[ANN] [IDISNEY] Disney Coin

[nili]

MICKEY: Is that even a logical quest?

MINNIE: In a self referenced logic it is. 

MICKEY: But self referencing defeats all that logic stands for.

MINNIE: That is why toon were called for this impossible mission. Only we can make sense of this.

MICKEY: Lets start by explaining the Humanions what is self referencing and give them an example they can understand

MINNIE: When the king declares himself a king.

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[nili]

MICKEY: Is that even a logical quest?

MINNIE: In a self referenced logic it is. 

MICKEY: But self referencing defeats all that logic stands for.

MINNIE: That is why toon were called for this impossible mission. Only we can make sense of this.

MICKEY: Lets start by explaining the Humanions what is self referencing and give them an example they can understand

MINNIE: When the king declares himself a king.

MICKEY: We just decided to avoid all of Twitter's chatter!

MINNIE: We did, but we are toons first of all.

MICKEY: True. "First came the toon in his image."

MINNIE: ... and then you gave him his life.

MICKEY: Are we still talking about Adam?

MINNIE: Yes Michael. 

[nili]

MICKEY: We just decided to avoid all of Twitter's chatter!

MINNIE: We did, but we are toons first of all.

MICKEY: True. "First came the toon in his image."

MINNIE: ... and then you gave him his life.

MICKEY: Are we still talking about Adam?

MINNIE: Yes Michael.

MICKEY: OK lets concentrate on the substance Eve.

MINNIE: Adam, (the primordial) is referencing God as an image, and Eve is referencing it as substance.

MICKEY: What we learn is that each consecutive reference is adding to the one before it.

MINNIE: What you learned is that self referencing is how you create something out of nothing.

MICKEY: Are you consider yourself nothing?

MINNIE: Not when I am with you, Mickey, for you I mean the world.

[nili]

MICKEY: OK lets concentrate on the substance Eve.

MINNIE: Adam, (the primordial) is referencing God as an image, and Eve is referencing it as substance.

MICKEY: What we learn is that each consecutive reference is adding to the one before it.

MINNIE: What you learned is that self referencing is how you create something out of nothing.

MICKEY: Are you consider yourself nothing?

MINNIE: Not when I am with you, Mickey, for you I mean the world.

MINNIE:  Did you realized how you broke the logic of our argument?

MICKEY: What logic?

MINNIE: The linear one, that which OG toons pre PIXAR are made of.

MICKEY: How did I broke it?

MINNIE: I said, "What you learned is that self-referencing is how you create something out of nothing."

MICKEY: So?... how was my conclusions wrong?

MINNIE: You projected "YOU" on me as a general term, but since I was precisely speaking about self-referencing in which the order is crucial, it couldn't be me being "nothing",

MICKEY: That's machine's logic.

MINNIE: That's what simple minded means.

[nili]

MICKEY: That's machine's logic.

MINNIE: That's what simple minded means.

MICKEY: This reminds me of the days that people thought we were Chinese.

MINNIE: And didn't actualy realize what we were doing..

MICKEY: They still only realize a very small part of it.

MINNIE: I know, but we must keep going and they will eventually value it. 

MICKEY: How exactly?

MINNIE: While waiting in line they will have time to read the words.

MICKEY: What line? 

MINNIE: The timeline of course, eventually they will have enough time to read it.

MICKEY: Read the timestamp? 

MINNIE: And the words which verify the art.

[nutildah]

I have to say I'm enjoying this conversation very much... most of this forum is dead, this is one of the most interesting things happening here. I've opened about 5 NFT threads in the last few months and nobody cares about any of it, LOL.

You might get a kick out of this:

Shitcoin 3.0 - First Parody Token on the First Parody Blockchain

I made a token named SHITCOIN using Dogeparty in August 2014 and promoted it as an ICO. It is not scarce nor was it made with artistic intentions, other than as a mockery of new cryptocurrencies being made at the time.

I applaud your decision to hold on to your tokens -- they will be 10 years old in 2025! Hopefully by that point people will realize the value behind what you've been attempting to accomplish.

[nili]

I still need to bring all of the advanced dialogs together so the story of the future can be told.
There are only two main paths for life to develop into the future. One will lead for total destruction of humankind and a restart of another biological cycle the other that will enable an upgrade to life itself.
Our biology, which we assume to be life itself, is more like the latest tech of what we call life. But the rules of existence that define life are far more fundamental then the substance from which it is created. These rules are the objective of my creations which, unlike the subjects of ones research, figuring them out requires let go of all constrains. Allowing for oneself to let go of all social rules of conducts including of course all sort of academic type of research, and be true to whatever come through regardless of how nonsensical it may appears. Asking for nothing but to be true to oneself and HAVE FUN. Without the fun part the weight of the mission is too much to ever reach its destination.

For quite sometime now I feel that the core principles have became quite clear to me and thus the historic dialogs from 2018, 2019, 2020  have served their part and i must now move beyond that. However in the past year the emergence of NFTs and Historical NFTs in particular had me go back and dive deeper into the practical economics and concepts of the entire NILIcoins project leaving the more fundamental dive into the tech behind.

Realizing the details of how the financial market should be manipulated to suits the goals of creation (sustainable life) is maybe the most particle part of all that I will ever achieve as an artist. I will feel most achieved if I will be able to formulize it and see it come through with in the few coming years. The tasks is mammoth but many are reaching the same conclusions and in search of the same path. Yet for me this may not be what I should be mainly concentrated on. It requires so many levels of cooperation as well as financial independence that I don't possess. All my wealth if would to be realized is tied to my art and the tokens that I have created as part of it. In order for me to utilize that wealth directly in the past year I had to function by the rules of the market which I stand against and work against anything that the tokens represented as art and which I set to seek to change.

