Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

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[bitcoinPsycho]

Roses are red
Violets are blue
Bitcoin is going up
So fuck you

[BitcoinBunny]

Oh no, bitcoin crashed to levels not seen since 2 days ago.

[Arriemoller]

Oh no, bitcoin crashed to levels not seen since 2 days ago.

And three weeks ago, and seven months ago.

[cAPSLOCK]

Good news not moving the price much. Like CEO of Apple invested in Crypto or Elon Musk selling 20 BN of his stocks for Bitcoin. But one small unconfirmed FUD and we see a massive dump. This market is so shaky.

When the price moves, it tends to leave the order book a bit flat behind it. A well executed FUD dump like this can knock things back down pretty easily.

When did E. Musk say he was putting the billions in BTC?

I don't know if he said that. I know people were suggesting he invest the billions he gets from selling tesla shares into bitcoin.

https://news.bitcoin.com/elon-musk-twitter-poll-decide-sell-20-billion-tesla-stock-investors-buy-bitcoin/

A number of people suggested that Musk should use the proceeds from selling his TSLA stock to buy BTC. For example, Microstrategy CEO Michael Saylor suggested: “If the goal is diversification, an alternate strategy to consider is converting the TSLA balance sheet to a Bitcoin Standard and purchasing $25 billion in BTC.

Syke posted this, but I don't know if Elon Musk actually said it.

Bear in mind other @RelevantElon tweets aren't very serious, such as this one.

https://twitter.com/RelevantElon/status/1454198388447223808

PRETTY sure that's a parody account run by a bitcoinner.  There is also a relevantPeterSchiff account...

[Dabs]

The issue about "lost" bitcoins has been discussed some time ago. Right now, there is nothing that can be done about them and likely nothing will ever be done about them. Lost = Lost and that's it. There are always new coins being mined, and transaction fees get included in the block reward, so there will always be new mined coins.

The issue that is being discussed are about ancient coins that don't live in addresses, the ones before the 1xxx addresses, the ones before the legacy ones. Any addresses that begin with 1, or 3, or bc1q are going to remain the way they are and never moved unless the owner or holder of the private key spends them.

I think those are the pay to pub key transactions. No addresses, just public keys. Those were already "obsolete" around after 2010 or 2011. Those are the only ones that may be "questionable" as they are not protected by a hash of the public key.

[WastedLTC]

Bear in mind other @RelevantElon tweets aren't very serious, such as this one.

https://twitter.com/RelevantElon/status/1454198388447223808

Texas Institute of Technology & Science
https://www.indy100.com/science-tech/elon-musk-texas-university-name-b1947616

[hisslyness]

Like I said I was born in 1957 and will almost certainly be dead by 2069 as 112 is not going to happen.

But if BTC is to wind out and whale and be 1 or 2 or 3 million even 10,000,000  and there are 2,000,000 in Frozen coins they will be moved or set back into circulation.

As  1,000,000 x 2,000,000 = 2,000,000,000,000 / 2 trillion to and 10 million x 2 mill = 20 trillion in coins.

No way is that staying idle for all time.  

The pressure put on them going back to recirculate will be huge. The power grid and gear used at that time will need to be fed.

Not a worry for this in 2021 or 2029 or 2039 or 2049 but by 2059 yeah if the world and btc have survived they will be big pressure for that event.

To those that disagree fine hope you live to see it not happen and come to my grave and laugh at me.

Philip... Oh, Philip... What's happening to you? Is this some kind of joke, or even a r0ach-like metamorphosis?

If what you're saying ever happens, it will be the end of Bitcoin. It doesn't make any sense and, frankly, I'm very surprised you're saying it.

Keys ---> Coins.
Keys lost = Coins lost.

That's a one-way street, can't work around it. Putting backdoors to coins is equivalent to breaking Bitcoin's security. Who is to decide when, how much, and from where? Coin age? And what if the original owner suddenly appears? Would his keys suddenly become invalid? What you're saying implies a central authority taking control of Bitcoin's blockchain, and is equivalent to hard-coding the invalidation of keys in the Bitcoin protocol. This is sweet music to CSW's ears, should a retarded judge ever award him rights to Satoshi's coins.

Sorry to have to say this, but what you're suggesting is probably the biggest pile of nonsense I've ever read in WO...

It is simple fucking math!

If I had 10 Apples and You have 10 Apples and someone else has 10 Apples, and each apple will swap for 1 Hoe..

Say for some unknown reason you lost your 10 Apples and for the life of you, can not find it anywhere, then guess what!

1. You can’t have any Hoe’s
2. I can now buy 3 Hoe’s for 2 Apples
3. That someone else can also swap 2 Apples for 3 Hoe’s
4. You potentially may have to be a Hoe if you to want some apples, but wait that means there are now more Hoe’s, which means my 1 Apple may be buying 3 or 4 Hoes now!

In other words, the lost/missing coins have already been recycled, in a much more intelligent way. If you can not see it already then you really don’t understand what Bitcoin truely is.

Mining lost coins.. that the same as money printer going brrrrrr….

[cAPSLOCK]

Back to the 64xxx again I see, getting really tired of this, really, really, tired.

