[DISCONTINUED] cryp.today Mining revenue stats Scrypt Scrypt-N X11 X13

[suchmoon]

For better or worse, I'm part of the "Big ASIC Massacre of 2014" in a small way. I've mostly used ASICs, with just a bit of GPU dabbling.

So I for one hope that suchmoon keeps at least some reasonable representation of scrypt pool options.

As far as the massacre is concerned, is there any one event that's got you concerned suchmoon? Or is it just that ASICs will continue to gain momentum and lead to the same arms race as happened with bitcoin?

When you look at the ASIC options out there, few of them have any hope of an ROI. I knew that getting into this, but I was more interested in learning about crypto currencies and having fun.

This chart pretty much sums it up:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1msn9gC7wgBYdiyOLZLhQifOSKpt3ukdnuTy14m-F-s8/edit#gid=1966313813

Of course math doesn't stop people from buying unprofitable rigs.

The scary ones are the products that haven't shipped yet and actually appear have a decent ROI. If the KnC Titan and Mini Titan actually ship before the bottom drops out of the scrypt market, and if they can ship in quantities needed to meet demand, it looks like they could have a major impact. I have to admit that 150 Mh/s for under $6k and an ROI of a month is pretty interesting...

The "massacre" was meant to be somewhat sarcastic, as I don't think anybody has any real clue as to what and when is going to happen. I tend to think that KNC et al will be late to the party, considering that Innosilicon is already shipping hardware with capacities within the same order of magnitude (~90 MH/s vs KNC's 300 or whatever it is) and there is no reason why they couldn't scale up in a few months. And if Zeus delivers within the next couple of weeks as promised, there will competition, price pressure, etc, so by the time the hyped-up preorders arrive it might not matter anymore. You might be able to pick up IN STOCK hardware for roughly the same $ / MHS as someone who sank in their cash months ago. And no, I don't believe there is going to be a 1 month ROI on any of it - I think scrypt profitability will slide down, likely more gradually than abruptly. Again, that's just my speculation on the subject, and I will probably end up being embarrassingly wrong

[1715688529]

1715688529

[SpruceMoosey]

Haha.  the great "Asic massacre of 2014"!!!!

I think it is a term well worth coining Suchmoon, no backing out now ^^.


No matter which way you look at it, if the Asic's come out in the approximate timeframe they are supposed to, there will be a massacre.    If nothing else a massacre on "Shitcoins".


In the end it could be great for crypto's.  They had a learning period in scrypt and the market will be more learned and well evolved in the new coins, weather it be x11, nscrypt or gristlycoins etc etc etc.    Someone will stumble on the new Popular format at some stage and I don't think its going to be the Dark or Anonymous coins, though they may have their part to play!!!

I think scrypt will die with scrypt Asic's, but after that the future for crypto's is bright!

[edonkey]

The "massacre" was meant to be somewhat sarcastic, as I don't think anybody has any real clue as to what and when is going to happen. I tend to think that KNC et al will be late to the party, considering that Innosilicon is already shipping hardware with capacities within the same order of magnitude (~90 MH/s vs KNC's 300 or whatever it is) and there is no reason why they couldn't scale up in a few months. And if Zeus delivers within the next couple of weeks as promised, there will competition, price pressure, etc, so by the time the hyped-up preorders arrive it might not matter anymore. You might be able to pick up IN STOCK hardware for roughly the same $ / MHS as someone who sank in their cash months ago. And no, I don't believe there is going to be a 1 month ROI on any of it - I think scrypt profitability will slide down, likely more gradually than abruptly. Again, that's just my speculation on the subject, and I will probably end up being embarrassingly wrong

I know that some blogs have reviewed the Innosilicon A2 modules, but I didn't think they were in production yet. In any case, their current price per MH/s is much higher than what KNC is promising. Same for the upcoming Zeus products and GAW Miner's clones.

Anyway, as interesting as KNC's numbers are now, they're probably a fantasy. Who knows when they actually will ship and what profitability will look like then.

But if KNC were shipping now and had units in stock, I'd be sorely tempted. At today's difficulty and without considering power costs, the $5.5k Mini at 150 MH/s would generate around $200 per day with straight LTC (slightly better on average with a multipool). Unless difficulty abruptly hockey sticks, you'd have a decent shot at a relatively quick ROI.

Like I said though, it's a fantasy until they actually deliver something...

[suchmoon]

Yes, A2 is in stock, and yes, it is overpriced, and yes, it will match KNC pricing when/if that becomes relevant. Just as Gridseed miners suddenly became price-competitive with A2/Zeus. Margins are huge, lots of room for all sorts of shenanigans, all we can hope for is that increased competition will stabilize the market to some extent. I think I'm currently getting better ROI from Ants and GPUs than all that Scrypt ASIC crud

[edonkey]

Yes, A2 is in stock, and yes, it is overpriced, and yes, it will match KNC pricing when/if that becomes relevant. Just as Gridseed miners suddenly became price-competitive with A2/Zeus. Margins are huge, lots of room for all sorts of shenanigans, all we can hope for is that increased competition will stabilize the market to some extent. I think I'm currently getting better ROI from Ants and GPUs than all that Scrypt ASIC crud

Ah, I get what you're saying. If and when KNC (or some other product with significant MH/s per $) ships, the other companies will adjust to compete. Makes sense.

What a whacky market. All this hardware development for what amounts to a small window of viability.

[suchmoon]

Charts have been updated for today. No major changes.

[jbass350z]

Is the consensus that GPU mining is dead? I see ebay being flooded with rigs now and getting concerned about selling mine for any decent amount.

