█████ ***** THE ZEROCASH SOURCE - Truly anonymous coin ***** █████

[LiteCoinGuy]

https://z.cash/

Release: 2016

Mining algorithm: unknown

I want to collect some press about Zerocash, that will be released as an independent coin in 2016.

"Zerocash is a new protocol that provides a privacy-preserving version of Bitcoin (or a similar currency).

Zerocash fixes an inherent weakness of Bitcoin: every user's payment history is recorded in public view on the block chain, and is thus readily available to anyone. While there are techniques to obfuscate this information, they are problematic and ineffective. Instead, in Zerocash, users may pay one another directly, via payment transactions that reveal neither the origin, destination, or amount of the payment. This is a marked improvement compared to Bitcoin (and similar decentralized digital currencies), where every payment's information is made public for the whole world to see.

Zerocash improves on an earlier protocol, Zerocoin, developed by some of the same authors, both in functionality (Zerocoin only hides a payment's origin, but not its destination or amount) and in efficiency (Zerocash transactions are less than 1KB and take less than 6ms to verify)."

Authors of this project:

   Eli Ben-Sasson (Technion)
    Alessandro Chiesa (MIT)
    Christina Garman (Johns Hopkins University)
    Matthew Green (Johns Hopkins University)
    Ian Miers (Johns Hopkins University)
    Eran Tromer (Tel Aviv University)
    Madars Virza (MIT)

I think the concept of this project is very promising and I will start with a bunch of interesting stuff:

P r e s s :



What You Need To Know About Zero Knowledge

http://techcrunch.com/2015/02/07/what-you-need-to-know-about-zero-knowledge/


Zerocoin Startup Revives the Dream of Truly Anonymous Money

http://www.wired.com/2015/11/zerocoin-startup-revives-the-dream-of-truly-anonymous-money/

How Two Alt-Coins Could Shape The Future of Bitcoin

http://cryptocrimson.com/2014/04/two-alt-coins-shape-future-bitcoin/

MIT’s Madars Virza: Bitcoin Privacy Issues and How Zerocash Can Help

http://insidebitcoins.com/news/mits-madars-virza-bitcoin-privacy-issues-and-how-zerocash-can-help/30751

The First 3 Generations of Bitcoin Mixing

http://letstalkbitcoin.com/the-first-three-generations-of-bitcoin-mixing-technology/


Market-Based Reactions to New Bitcoin Regulation

http://www.coindesk.com/market-based-reactions-new-bitcoin-regulation/


Hopkins researchers are creating an alternative to Bitcoin

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2014-02-01/news/bs-md-hopkins-bitcoin-20140201_1_virtual-currencies-bitcoin-foundation-ross-william-ulbricht


Matt Green aims to fudamentally change the way we interact

http://imgur.com/a/J6vO8#Vmo8rt9


Bitcoin Anonymity Upgrade Zerocoin To Become An Independent Cryptocurrency

http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygreenberg/2014/01/13/bitcoin-anonymity-upgrade-zerocoin-to-become-its-own-cryptocurrency/


Researchers Work to Add More Anonymity to Bitcoin

http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/11/18/researchers-work-to-add-more-anonymity-to-bitcoin/?_r=1


Researchers Creating an Alternative to Bitcoin

http://www.sci-tech-today.com/story.xhtml?story_id=0200000136SW


Who’s Who in Bitcoin: Zerocoin Hero Matthew Green

http://spectrum.ieee.org/computing/networks/whos-who-in-bitcoin-zerocoin-hero-matthew-green


Feds Wrongly Demonize Privacy in Liberty Reserve Case

http://www.americanbanker.com/bankthink/feds-wrongly-demonize-privacy-in-liberty-reserve-case-1059468-1.html?zkPrintable=1&nopagination=1

Zerocoin: making Bitcoin anonymous

http://blog.cryptographyengineering.com/2013/04/zerocoin-making-bitcoin-anonymous.html


Unlike Liberty Reserve, Bitcoin Is Not Anonymous — Yet

http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/05/29/bitcoin-is-not-anonymous-but-it-could-be/?_r=0



'Zerocoin' Add-on For Bitcoin Could Make It Truly Anonymous And Untraceable

http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygreenberg/2013/04/12/zerocoin-add-on-for-bitcoin-could-make-it-truly-anonymous-and-untraceable/


Why Bitcoin (And Other Cryptocurrencies) Will Inevitably Become Tools Of The Rich, Powerful, and Criminal

http://www.businessinsider.com/why-bitcoin-and-other-cryptocurrencies-will-inevitably-become-tools-of-the-rich-powerful-and-criminal-2013-12


Bitcoin add-on makes your virtual purchases private

http://www.newscientist.com/blogs/onepercent/2013/03/bitcoin-zerocoin.html



We need anonymity to make democracy safe – Stallman talks bitcoin

http://rt.com/news/bitcoin-not-anonymous-stallman-522/


Bitcoin research is no sop to organized crime [Letter]

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/readersrespond/bs-ed-bitcoin-letter-20131204,0,3966705.story


The Civil War Inside Bitcoin: Go Anonymous or Go Mainstream?

http://blogs.kqed.org/newsfix/2013/10/15/115021/bitcoin


Zerocoin: Anonymous Distributed E-Cash from Bitcoin

http://spar.isi.jhu.edu/~mgreen/ZerocoinOakland.pdf


New Alt-ZeroCoin Faster, More Private

http://letstalkbitcoin.com/new-alt-zerocoin-faster-more-private/



V i d e o :


Cryptocurrency: The Policy Challenges of a Decentralized Revolution - Panel IV — The 4th Amendment Challenge

http://www.cato.org/multimedia/events/cryptocurrency-policy-challenges-decentralized-revolution-panel-iv-4th-amendment


Eli Ben-Sasson - Zerocash

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0o0WKDSh2M


Zerocash: improving Bitcoin using SNARKs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6qOj9ap6RM


Matthew Green at New America Foundation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTxsuVn1LFA


Zerocash: Decentralized Anonymous Payments from Bitcoin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfEgrlWmu5k


ZeroCash: ZeroCoin meets SCIPR-lab

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7LSSE0bRRo


Cryptocurrencies: View From the Treasury

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7bbDpwlTws&feature=youtu.be&t=11m49s


Professor Mattew Green, creator of ZeroCash and ZeroCoin at 2014 Real World Cryptography Workshop

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uh6erfE9HYE#t=15


Bitcoin 2013 conference - Ian Miers - Zerocoin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7rnE9nqhic


Bitcoin Isn't Truly Anonymous, 'Zero Coin'

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x138keu_bitcoin-isn-t-truly-anonymous-zero-coin-developer-says_tech


Zerocoin: Anonymous Distributed E-Cash from Bitcoin

http://research.microsoft.com/apps/video/dl.aspx?id=192058

or first part:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LDA0kCMMIY


The Bitcoin Group #3 (Live) - Bitcoin Anonymity, Zerocoin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-78OkvEWfA

starts at min 04:50




A u d i o :



Zooko Wilcox-O’Hearn: Zcash – An Open Financial System With Privacy

https://epicenterbitcoin.com/podcast/122/


Lets talk bitcoin

http://letstalkbitcoin.com/e72-powerful-perspectives/

starts at min 59:00

Audio of Matthew Green talk at Real World Crypto

https://m.soundcloud.com/rdlmitedu/140113_0001-wav

[indiemax]

Interested in this thanks

[CoinHoarder]

Thanks for bringing more attention to this project.

May I ask how you know that this will be released as an independent coin next year? I haven't heard of that yet, but if true it is great news!.

The government chopped off Bitcoin's balls, I'm glad someone will make this awesome idea a reality.

[LiteCoinGuy]

Thanks for bringing more attention to this project.

May I ask how you know that this will be released as an independent coin next year? I haven't heard of that yet, but if true it is great news!.

The government chopped off Bitcoin's balls, I'm glad someone will make this awesome idea a reality.

thanks for your comments. hopefully my topic dont sinks in this bunch of shit-coin topics in this section... 

if you have news about Zerocoin, you can add it here.

to your question:

a post from a lead-dev.

[Brewins]

interesting reads

[CoinHoarder]

Thanks for sharing Litecoinguy. I'll link your thread on my ALT coin thread.

This is awesome news, I missed that tweet myself but admittedly I'm not big on Twitter. I'm so glad to hear this!

[candidakefyr]

very interesting,
thanks for your share!

[trell0z]

Interesting! Thx for the summary.

[Coinsy]

How and when can I buy into this?

[wizzardTim]

Wow wow !

Zerocoin! At last! Watching.

[LiteCoinGuy]

How and when can I buy into this?

the answer is laying in this topic ;-)

[LiteCoinGuy]

Thanks for sharing Litecoinguy. I'll link your thread on my ALT coin thread.

This is awesome news, I missed that tweet myself but admittedly I'm not big on Twitter. I'm so glad to hear this!

thanks for sharing. you are welcome. 

[LiteCoinGuy]

Who’s Who in Bitcoin: Zerocoin Hero Matthew Green

Bitcoin has been called “cash with wings,” but does it really live up to this name? Cash is the most anonymous form of payment we have today, and thus it provides for two things: First, when you hand a dollar to someone, your identity doesn’t matter and it’s not needed to verify the authenticity of the transaction. Second, you can be nearly certain no one is tracking where that dollar was before you had it and where it will end up down the line. But Bitcoin possesses only one of these features.

http://spectrum.ieee.org/computing/networks/whos-who-in-bitcoin-zerocoin-hero-matthew-green

[LiteCoinGuy]

Researchers Work to Add More Anonymity to Bitcoin

In my column this week, Disruptions: A Digital Underworld Cloaked in Anonymity, I noted that the Deep Web, or Dark Internet, had mushroomed in recent years because of a growing belief that it was possible to remain anonymous online.

http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/11/18/researchers-work-to-add-more-anonymity-to-bitcoin/?_r=1

[CryptoTramp]

I'm in....

[semisyntheticpsy]

I'm in....

Sounds good to me too

[LiteCoinGuy]

What’s next? Zerocoin

http://www.coinmonkey.com/tag/zerocoin/

[surfer43]

Will Zerocoin most likely be SHA-256, scrypt, CPU mining, or another algorithm for PoW?

[bitrebel]

Well, this excites me, too.
 

[Cygnify]

Lots of buzz around this one, lets see what amounts of it

[kuverty]

I'm sure this will just explode right after launch. At least I've been waiting for this... really something new and useful.

[grizmoblust]

Why are you guys reserving the comments?

This isn't the official zerocoin thread. lolol

[wizzardTim]

Why are you guys reserving the comments?

This isn't the official zerocoin thread. lolol

link/?

[surfer43]

How and when can I buy into this?

the answer is laying in this topic ;-)

What do you mean?

[Exocyst]

It would be nice if they chose multi-algorithm security like, SRC or QRK, which both might have been nice altcoins without all the pre-mining. Otherwise, you'll need a serious ASIC (sha2 or scrypt) to mine this stuff in 2014. Zerocoin is one to watch if they manage to implement a fair release. Hoping this one is CPU-mineable.

[surfer43]

It would be nice if they chose multi-algorithm security like, SRC or QRK, which both might have been nice altcoins without all the pre-mining. Otherwise, you'll need a serious ASIC (sha2 or scrypt) to mine this stuff in 2014. Zerocoin is one to watch if they manage to implement a fair release. Hoping this one is CPU-mineable.

+1 No point in a pointless arms race

[Maconi]

I've been waiting for Zerocoin for a while. If they can fix the last few issues they're working on it'll be a great coin (actually something new nad not just a clone with different rates). Looking forward to it.

[digicoin]

If this coin is powered by SHA256, it is done. No massive community supports it any more. 

[dE_logics]

This basically implements encrypted connections among Bit/altcoin peers.

This can kill anoncoin.

[Apropos]

This basically implements encrypted connections among Bit/altcoin peers.

This can kill anoncoin.

I'm relatively new but if I read this article correctly zerocoin will be part of anoncoin. http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/2013/12/12/anoncoin-interview-lead-developer/

[surfer43]

What's the abbreviation to be? ZRC, 0C, NUL0 , NIL,

[surfer43]

This basically implements encrypted connections among Bit/altcoin peers.

This can kill anoncoin.

I'm relatively new but if I read this article correctly zerocoin will be part of anoncoin. http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/2013/12/12/anoncoin-interview-lead-developer/

Maybe it will be implemented, but shhhh... Zerocoin needs independence

[rrsn2006]

Wow! lets see what extra than in anonymouscoin...

[wizzardTim]

The impact of this coin will be huge!

When it arrives and when the first truly anonymous market opens, then it will surpass all coins.

[LiteCoinGuy]

This basically implements encrypted connections among Bit/altcoin peers.

This can kill anoncoin.

I'm relatively new but if I read this article correctly zerocoin will be part of anoncoin. http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/2013/12/12/anoncoin-interview-lead-developer/

No. Zerocoin will be released as an independent coin in 2014. no one knows "anonymouscoin".... i guess its a pre-mined scam coin   ? and its not even anonymous at all.

the devs of Zerocoin are smart guys. they have worked on this coin since 1 year or more. its not a simple fork like most other scam coins. if they do a fair start, with no pre-mining (what i exspect!), good algorithm security, limited supply, then it could be a good coin and maybe the third valuable.

----------------

@ surfer43

maybe ZCN  

and you will be able to mine them in 2014 i guess

[wizzardTim]

Do you know what mining algorithm will it use?

[LiteCoinGuy]

Do you know what mining algorithm will it use?

no. they will release these infos in 2014 i guess, stay tuned ;-)

[peer2peer360]

I could be wrong normally & usually I am...
is it not true John Hopskins University created Zerocoin??

earlier this year there were article on Zerocoin being built into bitcoin

http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygreenberg/2013/04/12/zerocoin-add-on-for-bitcoin-could-make-it-truly-anonymous-and-untraceable/

http://blog.cryptographyengineering.com/2013/04/zerocoin-making-bitcoin-anonymous.html?m=1

[Nano Fiber]

This is the altcoin I'm waiting for. I can already tell 2014 will be a great year

[LiteCoinGuy]

I could be wrong normally & usually I am...
is it not true John Hopskins University created Zerocoin??

earlier this year there were article on Zerocoin being built into bitcoin

http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygreenberg/2013/04/12/zerocoin-add-on-for-bitcoin-could-make-it-truly-anonymous-and-untraceable/

http://blog.cryptographyengineering.com/2013/04/zerocoin-making-bitcoin-anonymous.html?m=1

yes, these are some guys from John Hopskins University BUT you didnt read the first page of this thread ;-)

they will NOT implement this in some coin, they will make a new, independent coin: Zerocoin.

a good decision in my opinion because you dont have to deal with other scam coins (anocoin, feathercoin etc) and you can built your own truly anonyomous coin.

also bitcoin would never adopt that because of several reasons...