I wish I could go back to.. Oh.. I dunno early 2021 (or how about ~March of 2020!) and quote current you to previous you!

Previous you would come smack current you in the nose.

But yeah.  I am tired of it too :|  LOL

[cAPSLOCK]

Like I said I was born in 1957 and will almost certainly be dead by 2069 as 112 is not going to happen.

But if BTC is to wind out and whale and be 1 or 2 or 3 million even 10,000,000  and there are 2,000,000 in Frozen coins they will be moved or set back into circulation.

As  1,000,000 x 2,000,000 = 2,000,000,000,000 / 2 trillion to and 10 million x 2 mill = 20 trillion in coins.

No way is that staying idle for all time. 

The pressure put on them going back to recirculate will be huge. The power grid and gear used at that time will need to be fed.

Not a worry for this in 2021 or 2029 or 2039 or 2049 but by 2059 yeah if the world and btc have survived they will be big pressure for that event.

To those that disagree fine hope you live to see it not happen and come to my grave and laugh at me.

Philip... Oh, Philip... What's happening to you? Is this some kind of joke, or even a r0ach-like metamorphosis?

If what you're saying ever happens, it will be the end of Bitcoin. It doesn't make any sense and, frankly, I'm very surprised you're saying it.

Keys ---> Coins.
Keys lost = Coins lost.

That's a one-way street, can't work around it. Putting backdoors to coins is equivalent to breaking Bitcoin's security. Who is to decide when, how much, and from where? Coin age? And what if the original owner suddenly appears? Would his keys suddenly become invalid? What you're saying implies a central authority taking control of Bitcoin's blockchain, and is equivalent to hard-coding the invalidation of keys in the Bitcoin protocol. This is sweet music to CSW's ears, should a retarded judge ever award him rights to Satoshi's coins.

Sorry to have to say this, but what you're suggesting is probably the biggest pile of nonsense I've ever read in WO...

It is simple fucking math!

If I had 10 Apples and You have 10 Apples and someone else has 10 Apples, and each apple will swap for 1 Hoe..

Say for some unknown reason you lost your 10 Apples and for the life of you, can not find it anywhere, then guess what!

1. You can’t have any Hoe’s
2. I can now buy 3 Hoe’s for 2 Apples
3. That someone else can also swap 2 Apples for 3 Hoe’s
4. You potentially may have to be a Hoe if you to want some apples, but wait that means there are now more Hoe’s, which means my 1 Apple may be buying 3 or 4 Hoes now!

In other words, the lost/missing coins have already been recycled, in a much more intelligent way. If you can not see it already then you really don’t understand what Bitcoin truely is.

Mining lost coins.. that the same as money printer going brrrrrr….

This is really good.

It's one of the harder things to come to terms with in Bitcoin.  But the ability to lose coins forever is a feature, not a bug.

The limit is also very arguably important.

And any changes to the monetary policy of Bitcoin, PARTICULARLY well before it is deeply established, will most likely destroy it.

Now... the conversation as to what happens once the subsidy runs out?  Block size, et al?  Well that conversation may be worth having.  But the solution does NOT lie in changing Bitcoin's monetary policy.

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[philipma1957]

Like I said I was born in 1957 and will almost certainly be dead by 2069 as 112 is not going to happen.

But if BTC is to wind out and whale and be 1 or 2 or 3 million even 10,000,000  and there are 2,000,000 in Frozen coins they will be moved or set back into circulation.

As  1,000,000 x 2,000,000 = 2,000,000,000,000 / 2 trillion to and 10 million x 2 mill = 20 trillion in coins.

No way is that staying idle for all time.  

The pressure put on them going back to recirculate will be huge. The power grid and gear used at that time will need to be fed.

Not a worry for this in 2021 or 2029 or 2039 or 2049 but by 2059 yeah if the world and btc have survived they will be big pressure for that event.

To those that disagree fine hope you live to see it not happen and come to my grave and laugh at me.

Philip... Oh, Philip... What's happening to you? Is this some kind of joke, or even a r0ach-like metamorphosis?

If what you're saying ever happens, it will be the end of Bitcoin. It doesn't make any sense and, frankly, I'm very surprised you're saying it.

Keys ---> Coins.
Keys lost = Coins lost.

That's a one-way street, can't work around it. Putting backdoors to coins is equivalent to breaking Bitcoin's security. Who is to decide when, how much, and from where? Coin age? And what if the original owner suddenly appears? Would his keys suddenly become invalid? What you're saying implies a central authority taking control of Bitcoin's blockchain, and is equivalent to hard-coding the invalidation of keys in the Bitcoin protocol. This is sweet music to CSW's ears, should a retarded judge ever award him rights to Satoshi's coins.

Sorry to have to say this, but what you're suggesting is probably the biggest pile of nonsense I've ever read in WO...

It is simple fucking math!

If I had 10 Apples and You have 10 Apples and someone else has 10 Apples, and each apple will swap for 1 Hoe..

Say for some unknown reason you lost your 10 Apples and for the life of you, can not find it anywhere, then guess what!

