[RESURRECTION] Taking Beecoin to the Hive Flying!MANDATORY Client Update!

[bluejean]

1. My vote for algo is still Blake256 + POS....if X11 + POS wins in voting then that's what it should be.

2. I've seen the block tax amount go from 4-5% to 10-12% since it was first mentioned. I'm all for a block tax to help pay for coin development going forward but 10-12% is too high in my opinion. I think 6-7% is a nice middle ground with 3% to the dev (I think 2% is too low for Soopy's efforts). The other 3-4% would be used for any and all projects including games, faucets, charities, foundation projects, etc. We don't need to separate games and faucets from charity type projects. They can all come from the same bucket. I think the wallets for the dev and projects should be public and viewable by anyone. Of course Soopy can use any coins in the dev wallet for whatever he wants but the community should know how much is going to each.

A block with a 50,000 coin reward would mean 1500 Bees to the dev at 3% and 2000 bees to projects...leaving 46,500 bees for the miner(s)/Pool. A block with a 20,000 coin reward would mean 600 Bees to the dev and 800 Bees to projects...leaving 18,600 Bees for the miner(s)/Pool. There is still plenty of meat for the miner(s)/Pool after block taxes are taken. Even if block rewards are scaled back, there would still be a nice reward for each block solved. Also, POS would help to make up for the reward scale back.

Donations from the community, either to the dev or for projects are always welcome too. Donations can be made to the public dev wallet and the public project wallet.

3. Increasing the amount of coins is not a good idea in my opinion. It just devalues the coin and the value is low enough now. I think we should instead decrease the amount of block rewards by 25% and stretch out the mining duration until the total amount of coins are mined. POS will add to the total coinage anyway.

I think this can be done without a lot of fanfare. There's not a lot of attention being paid to Beecoin right now so decreasing the block reward should not raise a huge stink.

The original specs are:

PoW algorithm:Scrypt - This is changing
30 seconds block time - leave the same
Difficulty retargets every block - leave the same as it's better than KGW (which has had issues) or go with Digishield
Total coins supply 24 billions - leave the same
3 confirmations for transaction - leave the same
Support transaction message - leave the same...this is a nice feature that a lot of coins do not have in their wallets

Random block rewards
1-100,000: 0-200,000 BeeCoin Reward
100,001-200,000: 0-100,000 BeeCoin Reward
200,001-300,000: 0-50,000 BeeCoin Reward
300,001-400,000: 0-20,000 BeeCoin Reward ----------Not sure what block we're at but reduce by 25% and lengthen the mining term
400,001-500,000: 0-10,000 BeeCoin Reward
500,001-600,000: 0-5,000 BeeCoin Reward
600,000+:1,000 BeeCoin Reward

4. POS at 5% first year then 1% every year after that.

Just my opinion on all of this. I will go with whatever the community votes on.

[cryptohunter]

1. My vote for algo is still Blake256 + POS....if X11 + POS wins in voting then that's what it should be.

2. I've seen the block tax amount go from 4-5% to 10-12% since it was first mentioned. I'm all for a block tax to help pay for coin development going forward but 10-12% is too high in my opinion. I think 6-7% is a nice middle ground with 3% to the dev (I think 2% is too low for Soopy's efforts). The other 3-4% would be used for any and all projects including games, faucets, charities, foundation projects, etc. We don't need to separate games and faucets from charity type projects. They can all come from the same bucket. I think the wallets for the dev and projects should be public and viewable by anyone. Of course Soopy can use any coins in the dev wallet for whatever he wants but the community should know how much is going to each.

A block with a 50,000 coin reward would mean 1500 Bees to the dev at 3% and 2000 bees to projects...leaving 46,500 bees for the miner(s)/Pool. A block with a 20,000 coin reward would mean 600 Bees to the dev and 800 Bees to projects...leaving 18,600 Bees for the miner(s)/Pool. There is still plenty of meat for the miner(s)/Pool after block taxes are taken. Even if block rewards are scaled back, there would still be a nice reward for each block solved. Also, POS would help to make up for the reward scale back.

Donations from the community, either to the dev or for projects are always welcome too. Donations can be made to the public dev wallet and the public project wallet.

