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661  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Quant computers in five years on: September 06, 2012, 12:04:23 PM
The problem with this kind of predictions is that it can only be formulated by people with a vested interest in their realization. Reading the article, left me with the question: where are the facts ?
662  Economy / Service Discussion / What's going on with Bitfloor ? on: September 05, 2012, 08:30:36 AM
Aside from the excellent and timely report by Bitcoin Magazine below, does anyone have anymore info about this hack ?

Quote
Bitfloor, the fourth largest exchange dealing in US dollars, has just announced[1] that it has been hacked, and the service has taken a loss of 24,000 BTC, worth about $250,000 at the time of the theft. As Roman Shtylman, the founder of Bitfloor, describes it, “last night, a few of our servers were compromised. As a result, the attacker gained accesses to an unencrypted backup of the wallet keys (the actual keys live in an encrypted area). Using these keys they were able to transfer the coins. This attack took the vast majority of the coins BitFloor was holding on hand.” As a result, BitFloor has paused all exchange operations and, depending on the effect that this will have on BitFloor’s finances, BitFloor may take one of two options. They may either take the loss and continue running in an attempt to eventually earn the money back or, in the worst case, shut down entirely and begin an account partial refund process out of the available funds.

The unencrypted backup that allowed the thief to carry out the attack was made when Shtylman made a manual upgrade earlier and put the data into an unencrypted partition on his disk; Shtylman has so far declined to comment further on the details of the attack, saying that “my current focus is on the future and not the past.” As Bitcoin security experts point out, Bitfloor made not one but two errors that were both necessary to lead to such a severe loss; the first, leaving data stored unencrypted, was an honest and perhaps unavoidable mistake, but it would not have had nearly as much of an effect if there had not also been the second error of leaving so much money in an online-accessible “hot wallet”. Since the Bitcoinica Linode theft, in which an unknown attacker made off with $222,000 worth of bitcoins from Bitcoinica’s hot wallet in March, it has been generally understood that any Bitcoin-holding service should keep the vast majority of its funds in “cold storage”, a term referring to a setup where the private keys never touch any computer that is accessible from the internet.
663  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Three Pools Have Near-total Control Over the Bitcoin Network on: September 05, 2012, 06:27:06 AM
All
centralized
Quote
monetary systems tend towards corruption.
664  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin is quantum-computing proof? on: September 04, 2012, 01:13:35 PM
If quantum computing ever becomes an issue, I suspect the loss of bitcoin's keyspace will be among the least of our worries. It would be a very different world.
+1
On top of that, my understanding from a convincing demonstration by Bruce Schneier is that a quantum computer, if it is ever built, would have to break the laws of thermodynamics to break bitcoin. Therefore I would not worry to much about quantum computing.
The demonstration you're referring to relates to the impossibility of brute-forcing large keyspaces. Shor's algorithm is useful specifically because it is not a brute-force solution. (Grover's algorithm isn't a brute-force solution either, but only reduces the effective search space by a square root, so can be countered by simply doubling the key size).

You are mistaken in believing that Shor's algorithm is relevant.
ECDSA does NOT rely on the difficulty of prime integer factorisation (for which Shor is effective) but on the difficulty of finding the discrete logarithm (for which Shor is irrelevant)..
665  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin is quantum-computing proof? on: September 04, 2012, 09:46:41 AM
If quantum computing ever becomes an issue, I suspect the loss of bitcoin's keyspace will be among the least of our worries. It would be a very different world.
+1
On top of that, my understanding from a convincing demonstration by Bruce Schneier is that a quantum computer, if it is ever built, would have to break the laws of thermodynamics to break bitcoin. Therefore I would not worry to much about quantum computing.
666  Local / Discussions générales et utilisation du Bitcoin / Re: Help je suis perdu on: September 01, 2012, 07:40:29 PM
Le plus simple, de loin, c'est d'utiliser le wallet en ligne paytunia sur paytunia.com.
Tu peux l'utiliser ensuite depuis ton PC ou ton mobile (application mobile paytunia sur Google Play ou version mobile html5 du site web via m.paytunia.com pour les iPhones).
667  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: What are the chances of an address collision? and what happens when it does? on: August 30, 2012, 12:18:32 PM
What I'd like to know is why some letters have higher probability than others? Is that because some letters are more likely on the elliptic curve vs not? If you plug sequences into vanitygen it will give different difficulties depending on letter, eg.

