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Author Topic: [40+ PH] SlushPool (slushpool.com); World's First Mining Pool  (Read 3856022 times)
slush
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December 19, 2010, 12:55:10 PM
 #201

Problem we are discussing by PMs are different. Sometimes your gpu1 flooded server with incorrect hashes. Many attemps per second. This is different.

Another words, I trust you there is hardware problem and you are not trying to hack the service :-).

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December 19, 2010, 01:27:06 PM
 #202

How long does it take the block to be broadcast into the network? If too short, bad guys could recognize the proof of work. If too long, other clients could "steal" our block with theirs.

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December 19, 2010, 01:52:35 PM
 #203

How long does it take the block to be broadcast into the network? If too short, bad guys could recognize the proof of work. If too long, other clients could "steal" our block with theirs.

If I understand you question, you are asking if some node to which miner broadcast its final proof of work cannot hijack it and use for yourself? It is not possible because 'proof of work' is unique to miner who found it (there is encoded reward for miner inside; found block is useless for other miners).

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December 19, 2010, 02:00:40 PM
 #204

That's not what I meant.

If I understand correctly, right now, when a client of the cluster computes a block, that block is sent to more clients by the server as a proof of work (that is, to see that they actually compute). If the block is first broadcast into the Bitcoin network (not the cluster clients), a malicious cluster client could recognize the proofs of work. But on the other side, if it's first proof-of-work'd by the clients, then the server could spend seconds, even minutes before all the (connected) clients answer the check. If in that time a block is generated and broadcast in Bitcoin, ours would probably be invalidated (that's what I meant by "steal").

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slush
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December 19, 2010, 02:33:22 PM
 #205

That's not what I meant.

If I understand correctly, right now, when a client of the cluster computes a block, that block is sent to more clients by the server as a proof of work (that is, to see that they actually compute). If the block is first broadcast into the Bitcoin network (not the cluster clients), a malicious cluster client could recognize the proofs of work. But on the other side, if it's first proof-of-work'd by the clients, then the server could spend seconds, even minutes before all the (connected) clients answer the check. If in that time a block is generated and broadcast in Bitcoin, ours would probably be invalidated (that's what I meant by "steal").

No, this is not possible. Every worker gets unique sources for hashing, so when he found nonce which makes correct proof of work, it is definitely not valid for other jobs.

EDIT: Oh, I still don't understand your question. My answer was about broadcasting single PoW on low target between clients before submitting to cluster.

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December 19, 2010, 02:39:16 PM
 #206

Noodles, I become little angry. Stop flooding server or I will ban whole your subnet. There is NO race condition. Double spending will not work. Please save your time and server's resources.

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December 19, 2010, 02:58:42 PM
 #207

If I understand correctly, right now, when a client of the cluster computes a block, that block is sent to more clients by the server as a proof of work (that is, to see that they actually compute).

No. PoW is checked directly on server. No job resending.
Quote
If the block is first broadcast into the Bitcoin network (not the cluster clients), a malicious cluster client could recognize the proofs of work.

Why should cluster client go directly to bitcoin network? If proof of work is valid, it's 50BTCwill be received by server, not client.

Quote
But on the other side, if it's first proof-of-work'd by the clients, then the server could spend seconds, even minutes before all the (connected) clients answer the check. If in that time a block is generated and broadcast in Bitcoin, ours would probably be invalidated (that's what I meant by "steal").

It is already possible that some miner find valid block and until he submit it to bitcoin network, somebody will be before them. Yes, in this case block will be invalid. But there is almost no latency between sending PoW from client to bitcoin network, if block is found.

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December 19, 2010, 03:11:47 PM
 #208

Noodles, I become little angry. Stop flooding server or I will ban whole your subnet. There is NO race condition. Double spending will not work. Please save your time and server's resources.

well, i'm not exactly flooding, i'm just trying to hook up BOTH GPUs of my HD5970 to the pool and stumbled across some problems.
check m0mchils miner-thread and see what's "flooding" here. (and tell me if i'm still flooding, or if it's looking ok now).

have a nice day

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December 19, 2010, 03:17:05 PM
 #209

Seems like there are problems with 5970's and apparent flooding, I think I'm going to hang out a bit on #bitcoin-dev Smiley

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December 19, 2010, 03:30:22 PM
 #210

Seems like there are problems with 5970's and apparent flooding, I think I'm going to hang out a bit on #bitcoin-dev Smiley

Yes, I apologize Noodles, it looks there are some compatiblity problems between newest m0mchil's miner, pool and strongest card. Too bad that I tested it together yesterday and worked for me Sad. We are talking on irc

gene
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December 19, 2010, 03:33:55 PM
 #211

New rewards sent.

Quote
2010-12-19 13:00:16.311204
Send 16.27 to 18S4ui2V4kW43Rf1f6YaWL25oTiVkRsoNF
Send 10.36 to 124TQXntz7akAYCrUxDjLuVg7fLGTJqcgt
Send 10.05 to 1B7SvpLs2bmB8mGX2Bqdqn8UToTB1qgwUd
Send 5.1 to 1Eo51LLvhkJhxGR6oga1QkNV9a1KJsbrF7
Send 3.81 to 1P83a5bNdzDpYPxFgxf9XJJ5ET9e1k7m58
Send 3.8 to 1JdEn5LeMREmAjcAi4KWf8EX6zkubqGn55
Send 0.3 to 18cBAgYzcm9jLkSqAp2aAgWsFgeYgaTmu2
Send 0.29 to 1BwChPMbCE5d9pmQnDKCDrHt1FJjfkMsf9
Send 0.02 to 1JQJXeiJR4KUC63hUKysG1YyxKNGzaXBvF
Initial balance: 50.0, sent total 50.0 for 9 people, time 14. sec

My today's goal is remake of sending rewards to be absolutely fair - will send rewards only for confirmed blocks.

