BiblePay | 10% to Orphan-Charity | RANDOMX MINING | Sanctuaries (Masternodes)

[bible_pay]

Hello,

Does anybody know how the PODC Updates works? I the past, I was having 4-6 Updates every day and now I have only one (+ some others that I force manually just in case).
Why is the number of updates not consistent? What is the minimum number of updates per day to receive PODC payments?

Thanks!

Hello

Are you counting Rosetta or WCG or both?

Rosetta

And your mining machine is running 24/7 ?

You only need One to actually reach the network in 24 hours to be paid (as long as you have been sending at least one per day).

But our network spork setting is designed to send 4 per 24 hours.

[616westwarmoth]

I think it's funny we're trying to get more miners when mining isn't even profitable now.

Fair point..

Mining is the art of minting coins at a future expected value, not at the current value.

Actually if you're mining at below the cost you could be buying, you should be buying...that is the real art.

[harrisvan87]

" There are many serious vulnerabilities in the biblepay code. Get out while this coin still has some value "
This pray showing at block 69000...anyone see it ?

[SVK Noko]

Hello,

Does anybody know how the PODC Updates works? I the past, I was having 4-6 Updates every day and now I have only one (+ some others that I force manually just in case).
Why is the number of updates not consistent? What is the minimum number of updates per day to receive PODC payments?

Thanks!

Hello

Are you counting Rosetta or WCG or both?

Rosetta

And your mining machine is running 24/7 ?

You only need One to actually reach the network in 24 hours to be paid (as long as you have been sending at least one per day).

But our network spork setting is designed to send 4 per 24 hours.

The question was why he has only one podcupdate when he is running 24/7

[bible_pay]

Kairos and Jaap added this last night:

https://medium.com/biblepay-news/charity-profile-kairos-childrens-fund-696894542298

[616westwarmoth]

If you haven't already, please vote on the Team Requirement proposal.  I'd hope the following would sway a no vote, but if you still feel yes (killing the team requirement) is justified, then please vote!

TLDR: I fell it's unlikely we'd gain more than 1.5M Team RAC at the most wildly generous numbers. This would, if fully staked, add only 30M BBP demand for the coin, which is roughly 1 month of average volume/15 days of newly minted coins.

So, here is my logic on why removing the Team Requirement is not going to help.

First off, as a holder and big PoDC miner of BBP, there are two conflicting thoughts that present before considering the actual primary issue. The first is if the BBP Team Requirement (which I'll save some typing and call BBP-TR) is removed, but we also ban other coin teams (basically Gridcoin and Byteball) then one of two things could happen. One, nothing. Two, we could spike our RAC. A spike in Team RAC would make mining unprofitable for most if not all current users unless you had some unique advantage such as dirt cheap power. So the current miners, like myself would drop out. So we'd need a HUGE spike to offset this. If we did see a huge spike in RAC and that corresponded to a similar long-term increase in price, then as a big holder, I should welcome this. Sure I wouldn't be mining anymore but, in silly terms, if price went up 100x because the RAC went up 200x, then I'm coming out great!

The issue is this. Look at Byteball. There is no team requirement, in fact wasn't even a Byteball Team for the longest time, and the benefit for being on the team is still small. I can account for most of the top 10, which is about 50% of the distribution. I'm pretty close to the top 10, in fact most of the top 10 is Team BPP, but I'd wager the rest of the other BBP users don't know much about it either and are either 1) cashing out when they mine or 2) hoping for a price increase since this is basically "free" coins.

So the question becomes, where are all the team members from Hard[OCP], US Navy, Oracle, Overclock Forums, etc? Why are they not participating in Byteball? I don't see them in any large numbers (at least in coins rewarded, since again, I've got most the top 10 covered and the top 10 is about half the reward), Byteball is incredibly easy to set up. It's trivial enough I think my beginner computer friends could get linked to Byteball following the instructions. However, none of them would be able to figure out our coin without help, and then the issue of buying crytpo to stake, would end that discussion. So I don't think (if we block Team Gridcoin and Team Byteball) we'll see many new users from this, since the most crypto savvy ones are going to be blocked. And the rest of the teams, as evidenced by their non-participation in Byteball, which has far less complexity, are not interested. Or maybe because in part, most of the big teams, don't do much CPU BOINC.

