Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[mb300sd]

Bitcoin is by design encouraging saving and thus attracts people who would like to save. (But have only shitty ways of doing so thanks to the inflationary monetary system  )

The is the argument against a gold (or bitcoin) standard by the FED and banking status quo.

Under today's credit fiat system, it makes no sense to "save" money in currency since it continuously inflates. Instead savers are suppose to invest the money into businesses, capital spending, stocks, etc.

The problem is today no one saves this way, instead savers (those with disposable income over expenses) spend money frivolously on vacations/restaurants/crap instead of saving for the long term, and many of those who do invest do so in bubble type assets (i.e. large houses).

The fiat credit system is suppose to work in theory, but in practice it obviously does not. Hence bitcoin. It provides a real escape for true savers.

Saving is good, hoarding like a lunatic is not.

Confession: My name (pseudonym) is Erdogan, and I am addicted to the austrian economics.

Everything that is produced, has to be consumed or invested (in capital goods). When you buy a car, you pay with your work. Or, even easier to understand: when a farmer buys a pair of rubber boots, he really pays with potatoes. The money is just oil in the trading machinery. Money has to be maximally tradable, and it has to keep its value in the short run and the long run.

The two main functions of money, medium of exchange and store of value, are closely related, and you can not have the one, and not the other.

When you save money, you let other people consume what you do not consume. All saving is for the purpose of spending later. Tomorrow, next summer, when you retire, or by your descendants in the next few generations.

Hoarding is just a derogtive name for for saving, and the hate is undeserved. What is bad with letting some needy child getting in front of you in the toilette queue?

The savers (hoarders) deserve to be able to spend the full value of their savings when they later decide to spend.

With bitcoin, of course, you will be able to spend more. That is because bitcoin, the new money, is in the implementation phase. When you save in bitcoin, you do not just save, you are also an entrepreneur. You are paid for your knowledge and vision, by giving the world a better money.

The bitcoiners saw all that they had made, and it was very good.

Let's say only 300000 people own bitcoins today and they all decide to hoard their coins for 20 years. How will this new money spread to the rest of the population?

Those who want in, will buy, the price will rise until some of those hoarding are willing to sell.

I always say I'm going to hold for the long term, but I'm a college student living off of a few thousand bitcoins, there is a price.

[mrm0]

allot of members here are married and have kids and independent life

Isn't it contradictiory in terms? ;-)

Why, oh why, don't I have some fiat in an exchange right now?

[niothor]

Bitcoin is by design encouraging saving and thus attracts people who would like to save. (But have only shitty ways of doing so thanks to the inflationary monetary system  )

The is the argument against a gold (or bitcoin) standard by the FED and banking status quo.

Under today's credit fiat system, it makes no sense to "save" money in currency since it continuously inflates. Instead savers are suppose to invest the money into businesses, capital spending, stocks, etc.

The problem is today no one saves this way, instead savers (those with disposable income over expenses) spend money frivolously on vacations/restaurants/crap instead of saving for the long term, and many of those who do invest do so in bubble type assets (i.e. large houses).

The fiat credit system is suppose to work in theory, but in practice it obviously does not. Hence bitcoin. It provides a real escape for true savers.

Saving is good, hoarding like a lunatic is not.

Confession: My name (pseudonym) is Erdogan, and I am addicted to the austrian economics.

Everything that is produced, has to be consumed or invested (in capital goods). When you buy a car, you pay with your work. Or, even easier to understand: when a farmer buys a pair of rubber boots, he really pays with potatoes. The money is just oil in the trading machinery. Money has to be maximally tradable, and it has to keep its value in the short run and the long run.

The two main functions of money, medium of exchange and store of value, are closely related, and you can not have the one, and not the other.

When you save money, you let other people consume what you do not consume. All saving is for the purpose of spending later. Tomorrow, next summer, when you retire, or by your descendants in the next few generations.

Hoarding is just a derogtive name for for saving, and the hate is undeserved. What is bad with letting some needy child getting in front of you in the toilette queue?

The savers (hoarders) deserve to be able to spend the full value of their savings when they later decide to spend.

With bitcoin, of course, you will be able to spend more. That is because bitcoin, the new money, is in the implementation phase. When you save in bitcoin, you do not just save, you are also an entrepreneur. You are paid for your knowledge and vision, by giving the world a better money.

The bitcoiners saw all that they had made, and it was very good.

Let's say only 300000 people own bitcoins today and they all decide to hoard their coins for 20 years. How will this new money spread to the rest of the population?

Those who want in, will buy, the price will rise until some of those hoarding are willing to sell.

I always say I'm going to hold for the long term, but I'm a college student living off of a few thousand bitcoins, there is a price.

From my understanding somebody is hoarding bitcoins when he has more coins than you do

[VincentX]

From my understanding somebody is hoarding bitcoins when he has more coins than you do

Hoarding occurs when the returns from keeping something become less than what you would get from doing something else, more productive, with it.

No hoarding is currently happening with Bitcoin, just rational saving.

[macsga]

WTF.... I'm tired of this consolidation... I need some CHOO CHOO!!!

