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[wayshegoes]

That's great Dean, see you in chat soon.

[PocketRocketsCasino]

Sites are back up now guys.
All investments should be refunded. Email me if there seems to be an issues and I'll look into that.

The flaw in the dice provably fair method has been fixed also.

I have not yet had time to refund all the players who may have lost due to the flaw (~4.6% of "lo" bets may be affected).
I will get this done tomorrow.

Dean

[wayshegoes]

Got everything back in full. Dean has quite literally worked non-stop since the issue happened and has made everything good.

[BitBOOM]

Thanks for making this right Dean.

[dooglus]

Got everything back in full. Dean has quite literally worked non-stop since the issue happened and has made everything good.

Has there been a statement about exactly what bets have been / are going to be rolled back?

What's the deal with the sjess account? Is he just out of luck?

[dooglus]

Appears to be the case which is 100% bullshit.

It's a tough call.

Suppose you accidentally run a roulette game where 60% of the numbers are red due to a manufacturing error.

Some guy notices and plays for 15 hours non-stop, betting on red over and over, and wins a bunch.

Are you obliged to honour all his bets, even after he openly admits "I saw there were more reds than blacks, so I bet on red a lot"?

I don't know the answer.

I do think it makes sense to refund the people who bet on black and lost due to the error, but it's less clear what to do about people who won a bunch on red. Some of them didn't even notice the error and were just playing 'red' because they like red, but others were clearly playing because they saw they have a positive expectation.

I guess the right thing would be to pay him out, and take the hit. Whether to pass that on to investors or not is a separate question.

[FastBluff]

Appears to be the case which is 100% bullshit.

It's a tough call.

Suppose you accidentally run a roulette game where 60% of the numbers are red due to a manufacturing error.

Some guy notices and plays for 15 hours non-stop, betting on red over and over, and wins a bunch.

Are you obliged to honour all his bets, even after he openly admits "I saw there were more reds than blacks, so I bet on red a lot"?

I don't know the answer.

I do think it makes sense to refund the people who bet on black and lost due to the error, but it's less clear what to do about people who won a bunch on red. Some of them didn't even notice the error and were just playing 'red' because they like red, but others were clearly playing because they saw they have a positive expectation.

I guess the right thing would be to pay him out, and take the hit. Whether to pass that on to investors or not is a separate question.

I would honor those bets, it is the right thing to do. He had advantage but not cheating, since it would be my error.

[superbit]

It is the right thing to do definitely from a PR stand point, but I wouldn't take it from the investors.  In the Dooglus example if you are going to refund the users that bet on black because they did not notice, then you need to refund the investors that bet on black +1% too, because they weren't given the advertised odds either.

Offer to pay Sjess by giving him 50% of the weekly commission until paid off and move on.

[Stunna]

Appears to be the case which is 100% bullshit.

It's a tough call.

Suppose you accidentally run a roulette game where 60% of the numbers are red due to a manufacturing error.

Some guy notices and plays for 15 hours non-stop, betting on red over and over, and wins a bunch.

Are you obliged to honour all his bets, even after he openly admits "I saw there were more reds than blacks, so I bet on red a lot"?

I don't know the answer.

I do think it makes sense to refund the people who bet on black and lost due to the error, but it's less clear what to do about people who won a bunch on red. Some of them didn't even notice the error and were just playing 'red' because they like red, but others were clearly playing because they saw they have a positive expectation.

I guess the right thing would be to pay him out, and take the hit. Whether to pass that on to investors or not is a separate question.

It's a difficult situation indeed. Assuming the player had no idea they were abusing the site then the proper thing to do would be not to punish said user. As far as passing off the burden to investors, this sort of thing needs to be clarified at time of investment. If there is some sort of terms and conditions/FAQ for investment that specifically states that investors would take the hit, then it would be just.

[sherbyspark]

Sjess knew about the flaw and admitted knowing it.
The Funny part is that despite it being obvious that bets willbe/were rolled back, sjess has not asked for his winnings. He seems least worried about the coins. 

[sherbyspark]

Appears to be the case which is 100% bullshit.

It's a tough call.

Suppose you accidentally run a roulette game where 60% of the numbers are red due to a manufacturing error.

Some guy notices and plays for 15 hours non-stop, betting on red over and over, and wins a bunch.

Are you obliged to honour all his bets, even after he openly admits "I saw there were more reds than blacks, so I bet on red a lot"?