11... > 1A...
1Q... > 1D...
1R... > 1Q... and so on.

I made a table of the first three chars after 1 to help me in a project with fast lookup of difficulty calculation. There are broad classes of probabilities depending on what letters are involved. I guess there is some non 1-1 mapping from 2^160 possible addresses and base 58 representations.

In ECDSA, you start with a large integer as your private key then multiply ("multiplication" here must be understood as a group operator not as arithmetic multiplication) the base point G of your elliptic curve to get the corresponding public key.
Therefore your public key is a point (x,y) on the elliptic curve.

In bitcoin, your address is some hash of you public key.
As a result, if you start from a random string, the likelihood of a collision between said string and a "valid" address depends on how many integers n satisfy the condition "n*G is a point on the curve AND this point hashes to a matching string".
Therefore a brute force algorithm (like vanitygen) might display varying difficulty as a function of the chosen string.
668  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: What are the chances of an address collision? and what happens when it does? on: August 30, 2012, 06:47:54 AM
To me a "valid" address is one that has a private key.
The checksum verification of an address does not warrant that a private key exist for that address.

Hence my post above: the point represented by the public key MUST be on the ellptic currve.

In short,
1/you can random type an address with a valid checksum
2/ funds can be sent to that address because miners will get it on the blockchain
3/Nobody will ever spend those funds again because there is no private key for that address: the bitcoins on that address are lost for ever
669  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: What are the chances of an address collision? and what happens when it does? on: August 29, 2012, 08:11:35 PM

Not to hijack the thread, cuz i'm sure other people will read and be curious abut his too: But can some one quickly explain why its also very unlikely to accidentally type a valid Bitcoin address.  They are 33 (32 unique) case-sensitive alpha-numeric digits (Base 58).  Only a subset of all possible combinations are valid addresses.  What is the method and explanation for this?

Can some one also explain how if a public address is a sha hash of a public key, how can an address be signed by the owner of the privkey, if the public address can't be reversed into the full public key  (the key pairs are 256 bit ECDSA right?  Should be loner than 32 characters).

Since a bitcoin public key is in fact a pair of coordinates for a point on the elliptic curve, it's not surprising that only a subset of the possible address strings happen to be a hash of valid coordinates.
Plus there is a checksum attached to it.
It would be a miracle to random type a valid bitcoin address.
670  Local / Discussions générales et utilisation du Bitcoin / Re: Mention de bitcoin dans le rapport TRACFIN 2011 on: August 28, 2012, 08:59:34 AM

L'intro du bitcoin est juste légendaire : 
Quote
Le bitcoin est une monnaie virtuelle, qui peut être qualifiée de « virale » (les bitcoins se dupliquant automatiquement)

C'est énorme  Grin
671  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: If Pirate Runs: The Danger of one entity with 500K BTC on: August 27, 2012, 09:01:39 PM
everywhere you see, say, $10, mentally substitute "whatever the average  price would have been over the medium-term had the price not been manipulated". Wherever you see, say, $7, substitute "a bit less than what the price would have been had it not been manipulated".

I don't know what you had for breakfast, but I hope you realize this doesn't make sense AT ALL.

Again, the future price is set by the wealthy influential investor not by "rational" investors.

If investors invest without complete, exhaustive, public information about what is it they are buying, they are NOT rational, by definition.

By the way, the pump and dump strategy is a known scheme that has worked many times (ever heard of Enron) even though it's considered a fraud in most jurisdiction.

672  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: If Pirate Runs: The Danger of one entity with 500K BTC on: August 27, 2012, 08:30:25 AM
No, the only implicit assumption I am making here is that he is able to drive the market up and down because of his clout and larger stash of cash. Each successful cycle would only increase his momentum. A failed cycle would signal the end of the attack. The key success factor is to start with a big enough cash reserve and solid nerves..
The problem is that anyone who understands this strategy can get the same profit he does without any of the expense.

