It is guaranteed. Bitcoin-Brokers will guarantee a 4% profit on every transaction. The only thing that is not guaranteed is the amount of business that can be generated every day. That is up to the buyers, not Bitcoin-Brokers.

Perhaps you are not understanding, so I will attempt to paint a clearer picture for you:

This is how it would work:

Buyers request to purchase bitcoins from Bitcoin-Brokers. Bitcoin-Brokers instructs the buyer to make a cash deposit into your bank account for a predetermined amount (this is how Bitcoin-Brokers works now already and the buyers love it and keep coming back to buy more and more). In this case, let’s say the buyer wanted $1,000 worth of bitcoins. You would be made aware of all the deposits that were going to be made into your account that day.

You would keep watch of your online bank account, and verify that indeed the deposit had been made, and it was in cash. With good funds in your account, you are now able to purchase $1,000 worth of bitcoins from BTC-e (as an example).

Using a spread of 4% (which is the locked in rate I will guarantee you on every transaction) this is how a hypothetical transaction would play out:

BTC-e prices of $70.00/bitcoin.

Your $1,000 purchase at BTC-e would net you 14.2857 bitcoins

Bitcoin-Brokers is only forwarded 13.7142 bitcoins.

This would net you 0.5715 bitcoins or 4% before BTC-e transaction fees of 0.5% (I believe this is their current rate). Remember…you have received $1,000 cash deposit into your bank account which gets balanced off against the $1,000 BTC-e purchase.

Now Bitcoin-Brokers has acquired bitcoins for effectively current MtGox rates (since 4% seems to be the average spread between BTC-e and MtGox......sometimes its more or less, but on average it sits around 4%), and Bitcoin-Brokers simply forwards 98% to the buyer. This concludes the transaction with you netting 4%, Bitcoin-Brokers netting 2% and the buyer acquiring bitcoins for effectively 2% above MtGox inclusive of all fees.


As I said...guaranteed. The arbitrageur could effectively tie their proverbial wagon to Bitcoin-Brokers and ride this bitcoin growth wave with Bitcoin-Brokers. Its risk free guaranteed cash. Guaranteed because I am the owner of Bitcoin-Brokers, and I am declaring that this is how it will be.

I can allay your fears. Would you be able to contact me through the helpdesk at Bitcoin-Brokers?

Thanks.

This is an indication that your price is too low.

It has nothing to do with that at all. Some sellers have set price levels at which we are no longer permitted to sell at. In this recent sell off that we have witnessed two of my largest suppliers who still have bitcoins to sell instructed to stop selling their supply simply because of the prices offered in the open market had fallen too low in their opinion.

The reason why this is happening is because buyers see the great value in being able to buy their bitcoins at a bank. The fact that it is at a really low rate is just a bonus in the transaction.

Somebody with enough fiat and bitcoins to act as a constant liquidity provider for your site is going to run into a significant problem - a personal bank account in the US that receives cash deposits from random people all over the country and wires out all received funds to an offshore bitcoin exchange is very quickly going to be identified as a high-risk account, probably reported for suspicious activity, and surely closed.

I would want to offer this arbitrage opportunity to multiple people. Some people may want to approach this as a side gig, a day here and a day there, while other people may try to build their own little empire alongside Bitcoin-Brokers. Bitcoin-Brokers can create a trading environment as large or as small as the arbitrageur felt comfortable with. Additionally, the arbitrageur could work as many days a week as they want.

What if you instead arbitraged between people who want to buy bitcoins and traders who want to cash out their fiat from BTC-e and Bitstamp (or any exchange that allows account-to-account transfer of fiat balances)?



I would run into the same problem (good problem..but still a problem), there are too many buyers in relation to sellers. For whatever reason, the helpdesk is flooded with an imbalance of buyers overpowering sellers. I have had to turn away more business than I care to admit.

What Bitcoin-Brokers needs is a steady flow of bitcoins.

Bitcoin-Broker's first transaction was just 2 weeks ago for a whopping 0.28 bitcoins. It was the only transaction for the day, and it sold for approximately $30.

A couple days later, 6 more coins were loaded onto the website. Those sold in one day. This inspired approximately $3,000 worth of bitcoins to be loaded on the website by various sellers which sold in a couple of days.

