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Author Topic: "Bitcoin is Dead" - Mike Hearn  (Read 17567 times)
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January 16, 2016, 01:07:01 PM
 #161

You guys are all fucked.
ofc btc is dead. No one is talking about bitcoin anymore.
It's all about the blockchain.
I been selling my btc and I suggest yall do the same.

OK, sell me some "blockchains" when you'll have them.

Can sell ya, but accept only the "altcoins".

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January 16, 2016, 02:55:46 PM
 #162

honestly,Mike was succesfull make all people worry about this situation,and nytimes also out when bitcoin have trouble,seems perfects. but as true bitcoiner,we dont have to worry or panic,as long we still believe in bitcoin.

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January 16, 2016, 03:02:56 PM
 #163

Well maybe you are right. But if the price drops to much there will be a counter speculation. You can kill everything with a newspaper Smiley

This is a real news. Only stupids may think that BTC is not manipulated and it's not "own" by few people. The facts are clear.

Mike Hearn just revealed what any common sense person known : ". Bitcoin has no future whilst it’s controlled by fewer than 10 people"
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January 16, 2016, 03:18:29 PM
 #164

The resolution of the Bitcoin experiment

I’ve spent more than 5 years being a Bitcoin developer. The software I’ve written has been used by millions of users, hundreds of developers, and the talks I’ve given have led directly to the creation of several startups. I’ve talked about Bitcoin on Sky TV and BBC News. I have been repeatedly cited by the Economist as a Bitcoin expert and prominent developer. I have explained Bitcoin to the SEC, to bankers and to ordinary people I met at cafes.

From the start, I’ve always said the same thing: Bitcoin is an experiment and like all experiments, it can fail. So don’t invest what you can’t afford to lose. I’ve said this in interviews, on stage at conferences, and over email. So have other well known developers like Gavin Andresen and Jeff Garzik.

But despite knowing that Bitcoin could fail all along, the now inescapable conclusion that it has failed still saddens me greatly. The fundamentals are broken and whatever happens to the price in the short term, the long term trend should probably be downwards. I will no longer be taking part in Bitcoin development and have sold all my coins.

Why has Bitcoin failed? It has failed because the community has failed. What was meant to be a new, decentralised form of money that lacked “systemically important institutions” and “too big to fail” has become something even worse: a system completely controlled by just a handful of people. Worse still, the network is on the brink of technical collapse. The mechanisms that should have prevented this outcome have broken down, and as a result there’s no longer much reason to think Bitcoin can actually be better than the existing financial system.

Think about it. If you had never heard about Bitcoin before, would you care about a payments network that:

    Couldn’t move your existing money
    Had wildly unpredictable fees that were high and rising fast
    Allowed buyers to take back payments they’d made after walking out of shops, by simply pressing a button (if you aren’t aware of this “feature” that’s because Bitcoin was only just changed to allow it)
    Is suffering large backlogs and flaky payments
    … which is controlled by China
    … and in which the companies and people building it were in open civil war?

I’m going to hazard a guess that the answer is no.
Deadlock on the blocks

In case you haven’t been keeping up with Bitcoin, here is how the network looks as of January 2016.

The block chain is full. You may wonder how it is possible for what is essentially a series of files to be “full”. The answer is that an entirely artificial capacity cap of one megabyte per block, put in place as a temporary kludge a long time ago, has not been removed and as a result the network’s capacity is now almost completely exhausted.

Here’s a graph of block sizes.

The peak level in July was reached during a denial-of-service attack in which someone flooded the network with transactions in an attempt to break things, calling it a “stress test”. So that level, about 700 kilobytes of transactions (or less than 3 payments per second), is probably about the limit of what Bitcoin can actually achieve in practice

    NB: You may have read that the limit is 7 payments per second. That’s an old figure from 2011 and Bitcoin transactions got a lot more complex since then, so the true figure is a lot lower.

The reason the true limit seems to be 700 kilobytes instead of the theoretical 1000 is that sometimes miners produce blocks smaller than allowed and even empty blocks, despite that there are lots of transactions waiting to confirm — this seems to be most frequently caused by interference from the Chinese “Great Firewall” censorship system. More on that in a second.

