[ANN] SpreadCoin | True Decentralization (No Pools) | Testing New Masternodes

[catotune]

I think you might have this backwards my friend. Having a fixed limit on MNs will ensure that only the richest can play. With DRK, sure the price isn't cheap - at today's prices it's about $1,680 for a MN - but you don't have to be continuously richer and richer to compete. Once you're in, you're in.

With 1000 fixed SPR MNs, you can bet a few rich people will own the majority. And once they're entrenched, they will be harder to dislodge, because they will keep receiving more MN income than anyone. Plus, if I'm right about the price, SPR in 6 months will be worth a lot more than it is today, and it will be even harder to get a spot in the top 1000 with each passing day, heavily favoring early adopters.

Having said all of that, I don't think anyone can know for sure what will happen. A part of me wants to see the variable price / fixed number MN system in the wild, despite my misgivings. I might just invest in 1 MN and make sure its balance stays high enough to stay in the game.

There is a famous saying:

If you are camping and a bear attacks the camp, you don't have to be faster than the bear, you just have to be faster than the slowest camper.

The slowest camper is the weakest MN.
The bear is the newcomer.
All the other campers stay in the game, to see another day of profits.

Let that sink in for a second, because that's the basic principle why it will always be easy to secure your MN if you aren't greedy and have foresight.
And it will always be possible for newcomers to enter the market, because there will always be a slow greedy camper who ate too many sausages. ;-)
In this case it's in our favour that we are a greedy species, lol!

I can see your cartoonist mind at work in every post (looking forward to seeing an animated rendition of the angry bear eating the slowest camper to explain SPR masternodes  )!

The problem is that whales aren't just a guy who can run a little faster than you - they have millions of dollars. They can fill up a thousand spots and easily keep the average guy from getting even a single seat at the table. If the Winklevoss twins find out about SPR, they aren't going to get in a bidding war against you 1 SPR at a time for a masternode. They will make sure out of the gate that you have no chance.

But hey, maybe that will work itself out... If it gets too expensive for an average guy to own a masternode, at least that means the SPR we do own will be worth a lot more. The downside is centralization for a few very rich MN owners; the upside is less network traffic and a very valuable coin.

[e1ghtSpace]

You guys are all forgetting that there is only around 1M spr in the wild. Which means having 1k masternodes means that (if all coins are used as DM's) they will all have 1k spr each.
It seems pretty fair to me.

[georgem]

There is a famous saying:

If you are camping and a bear attacks the camp, you don't have to be faster than the bear, you just have to be faster than the slowest camper.

The slowest camper is the weakest MN.
The bear is the newcomer.
All the other campers stay in the game, to see another day of profits.

Let that sink in for a second, because that's the basic principle why it will always be easy to secure your MN if you aren't greedy and have foresight.
And it will always be possible for newcomers to enter the market, because there will always be a slow greedy camper who ate too many sausages. ;-)
In this case it's in our favour that we are a greedy species, lol!

I can see your cartoonist mind at work in every post (looking forward to seeing an animated rendition of the angry bear eating the slowest camper to explain SPR masternodes  )!

The problem is that whales aren't just a guy who can run a little faster than you - they have millions of dollars. They can fill up a thousand spots and easily keep the average guy from getting even a single seat at the table. If the Winklevoss twins find out about SPR, they aren't going to get in a bidding war against you 1 SPR at a time for a masternode. They will make sure out of the gate that you have no chance.

But hey, maybe that will work itself out... If it gets too expensive for an average guy to own a masternode, at least that means the SPR we do own will be worth a lot more. The downside is centralization for a few very rich MN owners; the upside is less network traffic and a very valuable coin.

Haha, I'll take that as a compliment. Yep I enjoy this colorfull language!

