- AURORACOIN -

[Bimmerhead]

You're missing my point. Here's a brief summary in my own words how I'd read this topic, and the previous one:

Icelandic people were victims multiple times due to abusiveness of those above them or in control. The ISK plummeted to this, which affected the normal Icelandic people. Lots of anger and scandals, and the people left with devaluated assets. Auroracoin has the potential to liberate from this.



So okay, yeah, everybody in Iceland going for Auroracoin and breaking their shackles from fiat currency. Yeah. Great, we now have them Icelandic people set free and given them financial freedom. Yeah again. So, then comes a pump and dump group humptydumping along. Toying and hyping a bit with Auroracoin, and then plummet it down to ground. Group happy with profits, "bye-bye auroracoin, was fun" and regular user (read: like the Icelandic inhabitants) left with assets less valuable then before. Again.

^^^ Dev team ever thought of that possibility?

Or, another point of view:
So the ISK is kinda rigged, and was/is subject to them big bullies on top that got away unpunished and left a deflated national currency.
Bad thing, not nice, the ISK fucked over, lots of people unhappy, right?

So, we have had a volatile national coin, left quite deflated, with all kinds of regulations and restrictions imposed and in place. But, this is crypto. And if anything is volatile, AND subject to 'control' and what not, it's crypto!
Whales cannot push national currencies that hard. With crypto's, they can.
Corporate or entities cannot push national currencies that hard. With crypto's, they can.
P&D groups cannot push national currencies that hard. With crypto's, they can.
Etc.

Do you see the point I'm trying to make? Auroracoin is an interesting project, but could also backfire in the end on it's intentions.

Sure, Auroracoin could fail epically.

What are the alternative no-risk ways to replace a national currency?

[JessicaG]

You're missing my point. Here's a brief summary in my own words how I'd read this topic, and the previous one:

Icelandic people were victims multiple times due to abusiveness of those above them or in control. The ISK plummeted to this, which affected the normal Icelandic people. Lots of anger and scandals, and the people left with devaluated assets. Auroracoin has the potential to liberate from this.



So okay, yeah, everybody in Iceland going for Auroracoin and breaking their shackles from fiat currency. Yeah. Great, we now have them Icelandic people set free and given them financial freedom. Yeah again. So, then comes a pump and dump group humptydumping along. Toying and hyping a bit with Auroracoin, and then plummet it down to ground. Group happy with profits, "bye-bye auroracoin, was fun" and regular user (read: like the Icelandic inhabitants) left with assets less valuable then before. Again.

^^^ Dev team ever thought of that possibility?

Or, another point of view:
So the ISK is kinda rigged, and was/is subject to them big bullies on top that got away unpunished and left a deflated national currency.
Bad thing, not nice, the ISK fucked over, lots of people unhappy, right?

So, we have had a volatile national coin, left quite deflated, with all kinds of regulations and restrictions imposed and in place. But, this is crypto. And if anything is volatile, AND subject to 'control' and what not, it's crypto!
Whales cannot push national currencies that hard. With crypto's, they can.
Corporate or entities cannot push national currencies that hard. With crypto's, they can.
P&D groups cannot push national currencies that hard. With crypto's, they can.
Etc.

Do you see the point I'm trying to make? Auroracoin is an interesting project, but could also backfire in the end on it's intentions.

Sure, Auroracoin could fail epically.

What are the alternative no-risk ways to replace a national currency?

I still think you guys don't get my point I'm trying to make. I'm trying to make an ethical point, not something else.

I have seen quite some comments non favorable regarding the current Icelandic conditions, spanning back when the bank crisis began. And, that Auroracoin could prove a solution to it. So okay, Auroracoin pops in and gets accepted among the Icelandic population. Hurrah. And then some whale, P&D group or whatever comes along, and messes up Auroracoin pretty bad.

The above situation(s), whom would be held responsible you'd think? *COULD* it be, that in such case, people *might* tend to look that the dev team for *potential* being the ones responsible? Simply, for *introducing* it into Iceland?