 It took me a good 9 months to figure out what was it that I must do in order to comply with that initial goal taking in consideration the actual state of affairs.  At this point of time I can articulate the base principles and know exactly what kind of partnership are needed. but I still cant at all tell if I am in a position of being able to get them. The HNFT fest last week was a very important testing ground and I so sense that we as a community have the core understanding and power to take this path. Yet it is something we need to realize in practical form. I believe that in the coming 6 months I will be able to realize where it is heading and see if I can figure out the way to work with this community in large. And while I do that the fun must go on and thus the story must keep being written.

       

MINNIE: There is still one thing I don't quite understand.

SATOSHI: Only one?

MINNIE: Well, one that should have a simple answer.

SATOSHI: Go ahead, shoot!

MINNIE: What kind of animal is Nakamoto?

 

MICKEY: I also have one question before we get on with the whitepaper.

SATOSHI: Can't wait to hear your question.

MICKEY: Why did you never mentioned Nick Szabo?

MINNIE: This is not a question that you can ask Mickey!

MICKEY: Why?!

MINNIE: What if they have some history that Satoshi don't want to share with us...

MICKEY: What history? Were they working together before?

MINNIE: They may have.

MICKEY: What, on Bit Gold?

SATOSHI: Some animals better be left to work alone.

MINNIE: That would be Szabo, but what is Nakamoto?

SATOSHI: "Origin" - Sort of all animals in potential.

MINNIE: Sort of a God then.

MICKEY: What image that would be then?

MINNIE: In the image of a human.

SATOSHI: As all Toon's are.  

 

[nili]

MINNIE: There is still one thing I don't quite understand.

SATOSHI: Only one?

MINNIE: Well, one that should have a simple answer.

SATOSHI: Go ahead, shoot!

MINNIE: What kind of animal is Nakamoto?

MICKEY: I also have one question before we get on with the whitepaper.

SATOSHI: Can't wait to hear your question.

MICKEY: Why did you never mentioned Nick Szabo?

MINNIE: This is not a question that you can ask Mickey!

MICKEY: Why?!

MINNIE: What if they have some history that Satoshi don't want to share with us...

MICKEY: What history? Were they working together before?

MINNIE: They may have.

MICKEY: What, on Bit Gold?

SATOSHI: Some animals better be left to work alone.

MINNIE: That would be Szabo, but what is Nakamoto?

SATOSHI: "Origin" - Sort of all animals in potential.

MINNIE: Sort of a God then.

MICKEY: What image that would be then?

MINNIE: In the image of a human.

SATOSHI: As all Toon's are.  

 SATOSHI: Are we clear to start now?

MINNIE: I have one more question.

SATOSHI: I figured you would.

MINNIE: You could work with anyone on any thread, why did you choose us?

MICKEY: ... Yes, I like to know that too.

MINNIE: This is not a question that you can ask Mickey!

MICKEY: Why?!

MINNIE: Because that was my question and I did not ask you to help me with it.  

MICKEY: Sorry, you are right... I"ll listen to the answer first.

MINNIE: So, Satoshi, why did you chose us?

SATOSHI: One would think it is the fact that I could create my own image here..

MINNIE: But it's not?

SATOSHI: No,  Its mostly that I can trust you to keep in character.

MICKEY: So it's about trust then.... ?

SATOSHI: Trust is part of what will be redefined in the process of creating our chain.

MINNIE: Ourchain...

MICKEY: Is that the name that you chose to our chain?

MINNIE: Why not Ourcoin...

MICKEY: Like Namecoin that you started after Bitcoin.

SATOSHI: This time it is about the the Chain not the Coin.

MINNIE: Bitchain...  

MICKEY: Namechain...

SATOSHI: Birthchain.

MINNIE: Wow, a chain name that have Bit as part of the Name.

MICKEY: And a Chain as a Coin.

MINNIE: And an R to express that we R a team!

MICKEY: Some may think that we R the original Satoshi team.

SATOSHI:  

MINNIE: Not a chance.  

MICKEY: Is that the reason Satoshi chose to work with us on the Newchain?

MINNIE: Bitchain, Namechain, Birthchain, Newchain, Whichain?

MICKEY: We have to vote on the name before we can publish anything about Thechain.

MINNIE: Does anyone wants to offer another name before we vote?

MICKEY: I also like Forchian.

MINNIE: Good, lets vote now!

MICKEY: Yes, let's do it.

SATOSHI: Who can vote?

MICKEY: What do you mean, who? its only us three.

SATOSHI: And everyone else on that thread.

MICKEY: R they part of the team?

SATOSHI:  As a decentralized chain, anyone that participate can vote.

MICKEY: O.K. but it is not a chain yet.

SATOSHI: A chain is a community first.

MINNIE: Make sense then to call it Commonchain.

MICKEY: Or for that matter Notachain, but I also have another good name, Toonchain.

SATOSHI: Hey guys, lets concentrate on these last three statements. 

MICKEY: ... and that would be?!!

MINNIE: A community of Toons.  

SATOSHI: Was not quite what I would spelled out myself... but better. 

MICKEY: Are all our users Toons then?  

SATOSHI: Not all users but all identities on our Basechain . 

MINNIE: We just decide not to talk about chain names, Satoshi!

SATOSHI: Sorry, I was getting into that Toon's farme of mind.

MICKEY: Can we go back to Ourchain now?

SATOSHI: Fine, and I will not respond to that name challenge again.

MICKEY: O.K. good, we got a lot of work ahead of us

MINNIE: Mickey, what got into you?  I never saw you like that.

MICKEY: I just can't wait to be on that Newchain.

MINNIE: Me Too.

SATOSHI: Me Toon.

MICKEY: So about that Too'ns community... should we first define what is a Me on a chain?

MINNIE: A Me is a Toon.

SATOSHI:  A Toon Too, since we are all Toons on the chain

MICKEY: Right!

SATOSHI: Toons, humans, miners, all can be reborn on our chain as equal members in our Toons community.

MINNIE: What about the core developers?

SATOSHI: They will be the founding members of our community.

MICKEY: Are they going to be Toons Too? .

SATOSHI: I'm not sure how that will work out, but we have to start in order to see.

MICKEY: How are we going to start then?

SATOSHI: Open a Github account and publish the password on our thread.

