bad news for bASIC - not shipping til mid Jan at best

[repentance]

While it's pretty obvious that the dates quoted in the update are a typo and should read February 10-25, the reality is that production is affected for considerably longer than the official holiday period.  Workers start heading home for the holidays in the couple of weeks prior to CNY because it takes so fucking long to travel home - bear in mind that most are poor people travelling very long distances using unreliable means of transport.  Of those who return - and many don't because employment contracts typically end at that time or they just can't face returning to factory life - many only begin making their way back at the end of the holiday period.  

Nobody who has any experience at all with having things manufactured in the region is unaware of this - it's something you plan for months in advance and take into account when planning your project.  It's not unusual for manufacturers to stop taking new orders between October and February to take this winding down of capacity into account, so any change at all regarding your order during that period (like the need to redo something or needing larger quantities) can add months to your delivery date because the capacity to meet your new needs may not be there until after CNY even if your need arises in November.  One of the sanest things you can to avoid this is to plan your projects so that you're never dependent on delivery between October and February.

Chinese New Year isn't some sudden, unforeseen event which throws you off schedule.  It's something you know damned well is going to happen and when.  Realistically, bASIC isn't likely to be delivering until at least March if "more than one aspect of the bASIC device" is going to be affected by CNY.

Every ASIC vendor on these forums needs to concentrate their energy on getting their own product shipped at the moment instead of flinging shit at their competition.  It shouldn't matter a damn to any of you what your competition is doing if you're confident in your own product and your own competence.

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[poon-TANG]

Personally I'm slightly offended that bASIC used a "fake" chinese new year as an excuse. Those dates are not even close.

Don't you start too, your company have only really thrown the spitefulness back at others so far. bASIC haven't put themselves out to disparage the competition without being provoked, you should afford them the same courtesy. It's not impossible that they made a mistake on the timing of Chinese New Year, so to try and paint it as an intended offence edges you into Inaba/finger puppet territory.

Remember that BFL and it's shills (largely all one "man") hounded the bASIC project so relentlessly, mercilessly and shamelessly that they have abandoned this forum altogether, and they're starting to try to do the same to your project too. You've handled it well so far, but to indulge in the same hyperbolic mud-slinging is just totally unsporting, and unnecessary.

It will not: 

- speed your product delivery up
- slow bASIC's product delivery down
- win you any customers in the short term, seeing as you sold out quite some time ago and will not be accepting new customers until the 1st batch ships
- achieve anything except worsen your public reputation in the eyes of those that believe in the sanctity of a fair fight


Fucking stop it, the lot of you (that includes all of your multiple personalities Inaba, it will serve you right if you develop a schizophrenic disorder through your weirdo stalking)

LOL   funny how people talk so much sh!t on BFL threads but can't take it.

[Carlton Banks]

Fucking stop it, the lot of you (that includes all of your multiple personalities Inaba, it will serve you right if you develop a schizophrenic disorder through your weirdo stalking)

LOL   funny how people talk so much sh!t on BFL threads but can't take it.

I'd love to see the externalised expression of this particular marionette of yours, Josh, once you've settled into your straitjacket, that is. Can anyone 'chop an Inaba pic with cheetos for eyebrows? Good job of not responding to me, except you've forgotten jsut how pathetically transparent you are to anyone with more than double your brain cell count

[BitSyncom]

Personally I'm slightly offended that bASIC used a "fake" chinese new year as an excuse. Those dates are not even close.

Don't you start too, your company have only really thrown the spitefulness back at others so far. bASIC haven't put themselves out to disparage the competition without being provoked, you should afford them the same courtesy. It's not impossible that they made a mistake on the timing of Chinese New Year, so to try and paint it as an intended offence edges you into Inaba/finger puppet territory.

Remember that BFL and it's shills (largely all one "man") hounded the bASIC project so relentlessly, mercilessly and shamelessly that they have abandoned this forum altogether, and they're starting to try to do the same to your project too. You've handled it well so far, but to indulge in the same hyperbolic mud-slinging is just totally unsporting, and unnecessary.

