Liquid Synergy Designs Inc. -ASIC mining hardware

[rocks]

On a serious note, if you trace steamboat's payment addresses forward in blockchain.info, you can find the 782.1 BTC payment to Avalon and quickly find what appears to be their final receiving address for chip sales

1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU

This address contains 64,060.9 BTC. The first payment to this address was received 4/16/2013 and consists mainly of 782.1 BTC payments for 10,000 chips each. Several of the initial payments were blocks for 3,000 BTC or 5,000 BTC.

If you assume Avalon is using this address for all of their chip payments, 64,060.9 / 782.1 = ~81.9 blocks of 10,000 chip purchases.

81.9 chip purchases * 10,000 chips each * 282 MHash/chip = 231 THash/sec added to the network.

That is roughly a 2x increase over the current ~110THash/sec for the current network just for chip purchases to date. Also from the Avalon payment address it looks as if roughly 1 batch is purchased per day recently.  Even with these increases the ASIC ROI on raw chip purchases and x16 open sourced boards is still quite positive.

Thoughts? (Sorry if this is a bit off-topic, very curious how Avalon's operation is proceeding so far...)

[dmcdad]

On a serious note, if you trace steamboat's payment addresses forward in blockchain.info, you can find the 782.1 BTC payment to Avalon and quickly find what appears to be their final receiving address for chip sales

1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU

This address contains 64,060.9 BTC. The first payment to this address was received 4/16/2013 and consists mainly of 782.1 BTC payments for 10,000 chips each. Several of the initial payments were blocks for 3,000 BTC or 5,000 BTC.

If you assume Avalon is using this address for all of their chip payments, 64,060.9 / 782.1 = ~81.9 blocks of 10,000 chip purchases.

81.9 chip purchases * 10,000 chips each * 282 MHash/chip = 231 THash/sec added to the network.

That is roughly a 2x increase over the current ~110THash/sec for the current network just for chip purchases to date. Also from the Avalon payment address it looks as if roughly 1 batch is purchased per day recently.  Even with these increases the ASIC ROI on raw chip purchases and x16 open sourced boards is still quite positive.

Thoughts?

That looks about right to me.

One thing I find odd is that Avalon hasn't taken ANY coins out of that address yet. I would think by now they would have taken some of that $8 million+ USD out to start paying for chip production. Not trying to spread FUD here (I'm about to place an order with steamboat) but what are others' thoughts on the Avalon sitting on the coin still?

[jimrome]

On a serious note, if you trace steamboat's payment addresses forward in blockchain.info, you can find the 782.1 BTC payment to Avalon and quickly find what appears to be their final receiving address for chip sales

1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU

This address contains 64,060.9 BTC. The first payment to this address was received 4/16/2013 and consists mainly of 782.1 BTC payments for 10,000 chips each. Several of the initial payments were blocks for 3,000 BTC or 5,000 BTC.

If you assume Avalon is using this address for all of their chip payments, 64,060.9 / 782.1 = ~81.9 blocks of 10,000 chip purchases.

81.9 chip purchases * 10,000 chips each * 282 MHash/chip = 231 THash/sec added to the network.

That is roughly a 2x increase over the current ~110THash/sec for the current network just for chip purchases to date. Also from the Avalon payment address it looks as if roughly 1 batch is purchased per day recently.  Even with these increases the ASIC ROI on raw chip purchases and x16 open sourced boards is still quite positive.

Thoughts?

That looks about right to me.

One thing I find odd is that Avalon hasn't taken ANY coins out of that address yet. I would think by now they would have taken some of that $8 million+ USD out to start paying for chip production. Not trying to spread FUD here (I'm about to place an order with steamboat) but what are others' thoughts on the Avalon sitting on the coin still?

Yeah, I'm interested in hearing people's thoughts about this as well - especially given the delays in the shipment of Avalon miners.

[rocks]

Yeah, I'm interested in hearing people's thoughts about this as well - especially given the delays in the shipment of Avalon miners.

I am curious on that as well. Would guess the fab they use only requires a partial payment upfront with final payment on delivery. Does anyone know how the fab they use operates?

