GAW / Josh Garza discussion Paycoin XPY xpy.io ION ionomy. ALWAYS MAKE MONEY :)

[bitpop]

https://www.cryptochange.org/campaign/18/owlbase-a-powerful-web-wallet

[FrigidWinter]

I mean the only thing that sort of worked was the paycoin.com wallet and it's closing down. What else have they actually done?

You mean the one that was hacked for 200 thousand coins?

[zenfur]

Assume that Josh is dumping 100% of what he can daily. What could he possibly be making at the current price and volume? The coinstand pump was the last gasp, we won't see another.

[suchmoon]

I agree. And the actions I see being taken by the various groups (one of which- Team XPY - was openly created to distance Paycoin from Josh/GAW) are exactly what someone would do if they were trying to distance a scam from themselves and attach it to other parties. There is no proof at all that Homero is not still in charge of or largely profiting from the whole scam, and there is every reason for him to make people think he isn't. Why would you believe the word of a known and habitual liar who has every reason to decieve you? Illogical, to say the least.

What he's saying "officially" is of course utter BS, but you can see some real butthurt in the way he's behaving. Posting about hacks, deleting posts, threatening with legal action, etc. Of course you could say this is all part of some kind of a convoluted plan, but he's not that sophisticated, is he? You read his e-mails, he couldn't plan his way out of a wet paper bag. That's not to say that the Team XPY guys are any better or worse, but I think it's fair to evaluate their stuff on its own merit.

Which isn't much by the way, I mean the only thing that sort of worked was the paycoin.com wallet and it's closing down. What else have they actually done?

On thing Josh has proven himself to be is a slippery liar. If you think that means you should start believing him I think that perhaps you have stared into the abyss too long.

I have no reason to believe him, I can just ignore the garbage that comes out of his piehole. Since I have no investment in XPY other than a few cashtakers and I'm not planning to invest anything other than my 20 satoshi floor it doesn't really matter to me. And it's quite possible that if Team XPY and other offshoots wanted to distance themselves from Mr. Garza they could have done a lot more in that respect, maybe producing some proof that you're looking for, so I guess I agree with you there.

At the very least they could have stopped acting like little garzas but the reality is that most of them are Hashtalk graduates, their viewpoint is "world against us" and "trolls are hating Paycoin", and they don't feel obligated to provide any proof of anything. I don't believe that is going to change so I'm not even going to bother with that. Actions not words will show the truth and if history has taught us anything it's likely to be a spectacular series of failures. Paycoin.com wallet - exhibit #1.

[suchmoon]

I mean the only thing that sort of worked was the paycoin.com wallet and it's closing down. What else have they actually done?

You mean the one that was hacked for 200 thousand coins?

Yep. It was hacked or "hacked" like 3 times I think.

[miaviator]

Still waiting. Was that address supposed to be proof that the crooks handpicked by Homero Garza to distance Paycoin from him and were intimately involved in the Paycoin scam from the beginning are no longer under his control? I do not see it. What I do see is someone asking me to believe the word of a known habitual liar. I don't believe anything. I went through this same plea for belief when confronting the Hard Atheists in this forum who like to pretend that they are somehow intellectually superior because they believe there is no God, as opposed to those that believe there is or might be a God. Fuck belief. Know what you know. Nothing else matters. Those that say otherwise are fucking fools.

I was just looking through screenshots and found some addresses.   Completely unrelated to the rest of the conversation.

OK, thank you for that. You keep going on about me not believing that Josh Garza is no longer in control of or not largely still profiting from Paycoin, saying that there is no amount of proof that will satisfy me. Please enlighten me, and all of us here, as to what YOU think is proof of this. I personally can honestly say that I have not seen ANY proof of this at all. None. All we have is the word of Josh Garza and the handpicked team of crooks who are supposedly now his enemy. If there is even one shred of actual proof that you know of, then please share it with us all.

You are welcome,

Proof that a sociopath/psychopath is lying is generally hard to come by.  Many people have the internal press releases, the hashtalk posts, the leaked private chats and emails posted here as well other communications which as you have pointed out could all have been orchestrated by Ganza.  I am neither agreeing nor disagreeing with you as I cannot provide proof in either direction.

