Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[jojo69]

The choice between the legacy bitcoin and 2x is a choice between a continuously proven and non-censorable store of value, and a provenly compromised store of value with temporarily lower transaction fees.

that CD opinion piece really nails it

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[Arriemoller]

So, I have talked a little bit more with Coinomi about the upcoming fork to clear things up.
Here's what I have so far.

They will support both chains after the fork.
Bitcoin will still be called bitcoin and still be on the legacy chain.
They will  implement replay protection for SW2X on their wallets.
You will be able to claim your SW2x coins.

Sounds good to me, I will keep my coins there during the fork.

Just be extra careful if you have a lot of coins. Mine are in a TREZOR and I dare not touch them. I had to change my old recovery seed to a fresh one because of the BCH hard fork, during which my coins always stayed in the TREZOR and the seeds kept offline.

I use Coinomi and it's a nice wallet, but I'm not sure I want to transfer all my stash there. I think I'll wait for a solution by the TREZOR team.

I don't have a Trezor or similar device yet, so for me it was either a core node, but I have just bought a new computer, and I can't be bothered to download the whole chain right no. Or Electrum, or Coinomi. And since I got assurances from Coinomi that my coins would stay on the legacy chain, and they would enable replay protection, I opted for Coinomi.
Had I had a Trezor I might have kept my coins there, seems pretty safe..

[Arriemoller]

As soon as it is safe I will move my stash to Electrum, then claim my BTG and SW2X coins, move them to Blockchain, get a new seed for my Coinomi wallet, move the free coins back there and use them as spending money, and the original stash will stay on Electrum as a savings account.

[Dabs]

You don't have to join the Canadian Forces to get a uniform; there are plenty of army surplus shops in the area that sell those... though you might not be able to pay with Bitcoin

Oh, sorry, I thought you came from somewhere else, my mistake.

I don't want to wear the full uniform unless I'm actually authorized to do so. It also looks sloppy if you only wear half or part of a uniform, I see that all the time in other countries.

I don't want to be caught impersonating an officer unless that's actually part of my job (if I become some sort of spy or secret agent or something.)

[julian071]

There are some walls on Kraken.

[Gab0]

https://cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-needs-new-proof-of-work-chain-after-segwit2x-says-bitcoinorg-co-owner

Not 2 but 3 bitcoins after the HF! I've expected that core team is secretly developing an emergency nuke POW change in case 2x wins. I know that some still think the legacy chain can survive with 20% hash support but it is not realistic. In this case unfortunatelly the original bitcoin will die and everyone will say: "The king is dead. Long live the king!" It remains to believe that by some magic wand the current price is transferred to one of the forks.

“We won’t surrender and we won’t compromise. A new hard fork will be released with a new PoW algorithm and we’ll carry on as normal.”

[...]

“The market and exchanges should be prepared to support three different forks of Bitcoin this November. The original chain, the 2x chain, and the new Bitcoin chain with a better PoW,” he concludes.

“As soon as the new PoW hard fork binaries are released on Bitcoin.org, I intend to fully commit to supporting that chain and calling it “Bitcoin,” even if hash rate returns to the original chain at a later date.”

It seems really absurd to me. It has no logic
They do not support an increase in block size (a technically simple change in the protocol), but if they plan to make a change in the PoW?
Has it been discussed and proven that it would be a "better PoW"?

What, do you think, are the reasons why Core does not support x2? It is a serious question. If they did, the market, the users and the miners would stay with them, and, more importantly, there would not be a contentious hardfork.

[Arriemoller]

You don't have to join the Canadian Forces to get a uniform; there are plenty of army surplus shops in the area that sell those... though you might not be able to pay with Bitcoin

Oh, sorry, I thought you came from somewhere else, my mistake.

I don't want to wear the full uniform unless I'm actually authorized to do so. It also looks sloppy if you only wear half or part of a uniform, I see that all the time in other countries.

I don't want to be caught impersonating an officer unless that's actually part of my job (if I become some sort of spy or secret agent or something.)

Uniforms are nice, especially the blue Navy/Marines. But I might be biased since I got one of those myself. Retired but still allowed to use it at some occasions.

[Torque]

The choice between the legacy bitcoin and 2x is a choice between a continuously proven and non-censorable store of value, and a provenly compromised store of value with temporarily lower transaction fees.

that CD opinion piece really nails it

And how about we add the non-existent 2x dev team? One lone wolf idiot programmer that has already abandoned the project is neither a 'dev' or a 'dev team'. How anyone with a brain would see this as the future version of Bitcoin is beyond logic or reason.

[Gab0]

The choice between the legacy bitcoin and 2x is a choice between a continuously proven and non-censorable store of value, and a provenly compromised store of value with temporarily lower transaction fees.

that CD opinion piece really nails it

And how about we add the non-existent 2x dev team? One lone wolf idiot programmer that has already abandoned the project is neither a 'dev' or a 'dev team'. How anyone with a brain would see this as the future version of Bitcoin is beyond logic or reason.

I do not think the market, the miners or users who subscribe to the x2 consider btc1 as a long-term customer. Core has a lot of technical experience. Btc1 is a consequence to the requirement of a part of the market. I do not think it's a long-term solution.

[Paashaas]

And how about we add the non-existent 2x dev team? One lone wolf idiot programmer that has already abandoned the project is neither a 'dev' or a 'dev team'. How anyone with a brain would see this as the future version of Bitcoin is beyond logic or reason.

Jeff had some spare time left to spin more 'zombie' nodes out of thin air.

This whole 2x is one major dogshit omfg man...        

