Steemit how can this thing be workable long term?

[smooth]

What is the "recommendation engine"? Please define new terms.

Recommendation engine is a generic term: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recommender_system

Dan made a post about the specific algorithm he used, but I wouldn't guarantee that the post matches the code. The code is the only real specification.

So why did you disagree above.

Because of the tension between the monetary incentives and the utility incentives of the recommendations for one thing. For another, the recommendation system in Steem was't addressed in my post. I think it probably didn't exist at the time, but I don't precisely remember (the post includes some comments about the concept as a potentially viable direction to explore which suggests that it didn't).

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[iamnotback]

So why did you disagree above.

Because of the tension between the monetary incentives and the utility incentives of the recommendations for one thing. For another, the recommendation system in Steem was't addressed in my post.

I am asking why you disagreed with me, in that I claimed popularity and quality are aligned when the voters are (grouped to be) like-minded? Which is what I wrote and you disagreed by saying you did not make an error by claiming there is still a tension between the two after I explained there doesn't need to be if the voters are like-minded.

What I am saying is that you built a strawman because you failed to realize that the reason for the tension is the retarded voting system of Steem that groups everyone into one grouping, regardless if they share the same interests.

There is no tension there. My conclusion is clear that a voting system can't measure subjective quality. You apparently agree.

The precisely something the Synereo got correct in their design and Steem fucked up royally. But that is exactly what I would expect from Dan, because he always has these concepts of a globalized set (monolith).

[Gohs]

The safest thing to do now is not but steem coins. If you have any with you, sell as fast as you can, keep cool and see if the coin will rise again...

[iamnotback]

I think perhaps I see a way to make Steemit much better than Reddit by making a change along the lines I suggested, but I am not sure yet. I am working on the details. I'll probably make a blog post if I am able to come up with a ranking algorithm I feel is reasonably solid.

I will be attempting to make a series of blog posts to do my best to offer suggestions on how to improve Steemit, while also being frank and critical about what I think is broken.

Not sure yet what exactly I can come up. I have already some back of the napkin ideas on improving voting so it isn't a groupthink and on reducing attrition to make the site more sticky.

A lot of people have been thinking about these issues for much longer than I have. So I need to try to first absorb the knowledge of others on this subject.

I figure that if I haven't done my best to improve an open source project, then I am not objectively justified to criticize it.

If after doing my best to offer suggestions, I find objectively that it is insolubly broken, then I can be justified to criticize it.

No matter what I think of the funding model long-term, the short-term potential to be paid well (even relative to my opportunity cost, while noting such research is probably synergistic to my project/plans) for doing work on this project by offering suggestions, means I have no rational excuse to justify not doing so. Contrast this with the prospect of doing work for Monero in the past, where it was very unlikely I could be compensated for my opportunity cost (at least from perspective).

Let's see where this goes...

P.S. Steem and my project/plans are not necessarily mutually exclusive or competitors. They are also potentially synergistic, but I need to wade through many more details before I can clearly see the light at the end of the tunnel of thinking and study I need to do.

[razdva]

Steemit plaform is for me interesting only as a social experiment. The community forming there is pure utopia. You have society of people dependant on mathematical system and feelings of other members, that together reward each participant of community

[generalizethis]

Testing--

https://steemit.com/monero/@moneroman/why-monero-will-change-fintech

(I noticed that I saw a spellcheck error in the post loading page--it didn't show in the original text--but when I went back to edit it that it wasn't present. So did it auto-correct or is it still there, but does not acknowledge it after it's been posted?)

[tobysc]

Anyone else getting this error when trying to edit?

comment.last_payout == fc::time_point_sec::min():

[unusualfacts30]

https://steemit.com/beauty/@roelandp/the-first-steemit-male-makeup-tutorial-bringing-youtubers-to-steemit-roelandp-is-back

How is this post worth 12k?  

If you're a straight male and you find this funny or worth 12k, I got some bad news.

[generalizethis]

https://steemit.com/beauty/@roelandp/the-first-steemit-male-makeup-tutorial-bringing-youtubers-to-steemit-roelandp-is-back

How is this post worth 12k?  

If you're a straight male and you find this funny, I got some bad news.

It allowed for easy attaching of funny memes and comments--seems to be value in offering a small participation award (gots game[d]).

[AlexGR]

https://steemit.com/beauty/@roelandp/the-first-steemit-male-makeup-tutorial-bringing-youtubers-to-steemit-roelandp-is-back

How is this post worth 12k?  

If you're a straight male and you find this funny or worth 12k, I got some bad news.

It's kind of a troll-response to a female makeup tutorial which got something like 30k.

[unusualfacts30]

https://steemit.com/beauty/@roelandp/the-first-steemit-male-makeup-tutorial-bringing-youtubers-to-steemit-roelandp-is-back

How is this post worth 12k?  

If you're a straight male and you find this funny or worth 12k, I got some bad news.

It's kind of a troll-response to a female makeup tutorial which got something like 30k.

that's actually quite common on internet, doesn't make it worth that much money though. As someone has already mentioned, it seems like people with most steempower gets to decide who gets most money. It's a loophole, if you see one post making money, everyone will start creating similar posts regardless of its quality.

You can forget about quality traffic at that point. I'm assuming that steem developers are trying to post advertisement at some point? companies aren't going to pay money to get garbage and unrelated traffic that's only motivation is to make money rather than GIVE money.

