[HAVELOCK] PETAMINE - 1,150 TH/S HASH RATE (1GH/S per Unit)

[hephaist0s]

Slow learner huh ?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=310783.msg8601840#msg8601840

My mistake - I meant it is absolutely good news for shareholders. But you're not, so what's your angle, again?

[Puppet]

Clearly not the sharpest pencil in the drawer.
let me try to explain really slowly... the hardware is worth more than it will ever mine, and far more than it will ever generate after fees. Ive been saying this since spring, the least worst thing that could happen for shareholders is liquidation. The sooner the better. Wasnt this hardware purchased at like 5 or 7 BTC/TH ?  There was some hope zero dividend day would prompt a liquidation, making the current price possibly even attractive. Lowering fees, as predicted,  pushes this out, and cryptx will keep pushing this out until the hardware is worthless, because he only cares about his fees. Enjoy your crumbs in the meanwhile, Mr "247% annual return ".

[hephaist0s]

Clearly not the sharpest pencil in the drawer.
let me try to explain really slowly... the hardware is worth more than it will ever mine, and far more than it will ever generate after fees. Ive been saying this since spring, the least worst thing that could happen for shareholders is liquidation. The sooner the better. Wasnt this hardware purchased at like 5 or 7 BTC/TH ?  There was some hope zero dividend day would prompt a liquidation, making the current price possibly even attractive. Lowering fees, as predicted,  pushes this out, and cryptx will keep pushing this out until the hardware is worthless, because he only cares about his fees. Enjoy your crumbs in the meanwhile, Mr "247% annual return ".

Third time, for the very, very slow: yesterday we didn't make dividend. Today costs were lowered, dividend resumed, share price up.

Third time, for the very, very Puppet: Explain to me any way in which this is bad news for shareholders (not you, who are not a shareholder, and have other ways of assessing what is good news and bad).

I am not:
a) saying this is an amazing investment, as-it-stands-now.
b) saying this will turn everything around and everything is ok.
c) saying this is the best possible course.

But it is discouraging to me to come here and see the incessant trolling with an instant post about how only idiots will think this reduction of costs, resumption of dividends and subsequent rise in share price is good news. How, on Earth, could it *not* be construed as good news?

Just this thing. Not everything else. I am not commenting on your other hundreds of posts on this topic, Puppet. Just this one. Surely, it is good news?

[Puppet]

I give up. its great news hephaist0s, you will be receiving daily crumbs for several more months now and your annual yield will skyrocket as the share price keeps tumbling as cryptx milks his miners for what they are really worth. Rejoice!

[DebitMe]

Clearly not the sharpest pencil in the drawer.
let me try to explain really slowly... the hardware is worth more than it will ever mine, and far more than it will ever generate after fees. Ive been saying this since spring, the least worst thing that could happen for shareholders is liquidation. The sooner the better. Wasnt this hardware purchased at like 5 or 7 BTC/TH ?  There was some hope zero dividend day would prompt a liquidation, making the current price possibly even attractive. Lowering fees, as predicted,  pushes this out, and cryptx will keep pushing this out until the hardware is worthless, because he only cares about his fees. Enjoy your crumbs in the meanwhile, Mr "247% annual return ".

Third time, for the very, very slow: yesterday we didn't make dividend. Today costs were lowered, dividend resumed, share price up.

Third time, for the very, very Puppet: Explain to me any way in which this is bad news for shareholders (not you, who are not a shareholder, and have other ways of assessing what is good news and bad).

I am not:
a) saying this is an amazing investment, as-it-stands-now.
b) saying this will turn everything around and everything is ok.
c) saying this is the best possible course.

But it is discouraging to me to come here and see the incessant trolling with an instant post about how only idiots will think this reduction of costs, resumption of dividends and subsequent rise in share price is good news. How, on Earth, could it *not* be construed as good news?

Just this thing. Not everything else. I am not commenting on your other hundreds of posts on this topic, Puppet. Just this one. Surely, it is good news?

Here is another way to think about it.

Yes, it is good news that money is flowing out to shareholders again, but better news would be if they decided to liquidate the mine, and here is why...

If all assets were sold off right now, a last dividend of somewhere between .0007 and .001 btc per share would be sent out to all shareholders.

If cryptx continues to hold the machines and mine, they will pay out a lot less than that per share in dividends, and the price that you could get for the machines on the market will continue to go down, effectively decreasing the amount of final dividend that will be distributed.

So yes, it is better that they are paying out dividends instead of keeping the mining revenues for themselves, but it could be even better if they just sell everything and pay out the proceeds.



Also, did anyone else feel like the update was a giant FU to everyone?  It sounded really really smug to me and sort of like, yea whatever F you all I will do want i want.  Also ScryptX should have lowered fees now too since we now know that the hosting fee was not the bottom dollar that they could charge people.

