete etc . These are issues which  the major storage companies and  enterprises  struggle with .
SIACOIN solves a majority of  these problems and is going to huge.

I have  675 TB  of data I manage at home,  which means I need to keep another 675TB of space  for backups and another 675TB in case the main backup fails.
You can imagine my electricity bill,  its  up there and I try to offset it with solar panels and 20 x  12volt (256 Amp Hrs) solar batteries which run these NAS devices when the Sun goes down and  the panels no longer supply energy.

In summer time these NAS boxes require  a lot of cooling and im also mindful  of what happens to the data if there's one of these California  earthquakes . This is where SIACOIN comes in as I will  archive the data to the SIACOIN network, and now  I  only need to keep 675TB of live data and my cooling and  power requirement issues are now resolved - As a plus  I also get to pocket a lot in savings. Another added benefit is its decentralized so I no longer need to worry about security ( As you need the wallet key and seed to get to the data ). Plus its decentralized so there's no need to worry about  a single point of failure - And Even if SIACOIN  team folds and gives up the project  the network still  lives on .
 
Think again @DanTheHam  in the future I see SIACOIN on phones, in cars, watches etc ... this revolutionary and is going to be huge !





Another wonderful thing is no matter how much Dropbox, Amzon, Microsoft, Box etc  try they can never complete with SIACOIN in the storage space. This is because there's no storage,  cooling, security, power  etc.. etc requirements for SIACOIN its all taken care of in their distribution model.  There's never overhead as its decentralized. If  Drobox, Microsoft, Box etc attempt to compete with SIACOIN they can never ever win as they have various  financial overhead they can never  avoid - you gotta love it .   These are some smart Devs over at SIA -  So SIACOIN will always undercut them in prices and will always be more secure .
Where do you think these enterprises are going to turn to cut costs and  up their stock valuation ? .. SIACOIN network gives them this option


I do not agree with your analysis in the previous post. Please take a neutral analysis for both Sia (de-centralised) and others (centralised, including Dropbox, Amazon, etc.). You can see that all of them need hardwares, by which I mean real high-perfomanced devices for their storage services. Those services all need power, cooling systems, etc. which put the Earth under extremely high pressure about environmental pollution, generally. The only thing Sia project is better than those others is it use de-centralized devices, and you can restore your data easier. That's it.

regarding storage and siacoin. how is the data storage security is it uniformly encrypted on each devices? where can I learn more about this as I would be keen to use it for additional phone storage. Smiley



in a traditional storage model i.e  raid volume the data is spread across several disks for speed, redundancy etc. For example in a raid5 data is spread across five disks inclusing the parity data so you can lose one disk and still recover the data  - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_RAID_levels#RAID_5

With a raid 6 you add a second parity stripe ( or some manufacturers use a  dedicated parity  disk ) so you can have a two disk failure. This also mean that if one day someone walks off with one disk from your data center they only have 1/5 of your data and its useless as its only  partial block data which makes it unreadable . SIACOIN extends this model but unlike hard disks in one data-center  the data is spread across  multiple computers across the internet and you do not know the ID of those computers. So even if someone hacks into one of those computers  they only get partial data which is unreadable and not usable as the block data is garbage. Throw encryption on top of that for  added security  and  a block-chain wallet key and you have  very highly secured data.  Which of the current storage provider models can beat this model or offer better security ? Pray do tell me
 - The beauty of the SIACOIN model is its very simple  and yet very highly effective and  very affordable as the overhead requirements are stripped.
What do you think the developing world will be using ?  
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November 27, 2017, 05:20:39 AM
 #6631

I don't mine it since I get X10 slower rates than others and my chances of getting a block is too small in solo mining, and even if there was a pool why should I mine when others get much higher hashrates?
The price would also be evaluated by the mining profitability, meaning , less miners lower hashrate lower price.. everything is connected.
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November 27, 2017, 05:25:21 AM
 #6632