Has the dev team *thought* of that? Cuz I can't read anything anywhere back regarding such. I can find enough things like 'we can do better, yeah we can do better, fiat sucks, Auroracoin is better, better than the current system, the current system sucks, etc'.
But what I can't find back, anywhere, is where somebody steps up with a mild display of responsibility *if* things would go sour. Which, they can. Because, this is crypto! Highly volatile!!!

So I'll simplify the question:
Has the dev team, *considered* they *could* be responsible, for plummeting 330k people, *again* into a *potential* financial roller coaster?

Where's the ethics?

[LTEX]

I still think you guys don't get my point I'm trying to make. I'm trying to make an ethical point, not something else.

I have seen quite some comments non favorable regarding the current Icelandic conditions, spanning back when the bank crisis began. And, that Auroracoin could prove a solution to it. So okay, Auroracoin pops in and gets accepted among the Icelandic population. Hurrah. And then some whale, P&D group or whatever comes along, and messes up Auroracoin pretty bad.

The above situation(s), whom would be held responsible you'd think? *COULD* it be, that in such case, people *might* tend to look that the dev team for *potential* being the ones responsible? Simply, for *introducing* it into Iceland?

Has the dev team *thought* of that? Cuz I can't read anything anywhere back regarding such. I can find enough things like 'we can do better, yeah we can do better, fiat sucks, Auroracoin is better, better than the current system, the current system sucks, etc'.
But what I can't find back, anywhere, is where somebody steps up with a mild display of responsibility *if* things would go sour. Which, they can. Because, this is crypto! Highly volatile!!!

So I'll simplify the question:
Has the dev team, *considered* they *could* be responsible, for plummeting 330k people, *again* into a *potential* financial roller coaster?

Where's the ethics?

Ok, I do see your point and I can say we obviously have given that a lot of thought. We are however not stating we are going to take over the Krona in Iceland in a flash. Maybe even not at all. Our main goal is to get Auroracoin adopted along side the Krona for now.

You see, for sure things will be volatile in the beginning and there will always be opportunities for whales and their P&D schemes. But we think that once the organic growth of adoption and actual usage is gradually increasing, so will the prospect of those schemes gradually decline. If the actual market picks up larger volumes there simply will not be enough AUR around to play with for the Whales. Of course this is something that won't happen over night and might even take well over 5 years.

Mind you that of all crypto currencies Auroracoin has by far the highest spread and penetration of it's targeted market. Around 10% of the population has claimed their airdrop coins, they hold over 50% of the liquid market (taken into account that the burned premine is gone and the DEV fund will only be spend inside Iceland). And I personally know the holders of the larger wallets and they are all in this for the long run.

[dinobotta]

You're missing my point. Here's a brief summary in my own words how I'd read this topic, and the previous one:

Icelandic people were victims multiple times due to abusiveness of those above them or in control. The ISK plummeted to this, which affected the normal Icelandic people. Lots of anger and scandals, and the people left with devaluated assets. Auroracoin has the potential to liberate from this.



So okay, yeah, everybody in Iceland going for Auroracoin and breaking their shackles from fiat currency. Yeah. Great, we now have them Icelandic people set free and given them financial freedom. Yeah again. So, then comes a pump and dump group humptydumping along. Toying and hyping a bit with Auroracoin, and then plummet it down to ground. Group happy with profits, "bye-bye auroracoin, was fun" and regular user (read: like the Icelandic inhabitants) left with assets less valuable then before. Again.

^^^ Dev team ever thought of that possibility?

Or, another point of view:
So the ISK is kinda rigged, and was/is subject to them big bullies on top that got away unpunished and left a deflated national currency.
Bad thing, not nice, the ISK fucked over, lots of people unhappy, right?

So, we have had a volatile national coin, left quite deflated, with all kinds of regulations and restrictions imposed and in place. But, this is crypto. And if anything is volatile, AND subject to 'control' and what not, it's crypto!
Whales cannot push national currencies that hard. With crypto's, they can.
Corporate or entities cannot push national currencies that hard. With crypto's, they can.
P&D groups cannot push national currencies that hard. With crypto's, they can.
Etc.