It will not:  

- speed your product delivery up
- slow bASIC's product delivery down
- win you any customers in the short term, seeing as you sold out quite some time ago and will not be accepting new customers until the 1st batch ships
- achieve anything except worsen your public reputation in the eyes of those that believe in the sanctity of a fair fight


Fucking stop it, the lot of you (that includes all of your multiple personalities Inaba, it will serve you right if you develop a schizophrenic disorder through your weirdo stalking)

I don't disagree, but like I said. Personally I'm tired of BFL or bASIC's excuses. I'm very well aware of the fact it is probably a typo, repentance here said it best.

Chinese New Year isn't some sudden, unforeseen event which throws you off schedule.  It's something you know damned well is going to happen and when.  Realistically, bASIC isn't likely to be delivering until at least March if "more than one aspect of the bASIC device" is going to be affected by CNY.

Every ASIC vendor on these forums needs to concentrate their energy on getting their own product shipped at the moment instead of flinging shit at their competition.  It shouldn't matter a damn to any of you what your competition is doing if you're confident in your own product and your own competence.

Allow me to remind you they said they will ship in mid-Jan, how is this Chinese New Year going to effect them? Either way though, what I got a problem is how my competition announces and downplay delays.

I have illustrated it here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=87934.msg1411740#msg1411740

and here is how Avalon announces delays. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=120184.msg1397668#msg1397668

Whatever, I'll bash more after I ship, ever since this https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=120184.msg1381739#msg1381739
I've concluded with my team that BFL and bASIC is full of shit and have no chips.
Don't believe me? that's fine too. Let's speak again after this month ends.

[Carlton Banks]

rantrantrantrantrantrantrantrantrantrantrantrantrantrantrantrantrantrantrantran trantrantrantrant

I don't disagree, but like I said. Personally I'm tired of BFL or bASIC's excuses.

How odd that this is your personal view, anyone would think that this was self-evident by virtue of the fact that its was you saying it. I wasn't expecting you to present anyone's view except your own! Although it might help if you could modify your public pronouncements to take account of, heck, I dunno, a professional point of view? Mud-slinging is only a professionalism when you're in career politics, and only Inaba is trying to turn an electronics venture into a game of grown men engaging in a tug-of-war using thinly stretched egos as rope. Please stop stooping to his level, you're beginning to resemble the pre-match shit-talking from the World Wrestling Federation. Again.

I'm very well aware of the fact it is probably a typo,

And you still choose to cast it in the worst possible light? Not a very pleasant way of behaving, especially after you guys have wished the bASIC team good luck in the past. Makes that appear a little conceited.

Allow me to remind you they said they will ship in mid-Jan, how is this Chinese New Year going to effect them? Either way though, what I got a problem is how my competition announces and downplay delays.

I have illustrated it here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=87934.msg1411740#msg1411740

and here is how Avalon announces delays. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=120184.msg1397668#msg1397668

Whatever, I'll bash more after I ship, ever since this https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=120184.msg1381739#msg1381739
I've concluded with my team that BFL and bASIC is full of shit and have no chips.
Don't believe me? that's fine too. Let's speak again after this month ends.

I've got more confidence in your team than the other two, precisely because of the transparency you've cited. That doesn't mean you're definitely shipping on schedule, that's only a certainty once it successfully takes place. Until then, you'd be wise not to be over-confident, just in case something you couldn't have predicted throws a spanner in the works. Unforeseen problem was unforeseen!

[squeept]

lol @ carlton

This guy is redefining "double standard"

[Carlton Banks]

lol @ carlton

This guy is redefining "double standard"

Explain how I'm treating any of these ASIC reps any different to the others, and I'll happily accept it.

[squeept]

Oh, nothing, just exploding in defense of bASIC as they employ every tactic that you're upset about BFL using. Apparently, I'm also Inaba.

This is fucking stupid. I quit. This is by far the dirtiest pit of trolls and idiots that I've ever seen, and I wash my hands of it.