But that thought aside, let's look at some very hard numbers. If we could get a 1% conversion rate, that is, by removing the BBP-TR, we would get 1% of the overall user base to become BBP users and fully stake their mining, what would that really mean? (and for the record I think 1% is way too high). At R@h, we're anywhere between 15-20% of the daily work done, Gridcoin is usually about 10%. Yesterday the two teams combined accounted for roughly 29% of the work at R@h. So if we got 1% of the remaining 71% that would be 225K RAC. At World Community Grid, we're about 3%, Gridcoin is about 4.6% and Byteball is about .5%. So between all three projects we're basically 8% of the total. Again, if we could get 1% of the remaining 92% that's about 1.2M RAC. Even rounding up we're looking at, again in my opinion of the best case, roughly 1.5M RAC added to our team. That would create demand for 30M BBP to stake, which is roughly 1 month of our average volume, or about 15 days worth of newly minted coins. How would that affect us? Who knows, but probably not by more than a few satoshi of value in the medium term.

In the end, the market is poor all around. We've overextended our support of orphans given the fall in price. Removing the BBP-TR is removing one of the potential major marketing points of the coin, the hard and fast numbers of how many people we've added to the cause of scientific research. How many we can lay exclusive claim to for being on BOINC. We're the number 3 team ALL TIME at Rosetta@home, set to be number two by mid-October. And number one in RAC there. We're number 89 all time at World Community Grid and should break into the top 50 by the end of the year, all while being the fifth highest there in RAC. Giving up that potential marketing angle for what I suspect will be a pittance of users seems not worth the effort. And using that programming time (however small) seems to be a poor use of resources in an increasingly lean time.

[bible_pay]

Hello,

Does anybody know how the PODC Updates works? I the past, I was having 4-6 Updates every day and now I have only one (+ some others that I force manually just in case).
Why is the number of updates not consistent? What is the minimum number of updates per day to receive PODC payments?

Thanks!

Hello

Are you counting Rosetta or WCG or both?

Rosetta

And your mining machine is running 24/7 ?

You only need One to actually reach the network in 24 hours to be paid (as long as you have been sending at least one per day).

But our network spork setting is designed to send 4 per 24 hours.

The question was why he has only one podcupdate when he is running 24/7

No, it wasn't.    But thanks for quoting the question.

The minimum number is not consistent if you don't have enough MATURE stake balance in 'exec totalrac'.  You can only stake if you have coins older than 24 hours to stake in coin control.  Secondly you need to keep your miner actually running and wallet passphrase has to be entered correctly when you boot.  Its obviously working for our other 2,400 users.

[bible_pay]

" There are many serious vulnerabilities in the biblepay code. Get out while this coin still has some value "
This pray showing at block 69000...anyone see it ?

No there aren't,  the code continues the same at 69000 and we don't have a mandatory scheduled for 1.1.4.8's features yet, so nothing is scheduled to be changed in prod other than "possibly" removing the team requirement (although remember we still require Signed boinc association, so there is no loss of security in that respect).

Could you point me in the direction of someone competent enough to name ONE so I can speak to the individual, and name the item you are referring to?


THIS IS FUD!  THANKS FOR THE FUD! 

[harrisvan87]

" There are many serious vulnerabilities in the biblepay code. Get out while this coin still has some value "
This pray showing at block 69000...anyone see it ?

No there aren't,  the code continues the same at 69000 and we don't have a mandatory scheduled for 1.1.4.8's features yet, so nothing is scheduled to be changed in prod other than "possibly" removing the team requirement (although remember we still require Signed boinc association, so there is no loss of security in that respect).

Could you point me in the direction of someone competent enough to name ONE so I can speak to the individual, and name the item you are referring to?


THIS IS FUD!  THANKS FOR THE FUD! 

https://imgur.com/j6mPzcb

just captured when seeing.