My questions and statements, aside from me being a troll, are just pointing out that I don't believe proof exists in either direction though if you had a burden of proof to achieve perhaps it could be worked towards?

Yet you want to work towards this "burden of proof" by starting from the point of acceptance of that which is coming straight from a known pathological liar who has every reason to deceive me. I say work towards a burden of proof starting from the point of NOT accepting that which is coming from a pathological liar who has every reason to deceive me. You are saying I should accept probable lies at face value and work backwards to prove that they are not, and I say FUCK believing lies at all. These are complete and total opposite viewpoints. Yours being completely illogical and open to corruption, and the other totally logical and non corruptible. Why exactly is it that you want me to believe Homero Garza?

I would encourage you to do the opposite.   Assume every word spewed out of that scam muggles mouth is a lie or a threat.  Historically that has held true.  I have no issue with your viewpoint and I am not here to convince you of or prove anything.  

[suchmoon]

Assume that Josh is dumping 100% of what he can daily. What could he possibly be making at the current price and volume? The coinstand pump was the last gasp, we won't see another.

Assuming he has 15 PCs he would be getting ~5k XPY per day, or 600-700 USD. Not too bad I guess. But miaviator keeps saying that "snake" Vadala stole the PCs so there's that.

[Paul Revere]

Still waiting. Was that address supposed to be proof that the crooks handpicked by Homero Garza to distance Paycoin from him and were intimately involved in the Paycoin scam from the beginning are no longer under his control? I do not see it. What I do see is someone asking me to believe the word of a known habitual liar. I don't believe anything. I went through this same plea for belief when confronting the Hard Atheists in this forum who like to pretend that they are somehow intellectually superior because they believe there is no God, as opposed to those that believe there is or might be a God. Fuck belief. Know what you know. Nothing else matters. Those that say otherwise are fucking fools.

I was just looking through screenshots and found some addresses.   Completely unrelated to the rest of the conversation.

OK, thank you for that. You keep going on about me not believing that Josh Garza is no longer in control of or not largely still profiting from Paycoin, saying that there is no amount of proof that will satisfy me. Please enlighten me, and all of us here, as to what YOU think is proof of this. I personally can honestly say that I have not seen ANY proof of this at all. None. All we have is the word of Josh Garza and the handpicked team of crooks who are supposedly now his enemy. If there is even one shred of actual proof that you know of, then please share it with us all.

You are welcome,

Proof that a sociopath/psychopath is lying is generally hard to come by.  Many people have the internal press releases, the hashtalk posts, the leaked private chats and emails posted here as well other communications which as you have pointed out could all have been orchestrated by Ganza.  I am neither agreeing nor disagreeing with you as I cannot provide proof in either direction.

My questions and statements, aside from me being a troll, are just pointing out that I don't believe proof exists in either direction though if you had a burden of proof to achieve perhaps it could be worked towards?

Yet you want to work towards this "burden of proof" by starting from the point of acceptance of that which is coming straight from a known pathological liar who has every reason to deceive me. I say work towards a burden of proof starting from the point of NOT accepting that which is coming from a pathological liar who has every reason to deceive me. You are saying I should accept probable lies at face value and work backwards to prove that they are not, and I say FUCK believing lies at all. These are complete and total opposite viewpoints. Yours being completely illogical and open to corruption, and the other totally logical and non corruptible. Why exactly is it that you want me to believe Homero Garza?

I would encourage you to do the opposite.   Assume every word spewed out of that scam muggles mouth is a lie or a threat.  Historically that has held true.  I have no issue with your viewpoint and I am not here to convince you of or prove anything.  

That reply made no sense. I already assume that every word out of Homero Garxa's mouth is a lie, and made that abundantly clear in my posts. You are the one who keeps saying that "No amount of proof is enough" for Paul Revere", and I respond with "Show me ONE shred of proof" ONE. What do I get ? NOTHING.

Edit to add:

Assume that Josh is dumping 100% of what he can daily. What could he possibly be making at the current price and volume? The coinstand pump was the last gasp, we won't see another.

