MoneyPot.com :: The bitcoin gambling wallet

[BetterBets.io]

As a new privacy feature, some (but not all) of your withdrawals will now have multiple change addresses (which may be from the cold, hot or warm wallet).

Here's an example withdrawal: https://blockchain.info/tx/93edee61b741dca549f4fad518caa7a4728b9e3f73b055756feb977fd8d7c7fc

This makes it even more of a PITA for anyone trying to do blockchain analysis on MP withdrawals (as it makes it almost impossible to reliably tell change addresses from withdrawal addresses).  And remember to generate unique addresses for each transfer you receive, and when you need that extra level of privacy use our awesome cold-addresses ( https://blog.moneypot.com/cold-addresses/ ) for deposits.

Great idea, privacy concerns are always a concern for some bitcoin users and especially helpful for this business. Good job on this implementation!

[ranlo]

As a new privacy feature, some (but not all) of your withdrawals will now have multiple change addresses (which may be from the cold, hot or warm wallet).

Here's an example withdrawal: https://blockchain.info/tx/93edee61b741dca549f4fad518caa7a4728b9e3f73b055756feb977fd8d7c7fc

This makes it even more of a PITA for anyone trying to do blockchain analysis on MP withdrawals (as it makes it almost impossible to reliably tell change addresses from withdrawal addresses).  And remember to generate unique addresses for each transfer you receive, and when you need that extra level of privacy use our awesome cold-addresses ( https://blog.moneypot.com/cold-addresses/ ) for deposits.

Great idea, privacy concerns are always a concern for some bitcoin users and especially helpful for this business. Good job on this implementation!

Huge +1. I've never heard of this method being used before, but it's a great idea. Did you come up with this from somewhere else or did you get the idea on your own? This is a huge step forward for obfuscation of addresses.

[RHavar]

Huge +1. I've never heard of this method being used before, but it's a great idea. Did you come up with this from somewhere else or did you get the idea on your own? This is a huge step forward for obfuscation of addresses.

I independently came up with it, but I'm sure it's been proposed many times before. I know a lot of people have worked on coin selection ideas that make change amounts difficult to distinguish from the sending amounts, but in practice it's very difficult to do that well. On the other hand, having multiple change addresses makes it easy to have them completely ambiguous with the actual withdrawal, at the expense of making the transaction a little bigger and occasionally spend-linking a few extra outputs together.

(The other disadvantage being that transactions with 3 or more outputs are relatively uncommon, so I can't use them too much or it will be characteristic of a MP withdrawal)

It started off when I was playing around with blockseer on MP and some other sites, and it was a bit surreal to see that in what seemed like ~99% of the cases you could build up a pretty accurate picture of the hot wallet, purely by tracking transactions and deducing which was the change and not. I'm pretty sure that with enough effort, it would be quite easy for someone (e.g. coinbase or circle?) to build quite an accurate idea of what is a deposit and withdrawal (but not really link them together).

As another benefit, the code now monitors the size of the hot wallet and actually automatically spills it over into cold storage (using bip32 addresses) which avoids the other potentially privacy damaging sweep operation =)

[ranlo]

Huge +1. I've never heard of this method being used before, but it's a great idea. Did you come up with this from somewhere else or did you get the idea on your own? This is a huge step forward for obfuscation of addresses.

I independently came up with it, but I'm sure it's been proposed many times before. I know a lot of people have worked on coin selection ideas that make change amounts difficult to distinguish from the sending amounts, but in practice it's very difficult to do that well. On the other hand, having multiple change addresses makes it easy to have them completely ambiguous with the actual withdrawal, at the expense of making the transaction a little bigger and occasionally spend-linking a few extra outputs together.

(The other disadvantage being that transactions with 3 or more outputs are relatively uncommon, so I can't use them too much or it will be characteristic of a MP withdrawal)

It started off when I was playing around with blockseer on MP and some other sites, and it was a bit surreal to see that in what seemed like ~99% of the cases you could build up a pretty accurate picture of the hot wallet, purely by tracking transactions and deducing which was the change and not. I'm pretty sure that with enough effort, it would be quite easy for someone (e.g. coinbase or circle?) to build quite an accurate idea of what is a deposit and withdrawal (but not really link them together).

As another benefit, the code now monitors the size of the hot wallet and actually automatically spills it over into cold storage (using bip32 addresses) which avoids the other potentially privacy damaging sweep operation =)

Really cool idea. I think this should be displayed somewhat prominently when making a withdrawal, though. Some sites in the past have had issues when making a deposit that had multiple outputs to it, and would ignore the deposit altogether as a result. I can't think of the big one I did this with, but I learned when I withdrew from the original SWC (which had like 50 outputs linked together) and never saw my transaction show up on one of the exchanges.

[jacee]

I must've missed the time where I used to play at moneypot before and when I say money pot it's the old game and now when I go to the sites' a bunch of dice games are gradually popping. Nice development to the moneypot tho.

[ranlo]

I must've missed the time where I used to play at moneypot before and when I say money pot it's the old game and now when I go to the sites' a bunch of dice games are gradually popping. Nice development to the moneypot tho.

The old game is now bustabit.com and still exists, as well.

[jacee]

I must've missed the time where I used to play at moneypot before and when I say money pot it's the old game and now when I go to the sites' a bunch of dice games are gradually popping. Nice development to the moneypot tho.

The old game is now bustabit.com and still exists, as well.

Yes I know, it's a lot more better than the old game so I'm applausing to the devs work.

