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Question: How do you feel about Merit Point System???
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Author Topic: How Do You Feel About This New System??  (Read 2612 times)
hilariousetc
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February 06, 2018, 10:58:25 AM
 #121

I don't care about activity points, ranks, or these new merits points to be honest. I don't limit my judgment on the quality of a member on these artificially created merits. All that matters to me is the quality of your posts.

But to a sig spammer it's the opposite. They don't care about quality of posts, just hitting the highest rank they can as fast as they can with the lowest amount of effort possible. That's why merit should hopefully change this culture because making shitposts will get you nowhere pretty fast.

Feel free to comment about it guys !

Most people seem to be ignoring the main and positive purpose of the merit system:  It gives appreciation and encouragement to good posters.

The whiners are exactly the ones who should go away.

Signed,

A user who ranked up from Jr. Member to Member on 30 January, and thus started with zero merit.

You're making great posts and people like you will have no issue in 'ranking' up. It's just the lazies who got used to being able to fly through ranks just by posting the most generic of shitposts that are going to have great problems. If only they could be bothered putting the same amount of effort they do for the whining about the merit system into the regular posts they'd be no issue at all.

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February 06, 2018, 01:18:41 PM
 #122

I like theymos' purpose for implementing this kind of new system and I think this will be very effective in the long run because each one of us are now forced to make good quality posts instead of unsubstantial one, this will definitely result to a better environment here in the forum.

But honestly, I have a concern. I'm a little bit worried knowing the fact that I will not rank even though we assume that I already meet/exceed the minimum activities required. We can conclude that rank ups will now depend on merits and I'm very sad about it because becoming a Sr. Member seems so far for me to reach.

Anyway, this system undergone a lot of process before implemented so who am I to question it? I still would love to embrace this new system since its advantages still outnumbered the disadvantages. Smiley

athanz88
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February 06, 2018, 02:22:42 PM
 #123

I don't care about activity points, ranks, or these new merits points to be honest. I don't limit my judgment on the quality of a member on these artificially created merits. All that matters to me is the quality of your posts.

But to a sig spammer it's the opposite. They don't care about quality of posts, just hitting the highest rank they can as fast as they can with the lowest amount of effort possible. That's why merit should hopefully change this culture because making shitposts will get you nowhere pretty fast.

Feel free to comment about it guys !

Most people seem to be ignoring the main and positive purpose of the merit system:  It gives appreciation and encouragement to good posters.

The whiners are exactly the ones who should go away.

Signed,

A user who ranked up from Jr. Member to Member on 30 January, and thus started with zero merit.

You're making great posts and people like you will have no issue in 'ranking' up. It's just the lazies who got used to being able to fly through ranks just by posting the most generic of shitposts that are going to have great problems. If only they could be bothered putting the same amount of effort they do for the whining about the merit system into the regular posts they'd be no issue at all.

I agree that merit will encourage people to make some good posts later. But by the way, is it for me or nullius? just wondering hahaha
Please do take a look at my infographic that i made in the first post.
vlad230
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February 09, 2018, 10:41:25 AM
 #124

The thing is that with the merit system in place, even if you create quality posts (or at least not useless spam and using proper English in them) people are either not used to sending merit yet or they don't really send merit even if they find your post useful.

I have been a member on this forum for about 3-4 months but I have not received any merit for the posts I have created directly. I have received some merit from an anti-spam campaign but none for any of my posts.

I am not a spammer or do not create posts just for the sake of it. I just wanted to be able to link my signature to a post on this forum advertising my service, which I cannot do because of the rank I currently have.

What do you think? Is this merit system fair for my case?
krishnaverma
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February 09, 2018, 10:45:56 AM
 #125

I am not a spammer or do not create posts just for the sake of it. I just wanted to be able to link my signature to a post on this forum advertising my service, which I cannot do because of the rank I currently have.

What do you think? Is this merit system fair for my case?

See if you want to get a privilege associated with higher rank (signature in this case), you need to work for it. I checked your posts and some of them are really good. You will easily become a member if you keep making such posts.

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vlad230
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February 09, 2018, 03:29:52 PM
 #126

I am not a spammer or do not create posts just for the sake of it. I just wanted to be able to link my signature to a post on this forum advertising my service, which I cannot do because of the rank I currently have.

What do you think? Is this merit system fair for my case?