[repentance]

Allow me to remind you they said they will ship in mid-Jan, how is this Chinese New Year going to effect them? Either way though, what I got a problem is how my competition announces and downplay delays.

How other vendors announce and downplay delays reflects badly on them, but people aren't entirely stupid.  When multiple aspects of a device are now going to be affected by CNY, then it raises huge questions about the manner in which the project has been planned because anyone who's ever done business in the region knows that it's very risky to depend on delivery in the month leading up to CNY and that a slip in schedule at that point will often set you back a couple of months.  

At this point, when any vendor claims a last minute problem people no longer believe them, because short of the fab burning down those "problems" are ones which should have been anticipated and planned for (and the project should be insured against those types of possibilities anyway).

The thing is that it doesn't take a competing vendor to point these things out.  Customers and potential customers are doing it every time another delay is announced.  

The commercial reality is that a lot will be forgiven in respect of the first company which delivers ASICs which meet its promised specifications, which is why every vendor needs to focus on being the first company to do that.  It's also a commercial reality that these delays are going to affect the financial forecasts of the vendors and that we may see companies ultimately deliver a product but not be able to absorb the financial impact of these delays.

[poon-TANG]

Oh, nothing, just exploding in defense of bASIC as they employ every tactic that you're upset about BFL using. Apparently, I'm also Inaba.

This is fucking stupid. I quit. This is by far the dirtiest pit of trolls and idiots that I've ever seen, and I wash my hands of it.

+1

Its a very deep dirty pit indeed.

[poon-TANG]

Fucking stop it, the lot of you (that includes all of your multiple personalities Inaba, it will serve you right if you develop a schizophrenic disorder through your weirdo stalking)

LOL   funny how people talk so much sh!t on BFL threads but can't take it.

I'd love to see the externalised expression of this particular marionette of yours, Josh, once you've settled into your straitjacket, that is. Can anyone 'chop an Inaba pic with cheetos for eyebrows? Good job of not responding to me, except you've forgotten jsut how pathetically transparent you are to anyone with more than double your brain cell count

All I can say is your an idiot. So everyone here is Inaba/Josh including me.

[CoinHoarder]

It's scary to me that the bASIC camp thought CNY is in January.

If they can't even even get a date like that right which can be easily verified through Google... what else are they overlooking??

[Carlton Banks]

Fucking stop it, the lot of you (that includes all of your multiple personalities Inaba, it will serve you right if you develop a schizophrenic disorder through your weirdo stalking)

LOL   funny how people talk so much sh!t on BFL threads but can't take it.

I'd love to see the externalised expression of this particular marionette of yours, Josh, once you've settled into your straitjacket, that is. Can anyone 'chop an Inaba pic with cheetos for eyebrows? Good job of not responding to me, except you've forgotten jsut how pathetically transparent you are to anyone with more than double your brain cell count

All I can say is your an idiot. So everyone here is Inaba/Josh including me.

Funny how once the trolls all scarpered, no-one much had anything left to say. Except useful discourse. Damn, anyone would think that was what the forum was for.

So, I think my choke-a-troll rampage did the trick just fine, and now, no-one coming here is in any doubt as to what you and your spasticated agenda is. Now, do us all a favour and slither back to your cave you horrendous wretch (again). Is it too much to ask for you to stay there?

[repentance]

It's scary to me that the bASIC camp thought CNY is in January.

If they can't even even get a date like that right which can be easily verified through Google... what else are they overlooking??

I suspect that was a typo - either that or they don't understand how early production is affected in the lead-up to CNY and assumed the email they got said February but they assumed that was a typo - but it's really, really difficult to believe that they've only just become aware of this issue and it raises the question of the new anticipated delivery date for the component they'll receive last.

One thing's clear - their chips aren't packaged yet and they apparently don't have a date for when that will happen other than "should be coming very soon".

[Phinnaeus Gage]

It's scary to me that the bASIC camp thought CNY is in January.

If they can't even even get a date like that right which can be easily verified through Google... what else are they overlooking??