[Altcoin4life]

I must've missed the time where I used to play at moneypot before and when I say money pot it's the old game and now when I go to the sites' a bunch of dice games are gradually popping. Nice development to the moneypot tho.

The old game is now bustabit.com and still exists, as well.

Yes I know, it's a lot more better than the old game so I'm applausing to the devs work.

Yeah I think most don't even yet realize how big a deal this moneypot system really is still. It's great for players.

[Erza]

I must've missed the time where I used to play at moneypot before and when I say money pot it's the old game and now when I go to the sites' a bunch of dice games are gradually popping. Nice development to the moneypot tho.

The old game is now bustabit.com and still exists, as well.

Yes I know, it's a lot more better than the old game so I'm applausing to the devs work.

Of course they have been better and better to attract more people to play in their game, and btw bustabit is still nice to play so old game will never die though 

[Dennis7777]

As another benefit, the code now monitors the size of the hot wallet and actually automatically spills it over into cold storage (using bip32 addresses) which avoids the other potentially privacy damaging sweep operation =)

What if someone deposit a big amount and withdraw it back some hours later? Your code will automatically send the bitcoin to your cold wallet, and you will manually send bitcoin from your cold wallet to process the withdrawal, but will the last step make your cold wallet addresses linkable?

[RHavar]

What if someone deposit a big amount and withdraw it back some hours later? Your code will automatically send the bitcoin to your cold wallet, and you will manually send bitcoin from your cold wallet to process the withdrawal, but will the last step make your cold wallet addresses linkable?

There's not a single cold-wallet address (we generate a new one for each deposit, using bip32) so if people find out a few of them, is not a problem, and doesn't reveal what the others are. Also, the code is quite intelligent so it doesn't spill money to the cold wallet, unless the hot wallet overflows a configurable "too full" level, and will never spill too much. 

[Pro Gamers]

I dont understand how the investments worked i have deposited but i cant transfer 0.01 to investment.

[shulio]

I dont understand how the investments worked i have deposited but i cant transfer 0.01 to investment.

Just go to the investment then you invest the bitcoin there, it will work automatic but with 0.01 you will get <0.01 % so you will almost not get anything from the loss of the player

[NLNico]

That reminds me, I would like an "Invest all" button on that page. Hope that's possible, would save me many seconds of copy-pasting, thanks.

[Pro Gamers]

I dont understand how the investments worked i have deposited but i cant transfer 0.01 to investment.

Just go to the investment then you invest the bitcoin there, it will work automatic but with 0.01 you will get <0.01 % so you will almost not get anything from the loss of the player

I did that but the amount i invested still placed in the wallet and didnt move to investment wallet, is everythings ok? I saw 0.01% stake already

[Chemistry1988]

The 10% investor profit commission will kick in once the investor profits reach their previous high levels (~50 BTC). From then on, investors will pay a 10% fee on further profits, this will be deducted upon divestment, or on a monthly basis.

The investor profit is now +60 btc, so the commission system should have been kicked in already. But I just did a divestment and don't seem to see it. Also, it would be good to show my investment profit since the last commission payment on the investment page, so that I can have a clear picture of it before divesting.

[ranlo]

The 10% investor profit commission will kick in once the investor profits reach their previous high levels (~50 BTC). From then on, investors will pay a 10% fee on further profits, this will be deducted upon divestment, or on a monthly basis.

The investor profit is now +60 btc, so the commission system should have been kicked in already. But I just did a divestment and don't seem to see it. Also, it would be good to show my investment profit since the last commission payment on the investment page, so that I can have a clear picture of it before divesting.

I want to second the idea of having our previous high, as a way to transparently measure where we're at. JD does this and it's a great thing.

[RHavar]

The investor profit is now +60 btc, so the commission system should have been kicked in already. But I just did a divestment and don't seem to see it. Also, it would be good to show my investment profit since the last commission payment on the investment page, so that I can have a clear picture of it before divesting.

Well the good news is that I've been busy, and haven't had the time to do proper testing for the investor commissions branch, so all earnings are completely free of commission at the moment. After the change lands, it is quite explicit about your investing profit and how much commissions will be charged. (and don't worry, it won't charge profits from before the change lands).


But at the moment it's taken a bit of a back seat to some of the bustabit maintenance work I've been doing, and building a brand-new exciting feature for MP (sorry, I won't leak too much, but it'll be really cool, I promise).

[RHavar]

I dont understand how the investments worked i have deposited but i cant transfer 0.01 to investment.

You're trying to transfer 0.01 bit to investment? Offhand, I think there might be a small limit (which I'll probably soon raise to 10k bits, as investing and divesting is quite an expensive database operation)

[ranlo]

The investor profit is now +60 btc, so the commission system should have been kicked in already. But I just did a divestment and don't seem to see it. Also, it would be good to show my investment profit since the last commission payment on the investment page, so that I can have a clear picture of it before divesting.

Well the good news is that I've been busy, and haven't had the time to do proper testing for the investor commissions branch, so all earnings are completely free of commission at the moment. After the change lands, it is quite explicit about your investing profit and how much commissions will be charged. (and don't worry, it won't charge profits from before the change lands).


But at the moment it's taken a bit of a back seat to some of the bustabit maintenance work I've been doing, and building a brand-new exciting feature for MP (sorry, I won't leak too much, but it'll be really cool, I promise).

Do you mean that when you choose to divest, it'll tell you what the fee will be and such before it's final? Or that it will tell you this after it's done? Hoping for the former.