Need recommendations for a person/company that can trace the funds at that time and confirm they were actually sold for fiat.
You can try a special service from Chainalysis, I've never used it and this is the first time I've heard of it, but this service looks legit and promising. They're also on Trustpilot with few reviews. Following your topic from a while ago, I hope you can get it right and what you should actually get. I'm not an expert, but feel free to shoot me a PM if you need some advices. I contacted them, waiting for a reply. Need recommendations for a person/company that can trace the funds at that time and confirm they were actually sold for fiat.
You can try a special service from Chainalysis, I've never used it and this is the first time I've heard of it, but this service looks legit and promising. They're also on Trustpilot with few reviews. Following your topic from a while ago, I hope you can get it right and what you should actually get. I'm not an expert, but feel free to shoot me a PM if you need some advices. Hi, this seems quite complex. Do you mind explaining how it actually works? Cheers |
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I invested in an ICO back in 2017 and all 27K ETH were sold at Bitfinex.
Need recommendations for a person/company that can trace the funds at that time and confirm they were actually sold for fiat.
key words: tracing, tracking, research, blockchain analysis
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Some of my layman's opinion would be that the e-mail was written by the same people who were behind the project with the reason that they would scare you into continuing with what you are about to do.
The email came from what appears to be a real lawyer. Btw is it against my interest to publish selected identifying information here? For example the email and website of said lawyer. I can't think of a valid reason where this can be used against me. However, the message also mentions some interesting things like : Please be reminded that your purchase of tokens was a high-risk investment (as you can double-check in the “Real Crowd-Sale Agreement” you executed with Real Estate Asset Ledger Pte. Ltd on the 31st August 2017, and its exhibits, particularly, Exhibit C), undertaken with full acknowledgment of its speculative nature and the clear understanding that there was no guaranteed return. which would mean that you somehow became familiar with the possibility that you could lose your investment, and that you could not claim any compensation for the damage if it happened. However, in order to clarify the legal situation, you will have to find someone who will study all the documentation in detail and then conclude whether you have legal grounds for any claims. The ICO ended on 30 September 2017 and all ETH were invested prior to that date. The document itself was backdated and states "This Token Crowd-Sale Agreement (this “Agreement”) is made as of this August 31st 2017 (the “Effective Date”) " But it was created and published well after the ICO. I actually remember this: at some point the team hired a lawyer, who I assume advised them to create said T&C and also remove some of the content they have previously published on Medium.com It looked like damage control to me. I contacted ZachXBT as someone suggested here, but he refused to help stating that: Sorry too much time has passed for me to investigate
I have to trace 6 years of transactions
I only accept things from 1-2 years
Should have asked someone sooner
It makes me look bad if I cannot find anything and too much time has passed
Any other recommendations for a reliable person/service to do an investigation on the ETH movement? |
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This is the right start. Fraudsters usually have an exit plan in mind, and I have often seen scams with the same company names. They can register companies with the same names for completely different people or register a company that will be similar in its activities to a decent company. And in such cases, the chances of getting the money back are zero.
The laws in registering a company are so shit that you can even register a company in a few countries without even being in that country. I saw a few YouTube videos on how scammers, money launderers, and even politicians can open up a company in the UK without physically being in that country. This news was alarming to me as many Indian businessmen who could not repay the debt of banks have left India for the UK. If this is common in a first world country then imagine how a third world country works. In my country to form a company it takes more than 2 months and then bribing is still common if we need to expedite the process. Op said that the investment is for more than five years. The project has been running for years before turning into a scam. It may be that the information published is false or the credibility has been manipulated. But there must be physical traces for this project. Op mentioned that he received profits before the Corona period and did not mention whether he could withdraw his investments before the Corona period to confirm whether it was really a Scam project from the beginning. I did withdraw rent numerous times, a bit over 60ETH. The last message posted on their website before being taken down was supposedly from the liquidators but overall gives off a very scammy vibe. What kind of a liquidation company used proton main? ( real.liquidation@protonmail.com) Whoever is behind this email obviously wants to be anonymous. I did email them, but never received a reply. Also received a Cease and desist request from Harassment and Defamation from supposedly the owner's lawer. They claim the owner ceased managing Real Estate Asset Ledger Pte. Ltd in 2020 yet this was never communicated to investors. If he claims that he must know who are the people behind the company since then? And what happened with the properties that were purchased with investors money. But there is only silence. This letter serves as a formal notice for you to cease and desist from all harassing and defamatory activities against my client, Mr. xxxxxxxxxx, in relation with your purchase of tokens in 2017 from Real Estate Asset Ledger Pte. Ltd, of which my client was a director.
