Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[yermom]

Remember you were an Average Joe once...

While we keep learning, it's our duty to let them know what are governments doing, what is exactly capitalism, how money works, and the meaning of freedom... I'm a dreamer I know

[1714759235]

1714759235

[becoin]

So how you guys liking that back-and-forth wash trading?

Feels just like a groundswell of overwhelming public demand, doesn't it?  At this rate we'll be over $5K in no time!  /s

$5K is a done deal. Interesting question is if we go over $10K by the end of this year?

So sure are we? Hope that you are right, but I'm curious what you are attributing that to.

I'm not sure that Average Joe, after reading the headlines about BTC-e's demise and that bitcoin is used by criminals, will be falling all over himself to buy ANY bitcoin right now. Especially when he has absolutely no fkn clue what either SegWit or SegWit2X are, nor does he care.

Big money is just waiting the 'correct' time to enter Bitcoin. They are losing patience and starting to panic why market isn't dumping in light of HF fud, 1stAug, chain split, SEC ruling on ICOs, BCC, and btc-e news. A lot of people that shorted Bitcoin are now biting their nails.

[savetherainforest]

So how you guys liking that back-and-forth wash trading?

Feels just like a groundswell of overwhelming public demand, doesn't it?  At this rate we'll be over $5K in no time!  /s

$5K is a done deal. Interesting question is if we go over $10K by the end of this year?

So sure are we? Hope that you are right, but I'm curious what you are attributing that to.

I'm not sure that Average Joe, after reading the headlines about BTC-e's demise and that bitcoin is used by criminals, will be falling all over himself to buy ANY bitcoin right now. Especially when he has absolutely no fkn clue what either SegWit or SegWit2X are, nor does he care.

Big money is just waiting the 'correct' time to enter Bitcoin. They are losing patience and starting to panic why market isn't dumping in light of HF fud, 1stAug, chain split, SEC ruling on ICOs, BCC, and btc-e news. A lot of people that shorted Bitcoin are now biting their nails.

I keep wondering the same thing.. When are they gonna come and buy some?? Because when they do everything will go apesh!t.. with blood and paper money flying on the walls. The exchanges will go absolutely bonkers! Vertical will be the way! Trying to flush out coins from all corners of the world with a higher, higher and higher price for each coin from those that hodl so they can regain control of the manipulation.

[ShroomsKit_Disgrace]

As the price always goes opposite direction it seems to be reasonable, it can only go DOWN from here:

1. BTC-e + SEC + BCC + segwit activation drama = obvious massive crash (yesterday news)

2. Since crash didn't happen, now people are like: Jezzz!!! This is super bullish! 1st August to the moon!

3. Since 1st of August will not moon, and probably new info from BTC-e may suggest there are 66k coins ready to dump somewhere = supercrash.

I hope I am wrong.

[European Central Bank]

I keep wondering the same thing.. When are they gonna come and buy some?? Because when they do everything will go apesh!t.. with blood and paper money flying on the walls. The exchanges will go absolutely bonkers! Vertical will be the way! Trying to flush out coins from all corners of the world with a higher, higher and higher price for each coin from those that hodl so they can regain control of the manipulation.

big money does not get big by going on an exchange and buying everything with two hands.

it buys otc, but only after crashing the market to the best of its ability.

[bitserve]

As the price always goes opposite direction it seems to be reasonable, it can only go DOWN from here:

1. BTC-e + SEC + BCC + segwit activation drama = obvious massive crash (yesterday news)

2. Since crash didn't happen, now people are like: Jezzz!!! This is super bullish! 1st August to the moon!

3. Since 1st of August will not moon, and probably new info from BTC-e may suggest there are 66k coins ready to dump somewhere = supercrash.

I hope I am wrong.

I wouldn't worry too much about those 66k because either:

- They are already confiscated.
- They are controlled by other BTC-e  owners

In first case it will take years before those coins get auctioned. It is also probable another lawsuit from Mtgox claiming those coins.
In second case, either BTC-e reopens or they guy just hand it over to authorities. At this moment, other participants of BTC-e must be scared as hell. I don't think they will do anything with the coins in some long time if ever, plus those coins are being heavily monitored and it won't be easy to try convert them to fiat without incurring in very high risks.

About your point 1... it is you who thought that would mean a price crash... For me it was somewhat bullish/neutral: There have been almost no drama in the segwit activation process, in fact it is going smoothly and with 100% consensus. BCC, meh. And it is not that bad that regulators are starting to enforce the regulation that was theoretically in place since a few years now.

Also, you are assuming 1 Aug will not moon. I don't expect it to moon either. I expect it to start rising and breaking ATH a few days later. For moon, you will have to wait for october/november.

I don't have a crystal ball, but besides the drama Bitcoin is in a better position now than it has ever been.

[JimboToronto]

average joe will not drive the price up until many more years have passed. no one cares what average joe thinks for now.

