The Ethereum Paradox

[TPTB_need_war]

4)  Market cap is determined by market makers and market makers plan to raise the price.  People don't build 100 million dollar mining facilities and then let the price be determined by sheer luck or fate.

The mining profit will come from increasing transaction fees × transaction volume. The problem is that increasing the block size too much will lower the fees. This is why this has been such a contentious issue. The mining cartel in China wants to make sure they can set the block size to maximize that multiplicative product. Why do others not able to deduce what is so obvious to me  

Bitcoin's volatility makes that entirely insignificant. Bitcoin can't be a currency until it has an economy where it is the unit-of-account. Well it actually has one, that is Bitcoin is the unit-of-account of the crypto gambling economy.

This is more important than you may realize. The Chinese are trying to trade their BTC for ETH, so they can control Ethereum when it goes Proof-of-Stake in Casper. So they can control the block sizes so they can maximize the transaction fees × transaction volume multiplicative product. Realize the Chinese want to control that multiplicative product for all major CCs. They will control the #1 PoW coin Bitcoin and the #1 PoS coin Ethereum. They control Bitcoin via ASIC mining and Ethereum by owning a majority of the ETH.

This is another reason ETH will rise again after BTC peaks at $500:

Btw, I think a double-top for ETH at $15 is likely. Too much bad news has come out, sentiment is negative, and I had always said it would bounce at $7. There needs to be a GPU mineable alternative to Bitcoin, same as the role Litecoin provided. It doesn't matter that ETH has no adoption. It is purely a store-of-value arbitrage/speculation proposition.

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[Blawpaw]

Ethereum Price Technical Analysis – ETH Remains Vulnerable

Ethereum price ETH continued its downtrend and moved further down. Yesterday, there was an attempt to correct higher, but a bearish trend line formed on the hourly chart (data feed via Kraken) of ETH/USD prevented the upside move and pushed the price down once again. The highlighted trend line resistance holds a lot of importance, as it acted as a barrier for the ETH bulls on many occasions...

read more

[r0ach]

This is more important than you may realize. The Chinese are trying to trade their BTC for ETH, so they can control Ethereum when it goes Proof-of-Stake in Casper.

R3 affiliates put up the money for that Eth pump and support.  If China wants to waste money buying Eth at the top of the bubble and become the bag holders...oh well.

[r0ach]

If you put the pieces of the puzzle together, China did not want to follow or support the Bitcoin rise initiated by the west and just tried to stop it with a shakeout.  When China has more miners than the US by far, there's not many logical reasons they would do this.  I'm thinking China may actually have bought a bunch of Eth and wants to find someone to dump it on before the BTC halving so they attempted to slow the BTC bull run on purpose.  Combined with Vitalik dumping 25%, they were probably getting murdered too hard on alts cratering.

[Gillette]

Russian scammer Vitalik Buterin is looking to dump the remaining 75% of ETH. So dump your ETH before it`s not too late!

[finitemaz]

Btc-e has always been against scammy premined ipo coins.  Why torpedo their credibility now? Profits yes, but they could have made profits from the beginning with these shit coins.

[wikenpp]

Btc-e has always been against scammy premined ipo coins.  Why torpedo their credibility now? Profits yes, but they could have made profits from the beginning with these shit coins.

I don't consider BTC-E an exchange with a high reputation. They got a solid reputation but that's it.
As it goes for ETH i do think it is a coin with potential. More potential then 99% of the coins listed on BTC-E

[sandiman]

Ethereum Price Technical Analysis – ETH Remains Vulnerable

Ethereum price ETH continued its downtrend and moved further down. Yesterday, there was an attempt to correct higher, but a bearish trend line formed on the hourly chart (data feed via Kraken) of ETH/USD prevented the upside move and pushed the price down once again. The highlighted trend line resistance holds a lot of importance, as it acted as a barrier for the ETH bulls on many occasions...

read more

Well, it looks like resistance level has been broke sooner that expected.  still bearish ?

[finitemaz]

Btc-e has always been against scammy premined ipo coins.  Why torpedo their credibility now? Profits yes, but they could have made profits from the beginning with these shit coins.