This also answers the question people have had which is why would they sell chips instead of just mine with them. $8M in the address so far with roughly $100k deposited per day...

[Reckman]

I dont know if you answered this already, but you will be taking bitcoin for the PCB and Assembly right? Collection when orders are placed?


Also board shipping cost?

[ecliptic]

Yeah, I'm interested in hearing people's thoughts about this as well - especially given the delays in the shipment of Avalon miners.

I am curious on that as well. Would guess the fab they use only requires a partial payment upfront with final payment on delivery. Does anyone know how the fab they use operates?

This also answers the question people have had which is why would they sell chips instead of just mine with them. $8M in the address so far with roughly $100k deposited per day...

I thought someone said they use TSMC?

They might have had enough made from their miner batch sales (especially #3+) to pay for it all.  Once you've paid the NRE on an asic, having them made wafer by wafer isn't terribly expensive.  That's kind of the point.  They're selling these for much more then what it costs them marginally, because of the massive up-front cost and engineering work.

[ionstorm]

hey steamboat,
would love to buy some BFL chips through a group buy by you, you are awesome at managing things and I dont know if I could trust anyone else, please consider it.
Thanks,
ionstorm

[steamboat]

I dont know if you answered this already, but you will be taking bitcoin for the PCB and Assembly right? Collection when orders are placed?


Also board shipping cost?

BTC will be accepted for the PCB and Assembly costs, as well as any other services or parts offered. Collection will begin once pricing and availability is finalized. I will not be taking preorders for vaporware.

hey steamboat,
would love to buy some BFL chips through a group buy by you, you are awesome at managing things and I dont know if I could trust anyone else, please consider it.
Thanks,
ionstorm

I saw that post. I am very hesitant to offer any type of crowdfunding option for a product I do not have reasonable assurances will be produced. When time permits I will look into this more and see if it is a possibility.

All purchases received, recorded, replied.

[hoss]

Off topic:
Hate to be a Debbie downer but looks like the beginning of the end for non asics miners. Somebody powered up some serious hardware today...

http://bitcoin.sipa.be/speed-lin.png

also confirmed here with a block per hour well above the target of 6...

http://bitcoinwatch.com/

get your batch 5 while you can?

[steamboat]

Off topic:
Hate to be a Debbie downer but looks like the beginning of the end for non asics miners. Somebody powered up some serious hardware today...

http://bitcoin.sipa.be/speed-lin.png

also confirmed here with a block per hour well above the target of 6...

http://bitcoinwatch.com/

get your batch 5 while you can?

This is expected. Developers will most likely be bringing units online in batches, and any ROI analysis should take into account the hash rates expected and possible from each producer.

Edit: the products offered here are indeed ASIC, and much more efficient than any graphics card or fpga based unit.

[bystander]

On a serious note, if you trace steamboat's payment addresses forward in blockchain.info, you can find the 782.1 BTC payment to Avalon and quickly find what appears to be their final receiving address for chip sales

1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU

This address contains 64,060.9 BTC. The first payment to this address was received 4/16/2013 and consists mainly of 782.1 BTC payments for 10,000 chips each. Several of the initial payments were blocks for 3,000 BTC or 5,000 BTC.

If you assume Avalon is using this address for all of their chip payments, 64,060.9 / 782.1 = ~81.9 blocks of 10,000 chip purchases.

81.9 chip purchases * 10,000 chips each * 282 MHash/chip = 231 THash/sec added to the network.

That is roughly a 2x increase over the current ~110THash/sec for the current network just for chip purchases to date. Also from the Avalon payment address it looks as if roughly 1 batch is purchased per day recently.  Even with these increases the ASIC ROI on raw chip purchases and x16 open sourced boards is still quite positive.

Thoughts?

That looks about right to me.

One thing I find odd is that Avalon hasn't taken ANY coins out of that address yet. I would think by now they would have taken some of that $8 million+ USD out to start paying for chip production. Not trying to spread FUD here (I'm about to place an order with steamboat) but what are others' thoughts on the Avalon sitting on the coin still?