[bible_pay]

If you haven't already, please vote on the Team Requirement proposal.  I'd hope the following would sway a no vote, but if you still feel yes (killing the team requirement) is justified, then please vote!

TLDR: I fell it's unlikely we'd gain more than 1.5M Team RAC at the most wildly generous numbers. This would, if fully staked, add only 30M BBP demand for the coin, which is roughly 1 month of average volume/15 days of newly minted coins.

So, here is my logic on why removing the Team Requirement is not going to help.

First off, as a holder and big PoDC miner of BBP, there are two conflicting thoughts that present before considering the actual primary issue. The first is if the BBP Team Requirement (which I'll save some typing and call BBP-TR) is removed, but we also ban other coin teams (basically Gridcoin and Byteball) then one of two things could happen. One, nothing. Two, we could spike our RAC. A spike in Team RAC would make mining unprofitable for most if not all current users unless you had some unique advantage such as dirt cheap power. So the current miners, like myself would drop out. So we'd need a HUGE spike to offset this. If we did see a huge spike in RAC and that corresponded to a similar long-term increase in price, then as a big holder, I should welcome this. Sure I wouldn't be mining anymore but, in silly terms, if price went up 100x because the RAC went up 200x, then I'm coming out great!

The issue is this. Look at Byteball. There is no team requirement, in fact wasn't even a Byteball Team for the longest time, and the benefit for being on the team is still small. I can account for most of the top 10, which is about 50% of the distribution. I'm pretty close to the top 10, in fact most of the top 10 is Team BPP, but I'd wager the rest of the other BBP users don't know much about it either and are either 1) cashing out when they mine or 2) hoping for a price increase since this is basically "free" coins.

So the question becomes, where are all the team members from Hard[OCP], US Navy, Oracle, Overclock Forums, etc? Why are they not participating in Byteball? I don't see them in any large numbers (at least in coins rewarded, since again, I've got most the top 10 covered and the top 10 is about half the reward), Byteball is incredibly easy to set up. It's trivial enough I think my beginner computer friends could get linked to Byteball following the instructions. However, none of them would be able to figure out our coin without help, and then the issue of buying crytpo to stake, would end that discussion. So I don't think (if we block Team Gridcoin and Team Byteball) we'll see many new users from this, since the most crypto savvy ones are going to be blocked. And the rest of the teams, as evidenced by their non-participation in Byteball, which has far less complexity, are not interested. Or maybe because in part, most of the big teams, don't do much CPU BOINC.

But that thought aside, let's look at some very hard numbers. If we could get a 1% conversion rate, that is, by removing the BBP-TR, we would get 1% of the overall user base to become BBP users and fully stake their mining, what would that really mean? (and for the record I think 1% is way too high). At R@h, we're anywhere between 15-20% of the daily work done, Gridcoin is usually about 10%. Yesterday the two teams combined accounted for roughly 29% of the work at R@h. So if we got 1% of the remaining 71% that would be 225K RAC. At World Community Grid, we're about 3%, Gridcoin is about 4.6% and Byteball is about .5%. So between all three projects we're basically 8% of the total. Again, if we could get 1% of the remaining 92% that's about 1.2M RAC. Even rounding up we're looking at, again in my opinion of the best case, roughly 1.5M RAC added to our team. That would create demand for 30M BBP to stake, which is roughly 1 month of our average volume, or about 15 days worth of newly minted coins. How would that affect us? Who knows, but probably not by more than a few satoshi of value in the medium term.

In the end, the market is poor all around. We've overextended our support of orphans given the fall in price. Removing the BBP-TR is removing one of the potential major marketing points of the coin, the hard and fast numbers of how many people we've added to the cause of scientific research. How many we can lay exclusive claim to for being on BOINC. We're the number 3 team ALL TIME at Rosetta@home, set to be number two by mid-October. And number one in RAC there. We're number 89 all time at World Community Grid and should break into the top 50 by the end of the year, all while being the fifth highest there in RAC. Giving up that potential marketing angle for what I suspect will be a pittance of users seems not worth the effort. And using that programming time (however small) seems to be a poor use of resources in an increasingly lean time.

