BFL ASIC seized by EU , european & german Customs

[candoo]

Well,

one of the german community member posted in the german section that his BFL got seized by the customs. They believe that the CE Zerification is  non-complian and fictional.  They also failed to have a EU conformity declaration and a user handbook with information.


The main reason why it got a suspect by the customs: they included a american power cord in the package! Holy moly what would've happend if the user used that cable? USA(120volt)(germany 230volt)

That guy would be burned by now.


The package goes now to the Office of the Federal President for further inspection.  It MAY happen that Butterflylabs gets "blacklisted" by the european custums and all packages that go in the EU gets seized!!!


Inaba: I dont want to ruin your business. I just know that you dont read PM/s or Emails. So I thought that this Thread was the best to inform you guys. I have a lot of experience with german customs (through my job of importing stuff) and I know that this is  a very serious condition right now. They think that you just "printed" the CE label and put it on their without checking your components...
I may help your company to get cleared  by the customs, but that process consums a lot of time and money.

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[candoo]

LOL Germans got a lot money for bullshit, in Slovakia the officers do not care if u pay Sir we got Your booth whatbis the cost   A 100$ officers why the BFL do not remove the logo from box how can i scam the customs officers

No that is not about Germany. The whole EU got the same laws about that custom/importing stuff. So it COULD happen that the whole EU will block butterflylabs packages.

You cant scam the customs. They look at the adress where it comes from and they can also  check packages by specific weights and dimensions.

Example: Package with (12cmx50cmx80cm and 2400 Grams) = check everyone manual.

They have the infrastructure to do such things and it happend in the past. (Lots of chinese vendors got blacklisted for shipping fake tshirts and jeans)

[ecliptic]

Their FCC compliance is likely also fictional

Could very easily happen in the USA as well!

[Red_Wolf_2]

They care about US power cords? Seriously? Most of the time these are built to handle 230v 10a anyway, as almost all power supplies these days are switching power supplies that can handle anything between 100 and 250v.

Wonder if they confiscate Cisco gear for the same reason? I've never had a switch or router arrive that hasn't had a US power cable included. Got a huge pile of them somewhere now...

Oh also, its entirely possible they're wrong about the certifications... I've seen Customs do stupid things many times before. Maybe someone in customs knows what it is and wants to hang onto it for a few days?

[iANDROID]

LOL Germans got a lot money for bullshit, in Slovakia the officers do not care if u pay Sir we got Your booth whatbis the cost   A 100$ officers why the BFL do not remove the logo from box how can i scam the customs officers

No that is not about Germany. The whole EU got the same laws about that custom/importing stuff. So it COULD happen that the whole EU will block butterflylabs packages.

You cant scam the customs. They look at the adress where it comes from and they can also  check packages by specific weights and dimensions.

Example: Package with (12cmx50cmx80cm and 2400 Grams) = check everyone manual.

They have the infrastructure to do such things and it happend in the past. (Lots of chinese vendors got blacklisted for shipping fake tshirts and jeans)

Even in non-EU states(like Switzerland)!

[Gordon Bleu]

thats just Computer parts, like a external RAM,
and please hope he doesnt  just painted CE on the Box thats probably worst than without faked Certificates

[vm1990]

LOL Germans got a lot money for bullshit, in Slovakia the officers do not care if u pay Sir we got Your booth whatbis the cost   A 100$ officers why the BFL do not remove the logo from box how can i scam the customs officers

No that is not about Germany. The whole EU got the same laws about that custom/importing stuff. So it COULD happen that the whole EU will block butterflylabs packages.

You cant scam the customs. They look at the adress where it comes from and they can also  check packages by specific weights and dimensions.

Example: Package with (12cmx50cmx80cm and 2400 Grams) = check everyone manual.

They have the infrastructure to do such things and it happend in the past. (Lots of chinese vendors got blacklisted for shipping fake tshirts and jeans)

would be pretty easy to get around it but i think it will be outside of BFLs capability..... they are American after all.....(yes i am poking fun at the all knowing Americans and i dont care) best way would to simply have uncertified items or simply get them properly certified..... worst thing you can do is lie or stick a fake sticker on things... (Americas to use to lieing about important stuff these day)

all that said anyone who gets there parcel taken off them by customs should be compensated AND fully reimbursed for the item and any lost earnings

[Bitcoinorama]

I would imagine if 'CE' is fraudulently stuck on customers not getting their units would be the least of their problems. This would be game over for Butterfly Labs.

That 'silly little sticker' is taken very, very seriously in Europe. If they have it displayed without adhering to the requirements and application they are in a world of shit. Really.

[madsusies]

There are lot jala box and labes pictures you can check if they got CE

[k9quaint]

Ouch. Where are all those people who said "certification doesn't matter!" 

[Turbor]

Even in non-EU states(like Switzerland)!

Never had troubles with Swiss customs. And as a HAM I shouldn't have problems to import hardware without CE sign.

[Loredo]

They also failed to have a EU conformity declaration and a user handbook with information.

Re-reading the OP, I've calmed down.  This is most likely about the user handbook.  And even there, it's undoubtedly something like it wasn't translated into French or something.

Now I'm going back to looking at posted photos of 50GH (or is it 30? or 60? who can keep up) miners, and dream.

[tempestb]

Apparently the CE is just a declaration that any manufacturer can print themselves through self certification.  So not sure where the "faking" idea is coming from.  My guess is, even if this were some compliance problem that reached some level of penalty, it would be monetary and not a ban on imports.  The EU would rather make money on people's mistakes than spend money trying to enforce an embargo.

[philips]

Just received two more Japs today. No customs officer gave a fuck about my box, they didn't even looked inside.

Just another reason for trolls to yap about.

[Bitcoinorama]

Germany is known to be the strictest bureaucratically so it may just be an unfortunate one-off...

[Turbor]

The main reason why it got a suspect by the customs: they included a american power cord in the package! Holy moly what would've happend if the user used that cable? USA(120volt)(germany 230volt)

There's a reason the plug won't fit. Not too long ago miners had to have some basic knowledge to run their stuff...

[Soros Shorts]

There are lot jala box and labes pictures you can check if they got CE

The only CE logo that came with my US-delivered Jalapeno is the one that appears on the power supply.

[Red_Wolf_2]

Someone with a Jalapeno please look at the punch marks on the American plugged cable for the PSU. It will tell you the type of wire used and what voltages it will handle. Better still, post a picture for all of us.

On the topic of CE certification, it gets rather grey... No unit besides the minirig actually runs on anything above 12v, (the minirig has PSUs in it, although as a separate module it might be debatable, however they are in the same physical box... I'm no lawyer...) so the low voltage directive doesn't apply in their case. What might apply is the EMC directive, but that in its own right might be debatable too as you could probably classify the ASICs as components, as they won't function in any way without being connected to a host device.

