BFL: Chips have shipped, on their way to US

[PuertoLibre]

I do have plenty to add, I am just not doing it with you. You are a known BFL supported and strong shill for them.

People don't really gain anything substantial by answering your demands. You simply ignore the points made even when perfectly legitimate. (Just as you did now) The question is, are you even worth the effort. I think not.

Bwahahaha that's a long way of saying "I have no evidence, so instead I will resort to mocking".

It's not that there is no evidence my slow friend. It just means that wasting time with you isn't the best option at this time.

Even when the evidence does slap you, you simply ignore it. Again, you did it just now in the last page.

There is no incentive to fulfill your request.

[1715132696]

1715132696

[1715132696]

1715132696

[Korbman]

Various members have researched (a heck of alot of issues) surrounding pre-orders and legal constraints and demands that companies must perform within a certain time frame.

For example, BFL was supposed to have notified their customers within 60 days of any changes to the status of pre-order shipments.

I know that silly, but I want links...that was actually what I was referring to a page (or two) back when I was trying to find the info on this very statement. This is where I think they crossed the line, but I wanted to double back and look at the facts.

It's not that there is no evidence my slow friend. It just means that wasting time with you isn't the best option at this time.

Even when the evidence does slap you, you simply ignore it. Again, you did it just now in the last page.

There is no incentive to fulfill your request.

Like you have anything better to do?

Come on Puerto, you live for this stuff! You troll every BFL thread there is, so I imagine you MUST have some sort of master list of all of BFL's transgressions, right?

[jspielberg]

Like you have anything better to do?

Come on Puerto, you live for this stuff! You troll every BFL thread there is, so I imagine you MUST have some sort of master list of all of BFL's transgressions, right?

That would be too organized for the local BFL busters.

I find the fact that they were required by paypal to ship some of their pre-orders interesting... though I don't really understand it.  Why did paypal require them to like ship a couple of jalapenos? Why would that make any difference? 

Also this thread is about their chips being shipped to the US.  I though BFL was using some domestic foundry (in California?).

[PuertoLibre]

Like you have anything better to do?

Come on Puerto, you live for this stuff! You troll every BFL thread there is, so I imagine you MUST have some sort of master list of all of BFL's transgressions, right?

That would be too organized for the local BFL busters.

I find the fact that they were required by paypal to ship some of their pre-orders interesting... though I don't really understand it.  Why did paypal require them to like ship a couple of jalapenos? Why would that make any difference? 

It isn't logical. Paypal would very likely require them to ship ALL orders.

The BFL storyline does not add up nor even seem logical.

Paypal gains nothing by a merchant shipping a dozen units out of ten thousand. The story is crooked (in my opinion).

Also this thread is about their chips being shipped to the US.  I though BFL was using some domestic foundry (in California?).

No comment....

[ecliptic]

47 C.F.R. 15.1b for starters, unless they already have it licensed (I have seen nothing to that end except some empty talk many months ago)

My guess is that they've already passed this part...given that essentially any electronic device has to pass it before going to market. If they didn't get past this, do you really think they'd send out an "illegal" device to dozens of media outlets?

Anything else, or was this your only thought on "many broken laws and regulations"?

You just want to hear what you want to hear.

Anything contradictory will be ignored by you.

Your mental framing needs adjustments.

If only that were true...I'm more than happy to acknowledge serious arguments, but the problem is I very rarely get any. Saying "BFL has broken so many laws and regulations" without pointing out anything of substance is not an argument.

And, as usual, I see you have absolutely nothing to add to the argument Puerto..just more conspiracy theories and "scam scam scam". As I've noted before: Point out the specific laws that BFL has broken, and I will show you why you're wrong. Simple as that.

They have no FCC certification.  Nothing is on file.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

And update from BFL_Josh:

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/2604-10-may-2013-update-7.html#post32042

Well, I was going to pick on post and reply to it as representative of the rest of the questions, but there isn't really a point in picking one post.

Here's the deal: We are not going to provide minute by minute accounts of our comings and goings. We are not going to provide detailed numbers with regards to what we are working on or shipping. It's really as simple as that. It's just not something a company does. I have tried it in the past and been burned on it when I have given out numbers that have changed and thus the numbers I gave out originally are no longer accurate. I've said it before and I will say it again: That is not going to happen going forward if I have anything to say about it. If I could give a number or a date that I was 100% confident in meeting, then I would. However, as the past few months has shown us, I simply can't be sure of any dates I have with 100% confidence right now, thus I'm not going to give dates or numbers. If I give a date or a number that does not have the caveat "should be," "hope to," etc... around it, then you can be sure I am pretty darned confident in that date or number. If not, then the number or date is subject to change. I always wondered why companies weren't more open with their customers and now I understand why.