Although I generally feel this is a good post in most respects, I want to offer the assertion that the "1% gain in boinc participation" should not necessarily be considered way too high in  our estimations.  I would say that in most PR campaigns that would be a true statement.  However, in this case for all intents and purposes we are basically inviting users who are already paid up on the hardware and paid on the electricity to come to BIBLEPAY for only the cost of the UTXO (which is considered their asset - they get to keep it - so its not a capital expense to them).  So on the grounds that they can tinker with a new novelty item (Those that were resistant to crypto) this might be the kicker that gets them started, I would argue over a year, it is possible to gain 20% of the boinc users (IE 10,000).  

This campaign is sort of an experiment, to see if we can become a seed in order to become a household name later.  Im looking at this as the difference between biblepays
 stagnation (requiring us to really think out of the box to grow), or possibly gaining a massive amount of PR and growing through this experience.  This appears to me to be the Holy Grail opportunity for growth at this time for the PODC side- especially since we already do that so well.  We are great cancer miners, and great at WCG.  

I do not believe the long term effect of additional boinc users is a price dump!  They can only dump the coins once while value buyers buy them once, at that point once the emission is emitted, our total supply is stable.  Another words, I view 10,000 miners with 10,000 exchange accounts as much less volatile and more stable for our price than 1,000 miners (over the long term - 1 year out+).

Anyway, I will roll with this either way, as I said I am for no double dipping and nice team stats, but I lean towards Growth at this time and feel with our blacklist feature we can prevent double dipping and make our own stats report.

[bible_pay]

Has anyone here gotten saved or at least decided that Jesus might be the Lord based on your experiences with BiblePay?

[bible_pay]

" There are many serious vulnerabilities in the biblepay code. Get out while this coin still has some value "
This pray showing at block 69000...anyone see it ?

No there aren't,  the code continues the same at 69000 and we don't have a mandatory scheduled for 1.1.4.8's features yet, so nothing is scheduled to be changed in prod other than "possibly" removing the team requirement (although remember we still require Signed boinc association, so there is no loss of security in that respect).

Could you point me in the direction of someone competent enough to name ONE so I can speak to the individual, and name the item you are referring to?


THIS IS FUD!  THANKS FOR THE FUD! 

https://imgur.com/j6mPzcb

just captured when seeing.

Along with the ones with "666", and "Pray that our price rises above 10 satoshis again." and Slovakias prayers.  Its pretty depressing the level of depravity it takes to deface a public prayer system.  But the depths of Satan are unspeakable.  Lets pray this person receives the Holy Spirit.

[slavino]

bible_pay can we participate on this https://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/forums/wcg/viewthread_thread,41044_offset,0

[sunk818]

Actually if you're mining at below the cost you could be buying, you should be buying...that is the real art.

Why pay for electricity on your servers when you can generate more BBP by buying directly...

[togoshigekata]

bible_pay can we participate on this https://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/forums/wcg/viewthread_thread,41044_offset,0

Good find!

Twitter: https://twitter.com/WCGrid/status/1037047912918917120



"Welcome to the THOR Challenge issued by the international team CRUNCHERS SANS FRONTIERES.

- The THOR Challenge will take place during 4 weeks.
- Ranking on the TRT (Total Run Time).
- ALL the World Community Grid active projects are in competition.
(MIP1, SCC1, ZIKA, HST1, FAAH, FAHB, OET, MCM)"

=

"Captains, click here to register your team to the THOR Challenge 2018 Y3-W1"
https://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/team/challenge/viewTeamChallenge.do?challengeId=9123&language=en_US

Team BiblePay
https://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/team/viewTeamInfo.do?teamId=JRD1XTFK92
Captain:   bible_pay

=

World Community Grid (WCG) is the 2nd CPU Only Science project that BiblePay rewards coins for

WCG Projects:
- Microbiome Immunity Project
- Smash Childhood Cancer
- OpenZika
- Help Stop TB
- FightAIDS@Home
- Outsmart Ebola Together
- Mapping Cancer Markers