I understand your viewpoint.
What I think the speciality about all this is that if you want your MN to be secured you will need to pay so much money for it, that you can't possibly (NOT WITH ALL THE SPR THAT EXISTS) fill all the available MN seats.
As a millionaire you can create a lot of MNs alright. And drive the price up, sure.
But securing all those MNs by moving them to the RIGHT SIDE of the SPREAD? (where they enter a state of untouchability.)

Impossible.

So you will have to endure the newcomers who will constantly try (and succeed) to take your seats away!

[georgem]

Consider the following two situations:
1. You have started a DarkCoin masternode, there were 800 masternodes at that time so you were receiving reward every 500 blocks. After some time there are 1600 masternodes and you receive reward 2x less frequently, to receive the same income you will now need to start another masternode and invest another 1000 DRK. Other people starting masternodes will affect you even if there is no limit on number of masternodes.
2. Imagine DarkCoin has a limit of 2000 masternodes and market-determined deposit amount. You are afraid that this mechanism will make it too expensive to run a masternode but instead it would make it cheaper than 1000 DRK in current situation since there are only 1777 masternodes.

1.Good point, at some point they start eating each others lunch...

Greedy bastards.

Just kidding.

2. Totally true, they shoot themselves in the foot with this.

[Mr. Spread]

What georgem says is true, there will be not enough spreadcoins.

Do you afraid that someone will start tens of thousands of DarkCon masternodes to just outnumber everyone else and receive 90% of rewards? This is simply not possible because there are not enough darkcoins.

[e1ghtSpace]

What georgem says is true, there will be not enough spreadcoins.

Do you afraid that someone will start tens of thousands of DarkCon masternodes to just outnumber everyone else and receive 90% of rewards? This is simply not possible because there are not enough darkcoins.

Mr. Spread, have you decided on the masternode limit yet?

[georgem]

What georgem says is true, there will be not enough spreadcoins.

Do you afraid that someone will start tens of thousands of DarkCon masternodes to just outnumber everyone else and receive 90% of rewards? This is simply not possible because there are not enough darkcoins.

Mr. Spread, have you decided on the masternode limit yet?

When deciding the max amount of MN we need to take into consideration the max amount of coins that will ever be mined: 20 million coins, because that's where we will naturally get the UPPER LIMIT for the max deposit per MN from. We don't have to set the max amount per deposit, much like we don't have to set a min amount per deposit. If we have 20 million coins, and 1000 MNs, this means the max will be 20k SPR.

Mr.Spread how accurate is the final coinsupply? Will it be "about" 20 million, maybe even 21?

[Mr. Spread]

What georgem says is true, there will be not enough spreadcoins.

Do you afraid that someone will start tens of thousands of DarkCon masternodes to just outnumber everyone else and receive 90% of rewards? This is simply not possible because there are not enough darkcoins.

Mr. Spread, have you decided on the masternode limit yet?

Not yet.

What georgem says is true, there will be not enough spreadcoins.

Do you afraid that someone will start tens of thousands of DarkCon masternodes to just outnumber everyone else and receive 90% of rewards? This is simply not possible because there are not enough darkcoins.

Mr. Spread, have you decided on the masternode limit yet?

When deciding the max amount of MN we need to take into consideration the max amount of coins that will ever be mined: 20 million coins.

Mr.Spread how accurate is the final coinsupply?

Coin supply and max number of masternodes are unrelated.

[georgem]

Coin supply and max number of masternodes are unrelated.

Shouldn't they relate atleast in some way?

For example, if we know that we will never have more than 20 Million coins, and we also assume that say no more than 50% will ever be locked in Masternodes... shouldn't those resulting 10 Million coins locked in masternodes serve as a guideline of how many MN we should maximum allow?

10 Million coins / 1000 MN = 10k SPR per MN (to reach a state of untouchability)

10 Million coins / 10k MN = 1000 SPR per MN (to reach a state of untouchability).

When I say untouchability I mean the amount of SPR your MN has to have so that NO OTHER MN can possibly take its seat away.

I am not sure if you read the last dozen posts I spouted out earlier, lol. I explain everything there.

