THE RISE AND RISE OF MONERO

[Ayers]

Crypto IS taxed.

http://www.coindesk.com/irs-bitcoin-tax-guidelines-mean/
http://www.coindesk.com/canada-revenue-agency-tax-rules-apply-bitcoin/

why are you reporting old news, what you linked is from 2014 and 2013, we all know that bitcoin is seen as a property in the usa but not in all country this is true and you have that coinbase operate on all country, and also your article only talk about bitcoin not crypto, crytpo can't be taxed because stuff liek monero are anonymous, can't be traced no matter what the government do

[1715001628]

1715001628

[1715001628]

1715001628

[u200811008]

  A very good coin maybe i would buy some

[dinofelis]

why are you reporting old news, what you linked is from 2014 and 2013, we all know that bitcoin is seen as a property in the usa but not in all country this is true and you have that coinbase operate on all country, and also your article only talk about bitcoin not crypto, crytpo can't be taxed because stuff liek monero are anonymous, can't be traced no matter what the government do

The problem with any way of hiding value for a mighty state that wants to take it away is of course that stuff is valuable mainly in interaction with others.   The only value you can truly hide is knowledge, as long as you keep it for yourself.  As most value is created in economic interactions, the weak point of failure is exactly that you have to interact with others, who can betray you.  Most hackers know that "social engineering" is way way more effective and valuable than pouring over thousands of lines of code to find a hole.  

So as long as mighty states want your value, you run a risk if you have to interact with others on that value.  This is a problem that monero cannot solve of course.  If you've sold a service (say, homework help) to someone else who paid you in monero, then that person can always betray you to the state and that state can come after you to take away 2/3 of the value you provided (called "taxes"), with a punishment on top of it because you didn't give it to them right away.

Of course, all bets are off if you use centralized services.  That's a gold mine for states.  

It is only in this (admittedly risky) endeavour to try to hide economic activity from the sticky fingers of the state, that I see any reason for crypto to exist.  I fail to see any other use case that isn't covered better with fiat-like systems.  But, as I said, it remains a risky business, only open for those people who love liberty more than comfort, and willing to take huge risks of others betraying them.  And as we can see, there aren't many around.  So most probably, this project (crypto currencies) failed and is on the verge of becoming a weapon in the hands of big bad evil states instead of a tool to fight them, especially transparent crypto.

[daveon]

Crypto IS taxed.

http://www.coindesk.com/irs-bitcoin-tax-guidelines-mean/
http://www.coindesk.com/canada-revenue-agency-tax-rules-apply-bitcoin/

Try harder you government shill!

[B8888]

XMR brothers I encourage you to take a look at DCR: https://medium.com/eeter/decred-developing-identity-and-design-system-for-a-digital-currency-17df76ab67c8

dcr wallet pic: https://twitter.com/decredproject/status/825779685485322240


It is also a great crypto project as XMR is. Bringing us new innovation to the space.

[Spoetnik]

Crypto IS taxed.

http://www.coindesk.com/irs-bitcoin-tax-guidelines-mean/
http://www.coindesk.com/canada-revenue-agency-tax-rules-apply-bitcoin/

why are you reporting old news, what you linked is from 2014 and 2013, we all know that bitcoin is seen as a property in the usa but not in all country this is true and you have that coinbase operate on all country, and also your article only talk about bitcoin not crypto, crytpo can't be taxed because stuff liek monero are anonymous, can't be traced no matter what the government do

The law that says Murder in the USA is old so it's not relevant anymore ?
You understand how legal law works right ?

I posted it because the guy earlier was denying it and he STILL is right after i last posted.

Reporting old news ? The laws do not "expire"  
If you do NOT pay your taxes you are in fact at risk of being thrown in jail for tax-fraud.
Then we can get into AML laws which are also in effect across crypto.

If you have an audit they say bring in your receipts.
So uhhh what are you going to do when your transactions were deliberately obfuscated using an ANON coin ?
Have all the exchange staff collect up your trade history etc and then hand it off to the Fed's ?
(Like they have admitted to doing already)

I want the kids playing this cute little game for as a well known cloner put it.. "For fun & profits" realize they are playing a deadly serious game.

You guys ARE in fact breaking laws on purpose and are now criminals and are guilty and may in time get caught.
How do you know Poloniex etc is not constantly handing over your data to the IRS ?
If it is requested they WILL comply i guarantee it !

Monero idiots chant well, i don't want to pay my taxes.
Neither do i but i do because i don't want my ass arrested.
Grow the fuck up kidiot Investard brats.  

