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421  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: OUCH! More Bad Bitcoin News... on: February 14, 2014, 04:28:27 AM
Meanwhile, the people that DO cause these reductions in price are exactly the people that don't hold a lot of bitcoins because they immediately panic and sell when they hear one of these news stories.

Well, remember that you also always have those who are going to sell off when something happens that looks like it will depress the price with the intent of taking a round of profits and then buying back in at the bottom.  To make money, the speculators have to be right while others are being fools.
422  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: OUCH! More Bad Bitcoin News... on: February 14, 2014, 04:22:00 AM
That's a good point.  I'm still new to bitcoin.  Any chance the US would ever make it illegal?

The question basically amounts to asking is it possible a government will do something insanely stupid in the future.  Yes, of course it is.

However, all the indicators seem to be that the move is toward regulation and not prohibition.  I think what is much more likely is that there will, at some point, be some incredibly burdensome and ill considered regulation that harms the market.  Since the feds, remarkably, seem to be behaving more or less rationally, I think this is most likely to come from the states.  For some reason, my crystal ball has some crusading New York State (or possibly California or New Jersey) prosecutor taking some ludicrous position on Bitcoin.  (Of course, the current Florida prosecution could be the thin edge of the wedge.)  Just call it a hunch.
423  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Contrary to Mt.Gox’s Statement, Bitcoin is not at fault - Gavin Andresen 10/2/14 on: February 14, 2014, 04:04:01 AM
If Bitcoin is not at fault, why are the Bitcoin developers working hard to fix the issue now... Yeah...  Roll Eyes

Obviously, because it is now a public relations issue.  So more compelling technical issues are being shunted aside to deal with this comparatively trivial issue because of Gox's actions.

Only because of Gox's fuckup and subsequent FUD has this difficult to fix but comparatively minor flaw suddenly become a priority, basically for PR reasons.
424  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: Filed a request for an administrative ruling with FinCEN this morning. on: February 14, 2014, 03:59:26 AM
You have my applause.  It is a well drafted document and an intelligent request to make.  Hope the response is as prudent.
425  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: Everyone Panic. There's a lawyer among us. [FinCEN Walkthrough on p2] on: February 14, 2014, 03:54:21 AM
I will point out that Tangible Cryptography (BitSimple) filed a request with FinCEN for an administrative ruling on the issue of whether an exchange between two individuals is money transmission, asserting that it is not.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=224553.0


Thanks for pointing this out.  It is a good idea.  I hope it has good results.
426  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: State of Florida attacks Bitcoin on: February 13, 2014, 08:56:17 PM
Why don't you ask one of these family members if drug cartels and money laundering used to support their activities are "victimless" crime.

I don't need to ask them.  I have logic.  As others have pointed out, when alcohol was prohibited, murder related to alcohol smuggling crimes skyrocketed.  Is drinking a beer therefore inherently a heinous crime? 

Obviously not.

Citing the costs prohibition itself creates is not a great argument for prohibition.  In fact, you just cited reasons prohibition is an abject failure and should be abandoned.
427  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: State of Florida attacks Bitcoin on: February 13, 2014, 06:14:54 PM
Is the actual act of money laundering a "victimless crime"?

Considering that the crime itself is predicated on other crimes, I'd say it really depends on the crime the proceeds of which are laundered.

If, as in this case, the proceeds are presumably either from or going to be used to purchase stolen credit cards, yes, there are inherently victims in the actually completed crime, even if there are no actual victims.
428  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: Everyone Panic. There's a lawyer among us. [FinCEN Walkthrough on p2] on: February 13, 2014, 05:57:57 PM
If you're just doing small trades as a trader for yourself, and not as a business, you might not have to, but I would certainly talk to an attorney!

Attorneys charge money for talking with you.  Just this prices the cautious casual dealer out of the market, or forces them to charge exorbitant fees themselves.

Yet another example of the actual real-world costs of "regulatory uncertainty."  Such a vague-sounding phrase, but hits you right in the wallet in reality.
429  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: New Mt Gox Press Release - Feb 10 - they are claiming flaw in bitcoin protocol ! on: February 13, 2014, 05:19:33 PM

Fuck this smug, fat cocksucker.

I wish he were a tenth as good at doing his job as he is at damage control and deflecting blame.
430  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: New Mt Gox Press Release - Feb 10 - they are claiming flaw in bitcoin protocol ! on: February 13, 2014, 05:17:55 PM
Mt.Gox is blaming the core-devs while they *could* implement a fix (apparently) and keep their business running.