[FiatKiller]

Great idea and I'm in, but won't this seemingly be the first target of any laws? The Feds hate not being able to trace anything. All the bad press about terrorism uses for it will force them to take action.

[LiteCoinGuy]

Great idea and I'm in, but won't this seemingly be the first target of any laws? The Feds hate not being able to trace anything. All the bad press about terrorism uses for it will force them to take action.

who knows? you cant stopp that. if they dont do that, others will do that.

you can only regulate the exchanges in my opinion, or try to ban it in every major country. good luck. 

[digicoin]

If it is implemented correctly, it will attract a lot of attention. Who knows?

[LiteCoinGuy]

If it is implemented correctly, it will attract a lot of attention. Who knows?

iam quite optimistic that they dont mess up with their coin and even when there are some "mistakes" they can fix it , its software. 

[Interized]

A coin that is designed just to be anonymous is completely pointless.

You can already make yourself anonymous with BTC with physical BTC paper wallets/coins amoung many other ways that really do allow you to be truely anonymous, depending on how you approach it.

No one but scum bags will EVER support a coin designed to be anonymous, the risks of allowing anonymous money through the internet are way too huge.

Infact, I'm sure the Illuminati will support zcoin.

[jgorham]

This basically implements encrypted connections among Bit/altcoin peers.

This can kill anoncoin.

I'm relatively new but if I read this article correctly zerocoin will be part of anoncoin. http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/2013/12/12/anoncoin-interview-lead-developer/

No. Zerocoin will be released as an independent coin in 2014. no one knows "anonymouscoin".... i guess its a pre-mined scam coin   ? and its not even anonymous at all.

the devs of Zerocoin are smart guys. they have worked on this coin since 1 year or more. its not a simple fork like most other scam coins. if they do a fair start, with no pre-mining (what i exspect!), good algorithm security, limited supply, then it could be a good coin and maybe the third valuable.

----------------

@ surfer43

maybe ZCN  

and you will be able to mine them in 2014 i guess

Even if Zerocoin is released as an altcoin, it is open source and will be added to Anoncoin as well. That article was from Dec 12, and the Anoncoin team recently added a developer specifically for Zerocoin integration. My guess is Zerocoin won't be a unique alt coin, but will exist on the same block chain as ANC

[LiteCoinGuy]

This basically implements encrypted connections among Bit/altcoin peers.

This can kill anoncoin.

I'm relatively new but if I read this article correctly zerocoin will be part of anoncoin. http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/2013/12/12/anoncoin-interview-lead-developer/

No. Zerocoin will be released as an independent coin in 2014. no one knows "anonymouscoin".... i guess its a pre-mined scam coin   ? and its not even anonymous at all.

the devs of Zerocoin are smart guys. they have worked on this coin since 1 year or more. its not a simple fork like most other scam coins. if they do a fair start, with no pre-mining (what i exspect!), good algorithm security, limited supply, then it could be a good coin and maybe the third valuable.

----------------

@ surfer43

maybe ZCN  

and you will be able to mine them in 2014 i guess

Even if Zerocoin is released as an altcoin, it is open source and will be added to Anoncoin as well. That article was from Dec 12, and the Anoncoin team recently added a developer specifically for Zerocoin integration. My guess is Zerocoin won't be a unique alt coin, but will exist on the same block chain as ANC

of course you can copy every work from others by simple copy and paste *clap*. we will see who wins this  

and why do you think that Zerocoin wont be a unique coin? one of the core dev team just said that 

[traxx187]

def looking forward to this zerocoin!

[damnation]

yes it does look interesting...

Look in your wallet.
ok

Do you see it?
No.

Zerocoin.. the anonymous coin...


Kidding aside.. i will def be around for launch

[LiteCoinGuy]

yes it does look interesting...

Look in your wallet.
ok

Do you see it?
No.

Zerocoin.. the anonymous coin...


Kidding aside.. i will def be around for launch

more than that: its so anonymous that you dont even know that you own them 

[FlappySocks]

Who came up with the logo?  Looks scary to me. Authoritarian.

[tadakaluri]

Very Interesting........

[noname_]

Very Interesting........

Yes, but it seems that eMunie (offering 100% anonymity) will be released first..

I am quite new in crypto's , anyone can tell me what is the real difference between eMunie and Zerocoin ? Are there any areas where Zerocoin is better ?

[LiteCoinGuy]

Who came up with the logo?  Looks scary to me. Authoritarian.

instead of their logo we could use your profile pic 


 

[giveBTCpls]

What is the difference compared to Anoncoin?

[Lauda]

Didn't some person around here say that zerocoin was still vulnerable to some kind of attacks (can't seem to remember)?

[Exocyst]

Who came up with the logo?  Looks scary to me. Authoritarian.

I like the logo. Reminds me of the 8-cell aka Tesseract: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesseract

[LiteCoinGuy]

What is the difference compared to Anoncoin?

well, Zerocoin is anonymous  

Zerocoin will have true anonymity build within the code that means, you cant scan the blockchain and see where the money comes from and where it goes and so on.

also i guess the devs will make further improvements. we will see in 2014.


@ LaudaM

dont know that but i guess they will fix that before release.

[headpolo]

The only single biggest problem at hand is lack of anonymity with bitcoin and all its derivatives which is practically all the coins out there.

Unless this or another coin can bring %100 anonymity to the table none of them has the right to be acknowledged as 2ND GEN COIN, period.

I 'am all in favor of emunie and this zerocoin.

[Skirmant]

So, any ideas when the new whitepaper will get released?

[LiteCoinGuy]

So, any ideas when the new whitepaper will get released?

no. nothing new on the zerocoin frontline. could be jan or feb 2014.

[JohnDoe21]

Who came up with the logo?  Looks scary to me. Authoritarian.

The people who made this coin seem very aggressive in their pursuits. Which is not entirely bad, but I get some weird vibes from them.

[daviducsb]

reserved

Not sure what is meant by writing "reserved", but I am all for it if it indicates interest in zerocoin and thanks to the op for starting this thread;

[LiteCoinGuy]

reserved

Not sure what is meant by writing "reserved", but I am all for it if it indicates interest in zerocoin and thanks to the op for starting this thread;

think so 

and you will find this topic faster if you posted here.

[kopam]

Looks great, will be looking for new infos

[Korporal]

Intertesting. I'll be following developments.

I vote for BTX for the abbreviation if this takes off. As in Bitcoin-next generation.

[LiteCoinGuy]

http://letstalkbitcoin.com/e72-powerful-perspectives/

starts at 59:00

[Lloydie]

This basically implements encrypted connections among Bit/altcoin peers.

This can kill anoncoin.

I'm relatively new but if I read this article correctly zerocoin will be part of anoncoin. http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/2013/12/12/anoncoin-interview-lead-developer/

Maybe it will be implemented, but shhhh... Zerocoin needs independence

after carefully reading Zerocoin may just be added in anoncoin..

...So, Zerocoin can be thought of as a built-in, no trust coin-mixing service. Right now, the Anoncoin team are deciding on a sensible exchange rate between Anoncoin and Zerocoin, and what percentage of Anoncoin block rewards will be paid out in Zerocoin – given the latter will be incorporated as an additional part of the ANC blockchain. In fact, Zerocoin was initially developed as an addition to Bitcoin. For whatever reason, perhaps caution against adding complex new features by the developers, or perhaps privacy being lower on their agenda than mainstream / regulatory acceptance, it seems unlikely the Bitcoin will adopt Zerocoin into its protocol any time soon.

This opens the door for Anoncoin, likely the first altcoin to integrate Zerocoin, to become the preferred coin for those who value their financial privacy. Let’s face it; such a privilege has long been lost to users of credit cards, electronic banking, wire services, PayPal or anything that isn’t cash, barter or carefully-deployed cryptocurrency. Anoncoin is shaping up to be the complete privacy package. I suspect it will function as a great testbed for anonymity features, as well as having a bright future of its own.

Anoncoin is premined. Also, zerocoin is now going to be its own alt coin, not an add on as was originally discussed on their website. The zerocoin website has not been updated for awhile.

[bithic]

Thanks LiteCoinGuy. Very interesting discussion. Makes a strong case for the importance of anonymity. I'll be following Zerocoin developments.

http://letstalkbitcoin.com/e72-powerful-perspectives/

starts at 59:00

[Sondey10mg]

I'm waiting for this launch. Any ETA?

[LiteCoinGuy]

I'm waiting for this launch. Any ETA?

no. some months i guess.

[marcus_of_augustus]

 ... tracking the untraceable.

[Nano Fiber]

I'm waiting for this launch. Any ETA?

Ian Miers says May.

In the meantime, as he says, Matthew Green is giving a talk on Zerocoin at the "Real World Crypto" event on Monday. Video/audio of the talk should be up soon after (I hope).

[LiteCoinGuy]

Bitcoin Anonymity Upgrade Zerocoin To Become An Independent Cryptocurrency

http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygreenberg/2014/01/13/bitcoin-anonymity-upgrade-zerocoin-to-become-its-own-cryptocurrency/

[LiteCoinGuy]

Audio of Matthew Green talk at Real World Crypto

https://m.soundcloud.com/rdlmitedu/140113_0001-wav

[kwest]

Thanks for posting these updates LiteCoinGuy. Much appreciated.

[NewLiberty]

Much hidden.

[HairyMaclairy]

so zero-knowledge

[phillipsjk]

Neither the Forbes nor soundcloud links worked for me. Forbes redirected me to an AD.

Soundlcoud said "Track not available on mobile". I wonder if it assumes no flash==mobile or something.

[xyzzyx]

Neither the Forbes nor soundcloud links worked for me. Forbes redirected me to an AD.

On the Forbes ad, there should be a link to skip the ad in the upper right-hand corner.  That'll take you directly to the article.

[doitnow]

Neither the Forbes nor soundcloud links worked for me. Forbes redirected me to an AD.

Click on 'Continue to Site »' right top corner

[El Dude]

what's the deal with this 7 masterkeys ? is this coin going to be centralized?

[Exocyst]

what's the deal with this 7 masterkeys ? is this coin going to be centralized?

It doesn't matter. ZeroCoin will be forked many times. I fully expect to see zerocoin-style transactions implemented on multiple new altcoins (with different Proof of Work algorithms), so if you don't like what they do just fork it.

[LiteCoinGuy]

what's the deal with this 7 masterkeys ? is this coin going to be centralized?

It doesn't matter. ZeroCoin will be forked many times. I fully expect to see zerocoin-style transactions implemented on multiple new altcoins (with different Proof of Work algorithms), so if you don't like what they do just fork it.

i am happy with it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JRMOMjCoR58

[tslimx]

Much thanks LiteCoinGuy for the updates, this is the main thread i love to follow on here now, as the securities subforum gives me ibs.

[LiteCoinGuy]

Prof. Mattew Green, creator of ZeroCash and ZeroCoin at 2014 Real World Cryptography Workshop

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uh6erfE9HYE#t=15

[cranial.nerve]

Is it alive?

I'm hear that developers drop project.

[canth]

Is it alive?

I'm hear that developers drop project.

Source?

[surfer43]

Is it alive?

I'm hear that developers drop project.

Source?

There is none.

Is it alive?

Is it an organism? 

[tslimx]

All i think about when i think about Zerocoin is "i'm gonna mine you so hard!" super excited.

[shtako]

Zerocash sounds like a "get rich quick" scheme.

It seems like the developers had a vision when they first announced zerocoin. Now it seems like they just want to get rich.

[Ente]

Zerocash sounds like a "get rich quick" scheme.

It seems like the developers had a vision when they first announced zerocoin. Now it seems like they just want to get rich.

If from both the technical and economical side zerocoin works out, I don't mind the devs getting filthy rich.
Just the same I don't mind Satoshi being filthy rich, and wouldn't mind Gutenberg been filthy rich too.

Ente

[Alohaboy?!]

any news?

[surfer43]

Zerocash sounds like a "get rich quick" scheme.

It seems like the developers had a vision when they first announced zerocoin. Now it seems like they just want to get rich.

What is Zerocash?

[cr1776]

Zerocash sounds like a "get rich quick" scheme.

It seems like the developers had a vision when they first announced zerocoin. Now it seems like they just want to get rich.

What is Zerocash?

A new name they threw around for zerocoin.

[TylerJordan]

I'm very curious as to whether this system -zerocoin- can be applied to a 100% PoS (Proof of Stake) coin (e.g. nextcoin) as opposed to the PoW (Proof of Work) system that bitcoin and it's dirivitives utilize...anybody know if they are technically compatible?

[NewLiberty]

Anonymity is not just for illegal activities.
There are plenty of very good and legal reasons to conduct private transactions.  Companies that use open blockchain transactions can be tracked by their competition and so many companies are not eager for this information to be public for simple business reasons.

This prospect provides an alternative for these legitimate uses.

[marcus_of_augustus]

Anonymity is not just for illegal activities.
There are plenty of very good and legal reasons to conduct private transactions.  Companies that use open blockchain transactions can be tracked by their competition and so many companies are not eager for this information to be public for simple business reasons.

This prospect provides an alternative for these legitimate uses.

There are legal requirements for private transactions, lawyer-client confidentiality, medical records, corporate policy, due diligence, fiduciary duty .. many of these legally require privacy of transactions.

It's just insane expecting a transactions system to be completely transparent. It's Utopian, mis-guided and goes against millenia of human nature. The people who propose it are dullards, lazy LE or corrupt insiders looking to gain an edge from information asymmetry.

[LiteCoinGuy]

Hopkins researchers are creating an alternative to Bitcoin

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2014-02-01/news/bs-md-hopkins-bitcoin-20140201_1_virtual-currencies-bitcoin-foundation-ross-william-ulbricht

[LiteCoinGuy]

Zerocoin: A New Bitcoin Rival?

https://coinreport.net/zerocoin-bitcoin-rival/

[surfer43]

Zerocoin: A New Bitcoin Rival?

https://coinreport.net/zerocoin-bitcoin-rival/

Devs: hurry up and launch this thing before everyone in the world knows about it 

[twistelaar]

does anybody knows if this coin is a cpu or gpu mine? thanks!

[surfer43]

does anybody knows if this coin is a cpu or gpu mine? thanks!

It is a mystery

[Sheldor333]

When does this coin come out? I mean is it known?

[LiteCoinGuy]

When does this coin come out? I mean is it known?

look at first page.

[LiteCoinGuy]

does anybody knows if this coin is a cpu or gpu mine? thanks!

there is no decision yet.

[darbsllim]

Do you know the zerocoin devs Mr LiteCoinGuy?

[LiteCoinGuy]

Do you know the zerocoin devs Mr LiteCoinGuy?

not first-hand  

[LiteCoinGuy]

Researchers Creating an Alternative to Bitcoin

http://www.sci-tech-today.com/story.xhtml?story_id=0200000136SW

[stephaneffenburg]

Keeping and eye on this project for sure.. very interesting

[tintumon]

This sounds interesting...will be watching this thread.

[Jungian]

This is a race against time like Andreas said.

[xDan]

This is a race against time like Andreas said.

What did Andreas say?

[surfer43]

This is a race against time like Andreas said.

What did Andreas say?

I was also wanting to know that.

[El Dude]

is it zerocash or zerocoin?

[Jungian]

This is a race against time like Andreas said.

What did Andreas say?

http://letstalkbitcoin.com/e72-powerful-perspectives/

Starting at 59 minute mark

[LiteCoinGuy]

Cryptocurrencies: View From the Treasury

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7bbDpwlTws&feature=youtu.be&t=11m49s

[xDan]

This is a race against time like Andreas said.

What did Andreas say?

http://letstalkbitcoin.com/e72-powerful-perspectives/

Starting at 59 minute mark

"we are in a race against legal and regulatory forces"
"who will turn Bitcoin into surveillance coin"

etc etc

[chinabreak123]

hope it back

[dwma]

Zerocoin is going to be a big one.

[Alohaboy?!]

Zerocoin is going to be a big one.

yes I´m totally with you in this point!

[knightcoin]

do they already decided between SHA-256 or Scrypt ?

[Searing]

do they already decided between SHA-256 or Scrypt ?

yea...my question.. I mean they have a hook...the zerocoin more anonymous in tracking then any other coin...

I would just LOVE IT to have them announce say May 2014 such and such date at this time NO PREMINE...gentleman start your engines at diff 0.0000

everyone with an old usb bitcoin card to Avalon 1st generation...and my oct Jupiter 555gh knc unit (would be winding down about this time) ..it would be a hoot!

would fire the puppies up


boy imho would that coin take off......

they likely will go scrypt imho thou (damn it)

and we will still be stuck with doorstops

Searing

[LiteCoinGuy]

do they already decided between SHA-256 or Scrypt ?

yea...my question.. I mean they have a hook...the zerocoin more anonymous in tracking then any other coin...

I would just LOVE IT to have them announce say May 2014 such and such date at this time NO PREMINE...gentleman start your engines at diff 0.0000

everyone with an old usb bitcoin card to Avalon 1st generation...and my oct Jupiter 555gh knc unit (would be winding down about this time) ..it would be a hoot!

would fire the puppies up


boy imho would that coin take off......

they likely will go scrypt imho thou (damn it)

and we will still be stuck with doorstops

Searing

as far as i know: they havent decided yet between SHA-256 or Scrypt.

and of course i expect no pre mining because they dont want to lose reputation.  i expect a fair start and i guess it wont be SHA-256. maybe cpu only or something new?

[Searing]

do they already decided between SHA-256 or Scrypt ?

yea...my question.. I mean they have a hook...the zerocoin more anonymous in tracking then any other coin...

I would just LOVE IT to have them announce say May 2014 such and such date at this time NO PREMINE...gentleman start your engines at diff 0.0000

everyone with an old usb bitcoin card to Avalon 1st generation...and my oct Jupiter 555gh knc unit (would be winding down about this time) ..it would be a hoot!

would fire the puppies up


boy imho would that coin take off......

they likely will go scrypt imho thou (damn it)

and we will still be stuck with doorstops

Searing

as far as i know: they havent decided yet between SHA-256 or Scrypt.

and of course i expect no pre mining because they dont want to lose reputation.  i expect a fair start and i guess it wont be SHA-256.

yeah its too bad would really shoot off and most of alt coin stuff is PR and press anyway....would get all them old miners who shut
their equip off way too excited anyway

alas paperweight my knc jupiter will be (or close to it by may)

imho the problem is nothing with a decent "hook" for an alt coin

lite coin had the linear growth asic resist thing and silver to gold and one of the 1st going for it

dodge much to the makers dismay had the silly angle

zerocoin if their anon stuff is as they say ..that is there hook

alas not smart enough to think of a hook for a sha-256 coin to jump start everyones asic stuff for fun/profit

Searing

[LiteCoinGuy]

Matthew Green at New America Foundation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTxsuVn1LFA

[knightcoin]

my prediction is:

hard times with financial authority, government regulations, etc...
Question... why exactly money should be anonymous ?.. I mean .. the philosophy behind that theory 

[marcus_of_augustus]

my prediction is:

hard times with financial authority, government regulations, etc...
Question... why exactly money should be anonymous ?.. I mean .. the philosophy behind that theory 

Fungibility.

[glerant]

Question... why exactly money should be anonymous ?.. I mean .. the philosophy behind that theory 

So that the common man has the same tools at his/her disposal as the Billionaire/Russian Oligarch/Multinational Corporation - and this is achieved via anonymity and plausible deniability. The elites called trickle down - it wasn't actually meant to work.

[knightcoin]

Thinking about fungibility actually reminds the opposite like art, or a personalized goods ...  

thanks, you guys are priceless

[surfer43]

100% fungible, even more so than cash.

[xDan]

Thinking about fungibility actually reminds the opposite like art, or a personalized goods ...  

thanks, you guys are priceless

if Bitcoin was used primarily as a store of value, as art is, and only rarely was to be passed between people and used as a money, then fungibility would be less important.

lack of fungibility means individual units of the currency might have different perceived values despite supposedly being the same.

perhaps we see it already with large investors preferring to buy newly mined coins, people worrying about "taint".

it's nice for authorities who want to track the proceeds of what they consider at any given moment to be a crime, but it potentially makes accepting and use of money more complex.

simple = good
complex = bad

and then there's the personal privacy angle.

(oh look, an address 2 steps from the one I used to pay at the local store has turned up in a porn site hack. Or an address 3 steps away shows a large sum which is my savings account balance. Should everyone know about those?)

[Jungian]

my prediction is:

hard times with financial authority, government regulations, etc...
Question... why exactly money should be anonymous ?.. I mean .. the philosophy behind that theory  

That's why we need a ANONYMOUS currency, to avoid them. If we can't stay away from government, then it's not anonymous enough.

We need a currency to make marketplaces like Silkroad working again. Bitcoin is very easy to track and will be the government approved currency. Now we need a new coin that delivers on the tabloid headlines that bitcoin used to create.

[Amph]

make it scrypt-n

[testbug]

I just messaged the creator team and asked them, if there are any infos on the coin becomming Scrypt or SHA-256.

Let's see if i receive an answer, ill bring it to this thrad then.

[dwma]

make it scrypt-n

Agreed!

[superresistant]

You deleted all the conversation concerning the Zerocoin generation.

What information do you have then ?

[xDan]

You deleted all the conversation concerning the Zerocoin generation.

What information do you have then ?

yeah, this is a little suspicious - a potential negative to this coin, and comments about it are deleted. Please explain

[Searing]

You deleted all the conversation concerning the Zerocoin generation.

What information do you have then ?

yeah, this is a little suspicious - a potential negative to this coin, and comments about it are deleted. Please explain

yep mine was deleted to re-phrase the question to match this thread

"Does anyone know if zero coin is going to be premined or not..?"

there that should be legit enough

Searing

[superresistant]

yep mine was deleted to re-phrase the question to match this thread
"Does anyone know if zero coin is going to be premined or not..?"
there that should be legit enough
Searing

I guess it was because we were going on the edge of the FUD but censorship is not the best answer, we want information.

[LiteCoinGuy]

You deleted all the conversation concerning the Zerocoin generation.

What information do you have then ?

yeah, this is a little suspicious - a potential negative to this coin, and comments about it are deleted. Please explain

hello,

please only talk about Zerocoin in this topic and dont make advertising for stupid scam coins (sorry). you can talk about the scam coins elsewhere.

and as i said: i dont think its pre-mined. if the coin would be pre-mined, i would close this whole thread and leave Zerocoin where it is. 

cheers!

[Ente]

So why should I care about Zercoin that smacks of mainstream establishment development that's probably got more NSA backdoors that Obama's underwear when Darkcoin already exists and doesn't bloat the blockchain?

Because

Encrypted transaction network: Work In Progress
Anonymous blockchain using coinjoin technology: Work In Progress

it's not working as it would like to work.
It's just another copycat until proven otherwise.

This topic will be moderated away again anyway ;-)

Ente

[LiteCoinGuy]

correct, go to the scam section please

[LiteCoinGuy]

Market-Based Reactions to New Bitcoin Regulation

Is it even possible for New York to ban tumblers that exist on the global Internet? How will the cryptographic free market respond to encroaching regulation into the market for Bitcoin?

Zerocoin and CoinJoin represent two attempts to restore the balance in making digital cash as private as physical cash today. They operate in a decentralized manner without requiring trust in a third party.

Originating from Johns Hopkins University, the first Zerocoin plan was a proposed extension to the Bitcoin payment network that added anonymity to Bitcoin payments and used provably secure cryptographic techniques to ensure that Bitcoins cannot be traced.

After refusing to gain traction among the bitcoin user and developer communities, creators Matthew Green and Ian Miers decided to launch Zerocoin as its own independent cryptocurrency complete with separate block chain and reward incentive system. The Economist refers to Zerocoin as “washing virtual money”.

http://www.coindesk.com/market-based-reactions-new-bitcoin-regulation/

[LiteCoinGuy]

The First 3 Generations of Bitcoin Mixing

http://letstalkbitcoin.com/the-first-three-generations-of-bitcoin-mixing-technology/

[BitLudmann]

Based on SHA-2, Scrypt or SHA-3? may be mix?

[Lloydie]

I hope it is scrypt jane, to make what i consider to be the ultimate coin. 

[mechanikalk]

I really hope that the developers of zero coin are intentionally delaying the release of this coin to prevent a harsh crack down from regulators globally.  Bitcoin first needs to hit truly critical mass before this type of heat is brought against the technology.

[Ente]

I really hope that the developers of zero coin are intentionally delaying the release of this coin to prevent a harsh crack down from regulators globally.  Bitcoin first needs to hit truly critical mass before this type of heat is brought against the technology.

Right now would be a bad time for launch, I agree. Just look what happened to the huge news of neo/bee launch a few days ago..

Ente

[Solariz]

I have a couple of basic questions and would appreciate it if someone could address them.

1) The developers have repeatedly stated that they will "Walk Away" from the project once it is released. As Zerocoin is a protocol, probably with flaws needing to be fixed or tweaked, how will the future development and management of Zerocoin be safeguarded ?

2) Without a Blockchain, how will you be able to "prove a transaction" later on (if used to buy goods from an online store etc.) ?

Thanks

[LiteCoinGuy]

I have a couple of basic questions and would appreciate it if someone could address them.

1) The developers have repeatedly stated that they will "Walk Away" from the project once it is released. As Zerocoin is a protocol, probably with flaws needing to be fixed or tweaked, how will the future development and management of Zerocoin be safeguarded ?

2) Without a Blockchain, how will you be able to "prove a transaction" later on (if used to buy goods from an online store etc.) ?

Thanks

where did you read, that they "walk away" after release? they worked 1,5 years on that, would be a little bit strange if they would do this, its their baby.

[superresistant]

I have a couple of basic questions and would appreciate it if someone could address them.
1) The developers have repeatedly stated that they will "Walk Away" from the project once it is released. As Zerocoin is a protocol, probably with flaws needing to be fixed or tweaked, how will the future development and management of Zerocoin be safeguarded ?
2) Without a Blockchain, how will you be able to "prove a transaction" later on (if used to buy goods from an online store etc.) ?
Thanks

where did you read, that they "walk away" after release? they worked 1,5 years on that, would be a little bit strange if they would do this, its their baby.

That's what Satoshi Nakamoto did.

[GreenWins]

I have a couple of basic questions and would appreciate it if someone could address them.
1) The developers have repeatedly stated that they will "Walk Away" from the project once it is released. As Zerocoin is a protocol, probably with flaws needing to be fixed or tweaked, how will the future development and management of Zerocoin be safeguarded ?
2) Without a Blockchain, how will you be able to "prove a transaction" later on (if used to buy goods from an online store etc.) ?
Thanks

where did you read, that they "walk away" after release? they worked 1,5 years on that, would be a little bit strange if they would do this, its their baby.

That's what Satoshi Nakamoto did.

Or did he?

[Solariz]

where did you read, that they "walk away" after release? they worked 1,5 years on that, would be a little bit strange if they would do this, its their baby.

Ah, I can't find the quote now, but it was from a video where he answered questions from the public.

Basically he said

"We are cryptographers and do this as a science project. Once the open code is out there, we will walk away from it and observe what the community does with it"

To me it seems that they are more interested in getting publications in scientific journals than actually establishing a new competitive Alt-coin.
I find the project very fascinating, so I hope I am wrong about this.

[xDan]

"We are cryptographers and do this as a science project. Once the open code is out there, we will walk away from it and observe what the community does with it"

To me it seems that they are more interested in getting publications in scientific journals than actually establishing a new competitive Alt-coin.
I find the project very fascinating, so I hope I am wrong about this.

I can understand people not wanting to get into the arms race that is alt-coins. They release the tech; others do the dirty work of creating the coin that has most desired features. I doubt everyone will be happy with whichever hashing algorithm they choose.

I just hope they don't abandon it completely and stick around to fix any problems.

[LiteCoinGuy]

"We are cryptographers and do this as a science project. Once the open code is out there, we will walk away from it and observe what the community does with it"

To me it seems that they are more interested in getting publications in scientific journals than actually establishing a new competitive Alt-coin.
I find the project very fascinating, so I hope I am wrong about this.

I can understand people not wanting to get into the arms race that is alt-coins. They release the tech; others do the dirty work of creating the coin that has most desired features. I doubt everyone will be happy with whichever hashing algorithm they choose.

I just hope they don't abandon it completely and stick around to fix any problems.

i would expect this but lets see 

[adhitthana]

Is Zerocoin expected to be listed on any particular exchange?

[marcus_of_augustus]

where did you read, that they "walk away" after release? they worked 1,5 years on that, would be a little bit strange if they would do this, its their baby.

Ah, I can't find the quote now, but it was from a video where he answered questions from the public.

Basically he said

"We are cryptographers and do this as a science project. Once the open code is out there, we will walk away from it and observe what the community does with it"

To me it seems that they are more interested in getting publications in scientific journals than actually establishing a new competitive Alt-coin.
I find the project very fascinating, so I hope I am wrong about this.

Translation: Somebody else will have to take the heat when the feds come knocking with special requests.

As long as it is in the interests of science ... free market experimentation driven by curiosity will only happen where the regulation boundaries end.

[LiteCoinGuy]

Is Zerocoin expected to be listed on any particular exchange?

maybe this one:

http://zerotrade.org/

but it will also be on other exchanges.

[marcus_of_augustus]

where did you read, that they "walk away" after release? they worked 1,5 years on that, would be a little bit strange if they would do this, its their baby.

Ah, I can't find the quote now, but it was from a video where he answered questions from the public.

Basically he said

"We are cryptographers and do this as a science project. Once the open code is out there, we will walk away from it and observe what the community does with it"

To me it seems that they are more interested in getting publications in scientific journals than actually establishing a new competitive Alt-coin.
I find the project very fascinating, so I hope I am wrong about this.

Translation: Somebody else will have to take the heat when the feds come knocking with special requests.

As long as it is in the interests of science ... free market experimentation driven by curiosity will only happen where the regulation boundaries end.

A bit of a chicken and egg problem there. It will actually take a messy combination of subverting existing boundaries and creating new ones. Those boundary conditions you mention exist because it is a means to profit for some party or other.

What has happened historically is the boundaries become evermore convoluted, gray at the edges and diffuse until eventually they just dissolve

You know they are already fighting a loosing battle when the only true innovators are those in Universities doing it for 'fun' ... Goverments are stifling free market innovation and experimentation in the actual markets that most need it, this symptom makes it crystal clear. The corollary is that the massive problems that beset the financial markets is due to the obvious over-regulation of monetary products.

[marcus_of_augustus]

There will be a window of opportunity to wrest value out of the hands of the entrenched before a new regime finds a way to entrench itself.

I understand what you are saying and have considered that a possibility also but I really do think this time is different.

Without wanting to derail this thread very much more I'll explain why ...  

Software is just about as close as you will get to the realm of pure ideas made real. Clearly regulators, beholden to entrenched interests or not, cannot regulate free thinking and just as mathematics, philosophy, theoretical physics and other abstract sciences are true free markets software manifestations of these fields are also free to spring forth unhindered, except albeit by the dogma of their own fields. Now with bitcoin, the invention of new monetary products and abstract fields like mathematics have collided, manifest as a software product, ready to function in the physical world on the internet. There really is no future that I can envision where this genie can be put back in the bottle. Whatever regime holds sway will forever know that they are but one bright idea away from obsolesence, regardless of what congressman, or media conglomerate they have on their payroll. Money has now joined the realm of free thinking, the war of ideas is it new home, and battleground.

This for me is the most fundamental shift that bitcoin provides, monetary science has become an applied science field and finds itself plonked down right between computer science and applied mathematics, the internet is its laboratory and programming geniuses skilled in cryptography are its practitioners.

[miguodong]

Looking forward to it. Good thoughts, good stuff.

[yshuifejng]

Complete anonymity！ really do not know is good or bad

[leafer]

When will zerocoin be launched?

[hypersire]

When will zerocoin be launched?

Supposedly sometime in May.

[Spekulatius]

I hope they stick to the idea of altchain release and dont attempt a totally overbought IPO Ethereum style..

[Spekulatius]

A coin that is designed just to be anonymous is completely pointless.

You can already make yourself anonymous with BTC with physical BTC paper wallets/coins amoung many other ways that really do allow you to be truely anonymous, depending on how you approach it.

No one but scum bags will EVER support a coin designed to be anonymous, the risks of allowing anonymous money through the internet are way too huge.

Infact, I'm sure the Illuminati will support zcoin.

Weren't the Illuminati supposed to be the control seekers? Im confused..

[Spekulatius]

where did you read, that they "walk away" after release? they worked 1,5 years on that, would be a little bit strange if they would do this, its their baby.

Ah, I can't find the quote now, but it was from a video where he answered questions from the public.

Basically he said

"We are cryptographers and do this as a science project. Once the open code is out there, we will walk away from it and observe what the community does with it"

To me it seems that they are more interested in getting publications in scientific journals than actually establishing a new competitive Alt-coin.
I find the project very fascinating, so I hope I am wrong about this.

If they really do shortly after the code is released, (I hope they manage to put a GUI in there before they leave), it will be a messy grab for the lead by different teams to put a working update/fork out there to profit from the first mover advantage/innovation boost=price appreciation of any chain that can successfully make use of the Zerocoin code base. In that case I would bet Anoncoin takes the lead as they will already be familiar with the complicated code mechanics and have their own implementation out there (they just announced Anoncoin/Zerocoin testnet to come online in 3-4 weeks from now.).

[Searing]

sigh i just want to know if it is gonna be sha-256 based (i know very very unlikely)...

want to keep my 555gh knc jupiter going on something zerocoin would be fun to do

alas.....it is more likely to be a door stop

but the fun and excitment of all the laptop/gpu/sha-256 units springing back to zombie life...heh...the frantic
search for 333mh block eruptors on the day they w/o premine say at 12 midnite this date....difficulty 0

ie ahem "gentleman start your dies/cores"

it would be do cool (alas as likely as bfl giving me a refund on my monarch card and satoshi being discovered..on the same day (or at least bfl's annoucement of such)....er wait that happened yesterday

(clueless hope springs eternal...bfl giving a refund on my monarch ALL is POSSIBLE!

Searing

[LiteCoinGuy]

hopefully not sha-256 based, would be unfair 

[Searing]

hopefully not sha-256 based, would be unfair 

as one with a 555gh Jupiter hell yes it would be unfair..but the PR splash alone you could make with a sha-256
coin with a hook like anon zero coin etc (all they need now is a meme)

would be a hoot

just want to mine something with my toy this summer even if it is a delusional coin hope

Searing

[Spekulatius]

Cant any of you crypto geniuses parse through those documents and kick up some hints to whether this is going to be SHA2(56) or else?


13 January 2014
Real World Cryptography Workshop
New York, NY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXU65XsLiFk
http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=q3rgh5ZY

Rational Zero
http://fc14.ifca.ai/bitcoin/papers/bitcoin14_submission_12.pdf

[Searing]

Cant any of you crypto geniuses parse through those documents and kick up some hints to whether this is going to be SHA2(56) or else?


13 January 2014
Real World Cryptography Workshop
New York, NY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXU65XsLiFk
http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=q3rgh5ZY

Rational Zero
http://fc14.ifca.ai/bitcoin/papers/bitcoin14_submission_12.pdf

i really really want it to be sha-256 but not a chance in hell imho (sigh)

Searing

[Searing]

What’s next? Zerocoin

http://www.coinmonkey.com/tag/zerocoin/

I like this but is dec 1st 2013..i think they are going to go scrypt or scrypt-jane or some such

which means my 555gh asic knc Jupiter just will be multitasked as a doorstop

would have been fun to play with zerocoin anon coin as sha-256 coin....would have been

a heck of a lot of fun from no premine 0 difficulty start your engines 00:00:01 heh

I need a sha-256 coin with a 'hook' of usefulness....zerocoin was probably it

sigh off to look at doors to use doorstop on this summer

Searing

[hisun]

great work
 zerocoin up up

[wujinxing2006]

Interested in this thanks

[tangshaowan]

Well,interest

[Anenome5]

KNC release Scrypt miner info, codename Titan. Good for mining Zerocoin?

https://www.kncminer.com/products/titan

[knightcoin]

... they could go CPU only, like primecoin...

[surfer43]

KNC release Scrypt miner info, codename Titan. Good for mining Zerocoin?

https://www.kncminer.com/products/titan

100 MH/S
Wow I would buy that in an instant if I had the money

[knightcoin]

Their chip is made on Germany isn't it ?

[Jungian]

KNC release Scrypt miner info, codename Titan. Good for mining Zerocoin?

https://www.kncminer.com/products/titan

100 MH/S
Wow I would buy that in an instant if I had the money

Why sell it if it can produce that kind of money for them? I'm very suspicious of these claims

[tempestb]

Don't preorder hardware. 

[coins101]

still no release information?

[ZJ778899]

What time does the  zerocoin  start  ?

[LiteCoinGuy]

sure, May/June.

---------

maybe cpu only would be a good idea.

[surfer43]

Well Bitcoin was intended to be cpu only.. until someone made a gpu miner... and then someone made ASICs. But we don't want it "cpu only" and at the same time someone make a private gpu miner that finds all the blocks...

[surfer43]

KNC release Scrypt miner info, codename Titan. Good for mining Zerocoin?

https://www.kncminer.com/products/titan

100 MH/S
Wow I would buy that in an instant if I had the money

Why sell it if it can produce that kind of money for them? I'm very suspicious of these claims

They aren't a mining company, they are a hardware manufacturing company. They may not be interested in mining cryptocurrencies, they would rather take their huge profit margin as pure fiat (don't want risk of BTC or LTC falling in price, and diff going higher). Anyway this is off topic 

[shaul]

There's a new talk about Zerocoin/Zerocash by Eli Ben-Sasson:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7LSSE0bRRo&feature=youtu.be

[omgbossis21]

Im very interested In this, is this the only announcement thread?  Not gonna miss this train!

[berone]

great idea。promising

[Searing]

Don't preorder hardware. 

worked ok with my knc jupiter 555gh got it oct 18th....best i can figure life of product (run it till elec is more then btc...or maybe for a bit beyond to speculate elec loss to btc)

but anyway 51 coins...and my total cost for the unit was with shipping 7,131.80 usd i think it was....

can't beat that....even at 139.83 btc i'd still break even more or less on paper (in my mind...i'd be crying thou....if it was that low)

now if my other guess the www.alpha-t.net unit at now 16mh comes thru in july/aug.....should do ok

but yeah its a crap shoot

Searing

[YYmeans]

when does it launch?

[Searing]

when does it launch?

they say MAY

as to if it is sha256 or not don't know....likely no longer sha-256

(we need a spy in their camp)

Searing

[spring.yu]

please  hurry up.
I wait for you so a very very  long time..

[TTM]

when does it launch?

they say MAY

as to if it is sha256 or not don't know....likely no longer sha-256

(we need a spy in their camp)

Searing

I bet we have to wait much more longer than May to see fully functional Zerocash network.
18 May is the day they release white paper. Source code for beta (or alpha) test net will be released later.

[LiteCoinGuy]

Im very interested In this, is this the only announcement thread?  Not gonna miss this train!

you can also visit the official site or reddit. but yes, here it is the only cool thread about Zerocoin 

[omgbossis21]

do want!

[Shivalein]

Will there be an IPO or is it a mining-only client?

[surfer43]

Will there be an IPO?

No.

[durrrr]

What makes this coin truly annonymous? does this mean this coin could never be taxed by the irs? this would be an awesome idea then

[Ebrelus]

They have a great goal. I hope they can make it. And we will know if it is a break throu when we will get to know code and how it will work.
They don't need to rush. Most important is to see it well desiged, finished and working.

[TTM]

What makes this coin truly annonymous? does this mean this coin could never be taxed by the irs? this would be an awesome idea then

It make your transactions encrypted, but it will not help you evade tax. If you exchangers or retailers report your purchases to IRS (yeah probably they will do that), you would be taxed.

[LiteCoinGuy]

ZeroCash: ZeroCoin meets SCIPR-lab

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7LSSE0bRRo

[tslimx]

ZeroCash: ZeroCoin meets SCIPR-lab

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7LSSE0bRRo

Wow thanks, just when i couldn't sleep an had a urge to check the thread you gimme some goodies to look at

[LiteCoinGuy]

How Two Alt-Coins Could Shape The Future of Bitcoin

http://cryptocrimson.com/2014/04/two-alt-coins-shape-future-bitcoin/

The second digital currency worth noting, which also provides enhanced security for P2P transactions is Zerocoin, which is specifically mentioned in Vessenes’ letter. Zerocoin, according to the their website, is different [ ], as this particular digital currency would act as an “extension” to bitcoin and while the coin has yet to launch its future remains vague. I say vague in that Zerocoin’s original plan is outlined below; however, I must note that Zerocoin now has plans to implement their own version of the coin as opposed to being simply an add-on to the bitcoin network that will likely be launched by May 18th as an independent digital currency. Vessenes letter; however, may change things for the digital currency as privacy becomes a growing concern for bitcoin.

...

[pizzaboy69696969]

Can't wait for this, hopin' for some announcements soon!

[Lordoftherigs]

Is it going to launch in may ? In the article it says 18th May ... can anyone confirm this ?

[LiteCoinGuy]

Is it going to launch in may ? In the article it says 18th May ... can anyone confirm this ?

i guess we will have some more infos in may (hopefully) but i dont think that the launch is in may.

[yayayo]

Is it going to launch in may ? In the article it says 18th May ... can anyone confirm this ?

i guess we will have some more infos in may (hopefully) but i dont think that the launch is in may.

Hope to hear from this project soon again. The homepage did not see updates for a longer period. Would be sad if the project was abandoned.

ya.ya.yo!

[LiteCoinGuy]

Is it going to launch in may ? In the article it says 18th May ... can anyone confirm this ?

i guess we will have some more infos in may (hopefully) but i dont think that the launch is in may.

Hope to hear from this project soon again. The homepage did not see updates for a longer period. Would be sad if the project was abandoned.

ya.ya.yo!

 i dont think its abandoned . but you are right, they could give more infos about their work.

[LiteCoinGuy]

i heard we will see new infos on the 18. May. stay tuned 

[yayayo]

i heard we will see new infos on the 18. May. stay tuned 

That's great, looking forward to it. I hope they will provide a clearer release plan soon.

Another question that interests me is the distribution method. Will it be mining only or some crowdfunding? A distribution that allows broad participation would be best.

[LiteCoinGuy]

The new zerocash protocol is faster & hides how much you transact, not just where it came from. We are presenting it at IEEES&P next Tuesday

https://twitter.com/secparam/status/465972761333346304

[surfer43]

We'll be presenting our Zerocash paper on Tuesday at the IEEE S&P (Oakland) conference in San Jose. Full paper & website up next week.

https://twitter.com/matthew_d_green/status/465963763028340736

[nakaone]

The new zerocash protocol is faster & hides how much you transact, not just where it came from. We are presenting it at IEEES&P next Tuesday

https://twitter.com/secparam/status/465972761333346304

i mean it is nice and so.. but this is not anonymity - I think it is probably a useful extension to btc, but I expected much more. anyway let us wait for the whitepaper

[nagatlakshmi]

How to use the software?

[pizzaboy69696969]

[cryptobuddy]

Important ANN:

We received news from the Zerocoin Team itself that they have abandoned the zerocoin project. Zerocoin is now a dead project. We had started implementing their library to Libertycoin hoping to implement a fully functional and stable version when they released more updates. Unfortunately, there is nothing we can do now. We will start removing the zerocoin library that we added to the code, and we will consult with our developer if there are other anonymizers we can deploy in the future. For the time being we will realease an update removing zerocoin from our code, and Libertycoin will remain as a great X11 100% proof of stake coin with 16.5 Million units.

About implementing the Zerocash
We will certainly study it, and if we consider it stable we will do it. They have already abandoned one project, so we don't want to take the risk of implementing something unstable that could be abandoned in the future. We paid a high price with zerocoin.

Thanks for you guys clarifying this.

Today Libertycoin dev has decided to remove the Zerocoin code from the Libertycoin. Then Libertycoin will be same as other X11 POW/POS coin, e.g. Badgercoin.

[SL1M]

litecoinguy why you deleted my post? it was a serious comment 

[LiteCoinGuy]

litecoinguy why you deleted my post? it was a serious comment  

hello

this topic is about Zerocoin only. If you want to talk about other coins, feel free to open your own topic.

[El Dude]

So zerocoin is not coming out ?

[surfer43]

So zerocoin is not coming out ?

Zerocoin already came out last year. Zerocash is still going to come out.

[SaraMine]

do you guys actually read this thread?
its stll in development...dunno how people implemented it to x11 coins

[LiteCoinGuy]

@SaraMine: thx 

-------

[spring.yu]

When dose it will launch, I  wait a long long time ....

[Lordoftherigs]

On their webpage in contribute section it is stated that : We’re currently developing libzerocoin on our own time

Does this have anything to do with libertycoin or it's just a similar name ?

[surfer43]

On their webpage in contribute section it is stated that : We’re currently developing libzerocoin on our own time

Does this have anything to do with libertycoin or it's just a similar name ?

lib in libzerocoin stands for library. It has nothing to do with libertycoin.

[shekelsteingoyberg2]

Take from this what you will, saw it on twitter earlier:

[pizzaboy69696969]

Oh man so excited!  So excited that I made this: (for FUN of course)

[yzhi]

Add two more questions to ask：
Will there be an IPO or is it a mining-only client?
will it going to launch in May ?  can someone confirm this ?

[LiteCoinGuy]

Oh man so excited!  So excited that I made this: (for FUN of course)

haha, thanks 

[LiteCoinGuy]

and thats probably the end of every shitcoin and its "implementation-try"...

[iHeartSmartArt]

The new zerocash protocol is faster & hides how much you transact, not just where it came from. We are presenting it at IEEES&P next Tuesday

https://twitter.com/secparam/status/465972761333346304

i mean it is nice and so.. but this is not anonymity - I think it is probably a useful extension to btc, but I expected much more. anyway let us wait for the whitepaper

Hides the amount but shows from where and to who. Not anonymous. I am not interested in using the coin then.

[giveBTCpls]

hi friends, i dont really get this, please can anyone answer for once:
What is the diference between Zerocoin and Zerocash
What is more anonymous, Darkcoin, Zerocoin, or Zerocash, or Bytenote and its forks? what about Darkwallet?
If you were like I dont know... Julian Assange or someone like that and you had to send some money and your life depended on it, and the only way was via a cryptocurrency... what crypto would you use? thats the question. Whatever brings more anonimity wins big time in long run!

[dewdeded]

Subbed.

[lunokhod2]

hi friends, i dont really get this, please can anyone answer for once:
What is the diference between Zerocoin and Zerocash
What is more anonymous, Darkcoin, Zerocoin, or Zerocash, or Bytenote and its forks? what about Darkwallet?
If you were like I dont know... Julian Assange or someone like that and you had to send some money and your life depended on it, and the only way was via a cryptocurrency... what crypto would you use? thats the question. Whatever brings more anonimity wins big time in long run!

Here is the short answer (to the best of my knowledge):

Zerocoin (original paper): User 1 "buys" zerocoins, and this transaction can be seen by everyone, including the amount. When user 1 spends the zerocoins to user 2, the amount can be seen by everyone, but it is cryptographically impossible to link user 1 and 2.

Zerocash (new paper): In addition to breaking the link between user 1 and 2, as in the original zerocoin paper, this also hides the amount of money being transferred. This protocol also allows to transfer a zerocash coin directly to the second user without having to redeem it in the base currency, as well as split and merge zerocash coins. What is bound to cause confusion is that the authors are calling the coins in zerocash "zerocoins", just like in the original paper, even though they are not the same thing.

Darkcoin: They use a modification of CoinJoin, which they call "darksend". This is a simple coin mixing service. However, given the limited number of coins that are mixed, as well as other problems, such as with change and trust, it is possible to de-anonymize at least some transactions if you really tried to.

CryptoNote coins: User 1 sends user 2 money, but the transaction is signed by X users in a ring signature. User 2 receives money, which is visible on the blockchain with the amount, but all that can be said is that it came from one of the X members that participated in the "ring signature". The amount of anonymity increases as the number of members in the ring signature increases. For low values of X, it is possible to de-anonymize some types of transactions by a block chain analysis.

Darkwallets: Not sure. I think that this is just CoinJoin for Bitcoin. These exist only because Bitcoin refuses to implement suitable privacy measures.

So, if you had to rank them: Zerocash is the most anonymous, Zerocoin (original) is next, Cryptonote is close behind, and Darkcoin and Darkwallets are poor-man alternatives. All are better than nothing.

Nevertheless, you need to put this is perspective and consider some practical aspects: Darkcoin is working, CryptoNote coins are working but with no graphical interface, Zerocoin (original) does not exist now and will likely be implemented in Anoncoin in about 1 month, and the authors of Zerocash claim that it will be released in 3-6 months. It is possible that another existing coin will implement zerocash first (such as Anoncoin, after they release their implementation of Zerocoin). In terms of practicalities, Darkcoin is easy to use, whereas for the others, you either need to set up some parameters (such as the number of signatures in a ring signature), or make an intermediate step by buying zerocoins.

I should note that another aspect of anonymity is hiding the physical location (i.e., IP number) of where the transactions took place. Anoncoin allows users to send their transactions via i2p, which effectively hides your IP number, and it is the only coin that supports i2p to my knowledge. I think that most coins allow you to send transactions via TOR (which would achieve the same thing), but this is not set up by default, and I couldn't get this to work on my computer after 30 minutes, so I gave up.

There are potential problems with zerocash (the paper was just published): you need to trust someone to set up the initial, one-time, secret parameters and then forget them (there is a trick to fix this in zerocoin); you also can not count the number of zerocash coins as the amount is hidden. There is thus a scary possibility that someone could break the code (or learn the secret parameters), that would allow them to mint coins without anyone ever finding out. This would have the effect of inflation.

Finally, people tend to forget that it is extremely difficult to achieve anonymity when you convert any cryptocurrency for fiat: Banks and exchanges will always be the weakest link as long as fiat is the "default" currency.

If I made any mistakes, please correct me.
 

[marcus_of_augustus]

Monero uses ring signatures to achieve some anonymity, it is worth a mention here also I think.

[jlspartz]

Can't wait, just had a read on the paper:  http://zerocash-project.org/media/pdf/zerocash-extended-20140518.pdf
To sum it up no one else comes close without implementing these current advancements in the field - "Our results leverage recent advances in zero-knowledge Succinct Non-interactive ARguments of Knowledge"

[LiteCoinGuy]

[thunderlei]

It is good to see valuable discussions here. Thanks your guys very much.

[LiteCoinGuy]

Zerocash: Decentralized Anonymous Payments from Bitcoin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfEgrlWmu5k

[LiteCoinGuy]

starts at 04:20

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfovKFvnqXk#t=298

[blackhatzw]

Is there ANN for Zerocash/Zerocoin

[surfer43]

Is there ANN for Zerocash/Zerocoin

No.

[blackhatzw]

Is there ANN for Zerocash/Zerocoin

No.

So where can I buy some, I am very interesting in these coins, especially Zerocash.

[surfer43]

Is there ANN for Zerocash/Zerocoin

No.

So where can I buy some, I am very interesting in these coins, especially Zerocash.

Zerocash has not been released yet, it is still in development.

[blackhatzw]

Is there ANN for Zerocash/Zerocoin

No.

So where can I buy some, I am very interesting in these coins, especially Zerocash.

Zerocash has not been released yet, it is still in development.

Thanks man, is there any thread to track the development status.

[surfer43]

Thanks man, is there any thread to track the development status.

This is it. 

[LiteCoinGuy]

Thanks man, is there any thread to track the development status.

This is it.  

  that´s true


if you take a look at the first page, you will find even more sources.

[blackhatzw]

Thanks man, is there any thread to track the development status.

This is it.  

  that´s true


if you take a look at the first page, you will find even more sources.

Thanks, when Zerocash is done, where can we buy some, do you have a platform already?

[LiteCoinGuy]

i guess on crypsy and the others...i dont know yet.

[LiteCoinGuy]

Matt Green aims to fudamentally change the way we interact

http://imgur.com/a/J6vO8#Vmo8rt9

[MatthewLM]

"We're building a system that will not have a back door"... Well there's no way of knowing that the security parameters do not contain a back door, so we have to trust the people who generate them. Hopefully someone will figure out a way to generate them in a provably trustworthy fashion. I don't know if that's possible.

[lunokhod2]

"We're building a system that will not have a back door"... Well there's no way of knowing that the security parameters do not contain a back door, so we have to trust the people who generate them. Hopefully someone will figure out a way to generate them in a provably trustworthy fashion. I don't know if that's possible.

In fact, it is possible to generate the security parameters in a completely trustless manner for the original Zerocoin protocol of Miers et al. (Zerocoin: Anonymous Distributed E-Cash from Bitcoin). All you need to do is generate a number that contains two large prime numbers, and whose factorization is unknown. Amazingly, you can generate such numbers using RSA UFOs, and this is the approach that Anoncoin has chosen for their implementation of Zerocoin.

Unfortunately, you can not do the same thing with the newer Zerocash protocol of Ben-Sasson (Zerocash: Decentralized Anonymous Payments from Bitcoin).

[MatthewLM]

Well hopefully there is a way to generate the parameters in a trust-less way, they just don't know how yet.

[AnonyMint]

hi friends, i dont really get this, please can anyone answer for once:
What is the diference between Zerocoin and Zerocash
What is more anonymous, Darkcoin, Zerocoin, or Zerocash, or Bytenote and its forks? what about Darkwallet?
If you were like I dont know... Julian Assange or someone like that and you had to send some money and your life depended on it, and the only way was via a cryptocurrency... what crypto would you use? thats the question. Whatever brings more anonimity wins big time in long run!

Here is the short answer (to the best of my knowledge):

Zerocoin (original paper): User 1 "buys" zerocoins, and this transaction can be seen by everyone, including the amount. When user 1 spends the zerocoins to user 2, the amount can be seen by everyone, but it is cryptographically impossible to link user 1 and 2.

Zerocash (new paper): In addition to breaking the link between user 1 and 2, as in the original zerocoin paper, this also hides the amount of money being transferred. This protocol also allows to transfer a zerocash coin directly to the second user without having to redeem it in the base currency, as well as split and merge zerocash coins. What is bound to cause confusion is that the authors are calling the coins in zerocash "zerocoins", just like in the original paper, even though they are not the same thing.

Darkcoin: They use a modification of CoinJoin, which they call "darksend". This is a simple coin mixing service. However, given the limited number of coins that are mixed, as well as other problems, such as with change and trust, it is possible to de-anonymize at least some transactions if you really tried to.

CryptoNote coins: User 1 sends user 2 money, but the transaction is signed by X users in a ring signature. User 2 receives money, which is visible on the blockchain with the amount, but all that can be said is that it came from one of the X members that participated in the "ring signature". The amount of anonymity increases as the number of members in the ring signature increases. For low values of X, it is possible to de-anonymize some types of transactions by a block chain analysis.

Darkwallets: Not sure. I think that this is just CoinJoin for Bitcoin. These exist only because Bitcoin refuses to implement suitable privacy measures.

So, if you had to rank them: Zerocash is the most anonymous, Zerocoin (original) is next, Cryptonote is close behind, and Darkcoin and Darkwallets are poor-man alternatives. All are better than nothing.

Nevertheless, you need to put this is perspective and consider some practical aspects: Darkcoin is working, CryptoNote coins are working but with no graphical interface, Zerocoin (original) does not exist now and will likely be implemented in Anoncoin in about 1 month, and the authors of Zerocash claim that it will be released in 3-6 months. It is possible that another existing coin will implement zerocash first (such as Anoncoin, after they release their implementation of Zerocoin). In terms of practicalities, Darkcoin is easy to use, whereas for the others, you either need to set up some parameters (such as the number of signatures in a ring signature), or make an intermediate step by buying zerocoins.

I should note that another aspect of anonymity is hiding the physical location (i.e., IP number) of where the transactions took place. Anoncoin allows users to send their transactions via i2p, which effectively hides your IP number, and it is the only coin that supports i2p to my knowledge. I think that most coins allow you to send transactions via TOR (which would achieve the same thing), but this is not set up by default, and I couldn't get this to work on my computer after 30 minutes, so I gave up.

There are potential problems with zerocash (the paper was just published): you need to trust someone to set up the initial, one-time, secret parameters and then forget them (there is a trick to fix this in zerocoin); you also can not count the number of zerocash coins as the amount is hidden. There is thus a scary possibility that someone could break the code (or learn the secret parameters), that would allow them to mint coins without anyone ever finding out. This would have the effect of inflation.

Finally, people tend to forget that it is extremely difficult to achieve anonymity when you convert any cryptocurrency for fiat: Banks and exchanges will always be the weakest link as long as fiat is the "default" currency.

If I made any mistakes, please correct me.

I have written some detailed information at the following linked thread, some of which is missing from your above summary:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=557732.msg6662978#msg6662978

Let is attempt the simplest summary, and readers who want to dig deeper can click the link above.

The resource requirements of the full client for Zerocoin are impractical, unless you want to centralize mining. Also all transaction amounts have to be the same, so you would run into the same issue as CryptoNote has (see below).

Zerocash hides the money supply (i.e. it is unknown), it is unvetted extremely complex new crypto (vetting takes years or a decade), and the setup parameters can not EVER be proven to not be backdoored, thus there will be no way to know if some entity (has cracked the crypto or intercepted the setup parameters and) is creating coins for free. Sorry but aren't we trying to get away from fiat central banking money where a centralized entity can print money at-will?

Many ways the NSA can get those setup parameters:

http://www.infowars.com/intel-ceo-refuses-to-answer-questions-on-whether-nsa-can-access-processors/

http://www.forbes.com/sites/steveblank/2013/07/15/your-computer-may-already-be-hacked-nsa-inside/

http://www.eweek.com/security/nsa-can-hack-you-even-if-you-arent-connected-to-the-internet.html

http://www.gizmag.com/malware-jump-air-gap/30056/

Include also if the people doing the setup have been served a national security letter gag order which compels them to do the setup and give the parameters to the NSA and not tell anyone.

The anonymity of CryptoNote (i.e. ByteCoin, Monero, and clones) requires that all transaction amounts be broken into separate transactions for standardized fragments which causes massive blockchain bloat (for any reasonable level of anonymity) and the blockchain can never be pruned. There is already a problem with Bitcoin's blockchain being too large and it doesn't have this massive bloat. In short, CryptoNote (and Zerocoin) can't scale.

Neither of the two do anything to obscure your IP address, and Tor/I2P are thought to be honey pots for national security agencies (Wikipedia says "who has the incentive to provide all this server bandwidth for free").

The need to obscure your IP address is less of an issue for Zerocash since it hides even the amount of the transaction, but this causes the money supply to be hidden as well which seems like an unacceptable tradeoff. Nevertheless, the authorities can see you are transacting to the Zerocash network even if they can't see the details, in theory the bezerk hunt for money during the coming sovereign debt collapse post-2016 will use the law to compel you to reveal secrets or face jail:

http://www.nestmann.com/could-the-government-force-you-to-tell-your-deepest-darkest-secrets

CryptoNote doesn't hide the amount and the payer is mixed with a limited number of numerous other potential payers, so the IP correlation can be used to narrow the possibilities statistically and home in on identity, by observing patterns across all users. Thus the lack of IP address obfuscation in CryptoNote (assuming Tor is really a honey pots, and or most users fail to employ Tor) reduces the anonymity.

CoinJoin’s algorithm suffers from not being atomic and thus it can be repeatedly jammed by an adversary, i.e. denial-of-service. This is because first the inputs have to be collected, then the outputs have to blind signed with a group signature, and then finally all inputs have to signed. If any one of the participant senders fails to complete all the steps, the transaction is jammed and the process must start again. All proposals for throttling or blacklisting adversaries was argued to be ineffective and intractable. Darkcoin innovated CoinJoin by adding a collateral payment which is forfeited by participants who fail to complete all steps. This requires a random master node to break the unlinkability as it knows the matching output of each input. It is assumed that not all master nodes will be adversaries and thus sending multiple times through different master nodes will provide a probablistic level of unlinkability. The master nodes are purchased and it isn’t clear that a sufficiently powerful adversary couldn't sufficiently Sybil attack by acquiring a larger percentage of the master nodes. There is also concern this might also enable the adversary to steal collateral payments. Also the master nodes aren’t untraceable and thus could perhaps be held liable by governments for breaking AML and KYC laws. CoinJoin and Darkcoin suffer from the simultaneity timing problem that other spenders need to send spends of the same amount simultaneously.

None of these coins do anything to solve the centralization of mining, wherein one or two pools now control more than 50% of the Bitcoin mining hash rate.

Also many of these coins run into chaotic problems with their organization, e.g. apparently someone created a private GPU miner for Monero and is mining 50% of the coins for himself. Apparently there is no funding means or organization to rectify this.

"We're building a system that will not have a back door"... Well there's no way of knowing that the security parameters do not contain a back door, so we have to trust the people who generate them. Hopefully someone will figure out a way to generate them in a provably trustworthy fashion. I don't know if that's possible.

In fact, it is possible to generate the security parameters in a completely trustless manner for the original Zerocoin protocol of Miers et al. (Zerocoin: Anonymous Distributed E-Cash from Bitcoin). All you need to do is generate a number that contains two large prime numbers, and whose factorization is unknown. Amazingly, you can generate such numbers using RSA UFOs, and this is the approach that Anoncoin has chosen for their implementation of Zerocoin.

I read the research paper for UFOs. It is based on number theoretic assumptions and I am unaware if these assumptions have been sufficiently vetted.

Realize the NSA may have as much as the $3 trillion missing black budget at their disposal (the money former Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld announced was missing the day before 9/11 and then all the records were destroyed at the Pentagon by the attack the next day).

http://www.wired.com/2013/09/black-budget-what-exactly-are-the-nsas-cryptanalytic-capabilities/

Unfortunately, you can not do the same thing with the newer Zerocash protocol of Ben-Sasson (Zerocash: Decentralized Anonymous Payments from Bitcoin).

Correct.

Lastly remember all the coins are currently based on asymmetric public key cryptography, which can be cracked with a quantum computer if the NSA ever is able to create one. As well the NSA might have cracked some of the number theoretic factoring assumptions or backdoored the constants.

http://beta.slashdot.org/story/191445

https://www.schneier.com/crypto-gram-9911.html#EllipticCurvePublic-KeyCryptography

http://crypto.stackexchange.com/questions/10263/should-we-trust-the-nist-recommended-ecc-parameters

If you really want to be sure, you need to move to Lamport signatures which are not based on number theoretic assumptions.

Tor is a very secure system...

I don't think so...

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Onion_routing&oldid=592703635#Weaknesses

https://tails.boum.org/doc/about/warning/index.en.html#index4h1

https://tails.boum.org/doc/about/warning/index.en.html#index7h1

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tor_%28anonymity_network%29#Exit_node_eavesdropping

If you actually look in to where these Tor nodes are hosted and how big they are, some of these nodes cost thousands of dollars each month just to host because they're using lots of bandwidth, they're heavy-duty servers and so on. Who would pay for this and be anonymous?"

https://www.schneier.com/essays/archives/2013/10/attacking_tor_how_th.html

http://armstrongeconomics.com/2014/06/22/nsa-gathers-all-communications-everywhere/

[AnonyMint]

Add an analysis of XC...

PoS can never remain decentralized:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=557732.msg6501833#msg6501833

The supernode (analogous to the masternode in DarkCoin) concept is fundamentally flawed (Sybil attacks etc). See my comments about problems with reputation at the link above and about DarkCoin at the following link:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=362468.msg7513111#msg7513111

The dev just posted this update, which has this plan to prevent "xnodes" from stealing the coins:

"Just to clarify somethings as well - REV2 will have a solution to the bad actor problem.  Using a dynamic learning trust system, the wallet will choose the trusted nodes over the bad actor nodes.  This also will be tied into the fee system so it will also be incentive based."

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=630547.msg7071808#msg7071808

Hello, as I've seen your posts regarding how to (and how not to) implement anonymity/privacy into a coin, I have learned to respect your knowledge on the subject.

Thus, I'd like to ask (if you have the time or interest) your opinion on a newish coin called XC which claims anonymity with buzzwords like "fully decentralized", "secure", "xnodes", "Xprotocol", "encryption", "XC Alpha", "multi-path paradigm", "Blockchain2.0". It has market cap fluctuating between $5MM and $10MM, so it has become quite a big deal.


XC coin's homepage:
http://www.x11coin.org/

XC coin's source (The source for the xnode/mixer part of the code that supposedly does the anonymizing is not currently released):
https://github.com/atcsecure/X11COIN

XC coin's developer:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=88818

XC coin's own thread (now closed as a new moderated thread was started):
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=600706.0

XC coin's new moderated thread:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=630547.0

XC coin's uncensored thread (in case the thread mod doesn't like your posts):
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=631052.0

Technical details:
http://www.x11coin.org/images/xnode_topology.png
http://www.x11coin.org/images/network1.png
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=630547.msg7027979#msg7027979
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=630547.msg7028240#msg7028240
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=630547.msg7060321#msg7060321


There is a youtube video of testnet experiment that according to them proves that XC is anonymous and it is working (the video narrator is not the dev but someone who got to try it out I guess):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uTgnZAFuNU

Block explorer is also available for the testnet:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=631052.msg7063060#msg7063060


The concerns raised from that video and general vague descriptions XC dev has given, are that it is not trustless, so any wallet that is chosen as an "xnode" could just decide not to send your coins forward, i.e. steal them. When that question was asked, the dev said that the "Xprotocol" prevents that:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=630547.msg7042930#msg7042930

Other concerns that people have is that the developer paid user "loljosh" (known for his coin creation business) 0.7 BTC for his services at the time of XC coin release. User "loljosh" offers X11+PoS coins for 0.8 BTC (XC is X11+PoS) btw:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=631052.msg7033010#msg7033010
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=466908.msg6625004#msg6625004
So this raises the question: if the XC dev has to pay loljosh to create a coin for him, how could he not be way over his head when it comes to implementing secure anonymous transactions?


Thanks for your time!

[MatthewLM]

Woah, is this for real? http://www.scipr-lab.org/code

The zk-SNARK source code!?!

Came as a sudden surprise.

[AnonyMint]

How do you trust Zerocash, when the NSA could serve the creators of the setup parameters with a national security gag order on the eve of the public ceremony?

There are other advanced technical means that might be used to intercept the setup parameters even at such a ceremony, e.g. the NSA can reprogram the microcode of CPUs using built in backdoors and there is technology for jumping the air gap and intercepting the computations inside the computer.

And we will never know if the money supply is being inflated away since the money supply is invisible.

[MatthewLM]

Here's a tutorial for the zk-SNARKs:https://github.com/scipr-lab/libsnark/blob/master/src/gadgetlib2/examples/tutorial.cpp

Very low level, and it doesn't demonstrate circuit loops, but interesting nonetheless. Looking forward mostly for the TinyRAM circuit generator.

[AnonyMint]

How do you trust Zerocash, when the NSA could serve the creators of the setup parameters with a national security gag order on the eve of the public ceremony?

There are other advanced technical means that might be used to intercept the setup parameters even at such a ceremony, e.g. the NSA can reprogram the microcode of CPUs using built in backdoors and there is technology for jumping the air gap and intercepting the computations inside the computer.

And we will never know if the money supply is being inflated away since the money supply is invisible.

Potentially there is an alternative means of employing Zerocash in an altcoin which could ameliorate the above problem.

If a new Zerocash instance was created periodically, users were allowed to mint instance coins and then unmint (cash out) within a fixed period of time for each instance, then it would clear if the output cash out money supply was greater than the input minted money supply.

Since the creator of the setup parameters is unable to break the anonymity, anyone could create the setup parameters and if the money supply doesn't match after the instance is terminated, then that entity would no longer be trusted.

However there are still several things I don't like about this:

1. The complex unvetted new crypto could still potentially be broken by cryptanalysis over time. (and all the public history of anonymity would then suddenly be revealed to the adversary)

2. What to do if an instance's output money supply doesn't match the input? Ban all those coins? Yuk!

3. The entire thing rests on building reputations and reputation is a slippery slope to centralized hell:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=557732.msg6501833#msg6501833

...See my comments about problems with reputation at the link above...

[statdude]

So this ever going to exist in real life?

[LiteCoinGuy]

So this ever going to exist in real life?

yeah, they want to release it in the end of 2014.

[surfer43]

http://zerocoin.org seems to say that Zerocash will not be a new altcoin, but rather will be implemented into the Bitcoin protocol.

Zerocoin and the Zerocash protocol operates in the Bitcoin network and is implemented as a series of extensions to the existing Bitcoin protocol. This approach means that Zerocoin can be deployed without relying on a central coin issuer or bank (as used in previous e-cash schemes). Moreover, since no single trusted party operates the Zerocoin system, attacks on Zerocoin must take on a substantial fraction of the Bitcoin network.

I think this is a wording issue where they just inserted "Zerocash" where they were talking about the original Zerocoin, but I may be wrong. Because http://zerocash-project.org still talks about Zerocash as a new altcoin.

[LiteCoinGuy]

hello surfer43,

its a little bit confusing but believe me, nothing like this will be implemented in Bitcoin   .

so i explain it to you:


old site: http://zerocoin.org/

new site : http://zerocash-project.org/

on the new website you can read:

"Zerocash extends the protocol and software underlying Bitcoin by adding new, privacy-preserving payments. In doing so it forms a new protocol that, while using some of the same technology and software as Bitcoin, is distinct from it. This new protocol has both anonymous coins, dubbed zerocoins, and non-anonymous ones, which, for purposes of disambiguation, we call basecoins."



stay tuned  

[jenea4pda]

Hi folks! Can anybody say if I can buy(invest) in ZEROCoin now?

Regards.

[LiteCoinGuy]

Hi folks! Can anybody say if I can buy(invest) in ZEROCoin now?

Regards.

you should take a look at page 1.

[Sonatix]

Any news?

[surfer43]

Any news?

Soon™

[LiteCoinGuy]

nothing new. maybe in nov/dec. stay tuned.

[lunokhod2]

I know that there is no news, but....

Does anyone have any information on how they plan on choosing the Zerocash security parameters in a trustless manner?

I've seen a few crytpic tweets from the team about this, and it seems like they have some ideas, but it is not at all clear to me how they are going to do this in practice.

[PatMan]

Watching 

[ahmedshawezi]

What's the likelihood of a coin implementing this? And which coin will it be? And why is it so difficult to implement?

[BTC-Ninja]

A few coins are working on this. Seems its the holy grail of altcoins. I'd certainly buy a coin that had this implemented.

[lunokhod2]

A few coins are working on this. Seems its the holy grail of altcoins. I'd certainly buy a coin that had this implemented.

There are a lot of coins who claim they will implement Zerocoin, but Anoncoin is the only one who has proven that they are actually working on this. They have already generated and tested the RSA UFOs that will be used for the trustless setup up zerocoin, and there are numerous commits made at github over the past two months that you can inspect showing that progress is in fact being made.

If other coins implement zerocoin, I suspect that they will simply fork Anoncoin.

[Garryashas]

When the coin is going to be launched?

Have read a little bit about the coin and it seems to me it has only pros and no cons. I am suspicious when there is no cons. Maybe I haven't just mentioned the disadvantages of the coin.

[Skinnkavaj]

 

When the coin is going to be launched?

Have read a little bit about the coin and it seems to me it has only pros and no cons. I am suspicious when there is no cons. Maybe I haven't just mentioned the disadvantages of the coin.

One thing I would like to know about Zerocash is if it's possible to view the balances or not at will?
In Moneros case you have a third key. Called viewkey meaning that all balances on all addresses are private - until you give them the viewkey. When you give someone the viewkey to one of your addresses/accounts, the address balance can be looked up on in a public block explorer.

[ahmedshawezi]

What's the difference between Zerocoin and Zerocash?

[entertheabyss]

What's the difference between Zerocoin and Zerocash?

https://wiki.anoncoin.net/Zerocash
https://wiki.anoncoin.net/Zerocoin

[LiteCoinGuy]

What's the likelihood of a coin implementing this? And which coin will it be? And why is it so difficult to implement?

its not possible to implement Zerocoin/Zerocash in a crappy altcoin because Zerocash is nearly build from scratch and in development since 2 years. you will not find an unknown developer who can do this in 2 weeks, dont be a fool. there were already several attempts to scam people.

[zerocashdev]

What's the likelihood of a coin implementing this? And which coin will it be? And why is it so difficult to implement?

its not possible to implement Zerocoin/Zerocash in a crappy altcoin because Zerocash is nearly build from scratch and in development since 2 years. you will not find an unknown developer who can do this in 2 weeks, dont be a fool. there were already several attempts to scam people.

Not true at all. Zerocoin was designed to work with Bitcoin. It was in fact a Bitcoin shuttle. Most of these "crappy" altcoins are based on dear old dad Bitcoin. So it can work as intended with Bitcoin and certainly with any of its direct descendants. The Libezero was posted public and released for other devs to use to make work with their coins. It says so on the Zerocoin and Zerocash web pages. Perhaps you should read up on the Zerocoin and Zerocash web pages. Contact someone like Ian M from their dev teams too.

[LiteCoinGuy]

What's the likelihood of a coin implementing this? And which coin will it be? And why is it so difficult to implement?

its not possible to implement Zerocoin/Zerocash in a crappy altcoin because Zerocash is nearly build from scratch and in development since 2 years. you will not find an unknown developer who can do this in 2 weeks, dont be a fool. there were already several attempts to scam people.

Not true at all. Zerocoin was designed to work with Bitcoin. It was in fact a Bitcoin shuttle. Most of these "crappy" altcoins are based on dear old dad Bitcoin. So it can work as intended with Bitcoin and certainly with any of its direct descendants. The Libezero was posted public and released for other devs to use to make work with their coins. It says so on the Zerocoin and Zerocash web pages. Perhaps you should read up on the Zerocoin and Zerocash web pages. Contact someone like Ian M from their dev teams too.

yes its based on good old bitcoin and yes the first plan was to implement zerocoin into bitcoin but that never happened and will never happen. i know all that. i want to say that no little kid can add this technology to their crappy coin in some weeks. alot of people try to scam others when they say that.


why is your username "zerocashdev" ? it looks like you have nothing to do with Zerocoin or Zerocash right?

or who are you ? :

-   Eli Ben-Sasson (Technion)
-   Alessandro Chiesa (MIT)
-    Christina Garman (Johns Hopkins University)
-    Matthew Green (Johns Hopkins University)
-   Ian Miers (Johns Hopkins University)
-    Eran Tromer (Tel Aviv University)
-    Madars Virza (MIT)


my answer is: no one 

[CoinHoarder]

Re: Trust required for Zerocash setup





Maybe I am naive, but I think they will find a way to setup Zerocash that people will be able to trust.

[lunokhod2]

What's the likelihood of a coin implementing this? And which coin will it be? And why is it so difficult to implement?

its not possible to implement Zerocoin/Zerocash in a crappy altcoin because Zerocash is nearly build from scratch and in development since 2 years. you will not find an unknown developer who can do this in 2 weeks, dont be a fool. there were already several attempts to scam people.

Not true at all. Zerocoin was designed to work with Bitcoin. It was in fact a Bitcoin shuttle. Most of these "crappy" altcoins are based on dear old dad Bitcoin. So it can work as intended with Bitcoin and certainly with any of its direct descendants. The Libezero was posted public and released for other devs to use to make work with their coins. It says so on the Zerocoin and Zerocash web pages. Perhaps you should read up on the Zerocoin and Zerocash web pages. Contact someone like Ian M from their dev teams too.

Actually, what you say is only true for the original Zerocoin protocol of Miers et al. 2013, but not the Zerocash protocol of Ben-Sasson et al. 2014 (which is what the original post was referring to.).

It is easy to make this mistake, and Ben-Sasson et al. are to blame. In their Zerocash paper, they use the term "zerocoin", but this does not have the same meaning as "zerocoin" in Miers et al.

I suggest that you read the original papers. Their new combined "zerocash/zerocoin" website is really confusing.

[LiteCoinGuy]

....

Maybe I am naive, but I think they will find a way to setup Zerocash that people will be able to trust.

thx for that piece CoinHoarder.

for my part, i knew that already. for me it sounds like the best way it can be done today but we still have to wait how this plays out in the end. i would like to have some more infos. maybe the dev-team needs a PR guy.

[klintay]

bump, any update on this?

[Come-In-Behind]

Re: Trust required for Zerocash setup





Maybe I am naive, but I think they will find a way to setup Zerocash that people will be able to trust.

It still goes against the whole idea of cryptocurrencies being trustless...

[e-coinomist]

Maybe I am naive, but I think they will find a way to setup Zerocash that people will be able to trust.

It still goes against the whole idea of cryptocurrencies being trustless...

Unless it is setup like not 20 people, but Everybody? Some arcane distributed calculation process that can be done like mining, running for some prolonged timespan. I'm not the expert on that, merely curious.

What I cannot believe is the single genius releasing his invention as a closed source download hosted on Mega, seriously.

[tobeaj2mer01]

Is there any way to mine or buy some zerocash? If not, whan can we do it roughly?

[LiteCoinGuy]

Is there any way to mine or buy some zerocash? If not, whan can we do it roughly?

look at first page.

[BlindMayorBitcorn]

What's the likelihood of a coin implementing this? And which coin will it be? And why is it so difficult to implement?

its not possible to implement Zerocoin/Zerocash in a crappy altcoin because Zerocash is nearly build from scratch and in development since 2 years. you will not find an unknown developer who can do this in 2 weeks, dont be a fool. there were already several attempts to scam people.

Bump

[LiteCoinGuy]

Zerocash: improving Bitcoin using SNARKs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6qOj9ap6RM

[Run Away Train]

Zerocash: improving Bitcoin using SNARKs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6qOj9ap6RM

Thanks for sharing this. It's a good watch.

[Orangina]

When this is going to launch ? I don't exactly get it . It will be a new coin ? or a service to hide Bitcoin transactions & make them private ?

[Orangina]

Never

What , why not ?

[Orangina]

Never

What , why not ?

It is just my opinion because there is not a single code written over 1 year and since Israel and the Military U.S are interest in this project i think it will not be made public.

lol Really ? Why they are interessted on this project and I guess you have a point since it's been a year now ;
I guess I will just wait for the OP LiteCoinGuy to answer me thanks dude

[LiteCoinGuy]

i think they will release it when its ready  

"When this is going to launch ? I don't exactly get it . It will be a new coin ? or a service to hide Bitcoin transactions & make them private ? "

take a look at the first page. 

[Orangina]

i think they will release it when its ready  

"When this is going to launch ? I don't exactly get it . It will be a new coin ? or a service to hide Bitcoin transactions & make them private ? "

take a look at the first page. 

Let's hope that 2015 is the chosen year <3 I want to see this Zerocoin project working !

[LiteCoinGuy]

Bitcoin TLV `14, #29 - Eli Ben-Sasson - Zerocash

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0o0WKDSh2M

[LiteCoinGuy]

What You Need To Know About Zero Knowledge

Anonymity? Privacy? How quaint. We live in a world bedecked with ever more cameras, ever more sensors, ever more drones, ever more data, ever fewer things that can be hidden. TLS and Tor can hide your online browsing, true — but, realistically, everything important you do, online or off, can easily be audited and tracked.

http://techcrunch.com/2015/02/07/what-you-need-to-know-about-zero-knowledge/

[Orangina]

What You Need To Know About Zero Knowledge

Anonymity? Privacy? How quaint. We live in a world bedecked with ever more cameras, ever more sensors, ever more drones, ever more data, ever fewer things that can be hidden. TLS and Tor can hide your online browsing, true — but, realistically, everything important you do, online or off, can easily be audited and tracked.

http://techcrunch.com/2015/02/07/what-you-need-to-know-about-zero-knowledge/

We really want to see the final release of this , they are giving us no informations at all . (Developpers I mean) and it's been like 1 year & half . and the expected time to the final release already ended up

[klintay]

I just msg Matthew Green (@matthew_d_green), the supposed lead developer on twitter.

I suggest you do the same.

[Orangina]

I just msg Matthew Green (@matthew_d_green), the supposed lead developer on twitter.

I suggest you do the same.

Alright I will do that since it's my only choice I guess
have you got any answer from the him or not yet ? thanks mate

[klintay]

I just msg Matthew Green (@matthew_d_green), the supposed lead developer on twitter.

I suggest you do the same.

Alright I will do that since it's my only choice I guess
have you got any answer from the him or not yet ? thanks mate

No response yet but he is active on there so hopefully if we bug him enough it might get the ball moving or at least an update

[dewdeded]

Why do you care? No updates in this long time, just means the project is dead.
Dont put hope in it. It wont come magically back to live.

[klintay]

Matthew is not working on it anymore.




Zooko is doing it instead:

https://twitter.com/zooko/lists/zerocash-interest

[LiteCoinGuy]

MIT’s Madars Virza: Bitcoin Privacy Issues and How Zerocash Can Help

http://insidebitcoins.com/news/mits-madars-virza-bitcoin-privacy-issues-and-how-zerocash-can-help/30751

[klf]

There are lots of reasons for anonymous currencies and it doesn't all need to be illegal either.

[solid12345]

Seems to me Zerocash is all talk and no action. The last commit on github was 10 months ago.

[-Greed-]

Any news? Zerocoin seems to be dead/vaporware.

[wizzardTim]

Any news? Zerocoin seems to be dead/vaporware.

If you care about anonymity, then you'd like to know that it can be achieved with the help of AT coin mixer, for coins that have AT support, eg. Qora and Burst. The first Atomic Cross Chain Transfer is to be made soon!

[-Greed-]

Any news? Zerocoin seems to be dead/vaporware.

If you care about anonymity, then you'd like to know that it can be achieved with the help of AT coin mixer, for coins that have AT support, eg. Qora and Burst. The first Atomic Cross Chain Transfer is to be made soon!

Yes, I do but I don't like any (third-party) mixers. They have nothing to do with anonymity. I also do not like Dash and Monero for some reasons. I like Zerocash/Zerocoin and the concept behind it.

[klintay]

I like Dash and Monero but would still like ot see ZC come to life as a third option

[wizzardTim]

Any news? Zerocoin seems to be dead/vaporware.

If you care about anonymity, then you'd like to know that it can be achieved with the help of AT coin mixer, for coins that have AT support, eg. Qora and Burst. The first Atomic Cross Chain Transfer is to be made soon!

Yes, I do but I don't like any (third-party) mixers. They have nothing to do with anonymity. I also do not like Dash and Monero for some reasons. I like Zerocash/Zerocoin and the concept behind it.

Third party? I do not get what you mean. AT is open source.. There is no third party involved, meaning for the first time you don't have to trust anyone..


Or do you mean something else.

[-Greed-]

Any news? Zerocoin seems to be dead/vaporware.

If you care about anonymity, then you'd like to know that it can be achieved with the help of AT coin mixer, for coins that have AT support, eg. Qora and Burst. The first Atomic Cross Chain Transfer is to be made soon!

Yes, I do but I don't like any (third-party) mixers. They have nothing to do with anonymity. I also do not like Dash and Monero for some reasons. I like Zerocash/Zerocoin and the concept behind it.

Third party? I do not get what you mean. AT is open source.. There is no third party involved, meaning for the first time you don't have to trust anyone..


Or do you mean something else.

I meant I had not liked third-party mixers (you have to trust the mixer in this case) and any other mixers (your funds might be traced using taint techniques). But really don't know much about AT and if it's possible to reach a decent level of anonymity with it.

[lunokhod2]

https://twitter.com/Cryptoslave/status/598871927290208256

It is my understanding that this flaw only affects zerocash (which is not trustless), and not zerocoin.

[wizzardTim]

Any news? Zerocoin seems to be dead/vaporware.

If you care about anonymity, then you'd like to know that it can be achieved with the help of AT coin mixer, for coins that have AT support, eg. Qora and Burst. The first Atomic Cross Chain Transfer is to be made soon!

Yes, I do but I don't like any (third-party) mixers. They have nothing to do with anonymity. I also do not like Dash and Monero for some reasons. I like Zerocash/Zerocoin and the concept behind it.

Third party? I do not get what you mean. AT is open source.. There is no third party involved, meaning for the first time you don't have to trust anyone..


Or do you mean something else.

I meant I had not liked third-party mixers (you have to trust the mixer in this case) and any other mixers (your funds might be traced using taint techniques). But really don't know much about AT and if it's possible to reach a decent level of anonymity with it.

It's open source, you won't have to trust anyone - since you can review the code yourself.
Here is a relevant thread --> Please check https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=893271.0

[LiteCoinGuy]

Will Zerocash Re-Ignite The Anonymous Payments Debate?

http://bravenewcoin.com/news/blockchain-zero-knowledge-proof-anonymity-protocol-zerocash-available-in-early-2016/

[BurstIncomeAsset]

This coin has been talked about everywhere , it is very profound and well developed.

It can be a direct competitor to XMR (monero) in all aspects. Definitely a big competition going around DASH,XMR, ShadowCoin and this.

[klintay]

Any news? Zerocoin seems to be dead/vaporware.

If you care about anonymity, then you'd like to know that it can be achieved with the help of AT coin mixer, for coins that have AT support, eg. Qora and Burst. The first Atomic Cross Chain Transfer is to be made soon!

Yes, I do but I don't like any (third-party) mixers. They have nothing to do with anonymity. I also do not like Dash and Monero for some reasons. I like Zerocash/Zerocoin and the concept behind it.

Third party? I do not get what you mean. AT is open source.. There is no third party involved, meaning for the first time you don't have to trust anyone..


Or do you mean something else.

I meant I had not liked third-party mixers (you have to trust the mixer in this case) and any other mixers (your funds might be traced using taint techniques). But really don't know much about AT and if it's possible to reach a decent level of anonymity with it.

It's open source, you won't have to trust anyone - since you can review the code yourself.
Here is a relevant thread --> Please check https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=893271.0

So early 2016 is the launch date? We definitely need a new coin so excited about this. What about distribution? Will you do a IPO or giveaway? What is the approach to this?

[smoothie]

Zerocoin/cash is going to be a separate block chain. Technically an altcoin that will need miners to secure it.

Good luck with that. Seems like delays and more delays ...

At the very least Monero actually exists.

[klintay]

Zerocoin/cash is going to be a separate block chain. Technically an altcoin that will need miners to secure it.

Good luck with that. Seems like delays and more delays ...

At the very least Monero actually exists.

dunno about that...there is a hell of a lot of SHA256 and scrypt hardware out there already so....

[LiteCoinGuy]

Wired: Zerocoin Startup Revives the Dream of Truly Anonymous Money

http://www.wired.com/2015/11/zerocoin-startup-revives-the-dream-of-truly-anonymous-money/

[Searing]

Wired: Zerocoin Startup Revives the Dream of Truly Anonymous Money

http://www.wired.com/2015/11/zerocoin-startup-revives-the-dream-of-truly-anonymous-money/

All well and good ...but can you POW mine it? Can I pull out my old KNC Jupiter 550gh and have a go at it? (wtf its winter i can just use it as a speculative space heater)

hope its not 'scrypt' and GPU...or hell am I completely off and it is a 'protocol' to add to any alt scrypt or sha-256 as they stated 1 year ago....i think?

thanks

[klintay]

Wired: Zerocoin Startup Revives the Dream of Truly Anonymous Money

http://www.wired.com/2015/11/zerocoin-startup-revives-the-dream-of-truly-anonymous-money/

All well and good ...but can you POW mine it? Can I pull out my old KNC Jupiter 550gh and have a go at it? (wtf its winter i can just use it as a speculative space heater)

hope its not 'scrypt' and GPU...or hell am I completely off and it is a 'protocol' to add to any alt scrypt or sha-256 as they stated 1 year ago....i think?

thanks

good questions! any answer to these?