It has come to our attention that you have engaged in a series of unwarranted and baseless accusations against my client, including but not limited to, alleging involvement in fraudulent activities, and threatening to defame my client publicly. Your actions have not only caused significant distress but are also unfounded and legally untenable.
Please be reminded that your purchase of tokens was a high-risk investment (as you can double-check in the “Real Crowd-Sale Agreement” you executed with Real Estate Asset Ledger Pte. Ltd on the 31st August 2017, and its exhibits, particularly, Exhibit C), undertaken with full acknowledgment of its speculative nature and the clear understanding that there was no guaranteed return.
Please also note that my client ceased managing Real Estate Asset Ledger Pte. Ltd in 2020, and the subsequent liquidation of the company was a business outcome that neither implicates my client in wrongdoing nor entitles investors to personal redress from my client.
Your persistent harassment and threats towards my client, and dissemination of unfounded allegations to third parties, constitute a clear violation of the applicable laws, specifically regarding harassment and defamation.
By this communication, we kindly request you to cease all communication and attempts to contact my client directly or indirectly, and refrain from making any further false, defamatory statements about my client to any third party, including on public platforms or through direct communication. Failure to comply with these demands will leave my client with no choice but to pursue all available legal remedies.
This letter is written without prejudice to my client's rights, all of which are expressly reserved.
To All Creditors / Clients of Re Platform Ltd (In Liquidation) (“Re Platform”) We refer to the last update of the liquidation of Re Platform Ltd which was posted on Re Platform’s official website “www.realplatform.vc” (“Re Platform Website”) on 15th September 2023 and sent by email to all known potential creditors / clients of Re Platform based on the information available (“Creditors”). During the past 2 months, the Liquidators have received certain enquiries commonly raised by many Creditors. In the past, the Liquidators have attempted to answer the queries either by email and/or phone call. However, in light of the volume of the enquiries and the urgency to recover Re Platform’s data, records and assets, it is not efficient (if not impossible) for the Liquidators and their staff to answer the Creditors’ queries one by one. This update summarizes the Liquidators’ answers to the queries by the Creditors and will be sent to the Creditors by email. The Liquidators will also post a notice in respect of this update on the Re Platform Website. The Liquidators’ answers to any further queries from the Creditors will be similarly consolidated and sent to all potential Creditors by email (with a notice posted on Re Platform Website) as and when appropriate. Status of the Liquidation To date, the Liquidators are securing and taking control of all of Re Platform’s cryptocurrencies which are identifiable based on the information available to the Liquidators. The Liquidators’ primary focus (at this stage of the liquidation) remains to be securing and taking control of all assets, data and records of Re Platform and establishing Re Platform’s liabilities due to the Creditors. Re Platform Website and Account Balances With Creditors / Clients The Re Platform Website was shut down upon the making of the winding up of Re Platform on September 10th 2023 as, by statute, any business of a company shall cease upon the making of a winding up. As a result, you are currently unable to access your account through the Re Platform Website. We appreciate that you are unable to access your account and the Liquidators are ascertaining the feasibility and considering the appropriate means to provide the Creditors with details of their respective account balance with Re Platform based on the information available to the Liquidators. The Liquidators will provide an update in this regard as soon as practicable. Claim against Re Platform Ltd. Pursuant to the Saint Vincent and the Grenadines law, any potential Creditors who wish to file a claim against Re Platform must submit to the Liquidators a proof of their debt in the prescribed form (“POD”). Any Creditors who do not submit a POD (and supporting documents) to the satisfaction of the Liquidators may be excluded from the benefit of any distribution of assets and/or funds in the future. Accordingly, the first thing you, as a potential Creditor of Re Platform, should do at this stage of Re Platform’s liquidation is to complete and return a POD (with documents supporting your claim) to the Liquidators before November 30th. For the avoidance of any doubt, the Liquidators are required to consider all the information and documents available in order to identify the appropriate means to distribute any assets and/or funds to the relevant Creditors and this will be undertaken in accordance with the contractual terms between Re Platform and the Creditors and the relevant law and regulations. The Liquidators will start adjudicating the Creditors’ claims against Re Platform at the later stage of the