With the included PSUs its a lot clearer really. The CE certification would need to be handled by the manufacturer of the power supplies rather than BFL.

Just my interpretation of it all...

Also, for the guy who might (gasp) have plugged 120v power cables into a 240v supply... He probably wouldn't have noticed unless the PSU itself was only rated up to 120v (it isn't).
I've only ever seen mains PSU cables actually melt once before, and that was when someone got the bright idea of "neatening up" the power cables on a whole bunch of racks in a development lab. They coiled all the cables tightly around themselves, which were feeding high powered servers and similar gear. Anyone with even a hint of understanding of physics and EMI will know what happened next: the cables warmed right up and the insulation started breaking down. When discovered by chance, the insulation was cracked and oozing a mysterious oil that I can only assume was distilled out of the plastic from the insulation.

Made occupational health and safety busy for a little while. Very amusing!

[philips]

The main reason why it got a suspect by the customs: they included a american power cord in the package! Holy moly what would've happend if the user used that cable? USA(120volt)(germany 230volt)

That guy would be burned by now.

The power brick unit is for worldwide use, 100 - 240V. The cables are just fine.
I am using the same cables with an adapter.

[philips]

Someone with a Jalapeno please look at the punch marks on the American plugged cable for the PSU. It will tell you the type of wire used and what voltages it will handle. Better still, post a picture for all of us.

Sorry for the quality, iPod camera:)
6A 250V

[Red_Wolf_2]

Someone with a Jalapeno please look at the punch marks on the American plugged cable for the PSU. It will tell you the type of wire used and what voltages it will handle. Better still, post a picture for all of us.

Sorry for the quality, iPod camera:)

Oh look, a 250v rated plug! Bet the writing on the cable indicates its also rated to at least 110/250v (I have a 230v cable here which indicates 250/440v)

[madsusies]

It is US 250V? The same plug like in UK is used? Interesting

[Quantus]

Maybe some one in customs was like "hey I'll list this a possible counterfeit/dangerous Tech item and then lose it in sorting." *wink_wink*  

[Red_Wolf_2]

It is US 250V? The same plug like in UK is used? Interesting

Very different form factor to UK plugs. This is a non earthed US plug (NEMA standard). The UK (when I last checked, quite a long time ago) uses BS 1363 plugs, those big beefy looking ones rated for 13A (and definitely polarised!)
So many standards around the world, its a pain to keep up with them all! Often the approach is to design the basic parts to conform with as many as possible, so you'll find many decent (and even cheap) cables for the American (and other 120v) markets will be rated for 230-250v anyway, because its easier and safer. The actual peripheral or power supply connected via said cable is a different matter of course, but in any computer gear manufactured within the last 15 years a vast majority is either auto switching (as in the case with laptop supplies) or has a little red switch to move between 120v and 230v as seen on cheaper or older ATX power supplies.

Looking at the BFL supplied cable, its rated at either 3A or 8A. Not huge wattage, but more than enough for a Jalapeno.

[philips]

Looking at the BFL supplied cable, its rated at either 3A or 8A. Not huge wattage, but more than enough for a Jalapeno.

Is rated 6 A.

[Red_Wolf_2]

Looking at the BFL supplied cable, its rated at either 3A or 8A. Not huge wattage, but more than enough for a Jalapeno.

Is rated 6 A.

So it is... So theoretical maximum of 1500w. For sure I would not be comfortable running that much power through it (it would get warm) but still, more than enough to manage.

[TheSwede75]

Well,

one of the german community member posted in the german section that his BFL got seized by the customs. They believe that the CE Zerification is  non-complian and fictional.  They also failed to have a EU conformity declaration and a user handbook with information.


The main reason why it got a suspect by the customs: they included a american power cord in the package! Holy moly what would've happend if the user used that cable? USA(120volt)(germany 230volt)

That guy would be burned by now.


The package goes now to the Office of the Federal President for further inspection.  It MAY happen that Butterflylabs gets "blacklisted" by the european custums and all packages that go in the EU gets seized!!!


Inaba: I dont want to ruin your business. I just know that you dont read PM/s or Emails. So I thought that this Thread was the best to inform you guys. I have a lot of experience with german customs (through my job of importing stuff) and I know that this is  a very serious condition right now. They think that you just "printed" the CE label and put it on their without checking your components...
I may help your company to get cleared  by the customs, but that process consums a lot of time and money.

That sucks, but if you order a damn ASIC and still try using a US power cable (That don't even fit Euro Plugs) you have to be dumber than a sack of rocks.

[candoo]

I guess that 90% of the orders go through customs without problems. They dont check every parcel, but once they check it  they get suspicios. Of course CE is self-declaring, but you have to check your hardware more then a dozenz times before you self-declare it.

[goxed]

Avalon team shipped w/o any cables of any kind

[PaperClip]

As I know only 5GH/s unit is shipped with power cable, all other use power from separate PSU. Maybe 500 GH/s unit is shipped with power cables too, at least it looks like standalone device with its own PSU.

[vvic]

sure, sure. As if Avalons had all the appropriate certifications
But they were willing to declare it as "industrial controller" or something like that and lower the cost on the customs form, while BFL said they won't lie about these things

[PuertoLibre]

There are lot jala box and labes pictures you can check if they got CE

The only CE logo that came with my US-delivered Jalapeno is the one that appears on the power supply.

Is that an Avalon in the background?

Make sure to wash that side of the Avalon from the BFL taint.

[candoo]

Is that an Avalon in the background?

Make sure to wash that side of the Avalon from the BFL taint.

ahahhahaha

[Paladin69]

[Bicknellski]

Well,

one of the german community member posted in the german section that his BFL got seized by the customs. They believe that the CE Zerification is  non-complian and fictional.  They also failed to have a EU conformity declaration and a user handbook with information.


The main reason why it got a suspect by the customs: they included a american power cord in the package! Holy moly what would've happend if the user used that cable? USA(120volt)(germany 230volt)

That guy would be burned by now.


The package goes now to the Office of the Federal President for further inspection.  It MAY happen that Butterflylabs gets "blacklisted" by the european custums and all packages that go in the EU gets seized!!!


Inaba: I dont want to ruin your business. I just know that you dont read PM/s or Emails. So I thought that this Thread was the best to inform you guys. I have a lot of experience with german customs (through my job of importing stuff) and I know that this is  a very serious condition right now. They think that you just "printed" the CE label and put it on their without checking your components...
I may help your company to get cleared  by the customs, but that process consums a lot of time and money.

That sucks, but if you order a damn ASIC and still try using a US power cable (That don't even fit Euro Plugs) you have to be dumber than a sack of rocks.

Excuse me but why do you keep laying the blame on the customer? Doesn't BFL have any responsibility in this? Come on stop being a SHILL for BFL. The BFL SHILLING DAYS ARE OVER!