The devs don't have a "business."  They're maintaining an open source project.  They don't need this terrorism.

Also, they can't simply just roll out a fix.  That idea is bullshit, and is basically Gox propaganda.  First, any problems resulting from this non-optimal implementation are easily avoidable by people who are not morons, but second, fixing it will take literally years.  This isn't because of the inherent technical issues, but because it will require re-writing existing clients as well.  So the devs can't just roll out a fix, the community has to absorb the brunt of the change as well.

The devs may be wizards, but they're not gods, and at this point, Bitcoin is widespread enough a lot of the software people are using is NOT under their control.  Wreaking havoc to fix Gox's problem is not something that makes any sense.
431  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: Everyone Panic. There's a lawyer among us. [FinCEN Walkthrough on p2] on: February 13, 2014, 05:12:51 PM
There's a lot of nasty things that FinCEN potentially could do, but until they actually try it, there's not much basis to sue them.

I certainly didn't suggest suing them.  Nobody I can think of would have standing to do it, since they haven't done anything and do not appear to be about to do anything.  I was just pointing out they're the 800 pound gorilla in the room.  May be calmly eating bananas at the moment, but you always worry maybe he'll decide to eat you instead.  So maybe you don't set up a lemonade stand 20 feet from him.
432  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: State of Florida attacks Bitcoin on: February 13, 2014, 05:05:15 PM
The question I'm attempting to answer is "Who's the victim?", not "What is the crime?"

Clearly, in this case, there is no specific victim.  The crime was imaginary and the victims nonexistent.  Similarly, if you tried to hire a hit man to "rub out the guy who ratted on me" and there was no actual rat, there would be no actual victim.  However, murder-for-hire is not a victimless crime.  It inherently intends to have a victim and where one exists, that victim will be harmed.  Similarly, selling stolen credit card numbers is inherently a crime where there are victims, if the crime is completed.

I generally interpret the term "victimless crime" to mean "crimes" where inherently, there are no victims.  So, for instance, purchasing drugs is a victimless crime.  Thinking "bad" thoughts or expressing them is a victimless crime.  Any act which does not impair someone else in the exercise or enjoyment of their rights is victimless, and should never be subject to punishment by the state.
433  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: State of Florida attacks Bitcoin on: February 13, 2014, 05:00:40 PM
It will be interesting if the defendant testifies that he can always tell when someone is lying, so he knew the buyer didn't know anyone in Russia. 

Depending on how they interpret the specific intent requirement in Florida, that might actually be a defense, as silly as it sounds.  Of course, the fact-finder would have to believe or at least have reasonable doubt as to that intent.  For example, suppose the defendant testified that due to his personal knowledge of the buyer, he knew that the buyer was a milquetoast who really wanted to buy embarrassing, but entirely legal porn and made up this story to seem like a badass.

(Incidentally, while this may be a defense against the full monty money laundering charge, there are quite possibly lesser included offenses of money laundering that apply without specific intent.)

At that point, no crime there, unless you buy the state's rather contrived theory about unlicensed money transmitting businesses.  Incidentally, the latter is the far more worrisome potential consequence of this case, especially if adopted at the federal level, and there is some statutory basis for it.
434  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: "I met Satoshi Nakamoto in my mirror" - Kim Dotcom on: February 13, 2014, 02:44:55 AM
Who thinks he will beat the case against Kim Dotcom VS Hollywood!

The New Zealand courts basically threw out most of the evidence against him as being illegally obtained.  I wish them luck.  Actually, I don't.  I wish they'd find a fire, then jump in it and die in it.

They now have a tough case, though.  I'm sure they'd rather extradite him to the United Snakes where he can be waterboarded and held forever without any charges.
435  Bitcoin / Legal / Re: Everyone Panic. There's a lawyer among us. [FinCEN Walkthrough on p2] on: February 13, 2014, 01:47:52 AM
Its not so much a misinterpretation if you look at the question asked, though agree that it is very much a stretch.
Poster was looking for some general constitutional support for putting the breaks on this sort of FinCEN abuse, and there isn't much there on this matter.

What sort of FinCEN abuse?  What specifically have they done that violates someone's rights?

If you want a constitutional challenge, there would need to be something specific that you have a right to do, that FinCEN told you that you can't do.

Well, I'd say simply having to register to be able to sell BTC would be an issue.  FinCEN, as much as it has a lot of bad things at its disposal that it has not, in fact, done to date, has a fairly lengthy history of creating regulatory uncertainty and then suddenly prosecuting some practice that has been, to date, tolerated.  While I am not a full-bore anti-government loon by any stretch of the imagination, and in fact, FinCEN's public official statements to date have been actually pretty welcome and reasonable, there is still an environment of regulatory uncertainty.