Last Wednesday there was about $5,000 worth of bitcoins sold on the website. Thursday was the 4th..banks were closed. Friday there was $5,000 worth of bitcoins sold at which point customers were placed on a waiting list because we sold out half way through the day, and since that time I am sitting with $5,000 worth of back orders, plus whatever new business that Monday will bring in.

An arbitrageur would have made approximately $200 last Wednesday working with Bitcoin-Brokers, and would have made another $300-$400 on Friday if there had been access to more bitcoins. This is a really big opportunity, since Bitcoin-Brokers creates a guaranteed environment for somebody to make pretty incredible money...literally thousands of dollars per month the very first month, and it is in an industry which is growing as fast as bitcoin.

An arbitrageur can throttle the amount of deposits into their account. Simply tell Bitcoin-Brokers how much business to send through an account, and that limit will be respected. It would be very easy for a single account to have a few thousand dollars per day deposited into it. At that level, $3,000/day in deposits nets the arbitrageur approximately $120/day in profits. Approximately 26 days per month means one bank account can net that arbitrageur $3120 per month. Walk down the street open account a different bank, rinse and repeat, $6240 per month...all from $3,000 a day in deposits.

I like it this way better. This places the majority of profits in other people's hands making them financially motivated to work with Bitcoin-Brokers. I could see people earning fantastic incomes from this. The only limitation for the arbitrageur is the amount of business that is sent to them from Bitcoin-Brokers.

This is essentially free money for an arbitrageur who sees the value in this opportunity. Many people are wanting to hitch their wagon to something to participate in the Bitcoin Boom, this is one option.

An offshoot arbitrage discussion of Bitcoin-Brokers was just started. Since the discussion is trading related, I placed the topic over there, yet as a courtesy to followers of this thread, I wanted each of you to be made aware of the thread's existence in case it was of any interest.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=251951.msg2676740#msg2676740

Hopefully we can keep the arbitrage talk on that thread. Thanks everybody.

I am the owner of www.Bitcoin-Brokers.org and I have an opportunity for members of this forum.

I have a thread which can be read here:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=237164.0

There are many other threads on the internet about Bitcoin-Brokers, but that is the thread which I started and view every day.

After reading through the thread you should be able to see that Bitcoin-Brokers is experiencing so much growth that there is now a line up of buyers who are ready to buy, yet not enough bitcoins to sell them. Every day there are more and more bitcoins sold, and every day it becomes harder and harder to keep up with the growth on the buy side of the equation. Bitcoin-Brokers seems to attract a lot more buyers than it does sellers. For this reason, it has become necessary to tap other sources to keep up with the buy side of the business rather than run the risk of developing a reputation of being an unreliable source.

Here is the opportunity:

Bitcoin-Brokers will create a structured environment which allows members of this forum to arbitrage and become Bitcoin-Broker's supplier of bitcoins.


It is a risk-free arbitrage opportunity.  


Qualifications to apply for this arbitrage opportunity:


-Must have either a Bitstamp or BTC-e trading account.
-Must have a bank account.

Please no PMs here....just use the helpdesk at www.Bitcoin-Brokers.org

This is an immediate opportunity.

Thank you.

Bump

Bitcoin-Brokers accepts buyers and sellers and banks from every country.

If you wanted to list your bitcoins and you have a bank account in Europe, Bitcoin-Brokers would direct buyers to visit your bank and make a cash deposit in Euro or British Pound or whatever your native currency happens to be.

SEPA is a transfer which can be recalled for up to something like 30 days, and for this reason it is not accepted. Only cash deposited directly into the seller's bank account.

Bitcoin-Brokers

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=237164.0

Thanks to you as well.

Bitcoin-Brokers still needs all the bitcoins possible. There are cash buyers just like this member who are willing to deposit cash into your bank accounts for your bitcoins.

Wrong.

Bitcoin-Brokers never touches anybody's cash. Cash is deposited by the buyer into the seller's account directly. Bitcoin-Brokers never comes in contact with a bank account, nor touches ANY FIAT whatsoever.

