[ANN] Maieuticoin | 2014% PoS | 10k/MMXIV and BALLS/MMXIV Markets NOW OPEN

[Mortimer452]

Thank goodness for #LongestShiftEverOver and #BiggestPayoutEver  LOL

[1714065706]

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[corsaro]

@the multipool owner:

ask price now is 0.01300000 on bittrex,
but bid price is much lower @ 0.00650011

This will create a lot of fluctuations in price, when some persons will go to sell their MMXIV...

I think it could be better, not to post all these BUY orders when exchanging BTC for MMXIV, but to post some SELL orders too, so to allow bid price to go up...

Probably it could be good to make 50% for immediate BUY and an other 50% to be put on SELL orders, so to allow BID price going up

[Phosphorous]

@the multipool owner:

ask price now is 0.01300000 on bittrex,
but bid price is much lower @ 0.00650011

This will create a lot of fluctuations in price, when some persons will go to sell their MMXIV...

I think it could be better, not to post all these BUY orders when exchanging BTC for MMXIV, but to post some SELL orders too, so to allow bid price to go up...

This does not make sense. More sell orders beget lower prices and reflect selling pressure which is bad for pricing. Plus the account does not (or should not) hold inventory. As I understand it, the coins we earn are sold for BTC and then used to buy MMXIV. To hold any of it back would be to deprive the miners of their earnings.

[corsaro]

@the multipool owner:

ask price now is 0.01300000 on bittrex,
but bid price is much lower @ 0.00650011

This will create a lot of fluctuations in price, when some persons will go to sell their MMXIV...

I think it could be better, not to post all these BUY orders when exchanging BTC for MMXIV, but to post some SELL orders too, so to allow bid price to go up...

This does not make sense. More sell orders beget lower prices and reflect selling pressure which is bad for pricing.

it has no sense to have BID price @ 0.00650011 and ASK price @ 0.01300000

[Phosphorous]

@the multipool owner:

ask price now is 0.01300000 on bittrex,
but bid price is much lower @ 0.00650011

This will create a lot of fluctuations in price, when some persons will go to sell their MMXIV...

I think it could be better, not to post all these BUY orders when exchanging BTC for MMXIV, but to post some SELL orders too, so to allow bid price to go up...

This does not make sense. More sell orders beget lower prices and reflect selling pressure which is bad for pricing.

it has no sense to have BID price @ 0.00650011 and ASK price @ 0.01300000

Why not, that is the bid/ask spread. Low volume trading vehicles often have a wide spread.

[corsaro]

@the multipool owner:

ask price now is 0.01300000 on bittrex,
but bid price is much lower @ 0.00650011

This will create a lot of fluctuations in price, when some persons will go to sell their MMXIV...

I think it could be better, not to post all these BUY orders when exchanging BTC for MMXIV, but to post some SELL orders too, so to allow bid price to go up...

This does not make sense. More sell orders beget lower prices and reflect selling pressure which is bad for pricing.

it has no sense to have BID price @ 0.00650011 and ASK price @ 0.01300000

Why not, that is the bid/ask spread. Low volume trading vehicles often have a wide spread.

In my opinion, If some BTC are put in BUY orders, BID price will go up

[ThePeePs]

The "Ask Price" shown in the stats is the price when the shift closes.  I'm not sure why it was coded that way, but getting the stats like that (shares, shift share percentage, etc are accurate) to better reflect "real life" is on my todo list.

EDIT: When the MP does it's buys, it "walks" the sell book, starting at the lowest costing order, and moving on to the next until that algo runs out of BTC.


For example if there are 5 sell orders that look like this:

Ask (BTC)	Size (M)	Total (BTC)	Sum (BTC)
0.01435000	0.91818409	0.0132	0.0132
0.01439900	8.20565534	0.1182	0.1313
0.01440000	2.00000000	0.0288	0.1601
0.01489797	0.19466120	0.0029	0.1630
0.01499800	10.00000000	0.1500	0.3130

And SHA made 0.24 BTC, it would buy all of the first 4 orders, and part of the 5th.

I hope that makes things a bit clearer for you guys.