See if you want to get a privilege associated with higher rank (signature in this case), you need to work for it. I checked your posts and some of them are really good. You will easily become a member if you keep making such posts.

Thanks for the merit BTW Smiley

Yes, I agree but the thing is, you will not receive any merit points for your direct posts. I have only received merits when posting in this sub forum (when people have looked at my posts). Even the more established members that can make a difference (like mods, admins etc.) received very low amounts of merit points.

I have done well researched posts or helped out other guys that had issues with mining for example. None of them sent me any merit although the information was used or they thanked me (it seems like it's easier for them to thank me than send me merit Smiley ).
Using this merit approach will not work for good faith users that post good quality and are not spammers. That's why I think this system isn't working.

I think I will make the remaining 3 merits to get to member status in the next months (hopefully) but will definitely be stuck here for many years until I reach 100.

My opinion is that this system is just a measure of limiting users from acquiring rank to give the current established members more rights than the other folks.
I even named it a "Trumpish" system in another thread because it's kinda like what's happening in the US right now, immigration wise. Smiley
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February 09, 2018, 10:37:26 PM
 #127

Thanks for the merit BTW Smiley

Yes, I agree but the thing is, you will not receive any merit points for your direct posts. I have only received merits when posting in this sub forum (when people have looked at my posts). Even the more established members that can make a difference (like mods, admins etc.) received very low amounts of merit points.

I have done well researched posts or helped out other guys that had issues with mining for example. None of them sent me any merit although the information was used or they thanked me (it seems like it's easier for them to thank me than send me merit Smiley ).
Using this merit approach will not work for good faith users that post good quality and are not spammers. That's why I think this system isn't working.

I think I will make the remaining 3 merits to get to member status in the next months (hopefully) but will definitely be stuck here for many years until I reach 100.

My opinion is that this system is just a measure of limiting users from acquiring rank to give the current established members more rights than the other folks.
I even named it a "Trumpish" system in another thread because it's kinda like what's happening in the US right now, immigration wise. Smiley

Try getting 100 merits for reaching a Full Membership ranking.  Cheesy You'll have to be some kind of Einstein or Mother Theresa to gain such amounts of merits. Or somehow get sucked up into the group of scam moderators. That probably works best around here.  Roll Eyes

But it's no use complaining about it. Because the merit system was not designed to merit posts in the first place but rather to keep members from reaching higher rankings. And for that it is doing it's job wonderfully.
vlad230
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February 10, 2018, 09:31:16 AM
 #128


Try getting 100 merits for reaching a Full Membership ranking.  Cheesy You'll have to be some kind of Einstein or Mother Theresa to gain such amounts of merits. Or somehow get sucked up into the group of scam moderators. That probably works best around here.  Roll Eyes

But it's no use complaining about it. Because the merit system was not designed to merit posts in the first place but rather to keep members from reaching higher rankings. And for that it is doing it's job wonderfully.

Yes, I agree none of the new accounts will get higher than Member rank on this forum. It will be an exclusive club and that's it.

I see a lot of people with high ranks saying they "do not care" of the ranking system but they all participate in signature campaigns. How hypocritical of them Smiley
hilariousetc
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February 10, 2018, 10:31:39 AM
Merited by athanz88 (1)
 #129


My opinion is that this system is just a measure of limiting users from acquiring rank to give the current established members more rights than the other folks.
I even named it a "Trumpish" system in another thread because it's kinda like what's happening in the US right now, immigration wise. Smiley

No. It's to stop shitposters shitposting their way through the ranks. Now making unsubstantial posts will get you nowhere. If you don't have anything interesting to contribute then you will find yourself going nowhere fast. This is the only way to prohibit low-quality posters and reward people who are here to actually contribute something worthwhile.

Yes, I agree none of the new accounts will get higher than Member rank on this forum. It will be an exclusive club and that's it.

I see a lot of people with high ranks saying they "do not care" of the ranking system but they all participate in signature campaigns. How hypocritical of them Smiley

Plenty of people will achieve their rank, just as long as they're a great poster. The only "exclusive" club it will be is for people who who can contribute something worthwhile. The only people complaining about it will be those who either can't speak English sufficiently or people who just can't be bothered putting the effort into their posts.