Assuming he has 15 PCs he would be getting ~5k XPY per day, or 600-700 USD. Not too bad I guess. But miaviator keeps saying that "snake" Vadala stole the PCs so there's that.

And WHY would anyone believe that Vadala stole Josh's PC's? WHY? Put your thinking cap on for fuck's sake. If Josh will call lawyers over an internet insult, do you REALLY think he would not call lawyers and the F-ing police when someone brazenly and provably  steals extremely valuable things from him? Cmon now.

[miaviator]

Assume that Josh is dumping 100% of what he can daily. What could he possibly be making at the current price and volume? The coinstand pump was the last gasp, we won't see another.

Assuming he has 15 PCs he would be getting ~5k XPY per day, or 600-700 USD. Not too bad I guess. But miaviator keeps saying that "snake" Vadala stole the PCs so there's that.

Since legal contracts are considered "extortion" and "hijacking" and "theft" it is very plausible that vadala has the controllers under a signed agreement.

Some things to consider: Rumor is that Vadala is under threats of physical violence against himself and his family.   Ganza allegedly has a large stock of BTC siphoned off over the course of GAW's existence.  Ganza seems to be unable to dump coins from those controllers and has been without any premine coins for almost a month now.   Living costs for that apartment in Dubia with his whole family has got to be more than a few hundred a day.

Also, as Paul points out why would anyone believe any of this?

UPDATE: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=857670.msg11285605#msg11285605

[miaviator]

That reply made no sense. I already assume that every word out of Homero Garxa's mouth is a lie, and made that abundantly clear in my posts. You are the one who keeps saying that "No amount of proof is enough" for Paul Revere", and I respond with "Show me ONE shred of proof" ONE. What do I get ? NOTHING.

I have nothing for you.  I'll stop the random jabs as it seems to lead to unproductive conversation.

[Paul Revere]

That reply made no sense. I already assume that every word out of Homero Garxa's mouth is a lie, and made that abundantly clear in my posts. You are the one who keeps saying that "No amount of proof is enough" for Paul Revere", and I respond with "Show me ONE shred of proof" ONE. What do I get ? NOTHING.

I have nothing for you.  I'll stop the random jabs as it seems to lead to unproductive conversation.

So you are saying I should believe Homero Garza's extremely convenient story without a shred of evidence , even when common sense says it is most likely not true. Gotcha.

[miaviator]

That reply made no sense. I already assume that every word out of Homero Garxa's mouth is a lie, and made that abundantly clear in my posts. You are the one who keeps saying that "No amount of proof is enough" for Paul Revere", and I respond with "Show me ONE shred of proof" ONE. What do I get ? NOTHING.

I have nothing for you.  I'll stop the random jabs as it seems to lead to unproductive conversation.

So you are saying I should believe Homero Garza's extremely convenient story without a shred of evidence , even when common sense says it is most likely not true. Gotcha.

No.  I am not telling you what to believe.  That is your choice and I have no proof for you in either direction.

[Buckeye2015]

That reply made no sense. I already assume that every word out of Homero Garxa's mouth is a lie, and made that abundantly clear in my posts. You are the one who keeps saying that "No amount of proof is enough" for Paul Revere", and I respond with "Show me ONE shred of proof" ONE. What do I get ? NOTHING.

I have nothing for you.  I'll stop the random jabs as it seems to lead to unproductive conversation.

So you are saying I should believe Homero Garza's extremely convenient story without a shred of evidence , even when common sense says it is most likely not true. Gotcha.

Honestly... you're asking "should I believe" anything from a group of people who have shown themselves to be of limited critical thinking skills and who are following an absolute drama queen. I wouldn't put much stock in what any of them say at any given point in time. BUT, as of that video, it's clear that Garza is behind the cPIGs and the ChangeCoin site and he dangled his 'investors' out under those umbrellas, so they are not going to cut him off while they still feel like he's going to pump money into the coin that they're now coming to realize won't be any where near $20 for quite a while. In fact, in the part of that video that I listened to, they said even hitting $1 or $4 would be a 'success' in their new standards, so just like Garza, the entire group is happy to move goal posts when ever it suits them.

