It happens in the UK as well, and will happen anywhere that countries don't actively take steps to prevent it. Laissez-faire capitalism is not sustainable in the long-term; governments have a moral responsibility to rein in its excesses, but few do so. The question is, how far can it go this time, before it breaks again?

Yes, the problem is hugely overstated. Painting the blades (or one blade) dramatically reduces the problem. Not that it is much of a problem anyway. Funny how no-one is suggesting banning pesticides. I suspect that the people who raise this as an issue are those who have a vested interest in 'traditional' energy sources.


https://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/green-science/wind-turbine-kill-birds.htm


^{[citation needed]}


Nuclear does have its benefits. One problem is that the climate crisis is worsening year by year. It is questionable whether we have time to build nuclear reactors - it's not a quick option.
On thorium specifically, I think it is over-hyped. Yes the thorium reaction does have the benefit of not producing any transuranics (the dangerous heavy stuff) so it is safer than normal nuclear reactors as regards long-term radioactivity. However it is more dangerous for short-term radioactivity as the cycle proceeds to thallium 208, which has nasty gamma emissions. Also thorium needs something like an extra 500C of heat to prepare the fuel.
Not saying thorium is terrible, just that it's not necessarily better than existing nuclear reactors. Plus the fact that it's not really a proven technology is a cause for concern.

I don't think that a global pandemic that kills millions is a necessity. Official death toll is I think just short of 1 million, and for obvious reasons countries are under-reporting, so the actual total will be higher... but likely not orders of magnitude higher. The world population is 7.6 billion. Just how high a death toll would be needed in order to 'save economies'? Even 80 million deaths, ~100x the official figure, would only reduce the global population by 1%... which is about the same as current world population growth rate. So by this logic we'd need the equivalent of 100 CV19 pandemics every year just to maintain the population at a constant level.

Of course this ignores the fact that far from saving economies, CV19 has had (and will continue to have) a hugely detrimental effect on jobs, wealth and wellbeing.

If there are some people basing their decisions on careful analysis, and other basing theirs on random picks, then this would arguably result in a situation where many of those using analysis end up reaching similar conclusions and making similar picks. I would say that if you are capable of making the analysis, then you could use this information to your advantage. Knowledge of how people think the market will move is extremely valuable - and this is especially true if we are considering some of the smaller crypto markets.

Regardless, I would suggest that giving darts to monkeys is a bad idea.

Costa Rica or indeed any country opening for international tourists is obviously a risk, but as the thread title indicates, this isn't just tourism, it is the balance that governments are striking between the economy and the health of its population. But this is what it has been about everywhere, from the beginning. We saw most countries implement lockdowns far too late, because they valued the economy over health... a stupid gamble, repeated around the world, as a swift lockdown/quarantining of people coming into the country would have meant small initial economic damage, but then no nationwide lockdown. The economic hit would have been much smaller if governments had been willing to take that small amount of damage. But they weren't, we saw over and over again that governments waited until it was too late, and then had to implement full lockdown across the country and suffered huge economic damage as a result. I think this exposes the incompetence of politicians. With a cycle of elections every few years, politicians have an entirely short-term view... and that's what hit them here. They waited until it was too late, because they didn't want to look further ahead and see what effects their inaction might have.

Some nations have learned the lessons better than others. As for whether opening for tourism is an acceptable risk... it depends largely on how it is managed. But given governments' recent records, I wouldn't be surprised to see a second wave of the pandemic.

The first paper, the 'Isolation of Virus' and 'Transmission Electron Microscopy' sections.

I would say that if a paper has been cited 7,000 times, then it's unlikely the paper is wrong, because it means that thousands of different experts have followed up with thousands of other experiments that corroborate and build on the results of the first. This is how science progresses, building on what has gone before. I kind of understand your point, but we have to an extent to assume that experts are experts, if all (or almost all) other experts agree with them. Everything is there to be disproven... but if there is no countervailing evidence, then I think that is a strong indication that the paper's conclusions are correct. We can argue that a paper is incorrect, but I think we are on shakier ground if we try to argue that 7,000 follow-up papers have been written by 7,000 'experts' who are actually incompetent fools.