If you look closely, you can see that traffic has been growing since the end of the 2015 summer months. This is expected. I wrote about Bitcoin’s seasonal growth patterns back in March.

Here’s weekly average block sizes:

So the average is nearly at the peak of what can be done. Not surprisingly then, there are frequent periods in which Bitcoin can’t keep up with the transaction load being placed upon it and almost all blocks are the maximum size, even when there is a long queue of transactions waiting. You can see this in the size column (the 750kb blocks come from miners that haven’t properly adjusted their software):

When networks run out of capacity, they get really unreliable. That’s why so many online attacks are based around simply flooding a target computer with traffic. Sure enough, just before Christmas payments started to become unreliable and at peak times backlogs are now becoming common.

Quoting a news post by ProHashing, a Bitcoin-using business:

    Some customers contacted Chris earlier today asking why our bitcoin payouts didn’t execute …

    The issue is that it’s now officially impossible to depend upon the bitcoin network anymore to know when or if your payment will be transacted, because the congestion is so bad that even minor spikes in volume create dramatic changes in network conditions. To whom is it acceptable that one could wait either 60 minutes or 14 hours, chosen at random?

    It’s ludicrous that people are actually writing posts on reddit claiming that there is no crisis. People were criticizing my post yesterday on the grounds that I somehow overstated the seriousness of the situation. Do these people actually use the bitcoin network to send money everyday?

ProHashing encountered another near-miss between Christmas and New Year, this time because a payment from an exchange to their wallet was delayed.

Bitcoin is supposed to respond to this situation with automatic fee rises to try and get rid of some users, and although the mechanisms behind it are barely functional that’s still sort of happening: it is rapidly becoming more and more expensive to use the Bitcoin network. Once upon a time, Bitcoin had the killer advantage of low and even zero fees, but it’s now common to be asked to pay more to miners than a credit card would charge.

Why has the capacity limit not been raised? Because the block chain is controlled by Chinese miners, just two of whom control more than 50% of the hash power. At a recent conference over 95% of hashing power was controlled by a handful of guys sitting on a single stage. The miners are not allowing the block chain to grow.

Why are they not allowing it to grow? Several reasons. One is that the developers of the “Bitcoin Core” software that they run have refused to implement the necessary changes. Another is that the miners refuse to switch to any competing product, as they perceive doing so as “disloyalty” —and they’re terrified of doing anything that might make the news as a “split” and cause investor panic. They have chosen instead to ignore the problem and hope it goes away.

And the final reason is that the Chinese internet is so broken by their government’s firewall that moving data across the border barely works at all, with speeds routinely worse than what mobile phones provide. Imagine an entire country connected to the rest of the world by cheap hotel wifi, and you’ve got the picture. Right now, the Chinese miners are able to — just about — maintain their connection to the global internet and claim the 25 BTC reward ($11,000) that each block they create gives them. But if the Bitcoin network got more popular, they fear taking part would get too difficult and they’d lose their income stream. This gives them a perverse financial incentive to actually try and stop Bitcoin becoming popular.

Many Bitcoin users and observers have been assuming up until very recently that somehow these problems would all sort themselves out, and of course the block chain size limit would be raised. After all, why would the Bitcoin community … the community that has championed the block chain as the future of finance … deliberately kill itself by strangling the chain in its crib? But that’s exactly what is happening.

The resulting civil war has seen Coinbase — the largest and best known Bitcoin startup in the USA — be erased from the official Bitcoin website for picking the “wrong” side and banned from the community forums. When parts of the community are viciously turning on the people that have introduced millions of users to the currency, you know things have got really crazy.
Nobody knows what’s going on

If you haven’t heard much about this, you aren’t alone. One of the most disturbing things that took place over the course of 2015 is that the flow of information to investors and users has dried up.

In the span of only about eight months, Bitcoin has gone from being a transparent and open community to one that is dominated by rampant censorship and attacks on bitcoiners by other bitcoiners. This transformation is by far the most appalling thing I have ever seen, and the result is that I no longer feel comfortable being associated with the Bitcoin community.

Bitcoin is not intended to be an investment and has always been advertised pretty accurately: as an experimental currency which you shouldn’t buy more of than you can afford to lose. It is complex, but that never worried me because all the information an investor might want was out there, and there’s an entire cottage industry of books, conferences, videos and websites to help people make sense of it all.