I don't know the answer.

I do think it makes sense to refund the people who bet on black and lost due to the error, but it's less clear what to do about people who won a bunch on red. Some of them didn't even notice the error and were just playing 'red' because they like red, but others were clearly playing because they saw they have a positive expectation.

I guess the right thing would be to pay him out, and take the hit. Whether to pass that on to investors or not is a separate question.

It's a difficult situation indeed. Assuming the player had no idea they were abusing the site then the proper thing to do would be not to punish said user. As far as passing off the burden to investors, this sort of thing needs to be clarified at time of investment. If there is some sort of terms and conditions/FAQ for investment that specifically states that investors would take the hit, then it would be just.

When someone invests in such ventures. They are investing in the house(said clearly during investing). So, I believe if house has to take any hit due a mistake, then investors have to accept it too. Since majority of the people in chat are investors, the decision was probably taken to roll back the bets. Its not right, but not wrong either since he knew about the flaw.

[yhomega]

Thanks dean for the work.
Any wallet to send a tip?

[dooglus]

[...] possible ways to recoup funds later for investors such as SatoshiCarnival is doing.

I missed that one. What's the story there? Did they get exploited too somehow?

[wayshegoes]

I can't remember where I read it specifically, but they were exploited and plan to pay investors back over time from their commission.

Dean is probably still in bed after the fuck up yesterday but everything on PRC seems to be business as usual. Fair play Dean for sorting everything so fast.

[shitaifan2013]

any updates when it will be back and running?

Hi, I'm just going through and looking at bets that need refunded. It's going to take a bit of time to make sure everything is 100% correct but hopefully not too much longer.

hi dean!

after finishing your investigation, could you give us a summary of that dice incident prior to this one?

some user mentioned it in the trollbox, saying there was a another flaw some months ago related to some outsourced dice code.

he also emphasized that you personally reimbursed investors, just in case someone feels I'm trying to spread FUD 

*bumpy bump*  just to make sure that the question won't be missed.

[shitaifan2013]

[...] possible ways to recoup funds later for investors such as SatoshiCarnival is doing.

I missed that one. What's the story there? Did they get exploited too somehow?

here you go: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=619499.msg7551497#msg7551497

[dooglus]

here you go: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=619499.msg7551497#msg7551497

Thanks.

Turns out I had heard about it before but hadn't heard the details.

It's surprising how many ways there are of copying JD wrongly

[shitaifan2013]

here you go: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=619499.msg7551497#msg7551497

Thanks.

Turns out I had heard about it before but hadn't heard the details.

It's surprising how many ways there are of copying JD wrongly

yeah, sad but true.

looks like you have no other choice than to get back into the pit to safe us all  *pretty please*

[PocketRocketsCasino]

here you go: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=619499.msg7551497#msg7551497

Thanks.

Turns out I had heard about it before but hadn't heard the details.

It's surprising how many ways there are of copying JD wrongly

The provably fair code, as some know, was the only part of the site I outsourced. To a trusted developer I knew who I was hoping to bring in full time to help out. Reviewed by another developer I thought I could trust who was also going to be joining full time.  

It was actually on my list of things to review over the next few days as I wanted to get provably fair working for Blackjack.  

So yes, I could have done more tests on this and not just rely on the word of what was to be my "team" but it's certainly not something that would have went on for months unnoticed as some suggest in the chat.

Lessons learned. People who lost unfairly are being refunded and things are back to normal.

Will post a more detailed report after I do the final refunds.

[FastBluff]

here you go: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=619499.msg7551497#msg7551497

Thanks.

Turns out I had heard about it before but hadn't heard the details.

It's surprising how many ways there are of copying JD wrongly

The provably fair code, as some know, was the only part of the site I outsourced. To a trusted developer I knew who I was hoping to bring in full time to help out. Reviewed by another developer I thought I could trust who was also going to be joining full time.  

It was actually on my list of things to review over the next few days as I wanted to get provably fair working for Blackjack.  

So yes, I could have done more tests on this and not just rely on the word of what was to be my "team" but it's certainly not something that would have went on for months unnoticed as some suggest in the chat.

Lessons learned. People who lost unfairly are being refunded and things are back to normal.

Will post a more detailed report after I do the final refunds.

Can you name those developers so we can avoid them as a community? They are clearly not qualified to be working in this area of programming.