[e1ghtSpace]

If I knew how to, I could have just 51% attacked the network.

I suggest you the following workflow:
1. Stop your wallet if it is running.
2. Save current blockchain state by copying Motocoin data directory.
3. Start wallet and send all your motocoins to C-CEX.
4. Wait for the necessary number of confirmations (or mine them by yourself).
5. On C-CEX exchange all your motocoins to bitcoins and withdraw these bitcoins.
6. Stop your wallet and disconnect from internet.
7. Start wallet using the old blockchain state that you saved in step 2.
8. Send all your motocoins to yourself.
9. Mine as many blocks as necessary to overwhelm the original blockchain.
10. Restore your internet connection.
11. ? ? ?
12. PROFIT!!!

If C-CEX software is smart enough it will stop to accept motocoins after this. If not then you can repeat it as many times as necessary to buy all orders on C-CEX.

If only I knew who Mr. Spread was when he said this to me... I might have 50k spr.

[MyFarm]

I'm curious how many Darkcoin masternode owners have realized that they will be able to run a Spreadcoin masternode on the same VPS instance and increase their monthly ROI because of it.  The smart ones are starting to stock up on SPR now at cheap prices.  It makes little sense not to run both.

With that said, you SPR investors that haven't bought 1000 DRK?  It's not a bad idea at these prices IMO.

[MyFarm]

Mr. Spread, have you thought about percentage of block reward that will go to masternode owners and percentage that will go to miners?

[georgem]

I'm curious how many Darkcoin masternode owners have realized that they will be able to run a Spreadcoin masternode on the same VPS instance and increase their monthly ROI because of it.  The smart ones are starting to stock up on SPR now at cheap prices.  It makes little sense not to run both.

With that said, you SPR investors that haven't bought 1000 DRK?  It's not a bad idea at these prices IMO.

Very good point! I haven't even thought about that yet.
And you say an average server usually has enough capacity to run two instances side by side? (Assuming both darkcoin and spreadcoin reach similar traffic)

I think yes!

[Tiger_BTC]

I'm curious how many Darkcoin masternode owners have realized that they will be able to run a Spreadcoin masternode on the same VPS instance and increase their monthly ROI because of it.  The smart ones are starting to stock up on SPR now at cheap prices.  It makes little sense not to run both.

With that said, you SPR investors that haven't bought 1000 DRK?  It's not a bad idea at these prices IMO.

Very good point! I haven't even thought about that yet.
And you say an average server usually has enough capacity to run two instances side by side? (Assuming both darkcoin and spreadcoin reach similar traffic)

I think yes!

the $5 VPS on vultr.com is enough for you to run 2 instances.
 

[e1ghtSpace]

I'm curious how many Darkcoin masternode owners have realized that they will be able to run a Spreadcoin masternode on the same VPS instance and increase their monthly ROI because of it.  The smart ones are starting to stock up on SPR now at cheap prices.  It makes little sense not to run both.

With that said, you SPR investors that haven't bought 1000 DRK?  It's not a bad idea at these prices IMO.

Very good point! I haven't even thought about that yet.
And you say an average server usually has enough capacity to run two instances side by side? (Assuming both darkcoin and spreadcoin reach similar traffic)

I think yes!

the $5 VPS on vultr.com is enough for you to run 2 instances.
 

You can buy one on https://www.bitcoincloud.eu/ for less than 0.03 btc. You don't need to tell them any personal info at all, just your email address.

Just don't click "reset root password" because I clicked it and it didn't tell me what it got reset to. So now I need to contact support. :/

[Tiger_BTC]

I'm curious how many Darkcoin masternode owners have realized that they will be able to run a Spreadcoin masternode on the same VPS instance and increase their monthly ROI because of it.  The smart ones are starting to stock up on SPR now at cheap prices.  It makes little sense not to run both.

With that said, you SPR investors that haven't bought 1000 DRK?  It's not a bad idea at these prices IMO.