That has now changed.

Most people who own Bitcoin learn about it through the mainstream media. Whenever a story goes mainstream the Bitcoin price goes crazy, then the media report on the price rises and a bubble happens.

Stories about Bitcoin reach newspapers and magazines through a simple process: the news starts in a community forum, then it’s picked up by a more specialised community/tech news website, then journalists at general media outlets see the story on those sites and write their own versions. I’ve seen this happen over and over again, and frequently taken part in it by discussing stories with journalists.

In August 2015 it became clear that due to severe mismanagement, the “Bitcoin Core” project that maintains the program that runs the peer-to-peer network wasn’t going to release a version that raised the block size limit. The reasons for this are complicated and discussed below. But obviously, the community needed the ability to keep adding new users. So some long-term developers (including me) got together and developed the necessary code to raise the limit. That code was called BIP 101 and we released it in a modified version of the software that we branded Bitcoin XT. By running XT, miners could cast a vote for changing the limit. Once 75% of blocks were voting for the change the rules would be adjusted and bigger blocks would be allowed.

The release of Bitcoin XT somehow pushed powerful emotional buttons in a small number of people. One of them was a guy who is the admin of the bitcoin.org website and top discussion forums. He had frequently allowed discussion of outright criminal activity on the forums he controlled, on the grounds of freedom of speech. But when XT launched, he made a surprising decision. XT, he claimed, did not represent the “developer consensus” and was therefore not really Bitcoin. Voting was an abomination, he said, because:

    “One of the great things about Bitcoin is its lack of democracy”

So he decided to do whatever it took to kill XT completely, starting with censorship of Bitcoin’s primary communication channels: any post that mentioned the words “Bitcoin XT” was erased from the discussion forums he controlled, XT could not be mentioned or linked to from anywhere on the official bitcoin.org website and, of course, anyone attempting to point users to other uncensored forums was also banned. Massive numbers of users were expelled from the forums and prevented from expressing their views.

As you can imagine, this enraged people. Read the comments on the announcement to get a feel for it.

Eventually, some users found their way to a new uncensored forum. Reading it is a sad thing. Every day for months I have seen raging, angry posts railing against the censors, vowing that they will be defeated.

But the inability to get news about XT or the censorship itself through to users has some problematic effects.

For the first time, investors have no obvious way to get a clear picture of what’s going on. Dissenting views are being systematically suppressed. Technical criticisms of what Bitcoin Core is doing are being banned, with misleading nonsense being peddled in its place. And it’s clear that many people who casually bought into Bitcoin during one of its hype cycles have no idea that the system is about to hit an artificial limit.

This worries me a great deal. Over the years governments have passed a large number of laws around securities and investments. Bitcoin is not a security and I do not believe it falls under those laws, but their spirit is simple enough: make sure investors are informed. When misinformed investors lose money, government attention frequently follows.
Why is Bitcoin Core keeping the limit?

People problems.

When Satoshi left, he handed over the reins of the program we now call Bitcoin Core to Gavin Andresen, an early contributor. Gavin is a solid and experienced leader who can see the big picture. His reliable technical judgement is one of the reasons I had the confidence to quit Google (where I had spent nearly 8 years) and work on Bitcoin full time. Only one tiny problem: Satoshi never actually asked Gavin if he wanted the job, and in fact he didn’t. So the first thing Gavin did was grant four other developers access to the code as well. These developers were chosen quickly in order to ensure the project could easily continue if anything happened to him. They were, essentially, whoever was around and making themselves useful at the time.

One of them, Gregory Maxwell, had an unusual set of views: he once claimed he had mathematically proven Bitcoin to be impossible. More problematically, he did not believe in Satoshi’s original vision.

When the project was first announced, Satoshi was asked how a block chain could scale to a large number of payments. Surely the amount of data to download would become overwhelming if the idea took off? This was a popular criticism of Bitcoin in the early days and Satoshi fully expected to be asked about it. He said:

    The bandwidth might not be as prohibitive as you think … if the network were to get [as big as VISA], it would take several years, and by then, sending [the equivalent of] 2 HD movies over the Internet would probably not seem like a big deal.