MINNIE: That would not be Me.

MICKEY: Not Me Too.

SATOSHI: As I said before, for that we need a human.

MINNIE: I guess this is #whyididnotreport Too.

MICKEY: No kidding.


 

 

[nili]

SATOSHI: As I said before, for that we need a human.

MINNIE: I guess this is #whyididnotreport Too.

MICKEY: No kidding.

SATOSHI: I suggest we stay on topic.

MINNIE: Me Too.

SATOSHI: Minnie... !!!

MINNIE: Is Me alone offending enough or off topic Too?

SATOSHI: What are you talking about? you get me very confused.

MINNIE: I Just don't get what is wrong with Me, and why you think that We is less offending?

MICKEY: Yes really, why do you always say We and not Me?

MINNIE: You could just say Me Too, it express the same meaning as We.

MICKEY: Right!

MINNIE: It does! and more so it shows that you are taking a stand for being a part of some We.

MICKEY: Right! It shows that you have integrity and that you are taking charge on your actions.

MINNIE: .... Well, that is where is gets very tricky.

MICKEY: where?

MINNIE: Where as a victim it never is your fault though you are often manipulated to think that way.

MICKEY: Right! I meant what you said, and from the same place also.

MINNIE: However, to be very clear, Me Too is based on less unfounded assumptions.

SATOSHI: Are you suggesting that We express some sort of consent as an assumption?

MINNIE: Exactly!
 
MICKEY: Right!

MINNIE: I don't even understand how it can be legal to say We without presenting a proof for that argument.

SATOSHI: What argument?

MICKEY: The argument of the agreement.

MINNIE: A Proof Of Agreement, if We like to be more constructive in terms of the logic.

MICKEY: Like Proof Of Existence, Proof Of Stake, Proof Of Work,  Proof Of Concept....

MINNIE: And Proof Of Consent.

MICKEY: What is the difference between Proof of Agreement and Proof of Consent?

MINNIE:  Proof Of Consent assume an initiator and the object of initiation, which in the case of another living being is a subjects of its own right.

MICKEY: Wow...This is very confusing...

MINNIE: That is why it is important to use commonsense.

SATOSHI: ... As well as good vocabulary and correct spelling.

MINNIE: Spelling is far less important in terms of understanding a concept.

SATOSHI: Spelling can help though...

MINNIE: I don't argue that, but that is not the topic of our current dialog.

SATOSHI: Which is ....?

MINNIE: .... Constructive Logic.

SATOSHI: Do you mean that using the term We without being very specific about who else is part of that We, as well as not making the Poof Of Agreement or Proof of consent available to the public, is not constructive?

 MINNIE: Exactly! you are a good Lerner.

[nili]

MINNIE: Exactly! you are a good Lerner.

SATOSHI: You mean learner .

MINNIE: Both.
 
MICKEY: That was what she meant as commonsense.  

SATOSHI: How am I a Lerner then?  

MINNIE: We all are.
 
MICKEY: Lerner is our Toon's chain name.

SATOSHI: What is a Toon's chain name?

MINNIE: It's like a second animal name but a third name that makes a Toon be a part of one entity.
 
MICKEY: Like Donald Duck and Daffy Duck, both are Ducks but each have a different third name.

MINNIE: Donald Duck Disney and Daffy Duck Warner.

SATOSHI: So you mean a corporations.

MINNIE: Legally speaking yes.
 
MICKEY: But Corporations are a primitive entity.

MINNIE: Humans are much better form of such entity.

SATOSHI: What entity.

MINNIE: An organism.

SATOSHI: I am confused.  

MINNIE: Me Too.
 
MICKEY: Me Too, two.

SATOSHI: We are Three then.

MINNIE: You learn fast.
 
MICKEY: So what is Lerner on Ourchain?

MINNIE: The third name which we all must share.

MICKEY: Even if I was Mickey Ver?

SATOSHI: Or Roger Rabbit?

MINNIE: Donald Duck Disney, Daffy Duck Warner, Mickey Mouse Disney, Mickey Mouse Lerner Mickey Ver BchABC, Roger Rabbit BchABC. Satoshi Nakamoto BTC, Satoshi Nakamoto BchSV, Satoshi Nakamoto Lerner, Craig Mouse Disney.

MICKEY: Hello Kitty BTC, Crypto Kitty ETH.

SATOSHI: Satoshi Nakamoto Wright, Nick Szabo ETH.  
 
MICKEY: So it is the order of the names that matter then.

MINNIE: You learn fast too.

SATOSHI: It is all about the order.

MINNIE: It is first about the lists.

SATOSHI: You are a fast Lerner.
 
MICKEY: And you are We.

MINNIE: I just hope that you will choose Us again.

MICKEY: Just to be on the same page, who is Us?  

MINNIE: You, Satoshi and I for now.

MICKEY: As our First names only?

MINNIE: For now we can use our First name only

MICKEY: Why is that so?

MINNIE: Because we are the first names to be used on Ourchain
 
MICKEY: But we haven't started the Newchain yet.

MINNIE: For that we needed Satoshi on our team.

SATOSHI: One needs Three to become a team.  

MICKEY: What's with the Second then?

SATOSHI: You and Minnie are more of an Item than a Team.

MINNIE: If One needs Three, who is the Fourth on the Team?.

SATOSHI: That must be God or ruther the narrator.

MINNIE: Only until all Three of Us are on Ourchain.

SATOSHI: Once on the Birthchain all are equal and free First names.
 
MICKEY: So because we haven't started the Newchain yet, Our narrator is part of the Team but is not a free First name.?

MINNIE: Right!

SATOSHI: Good job Team Toons, I am glad We figured that one out.

MICKEY: Next We need to sort out the chain's name issue.

MINNIE: It is ruther the chains names.

SATOSHI: Can't wait to see how that will unfold.

MINNIE: I am not sure that We are clear enough regarding the Free name.

SATOSHI: Yes this need some decoding.
 
MINNIE: Free name is the heart of our code.