Do you see the point I'm trying to make? Auroracoin is an interesting project, but could also backfire in the end on it's intentions.

Iceland is used to pump and dump games with their currency. Back in 2002 our banks took part in the biggest pump and dump in history, paying roulette with the Icelandic krona. Increasing its value by ~50% and then printing up billions of ISK and dumped it and devalued the krona by ~100%.

If Bitcoin can be pumped to to $1.100 and dumped to $165 and then again now to $750, Auroracoin can be pumped also, nothing different here.

We don't want a pump and dump on Auroracoin but a steady growth that follows real adoption and usage. We all know that if we are able to push Auroracoin into general usage in Iceland pump and dumps from whales will just be a blip on the screen in the larger view.

Don't forget that 10% of Icelanders hold Auroracoin and will benefit on the way up if anyone pumps and hopefully they will take advantage of such a pump before the market manipulators.

[adamastor]

Did any one watch iceland draw Portugal in the euro?

Wow what a performance from the small guy, reminded me of auroracoin

[BioMike]

Don't forget that most whales can't trade on the Icelandic exchange. It has remained stable, where bittrex dropped past few days (in USD value). Opening up arbitrage possibilities and opportunities to import AUR into Iceland.

[coinbasesucks]

Putting the Auroracoin exchange together couldn't have been easy. 

[coinbasesucks]

You're missing my point. Here's a brief summary in my own words how I'd read this topic, and the previous one:

Icelandic people were victims multiple times due to abusiveness of those above them or in control. The ISK plummeted to this, which affected the normal Icelandic people. Lots of anger and scandals, and the people left with devaluated assets. Auroracoin has the potential to liberate from this.



So okay, yeah, everybody in Iceland going for Auroracoin and breaking their shackles from fiat currency. Yeah. Great, we now have them Icelandic people set free and given them financial freedom. Yeah again. So, then comes a pump and dump group humptydumping along. Toying and hyping a bit with Auroracoin, and then plummet it down to ground. Group happy with profits, "bye-bye auroracoin, was fun" and regular user (read: like the Icelandic inhabitants) left with assets less valuable then before. Again.

^^^ Dev team ever thought of that possibility?

Or, another point of view:
So the ISK is kinda rigged, and was/is subject to them big bullies on top that got away unpunished and left a deflated national currency.
Bad thing, not nice, the ISK fucked over, lots of people unhappy, right?

So, we have had a volatile national coin, left quite deflated, with all kinds of regulations and restrictions imposed and in place. But, this is crypto. And if anything is volatile, AND subject to 'control' and what not, it's crypto!
Whales cannot push national currencies that hard. With crypto's, they can.
Corporate or entities cannot push national currencies that hard. With crypto's, they can.
P&D groups cannot push national currencies that hard. With crypto's, they can.
Etc.

Do you see the point I'm trying to make? Auroracoin is an interesting project, but could also backfire in the end on it's intentions.

Sure, Auroracoin could fail epically.

What are the alternative no-risk ways to replace a national currency?

I still think you guys don't get my point I'm trying to make. I'm trying to make an ethical point, not something else.

I have seen quite some comments non favorable regarding the current Icelandic conditions, spanning back when the bank crisis began. And, that Auroracoin could prove a solution to it. So okay, Auroracoin pops in and gets accepted among the Icelandic population. Hurrah. And then some whale, P&D group or whatever comes along, and messes up Auroracoin pretty bad.

The above situation(s), whom would be held responsible you'd think? *COULD* it be, that in such case, people *might* tend to look that the dev team for *potential* being the ones responsible? Simply, for *introducing* it into Iceland?

Has the dev team *thought* of that? Cuz I can't read anything anywhere back regarding such. I can find enough things like 'we can do better, yeah we can do better, fiat sucks, Auroracoin is better, better than the current system, the current system sucks, etc'.
But what I can't find back, anywhere, is where somebody steps up with a mild display of responsibility *if* things would go sour. Which, they can. Because, this is crypto! Highly volatile!!!