And if you don't like paying your taxes then get the fuck off my paved roads assholes !
If you don't pay then don't use the service.

By the way..
I brought up that because i believe it is the single biggest barrier to the "Rise and Rise of Monero"
You know the topic here none of these guys want to address.
Once i ask about the future of Monero all these guys go silent and pour on the attacks & diversions.

[Hueristic]

The law that says Murder in the USA is old so it's not relevant anymore ?
You understand how legal law works right ?

I posted it because the guy earlier was denying it and he STILL is right after i last posted.

Reporting old news ? The laws do not "expire"  

So true and unfortunate at that! All the Blue laws need to die! We live under our own form of sharia law only difference is it's based on the bible and not the koran. All laws should have a timeframe that they will get reviewed at, that would keep the lawmakers busy and instead of making new ones everyday they would be fixing the old ones or repealing them. This is so obvious I don't know why no-one ever uses this as a platform. The problem is that Politicians don't think they are doing their job unless they are passing laws, that is their metric.

[Spoetnik]

The review concept is not a bad idea.

http://www.dumblaws.com/

What i think also needs to be reviewed is the shill's perpetuating Monero's grand rise and rise.

What has it accomplished and where exactly is it going ?
Step outside Bitcointalk walk outside and breath real air and tell me all those people you see will be abandoning fiat for lawless dark market Monero anon coin tokens by a millionaire and his paid lackies.

Notice how the entire crypto scene buries it's head in the sand when it comes down to reality ?

[Hueristic]

The review concept is not a bad idea.

http://www.dumblaws.com/

What i think also needs to be reviewed is the shill's perpetuating Monero's grand rise and rise.

What has it accomplished and where exactly is it going ?
Step outside Bitcointalk walk outside and breath real air and tell me all those people you see will be abandoning fiat for lawless dark market Monero anon coin tokens by a millionaire and his paid lackies.

Notice how the entire crypto scene buries it's head in the sand when it comes down to reality ?

I believe XMR is the best tech Virtual currency for the world, we need financial security and the fact criminals use it is actually a proof of it's safety. Criminals also use every other form of legitimate currency so trying to label XMR with that is just foolish. If the3re was a better tech that existed right now I would be supporting that, I care not about those in the community that have pissed you off and blinded to you the fact that the tech is all that matters.

[owlcatz]

Auction plug - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1791823.0

[Whtwabbit]

The review concept is not a bad idea.

http://www.dumblaws.com/

What i think also needs to be reviewed is the shill's perpetuating Monero's grand rise and rise.

What has it accomplished and where exactly is it going ?
Step outside Bitcointalk walk outside and breath real air and tell me all those people you see will be abandoning fiat for lawless dark market Monero anon coin tokens by a millionaire and his paid lackies.

Notice how the entire crypto scene buries it's head in the sand when it comes down to reality ?

You obey corrupt laws, you should go to this site www.dumbass.com

[Spoetnik]

Do you guys think you won something here ?
I made Monero look like swiss-cheese.
And the best you can do is dance around a little ?

Wanna know what is dumb ? Thinking your little opinions matter.
It don't.

The fact you have 0 legit retorts proves my point here.. Monero has no fucking future.

A currency for the world ?
What in the fucking hell have i been talking about each and every single god damn post for YEARS ?
You naive shill's skip over any and all rational explanation to how "the world" is going to end up using Monero.. one day.

You Monero idiots are the dumbest fucking shill's in all of crypto.

Your opinions mean squat.
Laws DO exist and they WILL be enforced whether you like it or not dumb fucks.
Sorry but you have no choice in the matter.
"Secure" he says earlier ?
Seen the earlier post i made where idiotpony posted his disclaimer ?
I could cite others from the past too.. all you guys do is shill bullshit for bucks.. BADLY !

If it's good enough for 3% of dark market criminals then it's secure enough for "the world" ?
Uhmmm did you just say that ? ROFL
Where do i even begin to start pounding that gay little shitty retort into the dirt ?
Lets start off by pointing Monero was just added to DM's and has not been used long enough to claim "secure"
At best you can say so far.. best you can tell.
Heard of Silk Road ? used it lately ?

And according to you dumb ass's the 3% of DM users translate into global world adoption and abandoning any and all financial law and dropping FIAT in favor of buying the millionaire's bags ?
You guys must so high your trippin' balls !