So nefarious market manipulators and shady Chinese miners are the only ones that matter for now. Actual users don't matter.

Got it.

I guess it depends on how you define "average Joe".

At this still early time in Bitcoin's short history, employee consumers making small retail purchases certainly don't represent more than a tiny fraction of Bitcoin use.

Bitcoin's main functions at present are as a speculative investment, a secure place to store wealth pseudonymously, and primarily as a cheap fast way to move money internationally.

[savetherainforest]

I keep wondering the same thing.. When are they gonna come and buy some?? Because when they do everything will go apesh!t.. with blood and paper money flying on the walls. The exchanges will go absolutely bonkers! Vertical will be the way! Trying to flush out coins from all corners of the world with a higher, higher and higher price for each coin from those that hodl so they can regain control of the manipulation.

big money does not get big by going on an exchange and buying everything with two hands.

it buys otc, but only after crashing the market to the best of its ability.

OTC transactions are 10% - 20% more expensive than the exchange ones! And also... I think they would create their own exchanges, that are in their own will of command!

[Torque]

Big money is just waiting the 'correct' time to enter Bitcoin.

Heard this one before. Heard it in 2014, after the market had peaked. In fact, there are tweets from mid 2014 where people like Barry Silbert were saying that exact same thing, that "big money" and "Wall Street" were right around the corner to come flooding in any minute.

They never did.

[Ludwig Von]

Big money is just waiting the 'correct' time to enter Bitcoin.

Heard this one before. Heard it in 2014, after the market had peaked. In fact, there are tweets from mid 2014 where people like Barry Silbert were saying that exact same thing, that "big money" and "Wall Street" were right around the corner to come flooding in any minute.

They never did.

Are you sure? I think they are already in. The Asian mom and pop investors (gamblers) are not sufficient to explain this years raise. As always, the banksters come in via the backdoor, then pump up and then start selling to the public.

[bitserve]

I keep wondering the same thing.. When are they gonna come and buy some?? Because when they do everything will go apesh!t.. with blood and paper money flying on the walls. The exchanges will go absolutely bonkers! Vertical will be the way! Trying to flush out coins from all corners of the world with a higher, higher and higher price for each coin from those that hodl so they can regain control of the manipulation.

big money does not get big by going on an exchange and buying everything with two hands.

it buys otc, but only after crashing the market to the best of its ability.

OTC transactions are 10% - 20% more expensive than the exchange ones! And also... I think they would create their own exchanges, that are in their own will of command!

OTC is much more than "localbitcoins". Big players buy and sell OTC in huge quantities (1000-10.000+) and arrange whatever price they both are willing to accept, usually with a negotiation, it may be higher or lower than exchanges price depending on many factors.

Also, try to buy 10.000BTC on any exchange and you will see where the price goes...

[becoin]

Heard this one before. Heard it in 2014, after the market had peaked.

People that bought that peak now have 150% profit!

[FractalUniverse]

looks like finex will credit bch  [bcc] using "socialized distribution coefficient"

Bitcoin Cash (BCH) Token Distribution
July 27, 2017

A minority of Bitcoin miners will be forking on August 1st, 2017 to create a new chain called Bitcoin Cash. The fork does not impact Bitcoin balances, but it creates a new token. At the time of the fork, all Bitcoin addresses holding a balance will automatically have equivalent balances in Bitcoin Cash.

There has been a variety of responses by the community about how to handle this new token. After a significant show of interest from our customers, we have decided to take steps to facilitate the distribution of Bitcoin Cash balances to those holding a settled Bitcoin balance on Bitfinex. We may also list markets for this new token, but that decision will be made after the fork event.

Although we see this token referred to as BCC on other platforms, unfortunately, that ticker symbol is already in use on our platform by the chain-split token representing Bitcoin Core. As such, we plan to use BCH as the ticker symbol and “Bcash” as the descriptive name to avoid confusion with Bitcoin.

Although several months ago, we developed a methodology for handling contentious hardforks, we will be applying a different methodology for what we regard as a spurious forking of the Bitcoin project with little mining support. Although we have not supported such Bitcoin UTXO-based distributions in the past (Stellar Lumens, Clams, etc.), we will support the distribution of Bitcoin Cash due to significant customer interest.

Distribution Policy

BCH will be distributed to settled bitcoin wallet balances as of the UTC timestamp of the first forking block, which is expected to occur on August 1st, 2017.