[MMXIV]

I think what he's saying is that instead of just buying into the sells, he is suggesting to put up Bids and wait for someone to sell

I see the advantage you see in this, here, but Phos is correct in his post, as well, and I think that idea trumps the waiting. If he was to put up Buys and wait for someone to sell, the pool would be holding funds from miners, resulting in misconstrued numbers and payouts. Even if you make more in the end, it wouldn't feel that way since the payouts would be staggered and hard to tell how much hash earned how much M. It would also screw up the pool's stats page, too, resulting in delayed, unfair (since not everything would be filled at once), or incomplete payments

I might be way off, but I think that's pretty accurate?

[Karn]

Did x11 make enough to get a pay out? Been a long time since I saw one (I'm only mining with 2 750ti's so I don't expect much)

[Phosphorous]

I think what he's saying is that instead of just buying into the sells, he is suggesting to put up Bids and wait for someone to sell

I see the advantage you see in this, here, but Phos is correct in his post, as well, and I think that idea trumps the waiting. If he was to put up Buys and wait for someone to sell, the pool would be holding funds from miners, resulting in misconstrued numbers and payouts. Even if you make more in the end, it wouldn't feel that way since the payouts would be staggered and hard to tell how much hash earned how much M. It would also screw up the pool's stats page, too, resulting in delayed, unfair (since not everything would be filled at once), or incomplete payments

I might be way off, but I think that's pretty accurate?

In addition to what you said, there is risk in waiting for an order fill and it may never happen and you don't know when it will happen. In the mean time, if the price of the coin really starts to move you can actually cost the miners if the price rises (and the converse would be true also), but what you would really be doing is gambling with the payout that has been rightfully earned before distributing it.

I didn't understand the original message as worded but now I understand. "but to post some SELL orders too" implies having an inventory of MMXIV coin that is sold, not posting a limit buy order (and wait for an order fill) as is what is now believe to have been intended.

[MMXIV]

I think what he's saying is that instead of just buying into the sells, he is suggesting to put up Bids and wait for someone to sell

I see the advantage you see in this, here, but Phos is correct in his post, as well, and I think that idea trumps the waiting. If he was to put up Buys and wait for someone to sell, the pool would be holding funds from miners, resulting in misconstrued numbers and payouts. Even if you make more in the end, it wouldn't feel that way since the payouts would be staggered and hard to tell how much hash earned how much M. It would also screw up the pool's stats page, too, resulting in delayed, unfair (since not everything would be filled at once), or incomplete payments

I might be way off, but I think that's pretty accurate?

In addition to what you said, there is risk in waiting for an order fill and it may never happen and you don't know when it will happen. In the mean time, if the price of the coin really starts to move you can actually cost the miners if the price rises (and the converse would be true also), but what you would really be doing is gambling with the payout that has been rightfully earned before distributing it.

I didn't understand the original message as worded but now I understand. "but to post some SELL orders too" implies having an inventory of MMXIV coin that is sold, not posting a limit buy order (and wait for an order fill) as is what is now believe to have been intended.

Yes, that's also true. I, too, think he just worded it wrong and meant to build up the buy side. Good additional point, though, on how it can actually lose more coins than it gains, I didn't even think of that

[Mortimer452]

I agree that using at least some of the MP's funds to build up the buy list would probably be a good idea.

The spread on MMXIV has been hovering at or near 100% for weeks.  Meaning, the lowest sell price is 100% higher (double) the highest buy price.  I guarantee you bots are playing this spread every day.  Place an order at the top of the buy list for 0.006, as soon as it's filled, place a sell order for those same coins at 0.012, and take advantage of the MP buys every day to double your money.  Repeat over and over every day (well, not EVERY day, but I digress).

These bots will continue to fill the sell list as long as they're making money - and I'm sure they are perfectly content making 100% on every trade so as long as the buy price is 0.006 the sell price will always be 0.012

When the highest buy and lowest sell are closer - say, within 5% of each other - we will start seeing some real movement

[MMXIV]

I agree that using at least some of the MP's funds to build up the buy list would probably be a good idea.

The spread on MMXIV has been hovering at or near 100% for weeks.  Meaning, the lowest sell price is 100% higher (double) the highest buy price.  I guarantee you bots are playing this spread every day.  Place an order at the top of the buy list for 0.006, as soon as it's filled, place a sell order for those same coins at 0.012, and take advantage of the MP buys every day to double your money.  Repeat over and over every day (well, not EVERY day, but I digress).

