[SHUTTING DOWN] [DiceBitco.in | BE THE BANK ! | 1% House Edge]

[bittathisbittathat]

What manl is doing is more fucked up.

He is not refunding people who are positive in balance.  He is refunding people only those that are negative in profit(in loss)

So basically if anyone gambled before 28th and was at 10 BTC profit, and lost to this rigged shit after that will not be refunded(if he is still positive).
SO Even if You lost 9 BTC to this rigged site after 28th. Currently you will be at 1 BTC profit. This means you have left the site with profit.

And Even though you were effected due to the rigged part...you will not be getting your money back and this is wrong.

https://i.imgur.com/Mg2pCWF.png




So people who just had 1 roll effected and are in net negative, will be given back their last deposit completely. And this is more wrong.

They need to work out how much is owed and how much they can payout in refunds then divide it up accordingly. Nobody has a greater right to a refund depending on their past profit's/losses.

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[bitfromit]

FYI I just received all my investment back promptly. I didn't gamble much so was not affected by this much. However, this is really painful to see something that was going so well mess up.

[Gws24]

With respect to the refund method i'm in dubio (is that english?): I was at a profit of something like 5 btc and went down to -2.62 so on one hand i'm pissed that I don't get all the payouts of the missing nonce bets back (total that I found was for 3 btc but there could have been more) but on the other hand I can see dicebitco's point. I myself would probably have lost most of it anyway. Reaaly not sure what to think of this.

[cloverme]

Trying to get caught up on this thread after a few days....

What's this recent talk of refunds and caught cheating?

[itod]

Trying to get caught up on this thread after a few days....

What's this recent talk of refunds and caught cheating?

Official story: Bad anonymous employe changed server code so that some of the winning bets were not shown to the players and dropped into nonexistence.

Edit: to be exact, for those winning bets dice rolled again, until turned into losing bets. It was noticed that the nounce of the winning bets were missing.

[Josepht]

Trying to get caught up on this thread after a few days....

What's this recent talk of refunds and caught cheating?

Official story: Bad anonymous employe changed server code so that some of the winning bets were not shown to the players and dropped into nonexistence.

Edit: to be exact, for those winning bets dice rolled again, until turned into losing bets. It was noticed that the nounce of the winning bets were missing.

The bold part isn't true. Sometimes a winning bet was rolled again only once. If it was a winner the second time, it wasn't rolled again.

[itod]

Trying to get caught up on this thread after a few days....

What's this recent talk of refunds and caught cheating?

Official story: Bad anonymous employe changed server code so that some of the winning bets were not shown to the players and dropped into nonexistence.

Edit: to be exact, for those winning bets dice rolled again, until turned into losing bets. It was noticed that the nounce of the winning bets were missing.

The bold part isn't true. Sometimes a winning bet was rolled again only once. If it was a winner the second time, it wasn't rolled again.

I stand corrected. Are you sure dice is rolled again only once?

[dooglus]

What's this recent talk of refunds and caught cheating?

See https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=716312.msg8714251#msg8714251 for an example of the cheating, and https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=716312.msg8717762#msg8717762 for the official explanation of how it happened.

[johndon]

I can verify your bets to check if your account is affected with the last accident just for small reward, please PM me if you are interested

[dooglus]

I stand corrected. Are you sure dice is rolled again only once?

Yes. That's how finn was winning around 25% of his 49.5% bets - whenever he was due to win twice in a row, he would win, otherwise he would lose.

[Stars]

Alright this is beginning to get pathetic. The way they're handling the re-funds is absolutely absurd. So lets say I won 50 BTC (Before the so called rogue employee joined and changed the code to skip winning bets) and then I decide to do a few bets last night (After the employee joins) and I lose 40 coins because of them skipping every winning bet. Then I don't get re-funded since my account is still +10 coins in the green. That is absolutely disgusting.

[Stunna]

I am sorry if i dont reply fast, i keep refreshing hot wallet(just sent 2k coins more).