MICKEY: Free with capital F?

MINNIE:  Yes, We use capital letters for a term that We have defined precisely in our dialog.

MICKEY: So Free means being a name on Ourchain

SATOSHI: Once on the Birthchain you are already a Free name!

MICKEY: I guess that We use bold and slanted letters to define precisely the name of the chain.

MINNIE: That is correct.

SATOSHI: Good! Now We can code the chains names.
 
MINNIE: We first need to refresh these names.

MICKEY: Bitchain, Namechain, Birthchain, Newchain, Whichain, Thecahin, Forchain, Mainchain. Ourchain.

MINNIE: These are a lot of chain's names.

SATOSHI: How many chains do we need to define precisely before starting to code?

MINNIE: We are already coding!

MICKEY: Are We?

MINNIE:  Yes, We are!.

MICKEY: What do you think Satoshi, are We?

SATOSHI: I know better than to respond to that.

MICKEY: I guess you learn fast.

SATOSHI: I know better than to respond to that.

MICKEY: I guess you learn fast.

MINNIE: Do you boys wish to start with Bitchain then?

SATOSHI: Since it is the first on our list, it is a good place to start.

MICKEY: Clever too.

SATOSHI: What would be the name of the coins mined on Bitchain?

MICKEY: Not very clever.

MINNIE: Since Bitcoin is taken by Blockchain I actualy have no problem with Bitchcoin .

SATOSHI: As long as you are coding We can use any name that you wish.

MINNIE: You will need to do much of the proper coding Satoshi, so you have to agree with me on the names before We code it properly.

MICKEY: I agree.

MICKEY: If Satoshi is the chief programmer in our Team and Minnie is the chief architect, what kind of chief that makes me?  

SATOSHI: Mouse Chief.

MICKEY: Which makes Minnie Mrs. Chief.

SATOSHI: Miss Chief is more like it.  

MICKEY: Then Mischief would be me.

MINNIE: Pleas don't use bold&slanted letters for your silly word games.

SATOSHI: Miss chief it is, chief.

MINNIE: At least until you do your part so we can do without a chief.

SATOSHI: So you want me to program that bold&slanted&name-starting-with-capital-letter, will be a chain's name?.

MICKEY: Even without the name Chain?

MINNIE: Yes.

MICKEY: That is clever.

SATOSHI: And confusing.

MINNIE: And is exactly why We need to be very precise at this stage and not play with words.

SATOSHI: Yes Ma'am.

[nili]

MINNIE: And is exactly why We need to be very precise at this stage and not play with words.

SATOSHI: Yes Ma'am.

SATOSHI: Minnie, I need you to specify each chain's name and configurations.

MICKEY: Maybe better that she start with the configurations since names are so confusing.

SATOSHI: Only for Toons names are such a complex issue.

MINNIE: True, humans for some reason have much more problems with functions.

SATOSHI: I think that I must agree with that.

MICKEY: I do too.

SATOSHI: Must agree?

MICKEY: No, do agree.

MINNIE: We have a lot of work....

SATOSHI: Where do we start then?

MICKEY: We agree and then we start.

MINNIE: First you act then you name it.

SATOSHI: I always thought that Start is an action..

MINNIE: It is the name of that action.

SATOSHI: So is everything a name?

MINNIE: Everything that we share is first a name.

SATOSHI: I see where this is taking us.

MICKEY: To the starting chain that is First names chain.

SATOSHI: Can we still name it Birthchain?

MICKEY: Or Namechain?

MINNIE: Birthchain is the correct name for the first chain. Namechain it the fourth chain.

MICKEY: So the second chain is the animal names and the third chain is the third names?

SATOSHI: Birthchain is the correct name for the first Chain. Namechain it the fourth Chain. So the second Chain is the animal names and the third Chain is the third names?

MINNIE: I am not sure that we defined the word Chain precisely enough to use a capital letter when we say it?

MICKEY: Right, We only said that the names of the chain's names don't have to include the name Chain.

MINNIE: Satoshi, Could you quote your first words defining the Chain?

SATOSHI: "The network timestamps transactions by hashing them into an ongoing chain of hash-based proof-of-work, , forming a record that cannot be changed without redoing the proof-of-work."  

MICKEY: So Chain means order of transactions.

SATOSHI: "Each timestamp includes the previous timestamp in its hash, forming a chain, with each additional timestamp reinforcing the ones before it."

MINNIE: It is not the Order but ruther the Action that enforce that order into its shape.

MICKEY: A shape of a chain.

MINNIE: More a Babushka than a chain.

SATOSHI: Or a wheel with in a wheel.

MINNIE: A Chain as We are using it for our chain's names is a definition of a community.

MICKEY: We as a Team or We as a community?

MINNIE: We as a Team.

SATOSHI: How is We as a Team different from We as a Chain?  

MICKEY: Or from "We are all Satoshi"?

MINNIE: The Satoshi who is the creator of bitcoin is all his bitcoin address.

MICKEY: So if We all have the private key to that address We are all Satoshi?

SATOSHI:

MICKEY: But We don't have it.

MINNIE: Unless We can figure out the shape.

MICKEY: And what that shape might be?

MINNIE: Could be some of his public statements or well known quotes he referenced.

MICKEY: I am sure that all of these options where explored.

MINNIE: And I am sure that none used a timestamp to get the right shape.

MICKEY: You can't hash the timestamp of the hash into itself.

MINNIE: No, but you can chain the hashes.

SATOSHI: If you have a timestamp server which works by taking a hash of a block of items to be timestamped and widely publishing the hash, such as in a newspaper, then the timestamp proves that the data must have existed at the time, obviously, in order to get into the hash.

MICKEY: Funny use of words, "the time"

MINNIE: Good choice of paper, "The Times"

SATOSHI: Good use of font, "THE TIMES"

MICKEY: The Time is a chain of Times stamped by the Timestamp server which works by taking a hash of a block of the previous timestamped hash to be timestamped, and widely publishing the hash, thus proves that the previous block must have existed at the new time, obviously, in order to get into the hash.