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February 10, 2018, 10:38:31 AM
 #130


I see a lot of people with high ranks saying they "do not care" of the ranking system but they all participate in signature campaigns. How hypocritical of them Smiley

I don't think you can make generlisations like that. One of the disadvantages of sig campaigns is that affiliates become prolific posters. There are a lot of good and valuable members here, and they aren't all in sig campaigns.


££&$$>  Find out about rail biking in the Jet Cash coffee lounge thread on the Ivory Tower board. <££&$$.
vlad230
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February 10, 2018, 03:03:01 PM
 #131

Quote
No. It's to stop shitposters shitposting their way through the ranks. Now making unsubstantial posts will get you nowhere. If you don't have anything interesting to contribute then you will find yourself going nowhere fast. This is the only way to prohibit low-quality posters and reward people who are here to actually contribute something worthwhile.

Yes, I agree the shit posting needs to stop but I am talking about the people that are not making shit posts and will never exceed the Member status with this system.
Like I said above, people do not send Merits, even if you help them or post constructivly.

Quote
Plenty of people will achieve their rank, just as long as they're a great poster. The only "exclusive" club it will be is for people who who can contribute something worthwhile. The only people complaining about it will be those who either can't speak English sufficiently or people who just can't be bothered putting the effort into their posts.

I see a lot of sr/hero/legendary members that do not use proper English in their posts. How is this fair? What contributions did they bring?

With the old system, an active poster would reach Full Member status in about 3 months. Let's assume it's about a good poster that tries to bring value to this forum. With the new system, reaching the same status will take years (at least 5).

For example I try to do quality posts and help out where I can but have not received ANY merits for my posts directly. I am by no means a great poster, I would like to think I'm average, but definitely not a spammer. So, something is definitely not working with this system.

I still hope this system will be changed and the intent wasn't about creating a closed group. Not giving everybody the same opportunities will lead to people moving on to other forums or just keeping those ideas to themselves and not sharing, because they're fine with just reading.

I have also proposed some alternatives: new ranks on top of legendary or a "likes" system that is easier to use and is not limited to the amount of sMerit you have. Check my posts in this sub forum.
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February 10, 2018, 03:16:48 PM
 #132

That only for privileged few people is good. I totally write in every topic about @MERIT SYSTEM@ and got only true answers from legendaries and sr.members that so everything is good but only from them Cheesy
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February 10, 2018, 09:46:33 PM
 #133

Not giving everybody the same opportunities will lead to people moving on to other forums

Correct. A Bitcointalk fork is being prepared already by a group of members who are fed up with the Lauda gang.
daduremi
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February 10, 2018, 09:55:33 PM
 #134

Yup, don't like it, so now you depend on other people to rank up on this forum, that's just not fair.
You could post 100 quality posts and not to receive single merit, and you could post 1 shitpost and get 100 merits.
So yea, it's not really thought through system, and therefore not fair at all...
yes you are right, i see so many posts that i think constructive
but do not get merit, while the post that I consider ordinary get merit
now the jr member account will forever become jr member, will never rise to become a member Roll Eyes
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February 10, 2018, 10:03:13 PM
 #135

Not giving everybody the same opportunities will lead to people moving on to other forums

Correct. A Bitcointalk fork is being prepared already by a group of members who are fed up with the Lauda gang.

Of course, this has been tried many times in the past already.  If you guys are going to openly invite scammers and spammers, it will be interesting to see how your forum handles them.

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WhaleSlayer
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February 11, 2018, 12:15:28 AM
 #136

I don't care about activity points, ranks, or these new merits points to be honest. I don't limit my judgment on the quality of a member on these artificially created merits. All that matters to me is the quality of your posts.

But to a sig spammer it's the opposite. They don't care about quality of posts, just hitting the highest rank they can as fast as they can with the lowest amount of effort possible. That's why merit should hopefully change this culture because making shitposts will get you nowhere pretty fast.

Feel free to comment about it guys !

Most people seem to be ignoring the main and positive purpose of the merit system:  It gives appreciation and encouragement to good posters.

The whiners are exactly the ones who should go away.

Signed,

A user who ranked up from Jr. Member to Member on 30 January, and thus started with zero merit.

You're making great posts and people like you will have no issue in 'ranking' up. It's just the lazies who got used to being able to fly through ranks just by posting the most generic of shitposts that are going to have great problems. If only they could be bothered putting the same amount of effort they do for the whining about the merit system into the regular posts they'd be no issue at all.

