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+1
Eternal growth is simply not compatible with sustainable development.
Only bankers need indefinite growth because without it interest rates would eat up all available capital.
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This is a failure by the owners of the banks to hold the top employees to account. It is not failure. The top employees in the banks act upon direct instructions of the owners of the banks! Let's not lose sight of the fact that the banking system is a cartel organised by the central bank. The share holders of the banks have little control over what top bankers decide: for instance, exceedingly high compensations in the banking industry act as a barrier to entry. If some brave shareholders of a bank decided to cut the compensation of the top managers, they would leave and be replaced by newcomers. The peers of those who left would simply not do business with the newcomers and the brave shareholders would get hurt. |
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Since another thread got started today on the same subject and got locked, I feel compelled to reply here.
The emerging bitcoin economy cannot fall in a deflationary spriral IMHO for the following reasons:
1/Even if there is hoarding, the value of bitcoins will eventually stabilize to some equilibrium price or equilibrium deflation rate.
In fact, the wild fluctuations we have witnessed in a recent past look more or less like the growing pains of a small cap stock.
A continuous but steady deflation rate is not a problem since bitcoins are infinitely divisible.
2/ Bitcoins then can be used as a meta-currency: the bitcoin network will act as a transaction processor for money transfers in just any currency.
If I send dollars overseas using a bitcoin Forex, I am in fact sending my bitcoins to this Forex.
If I wish to maintain my stock of bitcoins at the same level, I can just buy them back from that same Forex.
The seller is the recipient that billed me in dollars.
The Forex makes a living out of transaction fees that are more competitive than existing money transfer services.
3/Hoarding can last only as long as one does not need to liquidate.
Therefore, I see no need for demurrage nor for other artefact to stimulate bitcoin trading.
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Great!! The dates are penciled down in my agenda book (those words sound weird on such hi tech forum don't they).
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Intéressant en effet, mais "Meze grill" ne peut servir qu'une infime fraction de l'ensemble des Bitcoiners. Je vais en parler à des copains restaurateurs à Paris et je vous passerai les adresses si ils nous suivent.  |
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Après lecture de certains posts ici posant le droit à la propriété comme supérieur à tous les autres, j'invite ceux qui ne connaisse pas la clause lockéenne à en prendre connaissance et y réfléchir.
En gros, il s'agit d'affirmer que si il y a une source d'eau dans le désert, personne ne peut se l'approprier sans conditions.
Même si cette personne en a hérité.
D'ailleurs, si le droit de transférer ses biens à ses enfants sans conditions était si juste, le président des Etats Unis ne devrait il pas être un descendant de Geronimo ou de Sitting Bull ?
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To my knowledge, the bitcoin protocol specs already make provisions for contracts (dual signature transactions): no need to split keys or specify some other mecanism until the bitcoin contracts are tested.
Gavin's ClearCoin makes use of bitcoin contracts.
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From the judgement of the users on this forum it should probably be in some Amish town in Indiana.
Do Amish people use computers ? cell phones ? (in the barn, when no one is watching?) Or do they stick to bitbills ? |
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This thread does not belong on the bitcoin forum: moderators please see to it  |
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What's the easiest way to spend this address (created thanks to Grondilu and davout contributions on my Win 7 machine): 1Q82Ur6bYsBmXRdb8QJDzPSxaTZyymD1ZB using the private key formatted using Davout ruby script ?  |
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I suppose that Apple has done so well under Steve Jobs tenure also because the board was smart enough to give him full control of the company.
In contrast, Apple's competitors seem to be run by apparatchiks. Office politics is killing innovation in those companies.
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Sans vouloir en rajouter: le DU casse le monopole de la création monétaire par les prêts bancaires..
Je n'ai pas encore vu de théorie économique qui prouvait que l'optimum se trouvait à 100% de la création monétaire par les banques.
Et pour causes !!
1/La plupart des économistes ne savent pas qu'il est possible de faire autrement(et ne savent pas encore que bitcoin existe!!)
2/La plupart des économistes ont travaillé, travaillent ou travailleront un jour pour une banque.
Donc il est urgent d'essayer autre chose (bitcoin, le DU, etc) sans attendre qu'un économiste ne le recommande.
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Yes, but if your family doesn't know what your printed QR-code in your drawer is, your bitcoins are also going to disappear if you die.
I kind of like the idea that the bitcoins disappear with their owner: it's like a donation to the bitcoin community since the value of the remaining bitcoins is increased in proportion of the lost coins. That's the beauty of a limited money supply combined with infinite divisibility. |
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What would be very cool would be a script that creates a transaction to an other address, using raw block downloaded from blockexplorer.com and an IP found on IRC.
Just to clarify, are you suggesting to include the desired spending tx directly in a raw block and start mining it (to avoid the need to import the private key in a wallet) ? The script would have the destination address and raw block as arguments ? what is this ip address business ? |
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I don't even get why we have a board for this, if there have yet to be any actual alternatives that aren't just a scheme to get rich quickly. I propose that we rename this board to the "IWANNAMAKEMYOWNCOINS" board.
1/ +1 for this suggestion 2/ as a second choice, Other Chain Currencies |
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Thaks for this new installment: it works beautifully as per the transcript below (only the last lines). I have not yet tested the "spending" end though (sending coins to the address below importing the private key and spending). Meanwhile if anyone can send me a dime (0.10 BTC)  $ gpg < wallet.pem.asc | > openssl ec -pubout | > publicKeyToAddress You need a passphrase to unlock the secret key for user: "Boussac" read EC key 2048-bit RSA key, ID 26B8AF92, created 2011-07-02 read EC key gpg: encrypted with 2048-bit RSA key, ID 26B8AF92, created 2011-07-02 "Boussac" writing EC key writing EC key 1E1wr4xtgWDVsuqUR42rDi8J5U1nhKYnKa |
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I don't know much about freicoin, but I don't really believe fixed monetary base because that will limit the economy expansion, and deflation tendency will encourage hoarding of the currency.
My understanding of bitcoin is that it is more than a currency: it is also a transaction processing network. When one buys bitcoins, one is also buying shares in this new network (take a look at the the market cap of transaction network companies). People can hold the shares and trade them: hoarding is not a problem as long as there is liquidity. Bitcoins can be used as a meta-currency to process transactions in any currency. Deflation is a problem for fiat money not for shares in a small cap ! |
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Well, I believe all banking systems supporting euros and dollars use cryptographic techniques. Technology is not defining bitcoin entirely.
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CRYPTO sucks: in ancient greek that means "hidden". I don't want bitcoin to be hidden. I want it to stroll around in bright day light on Wall Street.
Who said crypto was "official" btw ??
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IMHO this category should be renamed: cryptocurrency sounds like a derogatory term invented by banksters !
In contrast, complementary currencies have been proposed and discussed for years by many: they are meant to coexist with state currencies, not to replace them entirely.
Unlike, bitcoin, none of them has gained much traction because they lacked one or more of the features displayed by bitcoin.
Or because they are based on very questionnable assumptions.
Alternatively, Grondilu has proposed "meta-currency" which sounds very relevant since it refers to one of the main use cases for bitcoins.
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