I can't even believe how fucking dumb you all are.
You think the entire world (the majority) WANTS to abandon all financial laws ?
Are you god damn high ?
Who the fuck paid those bail-outs way back in the USA ?
You drop FIAT for a secure anon coin at Bitcointalk ?
Is theymos going to hand out bail-out money if Monero tanks to shit if an exploit is found ?
Who is to say one hasn't been found already ?
One exploit and the whole entire chain has unraveled exposing every single user that ever used Monero.

THEN...

You foolish Investards think you can actually win

You naive kidiots here actually think you stand a chance in hell at going anywhere and doing anything let alone bring down govt and evading taxes and killing FIAT etc ?
You are high as fuck if you little morons think that !

The USA alone will take you out before you can even blink you snot nose cocky little crypto brats.
It's common sense that if the entire US govt's financial system is under serious threat.
You will all be dealt with and swiftly with ease.

Let's see how fast that little 3% niche market lasts when all the Monero big mouth shill's start vanishing one after another and their gambling sites etc are taken down.

You think Crypto in general has unbreakable faith in the success of Monero ?
FUCK NO !
They are loitering around trying to squeeze a buck off it and will run at the first sign of trouble.
When faced with the men-in-black at their door FEBO & Friends will tuck their little tails between their legs.

You know why the USA has not put severe pressure down on Monero ?
Because its not a threat.

The outside world and the people here give's 0 fucks about it.
There is nothing but 5 blow hard rejects here spouting off about it's "Rise & Rise"
Which amounts to a mini little profits & ROI's circle jerk in the crypto bubble.

FIAT vs Morono Coin ? guess who will win ?

Remember my Monero French Police Fraud topic ?
Remember how Latapie Risto's employee vanished for ages then came back apologizing with a story about a police investigation ?

ooooooooooooh i am soooooooooooooooooooooooooo sure he mouthed them off and told them "I don't have to pay taxes" or "I don't have to follow FIAT law" etc etc..

Nope he was on his knee's sucking police cock guaranteed !
Probably already ratting out most of you long ago idiots.

Funny thing is i am warning you stupid fucks.
I am doing you a favor and you don't even see it.
Grow the fuck up before you end up in jail snot nose brats.

Planet earth does not give 2 shits about your opinion on "Law".. you will cuffed the same regardless of Dino's anti-law free market rebel teen speeches.

Just seen a guy recently arrested on DM's for selling Fentanyl.
Guess what ? Canada just gave a guy 14 years for selling it and they announced lots of new police measures and international cooperation.
They are on a blood thirsty man hunt for anyone involved and tops on the list is you guessed it.. Dark Market dealers ..that Monero morons are pandering to and bragging about.

I can't stress how unbelievably god damn stupid the Monero idiots here are.
I swear either you are all brain damaged and blind by the fear that you can't give up or your "investment" will evaporate.... or
You are actually setting up Monero shit as a covert project to nail DM's assholes.

Either way i can not comprehend how anyone would want anything to do with this bullshit in the slightest never mind chanting FIAT is dead long live Monero (the FIAT and Financial Law killer)

With out a fight ?

[Whtwabbit]

There is no such place as "Planet" Earth.
And why are you so concerned about Monero, why don't you just move along and stay faithful your beloved "authority"

I am not scared of your brainless thugs

When are they coming for me, Soon™ or in Two weeks™?

“The question isn't who is going to let me; it's who is going to stop me.” Ayn Rand

[generalizethis]

I'm sure this applies to penguins too.

[Spoetnik]

Who is going to stop you ? Take your pick..
When Gavin Anderson was requested to come and meet with the FBI ...he went !

Jesse Ventura said the same after being elected.
They brought him into a dark room full of FBI agents and grilled his ass hard.

Next up we seen the FBI agent mentioning looking into Monero recently.
Soo....
You really have 0 reason to think you are all in the clear with this anti-law fiat killer system you have invented.. for DM usage and ROI's on govt compliant Poloniex.

When ? i don't care.. that is not the point.
HOW is.

Explain to me how Monero is on the RISE and RISE..
From where to where ?

And don't feed me this one day crap skipping the part in the middle again.
All i have heard is oh 3% of DM market adoption and then ohhh my god BAM! the world dropped FIAT and all financial law in favor of Monero coins on Polo.

Care to explain how the fucking hell that is going to happen ?


EDIT:

Get this people i went and looked just now and Dash is just under $20 a coin and Monero is at about $13 

I'd say that is an indication of what the Altcoin scene thinks..

[dinofelis]

FIAT vs Morono Coin ? guess who will win ?