See Sia founder David V. talk about ASICs with Decred and gives a nice intro into how Sia was formed:

http://video.genyoutube.net/8TPFIVYy_i4  
Well nice video and talk, do hope they can release more video and interact more with us
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November 27, 2017, 06:21:49 AM
 #6633

Lot's of great discussion and healthy debate which is great to see - along with many strong believers in the project. Of course I wish you all the best of luck with your endeavours. However, I am still not convinced; I could see Google, Microsoft and Amazon all very quickly jumping on the bandwagon of massive decentralised storage at the slightest glimmer of some $$$'s to be made. With their already huge user base and accounts system already in place I don't think it would take too much for them to integrate something (especially with multi-billion dollar budgets at their disposal) into what they already have. Also, as they all offer paid for services, payment in fiat currency would be possible, or if they were to launch their own storage coin, there would already be an entire ecosystem in place for spending it.

I'll apologise for the gloomy negative post again - but I always try to be super critical when putting my cash (along with modest mining resources) into a project. For me, the risk:reward is just not quite there.

From trading forex I'll tell you a little something my mentor taught me - "The markets will always be there tomorrow" - SIA is not a once in a lifetime opportunity, there will be many more chances to jump in later - and if that's the case, I'll be more than happy to come back and eat a huge slice of humble pie with you guys!

Best of luck folks...
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November 27, 2017, 08:45:59 AM
Last edit: November 27, 2017, 09:15:20 AM by Lionel
 #6634

Unlike you, i think you should focus more on end-users and not large companies , because the latter ones need to give responsibility to someone if technical failures happen.
They want to know who to blame if their stock price drops due to storage failures.

If they use Siacoin they can't blame anyone, and i guess they are willing to pay extra money to be protected or refunded when disasters happen.

-----------

Another aspect: hotlinking

Gdrive, dropbox etc. all offer hotlinking built-in, but with Sia such an extra feature becomes costly in terms of bandwith, because you should set up a single node who accepts HTTP requests and downloads the requested file from Sia under the hood and sends it back to the user.
But that means that all traffic is going through that single server, so the required bandwidth would be the same as if the server had the requested file on its local drive, .. no actually more that that, because the server needs to download the file from Sia as well, so that's extra bandwidth consumption.

How can you address this?
Well this hotlinking issue it's not a crucial aspect given that the price per TB is very cheap on Sia , but it's still a missing feature compared to traditional services

EDIT: i noticed that Sia can be integrated with Minio, which is like a layer on top of Sia to provide hotlinking right?
But i guess it doesn't address the extra bandwith issue i was talking about
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November 27, 2017, 10:07:05 AM
 #6635

I gave up mining SIA a while back (and switched to a non storage based coin) simply because, I don't see a future for it. I can't see any large company wanting to go through the hassle (and risks) of exchanging cash for SIA then using it to buy storage. Currency fluctuations can have big effects on profitability (Lots of UK businesses after Brexit have seen profits squeezed, or even wiped out after GBP took a dive) Why would a large company already at risk of currency fluctuations increase that risk by also getting involved with crypto markets, and with something as important / essential as storage?

With high speed networks, falling SSD prices (and increasing capacities) along with super reliable HDD's does SIA really have a large scale customer out there? Perhaps content creators could find a use for SIA as an alternative back up space - but the likes of a large multinational with huge storage requirements would probably already have their own facilities in place. Honestly, I don't see enough small scale users to make up the difference.

So, that's why I got out - I don't think the demand will ever match the supply. I think it's important to have faith in any project you're investing in (whether it's buying coins or using resources to mine them, it all counts as an investment!) - I have a great deal of respect for all those who do believe that there's a future for SIA - perhaps you can see something I can't... (or maybe you are just smarter than me!) - however, for me - I think there are better options out there.