So I'll simplify the question:
Has the dev team, *considered* they *could* be responsible, for plummeting 330k people, *again* into a *potential* financial roller coaster?

Where's the ethics?

With a 2 million marketcap, and the commitment of the devs,.......I mean hell they built an exchange from scratch, I don't see much downside.  Now if a whale came along and bought up every Aurora coin pushing the price up to 5 bucks per, then you would need to stay a little more ontop of things.  But where it stands right now the worst you would do is break even.  Just my 2 c

[coinbasesucks]

Don't forget that most whales can't trade on the Icelandic exchange. It has remained stable, where bittrex dropped past few days (in USD value). Opening up arbitrage possibilities and opportunities to import AUR into Iceland.

Great point.  The Icelandic exchange is completely seperate from the whims of speculators outside of Iceland

[Bimmerhead]

I still think you guys don't get my point I'm trying to make. I'm trying to make an ethical point, not something else.

I have seen quite some comments non favorable regarding the current Icelandic conditions, spanning back when the bank crisis began. And, that Auroracoin could prove a solution to it. So okay, Auroracoin pops in and gets accepted among the Icelandic population. Hurrah. And then some whale, P&D group or whatever comes along, and messes up Auroracoin pretty bad.

The above situation(s), whom would be held responsible you'd think? *COULD* it be, that in such case, people *might* tend to look that the dev team for *potential* being the ones responsible? Simply, for *introducing* it into Iceland?

Has the dev team *thought* of that? Cuz I can't read anything anywhere back regarding such. I can find enough things like 'we can do better, yeah we can do better, fiat sucks, Auroracoin is better, better than the current system, the current system sucks, etc'.
But what I can't find back, anywhere, is where somebody steps up with a mild display of responsibility *if* things would go sour. Which, they can. Because, this is crypto! Highly volatile!!!

So I'll simplify the question:
Has the dev team, *considered* they *could* be responsible, for plummeting 330k people, *again* into a *potential* financial roller coaster?

Where's the ethics?

You also aren't getting my point: there is no risk-free financial system. What we are offering is designed to reduce some of the risks associated with the current system. We also are not forcing anyone to join us in this experiment - it is purely voluntary. That is a positive in terms of ethics.

The scenario you are imagining, where 330k people are plummeted into a financial crisis, would require Auroracoin to have a market capitalization in the billions of US $. What kind of whale could manipulate that system? Why isn't this whale currently causing stock prices for hundreds of companies on the Nasdaq to vary by 75%?

[ny2cafuse]

I still think you guys don't get my point I'm trying to make. I'm trying to make an ethical point, not something else.

I have seen quite some comments non favorable regarding the current Icelandic conditions, spanning back when the bank crisis began. And, that Auroracoin could prove a solution to it. So okay, Auroracoin pops in and gets accepted among the Icelandic population. Hurrah. And then some whale, P&D group or whatever comes along, and messes up Auroracoin pretty bad.

The above situation(s), whom would be held responsible you'd think? *COULD* it be, that in such case, people *might* tend to look that the dev team for *potential* being the ones responsible? Simply, for *introducing* it into Iceland?

Has the dev team *thought* of that? Cuz I can't read anything anywhere back regarding such. I can find enough things like 'we can do better, yeah we can do better, fiat sucks, Auroracoin is better, better than the current system, the current system sucks, etc'.
But what I can't find back, anywhere, is where somebody steps up with a mild display of responsibility *if* things would go sour. Which, they can. Because, this is crypto! Highly volatile!!!

So I'll simplify the question:
Has the dev team, *considered* they *could* be responsible, for plummeting 330k people, *again* into a *potential* financial roller coaster?

Where's the ethics?

You also aren't getting my point: there is no risk-free financial system. What we are offering is designed to reduce some of the risks associated with the current system. We also are not forcing anyone to join us in this experiment - it is purely voluntary. That is a positive in terms of ethics.