Very good point! I haven't even thought about that yet.
And you say an average server usually has enough capacity to run two instances side by side? (Assuming both darkcoin and spreadcoin reach similar traffic)

I think yes!

the $5 VPS on vultr.com is enough for you to run 2 instances.
 

You can buy one on https://www.bitcoincloud.eu/ for less than 0.03 btc. You don't need to tell them any personal info at all, just your email address.

thx,I'll try it with drk mn

[snogcel]

I'm curious how many Darkcoin masternode owners have realized that they will be able to run a Spreadcoin masternode on the same VPS instance and increase their monthly ROI because of it.  The smart ones are starting to stock up on SPR now at cheap prices.  It makes little sense not to run both.

With that said, you SPR investors that haven't bought 1000 DRK?  It's not a bad idea at these prices IMO.

Bingo! That's a big reason why I built a position in SPR a couple weeks back - I'm sure others will realize sooner than later ;-)

[Tiger_BTC]

I'm curious how many Darkcoin masternode owners have realized that they will be able to run a Spreadcoin masternode on the same VPS instance and increase their monthly ROI because of it.  The smart ones are starting to stock up on SPR now at cheap prices.  It makes little sense not to run both.

With that said, you SPR investors that haven't bought 1000 DRK?  It's not a bad idea at these prices IMO.

Bingo! That's a big reason why I built a position in SPR a couple weeks back - I'm sure others will realize sooner than later ;-)

That explains the buying spree yesterday 

[Mr. Spread]

Coin supply and max number of masternodes are unrelated.

Shouldn't they relate atleast in some way?

For example, if we know that we will never have more than 20 Million coins, and we also assume that say no more than 50% will ever be locked in Masternodes... shouldn't those resulting 10 Million coins locked in masternodes serve as a guideline of how many MN we should maximum allow?

10 Million coins / 1000 MN = 10k SPR per MN (to reach a state of untouchability)

10 Million coins / 10k MN = 1000 SPR per MN (to reach a state of untouchability).

When I say untouchability I mean the amount of SPR your MN has to have so that NO OTHER MN can possibly take its seat away.

I am not sure if you read the last dozen posts I spouted out earlier, lol. I explain everything there.

I see your point. What I meant is that total cap is just an arbitrary number, for some coins it is billions for some just a few millions and it depends on unit of measurement.
If there are 1000 MN then you need 0.1% of total supply to reach state of untouchability regardless of the total supply.
If there are 10000 MN then you need 0.01% of total supply to reach state of untouchability regardless of the total supply.

[georgem]

Coin supply and max number of masternodes are unrelated.

Shouldn't they relate atleast in some way?

For example, if we know that we will never have more than 20 Million coins, and we also assume that say no more than 50% will ever be locked in Masternodes... shouldn't those resulting 10 Million coins locked in masternodes serve as a guideline of how many MN we should maximum allow?

10 Million coins / 1000 MN = 10k SPR per MN (to reach a state of untouchability)

10 Million coins / 10k MN = 1000 SPR per MN (to reach a state of untouchability).

When I say untouchability I mean the amount of SPR your MN has to have so that NO OTHER MN can possibly take its seat away.

I am not sure if you read the last dozen posts I spouted out earlier, lol. I explain everything there.

I see your point. What I meant is that total cap is just an arbitrary number, for some coins it is billions for some just a few millions and it depends on unit of measurement.
If there are 1000 MN then you need 0.1% of total supply to reach state of untouchability regardless of the total supply.
If there are 10000 MN then you need 0.01% of total supply to reach state of untouchability regardless of the total supply.

Ofcourse we agree.

Earlier you said something about too many MNs creating too much bloat in the network.
At which point does this become a problem?
Does this also depend on "how active" those MNs are?

Hey, you already reduced the transaction size by creating COMPACT TRANSACTIONS (I read your whitepaper).... you will probably not stop there, right?