They should hide the money tab at least or they're looking for another hack quite soon.

People don't need to know how much money others are earning. Do they?

There is a reason most online companies don't show their users earning to everyone. It exposes your website to hack. I'm surprised they didn't think about this.

[iamnotback]

...As someone has already mentioned, it seems like people with most steempower gets to decide who gets most money. It's a loophole, if you see one post making money, everyone will start creating similar posts regardless of its quality.

You can forget about quality traffic at that point...

I might have a solution. Stay tuned...

[generalizethis]

https://steemit.com/beauty/@roelandp/the-first-steemit-male-makeup-tutorial-bringing-youtubers-to-steemit-roelandp-is-back

How is this post worth 12k?  

If you're a straight male and you find this funny or worth 12k, I got some bad news.

It's kind of a troll-response to a female makeup tutorial which got something like 30k.

that's actually quite common on internet, doesn't make it worth that much money though. As someone has already mentioned, it seems like people with most steempower gets to decide who gets most money. It's a loophole, if you see one post making money, everyone will start creating similar posts regardless of its quality.

You can forget about quality traffic at that point.

Or innovative content will get rewarded quickly and force other posters to get more creative, more quickly....

It will be interesting to see how it goes.

[iamnotback]

Or innovative content will get rewarded quickly and force other posters to get more creative, more quickly....

That can't be a solution, because the problem is that users have differing ideals as to what is good content, thus one-size-fits-all ranking can never anneal to the diverse interests of users.

This appears to be the problem with Reddit and why it ends up as a fight with much negativity. Users are not allowed to disagree, because they are all forced to abide by the same ranking instead of having customized individualized rankings.

I think I can solve this problem mathematically using some form of clustering analysis. If so, this will be a significant innovation.

Stay tuned...

Edit: well time ranking posts as Reddit does, does allow the newer stuff to get ranked higher, thus differing interests do get satiated by differing posts replaced by differing posts that are newer, but that is still annoying/noisy which detracts from satisfaction. Thus your point about "more quickly" has some merit. But I think perhaps we can do much better.

[generalizethis]

Or innovative content will get rewarded quickly and force other posters to get more creative, more quickly....

That can't be a solution, because the problem is that users have differing ideals as to what is good content, thus one-size-fits-all ranking can never anneal to the diverse interests of users.

This appears to be the problem with Reddit and why it ends up as a fight with much negativity. Users are not allowed to disagree, because they are all forced to abide by the same ranking instead of having customized individualized rankings.

I think I can solve this problem mathematically using some form of clustering analysis. If so, this will be a significant innovation.

Stay tuned...

Edit: well time ranking posts as Reddit does, does allow the newer stuff to get ranked higher, thus differing interests do get satiated by differing posts replaced by differing posts that are newer, but that is still annoying/noisy. Thus your point about "more quickly" has some merit. But I think we can do much better.

I think you will see packaging innovation (which users can re-gift to their fellow think-a-likes).

[iamnotback]

I think you will see packaging innovation (which users can re-gift to their fellow think-a-likes).

Ad hoc link sharing is not as efficient/universal for the user as what I am contemplating to actually fix the ranking sort by grouping like-mindedness algorithmically.

[iamnotback]

I've got an algorithm. Writing a blog post now.

[noobtrader]

I think you will see packaging innovation (which users can re-gift to their fellow think-a-likes).

Ad hoc link sharing is not as efficient/universal for the user as what I am contemplating to actually fix the ranking sort by grouping like-mindedness algorithmically.

i think generalizethis suggest a pool of circlejerk and make everyone rich. which most of his comrades already done against dash.   

btw i think steemit can survive by being a propaganda warzone.  whale might forced to buy alot of steempower to advertise on steem, or doing black campaign on it.

[generalizethis]

I think you will see packaging innovation (which users can re-gift to their fellow think-a-likes).

Ad hoc link sharing is not as efficient/universal for the user as what I am contemplating to actually fix the ranking sort by grouping like-mindedness algorithmically.

i think generalizethis suggest a pool of circlejerk and make everyone rich. which most of his comrades already done against dash.    

btw i think steemit can survive by being a propaganda warzone.  whale might forced to buy alot of steempower to advertise on steem, or doing black campaign on it.

What I wrote, and you choose to misinterpret (misappropriate), is that some innovation (packaging regardless of content as mentioned) might shine on the steemit platform. That's neither a bold statement or one that endorses a circle jerk mentality.

[noobtrader]

I think you will see packaging innovation (which users can re-gift to their fellow think-a-likes).

Ad hoc link sharing is not as efficient/universal for the user as what I am contemplating to actually fix the ranking sort by grouping like-mindedness algorithmically.

i think generalizethis suggest a pool of circlejerk and make everyone rich. which most of his comrades already done against dash.    

btw i think steemit can survive by being a propaganda warzone.  whale might forced to buy alot of steempower to advertise on steem, or doing black campaign on it.

What I wrote, and you choose to misinterpret (misappropriate), is that some innovation (packaging regardless of content as mentioned) might shine on the steemit platform. That's neither a bold statement or one that endorses a circle jerk mentality.

I did  not misintrepret or any other miss as you suggest, pls think again...

Circlejerk
A group discussion or activity between like-minded individuals that validates mutual biases or goals in a non-confrontational environment.

if you post an article praising monero, and then your comrades which btw also  "fellow (of) think-a-likes"  all voting your article, i think thats fit the definition of circlejerk, no