I suspect that was a typo - either that or they don't understand how early production is affected in the lead-up to CNY and assumed the email they got said February but they assumed that was a typo - but it's really, really difficult to believe that they've only just become aware of this issue and it raises the question of the new anticipated delivery date for the component they'll receive last.

One thing's clear - their chips aren't packaged yet and they apparently don't have a date for when that will happen other than "should be coming very soon".

Would someone be so kind as to point to me where that CNY typo(?) was first introduced? Its source is eluding me.

[RaTTuS]

Would someone be so kind as to point to me where that CNY typo(?) was first introduced? Its source is eluding me.

here?
https://www.btcfpga.com/forum/index.php?topic=882.0

[Phinnaeus Gage]

Would someone be so kind as to point to me where that CNY typo(?) was first introduced? Its source is eluding me.

here?
https://www.btcfpga.com/forum/index.php?topic=882.0

Thanks, RaTTuS! Appreciated.

First, allow me to comment on that entire tread, sourced above.

Fuckin' WOW! (apologies to those who would have used 50pt font bold in red)

Upon reading that thread, I feel I owe Josh/BFL an apology and should make a trip to go suck his dick with a promised reach-around. Looks to me like people are ready to abandon ship, for I would if I were invested upon reading the latest, especially the posts by those who know their shit.

Concerning the CNY date: I started reading the post with an open mind, with perhaps a bias toward it being a mistake. I held that belief system all the way till I reached the 3/4 mark of the post, quoted below.

So Basically if I can get the ASICs at least on their way here before the 10th I think we will be in very very good shape, and this is what I am striving for - everything else is either already completed or nearly completed and things are falling into place.

To me, the above is predicated on his belief, or worse, perpetuating a falsehood with the mistaken date, for it clearly reads that the 10th of January is an important timetable.

Further in the same thread, I read something else. With apologies to Dave and Jody, respectively, consider and compare the following two quotes:

Please understand that if you bail out on us, we won't be able to sell you your position back again - I've already been asked by several people to let them buy back into their positions.  A sad number of Batch 1 positions (really, really good ones) have been given up already.

If we have extended our date beyond your ability to stick with us, we at Customer Service are ready to refund money for those who want to get out of the line.

I have read similar statements elsewhere.

With the above penned, here's to hoping that the wool is not being pulled over our eyes in regard to this ongoing saga and that it all works out in favor of Bitcoin. If not, the resulting fallout will pale in comparison all previous fiascos combined, cementing The Year of the Snake in the minds of bitcoiners beyond the last block mined regardless of how it'll be hashed.

[crazyates]

I wouldn't have minded an Avalon order or two, just for shits and giggles, but now I'm kinda glad I didn't order from Tom.

[Bogart]

Fuckin' WOW!

Yup, it looks pretty grim.

One question in my mind is: How did Tom ever manage to have success producing the MMQ product?  Was there someone else actually overseeing product development, and he just sells them?

Not knowing when CNY occurs, *and* not bothering to find out before making a product announcement regarding it surely deserves a facepalm if ever anything did.

[repentance]

To me, the above is predicated on his belief, or worse, perpetuating a falsehood with the mistaken date, for it clearly reads that the 10th of January is an important timetable.

Yeah, I was willing to believe that it might be a typo or the kind of brain-fart you have when you've been eating, sleeping and breathing a project for months  but Dave's follow up post is unsatisfactory in that respect.

I haven't responded because I don't know anything new besides what Tom has already posted:  He expects to find out early this week if (and how many) chips will ship prior to the CNY kicking in.  Understand that effects of the CNY will be felt by us sooner than the Feb 10 official start - this was Tom trying to give the community a heads up about whats coming down the pipe.

https://www.btcfpga.com/forum/index.php?topic=882.msg2714#msg2714

I have no idea what percentage of total orders the cancellations now being threatened would be, but it's clearly time for bASIC to "shit or get off the pot" as far as some of their users are concerned.

https://www.btcfpga.com/forum/index.php?topic=882.msg2725#msg2725