=

World Community Grid Mining Guide:
https://www.reddit.com/r/BiblePay/comments/97cx4f/world_community_grid_wcg_mining_guide/

[Dimarzio123]

Just want to chip in again

I said before we were at risk of becoming a 1 percent coin - that has come to pass
Huge difficulty in signing up to mine and share the rewards for the small guys

Solution

No blocks to joining or mining / stake on anyone wanting to mine up to 5000 RAC / no restrictions to heat mining / CPIDs required up to limit / other
We need numbers to come to BBP - doesnt matter where they come from

The argument some will set up multiple accts - so what? - adds up to more numbers
Maintaining multiple accts takes time and effort  - making sure RAC doesnt go over 5k to max out reward? / maintaining multiple PCs / updating wallets / etc - all add up to not being worth it
Once miners / others have a small pile of BBP - they become stakeholders - then they might want to continue building a stake - ie buy

Monthly selling of BBP needs to be done with far greater discipline
No more dumping of large blocks - I believe the agument a few superblocks ago was we are allright in the short time - just needed to obtain the months target and so dump.....
This attitude  towards selling just pisses off previous buyers who paid a lot more
Observe the last few superblocks and price action - you will see no reason to push the bid - coins will be dumped at any price - just put in a lowball bid and you will get hit

My 2c
PM

[sunk818]

bible_pay can we participate on this https://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/forums/wcg/viewthread_thread,41044_offset,0

I'm going to save my AMD EPYC 24c/48t for this. If we can rank well, this will help bring visibility to BiblePay and hopefully help sustain sponsorships to our poor children ("orphans")

Huge difficulty in signing up to mine and share the rewards for the small guys

That's what the airdrop was for. Some parts can be improved, but you have to register a Rosetta@Home account and download the BOINC client. That really can't be helped. Unless, someone runs a 0% bbppool clone and you just have one account to register. It could be done now with bbppool now but someone would have to subsidize the 35% pool fee.

Anyway, I am going to write a realistic suggestion where there is a new tab in the QT wallet outlining the steps required:

* Create account on Rosetta@Home - QT wallet will have a field where yo will be asked to enter your CPID so wallet can keep track
* Download BOINC client, add Rosetta project
* Complete Rosetta tasks

(This step is troublesome and could use refinement)

* Register Rosetta account to BBP blockchain

-- make CPID to blockchain registration fee lower (0.001) so that you can get easily from biblepayfaucet.com instead
-- smart contract knows you are not on blockchain, but have CPID and will send you 1 BBP once
-- pool.biblepay.org faucet for 1 BBP (but you have to register yet another account)

* Once CPID is on blockchain, biblepay.conf is revised to set up pool mining on purepool.org as you can PoBH mine anonymously (just need your wallet address) and CPID is recognized on blockchain

[616westwarmoth]

Although I generally feel this is a good post in most respects, I want to offer the assertion that the "1% gain in boinc participation" should not necessarily be considered way too high in  our estimations.  I would say that in most PR campaigns that would be a true statement.  However, in this case for all intents and purposes we are basically inviting users who are already paid up on the hardware and paid on the electricity to come to BIBLEPAY for only the cost of the UTXO (which is considered their asset - they get to keep it - so its not a capital expense to them).  So on the grounds that they can tinker with a new novelty item (Those that were resistant to crypto) this might be the kicker that gets them started, I would argue over a year, it is possible to gain 20% of the boinc users (IE 10,000).  

This campaign is sort of an experiment, to see if we can become a seed in order to become a household name later.  Im looking at this as the difference between biblepays
 stagnation (requiring us to really think out of the box to grow), or possibly gaining a massive amount of PR and growing through this experience.  This appears to me to be the Holy Grail opportunity for growth at this time for the PODC side- especially since we already do that so well.  We are great cancer miners, and great at WCG.  

I do not believe the long term effect of additional boinc users is a price dump!  They can only dump the coins once while value buyers buy them once, at that point once the emission is emitted, our total supply is stable.  Another words, I view 10,000 miners with 10,000 exchange accounts as much less volatile and more stable for our price than 1,000 miners (over the long term - 1 year out+).