I don't consider BTC-E an exchange with a high reputation. They got a solid reputation but that's it.
As it goes for ETH i do think it is a coin with potential. More potential then 99% of the coins listed on BTC-E

Have you even read anything in this thread?

[TPTB_need_war]

@TPTB: I have a theory regarding ETH. We all thought wallstreets would wake up to BTC at some point and they would end up buying it from us. We all thought we were front running them. What if Wallstreet has another strategy ? they back coins such as ETH, and use their enormous positions to pump the price to agitate greed inside us so we give them our rare btcs for their unlimited eth ?

Excellent! Yeah the game theory is complex.

[hv_]

PPP

Paradox Price Pee

https://www.tradingview.com/chart/ETHBTC/PZyvtwew-Been-right-so-far/

 

[TPTB_need_war]

PPP

Paradox Price Pee

https://www.tradingview.com/chart/ETHBTC/PZyvtwew-Been-right-so-far/

 

I have intimate daily experience with that Limp Cock Pattern, so I can vouch for its predictability. Well that is if Cialas is not a factor.

[cjmoles]

Wow....My brain cell hurts!  I'm only on page 6 of this thread and I'm exhausted already!  I'm a "noob" still but I am university educated, Electronics Engineering, so I am not hopelessly lost.  I am resolved to finish the entire thread but some cliff notes would surely help at this point.  After reading what I have so far, I am curious: Has there been any serious study of how a Mandelbrot function might be applied to the data structures associated with a blockchain ledger?  I know it's probably a naive question but its application just seems like a "no brainer" to me for some reason....

[YarkoL]

Has there been any serious study of how a Mandelbrot function might be applied to the data structures associated with a blockchain ledger?  I know it's probably a naive question but its application just seems like a "no brainer" to me for some reason....

Didn't Mandelbrot write a book on money exchanges
and patterns? Assuming there is something more than
numerology in there (I haven't read his
work), then such findings could be directly applicable.

Perhaps more on topic, it has been shown that the
problem whether a given number belongs "inside" a
geometrical fractal (that is, whether it converges on iterating
a function with it as an initial argument) is not decidable.

[TPTB_need_war]

Blockstream begins their assault on Ethereum:

Uncle Mining, an Ethereum Consensus Protocol Flaw

A year ago I was hired by Eth Dev Ltd through Coinspect to perform a security audit on the Ethereum design. One of our findings was that the uncle reward strategy in Ethereum was weird, and could lead to miners abusing the uncle rewards to almost triple the money supply.

https://bitslog.wordpress.com/2016/04/28/uncle-mining-an-ethereum-consensus-protocol-flaw/

[YarkoL]

Blockstream begins their assault on Ethereum:

That links to Sergio Demian Lerner's blog, and he has
no relation to Blockstream AFAIK.

But he is an expert at spotting subtle (and not so subtle)
flaws, and I have no doubt this post of his will have consequences.

[TPTB_need_war]

Blockstream begins their assault on Ethereum:

That links to Sergio Demian Lerner's blog, and he has
no relation to Blockstream AFAIK.

But he is an expert at spotting subtle (and not so subtle)
flaws, and I have no doubt this post of his will have consequences.

He is working on that Ethereum clone on the Bitcoin blockchain which is mentioned by Blockstream devs and it mentions Side Chains. They are supporting each other. I think also at one time I read something about a more close working relationship and maybe even some compensation involved.

[mybitcoin101]

Vitalikhisballs dumped his eth to buy pimple creme and to feed his goat that he bangs

[thejaytiesto]

Even if you could force the external entity to declare the full lineage of the input data (i.e. 100% dependently typed), that would require that the scripting can't be programmable, i.e. the external I/O capability would be eliminated. If you don't understand why, please go learn about the typing systems Coq and Epigram.

