NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[jl777]

Marketing = 3 million
infrastructure = 1 million or cost to deploy hubs needed for 1000TPS
tech = ~6 million - infrastructure

What the hell is "infrastructure fund"? Why money is being juggled so easily?

That 1 million will appreciate significantly if we do things right, so why such arbitrary decisions are taken so lightly? 

That should be a part of tech and tech will decide how much is needed to support the network, not some arbitrary round number.

And I want a fiscal conservative, like rickyjames to have at least a veto power, so we won't burn through all this money in a month! This radio deal we've got into so quickly doesn't look particularly bright.


Also, giving the rich more money in addition to their original stakes doesn't seem right. At least for outsiders it won't look good, we already have the distribution accusations...

I would rather see an independent trustees, who are not the original stakeholders.

The treasurers will NOT be getting any funds. They are just there to send the NXT as directed by the respective committees. There are no arbitrary decisions being made. The infrastructure cost will be estimated by probably both tech and infrastructure committees and then the 6 million will be allocated accordingly.

nxtchg, please understand that we have to decide on a Process to deal with unclaimed funds. The treasurers will have no say in how the money is spent. Separation of decision making from access to funds.

If you want to participate in the marketing committee then you can. But it is not appropriate for you to derail the entire process because you don't agree with one of the decisions made. We are talking about Process now. Not any specific spending decision. I know you are the worlds best programmer, but are you also the worlds best marketer? Please do not tangle up specific spending decisions of an area outside your sphere with the process.

Do you have any objections with klee or neer.g or bybitcoin or Pouncer being the ones who are responsible to disburse the NXT when directed by the respective committee?

James

[martismartis]

Hi NXTers

I'm still trying to runs NRS on android TV stick. I'm at 99% of work done. Ubuntu is running, Java installed. OK:

1. Started start.jar without any .nxt. Everything went smooth until block 22001, then java aborted.
2. Copied .nxt files from my other PC to the stick, started java.jar and after "Scanning blockchain..." BUMP, error is something like this:

A fatal error has been detected by the Java Runtime environment:

Internal error (os_linux_zero.cpp:285). pid=10388, tid=1090630768
fatal error: caught unhandled signal 11

JRE version: 7.0_25-b30
Java VM: OpenJDK Zero VM (23.7-b01 mixed mode linux-arm)
Core dump written. Default location :/home/ubuntu/Desktop/nxt/core or core.18388

Any thoughts from dev how to get rid of this problem?

Try again several times.

Doesn't help.

[NxtChg]

The treasurers will NOT be getting any funds. They are just there to send the NXT as directed by the respective committees.

And what if one day they decide they don't feel like doing it anymore?

Also, how do you think it's gonna look to outsiders?

[freigeist]

While saving energy and being eco-friendly is a strong argument in Nxt's favor, let's not forget that even more importantly Nxt gives people economic freedom.  This is the most important freedom of all.  You can give people every other freedom in the world, but without economic freedom it means nothing.  They are still slaves to the "debt as money" usury capitalists.

Bitcoin is broken because the security of the network can be forcibly compromised by third-parties.  Nxt's security does not have this issue.  A third-party would have to hold over 90% of all the currency to destroy Nxt.  To destroy Bitcoin, a third-party would only have to have over 51% of the network processing power.  Any entity can purchase tons of ASICs and destroy Bitcoin.

+1

[jl777]

The treasurers will NOT be getting any funds. They are just there to send the NXT as directed by the respective committees.

And what if one day they decide they don't feel like doing it anymore?

Then we would need to find a new treasurer. Not a big problem is it? In any case we already have one alternate, so this only becomes an issue if two people decide not to. However, these guys have the most to gain by spending to improve NXT, so they are the least likely to bail.