Like I said, going forward, future products are going to be shipping "when they are done" if I have anything to say about it.

Nothing good has ever come of me giving out numbers or dates. Just look at the issues people are focusing on now, because I gave numbers for chips and wafers. Now everyone wants to know the disposition of every chip in every wafer and where they went, what they are doing now, what they've eaten for breakfast and when their last BM was. It's a nightmare. If I could go back and do it again I would absolutely not have given wafer counts or chips per wafer and everyone would be just as happy (or not) as they are now. We have given far, far too much insight into our process and it's burned us many times over and it won't be happening again in the future.

Some people are great, understanding and intelligent, and I am happy to share details with those people. I would love to talk shop with those people, explain the problems we are facing and use the collective wisdom of those people. Some people... aren't any of those things and the spoil it for everyone. I don't see any way to separate the intelligent people from the useless people who just want to complain and wreck excellent discourse for everyone else. I could potentially create a forum where you have to be given access, but that seems to be very labor intensive and the content would certainly make it's way into the public, so we'd be right back in the same boat we are in now. I honestly don't see a way around it. It's a real shame that there are people who can't have a civil, intelligent discussion, but it's the internet and everyone has an opinion, no matter how worthless it is, and they feel the need and entitlement to express it to anyone and everyone.

<snipped, only wanting to the latest from BFL above>

Apologies for adding another long quote, but I deemed it relavent.

Doesn't the above negate the below, a complete 180 from offering up transparency and honesty? (more comment(s) from me below the fold)

First, let me start off by saying I apologize for the length of this post.  I wanted to get all the information out there at once.  Normally, I would not make a post of this nature, but given the current circumstances, I think it is warranted.

Many of you on bitcointalk.org forums know me as “Inaba,” the operator of the Eclipse Mining Consortium bitcoin pool.  In approximately two weeks I will also be wearing a different hat.  As you may be able to guess from my new forum name, I will be working with and for BFL.  Effective August 13, 2012 I have accepted the position of Chief Operating Officer of BF Labs INC. (Butterfly Labs)

BFL is the clear technical leader in the FPGA and upcoming ASIC mining space.  As a direct result, the company has grown very quickly over the past year.  Unfortunately, its customer service, which was initially very good, did not scale fast enough, which caused customer relations and transparency to suffer. BFL is eager to improve and one of my top responsibilities in this new position is to focus on that specific issue.  I am, have always been and will always be committed to good customer service and transparency when it comes to bitcoin in general and the daily operations of related activities.  This is where I will be focusing much of my initial attention, specifically to take the pressure off of everyone involved so that they can focus on the other important factors, such as getting the hardware delivered on time!

While I may not be universally liked by everyone in this community, I believe I at least have the respect of many people. I have always stood behind my integrity and commitment to what I promise and I take ownership of my mistakes.  This will not change going forward and I will give my best level of effort to deliver on the promises I make to this community as a representative of BFL, as I always have.  If for some reason I am unable to deliver on those promises, I will provide an explanation as to why.

While there may come a day when bitcoin does not need the Bitcointalk community, that day is still far in the future.  As I have cultivated a relationship with this community through EMC, I also plan on cultivating a rewarding relationship with the community through BFL.  There is some history and baggage to overcome, but I do not believe it is insurmountable.  I also will not be part of or lend my credibility to an organization I do not believe in or one that I believe is working to undermine bitcoin at the expense of the community just to make a quick buck.

To forestall some of the most likely questions, I’m going to answer them here:

Q. Have you been working for BFL all along?
A. No. I have had no business relations with BFL beyond being a customer and also providing some technical assistance getting their equipment to properly talk to pools.

Q. Seriously.  You’ve been working with BFL from the start, you can admit it, haven’t you?
A. Seriously, no!  I first discovered BFL at the same time as everyone else, back around November of 2011.  It was purely coincidental that I happened to work, literally, across the street from their registered address of operations.  I was just as skeptical as everyone else, especially when I discovered the registered address appeared to be a Lebanese restaurant that I frequent (but never really paid attention to the address).  I learned more about BFL along with everyone else and since I was local and close by, I reached out on behalf of the Bitcointalk community to BFL, specifically Sonny, to see if I could gather more information.  I had been running the EMC pool since May/June of 2011 and had no knowledge of, or association with BFL or any of the parties involved in BFL up until it was first noticed on these forums.

Q. Are you going to stop being such a jerk on the forums to some people?
A. Maybe.  It depends. Actually, yes.  As a pool operator and an independent individual I have far more latitude and freedom to express my displeasure with some of the more intense stupidity that can be encountered on the internet.  As a representative of a company, I am, unfortunately, a bit more constrained from explaining to various people exactly why they are idiots.  As such, I will likely be ignoring a lot of the more of the ludicrous posts than I have before. To those of you who enjoyed reading my rants, I am sorry that they will be far fewer and betweener.