I've had a go. Obviously I am not a professional epidemiologist, but the below should be useful:

If you want fluid samples and centrifuges, then this is a suitable paper: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7092803/
This paper explains the process using genomic sequencing and electron microscopy: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7045880/
There is also this, which places SARS-CoV-2 in its genetic family: https://nextstrain.org/groups/blab/sars-like-cov
Finally, the SARS-CoV-2 Wikipedia page also contains a lot of background information and further links: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Severe_acute_respiratory_syndrome_coronavirus_2

You can also go to Google Scholar to find out how often a paper has been cited by others. For example, the first one on my list has been cited nearly 7,000 times:
https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=%22A+Novel+Coronavirus+from+Patients+with+Pneumonia+in+China%2C+2019%22&btnG=

Indeed, and not just Africa. Problems today in Syria, Iraq and the wider Middle-East are due to how the British and French agreed to carve up the carcass of the Ottoman Empire after WW1. Imperialism/colonialism casts a long shadow down the decades. Nations, lands and tribal groupings have been carved up with absolutely zero regard for any local considerations. Any then these nations leave without cleaning up any of the mess they created.

It's a fair point. I suppose my response would be that a lot of the problems are due to the way that colonial powers depart. They tend to just leave abruptly, rather than carefully managing the transition. This dramatic and sudden shift to a new society causes civil unrest and often a power vacuum. This sort of society is then much easier to exploit than a mature democracy would be. This is why we so often see the military sweeping to power in Africa, and once that happens it is difficult to establish any form of democracy.

However there are some signs of improvement. Wikipedia only lists two current military dictatorships across the continent, compared to a huge number in recent history:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_dictatorship#Africa

Thanks! I'd forgotten that already, despite reading it only a few hours ago.

I shouldn't have brought that up, sorry.

I will concede the point. I will also concede that confirmation bias exists. Most things we do are based on belief. But whilst it's important to question the information we receive, it's also true that some sources are more reliable than others. This is why I would always side with science over faith. Anything that is experimentally verifiable and reproducible, and that has been peer-reviewed, is (to me) more reliable. I don't trust politicians at all, but I trust scientists more, especially when they are recognised as experts in their field. If I wanted my teeth fixed, I would visit a dentist rather than a carpenter. If I wanted someone to diagnose why I keep getting headaches, I'd visit a doctor rather than a plumber. If I wanted someone to explain about a viral pandemic, I'd trust renowned epidemiologists rather than politicians. The science is there, and it's not just one or two scientists, it's an overwhelming consensus. This is the crucial point, the weight of numbers.

I do realise that I'll never be able to convince you that anything I'm saying is correct. Equally, it's highly unlikely you'll ever manage to convince me that viruses don't exist. Or that consuming industrial bleach MMS improves your health.

Just as a point of curiosity - do you believe the excess death figures, i.e. that something is leading to a much greater than usual death toll this year? If so, what do you think that might be?

Agreed. They prove that something is killing a lot more people this year than would be expected from the historic average. And that this excess mortality started up around the same time as the pandemic. And that it spanned the world.

I think this is pretty strong evidence that it is CV19. And there is zero evidence that it's anything else.

@Coyster - I would argue that it's not that simple. History teaches us that when a colonial power leaves, the country doesn't just revert seamlessly back to its pre-colonial state. They leave behind power vacuums, or a system of hatred where the colonialist's local allies are left defenceless (Rwanda after Belgium left being a prime example). Sometimes they only leave in name, with 'free' elections rigged (example: https://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2007/08/377883.html) or puppet rulers installed. Often the departure is rushed and botched - because the colonialists are ceding all control, they have no interest any more in helping to manage the transition. Look at the mess of the Indian partition as an example here.