Additionally:

10 FinCEN's regulations provide that whether a person is a money transmitter is a matter of facts and circumstances. The regulations identify six circumstances under which a person is not a money transmitter, despite accepting and transmitting currency, funds, or value that substitutes for currency. 31 CFR § 1010.100(ff)(5)(ii)(A)-(F).
Looking up the six exemption circumstances in 31 CFR § 1010.100(ff)(5) will return the following:

(ii) Facts and circumstances; Limitations. Whether a person is a money transmitter as described in this section is a matter of facts and circumstances. The term “money transmitter” shall not include a person that only:

(A) Provides the delivery, communication, or network access services used by a money transmitter to support money transmission services;
(B) Acts as a payment processor to facilitate the purchase of, or payment of a bill for, a good or service through a clearance and settlement system by agreement with the creditor or seller;
 (C) Operates a clearance and settlement system or otherwise acts as an intermediary solely between BSA regulated institutions. This includes but is not limited to the Fedwire system, electronic funds transfer networks, certain registered clearing agencies regulated by the Securities and Exchange Commission (“SEC”), and derivatives clearing organizations, or other clearinghouse arrangements established by a financial agency or institution;
 (D) Physically transports currency, other monetary instruments, other commercial paper, or other value that substitutes for currency as a person primarily engaged in such business, such as an armored car, from one person to the same person at another location or to an account belonging to the same person at a financial institution, provided that the person engaged in physical transportation has no more than a custodial interest in the currency, other monetary instruments, other commercial paper, or other value at any point during the transportation;
 (E) Provides prepaid access; or
(F) Accepts and transmits funds only integral to the sale of goods or the provision of services, other than money transmission services, by the person who is accepting and transmitting the funds.


The above two points are also the exact same two points which are the reason why Bitpay didn't need to acquire a Money Transmittor license either.

BCB you are Bitcoin-Brokers competitor.

This is the second time you have ventured onto this thread to throw shade at Bitcoin-Brokers.

There are lots of threads on this forum other than this one, why don't you go find one?

Good point. I do not know what sort of limitations are in place on individual accounts with respect to people making cash deposits on a daily, monthly etc basis.

There are sole proprietors using their personal bank accounts as a deposit option for clients paying their invoices; I know the banks start breaking out the paperwork for cash deposits north of 10K at a time, but beyond that I have no idea. I suppose each bank has its own set of rules.

And the award for best solution goes to..........

That could work!

Bitcoin-Brokers would have to act as the guarantor, but not any more so than what it happening right now. Bitcoin-Brokers already guarantees current buyers that every transaction results in bitcoins in their wallet. This is achieved easily by collecting the bitcoins in advance from the seller. Buyers are only directed to fund the accounts of sellers who have already escrowed their bitcoins. That's why the buyer always is guaranteed to receive bitcoins with Bitcoin-Brokers.

And "yes", Bitcoin-Brokers would be there to complete the transaction on behalf of the seller, with the seller's escrowed bitcoins in case the seller suddently disappeared.  

It would be very easy to implement. Yet, just because it can be done doesn't mean it will be. Just chewing the proverbial bitcoin fat with fellow bitcoiners on a lazy Saturday.

Here is a hypothetical idea which might contain the solution..... Third cup of coffee for the day....brain is starting to wake up.

Everybody has always seen the spread between the MtGox rates and the BTC-e exchange rates. Right now for example the price of bitcoin on MtGox is $70, and BTC-e is $67. At current rates there exists approximately a 4% spread between these 2 prices.

BTC-e allows clients to withdraw bitcoins as a withdrawal method. This means that a BTC-e client could gain access to bitcoins at a price whereby they could capture the spread between MtGox rates and BTC-e rates if they were able to buy at BTC-e rates and immediately sell at current MtGox rates.

Yet the only way that this can be achieved is "if" and only "if" the market prices remained static. The client would need to be guaranteed that their sell price is locked in when they buy the bitcoins, otherwise they expose themselves to market movements which could easily turn against them on downward days like we have been witnessing recently.

So how do we achieve this?......"waiter.....4th cup of coffee please".....okay where was I?

We transfer the market risk onto the buyer and lock the seller in with a guaranteed profit.

For those of you who have purchased bitcoins from Bitcoin-Brokers this will look familiar, for those of you who have not ordered bitcoins from Bitcoin-Brokers.....yet, this is what  quote looks like when you request one.

Transaction ID # 111111
The current MtGox rate for your bitcoins is $  100.00 /BTC
Bitcoin-Brokers fee on this transaction is 2%
The net amount of this bitcoin transaction is  1 bitcoins
The net amount of bitcoins that you will receive will be 0.98
The exact total of your order is $100.00

To purchase these bitcoins simply visit any branch of Wells Fargo

Hand the teller a cash deposit for exactly $100.00

and request that payment be deposited into the account of:

John Doe
Account number :123456789
ABA Routing number: 123456789

Quotes under the way the current system operates will present the buyer with locked in rates, and with a locked in amount of bitcoins which will be delivered  for  a specific amount of money.