Soooooo wrong . Ive worked for two of the biggest storage manufacturers of storage in Silicon Valley and in the world. I'm not talking Terrabytes  of data  we are talking arrays which hold multi Exabytes of data, hosted in data centers the size of football fields. Every major company, business, hospital, stock market exchange  in the world is on these arrays. When an array goes down its in the news as it impacts something huge and the downtime can  affect the  stock price of a company.

Now think about this,  for every petabyte of data there has to be a backup of this petabyte of data , (government regulations dictate backups go back 7 years) , and to avoid a single point of failure this data has to be replicated to multiple branch locations throughout the world. Where do you think the XRAYS hospitals use are stored ? Do you really think the movie studios are storing  movie  data  on a bunch of hard drives ? Nope, they are on multi-million dollar intelligent arrays the size of fridges  which  manage the data and its spread across  several global locations.

One of the biggest challenges is how do you preserve this data,  how do you provide cooling , the cost of electricity, security, product failures, data redundancy, real time replication, data deduplication, ete etc . These are issues which  the major storage companies and  enterprises  struggle with .
SIACOIN solves a majority of  these problems and is going to huge.

I have  675 TB  of data I manage at home,  which means I need to keep another 675TB of space  for backups and another 675TB in case the main backup fails.
You can imagine my electricity bill,  its  up there and I try to offset it with solar panels and 20 x  12volt (256 Amp Hrs) solar batteries which run these NAS devices when the Sun goes down and  the panels no longer supply energy.

In summer time these NAS boxes require  a lot of cooling and im also mindful  of what happens to the data if there's one of these California  earthquakes . This is where SIACOIN comes in as I will  archive the data to the SIACOIN network, and now  I  only need to keep 675TB of live data and my cooling and  power requirement issues are now resolved - As a plus  I also get to pocket a lot in savings. Another added benefit is its decentralized so I no longer need to worry about security ( As you need the wallet key and seed to get to the data ). Plus its decentralized so there's no need to worry about  a single point of failure - And Even if SIACOIN  team folds and gives up the project  the network still  lives on .
 
Think again @DanTheHam  in the future I see SIACOIN on phones, in cars, watches etc ... this revolutionary and is going to be huge !





Another wonderful thing is no matter how much Dropbox, Amzon, Microsoft, Box etc  try they can never complete with SIACOIN in the storage space. This is because there's no storage,  cooling, security, power  etc.. etc requirements for SIACOIN its all taken care of in their distribution model.  There's never overhead as its decentralized. If  Drobox, Microsoft, Box etc attempt to compete with SIACOIN they can never ever win as they have various  financial overhead they can never  avoid - you gotta love it .   These are some smart Devs over at SIA -  So SIACOIN will always undercut them in prices and will always be more secure .
Where do you think these enterprises are going to turn to cut costs and  up their stock valuation ? .. SIACOIN network gives them this option


I do not agree with your analysis in the previous post. Please take a neutral analysis for both Sia (de-centralised) and others (centralised, including Dropbox, Amazon, etc.). You can see that all of them need hardwares, by which I mean real high-perfomanced devices for their storage services. Those services all need power, cooling systems, etc. which put the Earth under extremely high pressure about environmental pollution, generally. The only thing Sia project is better than those others is it use de-centralized devices, and you can restore your data easier. That's it.

regarding storage and siacoin. how is the data storage security is it uniformly encrypted on each devices? where can I learn more about this as I would be keen to use it for additional phone storage. Smiley



in a traditional storage model i.e  raid volume the data is spread across several disks for speed, redundancy etc. For example in a raid5 data is spread across five disks inclusing the parity data so you can lose one disk and still recover the data  - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_RAID_levels#RAID_5