Q. What are your qualifications in the endeavor?  What do you bring to the table?
A. I’m glad you asked.  From a customer service perspective, and more specifically, from an online community perspective, I have extensive experience on both sides of the fence.  I have run online forums since the Fidonet days, and have extensive experience in the often caustic, emotionally driven environment that an online forum can produce.  This allows me to effectively communicate with the population, since I am one of the populous myself.  Unlike many customer facing people in many industries, I also have a strong technical background; I am able to communicate effectively with you about your problems, wishes and desires from a technical perspective.  I will not make empty promises from a marketing standpoint if I know it’s technically unreasonable or impossible.  I am also able to effectively manage a project from end to end, which will be critical in getting our manufacturing and production lines going in the most efficient manner possible.  I have also run a number of startups, and I understand the unique challenges required of a startup to function properly and successfully.

Q. Come on, for real, you’ve been with BFL all along, right?
A.  No!  Really!  I have been working for an unrelated company that has nothing to do with bitcoin long before BFL was founded or I knew of any of the people involved, and I am still working for that company, until the day I start working for BFL.

Q. What will happen to EMC?
A. Right now, there are no plans to change anything with regards to EMC, other than more improvements as usual.  I will continue to operate EMC as I have since the start.

Q. You are going to have an unfair advantage when it comes to mining equipment, you’ll be able to get as much as you want before anyone else!
 A. I will not be expanding my mining footprint as it would be a conflict of interest.  I will continue with my current obligations and already acquired/paid for equipment but will not be purchasing or utilizing additional equipment as part of my mining operations.  This is one of the hardest changes I will be making, as I firmly believe there are plenty of opportunities in this space that I am going to be missing out on, but I believe I can do more good for the bitcoin community as a whole working to provide that equipment to people as opposed to using it myself.

Q. Why now?  Why not before?
A. The topic never really came up.  BFL as a corporate entity is a startup and has been running very lean and mean.  With wild success and absolutely spectacular outlook for products, it’s time to move to the next stage of business.  With my diverse skill set, I can replace both a technical lead and a PR/community lead, thereby eliminating the need for an additional person, which means we can move that much quicker in the market as well as have that much less overhead that can go towards development instead of human resources.

Q. Are you going to become just another mouthpiece for the BFL party line?
A. First of all, there is no “party line” coming out of BFL.  They have been up front and honest with their dealings in the community from day one.  There are a number of people on the forums that feel that BFL has been dishonest and some of those feelings are justified if viewed through the lens of “Every business should be perfect, always.”  However, both Sonny and the engineers, contrary to some statements you may have seen from others on the forum, have been honest in their assessments of capabilities and timelines.  They have been mistaken, yes, but they have not been willfully or intentionally dishonest.  Some can say they should have known better, and whether or not that is true is, at this point, academic.  I am looking at the future, not the past, and I will be doing my level best to provide accurate information from day one.  If there is some information that I believe to be inaccurate, a lie, or just plain wrong, I will not pass it off as fact.  I will not tow any “party line.”  I will give you the honest facts as I know them.  There may be times that there are trade secrets that I cannot reveal, but I do not believe this constitutes falsehood or anything nefarious, as there are times where revealing certain bits of information would put BFL at a competitive disadvantage.  That will harm not only BFL, but also its current and future customers.  If there are still people that, going forward, feel that this is somehow dishonest, then I apologize in advance and I also give advance notice that there will, in fact, be times where 100% of information cannot be disclosed, either immediately or possibly ever.

Q. Help me!  Order Status?  Why is the sky blue?
A. I will not be able to answer your questions with regards to order status, etc… via PMs.  The PM system does not allow me to track or correlate information to provide accurate answers.  I will, however, be able to do that via email and our new support system that I will be facilitating in the near future.  PMs requesting information that should be directed to the support system will be ignored.  I apologize for this, but it’s just not feasible to handle the volume of requests that it would generate.

Q. Are there cookies?
A. Yes, there will be cookies.  The cake, however, is still a lie.

Let's put this in perspective, guessing that there's about a dozen strong naysayers/trolls/ whatever their/we're referred to. Are you telling me that a viable company profiting off the very backs of mostly users on this forum has the audacity to keep 100's of their loyal and patient customer base at bay due to the actions of about a dozen individuals?

How the fuck does one go from being open and transparent to you'll receive it when you receive it with minimal information forthcoming from the BFL camp after they have their customer's money, sticking it further up their asses?

I've been critical of BFL, then backed off, only to complete the cycle again, all the time refrained from cursing to express my views. That said, this latest from Camp BFL leaves me no choice but to state: BFL is fucked up and a bunch of sorry bastards.