3. Increasing the amount of coins is not a good idea in my opinion. It just devalues the coin and the value is low enough now. I think we should instead decrease the amount of block rewards by 25% and stretch out the mining duration until the total amount of coins are mined. POS will add to the total coinage anyway.

I think this can be done without a lot of fanfare. There's not a lot of attention being paid to Beecoin right now so decreasing the block reward should not raise a huge stink.

The original specs are:

PoW algorithm:Scrypt - This is changing
30 seconds block time - leave the same
Difficulty retargets every block - leave the same as it's better than KGW (which has had issues) or go with Digishield
Total coins supply 24 billions - leave the same
3 confirmations for transaction - leave the same
Support transaction message - leave the same...this is a nice feature that a lot of coins do not have in their wallets

Random block rewards
1-100,000: 0-200,000 BeeCoin Reward
100,001-200,000: 0-100,000 BeeCoin Reward
200,001-300,000: 0-50,000 BeeCoin Reward
300,001-400,000: 0-20,000 BeeCoin Reward ----------Not sure what block we're at but reduce by 25% and lengthen the mining term
400,001-500,000: 0-10,000 BeeCoin Reward
500,001-600,000: 0-5,000 BeeCoin Reward
600,000+:1,000 BeeCoin Reward

4. POS at 5% first year then 1% every year after that.

Just my opinion on all of this. I will go with whatever the community votes on.

Ok cool .... so

algo - which ever one wins poll

retarget

digi shield or dgw? which every you all want.

block tax

2% dev
2% development pot
2% bees fund?  what about the bees? i think this part is important.

stay at 24B - but perhaps make the rewards not random because can be exploited

POS - 5% first year then 1 %?    - this will make the minting quite a lot more i hope you guys realise that... so if you want to keep totaly minting near 24B and not dilute your holdings then the block rewards will have to be reduced slightly... or just go with 1% POS from the start.

Looks like some want block tax total under 10% ... how about 6%?

Would be good to have some funds for developments like casino , flappy bee game, other things in future.

Soopy is ready to start let's not hold him back .... say a specific thing you want changed from this if you really are not happy.

[bluejean]

I was including the "saving the bees" fund in the same project wallet as all other projects if that's possible.

[GREEDYJOHN]

1. My vote for algo is still Blake256 + POS....if X11 + POS wins in voting then that's what it should be.

2. I've seen the block tax amount go from 4-5% to 10-12% since it was first mentioned. I'm all for a block tax to help pay for coin development going forward but 10-12% is too high in my opinion. I think 6-7% is a nice middle ground with 3% to the dev (I think 2% is too low for Soopy's efforts). The other 3-4% would be used for any and all projects including games, faucets, charities, foundation projects, etc. We don't need to separate games and faucets from charity type projects. They can all come from the same bucket. I think the wallets for the dev and projects should be public and viewable by anyone. Of course Soopy can use any coins in the dev wallet for whatever he wants but the community should know how much is going to each.

A block with a 50,000 coin reward would mean 1500 Bees to the dev at 3% and 2000 bees to projects...leaving 46,500 bees for the miner(s)/Pool. A block with a 20,000 coin reward would mean 600 Bees to the dev and 800 Bees to projects...leaving 18,600 Bees for the miner(s)/Pool. There is still plenty of meat for the miner(s)/Pool after block taxes are taken. Even if block rewards are scaled back, there would still be a nice reward for each block solved. Also, POS would help to make up for the reward scale back.

Donations from the community, either to the dev or for projects are always welcome too. Donations can be made to the public dev wallet and the public project wallet.

3. Increasing the amount of coins is not a good idea in my opinion. It just devalues the coin and the value is low enough now. I think we should instead decrease the amount of block rewards by 25% and stretch out the mining duration until the total amount of coins are mined. POS will add to the total coinage anyway.

I think this can be done without a lot of fanfare. There's not a lot of attention being paid to Beecoin right now so decreasing the block reward should not raise a huge stink.