I have read the posts of Nullius and they are indeed extremely good. But he is an exception. The system should work for a decent majority, not only for the truly excellent ones. "people like you" you say, but there are a very few like Nullius, if at all. If only the truly excellent ones can "rank up", then you don't even need this system, you just can pick up that dozen people who is really excellent and give them a Legendary ad honorem rank and that's it. The system should allow a decent majority (or a decent minority) to rank up as if nothing had changed, and just put limits for the indecent minority (or indecent majority). There is still time to improve the system so that this is achieved.

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HALLASTERA
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February 11, 2018, 12:52:16 AM
 #137

Not giving everybody the same opportunities will lead to people moving on to other forums

Correct. A Bitcointalk fork is being prepared already by a group of members who are fed up with the Lauda gang.
Hahaha it's true I hope that guy will be banned for promotion their scam projects.  That one of some dirty stories about this persone and their group https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1764757.0 Cheesy
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February 11, 2018, 04:08:39 AM
Merited by athanz88 (1)
 #138

Not giving everybody the same opportunities will lead to people moving on to other forums

Correct. A Bitcointalk fork is being prepared already by a group of members who are fed up with the Lauda gang.

Yeah, the Lauda gang is fearsome.  I thought I was tough enough to survive a “beat-in” for the secret initiation, so I tried to join.  It turns out, Lauda does worse:  A “scratch-in” by cats!  I’m still bleeding from that; and worst of all, they decided that I was too wimpy.  At least they didn’t feed me to the lion—I’m thankful for that, but could Lauda be going soft?


Not giving everybody the same opportunities will lead to people moving on to other forums

Correct. A Bitcointalk fork is being prepared already by a group of members who are fed up with the Lauda gang.

Of course, this has been tried many times in the past already.  If you guys are going to openly invite scammers and spammers, it will be interesting to see how your forum handles them.

In the manner of discovering THE TRUTH!!!, I myself have a pet theory that the merit system is designed as a weapon against Roger Ver’s .com forum playpen.  When all the spammers and trash posters leave, where will they go?  Hahah.


You're making great posts and people like you will have no issue in 'ranking' up. It's just the lazies who got used to being able to fly through ranks just by posting the most generic of shitposts that are going to have great problems. If only they could be bothered putting the same amount of effort they do for the whining about the merit system into the regular posts they'd be no issue at all.

I have read the posts of Nullius and they are indeed extremely good. But he is an exception. The system should work for a decent majority, not only for the truly excellent ones. "people like you" you say, but there are a very few like Nullius, if at all. If only the truly excellent ones can "rank up", then you don't even need this system, you just can pick up that dozen people who is really excellent and give them a Legendary ad honorem rank and that's it. The system should allow a decent majority (or a decent minority) to rank up as if nothing had changed, and just put limits for the indecent minority (or indecent majority). There is still time to improve the system so that this is achieved.

I’m glad you appreciate my posts.  But what you say brings to mind something pertinent which has been sitting in my drafts pile for a few days.  The relevant part is that to “rank up”, it’s not necessary to earn merit at anywhere close to the rate I do.  I can often earn +20–30 per day.  Comparing merit and activity thresholds for rank, the system seems designed with an expectation that an ordinary, decent poster will earn on average about +1 per day.  That sounds reasonable, does it not?


You're making great posts and people like you will have no issue in 'ranking' up. It's just the lazies who got used to being able to fly through ranks just by posting the most generic of shitposts that are going to have great problems. If only they could be bothered putting the same amount of effort they do for the whining about the merit system into the regular posts they'd be no issue at all.

Much obliged.  And yes, I’ve oftentimes wondered about the cost/benefit analysis (not) done by certain people.  The same applies much more strongly for those who sometimes expend extreme efforts trying to gain money or advantage by gutter methods such as spamming, rather than putting less effort into achieving reasonable success by decent means.  But I suppose that here, some people are of a religious belief that divine law entitles them to make money by posting generic one-liners with a signature attached from farmloads of sockpuppet accounts.  How else could the vehemence of their reactions be explained?  Well, too bad for them that there is such intolerance of their religion.


By the way, congratz man, 187 merits wow, thats a good achievement.