In some senses, this is good.  Sometimes, you really don't want the government all that interested in what you're doing at the moment.  However, it makes it rather difficult for large-scale money and venture capital to make long term decisions when they are considering rolling out physical infrastructure and other things that can't be rolled back and turned back into money should the situation change.  A lot of the kind of tech necessary for large-scale investments in Bitcoin is going to be stuff that is useful for nothing other than Bitcoin.  Therefore, a big investment in this kind of stuff would be rendered worthless by sudden prohibitive actions by the government.  This scares away that kind of big money.

Personally, I don't think FinCEN has yet abused its position, with regard to Bitcoin anyway.  But the possibility of it doing so is always going to be a variable.

I think the probability that Congress would do something insanely stupid if it did anything with regard to Bitcoin is a reason to prefer the current situation.  But that doesn't eliminate the downside of regulatory uncertainty.
436  Economy / Gambling / Re: SealsWithClubs.eu | Largest Bitcoin Poker Site | No Banking | Fast Cashouts on: February 13, 2014, 01:42:23 AM
The longer before late registration, the better.  "Never" would be my preferred time frame.

It's a bug, not a feature.
437  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: "I met Satoshi Nakamoto in my mirror" - Kim Dotcom on: February 13, 2014, 01:29:24 AM

It's a pretty arrogant and unwarranted claim, par for the course for Kim Dotcom.  I like that fat cocksucker anyway.
438  Other / Politics & Society / Re: EPA Bans Most Wood Burning Stoves In a Corrupt Scheme, Fireplaces Next on: February 12, 2014, 04:48:48 PM
I actually do lean in this direction quite a bit.  And why isn't it reasonable to presume that if you have x number of people "doing a job", then if you have 3x or 4x number of people "doing that job" it will be that much more objectionable and intrusive?



So you presume that if it takes a man a minute to dig a post-hole, that 60 men can dig a post-hole in one second?
439  Other / Politics & Society / Re: EPA Bans Most Wood Burning Stoves In a Corrupt Scheme, Fireplaces Next on: February 12, 2014, 04:42:10 PM
....

But if you actually care about the environment, you've just created an entire generation of people who hate your guts, and think you're a bunch of fascists, and actually, they're right.

Extremists serve no purpose but their own.  Beware whoever claims to love humanity.  Because they don't like YOU.

I see the causative factors of rule making like this quite differently.  There is no need to ascribe it to extremists, who are yes, quite interesting, but rare.

Suppose we envision two possible futures. 

(1) 100,00 people getting college degrees that serve no purpose in the open society and free market, but who find that with those degrees, they can get jobs with the EPA. 

(2) 50,000 people getting similar degrees and similarly getting jobs with the EPA.

(2) will yield twice as many rules and regulations, won't it?  It's all pretty simple, really.

Only if you assume there's some constant that correlates number of people getting degrees with pages of regulations.  That isn't actually the case, nor is it even the case that rules and regulations themselves directly correlate to evil, assuming evil is some measurable value.

A lot of what is called "deregulation" isn't.  A lot of times, some measure is proposed as "deregulation" and after it's done, if you count up the pages of "regulations," they're much larger.  What was called "deregulation" was simply a list of exceptions for the purchasers of the "deregulation."  When corporate sponsors purchase "deregulation," what they generally mean is deregulating THEM.  Not you or me.

Also, extremists themselves may be rare, but they're often influential or at least used as tools by the more powerful. 

The Sue-and-Settle Racket, an article by Forbes (yes I know) on the practice of setting policy you can't get through the legislature by having a "friendly" group sue you, then settling out of court on pre-arranged terms allowing you to do what you can't get passed into law.

I actually sometimes agree with policies that get enacted with this kind of shit, but it is obviously pernicious to have policy set in what amounts to a corrupt bypass of democracy.
440  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: New Mt Gox Press Release - Feb 10 - they are claiming flaw in bitcoin protocol ! on: February 12, 2014, 03:40:33 PM
Agreed ...the jury is still VERY much out that this is a systemic problem affecting anyone but GOX

Bitstamp are just check to confirm due to the mud being flung by GOX

I do believe it's a widespread problem, but not systemic.  It isn't inherent to the protocol.  It's just a best practices thing where less-than-best has become very common.  Some (Bitstamp) are responding sensibly to it, while others (the Magic the Gathering folks) are spreading FUD and trying to cover their ass.

I think we can see which response has better results already.
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