The original specs are:

PoW algorithm:Scrypt - This is changing
30 seconds block time - leave the same
Difficulty retargets every block - leave the same as it's better than KGW (which has had issues) or go with Digishield
Total coins supply 24 billions - leave the same
3 confirmations for transaction - leave the same
Support transaction message - leave the same...this is a nice feature that a lot of coins do not have in their wallets

Random block rewards
1-100,000: 0-200,000 BeeCoin Reward
100,001-200,000: 0-100,000 BeeCoin Reward
200,001-300,000: 0-50,000 BeeCoin Reward
300,001-400,000: 0-20,000 BeeCoin Reward ----------Not sure what block we're at but reduce by 25% and lengthen the mining term
400,001-500,000: 0-10,000 BeeCoin Reward
500,001-600,000: 0-5,000 BeeCoin Reward
600,000+:1,000 BeeCoin Reward

4. POS at 5% first year then 1% every year after that.

Just my opinion on all of this. I will go with whatever the community votes on.

Ok cool .... so

algo - which ever one wins poll

retarget

digi shield or dgw? which every you all want.

block tax

2% dev
2% development pot
2% bees fund?  what about the bees? i think this part is important.

stay at 24B - but perhaps make the rewards not random because can be exploited

POS - 5% first year then 1 %?    - this will make the minting quite a lot more i hope you guys realise that... so if you want to keep totaly minting near 24B and not dilute your holdings then the block rewards will have to be reduced slightly... or just go with 1% POS from the start.

Looks like some want block tax total under 10% ... how about 6%?

Would be good to have some funds for developments like casino , flappy bee game, other things in future.

Soopy is ready to start let's not hold him back .... say a specific thing you want changed from this if you really are not happy.

That is fine, I only wanted coin increases to fund gambling games that will make beecoin notorious. Coins have to be notorious to stick out from the crowd - this is why we have some coins with market caps at $50,000, $200,000 while some are at $500,000, 1,500,000, $5,000,000, or even up to $20,000,000.

Beecoin must have notorious feature to survive competition - people must want it, people want things that they can get for free, hence a slightly increased coinage to fund gambling games will do much benefit.

I realise that POS compound interest could take total coinage beyond 24bn.

This is fine, but I only wanted some giveaways in the form of gambling games, to make beecoin more interactive and to secure the network when POS kicks in and mining drops. Gambling games will force people to use the qt client, if they really want free BEES.

[GREEDYJOHN]

I agree with the POS figures, as POS may cause coinage to slightly exceed 24bn in the distant future.

However, BEECOIN needs features to make it an expensive high demand coin - people must really want beecoin - this is where the gambling game concept becomes useful.

A teenager on a train, or an office worker will be attracted to beecoin, if they discover that they can earn a few bees by merely downloading the wallet and playing games.

I wanted a game reservoir to be funded from the block tax, that will in turn work as a large faucet to reward gamers, instead of giving them coins for free.

Jealous miners can also play games to earn the coins back, while their rigs are also mining coins.

People on this forum do not understand - My reason for advocating for slightly increased coinage is to fund games that will create a magnetic attraction of the masses to beecoin.

We do not want beecoin to be stuck at $20,000 or $200,000 market cap, rather we should aim to reach $5,000,000 to $20,000,000, even to exceed blackcoin and whitecoin.

I feel that mere x11 plus POS will not take us far beyond $200,000, unless we are lucky.

WE NEED SPECIAL FEATURES TO SUCCEED.

[steady3d]

x11 pos is ok for me.

and for block tax 5% total is really the max.
2% for the dev himself.
and the 3 left for saving bees and marketing. 1.5 and 1.5 or 2 and 1...

no need to tax for funding gambling, if someone want to setup a gambling site he have to fund it himself. like i do.


and eventually we can increase coin supply (per block) by tax rate.

bye.

[bluejean]

Like I said, donations from the community are more than welcome also. I will gladly start with a 10 million bee donation to be used explicitly for game and gambling development.

[GREEDYJOHN]

x11 pos is ok for me.

and for block tax 5% total is really the max.
2% for the dev himself.
and the 3 left for saving bees and marketing. 1.5 and 1.5 or 2 and 1...

no need to tax for funding gambling, if someone want to setup a gambling site he have to fund it himself. like i do.


and eventually we can increase coin supply (per block) by tax rate.

bye.