It’s a simple argument: look at what existing payment networks handle, look at what it’d take for Bitcoin to do the same, and then point out that growth doesn’t happen overnight. The networks and computers of the future will be better than today. And indeed back-of-the-envelope calculations suggested that, as he said to me, “it never really hits a scale ceiling” even when looking at more factors than just bandwidth.

Maxwell did not agree with this line of thinking. From an interview in December 2014:

    Problems with decentralization as bitcoin grows are not going to diminish either, according to Maxwell: “There’s an inherent tradeoff between scale and decentralization when you talk about transactions on the network.”

    The problem, he said, is that as bitcoin transaction volume increases, larger companies will likely be the only ones running bitcoin nodes because of the inherent cost.

The idea that Bitcoin is inherently doomed because more users means less decentralisation is a pernicious one. It ignores the fact that despite all the hype, real usage is low, growing slowly and technology gets better over time. It is a belief Gavin and I have spent much time debunking. And it leads to an obvious but crazy conclusion: if decentralisation is what makes Bitcoin good, and growth threatens decentralisation, then Bitcoin should not be allowed to grow.

Instead, Maxwell concluded, Bitcoin should become a sort of settlement layer for some vaguely defined, as yet un-created non-blockchain based system.
The death spiral begins

In a company, someone who did not share the goals of the organisation would be dealt with in a simple way: by firing him.

But Bitcoin Core is an open source project, not a company. Once the 5 developers with commit access to the code had been chosen and Gavin had decided he did not want to be the leader, there was no procedure in place to ever remove one. And there was no interview or screening process to ensure they actually agreed with the project’s goals.

As Bitcoin became more popular and traffic started approaching the 1mb limit, the topic of raising the block size limit was occasionally brought up between the developers. But it quickly became an emotionally charged subject. Accusations were thrown around that raising the limit was too risky, that it was against decentralisation, and so on. Like many small groups, people prefer to avoid conflict. The can was kicked down the road.

Complicating things further, Maxwell founded a company that then hired several other developers. Not surprisingly, their views then started to change to align with that of their new boss.

Co-ordinating software upgrades takes time, and so in May 2015 Gavin decided the subject must be tackled once and for all, whilst there was still about 8 months remaining. He began writing articles that worked through the arguments against raising the limit, one at a time.

But it quickly became apparent that the Bitcoin Core developers were hopelessly at loggerheads. Maxwell and the developers he had hired refused to contemplate any increase in the limit whatsoever. They were barely even willing to talk about the issue. They insisted that nothing be done without “consensus”. And the developer who was responsible for making the releases was so afraid of conflict that he decided any controversial topic in which one side might “win” simply could not be touched at all, and refused to get involved.

Thus despite the fact that exchanges, users, wallet developers, and miners were all expecting a rise, and indeed, had been building entire businesses around the assumption that it would happen, 3 of the 5 developers refused to touch the limit.

Deadlock.

Meanwhile, the clock was ticking.
Massive DDoS attacks on XT users

Despite the news blockade, within a few days of launching Bitcoin XT around 15% of all network nodes were running it, and at least one mining pool had started offering BIP101 voting to miners.

That’s when the denial of service attacks started. The attacks were so large that they disconnected entire regions from the internet:

    “I was DDos’d. It was a massive DDoS that took down my entire (rural) ISP. Everyone in five towns lost their internet service for several hours last summer because of these criminals. It definitely discouraged me from hosting nodes.”

In other cases, entire datacenters were disconnected from the internet until the single XT node inside them was stopped. About a third of the nodes were attacked and removed from the internet in this way.

Worse, the mining pool that had been offering BIP101 was also attacked and forced to stop. The message was clear: anyone who supported bigger blocks, or even allowed other people to vote for them, would be assaulted.

The attackers are still out there. When Coinbase, months after the launch, announced they had finally lost patience with Core and would run XT, they too were forced offline for a while.
Bogus conferences

Despite the DoS attacks and censorship, XT was gaining momentum. That posed a threat to Core, so a few of its developers decided to organise a series of conferences named “Scaling Bitcoin”: one in August and one in December. The goal, it was claimed, was to reach “consensus” on what should be done. Everyone likes a consensus of experts, don’t they?