These bots will continue to fill the sell list as long as they're making money - and I'm sure they are perfectly content making 100% on every trade so as long as the buy price is 0.006 the sell price will always be 0.012

When the highest buy and lowest sell are closer - say, within 5% of each other - we will start seeing some real movement

I'm not sure if it's the pools place to hedge other peoples money. You guys will have to talk to ThePeePs about that, but if it were me, I'm not sure how comfortable I would be doing that. He would just be opening himself up to a lot of FUD

[Phosphorous]

I'm not sure if it's the pools place to hedge other peoples money. You guys will have to talk to ThePeePs about that, but if it were me, I'm not sure how comfortable I would be doing that. He would just be opening himself up to a lot of FUD

I agree, it's a good concept and I'm all for maximizing earnings, but it complicates everything too much and increases FUD. Additionally, it removes buying pressure/demand.

[Mortimer452]

I agree that using at least some of the MP's funds to build up the buy list would probably be a good idea.

The spread on MMXIV has been hovering at or near 100% for weeks.  Meaning, the lowest sell price is 100% higher (double) the highest buy price.  I guarantee you bots are playing this spread every day.  Place an order at the top of the buy list for 0.006, as soon as it's filled, place a sell order for those same coins at 0.012, and take advantage of the MP buys every day to double your money.  Repeat over and over every day (well, not EVERY day, but I digress).

These bots will continue to fill the sell list as long as they're making money - and I'm sure they are perfectly content making 100% on every trade so as long as the buy price is 0.006 the sell price will always be 0.012

When the highest buy and lowest sell are closer - say, within 5% of each other - we will start seeing some real movement

I'm not sure if it's the pools place to hedge other peoples money. You guys will have to talk to ThePeePs about that, but if it were me, I'm not sure how comfortable I would be doing that. He would just be opening himself up to a lot of FUD

I agree, sounds good in theory but would be tough in practice.  I guess my point is - until there is more buy pressure, or a heckuva lot more hash on the multipool, the price of M is going to stay where it is now.

[Phosphorous]

I agree, sounds good in theory but would be tough in practice.  I guess my point is - until there is more buy pressure, or a heckuva lot more hash on the multipool, the price of M is going to stay where it is now.

Actually, the price of M is more likely to decline in proportion to the increase in supply of M (due to POS), according to classic economic theory, unless demand can be increased.

[MMXIV]

I agree, sounds good in theory but would be tough in practice.  I guess my point is - until there is more buy pressure, or a heckuva lot more hash on the multipool, the price of M is going to stay where it is now.

Actually, the price of M is more likely to decline in proportion to the increase in supply of M (due to POS), according to classic economic theory, unless demand can be increased.

We have only created another 53 coins since we switched to PoS. The last buy on the multipool was over 40 just for SHA alone, granted it was a very long shift, but the point still stands that the multipool very easily overpowers the amount created by PoS

[ThePeePs]

I agree, sounds good in theory but would be tough in practice.  I guess my point is - until there is more buy pressure, or a heckuva lot more hash on the multipool, the price of M is going to stay where it is now.

Actually, the price of M is more likely to decline in proportion to the increase in supply of M (due to POS), according to classic economic theory, unless demand can be increased.

We have only created another 53 coins since we switched to PoS. The last buy on the multipool was over 40 just for SHA alone, granted it was a very long shift, but the point still stands that the multipool very easily overpowers the amount created by PoS

Send your hash to the MP, and then Neal before Zod!

(sorry couldn't help my self)

[devvienuis]

Are there two MMXIV's? I'm confused now 

Devvie
twitter.com/devnullius

[Phosphorous]

I agree, sounds good in theory but would be tough in practice.  I guess my point is - until there is more buy pressure, or a heckuva lot more hash on the multipool, the price of M is going to stay where it is now.

Actually, the price of M is more likely to decline in proportion to the increase in supply of M (due to POS), according to classic economic theory, unless demand can be increased.

We have only created another 53 coins since we switched to PoS. The last buy on the multipool was over 40 just for SHA alone, granted it was a very long shift, but the point still stands that the multipool very easily overpowers the amount created by PoS

Right, but a year from now, if all else stays the same, your coins will be worth 2/3 what they are today in theory with a 50% stake, and that works out to roughly 3 new coins per day, right? At current rates, the demand from the pool works out to be maybe 2-3M coins per day (if you average the last couple of months). The problem is that the selling volume on Bittrex appears to be many times that, so additional demand is going to be needed just to maintain current valuation unless you can keep people from selling.