liquidation after the Liquidators have secured all necessary data and records of Re Platform to establish Re Platform’s liabilities due to the Creditors. The Liquidators will notify the Creditors when they intend to distribute any assets and/or funds to the Creditors. Submission of Proof of Debt It is therefore important that you submit a POD to the Liquidators before November 30th . The Liquidators recommend that any Creditor (who has not yet submitted a POD to the Liquidators) file a POD with his best estimate of the amount due to him by Re Platform (with all supporting documents that he may have) before November 30th by email to real.liquidation@protonmail.comIf you are unable to estimate the amount of your claim, please insert “to be confirmed” on the POD and state the reason why you are unable to do so. We will contact you directly (at later stage of the liquidation) if they require any further information and documentation from you in respect your claim against Re Platform. We will provide further updates to the Creditors as and when appropriate. Should you have any queries or require any further information, please contact this office at real.liquidation@protonmail.comRegards, Joint and Several Liquidators Re Platform Ltd St Vincent and the Grenadines under Licence number 24762 IBC 2018 |
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There are two things that I can see in this issue and the first one is that they were paying you rent. The amount and for how many days/weeks/months you have received it is not mentioned in your topic. The problem started happening when COVID hit and there was a lockdown, which is considered a natural global disaster as it happened globally. Now, my question to you is how would you like to challenge a global disaster that did affect business or organizations. Some countries that are tourist destinations are still not able to get out of the problem they faced 5 years back due to COVID.
The next problem is that under liquidation, you cannot ask for money that is already starved. This is not a case where you can spend thousands of your money to get that amount which I feel is practically lost. You can talk to a lawyer and try to find a loophole in the law that can only help you in getting your amount back. I am certain that you have already done that and that is why you have come up with this topic to find out if anyone here has gone through the same situation. Which might help you in finding a solution to your problem.
I am currently researching my options and trying to figure out in which country I should be looking for legal representation. There are enough clues to suggest it was an exist scam. It will take hours for somebody new to absorb all the information related to the case. The main thing is there are assets (properties) that are still standing and being used to generate income. I know the exact buildings, locations, etc. They are listed on Booking.com and on the developer website too. I have copies of the deeds/titles of said properties. Have you found out who owns this property now? How many owners of the property changed after the company went bankrupt? If this company sold the property to affiliated parties, then you have a chance of creating legal problems for the owner, but if the current owner is not associated with the company in which you invested and is a bona fide buyer, then you have very little chance. I have not yet, I am just starting this journey. I found some related Thai legal services on Fiver, which might help me get that information. |
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I completely agree about the legal route, but not sure where to look for one.
Looking up the legal team in previous similar cases is a start. You can follow them up on professional platforms like LinkedIn and see their full portfolio. As a heads up, consecutive post is agajnts the forum rules. You should edit newer text into the original post. Are you aware of any similar cases that you can share with me? Cheers |
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You'll firstly need proper legal advice from a lawyer who has experience with legal battles related to cryptocurrency and get honest feedback on the chances of actually getting some or all of your outstanding investments back. Properly document all the information you have about the owners, your investments and your profits during the short time the project worked.
This by itself will cost some money and will basically be committing you to the recovery chase.
Are you aware of other investors who are equally interested in going down this road? If you all pool together the legal expense it will lighten the load.
I completely agree about the legal route, but not sure where to look for one. I assume most investors only invested very small amounts and have since forgotten about it. I am yet to find another person, who is interested in pursuing this matter legally. |
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~snip~
The main thing is there are assets (properties) that are still standing and being used to generate income. I know the exact buildings, locations, etc. They are listed on Booking.com and on the developer website too. I have copies of the deeds/titles of said properties.