It was immediately clear to me that people who refused to even talk about raising the limit would not have a change of heart because they attended a conference, and moreover, with the start of the winter growth season there remained only a few months to get the network upgraded. Wasting those precious months waiting for conferences would put the stability of the entire network at risk. The fact that the first conference actually banned discussion of concrete proposals didn’t help.

So I didn’t go.

Unfortunately, this tactic was devastatingly effective. The community fell for it completely. When talking to miners and startups, “we are waiting for Core to raise the limit in December” was one of the most commonly cited reasons for refusing to run XT. They were terrified of any media stories about a community split that might hurt the Bitcoin price and thus, their earnings.

Now the last conference has come and gone with no plan to raise the limit, some companies (like Coinbase and BTCC) have woken up to the fact that they got played. But too late. Whilst the community was waiting, organic growth added another 250,000 transactions per day.
A non-roadmap

Jeff Garzik and Gavin Andresen, the two of five Bitcoin Core committers who support a block size increase (and the two who have been around the longest), both have a stellar reputation within the community. They recently wrote a joint article titled “Bitcoin is Being Hot-Wired for Settlement”.

Jeff and Gavin are generally softer in their approach than I am. I’m more of a tell-it-like-I-see-it kinda guy, or as Gavin has delicately put it, “honest to a fault”. So the strong language in their joint letter is unusual. They don’t pull any punches:

    The proposed roadmap currently being discussed in the bitcoin community has some good points in that it does have a plan to accommodate more transactions, but it fails to speak plainly to bitcoin users and acknowledge key downsides.

    Core block size does not change; there has been zero compromise on that issue.

    In an optimal, transparent, open source environment, a BIP would be produced … this has not happened

    One of the explicit goals of the Scaling Bitcoin workshops was to funnel the chaotic core block size debate into an orderly decision making process. That did not occur. In hindsight, Scaling Bitcoin stalled a block size decision while transaction fee price and block space pressure continue to increase.

Failing to speak plainly, as they put it, has become more and more common. As an example, the plan Gavin and Jeff refer to was announced at the “Scaling Bitcoin” conferences but doesn’t involve making anything more efficient, and manages an anemic 60% capacity increase only through an accounting trick (not counting some of the bytes in each transaction). It requires making huge changes to nearly every piece of Bitcoin-related software. Instead of doing a simple thing and raising the limit, it chooses to do an incredibly complicated thing that might buy months at most, assuming a huge coordinated effort.
Replace by fee

One problem with using fees to control congestion is that the fee to get to the front of the queue might change after you made a payment. Bitcoin Core has a brilliant solution to this problem — allow people to mark their payments as changeable after they’ve been sent, up until they appear in the block chain. The stated intention is to let people adjust the fee paid, but in fact their change also allows people to change the payment to point back to themselves, thus reversing it.

At a stroke, this makes using Bitcoin useless for actually buying things, as you’d have to wait for a buyer’s transaction to appear in the block chain … which from now on can take hours rather than minutes, due to the congestion.

Core’s reasoning for why this is OK goes like this: it’s no big loss because if you hadn’t been waiting for a block before, there was a theoretical risk of payment fraud, which means you weren’t using Bitcoin properly. Thus, making that risk a 100% certainty doesn’t really change anything.

In other words, they don’t recognise that risk management exists and so perceive this change as zero cost.

This protocol change will be released with the next version of Core (0.12), so will activate when the miners upgrade. It was massively condemned by the entire Bitcoin community but the remaining Bitcoin Core developers don’t care what other people think, so the change will happen.

If that didn’t convince you Bitcoin has serious problems, nothing will. How many people would think bitcoins are worth hundreds of dollars each when you soon won’t be able to use them in actual shops?
Conclusions

Bitcoin has entered exceptionally dangerous waters. Previous crises, like the bankruptcy of Mt Gox, were all to do with the services and companies that sprung up around the ecosystem. But this one is different: it is a crisis of the core system, the block chain itself.

More fundamentally, it is a crisis that reflects deep philosophical differences in how people view the world: either as one that should be ruled by a “consensus of experts”, or through ordinary people picking whatever policies make sense to them.

