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1  Economy / Speculation / Re: Bitcoin is Undervalued vs Gold. Here is my thesis. on: December 20, 2023, 09:47:35 PM
imo you've computed the minimum value we can attribute to bitcoin.

but i'd probably give bitcoin more then a 0% for "track record", especially now that bitcoin is about to get a stamp of approval  Cool

also... it might be more fair to estimate the Total amount of gold available on earth and use that to calculate gold's market cap and compare that to bitcoin's 21million max supply.

Just to clarify, Bitcoin already has 0% for 'track record'. Gold beats Bitcoin in that category so that means Gold gets 100 points vs Bitcoin 0 points in that dimension.

The main variable is that I consider Bitcoin to be 35% as good as gold (all the points stuff just leads up to that 35%, so if you think maybe Bitcoin is 50% as good as gold overall you can just work with that % instead).
2  Economy / Speculation / Bitcoin is Undervalued vs Gold. Here is my thesis. on: December 20, 2023, 08:37:23 PM
Cast your mind back to mid-October. The price of Bitcoin was $27K, bulls were waiting for confirmation of a spot ETF, and bears were waiting for one last capitulation. Since then the price has increased +55% to $42K at the time of writing; the price briefly hit $44k in early December. The price rally was driven by rumours that the SEC will confirm the spot ETF - they actually delayed the decision to Q1 24 - and speculation that the FED will reduce interest rates. Regardless of whether you are a bull or a bear, everyone trading or investing in Bitcoin wants to know: what is Bitcoin really worth?

One way to estimate the true value of Bitcoin is to benchmark it against something else. Bitcoin is commonly compared to Gold. This post will estimate the true value of Bitcoin by using Gold as a benchmark. Fidelity Digital Assets, a subsidiary of Fidelity Investments, has completed the first step of benchmarking Bitcoin vs Gold by comparing the fundamentals. See this link and comparison chart below. The conclusion is that as a store of value, Bitcoin is better or equal to gold in six out of seven characteristics. Gold beats bitcoin for a longer track record. Overall I agree with their assessment.

https://i.imgur.com/WN1aASj.png

To estimate the true value of Bitcoin, we need to build upon Fidelity’s work. One weakness of this comparison chart is that some categories are more important than others. I have assigned an importance to each category below. This is subjective. Someone could make it more objective, but it would make the analysis more painstaking to complete and I don’t think my importance ratings will be majorly controversial anyway.

https://i.imgur.com/n2M1WZV.png

The largest consequence of my importance ratings is that Gold is going to get a favourable comparison vs Bitcoin for winning the ‘track record’ category which has 65% importance. I think that is cautiously fair. The largest advantage of Gold is that it has been used as a store of value for over 2,500 years and I think track record is an important characteristic for most investors. Crypto investors evidently don’t care about track record, but outside of crypto a lot of investors do care. I have avoided making any dubious assumptions that benefit Bitcoin in this benchmarking analysis. I would prefer to make a confident estimate that ‘Bitcoin is worth at least X’ instead of a dubious claim that ‘Maybe Bitcoin could be worth up to X’. For example, I think I have been harsh on Bitcoin to say that ‘verifiable’ only has a 14% importance. This is an important characteristic and Bitcoin is much more verifiable than Gold. So my end calculation will under-value Bitcoin if you agree verifiable is actually more important than 14%.

Next I want to quantify the exact difference between Bitcoin and Gold given Fidelity’s ratings and my importance ratings. The first step is to assign arbitrary points for each category. The winner of a category gets 100 points, the loser gets zero points, and for a draw both Bitcoin and gold get 50 points each. Here is how the results look:

https://i.imgur.com/UOa7Vu0.png

Bitcoin investors might be shouting ‘Stop the count!’ at this point because Bitcoin looks like a better store of value than Gold. But we have not considered the importance of each category just yet. Gold is going to perform much better once we factor in the importance of ‘track record’. To consider category importance, I calculated a weighted score by multiplying the points by importance. The results are shown below.

https://i.imgur.com/vcZrqfA.png

Bitcoin scores 26 vs gold 74 after we consider the importance of each category. This result is more meaningful if you put it into a percentage: Bitcoin is 35% as good as Gold as a store of value (26/74 = 35%). This 35% is a key figure that will be used to value Bitcoin in the remainder of this post. If you disagree with 35% that’s fine, you can replicate the steps below with a different figure. For example, if you think Bitcoin is half as good as Gold, you can use 50%. To estimate the value of one bitcoin we need to gather the remaining inputs for our calculation: (Market cap of Gold * % used for investing * 35%) / supply of bitcoin.

According to Infinite Market Cap, the market cap of Gold is $13.7 trillion. The small print mentions that the market cap is the total value mined. What we are interested in is the market cap of Gold used for investing because that is the market Bitcoin is trying to capture. Bitcoin can’t be used for jewellery. According to wikipedia: “The world's consumption of new gold produced is about 50% in jewellery, 40% in investments, and 10% in industry”. The exact percentages are debated because Gold reserves are not regularly audited (if at all). A few other sources tend to gravitate around a 40% figure. So we will stick with 40%. Lastly there is a maximum of 21 million bitcoin that will ever exist. Not all Bitcoin has been mined yet, and some has been lost. But I will use 21 million to err on the side of a pessimistic estimate.