With a raid 6 you add a second parity stripe ( or some manufacturers use a  dedicated parity  disk ) so you can have a two disk failure. This also mean that if one day someone walks off with one disk from your data center they only have 1/5 of your data and its useless as its only  partial block data which makes it unreadable . SIACOIN extends this model but unlike hard disks in one data-center  the data is spread across  multiple computers across the internet and you do not know the ID of those computers. So even if someone hacks into one of those computers  they only get partial data which is unreadable and not usable as the block data is garbage. Throw encryption on top of that for  added security  and  a block-chain wallet key and you have  very highly secured data.  Which of the current storage provider models can beat this model or offer better security ? Pray do tell me
 - The beauty of the SIACOIN model is its very simple  and yet very highly effective and  very affordable as the overhead requirements are stripped.
What do you think the developing world will be using ?  

thanks for the detailed response mycotoxin, one of the nice things about this approach, it even I wouldn't know where all the parts are it's like anonymous secure storage... truly decentralized i definitely think if the data age this is a key advantage.

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November 27, 2017, 02:41:35 PM
 #6636

I gave up mining SIA a while back (and switched to a non storage based coin) simply because, I don't see a future for it. I can't see any large company wanting to go through the hassle (and risks) of exchanging cash for SIA then using it to buy storage. Currency fluctuations can have big effects on profitability (Lots of UK businesses after Brexit have seen profits squeezed, or even wiped out after GBP took a dive) Why would a large company already at risk of currency fluctuations increase that risk by also getting involved with crypto markets, and with something as important / essential as storage?

With high speed networks, falling SSD prices (and increasing capacities) along with super reliable HDD's does SIA really have a large scale customer out there? Perhaps content creators could find a use for SIA as an alternative back up space - but the likes of a large multinational with huge storage requirements would probably already have their own facilities in place. Honestly, I don't see enough small scale users to make up the difference.

So, that's why I got out - I don't think the demand will ever match the supply. I think it's important to have faith in any project you're investing in (whether it's buying coins or using resources to mine them, it all counts as an investment!) - I have a great deal of respect for all those who do believe that there's a future for SIA - perhaps you can see something I can't... (or maybe you are just smarter than me!) - however, for me - I think there are better options out there.


Soooooo wrong . Ive worked for two of the biggest storage manufacturers of storage in Silicon Valley and in the world. I'm not talking Terrabytes  of data  we are talking arrays which hold multi Exabytes of data, hosted in data centers the size of football fields. Every major company, business, hospital, stock market exchange  in the world is on these arrays. When an array goes down its in the news as it impacts something huge and the downtime can  affect the  stock price of a company.

Now think about this,  for every petabyte of data there has to be a backup of this petabyte of data , (government regulations dictate backups go back 7 years) , and to avoid a single point of failure this data has to be replicated to multiple branch locations throughout the world. Where do you think the XRAYS hospitals use are stored ? Do you really think the movie studios are storing  movie  data  on a bunch of hard drives ? Nope, they are on multi-million dollar intelligent arrays the size of fridges  which  manage the data and its spread across  several global locations.

One of the biggest challenges is how do you preserve this data,  how do you provide cooling , the cost of electricity, security, product failures, data redundancy, real time replication, data deduplication, ete etc . These are issues which  the major storage companies and  enterprises  struggle with .
SIACOIN solves a majority of  these problems and is going to huge.

I have  675 TB  of data I manage at home,  which means I need to keep another 675TB of space  for backups and another 675TB in case the main backup fails.
You can imagine my electricity bill,  its  up there and I try to offset it with solar panels and 20 x  12volt (256 Amp Hrs) solar batteries which run these NAS devices when the Sun goes down and  the panels no longer supply energy.

In summer time these NAS boxes require  a lot of cooling and im also mindful  of what happens to the data if there's one of these California  earthquakes . This is where SIACOIN comes in as I will  archive the data to the SIACOIN network, and now  I  only need to keep 675TB of live data and my cooling and  power requirement issues are now resolved - As a plus  I also get to pocket a lot in savings. Another added benefit is its decentralized so I no longer need to worry about security ( As you need the wallet key and seed to get to the data ). Plus its decentralized so there's no need to worry about  a single point of failure - And Even if SIACOIN  team folds and gives up the project  the network still  lives on .
 