Did you read through my post? I only suggest the gambling option to make the coin popular, so that it can achieve a high market cap. There are a lot of coins that always fall below $200,000 market cap, because they do not appeal to the masses. GAMES AND GAMBLING are just a marketing tool.

[GREEDYJOHN]

Like I said, donations from the community are more than welcome also. I will gladly start with a 10 million bee donation to be used explicitly for game and gambling development.

When the proverbial "sh*t hits the fan", nobody will be donating BEES for anything, because of POS gains. It is good to get the bees from the block tax.
I simply suggest slightly increasing coinage, so that the tax for all projects will come from this increment, not from the original 24bn. WITH GAMES AND GAMBLING, miners could be able to retrieve some coins back.

My ideas are imaginary, soopy will make final decision.

[bluejean]

x11 pos is ok for me.

and for block tax 5% total is really the max.
2% for the dev himself.
and the 3 left for saving bees and marketing. 1.5 and 1.5 or 2 and 1...

no need to tax for funding gambling, if someone want to setup a gambling site he have to fund it himself. like i do.


and eventually we can increase coin supply (per block) by tax rate.

bye.

Did you read through my post? I only suggest the gambling option to make the coin popular, so that it can achieve a high market cap. There are a lot of coins that always fall below $200,000 market cap, because they do not appeal to the masses. GAMES AND GAMBLING are just a marketing tool.

Actually, I did read through your post John and I do understand what you are saying about funding the game and gambling activities without touching the 24 billion original Bees...over half of which have been mined so those wouldn't be affected by this anyway. I was simply suggesting that the community could help out with some donations to fund this. I don't like the idea of changing the total amount of coins mined. This could give potential Beecoin investors the idea that the amount of coins can be changed at any time to suit any need we may have.

Inflating the currency for any reason is opposite to what crypto is all about imho.  I think 24 billion is too many...but that's just me. It is what it is and shouldn't be decreased either. Miners and investors that are still involved in mining and purchasing Beecoin are doing so knowing there won't be any more than 24 billion mined. POS will be the only inflationary component to Beecoin if implemented. It will also help to secure the blockchain with a lot of wallets staying open for staking so it has another purpose.

I would rather see a little higher block tax (3% dev, 5-7% for everything else) to help support the gaming and gambling aspect than to have the total coinage increased. I agree that Beecoin needs something to make it stand out amongst all the other coins out there and gaming/gambling does attract people by the boatload. We also need to make people aware in a big way that bees and other pollinators such as butterflies, etc are responsible for at least 1/3 of the entire world's food supply. Their decline over the last couple of decades has already caused shortages which in turn cause higher prices for those foods at the grocery. This in itself should be something everyone could get behind if marketed properly to the crypto community.

I really am not too worried about POS all of a sudden causing everyone to hold their Bees and not spend them. If no one is going to spend any Bees, why have any games at all?

[cryptohunter]

x11 pos is ok for me.

and for block tax 5% total is really the max.
2% for the dev himself.
and the 3 left for saving bees and marketing. 1.5 and 1.5 or 2 and 1...

no need to tax for funding gambling, if someone want to setup a gambling site he have to fund it himself. like i do.


and eventually we can increase coin supply (per block) by tax rate.

bye.

Did you read through my post? I only suggest the gambling option to make the coin popular, so that it can achieve a high market cap. There are a lot of coins that always fall below $200,000 market cap, because they do not appeal to the masses. GAMES AND GAMBLING are just a marketing tool.

Actually, I did read through your post John and I do understand what you are saying about funding the game and gambling activities without touching the 24 billion original Bees...over half of which have been mined so those wouldn't be affected by this anyway. I was simply suggesting that the community could help out with some donations to fund this. I don't like the idea of changing the total amount of coins mined. This could give potential Beecoin investors the idea that the amount of coins can be changed at any time to suit any need we may have.

Inflating the currency for any reason is opposite to what crypto is all about imho.  I think 24 billion is too many...but that's just me. It is what it is and shouldn't be decreased either. Miners and investors that are still involved in mining and purchasing Beecoin are doing so knowing there won't be any more than 24 billion mined. POS will be the only inflationary component to Beecoin if implemented. It will also help to secure the blockchain with a lot of wallets staying open for staking so it has another purpose.