What just makes me sad, apart from the big blow of the site, is that people miss the picture.

So we wanted to cheat. And scam.

CAN SOMEONE PLEASE explain me why i am refunding people from my wallet AND didnt simply take the 7k coins and GO?

That goes to Stunna as well, which he didnt lose opportunity to put me a negative trust. I guess this fuckup is the perfect gift for him.

Oh well.

You are free to charge me with whatever accusations you wish. But scammer : no. Last time i checked in my books, scammers dont return the loot of their"scam". Just saying.

This is all simple expected value/game theory. I'll quickly argue why you wouldn't scam the 7k coins with a single point

Assuming you outright/prematurely scammed 7k coins

* The bitcoin community would hunt/dox you and put your life and livelihood in danger.



Here are the alternatives:

1. You skim off money from bankroll over time and make over 7k coins while remaining undetected and your trust continues to increase. (Ideal!)

2. You skim off money from bankroll over time and then run off with the funds.


#1 is obviously the ideal result while #2 results in the most profit but significant risk.


There's no such thing as being anonymous on the internet anymore, your point means nothing. You had an opportunity in the past to make your system reputable with the help of dooglus and chose not to do it, and I've been suspicious of you since. This isn't about me trying to attack a rival site, I have enough bitcoins to be content forever and I have a full time job outside of PD and near zero expenses or desire for valuable things. This is just me pointing out an obvious scam and refusing to be as naive as others, I've pointed out the dangers in your site previously.

I wouldn't be surprised if we see a "whale" win 300 coins off investors and then those same funds used to pay off people who were scammed to keep this going or perhaps we'll see DB shut down and an identical website take its place.


I will not consider adding investments until it is 100% "provably fair" I recommend other people do not invest in these schemes until the implementation improves as well.

[dooglus]

When was this picture taken? I assume this week? If so, that is very damning and puts a nail the coffin.

Every morning I copy/paste stats from a few dice sites for my records.

Here are my last two entries for dice.ninja:

Fri Sep  5 08:40:14 PDT 2014    B  643378   4094181     I  257.70837991 10248.87420062   P   2.71265918 107.74146973      W   6903.37722258 1439.12006055
Sat Sep  6 10:11:37 PDT 2014    B  850854   4126713     I  341.61305290 10254.44743964   P -16.07683501 113.31463278      W   7090.92352204 1450.98147195
Sun Sep  7 07:42:13 PDT 2014    B  970488   4168024     I  342.06743327 10256.27197150   P -15.63090506 115.13916464      W   7095.11874128 1460.81965824

So the screenshot was taken after 7:42 am today - after Finn made his video - because it shows more than 970k BTC bets.

Edit: but the chat itself is a couple of days old. There's not much chat activity at dice.ninja, so old chat hangs around for days.

[RoooooR]

.....

Every morning I copy/paste stats from a few dice sites for my records.

Here are my last two entries for dice.ninja:

Fri Sep  5 08:40:14 PDT 2014    B  643378   4094181     I  257.70837991 10248.87420062   P   2.71265918 107.74146973      W   6903.37722258 1439.12006055
Sat Sep  6 10:11:37 PDT 2014    B  850854   4126713     I  341.61305290 10254.44743964   P -16.07683501 113.31463278      W   7090.92352204 1450.98147195
Sun Sep  7 07:42:13 PDT 2014    B  970488   4168024     I  342.06743327 10256.27197150   P -15.63090506 115.13916464      W   7095.11874128 1460.81965824

So the screenshot was taken after 7:42 am today - after Finn made his video - because it shows more than 970k BTC bets.

If I remember correct, those messages were sent about 40 hours ago. I captured it a few hours ago.

[kolloh]

Alright this is beginning to get pathetic. The way they're handling the re-funds is absolutely absurd. So lets say I won 50 BTC (Before the so called rogue employee joined and changed the code to skip winning bets) and then I decide to do a few bets last night (After the employee joins) and I lose 40 coins because of them skipping every winning bet. Then I don't get re-funded since my account is still +10 coins in the green. That is absolutely disgusting.