I would add more, but I think I saw cake and cookies in the conference room, albeit rumor has it that the former is a lie.

They have no FCC certification.  Nothing is on file.

<with cookie crumbs on fingers> That was a BFL from Josh back in November of last year stating it's in the works and would have it in two weeks. Since that comment, and being called out on it, BFL has never bought up the subject again, avoid every instance of it being mentioned. TRANSPARENCY MY FUCKIN' ASS!

The information we've received so far from all companies has been a courtesy.

That courtesy was offered in exchange for sales, always giving information/dates to garner more sales. Once the sales slipped recently, most advertising has been halted, now reverting to a silence stance.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

Boy, times from changed!

So user BitcoinINV was supposed to repay a $1500 loan I had given him within 7 days of me recalling it. It's been 12 days now. He's also late on a BTCJam loan that I have no association with. I've tried e-mailing, texting, and calling the below information. Today, I got a return phone call but missed it and no voicemail was left.

I'm looking for someone who lives in or near Emerald Isle, NC that would be willing to drive to the address listed below and attempt to see if "Daniel" still lives there and get him to call me and explain when I should be expecting my money. I'll pay 2% of the loan's value to you ($30) for going and checking (you must submit picture proof to me that you were there and at least attempted to make contact by taking a picture of yourself holding your username on a sheet of paper in front of the apartment and another one in front of the street sign).

In the event I manage to recover my entire $1500 as a result of you contacting him, I'll pay you an additional $120 once the funds have been returned to me. If you are in the area and interested in this, please send me a PM. Here's this dude's information:

Name: Daniel Kowalczewski
Forum Name: BitcoinINV, Bitcoin-Financial.com
Email: drkowalczewski@mailccc.net
         daniel.kowalczewski@gmail.com
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/daniel.kowalczewski
Cell: 910-376-9244
Address: 8613 Reed Dr Apt 1, Emerald Isle, NC 28594-2579

Note the myriad of lies in the letter from BFL to Ms. Little.

[smoothie]

And update from BFL_Josh:

https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/2604-10-may-2013-update-7.html#post32042

Well, I was going to pick on post and reply to it as representative of the rest of the questions, but there isn't really a point in picking one post.

Here's the deal: We are not going to provide minute by minute accounts of our comings and goings. We are not going to provide detailed numbers with regards to what we are working on or shipping. It's really as simple as that. It's just not something a company does. I have tried it in the past and been burned on it when I have given out numbers that have changed and thus the numbers I gave out originally are no longer accurate. I've said it before and I will say it again: That is not going to happen going forward if I have anything to say about it. If I could give a number or a date that I was 100% confident in meeting, then I would. However, as the past few months has shown us, I simply can't be sure of any dates I have with 100% confidence right now, thus I'm not going to give dates or numbers. If I give a date or a number that does not have the caveat "should be," "hope to," etc... around it, then you can be sure I am pretty darned confident in that date or number. If not, then the number or date is subject to change. I always wondered why companies weren't more open with their customers and now I understand why.

Like I said, going forward, future products are going to be shipping "when they are done" if I have anything to say about it.

Nothing good has ever come of me giving out numbers or dates. Just look at the issues people are focusing on now, because I gave numbers for chips and wafers. Now everyone wants to know the disposition of every chip in every wafer and where they went, what they are doing now, what they've eaten for breakfast and when their last BM was. It's a nightmare. If I could go back and do it again I would absolutely not have given wafer counts or chips per wafer and everyone would be just as happy (or not) as they are now. We have given far, far too much insight into our process and it's burned us many times over and it won't be happening again in the future.

Some people are great, understanding and intelligent, and I am happy to share details with those people. I would love to talk shop with those people, explain the problems we are facing and use the collective wisdom of those people. Some people... aren't any of those things and the spoil it for everyone. I don't see any way to separate the intelligent people from the useless people who just want to complain and wreck excellent discourse for everyone else. I could potentially create a forum where you have to be given access, but that seems to be very labor intensive and the content would certainly make it's way into the public, so we'd be right back in the same boat we are in now. I honestly don't see a way around it. It's a real shame that there are people who can't have a civil, intelligent discussion, but it's the internet and everyone has an opinion, no matter how worthless it is, and they feel the need and entitlement to express it to anyone and everyone.

<snipped, only wanting to the latest from BFL above>

Apologies for adding another long quote, but I deemed it relavent.

Doesn't the above negate the below, a complete 180 from offering up transparency and honesty? (more comment(s) from me below the fold)

First, let me start off by saying I apologize for the length of this post.  I wanted to get all the information out there at once.  Normally, I would not make a post of this nature, but given the current circumstances, I think it is warranted.