I just came again across this initiative
http://www.idni.org/

like much of the discussion in this thread,
it occupies the higher stratosphere of crypto-related theory,
but as much as I'm able to make out of it, it endeavors to steer
clear of many pitfalls that have been explored here by employing
purely functional language "that contains a blockchain support built-in"

They are trying to apply 100% dependent typing to a distributed database by limiting the universe within which a script resides to a family of rules:

http://tauchain.org/tauchain.pdf

This means the programmability of that universe ("locally, not the network" meaning they also can't control external I/O) is limited to the permutations of the rules (which must not be unbounded, else it is Turing complete and thus no longer dependently typed). These universes won't be able to talk to each other unless by intepreter universe which speaks both families perhaps.

Some where the programmer will bump into a limitation that can't work. This is why Haskell MUST have the UnsafeIO class.

The fundamental issue will not be ameliorated by any design. I am not that worried about external failure, for as long as the external failure can be attributed to using a certain set of external logic (and thus not kill the block chain system's perceived value and thus not kill the Nash equilibrium). We need to think about how externalities will integrate with the programmable block chain.

I am really not ready to research that. I have other more important things to work on first.

The point is that scriptable block chains are something that won't mature and become a real adoption market until after many years from now (perhaps decades). The wild price rise of ETH is much too premature and purely hype.

Hi I want to ask you about tauchain, im quoting this post since you mentioned it here.

Can you explain this in layman terms? Im not a coder but I like to know what im investing into, and I have managed to understand the point of everything I've invested into but this tauchain thing is too tricky.

While I learn about it I want to know if this is competition for Ethereum and Maidsafe or it's a third different thing?

Do you think it's a good long term investment that may eventually blow up so getting some "just in case" makes sense?

Do you think that it will get a sooner-than-expected big pump like Ethereum and Maidsafe did due being a project that's at least interesting (just like those 2) as opposed to most of the altcoins which are crap?

[TPTB_need_war]

Even if you could force the external entity to declare the full lineage of the input data (i.e. 100% dependently typed), that would require that the scripting can't be programmable, i.e. the external I/O capability would be eliminated. If you don't understand why, please go learn about the typing systems Coq and Epigram.

I just came again across this initiative
http://www.idni.org/

like much of the discussion in this thread,
it occupies the higher stratosphere of crypto-related theory,
but as much as I'm able to make out of it, it endeavors to steer
clear of many pitfalls that have been explored here by employing
purely functional language "that contains a blockchain support built-in"

They are trying to apply 100% dependent typing to a distributed database by limiting the universe within which a script resides to a family of rules:

http://tauchain.org/tauchain.pdf

This means the programmability of that universe ("locally, not the network" meaning they also can't control external I/O) is limited to the permutations of the rules (which must not be unbounded, else it is Turing complete and thus no longer dependently typed). These universes won't be able to talk to each other unless by intepreter universe which speaks both families perhaps.

Some where the programmer will bump into a limitation that can't work. This is why Haskell MUST have the UnsafeIO class.

The fundamental issue will not be ameliorated by any design. I am not that worried about external failure, for as long as the external failure can be attributed to using a certain set of external logic (and thus not kill the block chain system's perceived value and thus not kill the Nash equilibrium). We need to think about how externalities will integrate with the programmable block chain.

I am really not ready to research that. I have other more important things to work on first.

The point is that scriptable block chains are something that won't mature and become a real adoption market until after many years from now (perhaps decades). The wild price rise of ETH is much too premature and purely hype.

Hi I want to ask you about tauchain, im quoting this post since you mentioned it here.

Can you explain this in layman terms? Im not a coder but I like to know what im investing into, and I have managed to understand the point of everything I've invested into but this tauchain thing is too tricky.

While I learn about it I want to know if this is competition for Ethereum and Maidsafe or it's a third different thing?

Do you think it's a good long term investment that may eventually blow up so getting some "just in case" makes sense?

Do you think that it will get a sooner-than-expected big pump like Ethereum and Maidsafe did due being a project that's at least interesting (just like those 2) as opposed to most of the altcoins which are crap?

Let me make it simpler. All the coins mentioned above will fail. Only own them for the P&D gambler's gains.

Summarizing all detailed arguments for layman is something on my future todo list. I really don't think you are going to understand unless we have a 1 month lecture series that every speculator needs to pass with a grade of at least a B. For example, how do I explain esoteric computer science topic of "dependent typing" to a layman