Yeah that doesn't like a fair way of handling this. All users who were affected should be appropriately reimbursed.

If you were previously at 50BTC profit before the affected rolls, you should at the very least be reimbursed back to your 50BTC starting point I would think.

[finnile]

Just to point out. The rolls started being fair soon after I posted about them on PRC and DB. And I figured the site devs had read the chart and fixed the bug. If this was the case, then clearly manl knew the reason behind that happening and was able to fix it immediately.

Also in the chat they say, they will hire someone new. Had they posted anything before today about hiring? and I thought gerry did most of the coding.

[Stars]

Alright this is beginning to get pathetic. The way they're handling the re-funds is absolutely absurd. So lets say I won 50 BTC (Before the so called rogue employee joined and changed the code to skip winning bets) and then I decide to do a few bets last night (After the employee joins) and I lose 40 coins because of them skipping every winning bet. Then I don't get re-funded since my account is still +10 coins in the green. That is absolutely disgusting.

Yeah that doesn't like a fair way of handling this. All users who were affected should be appropriately reimbursed.

If you were previously at 50BTC profit before the affected rolls, you should at the very least be reimbursed back to your 50BTC starting point I would think.

He should just re-fund the bets that were due to win but didn't because of his corrupt employee. That's the logical thing to do yet he is not doing it for some odd reason.

[GaleMartins]

I don't think by naming that person I will prove anything. He is not directly to blame, most of this is on us.

What? He deliberately added code to cheat your players.

How is he not to blame?

You're to blame too, for putting his code live, but he's also to blame for writing the malicious code! How is it fair for him to do this and remain anonymous? Someone else might employ him and get fucked over in the same way.

There's zero reason not to post that info, I highly doubt this person exists though which is your reason. If someone did this to me I would go to the ends of the world to make sure they were never employed again.

I still find it impossible to believe that your site randomly hired someone and gave him full access to server seeds without making any public statement. This seems very unlikely.

If I understand well, all people in this forum, even dooglus and stunna are anonymous, in the sense that other users do not know their real names.
If this is true, then I sort of understand DiceBitcoin's decision to not reveal the name of their employee (assuming there is one).
If he did, then the anonymity of the owners of DiceBitcoin would be jeopardised.
So, I do not find anything suspicious in their decision to not tell the employee.

[dooglus]

Just to point out. The rolls started being fair soon after I posted about them on PRC and DB. And I figured the site devs had read the chart and fixed the bug. If this was the case, then clearly manl knew the reason behind that happening and was able to fix it immediately.

Or the mystery employee saw you talking about it and turned your doomswitch off...

I asked the dice.ninja admin when the chat about not having any other developers happened:

16:32 dmf 1 1409885702
16:32 dooglus 176 thanks
16:32 dooglus 176 that's Thu Sep 4 19:55:02 2014 Pacific

So getting on for 70 hours ago.

[suchmoon]

I am sorry if i dont reply fast, i keep refreshing hot wallet(just sent 2k coins more).

At the very least you should promptly address the question raised by many here, i.e. why you are refunding deposits but not the actual stolen bets. E.g. Stars here stands to lose 20 BTC that seems to be rightfully his/hers.

some balances would still end up negative even after that incident, while some others would be positive. If i was doing that, then it would be another round of"oh if i won that bet i would stop". That is the best solution i can come up with.

I'm sorry but this is just wrong. What difference does it make if someone's balance is positive or negative? A player placed a bet and should have won a certain amount of coins, but instead the site made him/her lose. You should rerun the bets as they should have happened and refund the difference in the resulting balance, not just negative accounts and not just the initial deposit. Also I think you should probably shut the site down or at least halt gambling, give yourself some time to do a full data audit, code review, whatever you need to do to. I'm not sure I understand why you are asking players to file support tickets for refunds - you should be able to determine who's affected and refund proactively.