I would rather see a little higher block tax (3% dev, 5-7% for everything else) to help support the gaming and gambling aspect than to have the total coinage increased. I agree that Beecoin needs something to make it stand out amongst all the other coins out there and gaming/gambling does attract people by the boatload. We also need to make people aware in a big way that bees and other pollinators such as butterflies, etc are responsible for at least 1/3 of the entire world's food supply. Their decline over the last couple of decades has already caused shortages which in turn cause higher prices for those foods at the grocery. This in itself should be something everyone could get behind if marketed properly to the crypto community.

I really am not too worried about POS all of a sudden causing everyone to hold their Bees and not spend them. If no one is going to spend any Bees, why have any games at all?

Yeah not sure  POS will cause anyone to hold coins, 5% OR 50% pos per year does not matter to traders, these coins go up 200% in hours or days so they will be traded on spikes and dips as usual. People holding coins for staking thinking this is a good idea with regards making financial gain obviously don't know about trading.

I think keep final minting the same at 24BN because yes changing things can result it critical comments. Just a small POS will work to add security, let's keep it to a small % to hold back inflation. A game in the wallet later that did result in people being about to win beecoins would be great to get people having their wallets open. However that is something to discuss after the algo change so we can get on wit that.

I don't mind at all about the block tax... however there should be wallets for all 3 things

1. devs own wallet
2. project wallet for games, whatever
3. bees wallet for donations for bee saving causes.

so there is no confusing how many bee coins each has.


Soopy is ready to go so lets not hold him up further.

[bluejean]

It sounds like all that is left is deciding how to break down the block tax.

2% - 2% - 2%

With approx. 10 billion Bees left to be mined that would be 200 million per wallet.

I think Soopy should get more, but this can be made up with donations from the community directly to him.

[cryptohunter]

It sounds like all that is left is deciding how to break down the block tax.

2% - 2% - 2%

With approx. 10 billion Bees left to be mined that would be 200 million per wallet.

I think Soopy should get more, but this can be made up with donations from the community directly to him.

we could do something radical and ..

accelerate the minting a bit and send beecoin  POS like blackcoin and whitecoin?

we have 10BN bees left to mine.


put blocks back up to 200k fixed for 25k blocks then it's essentially over for POW  reduce reward to just 2 beecoins per block so it can still be POW mined to keep the chain more secure but really not worth mining.

then the POS starts and we have 5BN for POS ........ 2% Per year just leave it at that. Staking will have to be very frequently to keep the chain going like black coin.

Then we get a multi pool going like black coin to keep some buying demand for the coin.


?

Radical idea i know, but actually we get to move to POS faster and 25k blocks is a few weeks for everyone to have another start at the coin. We have been only getting 50k per block these last 41k blocks so it will give people a chance to get back into beecoin with some big block rewards now too.

This way we don't even have to risking swapping algo... in a week or two all POW blocks would be gone and we are mostly on POS. So scrypt asics won't matter.

[bluejean]

Intriguing...Blackcoin has turned out highly successful after POW phase is over and now strictly in POS and Whitecoin is trying to model the same and is doing ok trading at 1500+ satoshis. If we did this and cut off mining after 5 billion more coins, then we'd have to double the block tax to 4% - 4% - 4% to keep the amounts funded to each wallet the same.

[GREEDYJOHN]

Intriguing...Blackcoin has turned out highly successful after POW phase is over and now strictly in POS and Whitecoin is trying to model the same and is doing ok trading at 1500+ satoshis. If we did this and cut off mining after 5 billion more coins, then we'd have to double the block tax to 4% - 4% - 4% to keep the amounts funded to each wallet the same.

This is why I was advocating for a slightly increased mintage, of about 3 - 6bn, so that all of this increment can fund projects and games. Time is running out, people who need lots of coins should have already earned them by now.

We need to spread beecoin to the public, I mean THE REAL PUBLIC, so that it can be really wanted and valued. Block tax is necessary, because people may not have enough bees to physically donate.

The game concept is just a marketing survival strategy, to make people use the qt client more often - we really want people to believe that they can earn a few bucks a day by playing games, instead of receiving them at giveaway faucets. This is an easy way to make beecoin attractive to the public.