Colonialism leaves deep scars, and yes, even 50 years may not be long enough. Much of the instability in the Middle-East today can be traced back to the arbitrary divisions created by the British and the French more than a century ago, in the Sykes-Picot agreement (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sykes%E2%80%93Picot_Agreement).

The world is not a level playing-field, with equal opportunities for all. Africans start at a severe disadvantage, due in large part to historic injustices perpetrated by the West.

Have a look at the data rather than media reports. In order to bypass any government interference in causes of death, it may be more appropriate to look at excess mortality instead - the number of people dying from any cause this year, as compared to the recent average.
The Economist has presented the data quite well. https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2020/07/15/tracking-covid-19-excess-deaths-across-countries

Deaths start to deviate (increase) considerably from the expected value around late March/early April in a lot of countries...


We might also consider the extent of any discrepancy between excess deaths and official Covid deaths to be suggestive of the degree of honesty (or competence) of a government when ascribing cause of death.



^{[citation needed]}

He doesn't need to do it, but the fact is that he can do it with impunity. Putin is untouchable in Russia, and so is able to crush all opposition. And as recent history has shown, other countries will do nothing to stop him. China is an ally, the US under Trump has turned its back on the world, the EU is scared.

Every time he does something like this, and the only effect is a bit of grumbling in the international community, it encourages him to do the same again in the future. And each time he does so, it reinforces his strong-man image. We see the same behaviour with other powerful countries, most notably China's approach towards Hong Kong.

The point is though, if you are 20yo with no underlying health conditions, then you can contract the virus and (likely) suffer only very mildly... but crucially you will act as a carrier and can pass the virus on to people who are older and more vulnerable, or who have a compromised immune system. The reason that healthy people have to isolate and quarantine is to protect others rather than just themselves. The fact that people are complaining about this is perhaps more than anything indicative of the selfishness endemic to modern societies.

A healthy 20yo can go out to a party on the weekend, contract Covid-19, and then turn up at their job at a care home on the Monday morning, and kill people.

Yes, the link with coinmarketcap is likely to increase the profile of the coin significantly, and this in turn could well lead to an increase in price. It's interesting, we've had Coinbase Earn for a while, and now coinmarketcap is getting in, too. Of course there are as usual geographical limitations, in this case with no US involvement... but still, overall you'd imagine this campaign is a positive for both coinmarketcap and Band.

The main reason for the struggles of Africa today is the centuries of exploitation at the hands of (largely European) colonialists.
As for why Africa, as the birthplace of civilisation, is not the most advanced continent, one possible reason is that the continent's geography hampered development. It is often overlooked how vital navigable rivers are for establishing a prosperous trading society... and Africa's rivers are not particularly well suited for this, with plenty of rapids, waterfalls and shallows. Compare to say North America, with wide open rivers across the continent.

They're not mutually exclusive; they're the same thing.

Do you agree that exposure to mild pathogens in everyday life helps to boost the immune system? That, for example, a lot of the allergies that are so common these days are due in part to kids being brought up in overly sanitised environments?

Vaccines work by exposing the body to a weakened form of the virus, in order to train the immune system to repel the real thing.

If we don't have vaccines, we are effectively going into battle unprepared. We've discussed polio before. How about smallpox? Diptheria? Are you really contending that a world with no vaccines against these would be preferable? What about rising cases of measles due to anti-vaxxers?

Sleeping well, eating a healthy diet, sunbathing / optimizing vitamin D levels, etc. do not stop the spread of a pandemic, either.
A lot of the time, it does feel like I'm the only pro-vaccine person on this forum...

I agree that the pharmaceutical industry make huge profits and a lot of it is highly immoral. You don't have to look any further than Martin Shkreli to understand that this is the case. But the pharmaceutical industry also saves lives. Like most things, there are good and bad aspects.

I also agree that fostering a healthy immune system through sensible diet and exercise is a very good idea. A healthy immune system improves your chances of a good outcome whatever ailment you contract. It lessens the chances of severe effects, it lessens the chances of dying.... but it doesn't prevent these things, it doesn't magically confer immunity.