[fonsie]

Clearly not the sharpest pencil in the drawer.
let me try to explain really slowly... the hardware is worth more than it will ever mine, and far more than it will ever generate after fees. Ive been saying this since spring, the least worst thing that could happen for shareholders is liquidation. The sooner the better. Wasnt this hardware purchased at like 5 or 7 BTC/TH ?  There was some hope zero dividend day would prompt a liquidation, making the current price possibly even attractive. Lowering fees, as predicted,  pushes this out, and cryptx will keep pushing this out until the hardware is worthless, because he only cares about his fees. Enjoy your crumbs in the meanwhile, Mr "247% annual return ".

Third time, for the very, very slow: yesterday we didn't make dividend. Today costs were lowered, dividend resumed, share price up.

Third time, for the very, very Puppet: Explain to me any way in which this is bad news for shareholders (not you, who are not a shareholder, and have other ways of assessing what is good news and bad).

I am not:
a) saying this is an amazing investment, as-it-stands-now.
b) saying this will turn everything around and everything is ok.
c) saying this is the best possible course.

But it is discouraging to me to come here and see the incessant trolling with an instant post about how only idiots will think this reduction of costs, resumption of dividends and subsequent rise in share price is good news. How, on Earth, could it *not* be construed as good news?

Just this thing. Not everything else. I am not commenting on your other hundreds of posts on this topic, Puppet. Just this one. Surely, it is good news?

If I were you, I would buy all the shares you can get your hands on, considering this good news...

LOL

[fonsie]

Clearly not the sharpest pencil in the drawer.
let me try to explain really slowly... the hardware is worth more than it will ever mine, and far more than it will ever generate after fees. Ive been saying this since spring, the least worst thing that could happen for shareholders is liquidation. The sooner the better. Wasnt this hardware purchased at like 5 or 7 BTC/TH ?  There was some hope zero dividend day would prompt a liquidation, making the current price possibly even attractive. Lowering fees, as predicted,  pushes this out, and cryptx will keep pushing this out until the hardware is worthless, because he only cares about his fees. Enjoy your crumbs in the meanwhile, Mr "247% annual return ".

Third time, for the very, very slow: yesterday we didn't make dividend. Today costs were lowered, dividend resumed, share price up.

Third time, for the very, very Puppet: Explain to me any way in which this is bad news for shareholders (not you, who are not a shareholder, and have other ways of assessing what is good news and bad).

I am not:
a) saying this is an amazing investment, as-it-stands-now.
b) saying this will turn everything around and everything is ok.
c) saying this is the best possible course.

But it is discouraging to me to come here and see the incessant trolling with an instant post about how only idiots will think this reduction of costs, resumption of dividends and subsequent rise in share price is good news. How, on Earth, could it *not* be construed as good news?

Just this thing. Not everything else. I am not commenting on your other hundreds of posts on this topic, Puppet. Just this one. Surely, it is good news?

Here is another way to think about it.

Yes, it is good news that money is flowing out to shareholders again, but better news would be if they decided to liquidate the mine, and here is why...

If all assets were sold off right now, a last dividend of somewhere between .0007 and .001 btc per share would be sent out to all shareholders.

If cryptx continues to hold the machines and mine, they will pay out a lot less than that per share in dividends, and the price that you could get for the machines on the market will continue to go down, effectively decreasing the amount of final dividend that will be distributed.

So yes, it is better that they are paying out dividends instead of keeping the mining revenues for themselves, but it could be even better if they just sell everything and pay out the proceeds.



Also, did anyone else feel like the update was a giant FU to everyone?  It sounded really really smug to me and sort of like, yea whatever F you all I will do want i want.  Also ScryptX should have lowered fees now too since we now know that the hosting fee was not the bottom dollar that they could charge people.

CryptX will never (or at least he tries to) sell the hardware. Running hardware generates hosting fee, this is the only thing he cares about HOSTING FEES, all the rest can go f*****ck themselves, as long as there are HOSTING FEES, all is OK in CryptX wonderland.

[hephaist0s]

Yes, it is good news that money is flowing out to shareholders again

Exactly! Thank you.

If all assets were sold off right now, a last dividend of somewhere between .0007 and .001 btc per share would be sent out to all shareholders.

If cryptx continues to hold the machines and mine, they will pay out a lot less than that per share in dividends, and the price that you could get for the machines on the market will continue to go down, effectively decreasing the amount of final dividend that will be distributed.

This is not really a great difference. .0001 - .004 BTC per share is small potatoes at this point. I'm not saying it's nothing... but is is small spuds. If BTC/$ price goes up, this calculation could change significantly. Of course, it might not go up -- but we all hope it does, and if it doesn't the lifespan of this is not long anyway. Everyone is welcome to make their own risk assessment on this, but no matter what, this is not apocalyptic stuff.