~snip~
Then a number of properties were purchased in Thailand and I started receiving rent until COVID hit us.
I have no doubt that the properties are there, but the question is who are the owners who rent them out - it is possible that they are not the people behind the ICO in which you invested. It is possible that the real estate has been sold, and that seems the most logical - because if your business goes downhill, you can also face claims from clients, and then why risk something that can be seized and sold at auction. What you need is a good lawyer who is familiar with real estate and also knows something about ICO/cryptocurrencies + to go with him to Thailand and try to find out on the spot who the owners of those properties are. Yes, but I am uncertain in which country it would be best to look for a lawyer? Europe? Thailand? In terms of ownership of the properties, the documents that were uploaded to their platform were: Property titles in ThaiLease agreements for each apartmentProperty management agreement for all propertiesIn both agreements the lessor and the manager is the same thai person and there is also a witness, who is the manager of Noon Capital - another public person. I assume these can be checked by a local solicitor. |
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There are two things that I can see in this issue and the first one is that they were paying you rent. The amount and for how many days/weeks/months you have received it is not mentioned in your topic. The problem started happening when COVID hit and there was a lockdown, which is considered a natural global disaster as it happened globally. Now, my question to you is how would you like to challenge a global disaster that did affect business or organizations. Some countries that are tourist destinations are still not able to get out of the problem they faced 5 years back due to COVID.
The next problem is that under liquidation, you cannot ask for money that is already starved. This is not a case where you can spend thousands of your money to get that amount which I feel is practically lost. You can talk to a lawyer and try to find a loophole in the law that can only help you in getting your amount back. I am certain that you have already done that and that is why you have come up with this topic to find out if anyone here has gone through the same situation. Which might help you in finding a solution to your problem.
I am currently researching my options and trying to figure out in which country I should be looking for legal representation. There are enough clues to suggest it was an exist scam. It will take hours for somebody new to absorb all the information related to the case. The main thing is there are assets (properties) that are still standing and being used to generate income. I know the exact buildings, locations, etc. They are listed on Booking.com and on the developer website too. I have copies of the deeds/titles of said properties. |
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If the company has gone into liquidation, it is highly likely that the owners of this company has no funds or had hidden it somewhere safe. So legally you cannot do anything unless the court decides to sell their properties and pay out the money to the investors. That's how it ideally happens.
If you know the registered address of this company, you can file a lawsuit against them and put up your demand in a legal way. It is better if you can speak to a qualified lawyer.
That is the idea. I need to find a legal firm to have a consultation with and see if it's even possible. Supposedly they purchased these properties, so there are still assets to recover. |
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Thanks, it might be useful. |
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The ICO is [ANN] REAL [ICO] Invest in Real Estate, Earn Ether [AUGUST TOKEN SALE]It was not an immediate SCAM, it took years to happen. The main person behind it is still very active with other projects and easily trackable, but denies responsibility. I need to find a professional service that can investigate the blockchain and prepare a report + a legal team to consult me if I really have a case. I am just not sure under which country jurisdiction is best look for a firm. |
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It is unfortunate to see more investors losing their savings in ICO projects. I wonder what guarantees you obtained to venture into investing in the project in question! It will be easy to find someone to prepare the report if sufficient evidence is available through the thread. It is not an easy task in any case, because creating a conviction file is different from simply preparing a report. You may need to consult an avocat to guide your search. But at the same time, I suggest that you narrate what happened to you and provide the necessary evidences. There is a section here in the forum for " Scam and accusations" that you can use to post your issue for discussion. There is also a special subsection for “ Investigations” where the community can help you in the investigation process. There was no guarantee with crypto obviously, just my intuition. The project actually did pay rent for more than a year, I got a bit over 60ETH. But then it went all downhill after COVID hit. The fact is known people with real names are behind this and there are physical assets involved (the properties). I need to find a legal firm to represent me, but I am not sure in which country's jurisdiction. The original owner of the ICO is spanish living in Singapore The company behind the ICO is registered in St Vincent and The Grenadines The properties and the developing company that built them and still manages them are in Thailand |
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I was scammed in an ICO and I am currently collecting evidence for a possible legal case against the scammers.