[martismartis]

Hi NXTers

I'm still trying to runs NRS on android TV stick. I'm at 99% of work done. Ubuntu is running, Java installed. OK:

1. Started start.jar without any .nxt. Everything went smooth until block 22001, then java aborted.
2. Copied .nxt files from my other PC to the stick, started java.jar and after "Scanning blockchain..." BUMP, error is something like this:

A fatal error has been detected by the Java Runtime environment:

Internal error (os_linux_zero.cpp:285). pid=10388, tid=1090630768
fatal error: caught unhandled signal 11

JRE version: 7.0_25-b30
Java VM: OpenJDK Zero VM (23.7-b01 mixed mode linux-arm)
Core dump written. Default location :/home/ubuntu/Desktop/nxt/core or core.18388

Any thoughts from dev how to get rid of this problem?

Can you make a tutorial when you manage to let this work?
Maybe I can do it too then. Cool!

First of all I didn't finished completely, because of this error. I'd like to get rid of this problem and run everything smooth. So then I'll write some tutorial (never did that). It still 3 days I'm working on it, few times I wanted to resign from this thing, but I'll not surrender

Short tutorial:

1) install ubuntu on tv stick
2) install java in ubuntu
3) BUMP error. Worked for me till 22000 block

[jl777]

The treasurers will NOT be getting any funds. They are just there to send the NXT as directed by the respective committees.

And what if one day they decide they don't feel like doing it anymore?

Also, how do you think it's gonna look to outsiders?

I think it will look good to outsiders. Millionaire founders agree to obey the decisions of committees selected by the community. Committee members are chosen based on merit and not by how much NXT they have.

Just what part of that looks bad?

James

[bitcoinpaul]

The treasurers will NOT be getting any funds. They are just there to send the NXT as directed by the respective committees.

And what if one day they decide they don't feel like doing it anymore?

Also, how do you think it's gonna look to outsiders?

Then it is all gone. All the lousy 10M NXT.

Jesus...

[NxtChg]

And what if one day they decide they don't feel like doing it anymore?

Also, how do you think it's gonna look to outsiders?

I think it will look good to outsiders. Millionaire founders agree to obey the decisions of committees selected by the community. Committee members are chosen based on merit and not by how much NXT they have.

Just what part of that looks bad?

That "agree to obey" part. Let me ask again, what if one day they decide not to?

To outsiders it looks like this: "there were 73 super rich original stakeholders and when some of them didn't claim their funds, those funds were divided between the rest of the original rich guys".

And the outsiders won't get into any details that it's not true and that trustees have to "agree to obey"...

[NxtChg]

Then it is all gone. All the lousy 10M NXT.

Lousy to whom? As I understand, that's all we've got for Nxt development, outside of private money.

[Emule]

funny  

i know at least 2 founders have sent bcnext BTC from multiple accounts and sock pupet accounts.
this means that they r verry verry rich and have more than 100M each  
they will not have the time to unload them before 20 years

so the statistics is wrong and does not match up.

far less founders than 73, more like 12, do ur DD

[jl777]

And what if one day they decide they don't feel like doing it anymore?

Also, how do you think it's gonna look to outsiders?

I think it will look good to outsiders. Millionaire founders agree to obey the decisions of committees selected by the community. Committee members are chosen based on merit and not by how much NXT they have.

Just what part of that looks bad?

That "agree to obey" part. Let me ask again, what if one day they decide not to?

To outsiders it looks like this: "there were 73 super rich original stakeholders and when some of them didn't claim their funds, those funds were divided between the rest of the original rich guys".

And the outsiders won't get into any details that it's not true and that trustees have to "agree to obey"...

So because you are worried about baseless FUD that you admit will be baseless, you want to kill the best chance we have to actually start making use of the unclaimed NXT

If they decide not to obey, that will then make the FUD have some basis and it will hurt the value of NXT. Who does that hurt the most?

Keep in mind the alternative to getting a process like this in place is the likely destruction of the funds, not to mention delay in marketing plans and rolling out of hubs.

