[POLL] Does EVAN DUFFIELD regret instamining DRK/DASH at 100x emission?

[coins101]

Quite a few people who were at the Monero launch were reporting hitting 1-2 blocks per day. Over a two week period, they might have got 750-1,200 coins, lets be generous and say 5k.

Some people had managed to get really lucky and had 20k, about 10% of the supply at the time, in about a week.

.....
I already pledged 10k which is half of my coins...

Nice to have the luck to be in the right place at the right time and to have the resources to scale up such a mining effort.

But with Monero, the dev, or the patsy account, mysteriously vanished.

While the Darkcoin dev was open about his name, which part of America he lives and is still around - working away, for 14 months now, with plans to carry on developing - you know 'dev'ing.

--------

You see what I did there?

A few facts, and some leading words and you can take that sort of thing in a variety of directions depending on your intentions.

[smooth]

Quite a few people who were at the Monero launch were reporting hitting 1-2 blocks per day. Over a two week period, they might have got 750-1,200 coins, lets be generous and say 5k.

Some people had managed to get really lucky and had 20k, about 10% of the supply at the time, in about a week.

.....
I already pledged 10k which is half of my coins...

Nice to have the luck to be in the right place at the right time and to have the resources to scale up such a mining effort.

But with Monero, the dev, or the patsy account, mysteriously vanished.

While the Darkcoin dev was open about his name, which part of America he lives and is still around - working away, for 14 months now, with plans to carry on developing - you know 'dev'ing.

--------

You see what I did there?

A few facts, and some leading words and you can take that sort of thing in a variety of directions depending on your intentions.

Not sure what you are suggesting. If you're suggesting that I'm TFT or had some involvement with him, or that I was involved with the BCN scam...good luck with that. It makes you look even more ridiculous. But since you brought it up, the fact that I mined a lot of XMR, and I also know other people who mined a lot and had nothing to do with BCN (such as dga, and several other large miners I know) is how I know that TFT or BCN scammers didn't mine a lot of XMR before the crippled miner was fixed, or even during the period after that when it was no longer blatantly crippled but was being progressively optimized by dga and by us. There just wasn't that much left. So your theory about the scam-mining of XMR being this large percentage or that large percentage is just flat wrong (never mind that it is irrelevant to Dash, but I'll get to that later). It may be have been zero, or it may have been an vanishingly small amount. I don't know which.

In fact, I have a lot of my own computers (and cloud accounts) so I've mined a lot of CPU coins. In fact that is how I found BCN (which led to my involvement with XMR). Before XMR I mined BCN and before that I mined MMC and DTC and PTS and probably a few others I don't remember. Here's a bit of documentation for that which was easy to find.



(also traded cpu mined coins several times with this guy: http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=MobPhone&sign=ANY&type=RECV)

There are also some posts of mine in the altcoin marketplace related to coins I CPU mined, but I didn't bother to find them.

If you want to investigate XMR (or anything else) and find improprieties like, for example, misleading people about the launch time, go right ahead, but right now it looks like you aren't actually investigating, nor finding improprieties. You are just grasping at anything negative you can concoct to say about XMR as a method of throwing up a lot of nonsense to deflect attention from Evan's instamine. Still, do you think he regrets it?

This is the thing you fundamentally don't understand, coins101. Throwing insults or attacks at XMR does not help justify Dash's instamine or Evan's well-documented unscrupulous behavior surrounding it. It just makes everyone realize that you don't have any substantive refutation or justification and have necessarily gone into attack-the-attacker mode.

It also isn't going to intimidate us into keeping quiet about it so you can whitewash it and scam noobs unchallenged.

[coins101]

Some might call it standing up to bully boy tactics.

But I'm glad you called yourself an attacker. We do seem to be making progress.

And to think, I actually defended you in the Darkcoin thread.

....
I'm not 100% sure smooth has been trolling, but I haven't read all his posts.

From my experience with seeing smooth in various threads, he strikes me as being an asset to any project. But I'll defer to the views of those here who have seen most of his posts.