The scenario you are imagining, where 330k people are plummeted into a financial crisis, would require Auroracoin to have a market capitalization in the billions of US $. What kind of whale could manipulate that system? Why isn't this whale currently causing stock prices for hundreds of companies on the Nasdaq to vary by 75%?

Additionally, if someone were to manipulate the price to the point that we're discussing here, what is there for us to do?  Manipulate the price in the other direction?  That's not for us to control.  It's up to the people.

The beauty of crypto is that it's in the hands of the people, and it's controlled by them... not the government.  We're not dictating the value.  We're not really dictating anything other than the fact that we're here to work towards an alternative to government controlled finance, which has more day to day "legal" manipulation than I think you will ever see in the future of AUR.

I'm sure you're going to see attempts at manipulating the price.  Hell, I almost guarantee it once AUR breaks $1.  It will be like the wild west, but eventually the majority of people will dictate what the price is, and that single person or rogue PND group won't be able to compete with that.

Just my two cents.

-Fuse

[JessicaG]

Iceland is used to pump and dump games with their currency. Back in 2002 our banks took part in the biggest pump and dump in history, paying roulette with the Icelandic krona. Increasing its value by ~50% and then printing up billions of ISK and dumped it and devalued the krona by ~100%.

If Bitcoin can be pumped to to $1.100 and dumped to $165 and then again now to $750, Auroracoin can be pumped also, nothing different here.

You'd probably meant a different value than the ISK dumped and devalued by ~100%, because devaluating like ~100% would mean kinda like the ISK would be worth like 0.00. But that's just minor detail 

But yeah, your second line pictures it pretty good what I meant. Considering the financial history over the past years, it would be ashamed if the Icelandic inhabitants would hop on way to high during a bullish rally, only to see it plummet deeper than where they jumped on board.

[Skarfur]

Iceland is used to pump and dump games with their currency. Back in 2002 our banks took part in the biggest pump and dump in history, paying roulette with the Icelandic krona. Increasing its value by ~50% and then printing up billions of ISK and dumped it and devalued the krona by ~100%.

If Bitcoin can be pumped to to $1.100 and dumped to $165 and then again now to $750, Auroracoin can be pumped also, nothing different here.

You'd probably meant a different value than the ISK dumped and devalued by ~100%, because devaluating like ~100% would mean kinda like the ISK would be worth like 0.00. But that's just minor detail 

But yeah, your second line pictures it pretty good what I meant. Considering the financial history over the past years, it would be ashamed if the Icelandic inhabitants would hop on way to high during a bullish rally, only to see it plummet deeper than where they jumped on board.

The thing is that a county wide adoption would take many years to happen and during which time all major bag holders would make their dumps gradually during that road getting the coins effectively into the hands of many. You are looking at this like these tiny crypto markets that you are looking at today could possibly be translated into a full scale economy market. It will evolve massively! over time while it's in adoption and will not remotely resemble anything like these tiny crypto markets when fully evolved. Like ny2cafuse just mentioned. ton of "whales" will dump when the price reaches $1 and again at $3 or $5 and $10 and so forth.

Don't forget that this price increase will not be based on speculation like with all of the other cryptocurrencies (including Bitcoin) but from the fact that people will be using the coin so real demand will be increasing the price which will make it more sustainable than any other crypto. If Auroracoin would have reached the goal of having large % of the Icelandic market the price would be in the hundreds of $ and would have taken a long way to get there creating thousands of moments when any large bagholders would have considered the best time to release some or all of their funds.

Any currency that would not be instantly deployed through a nation and sanctioned by a government will have volatility while it's growing, it however would be just as stable as any fiat currency you have today when it has reached a point of being used the majority of all of the nation.

Having said all this I completely get what you are trying to point out and of course we don't want to burn anyone, that is why we will always be clear to people about the dangers of using a cryptocurrency. If people still continue to go down that path knowing the risk the answer is simple. People will then have judged the risk of using a cryptocurrency less than the damage that is currently being imposed upon us by a fiat currency in this fatally flawed monetary system. A system that in every 15-20 year period wipes out over half of all our assets.