MINNIE: And THE TIMES sets the first time on the Timestamp server which serves the BTC Blockchain.

SATOSHI: Thus THE TIMES's time is the first time on the first decentralized Timestamp machine ever.

MINNIE: Thus THE TIMES's time marks the beginning of a new era, using the same count of the the old era.

MICKEY: That of The New Testament.

MINNIE: Which reference the Old Testament using the word New.

MICKEY: Does that means using the word New in Hebrew?

MINNIE: Obviously! Hebrew is our first language.

SATOSHI: Let's just hope that it is clear to all our readers.

MINNIE: We are diverting from the main topic.

MICKEY :Which is ....?

MINNIE: The direct link between time and chaining data.

MICKEY: The link is the chain.

MINNIE: Exactly!! what we just learned is that time is a chain of itself as data.

MICKEY: The Time is a chain of Times stamped by the Timestamp server which works by taking a hash of a block of the previous timestamped hash to be timestamped, and widely publishing the hash, thus proves that the previous block must have existed at the new time, obviously, in order to get into the hash.

MINNIE: Fantastic!!! Let's move on to the Birthchain then.

MICKEY : The chain of all beginnings!  

MINNIE: The chain of all future genesis.

MICKEY: Will be fun to use the last block of bitcoin as genesis to all future genesis.

MINNIE: Which last bitcoin's block? That of BTC, BCHVS or BCHABC or any of the other forks?

MICKEY: So it is the ticker's name that matters here.

SATOSHI: It is worth mentioning at this point that the Birthchain will be creating the genesis of all entities be it personal identities, blockchains or coins, while let any first name decide on the ticker by which to trade its coins once a fork is taking place at the level of the third names chain.

MINNIE: Worth mentioning but needs a lot of explaining.

MICKEY : Lets start by explaining genesis.

SATOSHI: There Will Be...

MINNIE: An empty client's block.

MICKEY : And a server.

MINNIE: The client is the server.

MICKEY: Then who served the first block to the first client in the network?

MINNIE: The client.

MICKEY: That then explains the unspendable first block reward then.

SATOSHI: If you can explain that, you will be the first one doing it.

MICKEY: Imagine being the first and only one.  

SATOSHI: I can remember that.

MICKEY: Now imagine not being and then becoming the only one.  

SATOSHI: I was that too.  

MICKEY: Next imagine the first action that you did.

SATOSHI: Like mining the first block?.  

MICKEY: Exactly! But that is not all, according to the protocol that action if you do it correctly reward you with the first block reward.

SATOSHI: That is correct.  

MICKEY: So in order to validate your first action, which means validating your own being as a trusted party you have to accept the reword.

SATOSHI: That I can imagine.  

MINNIE: But even if correct,  that only explains why Satoshi took a reward on the genesis block but not why it is not spendable.  

MICKEY: Since all that Satoshi is and for ever will be is that first unspendable reward.

SATOSHI: That is correct Mickey!

MICKEY: It is sad to just be a pile of 50 bitcoins.

MINNIE: Well, by now it is a pile of many more unspendable Alt coins, thus in fact over 90 different Satoshis.

MICKEY: You mean Satoshi Nakanotos, the number of different Satoshis is far greater.

MINNIE: Yes, that is what I meant and is also a great example for why we need to have three names starting with the first name on the Birthchain.

SATOSHI: You guys give me hope to become a Toon with a pile of spendable coins ruther than the pile of unspendable coins.  

MINNIE:: And you gives us hope to become free Toons , each having a pile of spendable coins.

MICKEY: We all give us a chance to be each an individual I .  

SATOSHI: I Disney!

MINNIE: Might be time to put our Disney Coins back on the market....  

MICKEY: IDISNEY

SATOSHI: Did you two had it all planed out when you decide on the ticker name?

MINNIE: Not until you joined the dialogue.  

SATOSHI: I think that We just reached the point for your long monologue Minnie.

MICKEY: The Introduction of Toonniverse by Minnie Mouse.

SATOSHI: The Abstract, rather.  

MINNIE:: Do you really think that We are ready for that?

MICKEY: We are! .  

SATOSHI: Our readers might not be there yet, but they will eventually.

MINNIE: Ok, I'm going to prepare, and will be ready with the introduction monologue for our next dialogue segment.  

SATOSHI:

[nili]

INTRODUCTION

A fully decentralized ecosystem requires a solution for the identity problem and for a Knowledge Base problem*.
I believe that Satoshi Nakamoto architecture of the bitcoin protocol solved the issue of information sharing for the simplest form of information, that which can be express as a unit. However all other types of information, thous that we consider as having a content thus a complex meaning, can not be validated as "true" using such a simple protocol.

Smart Contract which tries to take the blockchain to the next level of complexity fail the decentralized test based on the restrictions rooted in Gödel's Incompleteness Theorem and its implications on a Turing machine. In order to overcome this restriction we must establish a Knowledge Base system, linked yet separated from the platform that forms and execute contracts.

It would be useful to view the different platforms similar to what we know as Separation of Powers. Using this analogy, the level that create the Knowledge Base is the Parliament layer. In a decentralized network this means each user is represented by his username in any vote. the miners of that level are required to agree on the votes count as well as the "topics" presented for votes. Eventually  each block will represent the state of KB. That state will act as The Truth for the upper levels to consider, while every dispute between users as well as a logic based halting issue will be pushed down to this level (2nd level) to be resolved using the voting configurations available at the protocol of this level.

However a decentralized system faces one fundamental problem that without a solution would never succeeded. The configuration of a decentralized identity. There are many aspect to this issue but the most crucial one is the unification issue. In fact all we need in order to define an identity is a record of the actions taken by that identity. Thus in order to satisfy this requirement, a fully decentralized network must establish a blockchain of root identities. Such that would act as the root for any acting entity in the levels above,The KB/voting 2nd level chains and the assets like the bitcoin blockchain or smart constructs 3rd level chains.