Also, did anyone else feel like the update was a giant FU to everyone?  It sounded really really smug to me and sort of like, yea whatever F you all I will do want i want.  Also ScryptX should have lowered fees now too since we now know that the hosting fee was not the bottom dollar that they could charge people.

No, I can't reasonably see it as an FU. At the end of profitabilty, Cryptx lowered hosting costs in order to prolong the life of the mine. Would you rather he didn't, so that we never received a dividend again, and the share price fell to zero immediately?

[DebitMe]

Also, did anyone else feel like the update was a giant FU to everyone?  It sounded really really smug to me and sort of like, yea whatever F you all I will do want i want.  Also ScryptX should have lowered fees now too since we now know that the hosting fee was not the bottom dollar that they could charge people.

No, I can't reasonably see it as an FU. At the end of profitabilty, Cryptx lowered hosting costs in order to prolong the life of the mine. Would you rather he didn't, so that we never received a dividend again, and the share price fell to zero immediately?

I think you misunderstood what I meant, not that what he did was a FU, but the way he did it.  I think we both agree that this just barely extends the life of the asset for a few more weeks, and they have just admitted that they can run the mine at lower hosting costs, so why did they wait until now to lower the hosting cost?  They are just trying to make as much money as they can and don't really care about the investor.

[hephaist0s]

Also, did anyone else feel like the update was a giant FU to everyone?  It sounded really really smug to me and sort of like, yea whatever F you all I will do want i want.  Also ScryptX should have lowered fees now too since we now know that the hosting fee was not the bottom dollar that they could charge people.

No, I can't reasonably see it as an FU. At the end of profitabilty, Cryptx lowered hosting costs in order to prolong the life of the mine. Would you rather he didn't, so that we never received a dividend again, and the share price fell to zero immediately?

I think you misunderstood what I meant, not that what he did was a FU, but the way he did it.  I think we both agree that this just barely extends the life of the asset for a few more weeks, and they have just admitted that they can run the mine at lower hosting costs, so why did they wait until now to lower the hosting cost?  They are just trying to make as much money as they can and don't really care about the investor.

Fair enough, up to a point. They have certainly always been in it to make a profit, though. (As are we all?) If you were going to start a mine, and have people buy in, how would you make money? It's all been transparent, people who thought hosting costs were too high didn't have to buy in.

[Puppet]

Would you rather he didn't, so that we never received a dividend again, and the share price fell to zero immediately?

IF that was the prospect, even the brief 0.00(however many 0's)01 BTC price would have been far too much. 

What you fail to comprehend is that the reason some people are/were still holding was the expectation of a liquidation. The sale of the hardware which belongs to the unit holders. That had the potential to bring in more than the current shareprice and would have been paid out as a one time dividend.

Of course, that wasnt gonna happen yet for many reasons (one of which I predicted and just like just about everything I predicted about cryptx so far has come true),  the other is the likelyhood that cryptx cant even sell the hardware at this point as he is most likely under contract by bitfury for another 10 months. In the previous 6 months that hardware lost >90% of its market value. What do you think it will be worth in august 2015?

[hephaist0s]

Would you rather he didn't, so that we never received a dividend again, and the share price fell to zero immediately?

IF that was the prospect, even the brief 0.00(however many 0's)01 BTC price would have been far too much. 

What you fail to comprehend is that the reason some people are/were still holding was the expectation of a liquidation. The sale of the hardware which belongs to the unit holders. That had the potential to bring in more than the current shareprice and would have been paid out as a one time dividend.

Of course, that wasnt gonna happen yet for many reasons (one of which I predicted and just like just about everything I predicted about cryptx so far has come true),  the other is the likelyhood that cryptx cant even sell the hardware at this point as he is most likely under contract by bitfury for another 10 months. In the previous 6 months that hardware lost >90% of its market value. What do you think it will be worth in august 2015?

That didn't make any sense. Try again?

The question was: How isn't a reduction in costs, resulting in a resumption in dividends, plus an upsurge in share price, good news? Go!

For those who can't scroll back a few posts, I'm not here to
a) be a PetaMine angel/hero/optimist
b) say everything is gong to be ok
c) make any comments about anything in the past

But I came back to this thread which I have avoided for so long to see Puppet telling everyone that a decrease in costs, resulting in a resumption of dividends and an upsurge in share price is somehow terrible, laughable news. For today. How is this possible?

[NotLambchop]

...
The question was: How isn't a reduction in costs, resulting in a resumption in dividends, plus an upsurge in share price, good news? Go!
...