The token distribution methodology will be:

    All BTC wallet balances will receive BCH
    Margin longs in BTC/USD and margin shorts in XXX/BTC will not receive BCH
    Margin shorts in BTC/USD and margin longs in XXX/BTC will not pay BCH
    BTC Lenders will receive BCH

Due to the net amount of BTC committed in margin positions at the time of the fork, the above methodology may result in Bitfinex seeing a surplus or deficit of BCH. As such, we will be resolving this discrepancy in the form of a socialized distribution coefficient. For example, currently, there are more longs than shorts on the platform, causing a distribution coefficient of ~1.091 (Meaning that for each qualifying BTC a user will receive 1.091 BCH). The actual coefficient will be calculated at the moment of the distribution. Please note that if there are more shorts than longs at the fork event, this coefficient will be less than one. This coefficient can be roughly computed from publicly available information from our API (longs & shorts) and the Blockchain (cold storage).

We recognize that this model is not perfect, but given the short time frames imposed upon us, better choices are not available. It would be an undue burden to create negative BCH balances for BTC/USD shorts and XXX/BTC longs. Furthermore, lenders may be locked in for up to 30 days and would be adversely impacted. In the end, we believe that this solution creates the least amount of disruption and facilitates a timely distribution of BCH.

Margin longs who wish to receive BCH should consider either claiming some or all of their position or exchanging and holding BTC collateral in their margin wallet as opposed to other assets. We hope to make withdrawals available soon after the fork, assuming everything is fine with the BCH blockchain.

Once again we want to reassure our customers that your bitcoin is safe and this event will not affect your bitcoin balances, positions, or loans - you will simply be receiving an additional token balance based upon the aforementioned methodology.

[becoin]

Heard this one before. Heard it in 2014, after the market had peaked.

                             and held for two and a half years
                                /
People that bought ^  that peak now have 150% profit!

FTFY

Wut?
150% ROI for 2.5 years... and that is somethin bad?!

[Torque]

I keep wondering the same thing.. When are they gonna come and buy some?? Because when they do everything will go apesh!t.. with blood and paper money flying on the walls. The exchanges will go absolutely bonkers! Vertical will be the way! Trying to flush out coins from all corners of the world with a higher, higher and higher price for each coin from those that hodl so they can regain control of the manipulation.

big money does not get big by going on an exchange and buying everything with two hands.

it buys otc, but only after crashing the market to the best of its ability.

This. This is how it works.

The most bullish scenario I can imagine right now has nothing to do with SegWit, or aversion of a hard fork, or any of that crap. None of that is even remotely interesting.

The bullish scenario has to do with the CFTC approval of bitcoin option swaps through LedgerX. That's supposedly coming online in Sept/Oct. timeframe. With that we could see some large hedge fund money move in, but not before they first short the market into the absolute ground to shake out weak hands.

If Sept/Oct passes with no new money coming in, or even after the first of the year in 2018, then I don't see anything else as bullish on the horizon right now.

[becoin]

This. This is how it works.

Everybody that shorted will be REKT. This is how Bitcoin works. Enough said.

[Torque]

This. This is how it works.

Everybody that shorted will be REKT. This is how Bitcoin works. Enough said.

Dude, please don't make statements that make no sense. To put it more succinctly for you:

The market maker(s) with the mega capital to push the market to new heights, are also the same people who can just as easily slam it down and short into the ground at the same time.  They don't intend on giving you any advanced warning either way. And it doesn't matter what the current "market sentiment" is. They can change that direction with a click of a mouse or keystroke.

If you can't understand that, then you (the little guppie) will be the one who gets REKT.

This how Bitcoin works. Enough said.

[yermom]

This. This is how it works.

Everybody that shorted will be REKT. This is how Bitcoin works. Enough said.

Dude, please don't make statements that make no sense. To put it more succinctly for you:

The market maker(s) with the mega capital to push the market to new heights, are also the same people who can just as easily slam it down and short into the ground at the same time.  They don't intend on giving you any advanced warning either way. And it doesn't matter what the current "market sentiment" is. They can change that direction with a click of a mouse or keystroke.

If you can't understand that, then you (the little guppie) will be the one who gets REKT.

This how Bitcoin works. Enough said.

Sorry if I'm getting into yours, but do you think what will happen if they just "click" and Bitcoin vanishes?

[jbreher]

I am thinking about pushing a Segwit patch to Bitcoin Cash github. Any chance it would be approved on time before 1 Aug?

You can try. I'm guessing you'll be met with an overwhelming chorus of NAKs.

Damn Bitcoin Cash Core ! They want to control everything! They are stopping real scalability for their own benefit!

Hahah.

On a more serious note: There are several other mechanisms that fix malleability. There is still a discussion to be had as to whether or not SegWit is the best approach.

Fixing malleability is important, but my predilection for Segwit goes much more far than that.

- INSTANT transactions...

- Unlimited transaction capacity...

- Once we have L2 in place, many of the improvements could be done as an additional layer...

- With Rootstock ...

Yeah. See, the thing is: none of that is dependent upon SegWit. A fix for malleability -- any fix for malleability -- simplifies those advances, but even that is not required for the features of which you speak.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

Floyd Mayweather just hash tagged bitcoin & eth in his latest instagram post.

Just saying.