Say the long-term, fair market value of bitcoins is around $10, and that's roughly where they would be if nobody manipulated them.

Nice try but unconvincing. There is no such things as "fair" market value, "rational" investor behavior or "efficient" markets. Please read Mandelbrot or Taleb on Finance to end the belief in Gaussian law applied to irrational behaviors.
It has been shown that, if we had "rational" markets", events like financial crises would happen every 500 000 years instead of every 10-15 years.
Hence you refutation does not hold.
673  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: If Pirate Runs: The Danger of one entity with 500K BTC on: August 23, 2012, 09:48:37 PM

That assumes he's the only one buying, though. He may be able to do this once, but when he tries it again (say next weekend) he'd find it harder to get away with.
No, the only implicit assumption I am making here is that he is able to drive the market up and down because of his clout and larger stash of cash. Each successful cycle would only increase his momentum. A failed cycle would signal the end of the attack. The key success factor is to start with a big enough cash reserve and solid nerves..
674  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: If Pirate Runs: The Danger of one entity with 500K BTC on: August 23, 2012, 09:41:24 PM
Still hypothetically,  Wink  I hope the bitcoin community has considered the very real danger posed by an individual in control of 500K of BTC. Sure there are accounts with balances almost as high but what is to prevent Pirate or anyone else with so much BTC from cyclically crashing the market and buying up more coins?

Some might say that someone with so many coins wouldn't destroy the market as they are so invested in it, but what happens if their Buy/Sell cycle doesn't destroy bitcoin in the long run, but they are just taking a wager that they can pull it off enough times while bitcoin is small enough and then quit misbehaving when it's bigger?

Even if you can't regularly do $15 to $8, even 1-2$ in change often enough could eventually give you monopolistic power over the bitcoin system.

For bitcoin's sake- I hope Pirate Returns the money, and the community stays away from such "financial innovation" in the future, even if it's not a ponzi.

So you're saying... he'll sell $1 of Bitcoin, sending the price down, then buy $1 of Bitcoin, sending the price up... and then he'll profit from that over and over?

Interesting business idea. Let me know how it goes.

There is zero danger of having one entity with 500k coins. The WORST outcome is if that person dumped all coins instantly. It would crash the price. Then what would happen? People like myself would buy up the cheap coins, the price would find some new stabilization level, and the "grave danger" would be gone. Someone with that many coins can crash the price, but only once. Problems solved.

It's a non issue.

As much as I would like to follow you, let me try to challenge your dismissal of the attack. Let's say George Soros sets aside 10 M USD to pump and dump bitcoins.
He pumps 500k bitcoins over a period of time when the price rises from 8 to 12 USD (buying @10 USD on average, spending 5 M USD). Then he dumps from 12 USD to zero (selling @ 6 USD average, getting 3 M USD). This first move cost him 2 M USD but now he can pump cheap bitcoins (starting at virtually zero) with 8 M USD in a second move.. Assuming he buys back at 5 USD on average (buyers are cautious because he has burned some), the remaining 8 M USD now yield 1.6 million BTC. Had he spent the 10 M USD upfront , he would have gotten only 1 million BTC (@ 10 USD average)..
675  Local / Discussions générales et utilisation du Bitcoin / Re: Mais ou vont les Bitcoin perdu ? on: August 23, 2012, 08:58:22 PM
ok merci, je ferais des copies la prochaine fois.

en même temps c'est logique, c'est comme des billets de banque, si je brule un billet de 10€, personne ne le récupére, il disparait définitivement

Non ce n'est pas pareil pour un billet de 10 €: les euros sont fabriqués à volonté par les banques par l'émission de dettes. La BCE peut en plus les imprimer sur du papier.

Par contre, des bitcoins sur une adresse peuvent devenir définitivement inaccessibles si tu perds la clé privée correspondant à l'adresse. Ils existent toujours mais personne ne pourra jamais les dépenser.
676  Local / Discussions générales et utilisation du Bitcoin / Re: Bitinstant et son projet de carte bancaire on: August 23, 2012, 08:46:03 PM

Les détracteurs diront que bitcoin réinvente ainsi ce qui existe déjà et ils diront que ça prouve que bitcoin n'apporte rien de neuf au système.