Yeah, I'm interested in hearing people's thoughts about this as well - especially given the delays in the shipment of Avalon miners.

Well, Yifu did say during the conference that at one point in the past, they had a choice of making "$3million the next month" or making "a lot less" by building units.  They decided to go ahead and build units w/ Batch #1 and it was the right choice to make as far as the community was concerned. 

However, my newbie and very uninformed guess is that they might be mining with some unknown quantity of units right now, then by carefully controlling the release of chips/units, they could maximize profitability given the current condition of the market: 1) BFL's ineptness and inability to deliver 2) controlling shipments on Batch #2#3   3) timeframe w/ open-source boards all hinging on upcoming chip deliveries. 

There's a small window of opportunity right now at the intersection of shipping units/chips and mining, they have enough credibility and leverage in this market to pull it off, especially when no one else is shipping a comparable product yet.

[KS]

On a serious note, if you trace steamboat's payment addresses forward in blockchain.info, you can find the 782.1 BTC payment to Avalon and quickly find what appears to be their final receiving address for chip sales

1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU

This address contains 64,060.9 BTC. The first payment to this address was received 4/16/2013 and consists mainly of 782.1 BTC payments for 10,000 chips each. Several of the initial payments were blocks for 3,000 BTC or 5,000 BTC.

If you assume Avalon is using this address for all of their chip payments, 64,060.9 / 782.1 = ~81.9 blocks of 10,000 chip purchases.

81.9 chip purchases * 10,000 chips each * 282 MHash/chip = 231 THash/sec added to the network.

That is roughly a 2x increase over the current ~110THash/sec for the current network just for chip purchases to date. Also from the Avalon payment address it looks as if roughly 1 batch is purchased per day recently.  Even with these increases the ASIC ROI on raw chip purchases and x16 open sourced boards is still quite positive.

Thoughts?

That looks about right to me.

One thing I find odd is that Avalon hasn't taken ANY coins out of that address yet. I would think by now they would have taken some of that $8 million+ USD out to start paying for chip production. Not trying to spread FUD here (I'm about to place an order with steamboat) but what are others' thoughts on the Avalon sitting on the coin still?

Yeah, I'm interested in hearing people's thoughts about this as well - especially given the delays in the shipment of Avalon miners.

Well, Yifu did say during the conference that at one point in the past, they had a choice of making "$3million the next month" or making "a lot less" by building units.  They decided to go ahead and build units w/ Batch #1 and it was the right choice to make as far as the community was concerned. 

However, my newbie and very uninformed guess is that they might be mining with some unknown quantity of units right now, then by carefully controlling the release of chips/units, they could maximize profitability given the current condition of the market: 1) BFL's ineptness and inability to deliver 2) controlling shipments on Batch #2#3   3) timeframe w/ open-source boards all hinging on upcoming chip deliveries. 

There's a small window of opportunity right now at the intersection of shipping units/chips and mining, they have enough credibility and leverage in this market to pull it off, especially when no one else is shipping a comparable product yet.

He also said they didn't cash the BTC until they had some actual invoices to pay and have means of selling them outside of exchanges (meaning they won't crash the price).

[lexis200]

Payment sent for 99 chips from batch 5

Payment BTC8.514

TX ID 3e22993223f3cd91d8e90af3347820adaf3ecc0cd62148618c9c66468faef02d

Email on its way!

Thanks Steamboat!

[Werner]

Why do they purchase from this if others are selling with lower order number and for fewer BTC?

Beats me.

[mjmvisser]

Why do they purchase from this if others are selling with lower order number and for fewer BTC?

I can't speak for everyone, but having completed boards in my hands a few days after chip delivery is a pretty good reason.

[lexis200]

Why do they purchase from this if others are selling with lower order number and for fewer BTC?

Beats me.

Do the "others" include the option for assembly and hosting etc (even though it's an additional cost)?

I'm buying here because, assuming the chips arrive and Steamboat manages to sort out the fab and hosting etc, it's a reasonable price, no minimum order, and I don't have to host it or deal with shipping and customs etc.