Put this all together and you can estimate the value of one bitcoin as ($13.7 trillion * 0.40 * 0.35) / 21 million = $91,833.

I like this analysis for three reasons. (1) It is based on the value of Gold which is a moving target and Bitcoin has a real opportunity to capture some of this market. (2) The assumptions are pretty ‘safe’. I think the biggest underlying assumption is the belief that if Bitcoin is 35% as good as Gold it should also be worth 35% of the addressable market. (3) It passes the ‘eyeball test’. The logic makes sense and the end result is a believable number.

If someone wanted to, they could also repeat this process for other markets that Bitcoin could capture. For example Bitcoin might partly capture market share of the reserve currency market cap or the real estate investment market cap. Then you could add the Gold benchmark + reserve currency benchmark + real estate market benchmark to have a final number.

For now, I am content believing that one bitcoin is worth $92K which could deliver a 119% ROI for anyone buying at the current market price.

Btw, if anyone wants a minimalist website to track the price of bitcoin over the next bull market cycle, I made DefiDive.com

TLDR:

Valuation calculation vs gold = (market cap of gold * percentage used for investing * percentage of market bitcoin should capture) / supply of bitcoin

= ($13.7 trillion * 0.40 * 0.35) / 21 million = $91,833.
3  Economy / Services / Re: RIOBET.COM Signature and Avatar campaign(OPEN) on: July 02, 2022, 07:02:20 AM
Bitcointalk Username: Blatchcorn
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4  Economy / Services / Re: [OPEN] [banned mixer] | What Matters is YOUR Privacy | Signature Campaign ~ 5x Sr. on: June 27, 2022, 09:04:08 AM
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5  Economy / Services / Re: 👉 {OPEN} Betplay.io Casino [Supports BTC Lightning Network] Signature Campaign. on: June 27, 2022, 09:01:47 AM
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6  Economy / Services / Re: Roobet.com | Art Contest "Summer '22" | $4950 Up for grabs! Ends July 31st! on: June 21, 2022, 06:00:37 PM
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8  Economy / Services / Re: [OPEN] Win.com | Play-to-Earn Gaming Infrastructure for Web3 | Sig Campaign Sr.+ on: June 08, 2022, 02:47:18 PM
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9  Economy / Services / Re: 1x₿it.com | Benefit Season Signature Campaign | Members + Up to $100/week [OPEN] on: June 08, 2022, 07:22:12 AM
Not interested. Deleting in 24 hours.
10  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] Xcavator - A Crypto Utility Token for Crypto Mining on: June 06, 2022, 06:33:15 PM
All money you generate will go to mining top coins like btc, etheruem etc. In days when bitcoin mining is too expensive is it wise move to go for mining such coins ? Secondly what's the utility of your token. What can it be used for? IMO a token without utility won't be of much use.
11  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: taking out a loan for a sports bet on: June 06, 2022, 05:06:36 PM
As I understand it, you received insider information ....

However, insider information can also be false.  It is possible that you will be deliberately misled.  It is also possible that the source of the insider information was (in turn) misled.  In any case, you can get into a very dangerous situation.  If your venture fails, you will not be able to repay the loan and pay the accrued interest. 

The bank is very cruel to debtors.  It passes the receivables to collectors.  Collectors take all measures to collect the debt from the debtor. 

In my opinion, the only situation where a bank loan is justified is the purchase of real estate.  Real estate is a very expensive asset.  It is difficult to buy property without a mortgage.

There is no guarantee whether insider information is correct or not, then why taking risk of loan. Bansk AFAIK does'nt approve loans for gambling, obviously you will give some wrong info to get your loan approved. Banks are never in loss they have something in there hand which you pledge againest your loan. Take loan for safe investments like real estate as you mentioned.
12  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: PROS AND CONS OF CRRYPTOGAMBLING. on: June 06, 2022, 04:45:45 PM

Countries that banned gambling wouldn't ban it for no reason. I believe that they have huge reasons for banning gambling in their country regardless of the huge taxes that they could get from it. Once they ban it, I don't think they aren't firm with their decision. Banning also has pros and cons in each country and I'm sure that the government focuses on the cons that made them ban it.

You can defiantly ban gambling in a country like placing ban on casinos and blocking online casinos but there is no way you can ban crypto gambling. The biggest pros of crypto gambling is that it opens window of gambling for people living in gambling restricted region. But the other side of this advantage is that kids under 18 years are also getting addicted of gambling. I would say crypto gambling has more side effects then good effects.
13  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: 2022 FIFA World Cup in Qatar - UEFA Qualifiers on: June 06, 2022, 04:34:08 PM
Too bad they had to fail at the end and Wales became the club that kept this squad from going to the world cup.
They played very dominant in terms of ball possession and chances created but Wales played quite tightly and Andriy Yarmolenko's own goal became the only goal that was created here and made them have to return home and could not participate in the World Cup

There's heaps of memes spreading all through the web. I don't know whether such exercises right or wrong however no more discussions about Ukraine. To be honest thing were going unbearable additionally undeniable to pass it. Ukraine tried their best, sadly karma wasn't their side and their fantasy about making World Cup 2022 officially shut down.