....
edit

taking a look back at smooth's posts, and will update

It really is shameful for a lead dev to be undertaking, sorry, leading such a smear campaign.

Lead devs lead by example, and this is the shameful example you choose to lead with.

[smooth]

But I'm glad you called yourself an attacker. We do seem to be making progress.

Come on man, you know that attack-the-attacker is a term of art and does not imply malice (quite the contrary) on the part of the person being subjected to it. It's an intimidation tactic used to suppress criticism.

Cut out the silly snipes at Monero and me already. It's pathetic.

It really is shameful for a lead dev to be undertaking, sorry, leading such a smear campaign.

Lead devs lead by example, and this is the shameful example you choose to lead with.

There is nothing shameful about standing up to scams and telling it like it. The problem with the altcoin community isn't the people like me do it, it's that people generally don't do it enough. That is shameful.

I'm proud of the example I set.

And to think, I actually defended you in the Darkcoin thread.

From my experience with seeing smooth in various threads, he strikes me as being an asset to any project. But I'll defer to the views of those here who have seen most of his posts.

Maybe you should consider that your first impression may have been correct and reasoning now on the basis of "smooth criticizes Dash therefore there must be something wrong with smooth (and Monero)" is not being intellectually honest. Because it is pretty clear that is exactly what you are doing.

[coins101]

"There is nothing shameful about standing up to scams and telling it like it."

Monero was launched with scam code. I can provide the links to yours and your other lead devs quotes if you want. But we all now know there were scam intentions at launch.

So, as you say, which I and others agree with you on, it is worth standing up to scams and also bully boys.

And for some reason you have decided to become a bully boy instead of leading by example and steering clear of smear campaigns, which part of your own community now find distasteful.

[smooth]

"There is nothing shameful about standing up to scams and telling it like it."

Monero was launched with scam code. I can provide the links to yours and your other lead devs quotes if you want. But we all now know there were scam intentions at launch.

I keep telling you that there is no evidence of scam intention at launch, because we don't know TFT's intentions. We don't even know if he knew that code existed, or if he or anyone ever took advantage of it. The intention of the code was clearly the BCN scam, where that code came from. It may or may not have been intended for scamming on Bitmonero. We don't know.

If you have evidence, let us know (ideally on an appropriate thread).

Feel free to investigate Monero, create threads about how you think Monero is a scam (ideally with evidence), etc. Have at it. But try not to derail threads about Dash (for example, "whether Evan regrets instamining it", or for that matter the Dash main thread) with your lashing out at Monero though.

[coins101]

Err, you do know it was a scam.

Before we can set up pools..
We need a miner.

Currently the mining is done In the wallet AFAIK

There is also a miner in the standard build, just no pool to connect it to.

Not long after launch, around one to two weeks, people started to smell a rat and at some point the Monero dev somehow did a runner, or possibly just changed account profile and carried (carries) on being involved.

Some of the early community members decided that, despite being only one or two weeks in, they would continue with the project rather than stop, fix, relaunch.

That smells a bit. Had we seen two or three months of effort, then maybe a continuation would have been more believable. People were smelling a rigged launch at the time:

i would like to propose a conspiracy theory here. could it be that TFT and friends created a problem where there was non, as they see the coin going up in popularity and thus limit ability for people to mine or participate.
1. yes mining continued: is this true can a non techy very this
2. increased frustration: people may hold of mining while a better wallet is in place. thus decreasing difficulty and increasing coin accumulation of those in the know.
3. a day later and still unable to access wallet from first page. people are pointed to github but I do not see a link there that says updated wallet. click here and your parse problems will be solved.
4. i recall i could not participate early because link was botched. there was no note underneath to clarify this for those new to cryptocurrencies. for 5 days I could not mine while tft and friends went about it merrily.

would tft go to such an extreme.... just speculating.

There is no dispute that Monero was launched with deceptive code intended to steal.  It has been admitted by the lead devs:

We've admitted to the crippled miner. We were the first ones to discover it, disclose it, and fix it. The reason I don't dwell on Monero's faults is not to hide them......