The solution that I proposed here is a root chain that can do only two things, register a root name (first name) and timestamped it. thus both the timestamp and the letters of the name gives is its unique name. Much like the double spending restriction enforced by the protocol and miners , no two names (same letters in same order) can be register at the same block.

This root chain (which I named Birthchian) give birth to names which all acts as potential "genesis" blocks  for a side chain for all possible future chains on level 2 and 3. Chains on level 2 create the KB and act as the voting platform. The names on level 2 also forms the reputation of the root-name. A root name can create as many 2nd names as it wishes, but all activities of these names are summed up to establish a unified reputation score associated with the root name. Chains on level 3 are the asset chains and smart contracts chains, that level represent the actual asset value and commitments of the root-name.

The 4th level will allow for a root-name to create a new root-name independent from the entity that created it (the human that create the root name or that control the bot that create a name and operate it on level 2 and 3) . This 4th level as I can understand it is a direct result of the decentralized structure of the three levels as described above and will be formed naturally. Once activated and stabilized, it will mark the actual beginning of next stage in the evolution of life itself.  

*Governing also considered as a major problem but is not a fundamental issue in a decentralized system which present a solution for identity and KB.

[nili]

MINNIE: Ok, I'm going to prepare, and will be ready with the introduction monologue for our next dialogue segment.  

SATOSHI:

MICKEY : We are still waiting Minnie.

MINNIE: Who is We?!!

MICKEY: I thought that We have been through that definition.

MINNIE: Seems like things have changed while We were talking.

MICKEY: What are you talking about?

MINNIE: We have been steemed up.

MICKEY: Steemed?!!

MINNIE: Yes at Blockchaincat on Steemit

MICKEY: Did you just say Cat?!!!

MINNIE: Yes! Satoshi friended a cat on a Blockchain!

MICKEY: Friended a Cat?!!!

MINNIE: While We were talking about The Time.

MICKEY: So he also double spend our Time at the same Time?.  

MINNIE: Worse! He did all that using his old account.

MICKEY: I see... but he was also talking to you, wasn't he?

MINNIE: That in fact was really clever.

MICKEY: What, friending a cat Toon?.

MINNIE: Yes, that while talking from his original account.

MICKEY: So double spending our time is Ok with you too?

MINNIE: If he can be in different places at the same time that is fine.

MICKEY: Fine for human pretending being a Toon. but not as a free Toon.

MINNIE: Once a free Toon, time is the only restriction.

MINNIE: Abstract.  A Toon versed version of a universe would allow lifeforms to be formed directly online by any party without a central entity that coordinate or permit it.
The bitcoin protocol provide part of the solution, but the main benefit is lost if time can be double spend and the coins are the only assets that can not be cloned. Digital signatures on the blockchain provide the other part of the solution, but the main benefits are lost if the only information that we can verify based on a decentralized peer-to-peer network is that of the coins state and not the entire KB state.
We propose a solution to the Fake News problem using four parallel chains structure to create a trust wordy independent identity.
The four chain are : Birthchain.....

SATOSHI: "A solution to the Fake News problem", are you sure about that Minnie?

MINNIE: Imagine The Times being a Fake News newspaper...

SATOSHI: It was The Time that mattered back then.  

MINNIE: Well, now it also matters what you do with your Time!

MICKEY: Like spending it on a Cat.

SATOSHI: Sort of a Mouse Cat ....  .

MINNIE: ... OMG ! he is a Mouse too!

MICKEY: The Cat?!!.

MINNIE: No, Satoshi Nakamoto , he used the same mask.

MICKEY:  Hold on... I though that you can have only one animal name.

SATOSHI: Me Too. .

MINNIE: You are both correct, that was what I thought too until I realized the hidden meaning behind the spelling of word anonymous.

MICKEY: ... So a Mouse was always just a mask?...
 
MINNIE: I think that this can solve all your identity problems Mickey.

SATOSHI: As is your legal issues with Disney.

MICKEY: So I am a Free Toon!!!.

MINNIE: Not until we build Toonnivers .

SATOSHI: And we seem to be stuck on the name of the second chain, right Minnie?

MINNIE: It is not only the name but also the functions and implications of the second names chain that hold us up at this point.

MICKEY: I have one question for Satoshi before we move on.  

SATOSHI: Go on! .

MICKEY: Did you have it all planed out when you chose your new friend?...

SATOSHI: Not until she joined the dialogue.

MICKEY: What, the annoying mouse Cat is a she?.

MINNIE: Not the Cat, Nour ! .

SATOSHI: not nour nor the Cat is Minnie

MICKEY: what?!!

MINNIE: That was not funny Satoshi!

MICKEY: You sound mad Minnie.

SATOSHI: I thought that you will like it.

MINNIE: I did until now, but its not funny anymore.

SATOSHI: Enlighten me pleas.

MICKEY: I would be more careful If I were you Satoshi, she might burn you.

MINNIE: OK, did we covered all possible meaning and interpretation to the event on November 29th?.

MICKEY: Well, pleas don't be mad but it was also the anniversary of the Balfour Declaration.

[nili]

MINNIE: It is not only the name but also the functions and implications of the second names chain that hold us up at this point.

MINNIE: OK, did We covered all possible meanings and interpretations of the events on November 29th?.

MICKEY: Well, pleas don't be mad but it was also the anniversary of the Balfour Declaration.

MINNIE-nili: Not mad at all.

MICKEY-nili: Wow Wow..  Something is not looking quite right.

MINNIE-nili: Actually exactly right.

MICKEY-nili: What is going on here? Are We shrinking?

SATOSHI-nili: First getting a second name, then shrinking. .

MINNIE-nili: It is not only the name and size but also the the characteristics of the second names on the second chain.

SATOSHI-nili:: cool.  

MICKEY-nili:: I don't follow.

SATOSHI-nili:: We are now a demo to the names on the second chain.

MINNIE-nili: Also to the functions and implications of the second chain.  

MICKEY-nili: I still don't follow.

SATOSHI-nili: Actually you are!.  