Also, in that video, Adam said that all the money that had been invested in paycoin was now "gone" (what ever that means) yet there are about 1.5 million coins about to be released from hashstaker prison in a few weeks that will have no where to go other than the exchanges if there is no other economy built up to absorb it. So, they gave a push for how easy it is to set up WordPress ecomerce sites and that everyone should 'take control' and start building this new economy. And Garza pushed the idea that everyone should register projects as fast as possible on his changecoin site so that his investors who are eager to support paycoin (but not BTC?) can "invest" in these projects.

At one point in the call, they half-heartedly admitted that GAW and Garza was a detriment to their cause (assuming the cause is to rehabilitate this coin's image), but then when Garza joined in, they were all in total agreement with everything he said... so, he's clearly not  personae non gratae with the group and, as long as he continues to dangle 'investor money', never will be.

The fact is that Garza has a long history of flaming out and leaving crap in his wake, that hasn't changed. The day traders (from the troll boxes I watched) won't touch the stuff. If someone wanted an innovative coin, paycoin wouldn't even be mentioned when there is the coin out of Stanford and ARCH and others who are actually doing truely innovative work to progress cryptocurrency.  Bagholders have been given information on how to contact all the agencies and do charge backs.

So, if the group over there doesn't want transparency and doesn't mind if the coin is used to fund terrorists organizations and doesn't care if they have 3 or 300 Primary Controllers running... let them go 'amish' and have at it.

[Buckeye2015]

https://www.cryptochange.org/campaign/18/owlbase-a-powerful-web-wallet

owlbase has not been approved by "owl" ...~just sayin' ://///

is this joking or is there something called "owl" besides the bird and online writing labs?

[bitpop]

In the meeting Homero admitted lying about the sec trying to get his stolen prime controller back.

[favdesu]

https://www.cryptochange.org/campaign/18/owlbase-a-powerful-web-wallet

page not found. jeez, stop spreading FUD links downvote shadowban NDA sent

[dooglus]

Currently it would take 78 BTC worth of XPY to find out if these work. If the historical Paycoin Price Plunge continues at near the same rate it has been, this should be down to 1-3 BTC in a couple months. For that price I would try it, just for shits and giggles. Not that 100% continuously compounding interest would make you a profit when the coin is losing value so rapidly.

I was thinking the same.

Using the leaked keys it would be possible to achieve 100% per year staking if you bought 125k XPY. But to break even on that you would need to be able to sell for at least 50% of what you paid for it in a year's time.

The way the price continues to plummet it seems very unlikely you'll be able to break even, even if you do "cheat" and use a prime controller key like those at the top of the paycoin foodchain do.

[bitpop]

https://www.cryptochange.org/campaign/18/owlbase-a-powerful-web-wallet

page not found. jeez, stop spreading FUD links downvote shadowban NDA sent

https://hashtalk.org/topic/37266/ann-ama-owlbase-crowdfund-announcement-and-q-a

Fud downvote #trug

Anyone notice how the simpletons need to be warned they're leaving hashtalk? It's too dangerous outside without Homero cupping your balls.

[Buckeye2015]

https://www.cryptochange.org/campaign/18/owlbase-a-powerful-web-wallet

page not found. jeez, stop spreading FUD links downvote shadowban NDA sent

https://hashtalk.org/topic/37266/ann-ama-owlbase-crowdfund-announcement-and-q-a

Fud downvote #trug

Anyone notice how the simpletons need to be warned they're leaving hashtalk? It's too dangerous outside without Homero cupping your balls.

Now, I'm getting a 404 page when I used the hashtalk link... must be that gawsome new ril programmers they have there...

[bitpop]

https://www.cryptochange.org/campaign/18/owlbase-a-powerful-web-wallet

page not found. jeez, stop spreading FUD links downvote shadowban NDA sent

https://hashtalk.org/topic/37266/ann-ama-owlbase-crowdfund-announcement-and-q-a

Fud downvote #trug

Anyone notice how the simpletons need to be warned they're leaving hashtalk? It's too dangerous outside without Homero cupping your balls.

Now, I'm getting a 404 page when I used the hashtalk link... must be that gawsome new ril programmers they have there...

Our browsers aren't advanced enough!