And the other lead dev:

....
The "dev" who launched Monero is thankful_for_today: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=233561

Thankfully when we (the current Monero core team) found the purposefully obfuscated code we immediately fixed it and made the fix freely available to all. This is what smooth means when he describes the Monero launch as fair. As dga says, at most thankful_for_today would've had a week of advantageous mining, but as our difficulty retargetting worked just fine and we didn't have crazy high initial block rewards there was very little that the scammer thankful_for_today could've made off with.

Note that these are all facts, directly observable by comparing increases in difficulty (ie. network hash rate) with the improved hashing code submitted to github. It does not require trust, it does not require anyone to take our word that coins have been sold or distributed, it is not based on hope. It is absolute, truthful, factual, verifiable by all.
...

[smooth]

Err, you do know it was a scam.

Let's not go back and forth on the same issue. Saying there was a crippled miner in the code that was forked from Bytecoin in a hurry, and was clearly crippled intentionally in Bytecoin, does not mean that crippled miner was intended as a scam for Bitmonero. It may have been, but there was no evidence of it.

If the code changes that TFT made in doing his fork had anything at all to do with the miner, then I'd acknowledge that he had at least looked at it. In fact, he did the typical altcoin copy/paste fork of changing a few parameters and launching, which had nothing to do with the miner at all.

If you disagree, create a thread and see if anyone believes you or cares. It seems people do believe the Dash instamine happened and they do care about it given the number of threads created about it and the amount of discussion they attract.

Back on the thread topic of whether Even regrets the Dash instamine. What do you think, coins101?

[coins101]

Yes, lets go back and forth on this issue.

Because that is all you have been doing for a month now. The other Trolleros have been at it for two months or more.

Err, you do know it was a scam.

Before we can set up pools..
We need a miner.

Currently the mining is done In the wallet AFAIK

There is also a miner in the standard build, just no pool to connect it to.

Not long after launch, around one to two weeks, people started to smell a rat and at some point the Monero dev somehow did a runner, or possibly just changed account profile and carried (carries) on being involved.

Some of the early community members decided that, despite being only one or two weeks in, they would continue with the project rather than stop, fix, relaunch.

That smells a bit. Had we seen two or three months of effort, then maybe a continuation would have been more believable. People were smelling a rigged launch at the time:

i would like to propose a conspiracy theory here. could it be that TFT and friends created a problem where there was non, as they see the coin going up in popularity and thus limit ability for people to mine or participate.
1. yes mining continued: is this true can a non techy very this
2. increased frustration: people may hold of mining while a better wallet is in place. thus decreasing difficulty and increasing coin accumulation of those in the know.
3. a day later and still unable to access wallet from first page. people are pointed to github but I do not see a link there that says updated wallet. click here and your parse problems will be solved.
4. i recall i could not participate early because link was botched. there was no note underneath to clarify this for those new to cryptocurrencies. for 5 days I could not mine while tft and friends went about it merrily.

would tft go to such an extreme.... just speculating.

There is no dispute that Monero was launched with deceptive code intended to steal.  It has been admitted by the lead devs:

We've admitted to the crippled miner. We were the first ones to discover it, disclose it, and fix it. The reason I don't dwell on Monero's faults is not to hide them......

And the other lead dev:

....
The "dev" who launched Monero is thankful_for_today: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=233561

Thankfully when we (the current Monero core team) found the purposefully obfuscated code we immediately fixed it and made the fix freely available to all. This is what smooth means when he describes the Monero launch as fair. As dga says, at most thankful_for_today would've had a week of advantageous mining, but as our difficulty retargetting worked just fine and we didn't have crazy high initial block rewards there was very little that the scammer thankful_for_today could've made off with.

Note that these are all facts, directly observable by comparing increases in difficulty (ie. network hash rate) with the improved hashing code submitted to github. It does not require trust, it does not require anyone to take our word that coins have been sold or distributed, it is not based on hope. It is absolute, truthful, factual, verifiable by all.
...