There is no "reduction in cost" for cryptx.  It costs him exactly the same to host the gear, he simply lowered the fee.
That's not a "reduction in cost" for you.  By lowering the fee, he is able to continue mining and paying you Satoshi divs, instead of having to sell your gear.

If he had sold your gear, you would have gotten much more money than you will ever collect in divs.
I have no idea why share price rose--anything from manipulation to traders being as intelligent as you.

  ~Happy investing.

[NotLambchop]

...
There is no "reduction in cost" for cryptx.  It costs him exactly the same to host the gear, he simply lowered the fee.
That's not a "reduction in cost" for you.  By lowering the fee, he is able to continue mining and paying you Satoshi divs, instead of having to sell your gear.

If he had sold your gear, you would have gotten much more money than you will ever collect in divs...

Are you really as stupid as you pretend to be?

[stompysteve]

...
The question was: How isn't a reduction in costs, resulting in a resumption in dividends, plus an upsurge in share price, good news? Go!
...

There is no "reduction in cost" for cryptx.  It costs him exactly the same to host the gear, he simply lowered the fee.
That's not a "reduction in cost" for you.  By lowering the fee, he is able to continue mining and paying you Satoshi divs, instead of having to sell your gear.

If he had sold your gear, you would have gotten much more money than you will ever collect in divs.
I have no idea why share price rose--anything from manipulation to traders being as intelligent as you.

  ~Happy investing.

I'm sorry, I guess you misunderstood me/ misunderstood language:

I meant that there was a reduction in costs for shareholders, not a reduction in costs for Lambschopspeculation/CryptXatRoot/OrAnyOneElse.

Again. I'm not saying everything is coming up roses. I am just asking the resident trolls to explain how a reduction in costs TO SHAREHOLDERS is bad news TODAY.

OKTHXBAITROLLS

im just gonna make up numbers here to make it easy

lets say today we sold hardware we get 1000 btc
or we mine for another month and get 200 btc, next month we can only sell hardware for 500btc for a total of 700btc

[hephaist0s]

...
There is no "reduction in cost" for cryptx.  It costs him exactly the same to host the gear, he simply lowered the fee.
That's not a "reduction in cost" for you.  By lowering the fee, he is able to continue mining and paying you Satoshi divs, instead of having to sell your gear.

If he had sold your gear, you would have gotten much more money than you will ever collect in divs...

Are you really as stupid as you pretend to be?

You are quoting yourself here? Then, yes that seems to be the case.

[Puppet]

I'm not actually going to weigh in on a course of action, but we already saw that 30% variance (700 vs. 1000 BTC) just in share price change today. So, what's the hubbub about, at this point?

You may not care if you lose 92 or 95% of your investment, but not everyone was stupid enough to buy in at IPO price and ignore the few people capable of third grade math for the next 6 months. For other people "the hubbub" is the difference between a big loss and a potential profit.

Anyway, from what I hear it will soon not matter much anyway, but for quite different reasons.

[Puppet]

The craziest of the crazy nuts predicted just about everything right while you got it dead wrong. What does that say about you?

[hephaist0s]

The craziest of the crazy nuts predicted just about everything right while you got it dead wrong. What does that say about you?

It says that you still haven't explained your interest, or agenda, or why you post here all the time for something you are not invested in. Your early predictions were all about CryptX's re-investments plans, yet that was voted out long ago, and you are still here even though this is a complete different (and, frankly un-interesting) security now. Why is that?

There is nothing to discuss anymore -- all the numbers are static,  easily calculated by anyone, but here you still are. Holy cow, why?!

[jaysabi]

It says that you still haven't explained your interest, or agenda, or why you post here all the time for something you are not invested in.

I'm not a shareholder (was for a very brief time, lost money which I entirely blame on myself and am not looking for a scapegoat like some people in here) but I'm interested in seeing the people who are running this thing be held accountable for lofty promises never delivered. Why does someone have to have an ulterior motive?

I'm not a shareholder now and won't be in the future, but I'm still interested in what's going on here. I'm interested in seeing someone who was running an exploitative enterprise go down in flames.

There is nothing to discuss anymore -- all the numbers are static,  easily calculated by anyone, but here you still are. Holy cow, why?!

I think there is more to discuss. First, the numbers aren't static. Didn't cryptx just cut hosting fees they were charging? Electricity rates didn't magically drop cuz PETA stopped paying dividends, which means if there's room to drop hosting fees, PETA shareholders were being overcharged from the start. That exploitative business practice is worth discussing. And that kind of shady practice makes people who aren't invested (like me) interested in seeing this whole thing finally blow up.

I can't speak for Puppet, but it seems to me he's been calling the unsustainable nature of this "investment" for a long time. If that was me, I'd be interested in seeing it finally confirmed, especially after dealing with so many people who were violently angry on these boards about his predictions.