Yes I do agree that lets just end this conversation about Ukarine. Under current circumstances Ukarine team did there best to make it to the final and unfortunately they weren't able to win it. As far as own goal from Yarmolenko is concerned, its just part of the game and it happens in crucial game. Net result is both teams were equally good and in the end we have only one winner and in this case its Wales.
14  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: taking out a loan for a sports bet on: June 06, 2022, 03:02:49 PM
Taking loan for gambling is just like jumping in river without knowing swimming. What if you lose the bet from loan money? You will take more loan to repay the loan. IMO gambling must be taken as a secondary form of entertainment and only invest as much as you can  afford to lose there. Never ever think of taking loan for betting.
15  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: 2022 FIFA World Cup in Qatar - UEFA Qualifiers on: June 06, 2022, 02:59:40 PM
But in the match they will continue to play professionally, even though Ukraine is in trouble it doesn't mean Wales will give an easy win. Honestly, considering the last match of Ukraine against Scotland at least it makes this match difficult to predict. At least just to convince myself about which team will be right to choose as the winner for betting, because I think the quality of the two teams is not much different and therefore from the odds it appears that there is no team with the most favorites in this match.

Finally we have end to this quiz that which one from Scotland,  whales or ukraine will make it to fifa World Cup. Andriy Yarmolenko own goal in 34 minute shattered ukarine dreams of making it to fifa World Cup 2022. Almost all counties less Wales wanna see ukarine in world cup.
16  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Will owning 0.01 BTC really make you rich? on: June 05, 2022, 04:51:06 AM
Right now on Preev.com 0.01 BTC is 297 USD. So you can easily see what that means if you own a 0.01 BTC, Price of BTC fluctuates and if it crosses 100k mark then 0.01 BTC will have some decent value. I would say there is no amount of bitcoin that can make you rich because we are not clear on what lies ahead. BTC is sometimes on 60k, sometimes on 29k.
17  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: How do you feel when the market is downtrend? on: June 05, 2022, 04:44:23 AM
So always be grateful when the market goes down, it gives us many lessons, lessons about emotions, lessons about capital management, trust and patience.

This is true that market is down there is so much to learn. Normally everyone is happy when market is up and not other way around. But your real test is when market is going down. No market can go up all the time, market always take correction and that correction may last for weeks, months or years. Your real test of patience is when market is down not when it up.
18  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: FIFA 2022 world cup on: June 05, 2022, 04:35:10 AM
Well , for me , this will be the first World Cup that will be held during the Winter and I must say that it will be an unique experience for almost everyone as Fifa is doing this for first time. Now ...favorites ? Well, you might find this funny or not true but I don't like Messi at all but I support Argentina national whenever they play with Messi becoming my favorite haha. Why ? Well I think it all started when I was young and won on Fifa 2004 a local tournament with players a lot more experienced and older than me and got around 20 euro and gave it to my mom ...it was all due to Argentina massive team even since then so yea , my favorite will always be Argentina when they play World Cup.

It true that this World Cup will kick off in November in Qatar. AFAIK, the winter in Gulf countries are never extreme. You cant say winter in Qatar are as extreme as they are in Europe or rest of the world. We can say it will be a moderate temperature in November. I too siding with Argentina ever since I started following football, prime reason is there versatile playing strategy aka short passes.
19  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: 2022 FIFA World Cup in Qatar - UEFA Qualifiers on: June 05, 2022, 04:27:35 AM
Wales records during play at home ground for world cup qualification was very impressive that they were unbeatable so far and today against Ukraine they had good advantages because playing at their home so clearly they are the favourite but Ukraine also not weak because after beat Scotland they have high motivation to be the winner of this match especially their records while against Wales is very good with total 3 matches Ukraine can able to win once and 2 draw so i think this match will be so tight because possible both of teams will playing attacking each other but based on statistics Ukraine can be the winner of this match

It's Wales vs Rest of the world, its reality that the whole world wanna see Ukraine in FIFA World Cup 2022 and Wales is fully aware of this fact. In last 6 matches, Ukarine is unbeaten while Wales has lost its last match against Poland. ODDs are somewhat neutrals a both teams are equally capable of winning this game.
20  Economy / Gambling discussion / Re: Can You See Or Tell If A Fight Or Event Is Fix ? on: June 05, 2022, 04:19:21 AM
I am a cricket enthusiastic so can say about cricket, yes if you know cricket then you can tell easily that a match is fixed or not. For instance, the Recent Indian Premier League 2022 was completely fixed. I am not the one who is saying this alone in fact majority of people who understand cricket can easily say that after seeing the outcome of matches.
BJP Leader Alleges IPL 2022 Was ‘Rigged’, Slams ‘De Facto Dictator Of BCCI’ Jay Shah
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