En effet, il sont capables de dire ça sans réaliser que ça revient à dire que l'invention de l'automobile ne sert à rien si le train existe déjà..
J'ai répété maintes fois sur ce forum que bitcoin ajoute un degré de liberté mais n'en enlève aucun: on peut continuer à utiliser les services d'une banque et être sa propre banque avec bitcoin. Le rapport de force avec la banque est changé.
On sait depuis Aristote que les rapports de force déterminent le prix des choses ( la fameuse loi de l'offre et de la demande est une simplification fausse.)
677  Bitcoin / Press / Re: 2012-8-22 techweekeurope.co.uk MasterCard Denies Plans For BitCoin Credit Card on: August 23, 2012, 03:27:39 PM
This still needs to be sorted out because Mastercard wouldn't necessarily have knowledge of partner bank's affiliate negotiations.

That is probably true, but the problem is that now that they know about it, they could revoke that bank's authorization to issue debit cards. The fact that MasterCard is coming out and saying they don't have knowledge of this does not bode well for the product launch.

That was my initial thought too, because something that was relatively innocuous is now on CNN, etc. However, in reality, the affiliate card programs generate transaction/fee volume for MC; they don't care if it's a Planned Parenthood card or an ACLU card or an NRA card. I doubt that this has put bitcoin on any 'special radar' (it's no different than selling bitcoin on your own and putting the value on your Wal*Mart debit card.)

I believe that the BitInstant card will receive approval. The thought that Mastercard is intimidated by bitcoin is funny, because they could co-opt BTC momentum at any time by just adding it to the list of 158 other currencies that they authorize and clear in. Bitcoin is another currency to Mastercard and the chargeback and consumer protections provided by that network are value-adds for certain transactions.

I believe too they will get approval. MC must have understood that they can offer value added services through their members using the bitcoin network. It's a no brainer for anyone with some understanding of bitcoin and some experience in the payment business. MC is a challenger to Visa, that's why they are the first movers.Yet it's a major shift of their current operating model. Bitcoin is still small enough for them to experiment without taking much risks.
678  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Bitcoin is a lot like egold. Egold was shutdown after having many HYIPs/Ponzis. on: August 22, 2012, 04:12:30 PM
yet another thread where the OP makes a FUD statement and then disappears unwilling to defend his position b/c he knows he can't.

+1
Lots of redundant FUD in trollish threads
679  Local / Actualité et News / Re: Revue de presse bitcoin en français on: August 22, 2012, 03:59:22 PM
Un article dans l'édition papier des Echos aujourd'hui qui parle (bien) de bitcoin et de Paymium: c'est une première !

http://www.lesechos.fr/entreprises-secteurs/finance-marches/actu/0202172194329-l-essor-du-bitcoin-devise-electronique-354618.php?Msg=Ident1

Quote
Pour envoyer 100 euros à un ami à l'étranger par exemple, il est possible de convertir ce montant sur l'une des places de marché de gré à gré où s'échangent les bitcoins (il en existe une petite vingtaine dans le monde) puis de l'envoyer par Internet. Une fois le transfert opéré, le destinataire peut à son tour convertir ses bitcoins dans la devise de son choix. «  Il n'est nul besoin de déployer un réseau intercontinental, une connexion Internet suffit : les coûts d'infrastructure sont donc quasi inexistants. Contrairement aux réseaux privatifs existant, comme Visa ou Mastercard, le système n'a pas besoin de commissions importantes pour être rentable », conclut Gonzague Grandval, président-directeur général de Paymium. Cette société de solutions de paiement a d'ailleurs créé une application mobile baptisée « Paytunia » permettant d'envoyer et de recevoir des bitcoins et de les convertir en monnaie traditionnelle.
680  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Is bitcoin 2 coming out next month? on: August 21, 2012, 01:27:57 PM
We all know the term "web 2.0" is a favorite of all the marketers who missed the boat on the web altogether and run after the lost time.
It's also the hope of many who would like to impose censorship on the web.
Unfortunately for them, there is no such thing as the web 2.0, there is the web period.


Expect again many "marketers" to promote the idea of a bitcoin 2 because so many of them are missing on bitcoin when the time is now.
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