Many of you on bitcointalk.org forums know me as “Inaba,” the operator of the Eclipse Mining Consortium bitcoin pool.  In approximately two weeks I will also be wearing a different hat.  As you may be able to guess from my new forum name, I will be working with and for BFL.  Effective August 13, 2012 I have accepted the position of Chief Operating Officer of BF Labs INC. (Butterfly Labs)

BFL is the clear technical leader in the FPGA and upcoming ASIC mining space.  As a direct result, the company has grown very quickly over the past year.  Unfortunately, its customer service, which was initially very good, did not scale fast enough, which caused customer relations and transparency to suffer. BFL is eager to improve and one of my top responsibilities in this new position is to focus on that specific issue.  I am, have always been and will always be committed to good customer service and transparency when it comes to bitcoin in general and the daily operations of related activities.  This is where I will be focusing much of my initial attention, specifically to take the pressure off of everyone involved so that they can focus on the other important factors, such as getting the hardware delivered on time!

While I may not be universally liked by everyone in this community, I believe I at least have the respect of many people. I have always stood behind my integrity and commitment to what I promise and I take ownership of my mistakes.  This will not change going forward and I will give my best level of effort to deliver on the promises I make to this community as a representative of BFL, as I always have.  If for some reason I am unable to deliver on those promises, I will provide an explanation as to why.

While there may come a day when bitcoin does not need the Bitcointalk community, that day is still far in the future.  As I have cultivated a relationship with this community through EMC, I also plan on cultivating a rewarding relationship with the community through BFL.  There is some history and baggage to overcome, but I do not believe it is insurmountable.  I also will not be part of or lend my credibility to an organization I do not believe in or one that I believe is working to undermine bitcoin at the expense of the community just to make a quick buck.

To forestall some of the most likely questions, I’m going to answer them here:

Q. Have you been working for BFL all along?
A. No. I have had no business relations with BFL beyond being a customer and also providing some technical assistance getting their equipment to properly talk to pools.

Q. Seriously.  You’ve been working with BFL from the start, you can admit it, haven’t you?
A. Seriously, no!  I first discovered BFL at the same time as everyone else, back around November of 2011.  It was purely coincidental that I happened to work, literally, across the street from their registered address of operations.  I was just as skeptical as everyone else, especially when I discovered the registered address appeared to be a Lebanese restaurant that I frequent (but never really paid attention to the address).  I learned more about BFL along with everyone else and since I was local and close by, I reached out on behalf of the Bitcointalk community to BFL, specifically Sonny, to see if I could gather more information.  I had been running the EMC pool since May/June of 2011 and had no knowledge of, or association with BFL or any of the parties involved in BFL up until it was first noticed on these forums.

Q. Are you going to stop being such a jerk on the forums to some people?
A. Maybe.  It depends. Actually, yes.  As a pool operator and an independent individual I have far more latitude and freedom to express my displeasure with some of the more intense stupidity that can be encountered on the internet.  As a representative of a company, I am, unfortunately, a bit more constrained from explaining to various people exactly why they are idiots.  As such, I will likely be ignoring a lot of the more of the ludicrous posts than I have before. To those of you who enjoyed reading my rants, I am sorry that they will be far fewer and betweener.

Q. What are your qualifications in the endeavor?  What do you bring to the table?
A. I’m glad you asked.  From a customer service perspective, and more specifically, from an online community perspective, I have extensive experience on both sides of the fence.  I have run online forums since the Fidonet days, and have extensive experience in the often caustic, emotionally driven environment that an online forum can produce.  This allows me to effectively communicate with the population, since I am one of the populous myself.  Unlike many customer facing people in many industries, I also have a strong technical background; I am able to communicate effectively with you about your problems, wishes and desires from a technical perspective.  I will not make empty promises from a marketing standpoint if I know it’s technically unreasonable or impossible.  I am also able to effectively manage a project from end to end, which will be critical in getting our manufacturing and production lines going in the most efficient manner possible.  I have also run a number of startups, and I understand the unique challenges required of a startup to function properly and successfully.

Q. Come on, for real, you’ve been with BFL all along, right?
A.  No!  Really!  I have been working for an unrelated company that has nothing to do with bitcoin long before BFL was founded or I knew of any of the people involved, and I am still working for that company, until the day I start working for BFL.

Q. What will happen to EMC?
A. Right now, there are no plans to change anything with regards to EMC, other than more improvements as usual.  I will continue to operate EMC as I have since the start.

Q. You are going to have an unfair advantage when it comes to mining equipment, you’ll be able to get as much as you want before anyone else!
 A. I will not be expanding my mining footprint as it would be a conflict of interest.  I will continue with my current obligations and already acquired/paid for equipment but will not be purchasing or utilizing additional equipment as part of my mining operations.  This is one of the hardest changes I will be making, as I firmly believe there are plenty of opportunities in this space that I am going to be missing out on, but I believe I can do more good for the bitcoin community as a whole working to provide that equipment to people as opposed to using it myself.