For which block is this? I have been contributing for the last several blocks and have not gotten any bitcoins. Please clarify what is going on here? "Absolutely fair?"

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slush
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December 19, 2010, 03:43:48 PM
 #212

New rewards sent.

My today's goal is remake of sending rewards to be absolutely fair - will send rewards only for confirmed blocks.

For which block is this? I have been contributing for the last several blocks and have not gotten any bitcoins. Please clarify what is going on here? "Absolutely fair?"

It is still today. I explained why some rewards was not still sent. I'm still working on. What is the issue?

I know it is your money. I know you are nervous. But keep in mind, this is free service in beta mode as was announced. No single milicent was lost yet, so please be patient. I'm doing in my free time. Last two days I spent on fucking hackers (I do not mean davout and bitlex now) which flooded single page of site and sending crippled PoWs again and again. Still you have excelent response times. Because of that, development is not so fast as I wish. But again, no money lost, no real problem.

BitLex
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December 19, 2010, 03:57:23 PM
 #213

I have been contributing for the last several blocks and have not gotten any bitcoins. 
what's your threshold-setting, what's your reward so far, what's your share-/hash-count?
"Please clarify"

so far there seems nothing to worry about the honesty of slush,
i can confirm the
Quote
Send 10.36 to 124TQXntz7akAYCrUxDjLuVg7fLGTJqcgt
which is the 3rd "reward" that i've got from contributing to the pool,
rewards add up nicely according to added GPUs, i've got nothing to complain.

except maybe for the still missing system stats on profil-pages, *poke
i still need to open 2 browser-tabs to check my share against the pool, but i can handle that.  Wink

gene
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December 19, 2010, 04:18:45 PM
 #214

what's your threshold-setting, what's your reward so far, what's your share-/hash-count?
"Please clarify"

My threshold is 0.01BTC. My "real balance (in BTC) from previous rounds" is considerably greater than that.

I began contributing on Dec 17. According to his website, those blocks have since matured - hence my question regarding the corresponding block number. Of course, I could be misunderstanding some crucial detail. However, I do become a bit suspicious when there is talk about "today's goal is remake of sending rewards to be absolutely fair." Was it not fair before? Does "fair" mean that I won't get anything? Surely, these are reasonable questions. When taking on the responsibility to run a server and assume trust, one must accept also a higher level of scrutiny and skepticism and be prepared to answer questions transparently.

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teknohog
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December 19, 2010, 04:50:21 PM
 #215

My threshold is 0.01BTC. My "real balance (in BTC) from previous rounds" is considerably greater than that.

I began contributing on Dec 17. According to his website, those blocks have since matured - hence my question regarding the corresponding block number. Of course, I could be misunderstanding some crucial detail. However, I do become a bit suspicious when there is talk about "today's goal is remake of sending rewards to be absolutely fair." Was it not fair before? Does "fair" mean that I won't get anything? Surely, these are reasonable questions. When taking on the responsibility to run a server and assume trust, one must accept also a higher level of scrutiny and skepticism and be prepared to answer questions transparently.

I am also wondering what is so special/secret/difficult about sending the rewards.

I am somewhat skeptical about pooled mining in general, mainly because a centralized pool goes against the distributed P2P nature of Bitcoin. However, I like to try things out before judging anything.

Unfortunately, this is giving me a negative experience. If I have to wait for my reward for several days, I could just as well use my local miner and get a full block in a similar timeframe.

slush
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December 19, 2010, 05:11:27 PM
 #216

I am also wondering what is so special/secret/difficult about sending the rewards.

REWARD IS NOT BOUNDED TO BLOCK MATURITY NOW. I'M WORKING ON FIX. RIGHT?

Guys, you are making me crazy. Until you see corresponding reward on site, everything is OK, you do not miss single bitcoin.

gene
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December 19, 2010, 05:15:22 PM
 #217

Is the source for your cooperative miner available?

++

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Enky1974
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December 19, 2010, 05:19:38 PM
 #218

Hey slush, that's exactly what I get in my logs?

enky, what are you mining on?
overclocked GPU ?

No, it is a standard Nvidia 8800 GTS 512, clocked at @700MHz

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December 19, 2010, 06:21:22 PM
 #219

Slush, maybe you shouldn't show them that they have a reward until the block is matured. Then they could count down the hours until they actually receive it. May not be too difficulty if you have a time stamp on the reward table.

Yes, there should be a distinction between "mature reward" (may be sent out to pool) and reward from blocks not yet mature.

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slush
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December 19, 2010, 06:24:41 PM
 #220

Slush, maybe you shouldn't show them that they have a reward until the block is matured. Then they could count down the hours until they actually receive it. May not be too difficulty if you have a time stamp on the reward table.

Thanks for your support! I appreciate it. Accounting rewards after block maturity is exactly what I'm working on. But I have to test a lot otherwise people will definitely kill me (too bad I have my location on bitcoinmap.com :-D).

Cool! During this post we found new block!

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