[Bicknellski]

sure, sure. As if Avalons had all the appropriate certifications
But they were willing to declare it as "industrial controller" or something like that and lower the cost on the customs form, while BFL said they won't lie about these things

See I think I found the error in your sentence... see that... where you say "BFL said they won't lie". That bridge been crossed so many times already they are thinking of putting in a TOLL GATE.

[Dunkelheit667]

Just some notes regarding the hand written information, might clarify some guessing. Please excuse my poor English skills...

a) States the power cord does not apply to directive 2006/95/EC, Annex I, 1(c).
Quote from the source: "The electrical equipment, together with its component parts, should be made in such a way as to ensure that it can be safely and properly assembled and connected."
b) Due to a) they put the CE marking into question (if it is legit).
c) Missing manual in German language and manufacturer/importer information.

Should be easy to fix.
1) As mentioned, remove the US power cord from the package (or put all three, four used in the EU inside the package).
2) Create a flyer with some setup instructions (with all EU languages) and put it into the package. Print your manufacturer address/contact data on the same flyer.

C'mon, this is easy. All manufacturers shipping to the EU doing the same boring stuff.

Hint: Smart companies will print in addition the declaration of confirmity and ship it with the unit.

[chmod755]

Oh, now it's not just chinese solar panels…but everything made in China? - and it's suspicious, because of the US power cord?

[quattro]

There are lot jala box and labes pictures you can check if they got CE

The only CE logo that came with my US-delivered Jalapeno is the one that appears on the power supply.

Generic power supplies like that usually have counterfeit certifications.

Generic and counterfeit (marked with lite on, dell, toshiba, etc) power supplies are a big problem, so it's not surprising that German customs are on the look out.  

[vm1990]

Oh, now it's not just chinese solar panels…but everything made in China? - and it's suspicious, because of the US power cord?

Well, we are living here with thousands of EU directives AND national laws. If someone want to sue you, waste you time, whatever, he/she/it will find something. And well, custom's mission is protecting all of us happy EU residents. What would happen if someone fiddling around with an US power plug into an EU wall socket? I'm not kidding, that's the way they're thinking.

Yeah, I've bought some chinese solar panels before.  It was just a question of time. FUD is working very well in all countries. Economy, terrorists, power plugs, you will find something.

to be honest i think they should allow it seriously if someone tries to put a us power plug into a EU socket they deserve what happens to them.... its how the human race keep defective people from breeding.... seriously its useful

[Flashman]

I am vaguely remembering some sort of discussion on BFL's forum about import issues, where it was thought that it would pass if it was not "consumer" equipment, but office equipment or some such other definition, so I don't know if they spun the statement of contents right for that.

Sucks for everyone though. I bet BFL is pissed if it's all "on" the PSU compliance and their supplier promised them genuine compliance.

[greyhawk]

There are lot jala box and labes pictures you can check if they got CE

The only CE logo that came with my US-delivered Jalapeno is the one that appears on the power supply.

Generic power supplies like that usually have counterfeit certifications.

Generic and counterfeit (marked with lite on, dell, toshiba, etc) power supplies are a big problem, so it's not surprising that German customs are on the look out.  

In fact that's not a CE logo on that brick. It's one of the variants of the China Export logo. The China Export logos are intentionally made to look similar to the CE logo but the real CE logo has a shorter middle stroke in the E.

[iANDROID]

[k9quaint]

Generic power supplies like that usually have counterfeit certifications.

Generic and counterfeit (marked with lite on, dell, toshiba, etc) power supplies are a big problem, so it's not surprising that German customs are on the look out.  

In fact that's not a CE logo on that brick. It's one of the variants of the China Export logo. The China Export logos are intentionally made to look similar to the CE logo but the real CE logo has a shorter middle stroke in the E.

Of course.   
Supply chains are like a game of minesweeper now. 

[Loredo]

Such an amusing coincidence.  Iconic of so much, isn't it?

BTW, the way to tell a real CE is to visualize the continuation of the "C" as a circle to the right.  The right-most point of that circle will intersect the "E" at the point of the center horizontal bar.  Anything else is just that innocently coincidental "China Export" symbol. 

[Viceroy]

If somebody can point to a SPECIFIC known law they broke, please post it in the below thread.  I'm starting a collection of such reports here:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=247310.0

[Gator-hex]

Looking at the BFL supplied cable, its rated at either 3A or 8A. Not huge wattage, but more than enough for a Jalapeno.

Is rated 6 A.

So it is... So theoretical maximum of 1500w. For sure I would not be comfortable running that much power through it (it would get warm) but still, more than enough to manage.

13v x 6A = 78watts max.

[Gator-hex]

Just some notes regarding the hand written information, might clarify some guessing. Please excuse my poor English skills...

a) States the power cord does not apply to directive 2006/95/EC, Annex I, 1(c).
Quote from the source: "The electrical equipment, together with its component parts, should be made in such a way as to ensure that it can be safely and properly assembled and connected."
b) Due to a) they put the CE marking into question (if it is legit).
c) Missing manual in German language and manufacturer/importer information.

Should be easy to fix.
1) As mentioned, remove the US power cord from the package (or put all three, four used in the EU inside the package).
2) Create a flyer with some setup instructions (with all EU languages) and put it into the package. Print your manufacturer address/contact data on the same flyer.

C'mon, this is easy. All manufacturers shipping to the EU doing the same boring stuff.

Hint: Smart companies will print in addition the declaration of confirmity and ship it with the unit.

Easy? I think there are 25 different languages in the EU! Draw a diagram and use as few words as possible.
What the Chinese seem to do is ship to someone in Switzerland and get them to walk over the boarder into the EU. 

[Red_Wolf_2]

Looking at the BFL supplied cable, its rated at either 3A or 8A. Not huge wattage, but more than enough for a Jalapeno.

Is rated 6 A.

So it is... So theoretical maximum of 1500w. For sure I would not be comfortable running that much power through it (it would get warm) but still, more than enough to manage.

13v x 6A = 78watts max.

Cable != power supply. The supply is rated at what, 78 watts, but the actual cable from mains to the power supply is rated to a maximum of 1500w. As said though, I would not want to try putting that much through it as it would certainly get warm.

[Gator-hex]

Looking at the BFL supplied cable, its rated at either 3A or 8A. Not huge wattage, but more than enough for a Jalapeno.

Is rated 6 A.

So it is... So theoretical maximum of 1500w. For sure I would not be comfortable running that much power through it (it would get warm) but still, more than enough to manage.

13v x 6A = 78watts max.

Cable != power supply. The supply is rated at what, 78 watts, but the actual cable from mains to the power supply is rated to a maximum of 1500w. As said though, I would not want to try putting that much through it as it would certainly get warm.