I am looking for somebody to go though the original thread posted here, collect key information from it and prepare a report.
Paying in BTC and the amount will be agreed beforehand.
Thank you.
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So REAL apparently went in liquidation, which was unexpectedly announced on their website some time in October or November 2023. There was not explanation why. Now to me it was not a liquidation of a failed company, but a premeditated and planned exit scam. I even doubt whether the investment properties were ever purchased. I tried contacting everyone who was originally involved in the project, but nobody responded back. 2 days later their websites were completely taken down - coincidence? I think not. I also received a Cease and desist request from Harassment and Defamation to Mr. Enrique Dubois from his lawyer. Are any other investors still active here? I will be starting legal proceedings and might include more creditors. This was the message on the website while it was still running: To All Creditors / Clients of Re Platform Ltd (In Liquidation) (“Re Platform”) We refer to the last update of the liquidation of Re Platform Ltd which was posted on Re Platform’s official website “www.realplatform.vc” (“Re Platform Website”) on 15th September 2023 and sent by email to all known potential creditors / clients of Re Platform based on the information available (“Creditors”). During the past 2 months, the Liquidators have received certain enquiries commonly raised by many Creditors. In the past, the Liquidators have attempted to answer the queries either by email and/or phone call. However, in light of the volume of the enquiries and the urgency to recover Re Platform’s data, records and assets, it is not efficient (if not impossible) for the Liquidators and their staff to answer the Creditors’ queries one by one. This update summarizes the Liquidators’ answers to the queries by the Creditors and will be sent to the Creditors by email. The Liquidators will also post a notice in respect of this update on the Re Platform Website. The Liquidators’ answers to any further queries from the Creditors will be similarly consolidated and sent to all potential Creditors by email (with a notice posted on Re Platform Website) as and when appropriate. Status of the Liquidation To date, the Liquidators are securing and taking control of all of Re Platform’s cryptocurrencies which are identifiable based on the information available to the Liquidators. The Liquidators’ primary focus (at this stage of the liquidation) remains to be securing and taking control of all assets, data and records of Re Platform and establishing Re Platform’s liabilities due to the Creditors. Re Platform Website and Account Balances With Creditors / Clients The Re Platform Website was shut down upon the making of the winding up of Re Platform on September 10th 2023 as, by statute, any business of a company shall cease upon the making of a winding up. As a result, you are currently unable to access your account through the Re Platform Website. We appreciate that you are unable to access your account and the Liquidators are ascertaining the feasibility and considering the appropriate means to provide the Creditors with details of their respective account balance with Re Platform based on the information available to the Liquidators. The Liquidators will provide an update in this regard as soon as practicable. Claim against Re Platform Ltd. Pursuant to the Saint Vincent and the Grenadines law, any potential Creditors who wish to file a claim against Re Platform must submit to the Liquidators a proof of their debt in the prescribed form (“POD”). Any Creditors who do not submit a POD (and supporting documents) to the satisfaction of the Liquidators may be excluded from the benefit of any distribution of assets and/or funds in the future. Accordingly, the first thing you, as a potential Creditor of Re Platform, should do at this stage of Re Platform’s liquidation is to complete and return a POD (with documents supporting your claim) to the Liquidators before November 30th. For the avoidance of any doubt, the Liquidators are required to consider all the information and documents available in order to identify the appropriate means to distribute any assets and/or funds to the relevant Creditors and this will be undertaken in accordance with the contractual terms between Re Platform and the Creditors and the relevant law and regulations. The Liquidators will start adjudicating the Creditors’ claims against Re Platform at the later stage of the liquidation after the Liquidators have secured all necessary data and records of Re Platform to establish Re Platform’s liabilities due to the Creditors. The Liquidators will notify the Creditors when they intend to distribute any assets and/or funds to the Creditors. Submission of Proof of Debt It is therefore important that you submit a POD to the Liquidators before November 30th . The Liquidators recommend that any Creditor (who has not yet submitted a POD to the Liquidators) file a POD with his best estimate of the amount due to