1. You can’t have any Hoe’s
2. I can now buy 3 Hoe’s for 2 Apples
3. That someone else can also swap 2 Apples for 3 Hoe’s
4. You potentially may have to be a Hoe if you to want some apples, but wait that means there are now more Hoe’s, which means my 1 Apple may be buying 3 or 4 Hoes now!

In other words, the lost/missing coins have already been recycled, in a much more intelligent way. If you can not see it already then you really don’t understand what Bitcoin truely is.

Mining lost coins.. that the same as money printer going brrrrrr….

. Dude I will be dead when the fight over frozen coins is started. The fight will be that they are not lost keys. The fight will be that they are abandoned coins.

 If you have any idea about worldwide legal bullshit in general and human nature those "frozen" coins will be fought over bigly down the road.

Like I said won't happen anytime soon. But it is going to happen.

[NeuroticFish]

All bitcoins that are not moved for a certain period of time (20, 50, or 100 years) should be presumed lost and then recycled through the usual mining process. I'm not sure if that can be achieved through a soft fork.

Math/cryptography tells that they belong to somebody. Even after 100 years. And that means theft.
You know that one can inherit a private key, a hardware wallet or a physical collectible with private key on it, right? You want to make them worthless in 100 years. Unless the term property will become more.. lax.. in 100 years, I don't see this happening.
And, more or less as philipma1957 said, I'll leave this for my grandchildren think it over.

[Dabs]

Now... the conversation as to what happens once the subsidy runs out?  Block size, et al?  Well that conversation may be worth having.  But the solution does NOT lie in changing Bitcoin's monetary policy.

Subsidy includes transaction fees. If blocks get full and we do not have an increase to that size, then fees go up as well if people want to continue transacting on the base layer or L1, or require block confirmations. Those that do not, can opt to use Lightning or any of the other second layer solutions, decentralized or centralized, it does not matter all that much.

Most of the whole world are happily transacting using debit cards and credit cards or even points or miles or other loyalty rewards. I get my coffee from McDonald's using a card with stickers! And then I get another sticker back. I get my french fries using this monopoly looking coupon that I found.

Apples. Hoes. Stickers. Coupons. Bitcoins? Sats? It's only a matter of time.

We have decades before the base block reward goes below 1 sat in 2140-ish. Effectively, we will know by 2036 to 2040 what is going to be the template for the rest of the future as 99% of all bitcoins will have been mined then and the next hundred years is a fight for the last 1 percent.

[philipma1957]

All bitcoins that are not moved for a certain period of time (20, 50, or 100 years) should be presumed lost and then recycled through the usual mining process. I'm not sure if that can be achieved through a soft fork.

Math/cryptography tells that they belong to somebody. Even after 100 years. And that means theft.
You know that one can inherit a private key, a hardware wallet or a physical collectible with private key on it, right? You want to make them worthless in 100 years. Unless the term property will become more.. lax.. in 100 years, I don't see this happening.
And, more or less as philipma1957 said, I'll leave this for my grandchildren think it over.

Which is my main point it is going to be down the road a bit before that fight happens.

In fact if it does happen it would mean 2 very good things.

Both the world and BTC survived long enough to have that fight.


To all that disagree look into  sunken  pirate ships and the treasure involved when found some very interesting laws are involved as to who gets to keep what is found.

[Dabs]

Like I said won't happen anytime soon. But it is going to happen.

I don't think it will ever happen. But if it does, you can be sure that within about 10 years of that "law" or change, plenty of coins will move from old addresses to new ones, then they are no longer considered "abandoned".

While some may disagree, I tend to move any coins I have that have been sitting in cold addresses once every few years, or that's the plan. Move them once a year, or move them once every couple of years. I think that's just good practice even if you have no other reason to move them. They can still be in the same wallet, just different addresses (if you use something like Electrum with seed phrase).

But, for all coins that reside on addresses and not public keys (P2PK), on any address that begins with 1, 3, or bc1, those will never be spent unless someone has the private key. No bitcoiner will agree to that, the nodes, the miners... mostly the nodes. It will be considered a hard fork and most likely bitcoin will remain bitcoin and bitcoin-spend-anyone will die a horrible death or state of existence similar to bitcoin cash or bitcoin SV. (which means no one is using them unless they want to store weather data or some garbage.)

[_javi_]

C'mon Dalai Lama, do your thing!

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[Torque]

Like I said won't happen anytime soon. But it is going to happen.

I don't think it will ever happen. But if it does, you can be sure that within about 10 years of that "law" or change, plenty of coins will move from old addresses to new ones, then they are no longer considered "abandoned".

You don't even have to move them all. You could literally send a tiny amount of dust from an address with a large amount of btc and that address would no longer be considered "abandoned".

Also, philipma1957 talks about "returning thousands of lost coins to circulation", but last time I checked there is no such public address labeled "circulation".  

[Macadonian]

You guys should be more concerned if you can fit another lambo in your driveway or if you need to upgrade instead of the debate about if lost coins will be recovered. They are lost for a reason and there is no way to determine what is lost and what is being held before this happens centuries will have to have passed for it to have any credit and guess what unless there are big improvements in the longevity of humans we will all be dead!