100-240v x 2A = 480w max

[Flying Hellfish]

There are lot jala box and labes pictures you can check if they got CE

The only CE logo that came with my US-delivered Jalapeno is the one that appears on the power supply.

Not trying to thread jack here but US-delivered power brick, am I missing the UL stamp, is it somewhere else on the brick or device?

[k9quaint]

There are lot jala box and labes pictures you can check if they got CE

The only CE logo that came with my US-delivered Jalapeno is the one that appears on the power supply.

Not trying to thread jack here but US-delivered power brick, am I missing the UL stamp, is it somewhere else on the brick or device?

I just checked my power bricks and they all have ULs, FCCs and CEs (of the EU varietal).

[Flying Hellfish]

There are lot jala box and labes pictures you can check if they got CE

The only CE logo that came with my US-delivered Jalapeno is the one that appears on the power supply.

Not trying to thread jack here but US-delivered power brick, am I missing the UL stamp, is it somewhere else on the brick or device?

I just checked my power bricks and they all have ULs, FCCs and CEs (of the EU varietal).

For US delivered jalapeno's?

[k9quaint]

Not trying to thread jack here but US-delivered power brick, am I missing the UL stamp, is it somewhere else on the brick or device?

I just checked my power bricks and they all have ULs, FCCs and CEs (of the EU varietal).

For US delivered jalapeno's?

Sorry no, they are just the power bricks I have lying around.  Laptops, printers, n such

[goxed]

[Phinnaeus Gage]

O O!

[erk]

If you think you are going to have customs problems, ask for the miner to be shipped without a power supply and source an approved one locally yourself. This is what Avalon have been doing, and probably why KNCminer are going to ship without a power supply.

The alternative is the possibility of not having your ASIC miner.

[iANDROID]

If you think you are going to have customs problems, ask for the miner to be shipped without a power supply and source an approved one locally yourself. This is what Avalon have been doing, and probably why KNCminer are going to ship without a power supply.

The alternative is the possibility of not having your ASIC miner.

I can imagine the answer from BFL:

All sales or final, we can't do it.

[erk]

If you think you are going to have customs problems, ask for the miner to be shipped without a power supply and source an approved one locally yourself. This is what Avalon have been doing, and probably why KNCminer are going to ship without a power supply.

The alternative is the possibility of not having your ASIC miner.

I can imagine the answer from BFL:

All sales or final, we can't do it.

They have already been shipping Singles without power supplies for some people,  this is obviously a potential problem, and it would be nice if you helped people with useful suggestions or refrain from posting.

[k9quaint]

If you think you are going to have customs problems, ask for the miner to be shipped without a power supply and source an approved one locally yourself. This is what Avalon have been doing, and probably why KNCminer are going to ship without a power supply.

The alternative is the possibility of not having your ASIC miner.

I can imagine the answer from BFL:

All sales or final, we can't do it.

They have already been shipping Singles without power supplies for some people,  this is obviously a potential problem, and it would be nice if you helped people with useful suggestions or refrain from posting.

It would be nice if you followed your own advice instead of being a BFL spokespuppet all the time. How about next time you see Josh in the office you mention to him he might want to follow the law instead of dumping mistakes like this in his customers lap.

[iANDROID]

If you think you are going to have customs problems, ask for the miner to be shipped without a power supply and source an approved one locally yourself. This is what Avalon have been doing, and probably why KNCminer are going to ship without a power supply.

The alternative is the possibility of not having your ASIC miner.

I can imagine the answer from BFL:

All sales or final, we can't do it.

They have already been shipping Singles without power supplies for some people,  this is obviously a potential problem, and it would be nice if you helped people with useful suggestions or refrain from posting.

To clarify the EU position, I send an email to the Swiss Customs.

[frankenmint]

Wikipedia states that self certification is possible.  I didn't bother reading after page 1 in case another person also found and posted this information.

Self-certification

Depending on the level of risk of the product, the CE marking is affixed to a product by the manufacturer or authorized representative who decides whether the product meets all the CE marking requirements. If a product has minimal risk, it can be self-certified where manufacturers a Declaration of Conformity and affixes the CE marking to their own product. Manufacturer then must do several things:
1. Decide whether the product needs to have a CE marking and if the product applies to more than one directive it needs to comply with all of them.
2. Choose the conformity assessment procedure from the modules called out by the directive for the product. There are several modules available for the Conformity Assessment Procedures as listed below:
Module A – Internal production control.
Module B – EC type-examination.
Module C – Conformity to type.
Module D – Production quality assurance.
Module E – Product quality assurance.
Module F – Product verification.
Module G – Unit verification.
Module H – Full quality assurance.
These will often ask questions about the product to classify the level of risk and then refer to the "Conformity Assessment Procedures" chart. This shows all the acceptable options available to a manufacturer to certify the product and affix the CE marking.
Products considered to have a greater risk have to be independently certified by a notified body. This is an organization that has been nominated by a Member State and has been notified by the European Commission. These notified bodies act as test labs and carry out the steps as listed in the directives mentioned above and then decided whether the product has passed. A manufacturer can choose its own notified body in any Member State of the European Union but should be independent of the manufacturer and a private sector organization or a government agency.

[Bitcoinorama]

Guys if you really want to get into the legal ins and outs as well as potential recourse, I suggest you take a look here;

This first;

http://www.slideshare.net/cbock/ce-marking-what-can-legal-metrology-learn-from-intellectual-property

Then;

http://www.conformance.co.uk/

http://www.ce-mag.com/dcforum/DCForumID18/63.html

http://ec.europa.eu/enterprise/policies/single-market-goods/cemarking/downloads/ce_brochure_en.pdf

[Enigma81]

Looking at the BFL supplied cable, its rated at either 3A or 8A. Not huge wattage, but more than enough for a Jalapeno.

Is rated 6 A.

So it is... So theoretical maximum of 1500w. For sure I would not be comfortable running that much power through it (it would get warm) but still, more than enough to manage.

13v x 6A = 78watts max.

Cable != power supply. The supply is rated at what, 78 watts, but the actual cable from mains to the power supply is rated to a maximum of 1500w. As said though, I would not want to try putting that much through it as it would certainly get warm.

Would it get warmer at US voltage (110) or UK voltage (220) if you put the maximum 6A through it?

[SwissMiner]

What the Chinese seem to do is ship to someone in Switzerland and get them to walk over the boarder into the EU. 

1 BTC/each for forwarding (Switzerland to EU) your miner 

[Bitcoinorama]

What the Chinese seem to do is ship to someone in Switzerland and get them to walk over the boarder into the EU.  

1 BTC/each for forwarding (Switzerland to EU) your miner  

I have to admit I would love to live in Switzerland...the place is breathtaking, incredible snow, and super environmentally focused.