[aagert]

Is the consensus that GPU mining is dead? I see ebay being flooded with rigs now and getting concerned about selling mine for any decent amount.

When everyone sell - buy for cheap while it lasts.
Do not go with a crowd. Real profit is usually in other direction.
But you'll have to wait patiently to reap the rewards in the end.

[suchmoon]

Is the consensus that GPU mining is dead? I see ebay being flooded with rigs now and getting concerned about selling mine for any decent amount.

Depending on your electricity cost it can still be reasonably profitable. X11 has waves of good earnings and it's good for cooling (i.e. less need for it). Even plain old Scrypt works quite well with rental services. Do your own math, don't look at eBay.

[suchmoon]

Charts have been updated for today.

I added NiceHash X11 and removed hashco.ws.

Some changes have been made to chart labels (pool/service names), quote from OP:

If pool/service name on the charts has a one-letter suffix it indicates the hashing algorithm: S is Scrypt (as in Litecoin), N is Scrypt-N aka Adaptive N-factor (as in Vertcoin), and X is X11 (as in Darkcoin).

One service that doesn't have any suffix is scrypt.cc. It is unclear what exactly they use, nor is it relevant since the user/stakeholder is not in control of that.

I have also started tracking another hosted mining project: Scrypt-X, which is based on Scrypt ASICs and will attempt to reinvest part of its earnings into additional hashpower. It's only in the spreadsheet at the moment.

[suchmoon]

Charts have been updated for today. No major changes.

X11 seems to be where the money is right now. If you haven't ebayed your GPUs yet - check it out. Scrypt-N is doing quite well too.

[trc]

Yes. Yesterday I officially bid my farewell to scrypt and all scrypt coins. It's only gonna get worse, exponentially from now on.

[suchmoon]

Charts have been updated for today. No major changes.

[merc82]

Charts have been updated for today. No major changes.

TMB Scrypt had a bad day due to some doge wallet issues 60% orphans from the 8hrs of mining we did on doge. The issue has been resolved

Kudo's to this chart -- i check it religiously every day

[suchmoon]

Charts have been updated for today. No major changes.

TMB Scrypt had a bad day due to some doge wallet issues 60% orphans from the 8hrs of mining we did on doge. The issue has been resolved

Kudo's to this chart -- i check it religiously every day

Thanks, I didn't know about that issue. Despite the bump you're doing very well compared to the big dogs, after mining with the pool for a few weeks I can see there is a good effort going on. I appreciate that you have X11 and Scrypt-N covered too.

Thank you for your support.

[ingvarfervent]

suchmoon, hi. Why on Betarigs(X) y provide so cheap. Average price 0.0018-20 x 3 = 0.0054 and more, but you 0.0030-32. On Leaserig price norm.  

[suchmoon]

suchmoon, hi. Why on Betarigs(X) y provide so cheap. Average price 0.0018-20 x 3 = 0.0054 and more, but you 0.0030-32. On Leaserig price norm.  

As stated in the OP, I'm aiming at the lowest price, and the time when rig is not rented is not included in the calculation. So for example at this time lowest price is 0.17, if my rig would be available now I would set the price at 0.16, and even then it's not guaranteed to be rented out immediately. If it's not rented out for ~2 hours, this will reduce my daily earnings by ~8%. Also the price depends a lot on when one lease ends and the other one starts. It's 0.17 now and could be 0.12 or 0.25 when my current lease ends in ~10 hours from now. If I'm asleep when the lease ends I could be renting out my rig too cheap or it will sit unrented for a few hours. If it's rented for 3 days my earnings will be locked for that period even if the average rate triples, like what happened recently. Some of these factors can go both ways, i.e. I could get a better rate than average for a few days (see May 15-17).

tl;dr My strategy with Betarigs (and LeaseRig) is very lazy. You can and should do better

[suchmoon]

Sorry for the delay. Charts have been updated for today. No major changes.

[Mithril1977]

thanks for the constant updates suchmoon. I check this daily. You rock sir.

[Accordus]

As stated in the OP, I'm aiming at the lowest price, and the time when rig is not rented is not included in the calculation. So for example at this time lowest price is 0.17, if my rig would be available now I would set the price at 0.16, and even then it's not guaranteed to be rented out immediately. If it's not rented out for ~2 hours, this will reduce my daily earnings by ~8%. Also the price depends a lot on when one lease ends and the other one starts. It's 0.17 now and could be 0.12 or 0.25 when my current lease ends in ~10 hours from now. If I'm asleep when the lease ends I could be renting out my rig too cheap or it will sit unrented for a few hours. If it's rented for 3 days my earnings will be locked for that period even if the average rate triples, like what happened recently. Some of these factors can go both ways, i.e. I could get a better rate than average for a few days (see May 15-17).

tl;dr My strategy with Betarigs (and LeaseRig) is very lazy. You can and should do better

I made a cute little script to read all the prices of all the available rigs and adjusts each of my terms to be 3% lower of the cheapest.
Still this did not give the best result because it seemed like some of the other people did this very same thing and we went to a very stupid price war while no ANY rent have happened for hours anyway.
Also, renters do not only choose based on price of the terms. It is very time consuming to check all the prices for all the rigs for all terms and chose the cheapest with desired rig speed at the same time. Sometimes they chose the topmost rig and just rent the desired term falsely thinking topmost position means cheapest prices for all terms.
Leaserig is a very tricky business and the operator does not seem to go into the problems of creating better tools for renters to evaluate options.
Luck is a big part on Leaserig.

Suchmoon> Why do you not include your default pool earnings of unrented times in this LR data? Everybody else would add in that value anyway. You seem like trying to model a situation (pure rent) which would never happen anyway.