Anyway, I will roll with this either way, as I said I am for no double dipping and nice team stats, but I lean towards Growth at this time and feel with our blacklist feature we can prevent double dipping and make our own stats report.

I respect your thoughts and discussion.

My major proofs that 1% is pretty high are 1) Byteball.  The paid out on 84.8M WCG Points, and there were a total of 906M points earned overall at the project.  So they go less than 10% on a no-staking, no-risk, super-easy to link coin.  2) Last time I ran the numbers, on the two CPU projects we were about 10x more profitable than Gridcoin. Gridcoin users are, by and large, savvy with crypto, so the technical barrier to entry is pretty low for them, but we've not seen many converts recently, which if they cared solely for maximizing profit, the would come here, PoDC BBP, sell it and buy GRC for a massively increased return.  That they haven't leads me to believe we're either still too hard, we've not been convincing enough that we're not a scam-coin or there are too many anti-religious crypto users that wouldn't come here even if the profits were 100-fold.  I don't truly believe we're too hard for a GRC user, so that leaves really the other two options, the first we can affect by increased transparency and the second we have not bearing on.

[slavino]

last winners was friends from XTREME_SYSTEMS= SLOVAKIA

A big thank you to David Pope Anderson, the big boss of BOINC, who supports the THOR CHALLENGE [Y3-2018].

[616westwarmoth]

Just want to chip in again

I said before we were at risk of becoming a 1 percent coin - that has come to pass
Huge difficulty in signing up to mine and share the rewards for the small guys

Solution

No blocks to joining or mining / stake on anyone wanting to mine up to 5000 RAC / no restrictions to heat mining / CPIDs required up to limit / other
We need numbers to come to BBP - doesnt matter where they come from

The argument some will set up multiple accts - so what? - adds up to more numbers
Maintaining multiple accts takes time and effort  - making sure RAC doesnt go over 5k to max out reward? / maintaining multiple PCs / updating wallets / etc - all add up to not being worth it
Once miners / others have a small pile of BBP - they become stakeholders - then they might want to continue building a stake - ie buy

Monthly selling of BBP needs to be done with far greater discipline
No more dumping of large blocks - I believe the agument a few superblocks ago was we are allright in the short time - just needed to obtain the months target and so dump.....
This attitude  towards selling just pisses off previous buyers who paid a lot more
Observe the last few superblocks and price action - you will see no reason to push the bid - coins will be dumped at any price - just put in a lowball bid and you will get hit

My 2c
PM

I'm not saying I would, but its pretty enticing for miners solely after profit to go though the work to split machines up to fall under any cap.  If they do that, then they do one of two things, either the dump unneeded coins and destroy the price or they convert into Sanctuaries and skew the ROI for others.  Again, not saying they would, but if our two biggest did that, there would be roughly 50M BBP suddenly freed up, if that all went into Sanctuaries, it would mean an instant 10% increase in Sanctuaries.

More importantly, it opens the door for botnets to crush our coin.  That was what was occurring before PoDC, it appeared half to two thirds of our coins were being mined by botnets.   When they left, the price rebounded (which could have been for a variety of reasons, but legitimate users started seeing reasonable numbers). The people least sensitive to the price of generating coins would be the ones hijacking computers and given enough incentive many will cheat.

We've tried to gain users, you can earn more writing orphan letters each month than the average home system is going to generate on PoDC but we struggle to get letters written.  You can get an airdrop which is enough for the average home system to partially stake and get rewarded but haven't seen a ton of small new users from it.  You can go to BBP-Pool and PoDC for 65% of the reward with NO Stake, but their user base seems to be capping out.  So would this help, who knows but so far there have been three methods to get around the objection that it's hard to get started due to stake and there has been little long term growth directly tied to that.  My belief is removing the stake would get users that are solely for the financial benefit, like I am at Byteball (and would wager most if not all the others from BBP that are there are for the same).

As far as selling the Orphan block, yes, I would agree.  Sell no more than 10% of the take per day would be a good starting point, 5% might be better.