[iANDROID]

What the Chinese seem to do is ship to someone in Switzerland and get them to walk over the boarder into the EU.  

1 BTC/each for forwarding (Switzerland to EU) your miner  

I have to admit I would love to live in Switzerland...the place is breathtaking, incredible snow, and super environmentally focused.

And then, when you see the shipping price.
For 15BTC, I will let you come 1 day in my home.

EDIT: Switzerland follow the same law as EU.

[SwissMiner]

Switzerland follow the same law as EU.

 

In which Kanton you are living as you have problems importing goods from China ?

I'm living in SG, never ever had troubles with China-Imports 

[iANDROID]

Switzerland follow the same law as EU.

 

In which Kanton you are living as you have problems importing goods from China ?

I'm living in SG, never ever had troubles with China-Imports 

FR with this: http://dx.com/p/portable-solar-powered-4000mah-battery-w-charging-adapters-101004

[Tinua]

Let write iANDROID a few mails more to custom. Then we will have also problems with import. 

[SwissMiner]

FR with this: http://dx.com/p/portable-solar-powered-4000mah-battery-w-charging-adapters-101004

Please show me/us the official statement from Swiss-Customs ..

[Tinua]

Furthermore, it was exactly 1 jalapeno stopped by an overenthusiastic customs employees!

Do not make an elephant out of a mouse.

[iANDROID]

FR with this: http://dx.com/p/portable-solar-powered-4000mah-battery-w-charging-adapters-101004

Please show me/us the official statement from Swiss-Customs ..

You really think of me having it after more than a year?

[Red_Wolf_2]

Looking at the BFL supplied cable, its rated at either 3A or 8A. Not huge wattage, but more than enough for a Jalapeno.

Is rated 6 A.

So it is... So theoretical maximum of 1500w. For sure I would not be comfortable running that much power through it (it would get warm) but still, more than enough to manage.

13v x 6A = 78watts max.

Cable != power supply. The supply is rated at what, 78 watts, but the actual cable from mains to the power supply is rated to a maximum of 1500w. As said though, I would not want to try putting that much through it as it would certainly get warm.

Would it get warmer at US voltage (110) or UK voltage (220) if you put the maximum 6A through it?

It would get just as warm if it was 6A on either voltage. The resistance would be the same, so the energy lost in the form of heat would be the same. Proportionally you would be losing more at 110v though. Where it gets fun is when you're considering watts (I*V=W). If you're using 220v you only need half as much current as if you're using 110v to get the same number of watts, and because resistance in wire results in a voltage drop you'll find greater heat resulting from the lower voltage at higher current than you will find at a high voltage, low current system.

I haven't really explained it that well, but a quick peek on wikipedia should fill you in on the details

[SwissMiner]

Even in non-EU states(like Switzerland)!

Never had troubles with Swiss customs. And as a HAM I shouldn't have problems to import hardware without CE sign.

I guess only iANDROID had problems (are you from Germany, living in FR ?) 

[Enigma81]

Looking at the BFL supplied cable, its rated at either 3A or 8A. Not huge wattage, but more than enough for a Jalapeno.

Is rated 6 A.

So it is... So theoretical maximum of 1500w. For sure I would not be comfortable running that much power through it (it would get warm) but still, more than enough to manage.

13v x 6A = 78watts max.

Cable != power supply. The supply is rated at what, 78 watts, but the actual cable from mains to the power supply is rated to a maximum of 1500w. As said though, I would not want to try putting that much through it as it would certainly get warm.

Would it get warmer at US voltage (110) or UK voltage (220) if you put the maximum 6A through it?

It would get just as warm if it was 6A on either voltage. The resistance would be the same, so the energy lost in the form of heat would be the same. Proportionally you would be losing more at 110v though. Where it gets fun is when you're considering watts (I*V=W). If you're using 220v you only need half as much current as if you're using 110v to get the same number of watts, and because resistance in wire results in a voltage drop you'll find greater heat resulting from the lower voltage at higher current than you will find at a high voltage, low current system.

I haven't really explained it that well, but a quick peek on wikipedia should fill you in on the details

I was actually just making sure that you were at least remotely qualified to be giving people advise on things electrical.  I'm an EE.  Heat in a cable is I^2*R - voltage has nothing to do with it.. (well, alright, not NOTHING, but very very very little)

Good answer.

Enigma.

[PuertoLibre]

If you think you are going to have customs problems, ask for the miner to be shipped without a power supply and source an approved one locally yourself. This is what Avalon have been doing, and probably why KNCminer are going to ship without a power supply.

The alternative is the possibility of not having your ASIC miner.

I can imagine the answer from BFL:

All sales or final, we can't do it.

They have already been shipping Singles without power supplies for some people,  this is obviously a potential problem, and it would be nice if you helped people with useful suggestions or refrain from posting.

It would be nice if you followed your own advice instead of being a BFL spokespuppet all the time. How about next time you see Josh in the office you mention to him he might want to follow the law instead of dumping mistakes like this in his customers lap.

You make it sound like it was an aborted baby.

[k9quaint]

If you think you are going to have customs problems, ask for the miner to be shipped without a power supply and source an approved one locally yourself. This is what Avalon have been doing, and probably why KNCminer are going to ship without a power supply.

The alternative is the possibility of not having your ASIC miner.

I can imagine the answer from BFL:

All sales or final, we can't do it.

They have already been shipping Singles without power supplies for some people,  this is obviously a potential problem, and it would be nice if you helped people with useful suggestions or refrain from posting.

It would be nice if you followed your own advice instead of being a BFL spokespuppet all the time. How about next time you see Josh in the office you mention to him he might want to follow the law instead of dumping mistakes like this in his customers lap.

You make it sound like it was an aborted baby.

That would be an insult to aborted babies everywhere. 

[Red_Wolf_2]

Looking at the BFL supplied cable, its rated at either 3A or 8A. Not huge wattage, but more than enough for a Jalapeno.

Is rated 6 A.

So it is... So theoretical maximum of 1500w. For sure I would not be comfortable running that much power through it (it would get warm) but still, more than enough to manage.

13v x 6A = 78watts max.

Cable != power supply. The supply is rated at what, 78 watts, but the actual cable from mains to the power supply is rated to a maximum of 1500w. As said though, I would not want to try putting that much through it as it would certainly get warm.

Would it get warmer at US voltage (110) or UK voltage (220) if you put the maximum 6A through it?

It would get just as warm if it was 6A on either voltage. The resistance would be the same, so the energy lost in the form of heat would be the same. Proportionally you would be losing more at 110v though. Where it gets fun is when you're considering watts (I*V=W). If you're using 220v you only need half as much current as if you're using 110v to get the same number of watts, and because resistance in wire results in a voltage drop you'll find greater heat resulting from the lower voltage at higher current than you will find at a high voltage, low current system.