Even if a new team was built to replace Bitcoin Core, the problem of mining power being concentrated behind the Great Firewall would remain. Bitcoin has no future whilst it’s controlled by fewer than 10 people. And there’s no solution in sight for this problem: nobody even has any suggestions. For a community that has always worried about the block chain being taken over by an oppressive government, it is a rich irony.

Still, all is not yet lost. Despite everything that has happened, in the past few weeks more members of the community have started picking things up from where I am putting them down. Where making an alternative to Core was once seen as renegade, there are now two more forks vying for attention (Bitcoin Classic and Bitcoin Unlimited). So far they’ve hit the same problems as XT but it’s possible a fresh set of faces could find a way to make progress.

There are many talented and energetic people working in the Bitcoin space, and in the past five years I’ve had the pleasure of getting to know many of them. Their entrepreneurial spirit and alternative perspectives on money, economics and politics were fascinating to experience, and despite how it’s all gone down I don’t regret my time with the project. I woke up this morning to find people wishing me well in the uncensored forum and asking me to stay, but I’m afraid I’ve moved on to other things. To those people I say: good luck, stay strong, and I wish you the best.
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January 16, 2016, 03:25:13 PM
 #165

I mean this question sincerely:  Who the fuck is Mike Hearn?

I'm like part-time into bitcoin and I don't read a lot of news or a lot of anything, and I should.  But I don't know who this guy is.  Or why his opinion carries extra weight.

My point exactly! Why freak out because Mike Hearn leaves Bitcoin?! Don't let the door hit you on the way out!
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January 16, 2016, 03:34:19 PM
 #166

@pompatore thanks for posting this.

Interesting reading and I'm not so sure if it's wise to ignore all of this. If he's right BTC might go down rather sooner than later.
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January 16, 2016, 04:28:14 PM
 #167

@pompatore thanks for posting this.

Interesting reading and I'm not so sure if it's wise to ignore all of this. If he's right BTC might go down rather sooner than later.

Of course, he is right. he was inside Bitcoin for years He knows many people(investors, exchangers, miners).


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January 16, 2016, 04:56:44 PM
 #168

@pompatore thanks for posting this.

Interesting reading and I'm not so sure if it's wise to ignore all of this. If he's right BTC might go down rather sooner than later.

Of course, he is right. he was inside Bitcoin for years He knows many people(investors, exchangers, miners).



Being an insider doesn't mean your right, it can very well mean he just wants to feel the same type of power he used to have when he was an insider. This happens with every aspect of business.

He was (and is) someone who wrote code, and so he doesn't have an economics degree just by existing within the development team. He claims Bitcoin's immediate downfall will be because of block size, which is irrelevant right now. He wanted to publish a more centralized future fix for the block sizes.

Bitcoin might go down in the short term, but I would attribute that due to shaken confidence from someone who had a fancy job title. I personally do not think he is right as it currently stands.
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January 16, 2016, 04:59:47 PM
 #169

Yea, makes you think for a while... But one question to see if I fully understand:
Everything is almost the same as a year ago, apart from the congestion of the blockchain, and the only problem is that the block sizes will not be augmented?
What if everyone would stop using bitcoin core and transferred to XT, then you'll get like 2 sides:

1 side that is either ignorant or related to the so mentioned 10 people,
and the other side will be the one who favors decentralisation.

If only enough people would see that, could that make this problem reversible? Or is it really too late for that?

I'm not expert whatsoever so I might miss some basic knowledge, but still... If it were possible this way, and we could get enough people to vouch for XT?
Perhaps I am too hanging to closely to this idea that it will be fine in the end, but a little hope is allowed no? :p

As for Mike, I would really like to know how much people are selling their btc without ever having heard of him before this f***** mass-media-massacre for btc...
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January 16, 2016, 06:56:41 PM
 #170

I mean this question sincerely:  Who the fuck is Mike Hearn?

I'm like part-time into bitcoin and I don't read a lot of news or a lot of anything, and I should.  But I don't know who this guy is.  Or why his opinion carries extra weight.


These are gimmicks to get higher popularity in journalism as make controversial statements. And bcz of he is author at NY times. There is no meaning of his statements. Actually  Mike is just programmer.

That's correct, he is just a programmer. One of probably millions who are capable of doing the same job equally well. I sense an inflated sense of self-worth.