Think again @DanTheHam  in the future I see SIACOIN on phones, in cars, watches etc ... this revolutionary and is going to be huge !





Another wonderful thing is no matter how much Dropbox, Amzon, Microsoft, Box etc  try they can never complete with SIACOIN in the storage space. This is because there's no storage,  cooling, security, power  etc.. etc requirements for SIACOIN its all taken care of in their distribution model.  There's never overhead as its decentralized. If  Drobox, Microsoft, Box etc attempt to compete with SIACOIN they can never ever win as they have various  financial overhead they can never  avoid - you gotta love it .   These are some smart Devs over at SIA -  So SIACOIN will always undercut them in prices and will always be more secure .
Where do you think these enterprises are going to turn to cut costs and  up their stock valuation ? .. SIACOIN network gives them this option


I do not agree with your analysis in the previous post. Please take a neutral analysis for both Sia (de-centralised) and others (centralised, including Dropbox, Amazon, etc.). You can see that all of them need hardwares, by which I mean real high-perfomanced devices for their storage services. Those services all need power, cooling systems, etc. which put the Earth under extremely high pressure about environmental pollution, generally. The only thing Sia project is better than those others is it use de-centralized devices, and you can restore your data easier. That's it.

regarding storage and siacoin. how is the data storage security is it uniformly encrypted on each devices? where can I learn more about this as I would be keen to use it for additional phone storage. Smiley



in a traditional storage model i.e  raid volume the data is spread across several disks for speed, redundancy etc. For example in a raid5 data is spread across five disks inclusing the parity data so you can lose one disk and still recover the data  - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_RAID_levels#RAID_5

With a raid 6 you add a second parity stripe ( or some manufacturers use a  dedicated parity  disk ) so you can have a two disk failure. This also mean that if one day someone walks off with one disk from your data center they only have 1/5 of your data and its useless as its only  partial block data which makes it unreadable . SIACOIN extends this model but unlike hard disks in one data-center  the data is spread across  multiple computers across the internet and you do not know the ID of those computers. So even if someone hacks into one of those computers  they only get partial data which is unreadable and not usable as the block data is garbage. Throw encryption on top of that for  added security  and  a block-chain wallet key and you have  very highly secured data.  Which of the current storage provider models can beat this model or offer better security ? Pray do tell me
 - The beauty of the SIACOIN model is its very simple  and yet very highly effective and  very affordable as the overhead requirements are stripped.
What do you think the developing world will be using ?  

thanks for the detailed response mycotoxin, one of the nice things about this approach, it even I wouldn't know where all the parts are it's like anonymous secure storage... truly decentralized i definitely think if the data age this is a key advantage.

yes good analysis of the SIA storage benefits.I just want to go back
to the cooling point made by "mycotoxin", its a great analysis of the
advantage of SIA over centralised competitors.

Each little data centre operated by each storage provider on the SIA
network is responsible for their portion including cooling so instead of
trying to control climate in a 39,000sq ft centre at a cost of millions
i will be cooling my cpu as normal while i am browsing BCT

big game change

https://storageservers.wordpress.com/2013/07/17/facts-and-stats-of-worlds-largest-data-centers/
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November 27, 2017, 02:44:19 PM
 #6637

I haven't seen any change or any update from Siatech for 3 months. What does Dev team do? I 'm waiting for you. A big update or bIg event

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November 27, 2017, 02:54:35 PM
 #6638

Have a low buy order ready for Sia coins which is a very big btc project now so all alts take a beating
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November 27, 2017, 02:59:52 PM
 #6639

I haven't seen any change or any update from Siatech for 3 months. What does Dev team do? I 'm waiting for you. A big update or bIg event
After the announcement about Obelist and Sia-ASICs
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November 27, 2017, 04:09:37 PM
 #6640

I haven't seen any change or any update from Siatech for 3 months. What does Dev team do? I 'm waiting for you. A big update or bIg event

Check the github or join the discord channels.

next version early December.
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