That' the thing about bully boy tactics. When people stand up to a bully, they never seem to like taking it as much as giving it.

Go back to being a dev and we can agree to disagree.

I have Monero people that are not on ignore because they are generally fair in their approach to a critique of other projects. The majority of Monero people are now on ignore.

I would now like to put you and Fluffy on ignore, but I won't while you maintain your smear campaign.

Go back to being a lead and lead by a good example. Then we can all move on.

[smooth]

I'm not going to reply to any more off-topic posts on this thread, it is just disrespectful to the other forum users.

Nor am I going to be intimidated into halting my criticism of any and all scams including the Dash instamine and Evan's well-documented misleading and deceptive behavior surrounding it.

coins101, if you post or reply on-topic (anywhere), I will happily discuss anything with you.

[BlockaFett]

I'm not going to reply to any more off-topic posts on this thread, it is just disrespectful to the other forum users.

Nor am I going to be intimidated into halting my criticism of any and all scams including the Dash instamine and Evan's well-documented misleading and deceptive behavior surrounding it.

coins101, if you post or reply on-topic (anywhere), I will happily discuss anything with you.

Very interesting reading, looks like your nose isn't so clean after all Smooth?

[BagHolder010]

Monero dev's at it again, so much jealousy towards EVAN because they can't code shit. If only Monero dev's start working instead of crying out loud towards EVAN coding skills and actually working to make Monero even better they would get better attention but since they can't code they are here spending time on forums. They hate that Evan is on magazines, crypto websites, and even getting more attention with he's innovation ways.

Cry more you won't get investors that way, people don't pay for laziness they pay for hard work and talent.

[spatula]

I had to give up counting how many Monero people are here.

Seems like a continuation of some sort of smear campaign. The 'cut off the head' approach.

I might now have take a good look at the deceptive launch of Monero and compare the two launches.

The purpose would be to consider what might constitute a scam launch and what might be considered legitimately a mistake. So on topic.

From memory about Monero,

The Monero launch included a launch pack that included some deceptive code aimed at rigging the mining for the material benefit of one or a few at the expense of the many. Also known as fraud.

Before we can set up pools..
We need a miner.

Currently the mining is done In the wallet AFAIK

There is also a miner in the standard build, just no pool to connect it to.

Not long after launch, around one to two weeks, people started to smell a rat and at some point the Monero dev somehow did a runner, or possibly just changed account profile and carried (carries) on being involved.

Some of the early community members decided that, despite being only one or two weeks in, they would continue with the project rather than stop, fix, relaunch.

That smells a bit. Had we seen two or three months of effort, then maybe a continuation would have been more believable. People were smelling a rigged launch at the time:

i would like to propose a conspiracy theory here. could it be that TFT and friends created a problem where there was non, as they see the coin going up in popularity and thus limit ability for people to mine or participate.
1. yes mining continued: is this true can a non techy very this
2. increased frustration: people may hold of mining while a better wallet is in place. thus decreasing difficulty and increasing coin accumulation of those in the know.
3. a day later and still unable to access wallet from first page. people are pointed to github but I do not see a link there that says updated wallet. click here and your parse problems will be solved.
4. i recall i could not participate early because link was botched. there was no note underneath to clarify this for those new to cryptocurrencies. for 5 days I could not mine while tft and friends went about it merrily.

would tft go to such an extreme.... just speculating.

There is no dispute that Monero was launched with deceptive code intended to steal.  It has been admitted by the lead devs:

We've admitted to the crippled miner. We were the first ones to discover it, disclose it, and fix it. The reason I don't dwell on Monero's faults is not to hide them......

And the other lead dev:

....
The "dev" who launched Monero is thankful_for_today: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=233561

Thankfully when we (the current Monero core team) found the purposefully obfuscated code we immediately fixed it and made the fix freely available to all. This is what smooth means when he describes the Monero launch as fair. As dga says, at most thankful_for_today would've had a week of advantageous mining, but as our difficulty retargetting worked just fine and we didn't have crazy high initial block rewards there was very little that the scammer thankful_for_today could've made off with.