I haven't really explained it that well, but a quick peek on wikipedia should fill you in on the details

I was actually just making sure that you were at least remotely qualified to be giving people advise on things electrical.  I'm an EE.  Heat in a cable is I^2*R - voltage has nothing to do with it.. (well, alright, not NOTHING, but very very very little)

Good answer.

Enigma.

Been a long time since I've had to use that set of equations seriously... Last time was building heater cores out of nichrome wire and furnace cement. You're right when it comes to heat being directly connected to current and resistance, the voltage only becomes really important when showing the difference in current between a ~220v and 110v system.
I'll admit I did deliberately simplify and use DC characteristics rather than getting into the fun of AC and varying currents over small time periods, not to mention the wonders of inductive loss (or melted PSU cables from idiots who like coiling them into tight bundles!). Few would recognise the difference and would just go "Oh, MATHS!" and switch their brains off

[erk]

The resistance of copper wire goes up with temperature. 4.9 x 10^-3 is the coefficient.

[Bicknellski]

Looking at the BFL supplied cable, its rated at either 3A or 8A. Not huge wattage, but more than enough for a Jalapeno.

Is rated 6 A.

So it is... So theoretical maximum of 1500w. For sure I would not be comfortable running that much power through it (it would get warm) but still, more than enough to manage.

13v x 6A = 78watts max.

Cable != power supply. The supply is rated at what, 78 watts, but the actual cable from mains to the power supply is rated to a maximum of 1500w. As said though, I would not want to try putting that much through it as it would certainly get warm.

Would it get warmer at US voltage (110) or UK voltage (220) if you put the maximum 6A through it?

It would get just as warm if it was 6A on either voltage. The resistance would be the same, so the energy lost in the form of heat would be the same. Proportionally you would be losing more at 110v though. Where it gets fun is when you're considering watts (I*V=W). If you're using 220v you only need half as much current as if you're using 110v to get the same number of watts, and because resistance in wire results in a voltage drop you'll find greater heat resulting from the lower voltage at higher current than you will find at a high voltage, low current system.

I haven't really explained it that well, but a quick peek on wikipedia should fill you in on the details

I was actually just making sure that you were at least remotely qualified to be giving people advise on things electrical.  I'm an EE.  Heat in a cable is I^2*R - voltage has nothing to do with it.. (well, alright, not NOTHING, but very very very little)

Good answer.

Enigma.

Been a long time since I've had to use that set of equations seriously... Last time was building heater cores out of nichrome wire and furnace cement. You're right when it comes to heat being directly connected to current and resistance, the voltage only becomes really important when showing the difference in current between a ~220v and 110v system.
I'll admit I did deliberately simplify and use DC characteristics rather than getting into the fun of AC and varying currents over small time periods, not to mention the wonders of inductive loss (or melted PSU cables from idiots who like coiling them into tight bundles!). Few would recognise the difference and would just go "Oh, MATHS!" and switch their brains off

Obviously you are not a teacher by trade by assuming people "switch" off? Tsk tsk.

[Red_Wolf_2]

Obviously you are not a teacher by trade by assuming people "switch" off? Tsk tsk.

Good heavens no! I'd be prone to throwing students out windows from frustration... I have all the patience in the world for those who want to learn, but anyone who wastes my time... Well...

[Cluster2k]

My Jalapenos made it through Australia Customs without hassles.  I've had other gear delivered from the USA, Europe and China with their plugs and no one cared.

When I first heard of the 'CE' China Export tag a few days ago I thought it was a silly online joke.  It staggers me that someone in China thought this was a great idea.  Total coincidence that the two logos look virtually identical 

I have purchased a Dell laptop PSU online that turned out to be fake.  It had a couple of spelling errors on the label and got quite hot in use.  I'm not surprised Customs may be picky about laptop PSUs as it's a real safety issue.

No 'UL' mark on my Jalapeno PSUs, and of course no markings apart from a serial number on the actual Jalapenos.

[erk]

My Jalapenos made it through Australia Customs without hassles.  I've had other gear delivered from the USA, Europe and China with their plugs and no one cared.

When I first heard of the 'CE' China Export tag a few days ago I thought it was a silly online joke.  It staggers me that someone in China thought this was a great idea.  Total coincidence that the two logos look virtually identical  

I have purchased a Dell laptop PSU online that turned out to be fake.  It had a couple of spelling errors on the label and got quite hot in use.  I'm not surprised Customs may be picky about laptop PSUs as it's a real safety issue.

No 'UL' mark on my Jalapeno PSUs, and of course no markings apart from a serial number on the actual Jalapenos.

The crazy thing is, if they ship the Jalapeno separate from a power supply, they don't need certification, as they are not a mains powered device, if they bundle them together then they do as it's considered part of a system.

I guess if BLF were smart they could put them as separate items on the paperwork so they are not a system.

[Gordon Bleu]

as far as i know, they don't need to send Plug's with it, because someone on BFL s Forum used a self built
6 PCI-E Power Cable
it's just a stupid Joke or the Customs Officer has gone full Retard.

[klondike_bar]

The main reason why it got a suspect by the customs: they included a american power cord in the package! Holy moly what would've happend if the user used that cable? USA(120volt)(germany 230volt)

That guy would be burned by now.

last i checked, the North American 115V plug is a lot different then a EU 230V plug, so I don't think there will be any issues with it setting the place on fire.



however, the power adapter might not handle 230V, even with the right cord type. A new one may be needed (not expensive, but still a PITA

[Bitcoinorama]

The main reason why it got a suspect by the customs: they included a american power cord in the package! Holy moly what would've happend if the user used that cable? USA(120volt)(germany 230volt)

That guy would be burned by now.

last i checked, the North American 115V plug is a lot different then a EU 230V plug, so I don't think there will be any issues with it setting the place on fire.



however, the power adapter might not handle 230V, even with the right cord type. A new one may be needed (not expensive, but still a PITA

FWIW Euro plugs do fit straight into UK sockets without an adapter...

[escrow.ms]

Sorry for offtopic post but some socket looks like emoticons lol
Look at north america (angry), great Britain (bebe pleure) and denmark one (happy).

[philips]

however, the power adapter might not handle 230V, even with the right cord type. A new one may be needed (not expensive, but still a PITA

The power adapter is rated 100 - 240V, worldwide use.

[peonminer]

Some customs agents just got into the Bitcoin game

[Flashman]

When I first heard of the 'CE' China Export tag a few days ago I thought it was a silly online joke.  It staggers me that someone in China thought this was a great idea.  Total coincidence that the two logos look virtually identical 

It more or less is, it was propagated among the redneck types in a wave of post 9/11 xenophobia.