[CryptStorm]

Could someone please comment on where they feel the exchange handles shorting well-- I'm asking whether Cavitrex (sp?) and vitrex (sp?) are the best/only game in town to participate in the 'other' successful trade (shorting)?

Thanks in advance. 

Bump. So, how are you guys shorting?

[kurious]

Bitcoin is by design encouraging saving and thus attracts people who would like to save. (But have only shitty ways of doing so thanks to the inflationary monetary system  )

The is the argument against a gold (or bitcoin) standard by the FED and banking status quo.

Under today's credit fiat system, it makes no sense to "save" money in currency since it continuously inflates. Instead savers are suppose to invest the money into businesses, capital spending, stocks, etc.

The problem is today no one saves this way, instead savers (those with disposable income over expenses) spend money frivolously on vacations/restaurants/crap instead of saving for the long term, and many of those who do invest do so in bubble type assets (i.e. large houses).

The fiat credit system is suppose to work in theory, but in practice it obviously does not. Hence bitcoin. It provides a real escape for true savers.

Saving is good, hoarding like a lunatic is not.

Confession: My name (pseudonym) is Erdogan, and I am addicted to the austrian economics.

Everything that is produced, has to be consumed or invested (in capital goods). When you buy a car, you pay with your work. Or, even easier to understand: when a farmer buys a pair of rubber boots, he really pays with potatoes. The money is just oil in the trading machinery. Money has to be maximally tradable, and it has to keep its value in the short run and the long run.

The two main functions of money, medium of exchange and store of value, are closely related, and you can not have the one, and not the other.

When you save money, you let other people consume what you do not consume. All saving is for the purpose of spending later. Tomorrow, next summer, when you retire, or by your descendants in the next few generations.

Hoarding is just a derogtive name for for saving, and the hate is undeserved. What is bad with letting some needy child getting in front of you in the toilette queue?

The savers (hoarders) deserve to be able to spend the full value of their savings when they later decide to spend.

With bitcoin, of course, you will be able to spend more. That is because bitcoin, the new money, is in the implementation phase. When you save in bitcoin, you do not just save, you are also an entrepreneur. You are paid for your knowledge and vision, by giving the world a better money.

The bitcoiners saw all that they had made, and it was very good.

Agree with some of the economics (although I am a Keynesian).

However, we are not gods - we are believers.  There is a difference.

Hehe, nonbeliever here, I just had to loan and adapt this elegant phrase from the bible.

I know and I can forgive you.  It's nice to see economics theory here instead of mathemetics and physics for a change.  It is supposed to be a child board of 'Economics' after all...

[Jamievs]

Could someone please comment on where they feel the exchange handles shorting well-- I'm asking whether Cavitrex (sp?) and vitrex (sp?) are the best/only game in town to participate in the 'other' successful trade (shorting)?

Thanks in advance. 

Bump. So, how are you guys shorting?

It's possible to go short? 

[oroboras]

So, this post-drop triangle draws to a close. Up or down next?

[Davyd05]

Could someone please comment on where they feel the exchange handles shorting well-- I'm asking whether Cavitrex (sp?) and vitrex (sp?) are the best/only game in town to participate in the 'other' successful trade (shorting)?

Thanks in advance. 

Bump. So, how are you guys shorting?

It's possible to go short? 

unless they came about today. no.
bitfenix was the only place I thought ran that

[justusranvier]

Let's say only 300000 people own bitcoins today and they all decide to hoard their coins for 20 years. How will this new money spread to the rest of the population?

If the rest of the population wants the bitcoins, they will offer of something in trade which the "hoarders" prefer to have instead of their bitcoins. It's the same as any act of voluntary trade.

Who's responsible for forcing people to create and operate the restaurants where you want to eat? Nobody.

If you and enough other customers are willing to pay enough to make it worth someone's time to build and operate restaurant, then they'll do it.

Who's business is it if somebody decides to refrain, for any reason, from spending their currency? Nobody's.

[kurious]

Could someone please comment on where they feel the exchange handles shorting well-- I'm asking whether Cavitrex (sp?) and vitrex (sp?) are the best/only game in town to participate in the 'other' successful trade (shorting)?

Thanks in advance. 

Bump. So, how are you guys shorting?

It's possible to go short? 

I checked but only contracts around are either dodgy, or just too expensive to make sense...  

[oroboras]

So, this post-drop triangle draws to a close. Up or down next?

Down, apparently XD

[Davyd05]

sat down to see the most recent dumping..another loop

edit 2200 sell wall at 700 and its gone but not munched

[kurious]

Jeez - some whales are betting big against the price.

[macsga]

NO WOO WOO - CHOO CHOO!!!

[Krabby]

Someone's having a whale of a time

[micalith]

next bottom 400, after a few bump bull traps?

[freethink2013]

China got us to 1200 and china crashed us back down. There's going to be huge uncertainty until china figures out the reality of their situation.

On a plus note the black market in china is probably bigger than the economies of most nations.

[kurious]

Someone's having a whale of a time

And then popping a 1000 BTC wall in at 699...   Price push down.