Those are big risks to take based on fear of FUD

[NxtChg]

you want to kill the best chance we have to actually start making use of the unclaimed NXT

Not at all. I just want 3 independent people, not original stakeholders, we have plenty of them.

What's the difference? We can select either 3 stakeholders or 3 independent trusted members. No big deal.

[abctc]

three different accounts, one for each treasurer.

Marketing = 3 million
infrastructure = 1 million or cost to deploy hubs needed for 1000TPS
tech = ~6 million - infrastructure

deploying the hubs - is a way to centralization. I think it is unacceptable. We need tech solution (in the core of Nxt), that makes profitable for hub owners to install these hubs.
So we do not need infrastructure committee at all.

[jl777]

you want to kill the best chance we have to actually start making use of the unclaimed NXT

Not at all. I just want 3 independent people, not original stakeholders, we have plenty of them.

What's the difference? We can select either 3 stakeholders or 3 independent trusted members. No big deal.

The BIG deal is that any treasurer cannot be in any of the committees. THAT is a big deal as we need to get people who are not the founders to put their stamp on NXT. The founders already did. Now it is the turn for the rest of us.

Do not worry about FUD. I would much rather have Anon helping in the committees than waiting to be told where to send the NXT to.

Do you understand that the treasurers function is to just hold the funds until told where to send it to. It will be held in a separate account for full transparency,

[Come-from-Beyond]

funny  

i know at least 2 founders have sent bcnext BTC from multiple accounts and sock pupet accounts.
this means that they r verry verry rich and have more than 100M each  
they will not have the time to unload them before 20 years

so the statistics is wrong and does not match up.

far less founders than 73, more like 12, do ur DD

Let me guess, 1 founder is u and another one is ur girlfriend?

PS: I'm still waiting for the dump...

[landomata]

you want to kill the best chance we have to actually start making use of the unclaimed NXT

Not at all. I just want 3 independent people, not original stakeholders, we have plenty of them.

What's the difference? We can select either 3 stakeholders or 3 independent trusted members. No big deal.

on this point your wrong....the 3 stakeholders ARE trusted.

[landomata]

three different accounts, one for each treasurer.

Marketing = 3 million
infrastructure = 1 million or cost to deploy hubs needed for 1000TPS
tech = ~6 million - infrastructure

deploying the hubs - is a way to centralization. I think it is unacceptable. We need tech solution (in the core of Nxt), that makes profitable for hub owners to install these hubs.
So we do not need infrastructure committee at all.

thats what Tech fund is for.....we need infrastructure....hubs are specialized someone will have to pay for them on a long term basis.

[jl777]

three different accounts, one for each treasurer.

Marketing = 3 million
infrastructure = 1 million or cost to deploy hubs needed for 1000TPS
tech = ~6 million - infrastructure

deploying the hubs - is a way to centralization. I think it is unacceptable. We need tech solution (in the core of Nxt), that makes profitable for hub owners to install these hubs.
So we do not need infrastructure committee at all.

Please make a specific proposal on how exactly we can get hub owners profitable by April. That is when we want to be able to handle 1000TPS. This is mission critical NXT component and I do not want to leave it to chance, plus there is no defined way for hub owners to make money yet. In any case, the important point is the proposed process. The actual allocation to infrastructure has not been determined yet. Currently we have many nodes that are subsidized and until we have a infrastructure that is self sufficient, I think it makes sense to subsidize it with the available NXT.

After all without the hubs, we won't get 1000TPS and without that we won't have the giant advantage over the other second gens

[BitcoinForumator]

funny  

i know at least 2 founders have sent bcnext BTC from multiple accounts and sock pupet accounts.
this means that they r verry verry rich and have more than 100M each  
they will not have the time to unload them before 20 years

so the statistics is wrong and does not match up.

far less founders than 73, more like 12, do ur DD

Let me guess, 1 founder is u and another one is ur girlfriend?

PS: I'm still waiting for the dump...

I believe Emule dump already happened but it was like this: