ccienet
Newbie
 Offline
Activity: 49
Merit: 0
|
 |
June 10, 2014, 08:58:00 AM |
|
It was MINED by THOUSANDS of people, yet completely unknown to the crypto community. You can't believe that now can you?
Sure, why not. Could you tell me how this is not a possibility in your mind? I can't speak for the previous poster but I can tell you that it is a near-zero possibility in my mind. It is hard to keep secrets and the cryptonote technology is incredibly interesting and important. I think gmaxwell (bitcoin core developer) described it here as one of the most significant developments since bitcoin (paraphrasing). Look at how quickly knowledge of Monero has spread throughout the bitcoin community and has become a "big thing." If it had been out there being mined by thousands of people, word would have almost certainly gotten out, and due to the significance of the technology would have spread rapidly. Some random poster claimed on this thread to have heard about it, and that is actually credible in the sense that (hypothetically) with thousands of people involved others would have heard about it. What is not credible is word of this hugely significant technology not spreading widely. Since I don't believe the claim of thousands of people keeping such a secret for two years, I view such claims as more evidence of deception and fraudulent intent. Two years ago, people do not know what is the currency, now circle is more and more big, spread fast behoove. |
|
|
|
|
|
sorryforthat
|
|
June 10, 2014, 09:05:41 AM |
|
It was MINED by THOUSANDS of people, yet completely unknown to the crypto community. You can't believe that now can you?
Sure, why not. Could you tell me how this is not a possibility in your mind? I can't speak for the previous poster but I can tell you that it is a near-zero possibility in my mind. It is hard to keep secrets and the cryptonote technology is incredibly interesting and important. I think gmaxwell (bitcoin core developer) described it here as one of the most significant developments since bitcoin (paraphrasing). Look at how quickly knowledge of Monero has spread throughout the bitcoin community and has become a "big thing." If it had been out there being mined by thousands of people, word would have almost certainly gotten out, and due to the significance of the technology would have spread rapidly. Some random poster claimed on this thread to have heard about it, and that is actually credible in the sense that (hypothetically) with thousands of people involved others would have heard about it. What is not credible is word of this hugely significant technology not spreading widely. Since I don't believe the claim of thousands of people keeping such a secret for two years, I view such claims as more evidence of deception and fraudulent intent. The choice to stay separate from Bitcoin was evident and to be honest still is. Whois record for bytecoin.org
Domain ID: D162497614-LROR
[b]Creation Date: 2011-06-11T03:36:44Z[/b]
Updated Date: 2014-05-12T11:50:51Z
Registry Expiry Date: 2014-06-11T03:36:44Z
Sponsoring Registrar:eNom, Inc. (R39-LROR)
Sponsoring Registrar IANA ID: 48 The problem with a lot of your posts and what you say is bound by how you feel over what evidence even exists and the fact that you are dev on Monero adds to the idea of your refusal to really budge on this topic. You are entitled to your right to conceptualize all that has been outlined in this thread, but your thoughts have been caustic with a quick rebut to dispute any claims toward answers. You try harder to dispel than to assist for reasons unknown. I view such claims as more evidence of deception and fraudulent intent. This to me makes absolutly no sense. Now you say that for two years they had fraudulent intent? For two years they did nothing to attempt to make money off this coin. |
|
|
|
|
Keyboard-Mash
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
|
|
June 10, 2014, 09:25:45 AM |
|
I'm kind of at a loss here. I started out largely in support of BCN .. but not for its potential marketcap or the fact that I could ever hope to use whatever it is as a financial tool .. but instead for the value of its contribution and exactly what that contribution was. That's not what I'd like to discuss though .. I'm sure everyone here's heard plenty about that. What I'm really interested in is .. have people in this thread been led to believe that they can or will ever become part of the closed community that Bytecoin is used by? I figured them for Cypherpunks .. or as they're saying nowaways, "Crypto-enthusiasts" instead of the usual "crypto-activists". I mean they have the Cyphernomicon in their blockchain so this is hardly a stretch .. are any of you Cypherpunks? Anyone on the mailing list? Don't get me wrong that's cool as hell .. but my background isn't programming  Cypherpunks write code .. so I left their money well enough alone after I figured whose it was  What about that picture for anon web hosting .. don't they advertize like .1 BTC = .001 BCN? Wouldn't that make the marketcap like $1,022,985,600,000 .. a trillion dollars! That's insane! I wonder what kind of mansions they all live in  Do you guys think that's what they trade it for on their websites? Just wondering what people think about these fourfive questions ... |
|
|
|
|
smooth
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
|
|
June 10, 2014, 09:48:47 AM |
|
Whois record for bytecoin.org
Domain ID: D162497614-LROR
[b]Creation Date: 2011-06-11T03:36:44Z[/b]
Updated Date: 2014-05-12T11:50:51Z
Registry Expiry Date: 2014-06-11T03:36:44Z
Sponsoring Registrar:eNom, Inc. (R39-LROR)
Sponsoring Registrar IANA ID: 48 The bytecoin domain name is three years old but if you look in wayback there was nothing related to the coin (or at all) on that domain until much more recently. We have no idea where the domain came from, it could well have been held by a domain speculator for years. Again, I'm looking for verifiable evidence in support of the extraordinary claim that a secret of this magnitude was kept by thousands of people for two years. I don't see it, therefore I don't believe the extraordinary claim. |
|
|
|
|
smooth
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:04:57 AM |
|
I view such claims as more evidence of deception and fraudulent intent. This to me makes absolutly no sense. Now you say that for two years they had fraudulent intent? For two years they did nothing to attempt to make money off this coin. I can't comment on what happened for two years since there is no verifiable evidence even supporting the existence of two years of activity. I'm talking about what has happened since this coin has surfaced. Implausible claims have repeatedly been put forward which suggests intent to deceive. Unless of course those claims, though implausible, turn out to be valid. I'm waiting for verifiable evidence. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. We can start with even ordinary evidence though. |
|
|
|
|
knightcoin
Full Member
Offline
Activity: 238
Merit: 100
Stand on the shoulders of giants
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:08:40 AM |
|
I, too, think that Monero is just a sad copy of ByteCoin (very poor name and branding, marketing fail during launch too IMO--I don't need to get into that discussion :p). I also agree that in the end the amount of initial users of this coin doesn't really matter, especially since the coin is so cheap right now (hovering around 5 satoshis). Such a small percentage of the world even owns the most popular crypto, bitcoin! It would be so easy for a new bitcoin adopter to say the same thing about bitcoin, being 61% mined without their knowledge. Fairness is subjective... ducknote is a funny coin, I actually like it. I know I just said Monero had a poor name, and some would say the same about ducknote...but I beg to differ. I think the coin idea is funny in a sort of sarcastic way and the duck is neutral. Fun experiment none-the-less...definitely open for some meme-age. Plus, who said ducks aren't marketable? "AAAFLLLAAAAC!!!" I enjoy the mystery and seemingly true to its nature history of ByteCoin. It's the real deal, and does not need hype *cough*DarkCoin. I think a lot of Shibes have bought into DarkCoin, or so it seems by the nature of its community to some level. I also am really interested in ducknote and I think that Monero, FantomCoin, QuazarCoin, and DarkCoin will not succeed in the long run. Just my 2 QUACKS! PS: CryptoNote block chains and charts: https://minergate.com/blockchain/bcn/blocksbytecoin have every cool element to become top notch coin in the market ... it's only have 1 problem, premining, but also due the nature of true anonymity, blockchain analisys resistance, etc .. I think we'll never know who are the big stakes ... In my view that's why bytecoin is not bitcoin competidor, but complements it... my bet is that developers still holding the high stakes .. I don't know why ... if I have a big stake I would sell or give way now 1/2 of it while price is low to popularize and make better distribution, like ..as investing .. and hodl the other half for the time when the anonymous e-commerce will emerge to the general public ... I'm really not very excited with bytecoins clones ... but they have some legit points made ... I have a name suggestion for the next clone though |
|
|
|
GreekBitcoin
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1428
Merit: 1001
getmonero.org
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:10:22 AM |
|
I, too, think that Monero is just a sad copy of ByteCoin (very poor name and branding, marketing fail during launch too IMO--I don't need to get into that discussion :p). I also agree that in the end the amount of initial users of this coin doesn't really matter, especially since the coin is so cheap right now (hovering around 5 satoshis). Such a small percentage of the world even owns the most popular crypto, bitcoin! It would be so easy for a new bitcoin adopter to say the same thing about bitcoin, being 61% mined without their knowledge. Fairness is subjective... ducknote is a funny coin, I actually like it. I know I just said Monero had a poor name, and some would say the same about ducknote...but I beg to differ. I think the coin idea is funny in a sort of sarcastic way and the duck is neutral. Fun experiment none-the-less...definitely open for some meme-age. Plus, who said ducks aren't marketable? "AAAFLLLAAAAC!!!" I enjoy the mystery and seemingly true to its nature history of ByteCoin. It's the real deal, and does not need hype *cough*DarkCoin. I think a lot of Shibes have bought into DarkCoin, or so it seems by the nature of its community to some level. I also am really interested in ducknote and I think that Monero, FantomCoin, QuazarCoin, and DarkCoin will not succeed in the long run. Just my 2 QUACKS! PS: CryptoNote block chains and charts: https://minergate.com/blockchain/bcn/blocksbytecoin have every cool element to become top notch coin in the market ... it's only have 1 problem, premining, but also due the nature of true anonymity, blockchain analisys resistance, etc .. I think we'll never know who are the big stakes ... In my view that's why bytecoin is not bitcoin competidor, but complements it... my bet is that developers still holding the high stakes .. I don't know why ... if I have a big stake I would sell or give way now 1/2 of it while price is low to popularize and make better distribution, like ..as investing .. and hodl the other half for the time when the anonymous e-commerce will emerge to the general public ... I'm really not very excited with bytecoins clones ... but they have some legit points made ... I have a name suggestion for the next clone though The problem is that the premining is soo big that they cant just sell it. There is not enough buy support to sell it... |
|
|
|
|
Keyboard-Mash
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:15:41 AM |
|
bytecoin have every cool element to become top notch coin in the market ... it's only have 1 problem, premining, but also due the nature of true anonymity, blockchain analisys resistance, etc .. I think we'll never know who are the big stakes ... In my view that's why bytecoin is not bitcoin competidor, but complements it... my bet is that developers still holding the high stakes .. I don't know why ... if I have a big stake I would sell or give way now 1/2 of it while price is low to popularize and make better distribution, like ..as investing .. and hodl the other half for the time when the anonymous e-commerce will emerge to the general public ... I'm really not very excited with bytecoins clones ... but they have some legit points made ... I have a name suggestion for the next clone though I can see how it's a premine to us. Maybe they were just trying to provide it as an example to show that the technology works. Sounds like they have their own economy that we can never really be a part of unless we're cypherpunks. I don't think their aim is to compete. I think their aim is to be as many "coins", "communities" and "forks" as possible in order to show that CN technology is superior! Maybe that's why they built the technology to have such a rough time scaling, because they think that thousands of small communities will be a better model for an economy that one large one? |
|
|
|
|
|
Rias
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:16:39 AM |
|
The problem is that the premining is soo big that they cant just sell it. There is not enough buy support to sell it...
It's only a problem for those wanting to sell 80%. Are you on the list? Otherwise, it's a good sign because dump is not possible. |
|
|
|
|
GreekBitcoin
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1428
Merit: 1001
getmonero.org
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:18:38 AM |
|
The problem is that the premining is soo big that they cant just sell it. There is not enough buy support to sell it...
It's only a problem for those wanting to sell 80%. Are you on the list? Otherwise, it's a good sign because dump is not possible.  |
|
|
|
|
smooth
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:19:34 AM |
|
bytecoin have every cool element to become top notch coin in the market ... it's only have 1 problem, premining, but also due the nature of true anonymity, blockchain analisys resistance, etc .. I think we'll never know who are the big stakes ... In my view that's why bytecoin is not bitcoin competidor, but complements it... my bet is that developers still holding the high stakes .. I don't know why ... if I have a big stake I would sell or give way now 1/2 of it while price is low to popularize and make better distribution, like ..as investing .. and hodl the other half for the time when the anonymous e-commerce will emerge to the general public ... I'm really not very excited with bytecoins clones ... but they have some legit points made ... I have a name suggestion for the next clone though I can see how it's a premine to us. Maybe they were just trying to provide it as an example to show that the technology works. Sounds like they have their own economy that we can never really be a part of unless we're cypherpunks. I don't think their aim is to compete. I think their aim is to be as many "coins", "communities" and "forks" as possible in order to show that CN technology is superior! Maybe that's why they built the technology to have such a rough time scaling, because they think that thousands of small communities will be a better model for an economy that one large one? There is certainly no question that "CryptoNote" who claims to be the inventor of the underlying technology is supportive of multiple coins and they even identify "approved" implementations on their web site. So if forks, relaunches, whatever you want to call them, are good enough for the inventors then why not good enough for everyone else? Given a clean relaunch that is approved by the inventors of the technology without an 80% premine, I really can't see why anyone would choose the 80% premine version. Link: https://forum.cryptonote.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=162#p566 |
|
|
|
|
Keyboard-Mash
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:25:07 AM |
|
The problem is that the premining is soo big that they cant just sell it. There is not enough buy support to sell it...
It's only a problem for those wanting to sell 80%. Are you on the list? Otherwise, it's a good sign because dump is not possible. How could they sell though ... I thought the exchange rate was like $6.50 / BCN? |
|
|
|
|
werrindor
Member
Offline
Activity: 98
Merit: 10
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:29:52 AM |
|
I think another reason that Bytecoin is failing to capture the public's inspiration is because the name is wayyyy to similar to Bitcoin. That's a massive point of confusion further down the line.
duckNote actually has a better brand than BCN. The main trouble with duckNote though is that the developer doesn't do any work.
Personally I don't mind about the Bytecoin premine as I've already made 300% profit on it.
This actually might be true...Bytecoin is really not the best brand on the market and people constantly confuse it with bitcoin. |
|
|
|
|
Keyboard-Mash
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:30:12 AM |
|
So if forks, relaunches, whatever you want to call them, are good enough for the inventors then why not good enough for everyone else?
Given a clean relaunch that is approved by the inventors of the technology without an 80% premine, I really can't see why anyone would choose the 80% premine version.
Yeah, that's kinda wierd .. I didn't even make the connection before that if the inventors of the technology approve .. then why don't all of us? It's brutal to suffer actual malice because someone "made a fork" especially when it's totally supported. Maybe someone should ask them on their website what their views on forks are .. rather than trying to use it as some kind of derogatory term? |
|
|
|
|
ajareselde
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1000
Satoshi is rolling in his grave. #bitcoin
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:31:07 AM |
|
The problem is that the premining is soo big that they cant just sell it. There is not enough buy support to sell it...
It's only a problem for those wanting to sell 80%. Are you on the list? Otherwise, it's a good sign because dump is not possible. everyone has a price, its just a matter of amount you need to satisfy, and thats why i never trust large premines. and whats with the name, we allready have bytecoin - BTE |
|
|
|
|
Keyboard-Mash
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:31:31 AM |
|
This actually might be true...Bytecoin is really not the best brand on the market and people constantly confuse it with bitcoin.
Don't rename it! We all know what happens when a community wants to change a name  |
|
|
|
|
werrindor
Member
Offline
Activity: 98
Merit: 10
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:34:20 AM |
|
This actually might be true...Bytecoin is really not the best brand on the market and people constantly confuse it with bitcoin.
Don't rename it! We all know what happens when a community wants to change a name Cmon i didnt mean it should be renamed!  Name is ok, just causes some confusion among those who are new to the cryptoworld. |
|
|
|
|
knightcoin
Full Member
Offline
Activity: 238
Merit: 100
Stand on the shoulders of giants
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:34:36 AM |
|
I was thinking about the dumping things ... Came to my mind a satoshi dice or roulette game with negative odds to the casino ...( remember odds are always against players in a long run.. )
|
|
|
|
|
rangedriver
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:35:49 AM |
|
There is certainly no question that "CryptoNote" who claims to be the inventor of the underlying technology is supportive of multiple coins and they even identify "approved" implementations on their web site.
So if forks, relaunches, whatever you want to call them, are good enough for the inventors then why not good enough for everyone else?
This is a brilliant point. |
|
|
|
|
smooth
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2968
Merit: 1198
|
|
June 10, 2014, 10:40:25 AM |
|
Yeah, that's kinda wierd .. I didn't even make the connection before that if the inventors of the technology approve .. then why don't all of us? It's brutal to suffer actual malice because someone "made a fork" especially when it's totally supported.
Maybe someone should ask them on their website what their views on forks are .. rather than trying to use it as some kind of derogatory term?
Don't need to ask because they've already stated their position. In fact they've offered to help! "We will help you establish your own CN-based cryptocurrency" https://forum.cryptonote.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=6In fact they suggest forking as a development strategy "For the reference code consider Bytecoin (BCN) source code" https://forum.cryptonote.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=6#p8 |
|
|
|
|
|