There are fake CE marks and badly proportioned CE marks even on compliant products, but no "China Export" mark per se

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_mark#Misuse


But since this thread is likely to devolve into wild conspiracy theories hugely divorced from fact, carry on....

[Loredo]

When I first heard of the 'CE' China Export tag a few days ago I thought it was a silly online joke.  It staggers me that someone in China thought this was a great idea.  Total coincidence that the two logos look virtually identical  

It more or less is, it was propagated among the redneck types in a wave of post 9/11 xenophobia.

There are fake CE marks and badly proportioned CE marks even on compliant products, but no "China Export" mark per se

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_mark#Misuse


But since this thread is likely to devolve into wild conspiracy theories hugely divorced from fact, carry on....

Why, yes, you are right.  That is an urban myth.  The European parliament has disavowed the counterfeit CE marks coming from China as standing for China Export.  http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides/getAllAnswers.do?reference=P-2007-5938&language=EN

Personally, I'll refrain from indirectly or directly attributing those marks to systemic shenanigans perpetrated by the PRC authorities.  Instead, I'll refer to it as a China Excrement mark.  That will very likely better describe a product foisted out with so little regard to the standards of that nation's largest trading partner.

[k9quaint]

At least they didn't put melamine in the power cords. Or milk. 

[Unacceptable]

At least they didn't put melamine in the power cords. Or milk.  

Don't forget about that "Great Drywall of China" too  

http://chinesedrywallflorida.org/

[polarhei]

Very well then.

[Turbor]

Some asshole at the German Zoll had his big day.

[Lohoris]

It more or less is, it was propagated among the redneck types in a wave of post 9/11 xenophobia.

There are fake CE marks and badly proportioned CE marks even on compliant products, but no "China Export" mark per se

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_mark#Misuse


But since this thread is likely to devolve into wild conspiracy theories hugely divorced from fact, carry on....

+1

Problem is, this urban legend is so much widespread, that the cited article itself, right next where it explains taht "China Export" doesn't exist, have an image depicting a "China Export" logo...

[Fiyasko]

Makes me wonder about how they did thier conduct with the FCC

[Viceroy]

They did nothing with the FCC.  If they had they would have a sticker on the device.   The device has no FCC sticker.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

They did nothing with the FCC.  If they had they would have a sticker on the device.   The device has no FCC sticker.

And the documentation would be on the official FCC site, of which it is not as of yesterday. I just checked. I believe somebody has a $1,000 USD bounty awarded to anybody who can prove via said site that BFL has submitted a single device. Amazingly, that's one bet that Josh won't be able to profit from.

Then again, don't put it pass BFL to create some document and state that due to the uniqueness of their devices, only a certificate is awarded without having it show up on the FCC site. The certificate is good as long as it's framed and displayed above the Luke Unit in the BFL Museum of BS.

[Flashman]

AFAIK low voltage computing devices or peripherals that don't have radios in them i.e. wi-fi or bluetooth, or don't connect to a phone line, don't need to be actually tested by the FCC themselves any more, thus won't get an ID tag. They have to be independantly certified as compliant with part 15, but that's by any of ~300 test labs.

BUT you are probably not aware of the fact that even if certified it was always on the USER to ensure that in service it did not interfere with anything, and to resolve any complaints of interference.

A metal box is pretty much a faraday cage though, so there should be no problem.

I believe BFL also does not regard these products as "consumer" products, and they may come under the commercial exemption to part 15
http://www.i-spec.com/EMC/usa.html


More importantly however...

WARNING: BFL PRODUCTS ARE NOT CERTIFIED AS KOSHER AND ARE NOT SUITABLE FOR CONSUMPTION BY PRACTICING JEWS

I also demand LD50 information in case I accidentally blend it into a fine powder and feed it to a 2 year old. It's important to know if 2 and half teaspoons is okay but 3 isn't.

EDIT: Poes Law strikes again.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poes_law The last 3 lines were sarcasm. I'm forgetting again that the rabid, raving BFL haters have become impossible to parody, due to there being no belief crazy enough that you can't be sure they wouldn't actually subscribe to it.

[Loredo]

WARNING: BFL PRODUCTS ARE NOT CERTIFIED AS KOSHER AND ARE NOT SUITABLE FOR CONSUMPTION BY PRACTICING JEWS

I'm forgetting again that the rabid, raving BFL haters have become impossible to parody, due to there being no belief crazy enough that you can't be sure they wouldn't actually subscribe to it.

I'm sure you know that to have your parody or sarcasm taken literally is a high complement.

One don't have to remain Kosher to be a practicing Jew, by the way. 

[Quix]

One don't have to remain Kosher to be a practicing Jew, by the way. 

Like most matters of religion, it really depends who you ask about that one. There are people who believe that you must keep Kosher to be a Jew. Religions are slippery like that, it all depends on who you ask.

[smoothie]

All I can say is...wow...

I'm curious what other screw ups or delays will be coming in the next weeks and months through BFL. They seem to make every possible mistake imaginable as an ASIC business.

[Unacceptable]

All I can say is...wow...

I'm curious what other screw ups or delays will be coming in the next weeks and months through BFL. They seem to make every possible mistake imaginable as an ASIC business.

Uh,the 90 day window to fulfill ALL preorders up to May has been moved to Sept from Aug...............imagine that 

[Phinnaeus Gage]

All I can say is...wow...

I'm curious what other screw ups or delays will be coming in the next weeks and months through BFL. They seem to make every possible mistake imaginable as an ASIC business.

Uh,the 90 day window to fulfill ALL preorders up to May has been moved to Sept from Aug...............imagine that 

Further imagine the 100K chip order being delivered on time, since we're in an imagine mode.

[smoothie]

All I can say is...wow...

I'm curious what other screw ups or delays will be coming in the next weeks and months through BFL. They seem to make every possible mistake imaginable as an ASIC business.

Uh,the 90 day window to fulfill ALL preorders up to May has been moved to Sept from Aug...............imagine that 

Link?

[SolarSilver]

Uh,the 90 day window to fulfill ALL preorders up to May has been moved to Sept from Aug...............imagine that 

Link?

Probably related to:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=252072.new

?

[zyyz]

and it happend again :

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/deutsch-german/3184-zoll-und-mehrwertssteuer-fuer-lieferung-2.html#post46131

:/

[Flashman]

Uh,the 90 day window to fulfill ALL preorders up to May has been moved to Sept from Aug...............imagine that 

Last reliable Josh quote said all orders to DATE in Sept.

So it couldn't at all be because they are getting a crapload more orders in because they are the only ASIC manufacturer currently in continuous production and shipping mode with a price that has any chance of ROI.... because that wouldn't make sense... because you all here know that they only pretended to make a product to send to just 10, 20, 50, 100, 200, 500, 1000 shills

[PuertoLibre]

Flashman,

I hope you realize that if by september, you don't already have your ASIC you will not be making the ROI in a year from that point onwards.