Q. Why now?  Why not before?
A. The topic never really came up.  BFL as a corporate entity is a startup and has been running very lean and mean.  With wild success and absolutely spectacular outlook for products, it’s time to move to the next stage of business.  With my diverse skill set, I can replace both a technical lead and a PR/community lead, thereby eliminating the need for an additional person, which means we can move that much quicker in the market as well as have that much less overhead that can go towards development instead of human resources.

Q. Are you going to become just another mouthpiece for the BFL party line?
A. First of all, there is no “party line” coming out of BFL.  They have been up front and honest with their dealings in the community from day one.  There are a number of people on the forums that feel that BFL has been dishonest and some of those feelings are justified if viewed through the lens of “Every business should be perfect, always.”  However, both Sonny and the engineers, contrary to some statements you may have seen from others on the forum, have been honest in their assessments of capabilities and timelines.  They have been mistaken, yes, but they have not been willfully or intentionally dishonest.  Some can say they should have known better, and whether or not that is true is, at this point, academic.  I am looking at the future, not the past, and I will be doing my level best to provide accurate information from day one.  If there is some information that I believe to be inaccurate, a lie, or just plain wrong, I will not pass it off as fact.  I will not tow any “party line.”  I will give you the honest facts as I know them.  There may be times that there are trade secrets that I cannot reveal, but I do not believe this constitutes falsehood or anything nefarious, as there are times where revealing certain bits of information would put BFL at a competitive disadvantage.  That will harm not only BFL, but also its current and future customers.  If there are still people that, going forward, feel that this is somehow dishonest, then I apologize in advance and I also give advance notice that there will, in fact, be times where 100% of information cannot be disclosed, either immediately or possibly ever.

Q. Help me!  Order Status?  Why is the sky blue?
A. I will not be able to answer your questions with regards to order status, etc… via PMs.  The PM system does not allow me to track or correlate information to provide accurate answers.  I will, however, be able to do that via email and our new support system that I will be facilitating in the near future.  PMs requesting information that should be directed to the support system will be ignored.  I apologize for this, but it’s just not feasible to handle the volume of requests that it would generate.

Q. Are there cookies?
A. Yes, there will be cookies.  The cake, however, is still a lie.

...

So they went from being TRANPARENT to being NONTRANSPARENT? Gee didn't see that one coming.

A company that says they are going to be transparent and then says they aren't 9 months later HAS SOMETHING TO HIDE.

Now the real question is WHAT IS IT THAT BFL NEEDS TO HIDE?

Josh? Inaba? Any shill from BFL?

[Bicknellski]

The fact they aren't shipping is transparent.

That is all anyone needs to know.

[Korbman]

They have no FCC certification.  Nothing is on file.

So I've recently found, which is quite interesting. I've opened a case with the FCC to confirm.

[smoothie]

They have no FCC certification.  Nothing is on file.

So I've recently found, which is quite interesting. I've opened a case with the FCC to confirm.

Screen shot of paperwork/form?

[ecliptic]

They have no FCC certification.  Nothing is on file.

So I've recently found, which is quite interesting. I've opened a case with the FCC to confirm.

Even worse for them as they've already shipped units in what appears to be a knowing violation.

[PuertoLibre]

Courtesy of: https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/2661-received-mildly-rude-call-bfl.html

Posted by JunkieXL:

I couldn't reply...it was a voicemail.

I sort of feel powerless now and that BFL has me by the balls. The call I received over the weekend (won't say who it was) but you can tell they are at their wits end and they just don't care. This person was responding to my e-mails. Basically it was to ask me to stop asking questions because they have a plethora of e-mails to answer.

I was being accused of asking the same questions...might have had me confused with someone else. Long story short, the questions I ask they have no info for right now and that I should just wait until more info becomes available.

Fair enough but the rudeness in this reply made me realize how little they care about customers now. I wish I could say that was all there was to the reply, but it got worse. It went on to further add how I'm not the highest paying customer...as if to say I don't matter as much as others. Words were attempted to be used carefully but it was a train wreck of a voicemail that exposed how they truly feel. I won't say what this person was replying to, but it was an olive branch statement I made which is why the rudeness surprised me. I was considering buying more and asked them a few things.

I think because my rigs cost them a lot more in hardware costs to manufacture now due to the power consumption screw up estimates...it felt like an attempt to make me want to cancel and I feel they would be very happy if I did.

This post probably doesn't have much purpose as I'm being cryptic to protect who it was that called me. I don't want to start a shit storm. I'm just curious if others have been treated similarly? I understand what they are going through. A lot of people are angry and there are a ton of flames to fan. I'm just a bit surprised.