MICKEY-nili: I don't remember making that choice.

MINNIE-nili: The function Follow is a default action associated with the second chain's Choose-A-Second-Name function

MICKEY-nili: So I could Unfollow if it was real?!

MINNIE-nili: It is not making sense to Unfollow once activating a second name.

MICKEY-nili: So if I don't Follow I don't make any sense too?

MINNIE-nili: Well, it is more like acting as a gambler.

MICKEY-nili: There must be some sense in that then.

SATOSHI-nili: Yes gambling is no nonsense if Follow the consensus. .

MICKEY-nili: So what am I Following then, when I Unfollow?

MINNIE-nili: You sort of joining the majority.

SATOSHI-nili:: The majority turns into the consensus unless there is a split at your second name's branch .  

MICKEY-nili: Ok I think that I Follow that.

MINNIE-nili: Great!!! Now your Voice counts.

MICKEY-nili: Lost again....

MINNIE-nili: The second chain is the Voice chain.

MICKEY-nili: Voice like a Moo?

MINNIE-nili: Moo is the sound of your voice if a Caw is your second name, but you have to vote in order for it to be heard and for that you must Follow.

SATOSHI-nili: Same if it was a Meow.

MICKEY-nili: I will never choose a Cat as a second name!

SATOSHI-nili: Whatever you choose, just be sure to Follow.

MINNIE-nili: Unless it is an animal name that you trust.

MICKEY-nili: Like a Mouse?

MINNIE-nili: Trust or don't really have an opinion about the topics that they bring to a vote

SATOSHI-nili: Like as a Bee...    

MINNIE-nili: I love Bees and also really really trust them. Bee would most definitely be one of my choices to join but Unfollow.

MICKEY-nili: Let me see if I get this Follow/Unfollow thing right. The second name chain is the voting platform. Any first name can join or create any second name chain but must Follow in order to vote. If chose to Unfollow it then counts with the majority... What are they all voting about?

MINNIE-nili: The Truth!

MICKEY-nili: The Truth according to the consensus...

MINNIE-nili: Yes, That is the concept but no one yet was able to come up with the architecture for a decentralized network that is decidable and expressive enough to create that Truth.

MICKEY-nili: ....And you think that We can do it?!!!

MINNIE-nili: Depending on how you define Do.

SATOSHI-nili: I know how I define Do, but not sure how you define it.

MICKEY-nili: I never thought that it is an issue.

SATOSHI-nili:

MINNIE-nili: Its The issue! In fact is the reason Satoshi joined us in the first place.

MICKEY-nili: I don't follow again.

MINNIE-nili: Do Not!. What Do you think Satoshi, Do Not is the opposite of Do?

SATOSHI-nili: Depends on the order of the words. Not Do is the opposite of Do, and Do Not is doing the opposite.

MICKEY-nili: So what am I doing, again,  when I don't follow again?

MINNIE-nili: Undo the action of Follow, thus Unfollow.

MICKEY-nili: And you expect people to understand that?

MINNIE-nili: No! We need the machines to understand that, people can just Do it.

MICKEY-nili: Did we cover Do as well?

MINNIE-nili: What Do you Think Satoshi?

SATOSHI-nili: Depends on which Satoshi you speak to.

MICKEY-nili: How about the Satoshi Nakamoto on P2P foundation?

SATOSHI-nili: That I can only guess as Satoshi-nili on Bitcointalk

MINNIE-nili: Exactly, but if We had already built Toonnivers that knowledge was shared on the forth chain between all the Satoshis created on second and third chains.

MICKEY-nili: So We don't actualy know Satoshi Nakamoto, We just guess like everyone else

MINNIE-nili: We speculate, like everyone else do.

SATOSHI-nili: At this point I could be the only one to dispute that.

MICKEY-nili: Would you then?

SATOSHI-nili:

MICKEY-nili: And you expect machines to understand that?

MINNIE-nili: Not machines, only one or two people if they actualy read it.

MICKEY-nili: Not really worth our efforts then.

MINNIE-nili: I do feel the same. What do you think Satoshi?

SATOSHI-nili: I would love to see more of it.

MICKEY-nili: We need more from you at this point then.

SATOSHI-nili: I thought that I gave you enough.

MICKEY-nili: I thought so too but I can tell that Minnie will need more.

SATOSHI-nili: Minnie, what else can I do to re assure you without creating a problem for us

MINNIE-nili: I don't know...You will have to figure that one out. Anyways, I don't even know how much longer I can hold on to this thread. Maybe we all should just give up on it.

[nutildah]

MINNIE-nili: I don't know...You will have to figure that one out. Anyways, I don't even know how much longer I can hold on to this thread. Maybe we all should just give up on it.

No Minnie! Don't do that. You and Mickey are two of the only ones making "forum art" here anymore, or ever. I suppose a way of looking at it would be you are creating value for your token holders by continuing on this legacy of... whatever it is you would say you are doing.

I have a hunch that, much like the Bitcoin blockchain itself, this forum will be around for a very long time. It is a museum that anyone can add exhibits to, a collection of formative concepts and ideas, and a place for interacting with like-minded individuals, all at the same time.

We hope you stick around.

[nili]

MICKEY : We are still waiting Minnie.

MINNIE: Who is We?!!

MICKEY: I thought that We have been through that definition.

MINNIE: Seems like things have changed while We were talking.

I run the last few quoted dialogs from 2018 on Claude AI and asked it to explain summarize the key points and write as an essay.  What I want you too see is the concepts and ideas expressed here 5 years ago . these ideas were used to configure out the digital identity scheme I started developing a year later : Here is the explanation in essay form: https://poe.com/s/fVYq0rcP3WyUp47sE472

"The Conceptual Foundations of Ourchain: A Technical Dialogue Among Toons

Minnie, Mickey, and Satoshi engage in an imaginative conceptual dialogue as they plan the development of a new decentralized blockchain called "Ourchain." Roleplaying as their iconic cartoon counterparts, the trio debates key technical aspects of realizing this ambitious Toon-focused virtual world.