him by Re Platform (with all supporting documents that he may have) before November 30th by email to real.liquidation@protonmail.comIf you are unable to estimate the amount of your claim, please insert “to be confirmed” on the POD and state the reason why you are unable to do so. We will contact you directly (at later stage of the liquidation) if they require any further information and documentation from you in respect your claim against Re Platform. We will provide further updates to the Creditors as and when appropriate. Should you have any queries or require any further information, please contact this office at real.liquidation@protonmail.comRegards, Joint and Several Liquidators Re Platform Ltd St Vincent and the Grenadines under Licence number 24762 IBC 2018 |
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So back in 2018 I invested 720ETH in what looked like a very promising ICO - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2064991The team behind it looked very professional, the White paper well written and overall, the idea very promising, so I decided to invest. Basically the idea was to purchase properties with the invested money and then receive rent based on your invested amount. From memory around 34k ETH were invested in the project, which were originally sold at $800 each, but because they couldn’t find a bank to hold it they had to buy back ETH and again sell it at $300 at a later date. Then a number of properties were purchased in Thailand and I started receiving rent until COVID hit us. There are too many details to mention as to what happened next, but as it stands now the company went in liquidation, which I very strongly believe was a premeditated and planned exit scam. I have a copy of their entire website + all documents related to the purchase of the properties (deeds, lease agreements). I am currently preparing a plan of action and any advice is greatly appreciated as I am willing to spend thousands of dollars to try and recover some of my investment. |
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How is this topic dead and not a single investor is interested what is happening?
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Some numbers:
There are roughly 21M USD to invest in properties.
Also roughly 10M tokens to invest in the platform between all investors.
The team has ~4M tokens too.
And ~5.7M tokens reserve and bounty.
The apartments they bought cost around 1.5-2M USD, which is roughly 10% of the investment capital.
If only these apartments are listed on the platform at launch there are 2 scenarios for the investors:
1 - The exchange rate is adapted, so all investors can participate and earn rent until more properties are acquired. Basically the rent will be quite low, because it has to be distributed between everyone who invests, which I assume will be most people.
2 - The exchange rate is calculated from the the 20M USD and 10M tokens and the quickest investors to react will be the only one to invest due to limited properties.
Also is it known if the team will invest its 4M tokens?
I am just trying to find out the most likely scenario for the launch.
What do you think?
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I am interested how the whole REAL > RPP > Property investement would work.
Let's say I have invested 100ETH at ICO and got 28K REALs.
Who decides what the REAL to RPP exchange rate is?
Or now they bought 10 flats and let's imagine they paid 100K USD for each, then how many RRP is one flat?
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I have a very old wallet, which I am unable to open. It is password protected, but I know what the password is. Bitcoin Core says Salvage failed.
Booted LiveUSB Ubuntu and installed pywallet.
ubuntu@ubuntu:~/Desktop/pywallet$ sudo ./pywallet.py --recover --recov_device /dev/sdc1 --recov_size 1Gio --recov_outputdir /home/ubuntu/Desktop/recover/ Enter the passphrase for the wallet that will contain all the recovered keys: 123456
Enter the possible passphrases used in your deleted wallets. Don't forget that more passphrases = more time to test the possibilities. Write one passphrase per line and end with an empty line. Possible passphrase: xxxxxxxx Possible passphrase:
Starting recovery. 0.10 Go read 0.20 Go read 0.30 Go read 0.40 Go read 0.50 Go read 0.60 Go read 0.70 Go read 0.80 Go read 0.90 Go read 1.00 Go read
Read 1.1 Go in 0.7 minutes
Found 1 possible wallets Found 221 possible encrypted keys Found 0 possible unencrypted keys
Possible wallet #1 with passphrase #1
Private keys not decrypted: 221 Trying all the remaining possibilities (221) might take up to 0 minutes. Do you want to test them? (y/n): y
Private keys not decrypted: 221 Try another password, check the size of your partition or seek help The wallet is encrypted and the passphrase is correct
Importing:
The new wallet /home/ubuntu/Desktop/recover//recovered_wallet_1513352751.dat contains the 0 recovered key ubuntu@ubuntu:~/Desktop/pywallet$
So it recognizes the password as correct, but it doesn't decrypt the keys.
Please help.
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