What I have taken from this whole experience has been extreme disappointment. When the second generation of ASIC comes out, I think I'll be going to a competitor unless there is an awesome upgrade plan of some kind.

[tvbcof]

Courtesy of: https://forums.butterflylabs.com/bfl-forum-miscellaneous/2661-received-mildly-rude-call-bfl.html

Posted by JunkieXL:

I couldn't reply...it was a voicemail.

....

What I have taken from this whole experience has been extreme disappointment. When the second generation of ASIC comes out, I think I'll be going to a competitor unless there is an awesome upgrade plan of some kind.

Jesus lord-a-mercy!  Can you say 'glutton for punishment?'

[ldrgn]

When is the 1 year anniversary for the first announcement of BFL ASICs?

[smoothie]

When is the 1 year anniversary for the first announcement of BFL ASICs?

Middle of June about?

[Phinnaeus Gage]

When is the 1 year anniversary for the first announcement of BFL ASICs?

Ain't this special! You never guess what I discovered while seeking to answer your question, revealed at the end of the following quote. Unless another confirmed date is presented, I'm guessing May 27, 2012.

BFL is announcing full custom ASIC chips.  
http://www.butterflylabs.com/products/

We're scared full custom ASIC is great!!!!! You would invest probably more than whole BTC worth then if you would go with say 45-nm!!!! You are serious player   I think this is the time, when security of SHA256 for block-chain generation should be .... IMPROVED   But let's go step by step   First deliver mini-rigs with nice performance and cost, then ASIC, then do buy-in, and then everything would be secure, under NDA of course Or ? Will you start again taking money for future product with "variable" performance ?  

Let me first say that I deeply respect the work you've done.  I really mean that.  It's spectacular and we're deeply impressed.  So believe me when I say that we take no pleasure in undermining your plans.  

As you know, you've only announced yourself within the last week or so while we've been working on our full product range in public view for 10 months.  The SC product plan and it's timing has been illustrated on our product lineup page that full time.  

We started out under attack from similar comments like yours above...   it's deja vu.  I think your first post was met with similar sarcasm.  That's just how it is.  You've got to take your lumps in the public forum.  Even the good Ngzhang once publicly accused us of being a scam product.  In sum, we've seen all this before and we're past it.  We've since shipped a quantity of product into the field that would surprise most people.  So if you want to cast doubt, go right ahead.  Honestly, we expect nothing less.  

I would hope that at some point the hostility becomes unnecessary.

Best regards,
BFL

Now, for what I discovered, but first a couple more quotes to drive the point home.

<quoted from a locked thread>

Re: Hi, my name is Sonny Vleisides

September 21, 2012, 02:13:37 PM                                                        #86

Thank you all for your comments...  both positive and negative.  I see many of our competitors in this thread pushing their agenda which isn't surprising but still, there are some very reasonable posts with deserving questions.  Overall, I appreciate the public's reason for concern and I will return and provide answers.

The following quote was edited to only show an example of the writing style, but opted to highlight one interesting tidbit.

<snip>

Q. Are you going to stop being such a jerk on the forums to some people?
A. Maybe.  It depends. Actually, yes.  As a pool operator and an independent individual I have far more latitude and freedom to express my displeasure with some of the more intense stupidity that can be encountered on the internet.  As a representative of a company, I am, unfortunately, a bit more constrained from explaining to various people exactly why they are idiots.  As such, I will likely be ignoring a lot of the more of the ludicrous posts than I have before. To those of you who enjoyed reading my rants, I am sorry that they will be far fewer and betweener.

<snip>

When is the Jalapeno getting FCC approval?

Maybe two weeks? We are waiting for the test lab to issue the test report.

With the bump in power requirements on the MR and the new screen, we had to make changes, although the new screen is already certified.  We are doing all the devices at once, since they all share the same board.

I quoted posts by users BFL, BFL_Sonny, Inaba (Josh) and BFL_Josh. What's the common denominator with them all? The majority of the time they all put an extra space when starting a new sentence.

I'll leave it to others to show/prove that the writing styles of BFL and Josh are similar.

I just thought of one more before I was about to post this: http://redstarmining.blogspot.com/2012_03_01_archive.html

Reply from BFL about our purchase

I just got a reply from BFL -


On 5 March 2012 18:27, BFLabs <sonny@butterflylabs.com> wrote:
Hi Matthew,

Please excuse the delay in confirming your order.  We have been focusing on production over new customer inquiry and are just now catching up.  Your PayPal payment has been received in full and your BitForce SHA256 Single is secure. Your date of purchase is 02/24/2012. I will keep you informed as to the expected delivery date of your order.
Thanks again for your interest in our product.