           

The most disgusting is this one from BitPay...i'll never forget.. (BitPay still haven't activated Segwit but it is a fronliner to push this bullshit through users throat)  

[julian071]

So, the consensus seems to be that this Segwit2x thing is going to be quite the clustefuck. What will that mean for the price? Is the upwards power of all the fresh fiat flowing in enough to prop up the price? Or should I dump everything now and buy back cheaper later?

[vroom]

So, the consensus seems to be that this Segwit2x thing is going to be quite the clustefuck. What will that mean for the price? Is the upwards power of all the fresh fiat flowing in enough to prop up the price? Or should I dump everything now and buy back cheaper later?

If someone could say this with 100% certainty he would make a fortune. We have to wait and see.
My guess is, we will see a dip because bch/b2x supporters dump a lot btc. Once the dust settles and the attack is fought off there will be a big rebounce to a new ATH.

[jojo69]

OK motherfuckers, here is the plan;

Most of us are in the Northern hemisphere, and it's getting colder anyway.  Blow the dust out of all those long obsolete miners and point them at BCH for now, do NOT point them at BTC yet.

It is a small gesture compared to the attack farms to be sure, but for many of us it is all we can realistically do, aside from hodling and running full nodes.

Be ready at forktime and switch all hash to BTC, hey, you got to heat the house anyway right?

I know, drop in the bucket, but it can't hurt.

[gembitz]

And how about we add the non-existent 2x dev team? One lone wolf idiot programmer that has already abandoned the project is neither a 'dev' or a 'dev team'. How anyone with a brain would see this as the future version of Bitcoin is beyond logic or reason.

Jeff had some spare time left to spin more 'zombie' nodes out of thin air.

This whole 2x is one major dogshit omfg man...        

           

The most disgusting is this one from BitPay...i'll never forget.. (BitPay still haven't activated Segwit but it is a fronliner to push this bullshit through users throat)  

why you all Jeff haters ?    ~he is trusted leet core dev brah! x2 = moon&mars!! <.< weeeeee

[AlexGR]

As I type BTC prices are bouncing between $7200 and $7400 - so I am going to use $7,300 as a price reference.  So let's look what is our current price appreciation that has taken place since the "scaling debate really got heated":

1) $250   -  29.2x

2) $350 - 20.86 x

3) $450 - 16.22 x


So, yeah, these nut job big blockers have been arguing doom and gloom of bitcoin since before $250 and arguing "scale or die" until they have been blue in the face, and the market does not seem to give a ratt's ass about their supposed doom and gloom assessments.

In part, it's because bitcoin is scalable beyond the transaction per second metric.

A blockchain might be doing 50 tx/sec, with 10$ average value per tx.
Another blockchain might be doing 5 tx/sec with 1000$ average value per tx.

Over a year, the first will have done 15.7bn USD in volume, while the second will have done 157.7 bn USD in volume.

There are plenty of blockchains out there who are resembling the first case: Potential for a lot of tx/sec but they are either unused or have very low value. Bitcoin is escalating the avg transaction amount, upwards, thus scaling how much it transacts on a daily, weekly, monthly, or annual basis.

Estimated tx volume, per day, in USD: https://blockchain.info/charts/estimated-transaction-volume-usd

According to the stat, we've gone from transacting 200mn per day to ~2bn USD per day. That's 10x volume scaling in a year, with pretty much the same tx/sec (the bump from Segwit to 4mb is relatively recent so I'm not accounting for that).

At 2bn USD per day, we are talking about 730bn USD per year, which is >2 times what paypal did in 2016 (354bn).

Needless to say that this is also achieved in a manner more economical than paypal, since paypal gets 2-3% of the transacted amount. For 730bn USD transferred it'd take something like 15-25bn USD in fees, plus another 3% for currency exchanges for people transacting in different currencies.

[conspirosphere.tk]

The choice between the legacy bitcoin and 2x is a choice between a continuously proven and non-censorable store of value, and a provenly compromised store of value with temporarily lower transaction fees.

"#Bitcoin was created so you can buy a Lambo. Not a cup of coffee #No2x"
Quote of the day

[gembitz]

The choice between the legacy bitcoin and 2x is a choice between a continuously proven and non-censorable store of value, and a provenly compromised store of value with temporarily lower transaction fees.

"#Bitcoin was created so you can buy a Lambo. Not a cup of coffee #No2x"
Quote of the day

why not both? lel

[Ludwig Von]

The choice between the legacy bitcoin and 2x is a choice between a continuously proven and non-censorable store of value, and a provenly compromised store of value with temporarily lower transaction fees.

"#Bitcoin was created so you can buy a Lambo. Not a cup of coffee #No2x"
Quote of the day

why not both? lel

Forget all these substitutes for small d...s. Buy the coffee shop instead... .

[rolling]

The choice between the legacy bitcoin and 2x is a choice between a continuously proven and non-censorable store of value, and a provenly compromised store of value with temporarily lower transaction fees.

"#Bitcoin was created so you can buy a Lambo. Not a cup of coffee #No2x"
Quote of the day

Buying coffee with Bitcoin is like using an armored truck and armed guards to protect your $5 payment for your Starbucks coffee.

[mOgliE]

So, I have talked a little bit more with Coinomi about the upcoming fork to clear things up.
Here's what I have so far.

They will support both chains after the fork.
Bitcoin will still be called bitcoin and still be on the legacy chain.
They will  implement replay protection for SW2X on their wallets.
You will be able to claim your SW2x coins.

Sounds good to me, I will keep my coins there during the fork.

Thanks for the tips man!

You have any idea about the possible precautions that should be taken in order to get the new coins too?
Will it be something automatical? I know I was really angry to have lost my new shiny coins after last fork simply because I didn't respect the process for my electrum wallet... That's really a shame to know you've lost 10% of easy money like that