If the first tier system of bitcoins is sold out, then the buyer could access the second tier BTC-e market. Yet to do this, the buyer would need to agree to a floating quote. They would be instructed to make a cash deposit, as they would with the first tier method, except they would not know exactly how many bitcoins they would receive before they make the deposit. They would know the ballpark amount, but not the exact amount.

This is how it "could" work:

The buyer would be presented with the banking information of the seller as they normally are. Buyer makes a cash deposit into the bank account of a seller. The buyer supplies Bitcoin-Brokers with the proof of deposit, and Bitcoin-Brokers confirms the deposit with the seller just like normal.

Seller would log into their BTC-e account, and make the purchase of bitcoins at current rates. The seller would then screen capture or something to show to Bitcoin-Brokers the exact purchase price of the bitcoins. Seller would then immediately transfer 96% of those bitcoins to Bitcoin-Brokers for the deposit which has ALREADY been made into their account. This locks the seller in with a guaranteed 4% profit on the transaction regardless what the market does.

Bitcoin-Brokers would take the same 2% fee in the form of bitcoins, and essentially forward 98% of the bitcoins which were transferred to Bitcoin-Brokers by the seller.

Simply buy out of BTC-e at current rates, and be guaranteed a 4% profit on every transaction....not bad. Every trader's dream right? Guaranteed 4% on every trade. I can just imagine all the traders who are reading this and salivating at the idea. $10,000 worth of sales per day earns you $400...where do you sign up right?

There is only one possible problem with this scenario (which is running through the minds of buyers who are reading this right now). Since the bitcoins have not been transferred to Bitcoin-Brokers to hold safely, how does the buyer expect any guarantee that after they have funded the bank account of the seller that they will receive bitcoins? Afterall, what is to stop the seller of bitcoins from simply allowing a cash deposit to be made into their bank account, and then simply choosing to not transfer any bitcoins?

Simple.....to become a seller at the 2nd tier level with Bitcoin-Brokers, each seller would be required to place a "bond" on themselves in the form of bitcoins. Whatever amount of bitcoins that the seller transfers to Bitcoin-Brokers as a bond would represent the maximum transaction size that Bitcoin-Brokers would allow.

Thus, when the buyer deposits enough money into the seller's bank account to purchase the bitcoins, even if the seller failed to buy the bitcoins from BTC-e, or if the buyer dies, or if the buyer falls into a coma or anything else, Bitcoin-Brokers will still be able to transfer the bitcoins to the buyer by tapping into the "bond" of the seller.

You sir, are reading my mind. I love being able to offer bitcoins to buyers at 2% above spot. I think it is about as good of a deal as can be found considering the timeframe for funding, ease of use etc.

Yet I also know that there are people who would trade off an extra few % points to have access to greater amounts of bitcoins any day of the week.

Now just for the sake of argument...this is just a hypothetical situation (caveat caveat caveat). Is there a world that exists whereby the existing framework which is offered at Bitcoin-Brokers can coexist with a second tier service?


When I say second tier service, I mean a premium is paid to the sellers to open up either a predictable arbitrage opportunity, or simply enough incentive to encourage additional sellers to opt to make use of the service. Considering that sellers could sell and effectively be paid in cash the minute the sale occurs, what sort of framework do people need to see to open up a recurring predictable profitable arbitrage environment?

Perhaps like a hybrid car which offers both, and each one kicks into play under different supply versus demand moments with the buyer always having the option if they wish to buy or not.

For example, lets assume that there are 100 bitcoins listed for sale at Bitcoin-Brokers which can be purchased at current rates, just the way things work right now. Once and only once all of those bitcoins are sold, do the second tier bitcoins become an option for the buyer. The sellers who insist upon being paid the premium will not have any of their bitcoins sold until the first tier sellers have sold theirs first. Once those first tier bitcoins are sold out, under the way the business operates right now, no sales can occur, afterall, we are sold out.
 
Hey...its Saturday and its raining....the mind wonders these sorts of things over the first coffee for the day.

PS-Bitcoin-Brokers would still only take a 2% fee, so don't worry, this isn't the early hints at a rate increase.