The games will act as a MASSIVE FAUCET, open to miners, non miners - EVERYBODY!

BEECOIN MUST APPEAL TO THE PUBLIC!

[GREEDYJOHN]

Intriguing...Blackcoin has turned out highly successful after POW phase is over and now strictly in POS and Whitecoin is trying to model the same and is doing ok trading at 1500+ satoshis. If we did this and cut off mining after 5 billion more coins, then we'd have to double the block tax to 4% - 4% - 4% to keep the amounts funded to each wallet the same.

We could have already minted 14bn, so stretching this coin to 27 -30bn in an attempt to fund projects and games is a very good idea.

People will not physically see this amount, but rather the useful amount of coins will be around 20bn, the other 7 -10bn (if my idea works) will be for POS, SCARCE MINTING, GAMBLING - this is the point of fierce competition between gamblers and miners to keep beecoin alive.

We need to keep beecoin alive after POS, or it could become a forgotten coin, please remember that many coins are still springing up.

POPULARITY and MARKETING are the issues here, not coin dilution or devaluation

[GREEDYJOHN]

If we finally have a total mintage of 30bn, do you know that we may not even physically get to the 20bn point this year! Do you know that POS compound interest  and final block rewards will consume more than 6bn coins? This amount will never really be seen.

Just like bitcoin that has total coinage of 21m, but is still stuck at 12 - 13m, may not get to 14m this year.

Realistically, with 30bn max coinage, we need to do all the work before approaching 20bn coinage, because the other 10bn will be a battle.

This is where games and gambling become useful - as miners, gamers and investors begin to scramble for the GAMBLING RESERVIOR, that typically pays out 1 BEE per wallet per day (just an imaginary figure to emphasise fierce competition and future scarcity of beecoin)

[ozycash]

i for one am getting tired of a lot of coins using hard forks, that means constantly downloading full blockchains all the time, why cant the updated programs contain block data or why cant new versions just over write with the latest version and leave everything else alone?
maybe some body needs to rewrite the whole qt. just think what is going to happen in years to come, nobody will join a coin as it will take forever to update, many current members will leave due to constantly having to reload everything, only a few people will be left and the coin will be worth nothing!
forget about adding new things or spreading the word etc make a qt so it works and updates without having to go through a load of waiting and starting from scratch every month or two!
having the best qt will get more people using the coin than having the prettiest picture or fastest block or advertising etc, word of mouth is cheaper and more powerful than wasting time on advertising!

[cryptohunter]

Intriguing...Blackcoin has turned out highly successful after POW phase is over and now strictly in POS and Whitecoin is trying to model the same and is doing ok trading at 1500+ satoshis. If we did this and cut off mining after 5 billion more coins, then we'd have to double the block tax to 4% - 4% - 4% to keep the amounts funded to each wallet the same.

that is true, i don't think that is an issue. Could be done.

1. new interest since blocks would now be double what they were even at the start.

2. quickly on to POS , no need to change algo

By then end of the POW for beecoin have the multipool ready so we can put miners straight on to that keep momentum going.


Of course this is a radical change and everyone needs to absorb this idea... if not we just go ahead with the x11 pos idea as before.

[GREEDYJOHN]

Intriguing...Blackcoin has turned out highly successful after POW phase is over and now strictly in POS and Whitecoin is trying to model the same and is doing ok trading at 1500+ satoshis. If we did this and cut off mining after 5 billion more coins, then we'd have to double the block tax to 4% - 4% - 4% to keep the amounts funded to each wallet the same.

that is true, i don't think that is an issue. Could be done.

1. new interest since blocks would now be double what they were even at the start.

2. quickly on to POS , no need to change algo

By then end of the POW for beecoin have the multipool ready so we can put miners straight on to that keep momentum going.


Of course this is a radical change and everyone needs to absorb this idea... if not we just go ahead with the x11 pos idea as before.

If coinage is increased to 30bn, we will really only see about 20bn. Block tax needs to be implemented fast, block tax is the real issue.

We need 2% DEV, 6% games faucet, 2% BEES, 2% PROJECTS.

This is what I want, if possible. I even want much more to go to gambling games faucet - this could be a large faucet, where members have to play a particular game (a very simple game), to earn very few bees, once every day.