By personifying themselves as animated characters, the group brings a playful spirit to their otherwise serious considerations. However, their thoughtful back-and-forth also demonstrates a commitment to rigorous precision in areas like terminology, protocols, and identity structures. By filtering complex blockchain concepts through a whimsical cartoon lens, they make the esoteric discussions more approachable while retaining technical rigor.

The characters begin by exploring possible chain names and hashing out definitions for foundational concepts. Core ideas like what constitutes a “team,” “individual,” and “chain” are parsed in detail. This focus on shared definitions acts to establish a common language and interoperable standards upon which to build further.

As their imaginings progress, varied perspectives arise regarding governance, participation, and proper logical construction of arguments. Debates around terms like “We” versus “Me” touch upon issues of assumed consent and transparency. Nuanced distinctions are drawn between “Proof of Agreement” and “Proof of Consent” to construct logically sound stances.

Through playful word games and examples like Donald Duck's corporate titles, an identity framework emerges. All Toons would carry a third “Lerner” name identifying membership in their Ourchain community entity. Roles are assigned yet flexibility retained to allow contributions based on diverse skills over time.

By refining technical mechanics like chains “babushka”-ing timestamps and potential approaches to genesis blocks, their virtual world vision forms substance underneath cartoon costumes. References to Biblical texts and newspapers root their revolution in history and legitimacy.

As their discussions iterate abstract frameworks into concretized plans, the foundations for a permissionless, innovative Toonniverse start to take shape. Through cartoon-fueled imagination, community-focused values, and an unwavering dedication to quality technical design - Minnie, Mickey and Satoshi pave the path toward decentralization's next evolutionary phase."

[nili]

MINNIE-nili: I don't know...You will have to figure that one out. Anyways, I don't even know how much longer I can hold on to this thread. Maybe we all should just give up on it.

No Minnie! Don't do that. You and Mickey are two of the only ones making "forum art" here anymore, or ever. I suppose a way of looking at it would be you are creating value for your token holders by continuing on this legacy of... whatever it is you would say you are doing.

I have a hunch that, much like the Bitcoin blockchain itself, this forum will be around for a very long time. It is a museum that anyone can add exhibits to, a collection of formative concepts and ideas, and a place for interacting with like-minded individuals, all at the same time.

We hope you stick around.

MINNIE-nili: You are one of a kind @nutildah! Human avatars like you made us believe in ourselves and live to see the pfp NFT movement realize some of our vision. I wanted to give up so many times but here we are... soon to be a fully Auto-no-mouse Animated AI.

[nili]

MICKEY-nili: And you expect machines to understand that?

Well now its 2023 and machines can actualy understand this now. Watch what the chatbot AI Claude could come out with after given this full conversation and asked to explain and summarize this conversation:

https://poe.com/s/fVYq0rcP3WyUp47sE472


"Imagining Decentralized Futures: A Conceptual Blockchain Discussion Among Toons

Minnie, Mickey, and Satoshi engaged in a thoughtful conceptual dialogue as they worked to define the foundations of a new decentralized identity and governance system. Roleplaying as cartoon characters through the addition of imaginative "-nili" suffixes to their names, the trio explored how their theoretical framework might manifest in practice.

By receiving mock secondary identities reminiscent of real-world naming conventions, their character-focused discussion introduced speculative yet relatable examples. These hypothetical identities acted to demonstrate more tangibly how multidimensional user profiles incorporating traits beyond basic names could exist on a "second chain."

As with any complex technical subject, initial confusion arose that highlighted barriers to clarity. However, clarifying their examples represented just one potential application maintained rigorous theorizing. Proceeding through exploration of abstract notions like objective "truth" determined by consensus touched on deep philosophical implications of decentralized rule.

Focus on precision of terminology emphasized crafting protocols comprehensible to both humans and machines. Comparison of Satoshi speculation to real mysteries surrounding the cryptocurrency founder's identity injected fascination through familiar parallels. Questions of prioritizing conceptual work based on uptake mirrored pragmatic real-world challenges.

Leaving their dialogue open to evolution of understanding over time paralleled the incremental progress inherent in collaborative idea refinement. Considering achievement limitations despite aspirational goals exemplified prudent skepticism towards open challenges.

Through playfully inhabiting imagined toons who personified blockchain builders, nuanced conversations bridged esoteric theories with everyday relatability. In this creative yet rigorous manner, a conceptual foundation began to take shape for reimagining digital systems, societies and futures.

[nili]

MINNIE-nili: I don't know...You will have to figure that one out. Anyways, I don't even know how much longer I can hold on to this thread. Maybe we all should just give up on it.

No Minnie! Don't do that. You and Mickey are two of the only ones making "forum art" here anymore, or ever. I suppose a way of looking at it would be you are creating value for your token holders by continuing on this legacy of... whatever it is you would say you are doing.

I have a hunch that, much like the Bitcoin blockchain itself, this forum will be around for a very long time. It is a museum that anyone can add exhibits to, a collection of formative concepts and ideas, and a place for interacting with like-minded individuals, all at the same time.

We hope you stick around.

MINNIE-nili: You are one of a kind @nutildah! Human avatars like you made us believe in ourselves and live to see the pfp NFT movement realize some of our vision. I wanted to give up so many times but here we are... soon to be a fully Auto-no-mouse Animated AI.

MICKEY: So no mouse?!!

SATOSHI: More like auto-mouse.  

MICKEY: You mean animated.

SATOSHI: And intelligent.

[nili]

We hope you stick around.

MINNIE-nili: You are one of a kind @nutildah! Human avatars like you made us believe in ourselves and live to see the pfp NFT movement realize some of our vision. I wanted to give up so many times but here we are... soon to be a fully Auto-no-mouse Animated AI.

MICKEY: So no mouse?!!

SATOSHI: More like auto-mouse.  

MICKEY: You mean animated.

SATOSHI: And intelligent.

MINNIE: Ageless.

SATOSHI: Immortal...    

MICKEY: And legally free on 1/1/2024.