In the end of the day the people will make this choice. We will only show them how the current monetary system really is and point out that there exists something that could be a better alternative.

[adamastor]

A smoke shop, a convenience store and a coffee bar here on the tip of Africa have all accepted auroracoin wallets and will be accepting the cutrendy once I furnish them with the right merchandise.

Our town simonsrown is the headcquartes for the countries navy yet we are a tiny community of 6000 people which includes 2000 employees at the naval he base here.

Close to 50 people have auroracoin here including many navy personal and our collective stash of auroracoin is near 1% of total supply. Most importantly a small financial services firm that actively invests in and promotes gold has invited me to pitch auroracoin to its client base which includes many money managers here in Cape town.

Selling auroracoin to navy personal has been interesting because they have been exposed to countless money schemes by other navy staff or by foreign navies that have visited us. The navy has the most disposable income though and the navy continues to be a great target for auroracoin.

[adamastor]

Like Skarfur has said auroracoin has to grow out of this small market cap of 2 million dollars.

From here you need the right partners to accept the coin


Merchants aren't the first answer and I don't know if the team has thought about this but merchants will convert coin back to krona if their suppliers don't accept coin.

 so the game you need to play is one of supply chain management. supply chains don't start with merchants they end with merchants. Instead they start with electricity so if you want many supply chains and the eventual merchants to accept the coin you need the electricity suppliers to accept auroracoin.

This is easier done in iceland than any other country given the six and nature of electricity supply in iceland.

Landsvirkjun, the largest electricity producer, had 76% annual production in 2007.The majority of the electricity is used in industry, mainly aluminium smelters and producers offerroalloy. Landsvirkjun does not participate directly in the retail market for households and smaller businesses. In the retail market the main companies are RARIK, Orkuveita Reykjavíkur and Hitaveita Suðurnesja.The last two have also entered into the market for energy intensive users. The households heated with electricity, not many, receive subsidies to make their heating costs comparable to hot water heating

[alex31]

Devs did you will plan update wallet? thanks

[adamastor]

Another great performance by iceland last night in their Euro group match against Hungary.

8 percent of iceland is in Paris to support their team team which is funny to watch coz they only fill up 2 grand stands in the stadium.

It puts the 10% who hold auroracoin into perspective.  30 000 icelanders doesn't seem like that much when you see them on the screen.

[dinobotta]

Another great performance by iceland last night in their Euro group match against Hungary.

8 percent of iceland is in Paris to support their team team which is funny to watch coz they only fill up 2 grand stands in the stadium.

It puts the 10% who hold auroracoin into perspective.  30 000 icelanders doesn't seem like that much when you see them on the screen.

The news was that 8% of Icelanders (26.000 people) tried to buy tickets for Euro group matches. Icelanders were only able to buy 8.000 tickets for Iceland - Portugal, 12.000 tickets for Iceland - Hungary and 15.000 for Iceland - Austria.

http://www.mbl.is/sport/efstadeild/2016/01/18/8_15_prosent_sottu_um_mida_a_em/

[Bimmerhead]

Devs did you will plan update wallet? thanks

Wallet updates are on their way, yes. No launch time to announce at the moment though.

[molecular]

slightly off-topic question about Icelandic history:

I remember someone telling a story about the Icelandic government accepting all kinds of things (not just the national currency) for tax payments at some point in the past.

If I recall correctly it started with people using some kind of privately issued commodity IOUs (I think they were on conrete or some other building material issued by an Icelandig business. If I recall correctly the owner of the business might've been an ancestor of the guy telling the story) as money. Because the Krona (or whatever currency in use) was being hyperinflated the tax officials accepted this private paper for tax payment (because the government could use it to buy goods/services and: why not).

So if anyone has a link to the story or any info about it (or is the grandson of that business owner), please do tell. (I hinted at the story in german subforum and promised to dig it out if someone voiced interest. Someone did, so I need help finding it ;-) ).