The question is, why did obama tell us Iraq was a stable, self reliant and sovereignty when it wasn't? His military advisors told him Iraq wasn't ready to go it alone and bush explained why we couldn't leave until it was, so how come obama the smartest president ever and the greatest military leader who caught osama wasn't smarter than bush? And BTW more men died in afg under obama than under bush.

It has been recorded that Herod did things we would consider unbelievable: The non-Christian writer is Macrobius (A.D. 395-423). Here is his comment,

When he [emperor Augustus] heard that among the boys in Syria under two years old whom Herod, king of the Jews, had ordered to kill, his own son was also killed, he said: it is better to be Herod's pig, than his son."

but i'm sure your right that some things in the Bible wouldn't show up in secular writings. If you wish to make that absolute truth that it never happened that's your option

I'm blind because someone points out what they think is a contradiction and i'm suppose to throw my hands up and dismiss everything? Jesus was talking directly to the 11 Apostles when He said that, so it was so with those they came in contact with, and believed, that's not possible? Beyond that i would have to see all Scripture in one context, so there may be a better answer i haven't come across yet, that doesn't mean i take your view as the whole thing being fairytale

18 they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all;

In earlier versions the word serpents are used here, and its parabolic language as described here

Psalm 140:1-4

1Deliver me, O LORD, from the evil man: preserve me from the violent man;

2Which imagine mischiefs in their heart; continually are they gathered together for war.

3They have sharpened their tongues like a serpent; adders' poison is under their lips.

4Keep me, O LORD, from the hands of the wicked; preserve me from the violent man; who have purposed to overthrow my goings.

So here serpents and poison (and other verses) are not actual serpents and poison but are what describe the wicked. So your verse can be seen in that light. There's another verse where Jesus calls a people a generation of vipers

they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well.”

The sick is also looked at 2 ways

Luke5 30;32 But their scribes and Pharisees murmured against his disciples, saying, Why do ye eat and drink with publicans and sinners?

31And Jesus answering said unto them, They that are whole need not a physician; but they that are sick.

32 I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance

Here being sick is being a sinner, which Jesus came to heal, which is Sin. It could give a clue also to how He heals even today, but you do point out a contradiction i can't fully address, just as i don't have every answer

I'm not trying to be like anyone but me, i hope. Jesus was addressing the apostles, but i can see a contradiction if its meant to mean we should be seeing the same things today happening, but i can address some of the language.

Rigon,i said no one is commissioned to offer the proof you are looking for. Its true in those days the Apostles had such power, but no one is doing that today, if they were even you would believe. I also do not have a religious background or remember anything taught in sunday school

I'm not asking anything of you either, and no one can convert anyone, and no one is commissioned to offer the kind of proof you seek

John 20;29 Jesus said to him, Zolace, because you have seen me, you have believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

John 6;44 No man can come to me, except the Father who has sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

So all the preaching in the world by any human can't convert anyone, its only a vehicle

Personal service work is not for the whiny ones, escorts, bartenders and waitresses included, amongst many others.Whiners don't last long in any service trade.

Rather limited, puritanical perspective you have going there. Do you ever dine out or go out for drinks? Do you think all waitresses and bartenders went into their trade willingly? It's a job. They too are service workers and are paid well (at least when I tip them) to keep their emotional baggage away from their work and me.

Sorry Rigon but unless you can prove your God you can't ask others to prove theirs .

Your the one changing the subject of this thread. You would be more believable if you just said your an atheist but you believe in God too. So prove your God exists because i can't see him either

Your God and mine could be the same, the only difference would be is you don't think He inspired the scripture, or the Bible we have today. The problem is no one can prove to someone else how it inspired them to believe it. So i won't debate on your grounds of proof, only you can read it, or study it, and see where it leads you  .

Who said that? 
That you believe in God, but think he has no interaction with mankind, but mainly that any discussion on the Bible would be irrelevant to you because you think its fairytale....is that close enough?

That's fine, the threads not going anywhere and i don't like to rush this either


Rigon, i probably would agree with Zolace on many things biblical, its just not as interesting to go over things agreed on. I don't mind you posting even if its off topic, just would ask you try and say everything in one post when you do or the other context gets pushed aside, but i'm more inclined to comment on the topic, your position is known to me already.

Isis is in Iraq and in Syria not iran and Syria. Look on the map, they started in the north near the Syrian border and moved east to the Kurdish area and then down toward Bagdad. And basically after reading that the more than 60% of Americans approve of air attacks on Iraq and Syria obama asked for our support in doing just that. Now lets see what his plan is when he presents it to congress. Oh, and I noticed that he said "we" when he normally would have said "I", maybe he is figuring it out and realized all that "I" stuff wasn't working.

And do you for one minute think any of the parents, friends or neighbors of those attackers will turn in the violent offenders and demand justice be served and that violent perps be removed from their neighborhood? Time will tell but like the beating in St Louis I won't hold my breath waiting for someone to do the right thing.

The left would have you believe this never happens, that its poor black folk that are attacked every day by angry white mobs and beaten if not murdered by raging white racists. And they make that claim in spite of the hundreds if not thousands of black flash mob videos on the web. That this kind of barbaric mentality even exists in the US is a disgrace to the country as a whole but do you think holder will be out there looking at race based civil rights violations? Hell no, when whites are beat down for being white he calls it justice.

One starts with a large puzzle, and many time the emotional reaction can be that there are pieces missing, something is wrong, etc, with the frustration that can come trying to put the puzzle together.

Yet, in time, it finally does fall into place.  But, the puzzle is not wrong prior to that moment.

That is the position I take with Scripture (and experience has born it out).

I believe what zolace is saying (and if so, I agree) is that it is not an issue of there being REAL contradictions, as apparent contradictions - when trying to see how pieces go together.

I don't see the point . God prepares for them their destiny, just as he prepares many things for judgment and salvation

John 14:2
In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.