Note that these are all facts, directly observable by comparing increases in difficulty (ie. network hash rate) with the improved hashing code submitted to github. It does not require trust, it does not require anyone to take our word that coins have been sold or distributed, it is not based on hope. It is absolute, truthful, factual, verifiable by all.
...

A fact cannot be considered subjective.  Subjective is a view not based on fact.

Subjective views, such as the current Monero devs saying that they don't view a week or so of Monero fraud as meaningful because it wasn't that bad of a fraud in the great scheme of things.

Well that depends on your point of view. The police might choose to prosecute someone who steals a candy bar, because theft is in fact illegal.

So a week of fraud being acceptable is subjective when proposed as such.

Objective views are based on fact.

The facts are Monero had a scam launch and people made decisions not to stop, fix and relaunch. So you have to now own the scam launch code provided with the launch pack.

So far Monero has more of a provable launch issue than Darkcoin.

You see, we can all play these games all day long. If that is what you really want to waste your time on.

These are all really good points. Everyone knows that Monero had scam code built into it, its no secret. This is similar to the launch issues that Dash had, except there is no proof of a intentional scam like Monero.

If smooth is out to be a white knight of crypto and protect users from intentional scams, why hasn't he started a campaign against Monero? Maybe this whole campaign against Dash is not only to bring investors into XMR, but also to draw attention away from his own coins shady history.

[BagHolder010]

I had to give up counting how many Monero people are here.

Seems like a continuation of some sort of smear campaign. The 'cut off the head' approach.

I might now have take a good look at the deceptive launch of Monero and compare the two launches.

The purpose would be to consider what might constitute a scam launch and what might be considered legitimately a mistake. So on topic.

From memory about Monero,

The Monero launch included a launch pack that included some deceptive code aimed at rigging the mining for the material benefit of one or a few at the expense of the many. Also known as fraud.

Before we can set up pools..
We need a miner.

Currently the mining is done In the wallet AFAIK

There is also a miner in the standard build, just no pool to connect it to.

Not long after launch, around one to two weeks, people started to smell a rat and at some point the Monero dev somehow did a runner, or possibly just changed account profile and carried (carries) on being involved.

Some of the early community members decided that, despite being only one or two weeks in, they would continue with the project rather than stop, fix, relaunch.

That smells a bit. Had we seen two or three months of effort, then maybe a continuation would have been more believable. People were smelling a rigged launch at the time:

i would like to propose a conspiracy theory here. could it be that TFT and friends created a problem where there was non, as they see the coin going up in popularity and thus limit ability for people to mine or participate.
1. yes mining continued: is this true can a non techy very this
2. increased frustration: people may hold of mining while a better wallet is in place. thus decreasing difficulty and increasing coin accumulation of those in the know.
3. a day later and still unable to access wallet from first page. people are pointed to github but I do not see a link there that says updated wallet. click here and your parse problems will be solved.
4. i recall i could not participate early because link was botched. there was no note underneath to clarify this for those new to cryptocurrencies. for 5 days I could not mine while tft and friends went about it merrily.

would tft go to such an extreme.... just speculating.

There is no dispute that Monero was launched with deceptive code intended to steal.  It has been admitted by the lead devs:

We've admitted to the crippled miner. We were the first ones to discover it, disclose it, and fix it. The reason I don't dwell on Monero's faults is not to hide them......

And the other lead dev:

....
The "dev" who launched Monero is thankful_for_today: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=233561

Thankfully when we (the current Monero core team) found the purposefully obfuscated code we immediately fixed it and made the fix freely available to all. This is what smooth means when he describes the Monero launch as fair. As dga says, at most thankful_for_today would've had a week of advantageous mining, but as our difficulty retargetting worked just fine and we didn't have crazy high initial block rewards there was very little that the scammer thankful_for_today could've made off with.

Note that these are all facts, directly observable by comparing increases in difficulty (ie. network hash rate) with the improved hashing code submitted to github. It does not require trust, it does not require anyone to take our word that coins have been sold or distributed, it is not based on hope. It is absolute, truthful, factual, verifiable by all.
...