[Financisto]

Are those projects still alive?

http://zerocash-project.org

http://zercoin.org

http://z.cash

I haven't seen any action since 2014... 

They promise so much improvement towards privacy and anonymity.

Are there any active github repositories?

I just found this (inactive) one:

https://github.com/Zerocash

Is it all dead? 

[GTO911]

Still hot air

[nLockTime]

http://www.wired.com/2016/01/zcash-an-untraceable-bitcoin-alternative-launches-in-alpha/
https://github.com/Electric-Coin-Company/zcash/wiki/Public-Alpha-Guide

[canth]

Thanks. Is there an official source of info for Zerocash that will be updated on a regular basis? We all read this story in Wired days ago.

https://twitter.com/ZerocoinProject - last tweet was in 2014
http://zerocash-project.org/ - last media update was in early 2015

[tifozi]

Thanks. Is there an official source of info for Zerocash that will be updated on a regular basis? We all read this story in Wired days ago.

https://twitter.com/ZerocoinProject - last tweet was in 2014
http://zerocash-project.org/ - last media update was in early 2015

https://github.com/Electric-Coin-Company/zcash github is a good source. Another way is to follow @zooko on twitter and maybe ask the Electric Coin Company directly.

[TPTB_need_war]

So what is the right approach to "marketing" monero? Scams are always going to win. Backdoored OSes are always going to be more popular. Linus didn't necessarily fight to win. He fought to fight and considered it a genuine marathon. He will win, long after naysayers don't exist in this planet. The metrics by which he "lost" in the short term are not what he fought to begin with, it's inner naiveté of the junta he chose not to exploit.

Satoshi absolutely went wrong with the economics of Bitcoin. I wish we could go back in time and argue with him and amend the economic modalities of Bitcoin.

I've also noticed that Monero has been inserting itself in numerous Wikipedia pages. Here is an example:

Other platforms which refute Zooko's conjecture, include: Twister and Monero OpenAlias.

Monero seems to have not understood that willynilly promotion is useless without a marketing strategy.

I seem to remember that FluffyPony ran down the list of thing Monero wanted achieve marketwise as a complete privacy hub (I'm sure hub is not the word he used), but the point is that private transactions and openalias are parts of a broader design. Judging its marketing based on what's transpired so far is akin to judging Netflix when they were only doing mail order--there's a plan and specific market (those looking for end-to-end privacy solutions), so you are most likely jumping the gun on any pronouncements of failure. 

I will need to stop thinking and writing about Monero because I need to work on my own project and its marketing. I know you in the Monero/Aeon community didn't originally ask me to do this, and I am the one who forcefully interjected my opinions about Monero. So thus let me try to wrap up with one more summary of what I have been suggesting upthread.

It seems to me very likely that fluffypony's market strategy is not well focused on what corporations might want from block chain privacy. I have stated my logic on Zerocash technology upthread and the reasons corporations are IMO more apt to embrace it; whereas, they currently do not embrace public block chains and I've been told that mentioning public block chains is a good way to get ignored by corporations.

I believe a privacy focused block chain should not be in any discussions whatsoever on a daily basis in a speculation forum. What corporations want to be associated with that! Not to mention how it influences what the lead developers think about and are focused on on a daily basis. I see your lead developer smooth of Aeon in these forums constantly talking about exchange market movements. Corporations would want him to be buried away in a lab accomplishing technology quietly and appearing in public to make announcements of milestones and broad technological goals and achievements.

In other words, if you want to be a long-term focused open source project, then you need to be aligned with the interests of long-term oriented corporations as Linux is. And then you need to produce the best technology for them, e.g. probably Zerocash based (contingent on your careful study).

Anonymity for the masses is nonsensical. I had to finally come to that realization myself. Corporations have a real business need to pay for privacy and public block chains promise more interoption and network effects than private databases. Also public block chains means that corporations don't fail when their partner corporation fails. In other words, just like the concept of open source in general, public block chains remove proprietary lockin failure modes. But corporations will not use public block chains if the privacy is not 100% certain. Period.

Sorry to say it probably means mostly restarting from scratch on a new code base. And it means broadening your perspective away from just crypto currency and including distributed databases and the economics thereof. For example in IoT, a parking meter needs to be paid.

It will require a deep rethink away from the delusion that you can build an anonymous coin for general use and you will all get rich over the long-term by buying low and selling high in a speculator market. I have explained upthread why an anonymous coin for general use makes no technological sense and has no markets. In short, the few individuals that would rely on it, would be risking jail time. Corporations don't risk jail time for using privacy on their data (especially if there is a viewkey when needed for regulatory oversight).

That is my gift to your community. Ignore it at your peril.

[Financisto]

http://www.wired.com/2016/01/zcash-an-untraceable-bitcoin-alternative-launches-in-alpha/
https://github.com/Electric-Coin-Company/zcash/wiki/Public-Alpha-Guide

Thank you for those references.

[AngusCanine]

I read an article on Flipboard about Zcash is this different coin than zerocoin?

[xDan]

I read an article on Flipboard about Zcash is this different coin than zerocoin?

It's by the same people, so I assume it's the same thing and going to be the real implementation.

>All of the authors of the Zerocash protocol are on our team, which includes most of the creators of the Zerocoin protocol and zk-SNARKs themselves.

[AngusCanine]

I read an article on Flipboard about Zcash is this different coin than zerocoin?

It's by the same people, so I assume it's the same thing and going to be the real implementation.

>All of the authors of the Zerocash protocol are on our team, which includes most of the creators of the Zerocoin protocol and zk-SNARKs themselves.

Is there a thread on bitcointalk about zcash

[TPTB_need_war]

I read an article on Flipboard about Zcash is this different coin than zerocoin?

It's by the same people, so I assume it's the same thing and going to be the real implementation.

>All of the authors of the Zerocash protocol are on our team, which includes most of the creators of the Zerocoin protocol and zk-SNARKs themselves.

Is there a thread on bitcointalk about zcash

Get the links to some BCT threads here:

https://forum.z.cash/t/fundamental-challenges/39

Also see this new thread:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1342065.0

[AngusCanine]

I read an article on Flipboard about Zcash is this different coin than zerocoin?

It's by the same people, so I assume it's the same thing and going to be the real implementation.

>All of the authors of the Zerocash protocol are on our team, which includes most of the creators of the Zerocoin protocol and zk-SNARKs themselves.

Is there a thread on bitcointalk about zcash

Get the links to some BCT threads here:

https://forum.z.cash/t/fundamental-challenges/39

Also see this new thread:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1342065.0

thanks

[fartbags]

Anyone know the basic info such as:

- mining algo
- pools
- link to miner
- coin totals
- premines
- block reward structure
- block time
- PoW or PoS

[ermak3]

New blog post https://z.cash/blog/welcoming-jack-grigg.html

[39tears]

is it possible to use gpu minig?

[klintay]

is it possible to use gpu minig?

its not even released yet...

[LiteCoinGuy]

Zooko Wilcox-O’Hearn: Zcash – An Open Financial System With Privacy

For Zooko Wilcox-O’Hearn, part of the cypherpunk movement since the early 1990s, the vision of a decentralized financial system that has both openness and privacy has existed since long before Bitcoin. After many failed attempts, Bitcoin proved that that vision could be achievable. But Bitcoin also failed to deliver on the privacy features as blockchain analysis allows tracing movements and deanonymizing many users.

https://epicenterbitcoin.com/podcast/122/

[Cryptorials]

Looking forward to more information being available about this. 10% founders reward seems quite high though.

[LiteCoinGuy]

Zcash CEO Zooko Discusses Privacy and Efficiency Tradeoffs vs the Bitcoin Blockchain

https://bitcoinmagazine.com/articles/zcash-ceo-zooko-discusses-privacy-and-efficiency-tradeoffs-vs-the-bitcoin-blockchain-1458829054

[LiteCoinGuy]

Cryptocurrency: The Policy Challenges of a Decentralized Revolution - Panel IV — The 4th Amendment Challenge

http://www.cato.org/multimedia/events/cryptocurrency-policy-challenges-decentralized-revolution-panel-iv-4th-amendment

[evergrow]

Z.cash, looks pretty dope. I'm checking this out as we speak

[K-Money]

I salivate at the mouth when I think about Zcoin. I didn't miss the boat when it came to Bitcoin ( I have a FinTech friend who "put me on" to it) . This go-round I want to get in on the ground floor. Fingers crossed for September 2016.

[I am the guy]

I salivate at the mouth when I think about Zcoin. I didn't miss the boat when it came to Bitcoin ( I have a FinTech friend who "put me on" to it) . This go-round I want to get in on the ground floor. Fingers crossed for September 2016.

As fellow crypto enthusiast, if your looking for an anon coin offering fungibility definitely check out Vcash while your waiting for September to roll around.

[egghead123]

how to mine this thing plz?

[klintay]

how to mine this thing plz?

mainnet has not been released yet... you can only mine test tokens on the testnet

[egghead123]

how to mine this thing plz?

mainnet has not been released yet... you can only mine test tokens on the testnet

Looking forward to the release.thanks

[madawg]

I too will mine this but can anyone recommend the best most efficient mining set up or pool etc?

[glerant]

I too will mine this but can anyone recommend the best most efficient mining set up or pool etc?

Maybe someone mining the testnet could do a quick walkthrough?

[MarketMagic]

Is zerocash still on testnet or is it on mainnet yet?

[bbc.reporter]

Litecoinguy should update the OP. The mining algorithm it is using is Equihash. I believe it is CPU mining only and the zcash team intends for it to stay that way. It is only in testnet for now with the alpha release. They also indicated that it is possible that there will be changes in the algorithm in the future.

[Ned Kelly]

Litecoinguy should update the OP. The mining algorithm it is using is Equihash. I believe it is CPU mining only and the zcash team intends for it to stay that way. It is only in testnet for now with the alpha release. They also indicated that it is possible that there will be changes in the algorithm in the future.

How is it possible to only cpu mine would it not take forever to find a block?

It's not difficulty. It's huge memory requirements.

[Ned Kelly]

Litecoinguy should update the OP. The mining algorithm it is using is Equihash. I believe it is CPU mining only and the zcash team intends for it to stay that way. It is only in testnet for now with the alpha release. They also indicated that it is possible that there will be changes in the algorithm in the future.

How is it possible to only cpu mine would it not take forever to find a block?

It's not difficulty. It's huge memory requirements.

can anyone recommend the type of set up needed best suited to mine it?

You can go to their forum and ask. Maybe they can advise you something.

[MarketMagic]

Is there any update on this topic?

[jmpFCE2]

who cares about Anonymity except speculators

[MarketMagic]

who cares about Anonymity except speculators

It will be interesting to see how the market reacts to this coin once it hits exchanges.It will be a major competitor for monero that is enjoying a surge in price and volume on poloniex right now.

[Febo]

Is there any update on this topic?

I think the last posponding of release was put on October, but i would nto bet on it since they postpone all the time.


It was almost a month ago when i heard here. and it was said October 27th.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=753252.msg15910848#msg15910848

[jmpFCE2]

who cares about Anonymity except speculators

It will be interesting to see how the market reacts to this coin once it hits exchanges.It will be a major competitor for monero that is enjoying a surge in price and volume on poloniex right now.

you still dont get it , it doesnt matter how the "market" reacts

GLFH

[MarketMagic]

Is there any update on this topic?

I think the last posponding of release was put on October, but i would nto bet on it since they postpone all the time.

Thanks for the update

[bbc.reporter]

Is there any update on this topic?

I think the last posponding of release was put on October, but i would nto bet on it since they postpone all the time.


It was almost a month ago when i heard here. and it was said October 27th.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=753252.msg15910848#msg15910848

Any news if they will still release it with the "trusted set up"? Was there a solution proposed to amend it? I feel that zcash will also be mired with its own set of controversies because of the "trusted set up" issue. There will always be doubts about it and that is a way for people to FUD the coin if it is not changed. The development team are known people with the who's who in the cryptosphere so it would be a risk if the trust and confidence in them is lost.

[MarketMagic]

ZCash proposes to integrate into the ethereum platform

6 hours ago by saramago using nEWBIUM platform https://coins.newbium.com/post/1846-zcash-proposes-to-integrate-into-the-ethereum-plat






The creator of Zcash, Zooko Wilcox, dedicated his presentation at the DevCon2 to expose the possibilities of the proposal brought by the creative team of the Zcash privacy protocol, to combine their platform with ethereum , leading security in smart contracts to another level, clarifying that while Bitcoin and ethereum present an image of transparency, that does not mean it ceases to be an objective that users are able to control access to their stored information. That's when Zcash appears.

The platform operates with zero knowledge proofs , which means employing a cryptography that restricts information to certain users on a network to confirm that those involved are anonymous. This application is called " selective discovery." The encryption system uses the ZK - Snark protocol, confirming that transactions are valid without disclosing any other information.


There are three ways of linking Zcash with ethereum said Wilcox. The platforms can be integrated using a method called "Baby Zoe" a little maneuver that adds a pre-compiler ZK-SNARK within ethereum . A second option is to add a Zcash programming protocol , capable of introducing smart ethereum contracts in Zcash platform . And the third is the codename of "Alchemy Project".



The main component of this project is the cross chain order , which will concrete the transactions between the chains. Thus, ethereum contracts issued -called "orders" - can be filled by sending a transaction in Zcash format. The amount the first user want to exchange will be retained for inspection while the second user or purchaser certifies . Even a buyer can create a Zcash transaction that may contain a target direction and the validity of this operation will be confirmed by the contract ethereum before completing the transaction. This represents a promise for companies that have independent blockchains and wish to integrate to a safe and unbreakable system like ethereum.

[egghead123]

This thang is trading on poloniex today afaik.Ticker is ZEC.

[BitcoinNewsMagazine]

This thang is trading on poloniex today afaik.Ticker is ZEC.

Both Kraken and Polo sometime today. Already listed on BitMex: https://www.bitmex.com/app/trade/ZECZ16

[bingbong1589]

Is this coin dead or was it released as Zcash (ZEC) ??

[MarketMagic]

Is this coin dead or was it released as Zcash (ZEC) ??

It is now called Zcash.

[GayOfThrones]

This is a very interesting thread for those who study Zcash, makes it possible to learn from its origin, especially as now there is not an official thread of zcash.