Not good enough.  So in the seven days since you wrote that, I’ve added another 113 merits—to get myself started. <g>


Try getting 100 merits for reaching a Full Membership ranking.  Cheesy You'll have to be some kind of Einstein or Mother Theresa to gain such amounts of merits. Or somehow get sucked up into the group of scam moderators. That probably works best around here.  Roll Eyes

100 merits is no problem.  I earned an additional 113 merits just since I last posted in this thread a week ago.  Here is a recent statistical breakdown of where I’m earning my merit.  Dividing out one extraordinary event I don’t deem representative of how merit is earned, the largest proportion of my merit has come from technical posts in Development & Technical Discussion.  But on the other hand, I’ve also oft been deemed meritorious for my vocal support of people who are making an heroic effort to clean up the forum.  —Oops, I meant for “somehow [getting] sucked up into the group of scam moderators.”  So, how would you characterize me?

But it's no use complaining about it. Because the merit system was not designed to merit posts in the first place but rather to keep members from reaching higher rankings. And for that it is doing it's job wonderfully.

Correction:  It’s no use whining.  Likewise, it is no use concocting absurd theories.  Meritorious posts earn merit.  For example, one of my highest-merited posts, “Bitcoin’s Public-Key Security Level”, is currently +18 (including +5 from the tech forum moderator).  Make good posts, and you will earn merit—or don’t, and you won’t.

(I will not even ask what motive theymos is imagined to have for nefariously designing a system to “keep [thoughtfully contributing] members from reaching higher rankings”.  Important words are here inserted.  Logically, if theymos wanted to freeze everybody’s ranks, he could do that much more easily.  Whereas the merit system separates the wheat from the tares; yes, it is designed to stop spammers and morons from rising in rank.)


[blah blah blah] Cheesy

Let’s see:  You created your very own whine thread, declaring a “right to consensus” and demanding that the merit system be put to a “general vote”.  Having succeeded in bringing yourself attention, you got caught by TheQuin passing yourself merit from an alt and red-tagged by Lauda.  Whereupon you promptly diverged into crazyland:  “Maybe [actmyname] and Lauda it's one persone?”  (Hahahah.)

Whining and blustering has worked so well for you in the past.  Keep it up to keep getting the same results!

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February 11, 2018, 05:27:42 AM
 #139

Well i feel challenge in this new system and try to learn more about bitcointalk to get more merits.They implement this merit system to avoid spammers and shitposting on forum and I am glad that I am pursuing myself to know more about crypto.
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February 11, 2018, 08:39:32 AM
 #140

I see a lot of sr/hero/legendary members that do not use proper English in their posts. How is this fair? What contributions did they bring?

With the old system, an active poster would reach Full Member status in about 3 months. Let's assume it's about a good poster that tries to bring value to this forum. With the new system, reaching the same status will take years (at least 5).

For example I try to do quality posts and help out where I can but have not received ANY merits for my posts directly. I am by no means a great poster, I would like to think I'm average, but definitely not a spammer. So, something is definitely not working with this system.

I still hope this system will be changed and the intent wasn't about creating a closed group. Not giving everybody the same opportunities will lead to people moving on to other forums or just keeping those ideas to themselves and not sharing, because they're fine with just reading.

I have also proposed some alternatives: new ranks on top of legendary or a "likes" system that is easier to use and is not limited to the amount of sMerit you have. Check my posts in this sub forum.

Hey buddy, If you think they didnt contribute at all, just think about their time, energy, etc that is spent on this forum long before bitcoin has a good price, has a signature payment for this forum, and has a big name like now. They did a great job to spent their time and energy thus creating a “traffic” to this forum, and you think that is not a contribution? You dont even contribute a bit of your energy and time to search bitcoin back then when you thought it was a scam in the early year of bitcoin. If there are no early people who “plays” in this forum, i guess you wouldnt be here to get money for doing signature/bounty/etc.


By the way, congratz man, 187 merits wow, thats a good achievement.

Not good enough.  So in the seven days since you wrote that, I’ve added another 113 merits—to get myself started. <g>


For that amount of merits and you said it is not good enough? Man thats a good positivity you have there. Getting merits over our great posts indeed is a great feeling. I got some too in this week and i hope it will continue in the future.
Meanwhile i have a nice idea for my next thread, will finish it soon after my other work is done. It will involve some statistics again and i hope it can changes people to be more positive on this merit system.
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