A fact cannot be considered subjective.  Subjective is a view not based on fact.

Subjective views, such as the current Monero devs saying that they don't view a week or so of Monero fraud as meaningful because it wasn't that bad of a fraud in the great scheme of things.

Well that depends on your point of view. The police might choose to prosecute someone who steals a candy bar, because theft is in fact illegal.

So a week of fraud being acceptable is subjective when proposed as such.

Objective views are based on fact.

The facts are Monero had a scam launch and people made decisions not to stop, fix and relaunch. So you have to now own the scam launch code provided with the launch pack.

So far Monero has more of a provable launch issue than Darkcoin.

You see, we can all play these games all day long. If that is what you really want to waste your time on.

These are all really good points. Everyone knows that Monero had scam code built into it, its no secret. This is similar to the launch issues that Dash had, except there is no proof of a intentional scam like Monero.

If smooth is out to be a white knight of crypto and protect users from intentional scams, why hasn't he started a campaign against Monero? Maybe this whole campaign against Dash is not only to bring investors into XMR, but also to draw attention away from his own coins shady history.

It's also because he's a no good developer with no coding skills, he's the type who would have nightmares of Evan's success maybe he should go back to school or do online schooling to try and do something new to crypto World with he's so called no good Monero dev's. Or after copying a GUI wallet they are stuck with nothing to copy lol

[slapper]

Unlike some here, I respect Evan for his tireless dedication to the project. He has demonstrated immense capability and potential in developing software, knowledge in a lot of aspects pertaining to finance, a reserved repentance to the instamine, a tireless passion for the "community" he created even after the initial chaos and misfortunes, but MOST importantly a sense of pride in the face of consistent attacks over the practicality and technicality of the main aspects of the coin he wanted to bring to everyone.

The biggest mistake however was not the fastmine/instamine but to yield to the pressure of whales (everyone knows their names and it is not just otoh), in breaking the social contract with respect to emission a LONG time after the mistakes during launch. This should NOT have been done under any circumstances. I will not trust Evan to make any more social contract changes (he is going to, until the coin completely dies). Even his cohort during the initial launch, who was subsequently asked to sever ties with the project, was surprised he has carried on for so long.

He fought well, there is no doubt about this. He silenced a lot of trolls, scumbags, thieves, PumpNDumpers and malicious crypto faggots. He is not a malicious person, but his problem is of being too malleable and perhaps some greed.

This is no longer a coin that should see any kind of "investment" or money coming in to support it. It is time to move to science, cryptography and community.

[smooth]

These are all really good points. Everyone knows that Monero had scam code built into it, its no secret. This is similar to the launch issues that Dash had, except there is no proof of a intentional scam like Monero.

There is no proof of intentional scamming in Monero, at all. The crippled mining code came from Bytecoin, not Monero, to deceive people about their 82% premine scam. That was the whole reason Monero was launched in the first place.

There is no proof anyone connected to Monero (including the original dev who launched it), ever even looked at that code, so how can you have intention to do anything without looking at the code (much less writing it)? Maybe he had that intention, maybe he didn't. Either way, no proof.

When it comes to proof on these things, the closest we can get is a pretty strong circumstantial case that the reason Evan repeatedly deceived people about the launch time was in order to reduce participation and get a bigger piece of the massive instamine (especially the first hour).

You're reaching for anything to deflect the focus away from Evan instamining Dash. Do you think he regrets it?

If smooth is out to be a white knight of crypto and protect users from intentional scams, why hasn't he started a campaign against Monero? Maybe this whole campaign against Dash is not only to bring investors into XMR, but also to draw attention away from his own coins shady history.

There's no white knight campaign. I don't even care if investors lose their money, they're adults, that's their business. It's unfortunate when noobs get scared because it might scare them away from crypto, but mostly instamines and misleading people about launch times and other such scams just piss me off. I wonder how Evan feels about it though. I'm guessing he feels a little differently, since he's the one who did that.