My point is: if you think that state and law will prevail in the end, then fiat vs. any crypto, guess who will win ?

Thus, my question: if you think that state and law will prevail in the end, why the hell do you care about crypto in general ?  Crypto is doomed if law and state will prevail, it has no purpose.  Fiat is better if law and state prevail.  Simple as that.

Note that I didn't contradict the opinion that law and state might very well prevail.  My only point is that if that's the case, crypto is meaningless, and even dangerous, because it will then be used by  state and law against you.  So if law and state will prevail, you better get far away from the silliness that's called crypto.

Fiat vs bitcoin ?  Guess who will win ?  It might very well be that bitcoin BECOMES a kind of fiat.  And then it is or useless, or extremely dangerous.

[Spoetnik]

FIAT works (with AML laws) now doesn't it ?

I don't think this is a debate about Crypto vs Laws.

I am talking about the Rise and Rise of Monero.
That topic title has what meaning ?
Where is it rising to ? What is the long term vision here ?
THAT is where i am pointing out law as an issue.. for the future.

I just seen this..

http://www.castanet.net/edition/news-story-188949-5-.htm#188949

China is adding carfentanil and three related synthetic opioids to its list of controlled substances effective March 1, China's National Narcotics Control Commission said Thursday.

The U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration called the move a potential "game-changer" that is likely to reduce supply of key chemicals driving a surge of overdoses and deaths among unsuspecting drug users in North America. After China controlled 116 synthetic drugs in October 2015, seizures in the United States of compounds on that list plunged.

"It's a substantial step in the fight against opioids here in the United States," said Russell Baer, a DEA special agent in Washington. "We're persuaded it will have a definite impact."

Some 5,000 times stronger than heroin, carfentanil is so potent it has been used as a weapon and is considered a potential terrorism threat. Dealers cut fentanyls into heroin and other drugs to boost profit margins.

Beijing already regulates fentanyl and 18 related compounds. China said it is also placing carfentanil's less-potent cousins furanyl fentanyl, acryl fentanyl and valeryl fentanyl under control. All are prevalent in the U.S. drug supply, Baer said.

In October, The Associated Press identified 12 Chinese companies that offered to export carfentanil around the world for a few thousand dollars a kilogram (2.2. pounds), no questions asked. That same month China began evaluating whether to add carfentanil and the three other fentanyls to its list of controlled substances. Usually, the process can take nine months. This time, it took just four.

Both the DEA and U.S. State Department have pressed China to make carfentanil a controlled substance. Though Beijing has said U.S. assertions that China is the top source of fentanyls lack evidence, the two countries have been deepening co-operation as the U.S. opioid epidemic intensifies.

U.S. opioid demand is driving the proliferation of a new class of deadly synthetic drugs, made by nimble chemists to stay one step ahead of new rules like this one. As soon as one substance is banned, others proliferate. After Beijing tightened its focus on fentanyls late last year, the AP documented how Chinese vendors began to actively market alternative opioids, like U-47700.

"We don't think their scheduling actions will end with just these four," Baer said

Then check out this..

https://encrypted.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&q=Fentanyl+dealer+arrested+selling+alphabay

I am not even going to link the sites posting the news story here !
I refuse to click on any of those DM web sites.

Ohhh but not you guys !
You actually had the god damn nerve to proudly brag about Monero's new exciting news !
CONGRATULATIONS MONERO IS NOW ACCEPTED ON ALPHA BAY !!!!1111ONE

Hooray !! we can all applaud right ?

That quote earlier noted that the DA considers Carfentanyl a terrorist threat.. caught being mailed via Dark markets in regular mail.

You all realize these packages are floating around the US mail system and if one of them broke open you could die from just a couple grains of Carfentanyl right ?

Are you all thinking about what you are doing here or simply pushing your agenda for ROI'z ?
i don't see fluffypony over here talking about this do i ?
Nope he was more worried about his cash cow illegal gambling site that was hacked.
And using my exact words as an excuse saying "EVERYTHING can and will eventually be hacked"
..except Monero of course which is "Secure, Private and Untraceable"

Sorry guys but you are not in any position to chant free market anymore.
Get your shit together, grow up and and FAST !

Lucky for you the big "rise" of Monero has been nothing at all so it has not attracted much attention yet.
(aside from the FBI guy saying they will look at it publicly)

Like to "Invest" do you guys ?
Well look around the dev's and shills and large whales behind Monero are oddly silent now aren't they ?
Probably because they know i am right and a shit-storm is coming.. eventually.

[dinofelis]

FIAT works (with AML laws) now doesn't it ?