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January 16, 2016, 07:37:56 PM
 #171

I heard Name of Mike first time by today. I never know him before. But what a strange today he said bitcoin is dead and suddenly it goes down this is just resemblance. Bcz he is just programmer. And there are so many talented programmer in world. If he think that quitting his job bitcoin will die then its his misunderstanding. Bcz There are so many big names have start to invest in bitcoin Even few are bank and industrial sector also.

Even there was prediction of 21 million bitcoin generation. Still it not completed.

I read article published in Fusion.
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January 16, 2016, 07:39:45 PM
 #172

Mike dont know that he was just and programmer doing whatever ordered if he know about cryptography then he might hv to create own cryptocurrency. So everything is just buzz no to worry.
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January 16, 2016, 07:48:56 PM
 #173

Cryptography is heavily based on mathematical theory and computer science practice; cryptographic algorithms are designed around computational hardness assumptions, making such algorithms hard to break in practice by any adversary. It is theoretically possible to break such a system, but it is infeasible to do so by any known practical means. These schemes are therefore termed computationally secure; theoretical advances, e.g., improvements in integer factorization algorithms, and faster computing technology require these solutions to be continually adapted. There exist information-theoretically secure schemes that provably cannot be broken even with unlimited computing power.

Cryptography is branch of modern physics, mathematics and IT. An one of the best example is Cryptocurrency like Bitcoin, Dogecoin, n many other.

Its already told that it is open source. So folks why r u worrying.

Firstly when it get introduced no one know about this concept. so people were quite stumbled. But since its origin people understand importance, uses and benefits, even implement it to day to day life. 
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January 16, 2016, 11:04:34 PM
 #174

What a craftily assembled narrative. I enjoyed the read. Now, back to reality.

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January 16, 2016, 11:07:48 PM
 #175

Cryptography is heavily based on mathematical theory and computer science practice; cryptographic algorithms are designed around computational hardness assumptions, making such algorithms hard to break in practice by any adversary. It is theoretically possible to break such a system, but it is infeasible to do so by any known practical means. These schemes are therefore termed computationally secure; theoretical advances, e.g., improvements in integer factorization algorithms, and faster computing technology require these solutions to be continually adapted. There exist information-theoretically secure schemes that provably cannot be broken even with unlimited computing power.

Cryptography is branch of modern physics, mathematics and IT. An one of the best example is Cryptocurrency like Bitcoin, Dogecoin, n many other.

Its already told that it is open source. So folks why r u worrying.

Firstly when it get introduced no one know about this concept. so people were quite stumbled. But since its origin people understand importance, uses and benefits, even implement it to day to day life. 


Congrats, you can cut and paste from wikipedia. LOL. Tongue

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jonald_fyookball
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January 16, 2016, 11:35:10 PM
 #176

"who the heck is mike" and "isnt he just a programmer"
type replies are missing the point.. its not about replacing
a programmer or whether he is even wise or not...

...look at what he is writing about with Greg Maxwell,
the community, the blocks.  Its all verifiable.

And if you don't know who Mike Hearn is,
then you're basically clueless...he's the
guy who wrote XT along with Gavin to
try to help raise the blocksize when
core refused to.

keepdoing (OP)
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January 17, 2016, 12:14:31 AM
 #177

Feeling good about price action after Mike's letter.  Looks like the January 16 price bottomed in the 360's and has turned corner and heading up again very solidly.  390+ as I write this.

http://bitcoincharts.com/charts/coinbaseUSD#rg2ztgSzm1g10zm2g25zv

I actually thought there would be more downside.  I think the clear evidence of almost 75% immediate support for Classic from the mining community is what has turned hte price corner.  People are beginning to have faith that Classic can make it.  Future is starting to look promising for the first time in months.

BUT - Blockstream/Core shills are pulling out all stops to FUD, Lie, Manipulate, confuse things.  It ain't over - but barring an unexpected disaster - it looks like Classic will prevail, and governance be restablished that isn't stupid, and full of conflict of interest (aka Blockstream/Core)

www.BitcoinClassic.com
* get ready to upgrade your node!  Countdown to Fork, commencing in.... 4, 3, 2....
owlcatz
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January 17, 2016, 03:27:24 AM
 #178

"who the heck is mike" and "isnt he just a programmer"
type replies are missing the point.. its not about replacing
a programmer or whether he is even wise or not...