[smooth]

Unlike some here, I respect Evan for his tireless dedication to the project. He has demonstrated immense capability and potential in developing software, knowledge in a lot of aspects pertaining to finance, a reserved repentance to the instamine, a tireless passion for the "community" he created even after the initial chaos and misfortunes, but MOST importantly a sense of pride in the face of consistent attacks over the practicality and technicality of the main aspects of the coin he wanted to bring to everyone.

The biggest mistake however was not the fastmine/instamine but to yield to the pressure of whales (everyone knows their names and it is not just otoh), in breaking the social contract with respect to emission a LONG time after the mistakes during launch. This should NOT have been done under any circumstances. I will not trust Evan to make any more social contract changes (he is going to, until the coin completely dies). Even his cohort during the initial launch, who was subsequently asked to sever ties with the project, was surprised he has carried on for so long.

He fought well, there is no doubt about this. He silenced a lot of trolls, scumbags, thieves, PumpNDumpers and malicious crypto faggots. He is not a malicious person, but his problem is of being too malleable and perhaps some greed.

This is no longer a coin that should see any kind of "investment" or money coming in to support it. It is time to move to science, cryptography and community.

You make some good points, slapper, but I don't know, that whole launch time thing really looks sketchy to me. He clearly deceived people. Intent is hard to show, but there's not really any other logical explanation for it. If you go back and read the the first dozen or so pages of the thread, its quite clear he was rushing it for some unknown reason, despite some very good reasons to slow down and fix the code before launching. Maybe he was being pressured even from the start, I don't know. There's no evidence on the thread of anyone pressuring him, in fact everyone was pressuring him to take his time, fix the code first, have a Widows build before launch, etc. Behind the scenes, maybe different.

[toknormal]

This is no longer a coin that should see any kind of "investment" or money coming in to support it. It is time to move to science, cryptography and community.

Excuse me. We're not writing the bible here.

Assets see "investment" if there's a case for a return. End of story.

Since, in the view of many, "Science, cryptography and community" are being moved more by Dash than any other project right now, then thats where their money goes. If you don't see it that way then nobody's forcing you to support it so don't complain.

For a long time I've watched this 'scam' accusation grind on and on and wondered to myself who "the scammed" were. Reading this thread I'm finally coming to the slightly hysterical conclusion "the scammed" turns out only to have been a handful of miners that are miffed they didn't get in on the early "bonanza" and who think that the dev "tricked them".

Fair enough, if thats really what you think then make your case, but don't expect much sympathy from traders who simply went out and bought it in markets since:

A - thats where most miners dump their coins anyway - even if most of you had had your cherished windows wallets and early warnings

B - the hypocrisy of this entire industry is such that 'emission curves' are going to look about as ethical as a bank robbery to the rest of the world if cryptocurrency ever goes mainstream. So your attempts to turn this into an issue of ‘ethics’ are moot

The bottom line is, "Evan's dedication to the project" is what has given it value. The unconventional launch is well priced in - as evidenced by the complete lack of impact all the mud throwing over the "instamine" has.

If you have an ethical problem with it so be it. The market may have as well but it also sees value and is much better placed to put the issues with the launch in a proper context than a bunch of butthurt miners riddled with resentment and envy who think Evan broke some universal law of crypto ethics.

He did not.

He made a fuck*ng coin and broke with convention in its launch. The market did the rest so I suggest you get over yourselves before your jaundiced eye leaves you all permanently colour blind.

[smooth]

Broke with convention ROFL. Is that code for deceitfully misled people about the launch time so he could get more for himself or what?

I guess you are voting for he doesnt regret it with a comment like that.

[toknormal]

Broke with convention ROFL. Is that code for deceitfully misled people about the launch time so he could get more for himself or what?

No. It's code for "I think you'd better get yourself a life before you expire with resentment".

Whether the guy's intentions were genuine or malevolent, planned or accident (as is my opinion), the market took subsequent events into account and endorsed the end product.

You might have to rewrite your little 'ethics manual'