Unless Bitcoin shoots through the roof (and assuming your paid in USD) then it will be very hard for that ROI to happen.

[Loredo]

and it happend again :

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/deutsch-german/3184-zoll-und-mehrwertssteuer-fuer-lieferung-2.html#post46131

:/

Would it be too much to ask you to provide the gist of the German-thread, or, even explain what "it" refers to above?

[SolarSilver]

Would it be too much to ask you to provide the gist of the German-thread, or, even explain what "it" refers to above?

German customs is doing spot checks and stops packages that are not compliant to local German laws.

Some of the violations for import are: not providing a German manual (Fehlende deutsche Anleitung) and not have the correct regulatory papers and stickers like CE & ROHS (Konformitätserklärung von Hersteller)

All of this was predicted last year when Josh attacked the other ASIC vendors of not having the FCC and CE compliance. BFL was going to quickly rush their almost finished product and have all the needed paperwork "in two weeks". We are 8 months later and no paperwork and guess who's shipments get confiscated and blocked at borders?

Avalon shipped 900 units and they were clever enough to have the right wording on the commercial invoice.

[petitcafe]

Would it be too much to ask you to provide the gist of the German-thread, or, even explain what "it" refers to above?

Avalon shipped 900 units and they were clever enough to have the right wording on the commercial invoice.

BFL does not even provide a commercial invoice outside or inside the package. That practically guarantees that orders are held up in Germany, and customs at least want you to bring in an invoice or transaction documents like a Paypal printout or something. Noone in Germany will have their ASICs delivered to their doorstep because of this.

[Radacoin]

and it happend again :

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/deutsch-german/3184-zoll-und-mehrwertssteuer-fuer-lieferung-2.html#post46131

:/

Would it be too much to ask you to provide the gist of the German-thread, or, even explain what "it" refers to above?

Gist: More and more users (Bombe, M_Myers, ...) are complaining that their BFL shipments are stopped & kept at German customs because of missing paperwork and missing conformity markings.

[philips]

Would it be too much to ask you to provide the gist of the German-thread, or, even explain what "it" refers to above?

Avalon shipped 900 units and they were clever enough to have the right wording on the commercial invoice.

BFL does not even provide a commercial invoice outside or inside the package. That practically guarantees that orders are held up in Germany, and customs at least want you to bring in an invoice or transaction documents like a Paypal printout or something. Noone in Germany will have their ASICs delivered to their doorstep because of this.

They do provide the invoice outside the package.

[greyhawk]

Would it be too much to ask you to provide the gist of the German-thread, or, even explain what "it" refers to above?

German customs is doing spot checks and stops packages that are not compliant to local German laws.

Some of the violations for import are: not providing a German manual (Fehlende deutsche Anleitung) and not have the correct regulatory papers and stickers like CE & ROHS (Konformitätserklärung von Hersteller)

All of this was predicted last year when Josh attacked the other ASIC vendors of not having the FCC and CE compliance. BFL was going to quickly rush their almost finished product and have all the needed paperwork "in two weeks". We are 8 months later and no paperwork and guess who's shipments get confiscated and blocked at borders?

And it'll get worse. The more they find those things in spot checks the more they will be actively looking for them. With the missing CE thingy it might even begin to affect other European States, because the different national customs agencies talk to each other. It takes a while but they do talk.

[petitcafe]

Would it be too much to ask you to provide the gist of the German-thread, or, even explain what "it" refers to above?

Avalon shipped 900 units and they were clever enough to have the right wording on the commercial invoice.

BFL does not even provide a commercial invoice outside or inside the package. That practically guarantees that orders are held up in Germany, and customs at least want you to bring in an invoice or transaction documents like a Paypal printout or something. Noone in Germany will have their ASICs delivered to their doorstep because of this.

They do provide the invoice outside the package.

The sticker on the outside is just a customs declaration and not sufficient for german customs to calculate tax. Shipping costs, for example, are not shown on the declaration.

[philips]

There is a sticker yes, and a folded page in a plastic bag attached to the package.
Whatever you want to call that piece of paper, the customs officer referred to as an invoice and use it to calculate the taxes I paid.
 

Besides, it says right on top of it: COMMERCIAL INVOICE.



I am curious, what made you think that there is no commercial invoice outside or inside the package ?

[Flashman]

Shipping costs, for example, are not shown on the declaration.

Ugh, they take more tax on shipping costs? That's nasty, because if they're feeling a bit broke, all they have to do is start excessively delaying cheaper shipping methods so people use more expensive ones. 

[Cluster2k]

Australian Customs will take the "value" of the item being the value plus the shipping cost.  Years ago when I received a package from Hong Kong that was sold on eBay the Customs guy actually went online to check the item's price and added on the shipping costs before calculating GST.  Then added around $60 in Customs duty on top.

Australia has a $1000 tax free threshold on imports (local retail sector is screaming for it to be lowered to, lol, $20) so I was careful to order just enough upgraded Jalapenos to not breach the limit.

[RaTTuS]

http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/tag/ce-compliance
will tell you some of the types of stuff you have to go though


but mostly it's about em-emissions that will cripple you

[Fallout]

Australia has a $1000 tax free threshold on imports (local retail sector is screaming for it to be lowered to, lol, $20) so I was careful to order just enough upgraded Jalapenos to not breach the limit.

In Germany you may import taxfree upto 22€ ... (45€ if it is a gift from a person) ... So what the retailers what is not that unrealistic unfortunately.

[Bitcoinorama]

UK has a new import duty most here do not yet realise.

If an item is purchased from outside the EU you pay;

+20% VAT and £8 ransom to have your goods released after they get round to telling you they have them ~10 days.

Now you pay an additional 9% duty on top of the VAT inclusive price for items amused over £135.

Basically it's now +31% and a further £8 ransom.

[petitcafe]

There is a sticker yes, and a folded page in a plastic bag attached to the package.
Whatever you want to call that piece of paper, the customs officer referred to as an invoice and use it to calculate the taxes I paid.

Besides, it says right on top of it: COMMERCIAL INVOICE.

http://imageshack.us/a/img853/4759/g3.jpg

I am curious, what made you think that there is no commercial invoice outside or inside the package ?

Whoops. Okay, maybe I'll have to take a close look at the package again this afternoon.

In the German BFL forum some people said the shipment came without invoice, so I expected the same. Even more so as my order was removed from my account page after shipping and I could not print an invoice myself.

[philips]

In the German BFL forum some people said the shipment came without invoice, so I expected the same. Even more so as my order was removed from my account page after shipping and I could not print an invoice myself.

Usually at the customs they keep the invoice and you don't get to see it, you will receive the box without it.
The one I posted above they somehow forgot about it and left on the package.