...look at what he is writing about with Greg Maxwell,
the community, the blocks.  Its all verifiable.

And if you don't know who Mike Hearn is,
then you're basically clueless...he's the
guy who wrote XT along with Gavin to
try to help raise the blocksize when
core refused to.

Yes i know all this. but.... what and where is the overall community going to go? XT? Core? Classic?

The waters are so muddied to the average bitcoiner, it's sad, hence the sell-off again....

What do you think Jonald?

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[/ce
jonald_fyookball
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January 17, 2016, 03:52:39 AM
 #179

"who the heck is mike" and "isnt he just a programmer"
type replies are missing the point.. its not about replacing
a programmer or whether he is even wise or not...

...look at what he is writing about with Greg Maxwell,
the community, the blocks.  Its all verifiable.

And if you don't know who Mike Hearn is,
then you're basically clueless...he's the
guy who wrote XT along with Gavin to
try to help raise the blocksize when
core refused to.

Yes i know all this. but.... what and where is the overall community going to go? XT? Core? Classic?

The waters are so muddied to the average bitcoiner, it's sad, hence the sell-off again....

What do you think Jonald?

I'm thinking Bitcoin Classic. 

Just look at who's backing it:  Gavin, Garzik, Coinbase, Bitstamp, and a ton of others.
Their purpose is clear: an immediate increase to 2MB.  We need to fork away
from Core.  Core has failed.  That's why we're in this mess and should be
as obvious as the fact that the emperor is wearing no clothes.  Those that
can't tell have bought into some dogma that "core must be right" while ignoring
the obvious facts that Core has done nothing but stall and fail to increase
transaction capacity, despite a lot of good sounding "ideas" like "lightning",
"scalability conferences", "segwit",...and that the same guys in core (everyone
except Gavin and Garzik) who are against meaningful blocksize increases work
for a private company called Blockstream who is in the business of blockchain
technology.

I'm sure I sound like a broken record by now to some, but you asked me directly
and I'm telling you the reality as I see it.


cjmoles
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January 17, 2016, 04:48:07 AM
 #180

"who the heck is mike" and "isnt he just a programmer"
type replies are missing the point.. its not about replacing
a programmer or whether he is even wise or not...

...look at what he is writing about with Greg Maxwell,
the community, the blocks.  Its all verifiable.

And if you don't know who Mike Hearn is,
then you're basically clueless...he's the
guy who wrote XT along with Gavin to
try to help raise the blocksize when
core refused to.

Yes i know all this. but.... what and where is the overall community going to go? XT? Core? Classic?

The waters are so muddied to the average bitcoiner, it's sad, hence the sell-off again....

What do you think Jonald?

I'm thinking Bitcoin Classic. 

Just look at who's backing it:  Gavin, Garzik, Coinbase, Bitstamp, and a ton of others.
Their purpose is clear: an immediate increase to 2MB.  We need to fork away
from Core.  Core has failed.  That's why we're in this mess and should be
as obvious as the fact that the emperor is wearing no clothes.  Those that
can't tell have bought into some dogma that "core must be right" while ignoring
the obvious facts that Core has done nothing but stall and fail to increase
transaction capacity, despite a lot of good sounding "ideas" like "lightning",
"scalability conferences", "segwit",...and that the same guys in core (everyone
except Gavin and Garzik) who are against meaningful blocksize increases work
for a private company called Blockstream who is in the business of blockchain
technology.

I'm sure I sound like a broken record by now to some, but you asked me directly
and I'm telling you the reality as I see it.



I agree.  May I ask you another question: If Bitcoin Classic is accepted, will it be robust enough to be able to compete with what the R3 blockchain group will put out?  I mean, the R3 group scabbed Hearn (among others), invested 9 billion USD in research alone (Bitcoins present marketcap is only 5.8 billion USD), and serves a huge US banking system with a platform and customer base already in place.  Surely, whatever the R3 group comes up with, it will be a totally different critter than Bitcoin, but what impact will it have on the adoption of Bitcoin Classic and the Bitcoin community in general?
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