I don't think this is a debate about Crypto vs Laws.

I am talking about the Rise and Rise of Monero.
That topic title has what meaning ?

That's simple, no ?  If ever crypto is to have a meaningful future, it will be with monero-like anonymity features that allow/help/... to escape the law, because there's no future for law-abiding crypto.  It just can't win from fiat, which is much less of a hassle when it comes to being law-abiding, and has nothing else to offer.  There's nothing that crypto can offer, within the framework of legality, that fiat can't do better.  So forget about "law-abiding crypto".  It is an oxymoron.  It is like non-hurting weapons.

But I'm not saying that crypto IS going to have a meaningful future.  Only, IF EVER it is to have one, it will be with monero-like properties of anonymity.

Dark markets are not about selling dangerous stuff (it is only part of it).  It is about taking back economic freedom.

[Spoetnik]

@Dino
That is fine and for the most part i agree with you. (some of it LOL)
The real question here is "The rise of Monero"

Either it can beat the law or.. it's fucked.

Place your bets  

I said long ago here it going to end up pigeon holed as a DM niche thing.
So where is it rising to ?

[dinofelis]

@Dino
That is fine and for the most part i agree with you. (some of it LOL)
The real question here is "The rise of Monero"

Either it can beat the law or.. it's fucked.

Place your bets  

Sure, but IF any crypto is to make sense, monero is much better placed than the other stuff.  Until better anon tech comes along.

Which doesn't mean that bitcoin isn't going to the moon at a certain point, but it will simply be Chinese fiat, and the "moon" will be for the Chinese government.

If ever crypto "goes mainstream", and is not severely anon protected (and maybe monero doesn't cut it, who knows), it is extremely simple for any conglomeration of states (like "the united nations" or whatever global gov. type of state cartel) to pass an international convention that it is considered illegal to possess secret keys of crypto coin addresses WHICH HAVEN'T BEEN SHARED with a "crypto central bank authority" or something.  Meaning, you're not allowed to have any, say, bitcoin address of which you have the secret key that you didn't give to the crypto central bank.  Each year, on your tax declaration, you declare all crypto coin addresses you possess ; the "authorities" can then verify that you gave the corresponding secret key to the "central bank".

To make this "secure" so that no employee of that central bank can steal your money, it would be easy:  5 (say) different entities ("central banks") have each their master secret key, of which they render their public key, eh, public, say, P1, P2, P3, P4 and P5.  
You encrypt, successively, your wallet keys with P1, P2, P3, P4 and P5, and you sign its hash with your secret wallet keys.  This 5-fold encrypted file, you send to the 5 entities and to your local government ("tax agency").  Nobody can reach your keys unless these 5 entities "conspire": to get to your wallet keys, they have to successively decrypt, using S5, S4, S3, S2, and S1.  It is sufficient that one entity doesn't want to cooperate, and your keys are safe.  

Big gov. services scrutinize the block chain to try to find out if ever you've been using an address you didn't declare: they can check all addresses you declared using the signatures of your declarations.  If ever you're discovered using an address that you didn't declare, you're imprisoned, your children are poisoned, and after being tortured for 10 years, you're thrown to the sharks.

Every so many years, you're invited to "empty" your wallet to a new address, and then the 5 agencies decrypt all the received keys.  They issue of course new public keys for the next round.  They verify that you've sent them the right encrypted wallets.  If ever you didn't, you're also imprisoned, tortured and thrown to the sharks, and your children are poisoned.    So you cannot send them rubbish, because a few years later, they will find out.  The decryption with the old S1, ... S5 keys is not a problem, as these addresses are now empty: they can't steal you, but they can verify that you did declare the right keys and punish you if you didn't.

Whenever there's a financial crisis, there will be an agreement to put the 5 keys together so that the world government can confiscate all crypto money.  But they won't tell you.  As you've given the keys at any moment, and as you're not allowed to have addresses of which you didn't give the keys, they can, at any moment, confiscate whatever they want from anyone.  Crypto is then a dream for stealing governments.  Much easier and automated than with standard banking.  They all have it on a single server.  Crypto is the dictator's dream.

See, it is easy, when there's the law, to make crypto into fiat and confiscate everything, or put you to jail if you don't cooperate.  Like with fiat.

And the "trustless, distributed, unstoppable" silliness of crypto is over, and with it, its entire reason to exist.  Except that states will now impose it upon you.  Worse than fiat.

And the excuse will be "fiscal fraud, and financing terrorism" of course.