It may not be the cheapest out there, but this deal has that warm fuzzy feel about it and the way Steamboat has conducted himself so far gives me as much confidence as I could get sending complete strangers money!

[Geode]

I don't mean disrespect by this, but how do we know that we can truly trust Steamboat? I could be totally wrong and Steamboat may be totally trustworthy, but I can imagine that those sending lots of money via Bitcoin to him can have legitimate doubts and some fears at the back of their minds. To Steamboat, in light of this, would you be willing to give your identity and address information to the escrow JohnK? This is for peace of mind for the others here who may not know you so well and I don't mean any offence by this request.

[bystander]

On a serious note, if you trace steamboat's payment addresses forward in blockchain.info, you can find the 782.1 BTC payment to Avalon and quickly find what appears to be their final receiving address for chip sales

1FGAftzSTztFSB8LMwsrdCKTyqGY6zr3sU

This address contains 64,060.9 BTC. The first payment to this address was received 4/16/2013 and consists mainly of 782.1 BTC payments for 10,000 chips each. Several of the initial payments were blocks for 3,000 BTC or 5,000 BTC.

If you assume Avalon is using this address for all of their chip payments, 64,060.9 / 782.1 = ~81.9 blocks of 10,000 chip purchases.

81.9 chip purchases * 10,000 chips each * 282 MHash/chip = 231 THash/sec added to the network.

That is roughly a 2x increase over the current ~110THash/sec for the current network just for chip purchases to date. Also from the Avalon payment address it looks as if roughly 1 batch is purchased per day recently.  Even with these increases the ASIC ROI on raw chip purchases and x16 open sourced boards is still quite positive.

Thoughts?

That looks about right to me.

One thing I find odd is that Avalon hasn't taken ANY coins out of that address yet. I would think by now they would have taken some of that $8 million+ USD out to start paying for chip production. Not trying to spread FUD here (I'm about to place an order with steamboat) but what are others' thoughts on the Avalon sitting on the coin still?

Yeah, I'm interested in hearing people's thoughts about this as well - especially given the delays in the shipment of Avalon miners.

Well, Yifu did say during the conference that at one point in the past, they had a choice of making "$3million the next month" or making "a lot less" by building units.  They decided to go ahead and build units w/ Batch #1 and it was the right choice to make as far as the community was concerned. 

However, my newbie and very uninformed guess is that they might be mining with some unknown quantity of units right now, then by carefully controlling the release of chips/units, they could maximize profitability given the current condition of the market: 1) BFL's ineptness and inability to deliver 2) controlling shipments on Batch #2#3   3) timeframe w/ open-source boards all hinging on upcoming chip deliveries. 

There's a small window of opportunity right now at the intersection of shipping units/chips and mining, they have enough credibility and leverage in this market to pull it off, especially when no one else is shipping a comparable product yet.

He also said they didn't cash the BTC until they had some actual invoices to pay and have means of selling them outside of exchanges (meaning they won't crash the price).

That's a good point, I do recall him saying that he does have means outside of exchanges.  Believe he might have said that in a response to a question from the floor.

[ScaryHash]

I don't mean disrespect by this, but how do we know that we can truly trust Steamboat? I could be totally wrong and Steamboat may be totally trustworthy, but I can imagine that those sending lots of money via Bitcoin to him can have legitimate doubts and some fears at the back of their minds. To Steamboat, in light of this, would you be willing to give your identity and address information to the escrow JohnK? This is for peace of mind for the others here who may not know you so well and I don't mean any offence by this request.

You are a little late, dude. This is the 5th group buy. What rock have you been living under that past month?

This has been ongoing for a while, and it's quite unlikely to be a scam.

I, for one, have bought a few chips in each one of his rounds. I'm quite confident that he's not scamming anybody.

[jasinlee]

steamboat loan me about $40,000 in Btc. if he was going to scam someone I doubt he would start out by giving out loans and then me loaning to him and him re paying almost immediately. And he paid interest that I did not even request. He is probably the those honest person I have dealt with on the forum