Kind regards,
Sonny K

Note the extra space at the beginning of the sentence(s).

Hi *****,

We have begun shipping of the product.  However, the lead time on new orders is 4-6 weeks from the date of purchase.  Now that we're underway with production, this could be much faster but it's best to assume 4-6 weeks when making a purchase decision.

Kind regards,
Sonny K
BF Labs Inc.

[smoothie]

Interesting catch PG.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

Interesting catch PG.

Thanks, smoothie!

Apologies for reposting this, but desire the following to be above the fold.

When is the 1 year anniversary for the first announcement of BFL ASICs?

Ain't this special! You never guess what I discovered while seeking to answer your question, revealed at the end of the following quote. Unless another confirmed date is presented, I'm guessing May 27, 2012.

BFL is announcing full custom ASIC chips.  
http://www.butterflylabs.com/products/

We're scared full custom ASIC is great!!!!! You would invest probably more than whole BTC worth then if you would go with say 45-nm!!!! You are serious player   I think this is the time, when security of SHA256 for block-chain generation should be .... IMPROVED   But let's go step by step   First deliver mini-rigs with nice performance and cost, then ASIC, then do buy-in, and then everything would be secure, under NDA of course Or ? Will you start again taking money for future product with "variable" performance ?  

Let me first say that I deeply respect the work you've done.  I really mean that.  It's spectacular and we're deeply impressed.  So believe me when I say that we take no pleasure in undermining your plans.  

As you know, you've only announced yourself within the last week or so while we've been working on our full product range in public view for 10 months.  The SC product plan and it's timing has been illustrated on our product lineup page that full time.  

We started out under attack from similar comments like yours above...   it's deja vu.  I think your first post was met with similar sarcasm.  That's just how it is.  You've got to take your lumps in the public forum.  Even the good Ngzhang once publicly accused us of being a scam product.  In sum, we've seen all this before and we're past it.  We've since shipped a quantity of product into the field that would surprise most people.  So if you want to cast doubt, go right ahead.  Honestly, we expect nothing less.  

I would hope that at some point the hostility becomes unnecessary.

Best regards,
BFL

Now, for what I discovered, but first a couple more quotes to drive the point home.

<quoted from a locked thread>

Re: Hi, my name is Sonny Vleisides

September 21, 2012, 02:13:37 PM                                                        #86

Thank you all for your comments...  both positive and negative.  I see many of our competitors in this thread pushing their agenda which isn't surprising but still, there are some very reasonable posts with deserving questions.  Overall, I appreciate the public's reason for concern and I will return and provide answers.

The following quote was edited to only show an example of the writing style, but opted to highlight one interesting tidbit.

<snip>

Q. Are you going to stop being such a jerk on the forums to some people?
A. Maybe.  It depends. Actually, yes.  As a pool operator and an independent individual I have far more latitude and freedom to express my displeasure with some of the more intense stupidity that can be encountered on the internet.  As a representative of a company, I am, unfortunately, a bit more constrained from explaining to various people exactly why they are idiots.  As such, I will likely be ignoring a lot of the more of the ludicrous posts than I have before. To those of you who enjoyed reading my rants, I am sorry that they will be far fewer and betweener.

<snip>

When is the Jalapeno getting FCC approval?

Maybe two weeks? We are waiting for the test lab to issue the test report.

With the bump in power requirements on the MR and the new screen, we had to make changes, although the new screen is already certified.  We are doing all the devices at once, since they all share the same board.

I quoted posts by users BFL, BFL_Sonny, Inaba (Josh) and BFL_Josh. What's the common denominator with them all? The majority of the time they all put an extra space when starting a new sentence.

I'll leave it to others to show/prove that the writing styles of BFL and Josh are similar.

I just thought of one more before I was about to post this: http://redstarmining.blogspot.com/2012_03_01_archive.html

Reply from BFL about our purchase

I just got a reply from BFL -


On 5 March 2012 18:27, BFLabs <sonny@butterflylabs.com> wrote:
Hi Matthew,

Please excuse the delay in confirming your order.  We have been focusing on production over new customer inquiry and are just now catching up.  Your PayPal payment has been received in full and your BitForce SHA256 Single is secure. Your date of purchase is 02/24/2012. I will keep you informed as to the expected delivery date of your order.
Thanks again for your interest in our product.

Kind regards,
Sonny K

Note the extra space at the beginning of the sentence(s).

Hi *****,

We have begun shipping of the product.  However, the lead time on new orders is 4-6 weeks from the date of purchase.  Now that we're underway with production, this could be much faster but it's best to assume 4-6 weeks when making a purchase decision.

Kind regards,
Sonny K
BF Labs Inc.

[smoothie]

Maybe Sonny wrote BFL_Josh's template and Josh just posted it?

hmm